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Sex and Relationships

Is Stripping a Feminist Act?

By Sarah Katherine Lewis, AlterNet. Posted May 4, 2007.


If a woman chooses to objectify herself -- shedding her clothes to obtain power through money -- is she helping to eliminate gender inequality or simply degrading herself? A former adult entertainer shares her story.
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A popular narrative about sex work, earnestly discussed in Women's Studies courses throughout the nation and represented in countless "I stripped my way through college!" memoirs, is that adult labor is automatically, and by definition, feminist.

The argument goes like this: By using sexual stereotypes professionally, by "owning" them (using them consciously), and by "subverting" them (choosing which stereotypes to exaggerate and which to discard), a sex-working woman is participating in a feminist reclamation of both personal and economic power. Her deliberate use of gender-drag turns wearing a g-string and gyrating on stage -- or behind glass -- from an act done merely to pay her rent into a strong, assured and transgressive statement more akin to political performance art. You can't objectify me -- I am objectifying myself, shrewdly and self-consciously, in order to obtain power through money, and control through being considered sexually desirable.

It's almost as if sex work is the most feminist thing a women can do -- because if women are objectified every minute of every day against our will and without any personal benefit, why not grab the reins on that process and make a decent living wage at it? If women's bodies belong to everyone, some feminists argue, why not be the ones to profit from our own bodies instead of being consumed for free?

If we're going to be forced to sell regardless, we may as well name our own prices and take comfort in pocketing our own net gain. It beats working a minimum-wage job forty hours a week while performing a second, unpaid, full-time job as visual erotic entertainment for society at large, simply by existing as a female in the world. Why not demand payment for that second shift?

And, as it turns out, that second shift pays far more than minimum wage -- and all you have to do to claim your paycheck is to agree to perform a ritualized acknowledgment of your status as entertainment by revealing your body or performing sexually. Goodbye polyester smock and plastic nametag -- hello tuition payments!

This was my view of sex work when I started stripping in the mid-90s. I'll admit it: I was a Nouveau Feministe. I thought sex work was exciting, real, raw, and powerful. I enjoyed shopping for fishnet stockings, ornate wigs, false eyelashes, and the other assorted accoutrements of my new profession. Why not? I figured. It wasn't like I felt less sexually objectified working as a waitress. I was young and angry. I wanted reparation for all the times I'd been stared at, yelled at, touched without consent.

Also, I wanted to control the desire I'd been denied as a fat and homely child. I wanted to be the Hot Girl for once in my life! I wanted to feel that power, even if it was a joke that only me and my coworkers were in on, made up of fake hair and makeup and seven-inch platform heels. I loved the idea that by giving men what they wanted in a way that was so completely stylized -- a portrayal of sexual pleasure and abandon so overstated it became insultingly ridiculous, or so I thought -- I was taking my customers' money and using it to fund my life as a feminist. I bought groceries, paid my rent, traveled, read, took walks, took naps. For the first time in my life, I was making a living wage. It felt powerful and important.

Meanwhile, my mother -- an old-school 1970s-era feminist -- believed that my work was actively harming feminism. Never mind that I was finally able to afford an occasional meal out and pay my utilities without worrying about an overdrawn checking account for the first time in my life. To her, no amount of money or lack of financial stability was worth what I was doing: selling myself and other women out. She loved me, but she found what I was doing to be politically untenable.


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See more stories tagged with: feminism, power, stripping, objectification

Sarah Katherine Lewis is the author of Indecent: How I Make It and Fake It as a Girl for Hire (Seal Press, 2006).

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Answer
Posted by: footman on May 4, 2007 5:53 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
No, it's not.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» Is it a Feminist act? Posted by: pdxstudent
» RE: Is it a Feminist act? Posted by: apeshow
» Except Posted by: pdxstudent
» RE: xcept Posted by: psychochurch
» RE: xcept Posted by: pdxstudent
» RE: xcept Posted by: Ian MacLeod
» RE: xcept Posted by: Ian MacLeod
» Correct. It's "Naked-for-cash-ism" Posted by: Philip Newton
» Still feeding the machine? Posted by: mimosa4real
» RE: Still feeding the machine? Posted by: anik1511
» RE: Still feeding the machine? Posted by: Astroboy
» RE: Still feeding the machine? Posted by: mimosa4real
» RE: Still feeding the machine? Posted by: Ian MacLeod
» RE: Still feeding the machine? Posted by: mimosa4real
» RE: Still feeding the machine? Posted by: lilcheese71
» RE: Still feeding the machine? Posted by: luckypuck
» RE: Still feeding the machine? Posted by: mimosa4real
No.
Posted by: jaby on May 4, 2007 6:01 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There is no dignity in having a man pay you to get him off. Whether you are dancing, sticking your hoo-haa in his face, or rubing his dick with your boobs and/or ass through his clothes or not. Or perhaps going back to the champagne room and prostituting yourself.

There is not one drop of dignity in there anywhere.

A stripper is just leading into the sterotype that women like being objectified and that it is their proper place to exist solely to please a man. If you want respect, start acting like you deserve respect. Find a different way to pay your bills.

And if you were a fat child, you probably are acting out some emotional damage. Just the way it is: if you were a thin, happy child, you would be something besides a stripper. Maybe a decent, thoughtful writer.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: No. Posted by: footman
» RE: No. Posted by: jaby
» RE: No. Posted by: CL
» RE: No. Posted by: jaby
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» RE: No. Posted by: jaby
» RE: No. Posted by: nathanhj1970
» RE: No. Posted by: jaby
» RE: jaby Posted by: soft2u47
» RE: jaby Posted by: jaby
» RE: No representation? Posted by: luckypuck
» RE: No representation? Posted by: jaby
» RE: No. Posted by: Ian MacLeod
» RE: No. Posted by: jaby
» RE: No. Posted by: Ian MacLeod
» RE: No. Posted by: Ian MacLeod
» RE: No. Posted by: jaby
» RE: No. Posted by: Colton
» RE: No. Posted by: jaby
» RE: No. Posted by: Colton
» RE: No. Posted by: jaby
» RE: I know you are but what am I! Posted by: psychochurch
» RE: I know you are but what am I! Posted by: psychochurch
» RE: I know you are but what am I! Posted by: psychochurch
» RE: I know you are but what am I! Posted by: psychochurch
» RE: No. Posted by: tfortner
» RE: No. Posted by: claude
» RE: No. Posted by: jaby
» RE: No. Posted by: jaby
» RE: No. Posted by: jaby
» RE: No. Posted by: tfortner
» Puritan Posted by: Sparks56
» RE: Puritan Posted by: jaby
» RE: Puritan Posted by: tfortner
Empowerful?
Posted by: pdxstudent on May 4, 2007 6:10 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Is it a Feminist act, does it make you empowerful, to doing something that relies on you being viewed as a sexual object, to be sexually objectified? No.

An excellent discussion of why this is so can be found HERE

(I meant to press new post earlier, though I accidently pressed reply)

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deja voodoo
Posted by: George Wilson on May 4, 2007 6:14 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Ms. Lewis says she can fake "it"...
the only one deceived is herself.
Still on the sluts r us maypole of self-justification
and so-called liberation--
proclaiming self-realization thru self-prostitution..
American capitalism personified!

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: deja voodoo Posted by: mewhins24
Money to feel empowered
Posted by: secretchief on May 4, 2007 6:22 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
While I am sympathetic to the idea of not being limited by stereotypes, even the stereotype of what a feminist "should" be, I do not like the tone of this article.

Just as I am sad when I talk to people who want a hybrid car because they think it is supposed to save them money, I am sad to hear feminism reduced to the idea that all women need is more money (which they can turn into free time, should they feel like it).

This sound too much like "the end justifies the means". Submitting to the industry standards of what a sex worker is supposed to do and to look like is just like doing every stupid thing your boss asks you to do without question, because "Who cares? I'm just doing it to pay the bills." I am not saying that stripping is a bad profession, far from it. What I don't like is the idea that you can do any job, as long as it pays a lot and allows you to indulge your real cause or your real dreams.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» I'm with you Posted by: pdxstudent
» Because they're only cool... Posted by: pdxstudent
» RE: Because they're only cool... Posted by: psychochurch
» RE: Because they're only cool... Posted by: pdxstudent
» RE: Money to feel empowered Posted by: Ian MacLeod
Let's just consider this...
Posted by: pdxstudent on May 4, 2007 6:23 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"If a woman chooses to objectify herself -- shedding her clothes to obtain power through money -- is she helping to eliminate gender inequality or simply degrading herself"

The very first part of this sentence belies any suggestions to otherwise: you cannot objectify yourself, except only for yourself (and do strippers strip to get themselves hot, not because they're being looked at or paid either?); you are objectified (by other subjects, viewing themselves as such). This is true of not just sex-work, but wage-labour period.

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Is Learing a Masculinistic act?
Posted by: Dale Dressler on May 4, 2007 6:30 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
No

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What?!
Posted by: ejb on May 4, 2007 6:35 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I thought being a feminist meant a women's right to CHOOSE across the board!! Whether it's sex-work, being a cocktail waitress, a tattooer or the myriad of other jobs that women do for money that are construed as a "novelty" for men to comment on. Women will be always be objectified until every family with a son teaches them NOT to treat women poorly.
Would you say then, that gansta rap is objectifying young black males because that's what white society expects them to act like?
It's about the MONEY. Always has been. I've worked in the sex industry, the film industry and now I am in the tattoo industry and STILL some men, not all, want to know who I shtupped to get my foot in the door and can I tattoo their penis.
Wake up, ladies. Whether we are in power-suits or g-strings, we are all considered subversive.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: What?! Posted by: Gypsi
» RE: What?! Posted by: MAD
» RE: What?! Posted by: ejb
» RE: What?! Posted by: drmflorida
» RE: What?! Posted by: Colton
» RE: What?! Posted by: drmflorida
» RE: What?! Posted by: mimosa4real
» RE: What?! Posted by: mimosa4real
» RE: What?! Posted by: soft2u47
» RE: What?! Posted by: drmflorida
» RE: What?! Posted by: luckypuck
» RE: What?! Posted by: ankhet
» RE: What?! Posted by: soft2u47
» RE: What?! Posted by: tfortner
» RE: What?! Posted by: tfortner
» RE: What?! Posted by: jmp3954
» RE: What?! Posted by: luckypuck
If it's just about the money...
Posted by: veggiegrrrl on May 4, 2007 6:45 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
When I was in college in the late 70s and early 80s, several friends became strippers and/or escorts.

While I was making a whopping $4.25 working in an office during the day and finishing college at night, they were making more $ in one day than I made in a whole week. It would take me a month to earn anything close to their weekly salary.

If money is freedom, then I understand why young women make these choices (stripping/escorting).

Imagine being a young single mom now. You can work at Walmart and earn 800.00 a month, full time, barely spending time with your kid....or you can be a stripper and earn 800.00 in a week and have much more free time with your children, actually SAVE money, maybe even work towards home ownership.

Although I wish all women had better options (aptitude for higher education, desire for higher education,money for higher education, professional jobs, etc...) sometimes it's just about survival.

I would never look down on a woman who was doing erotic work to pay for college or feed her children. When the choice is between 7.00 per hour and 40.00 per hour....

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» You are awesome, Ann83 Posted by: veggiegrrrl
» Is the contradiciton not obvious? Posted by: pdxstudent
» I'm sorry Posted by: pdxstudent
» RE: I'm sorry Posted by: drmflorida
» No Posted by: pdxstudent
Double standard...
Posted by: nise52 on May 4, 2007 6:45 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Why is it that a woman who dances in a strip club is a "slut/prostitute" but the men who pay to see her dance are "gentlemen"? (aka "gentlemen's clubs"??)

I take my hat off to all the ladies who do this for a living! They do this to make a decent wage in a world controlled by men who think women are only here to give them sex and clean the house.

Men should try to raise children on a $7/hr Walmart job and see how hard it is. If a woman can make $2,000/wk doing a pole dance (and secretly laughing at the google eyes that men make at her while she takes their money) I say "you go, girl!"!

Real Women do whatever needs to be done to survive, raise their kids, or further their education.

A salute from this grandma in Ohio!

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» RE: Double standard... Posted by: MartianBachelor
» I don't think... Posted by: vangogh69
» RE: I don't think... Posted by: drmflorida
» RE: Double standard... Posted by: JoshuaLudd
» RE: Double standard... Posted by: drmflorida
» RE: Double standard... Posted by: mimosa4real
» RE: Double standard... Posted by: Spock
» RE: Double standard... Posted by: mimosa4real
One Big Rationalization
Posted by: Gravitas on May 4, 2007 6:50 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I think that this author simply needs to rationalize why she did what she did. I think most of the article was redundant. She said it all, "it is the money honey." There is nothing wrong with survival! She is right, if one is self supporting, one really can't on minimum wage jobs. When one is facing eviction, one does what one has to do! No dishonor in that. But lets not put some lofty spin on it!

Although I do think she was on to something when she said she wanted to make up for being a fat, homely child. Some Alternet viewer complain when we have articles talking about social weight obsession. They are too simplistic to see that it is one of patriarchy's most powerful suppression mechanisms. It makes women so desperate for approval they are easily manipulated into doing almost anything.

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» RE: One Big Rationalization Posted by: Ian MacLeod
» RE: One Big Rationalization Posted by: mimosa4real
You Were Not Free to Choose.
Posted by: pdxstudent on May 4, 2007 6:50 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"I am thankful for the freedom I had to choose sex work, in all its polarizing complication."

The thing is, you were not free to choose. You yourself described how you were practically forced, lest you live your life hovering on toothpick-stilts over destitute poverty, to do sex-work, much in the same way that most of us are practically forced to get whatever work we can (the better paying, in theory, the better) lest we starve. If you were really free to choose sex-work, there would have been a variety of options besides sex-work that would have amounted to the same (just as questionable) financial freedom you argue sex-work brought you.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» Who is really worse off? Posted by: jasonk
» RE: Who is really worse off? Posted by: pdxstudent
» RE: Who is really worse off? Posted by: mimosa4real
» RE: You Were Not Free to Choose. Posted by: msluderitz
» RE: You Were Not Free to Choose. Posted by: MartianBachelor
» Oh, come on Posted by: pdxstudent
» RE: Oh, come on Posted by: MartianBachelor
» A different take Posted by: beeswing70
I know what you mean
Posted by: jbello on May 4, 2007 6:50 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This is all true. However there is another side to it that you hinted at but didn't say outright. There are lots of people in the sex trade, especially among the dancers and strippers who are there because they finally feel empowered. Who are angry. Unfortunately this is also true of the clientele. It is not a safe space, or an innocent one. And it's not just about the money. The money, like the stage and the costumes, is a prop. Damaged people who have lost their ability to be safely intimate come here to restore their boundaries. And it can work. But it's risky and dangerous. Not everyone succeeds and many are hurt.

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It's the Money, Honey
Posted by: nkmarti on May 4, 2007 6:53 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What feminist sex workers, as they might see themselves, have to acknowledge, is that the blonde, big boobed, white stereotype--depending on where you strip--makes more money than women of color, women with cellulite, women with smaller breasts. Sexually expressing yourself can be empowering, making money can also be so, but when some people's sex work brings less choices and financial gains than others, the industry--and those who claim to be feminst--need to take that into account.

The interesting thing about sex work is that you can have agency, be powerful and make choices, but you can also be victimized by a culture that commodifies women's bodies--certain women's bodies as well. So yeah, you can make the choice to exploit yourself, but is that necessarily a feminist choice?

And what if you do Cardio-striptease at your gym, put a pole up in your basement, or buy your eleven-year old thongs because she wants them? Are these still empowered feminist choices, or are you buying into a pornified culture without the financial return.

It IS the MONEY, HONEY....and there are all sorts of complexities that go into those choices, well beyond the black and white attitudes that surround such choices. For further reading I would suggest Ariel Levy, Katharine Frank, and (shameless plug) Sexy Thrills: Undressing the Erotic Thriller, and the new issue of Atlantis: A Women's Studies Journal on Feminist Sexualities.

This article raises very important and serious questions for our time. Bravo!

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WON'T SOMEONE PLEASE THINK OF THE IDENTITY POLITICS & WEDGE ISSUES!!??
Posted by: emmanuel_goldstein_fights_fake_lefties on May 4, 2007 6:59 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am SO glad the American Left is on top of these vital issues, like feminist strippers instead of wasting time on things like progressive taxation and single payer healthcare and worker vacation time and college tuition.

No wonder the Left is resurgent in America, thanks to the practical attitudes of Leftist activists and Leftist media. They will not stop until they address every vital issue that is important to the everyday lives of Americans.

Hip Hip Hurray for the American Left!!

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'empowerment' arguments/bashing '2nd wave' feminists doesn't address the real problems
Posted by: Theriomorph on May 4, 2007 7:00 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There is nothing more objectifying than poverty.

I agree.

If this article was about increasing financial options for women so they had reasonable alternatives to working in a corrupt sex industry in which all sex workers are truly and completely owned by the industry itself (whether they 'feel' empowered or not), I'd have little argument. But it's not: it's about setting up a false frame, and using a dichotomy about some monolithic ‘feminism’ that oversimplifies and divides, to justify the 'choice' to work in the sex industry, even as it is self-evident in the article that the 'choice' isn't there.

Here, make 600$ cash on a slow shift stripping.

Here, make 300$ for 45 hours of teaching. If you’re lucky.

This is a crime, and a tragedy for real women with real bills to pay. And we need to address it.

I’m not interested in seeing yet another flame war about how ‘pro-sex-work’ feminists are good/third wave and feminists who refuse to support the corruption of the sex industry are prudes/oppressing women who are just trying to pay the bills.

But I think that’s all this article can do, because the frame is one of free and balanced ‘choice’ which doesn’t exist, and of ‘am I feminist or not?’ which is not the issue (and is Alternet the place to ask that question, given the track record of woman-hating comments here? All for seeing Alternet continue to rise above its trolls, but I shudder to think where they’ll go with this one).

As Twisty says, the feminist who supports the sex industry

…confuses “empowerment” with the decision to acquiesce. This is understandable; it’s the one actual choice she has in this game: surrender, or stand and fight. She doesn’t have to be Candida Royalle to recognize that if she chooses the latter all she’ll get for her trouble is ridicule, hostility, suspicion, and the threat of bodily harm.

Feminists who seriously challenge the sex industry are, in my experience, uniformly in support of sex-worker’s safety while they are in the industry, and also for – rapidly - creating financial alternatives to the industry.

Many of them have also worked in the sex industry, and are struggling to create financial options for women which pay a living wage without requiring capitulation to, and active increase of, sexism and misogyny. And they are pro-sex, pro-women, pro-economic parity.

It’s not about judging the stripper or the prostitute, it’s about changing the culture which consumes them and creating alternatives for all of us.

The 'personal story' can enlighten people, but it can also create an impermeable argument in which one person's 'feelings' about their experience trump the larger conversation about systems.

There are plenty of personal stories in which the stripper or prostitute was raped, tortured, sold, killed, etc., too, but on the whole, we're not reading or discussing those personal stories - it's just not titillating enough. We'd rather hear about fishnets and false choice so we don't have to actually confront the systems and create real economic alternatives.

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» True- I'm a teacher Posted by: veggiegrrrl
» RE: True- I'm a teacher Posted by: jasonk
» RE: True- I'm a teacher Posted by: mimosa4real
» RE: True- I'm a teacher Posted by: Logic's Edge
» for logic's edge Posted by: veggiegrrrl
» RE: True- I'm a teacher Posted by: dannrusso
» Amen Posted by: AJN007
It is an economic issue...
Posted by: whataboutthepeople on May 4, 2007 7:09 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I agree feminism about choices. I also strongly believe in sexual freedom on equal terms for men and women. The problem with stripping and subjecting one's self to the sex industry is touched upon by the author -- a woman is not doing it on her terms but on their terms.

Yes, women's choices are limited by economics and circusmtance (divorce, children, school, crappy and/or expensive daycare, college tuition, low wage jobs) -- the fact that people need to turn to the sex industry and risk their health and lives to make a decent wage highlights the economic problems we have in our society right now. We should look at why women (or men) are driven to do this work and try to fix those problems: outrageous higher education tuition, low minimum wage, crappy working conditions, no governmental support for low income workers -- if we eliminated these problems then perhaps working in the sex industry would be a real choice rather than a choice of necessity.

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» RE: It is an economic issue... Posted by: Cathyblj
NOTHING TO DO WITH FEMINISM
Posted by: VZEQICVA on May 4, 2007 7:20 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Women have entertained men since the beginning of time. That's just the way it is. Why they do it is their business. I don't believe that they should be required to answer to the rest of us. Some women are born with the equivalent of a 'talent'. No matter what the approach is to questioning what they do, it always comes across as jealousy. Not everyone wants a corner office. A lady has to pay the rent. Thanks, ANNA

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» RE: NOTHING TO DO WITH FEMINISM Posted by: mmeetoilenoir
A Feminist Stripper?
Posted by: Poindexter on May 4, 2007 7:21 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The author is delusional, sorry to say.

On some level I suppose it may be true that $$ = Empowerment. However...

I'll ignore the objectification issue and read what the women have to say about that - of course, they're more qualified than I to make that judgment.

The money and the empowerment are temporary and highly conditional - and you do not control those conditions, hence there is no real power. The money you earn and the power you imagine you have are based on your ability and willingness to make yourself appear a certain way. In the first place, please forgive my crudeness, but not every waitress or WalMart clerk can don that appearance. So the money that gives you that "power" is only available to a few. Second, even those few able to create the look will only retain that look for a few years - do you see a lot 40-year old strippers and porn stars?

Then you're back to busing tables and stocking shelves - once the book royalties run out, that is.

So the power you imagine you have is based entirely on your fitting a stereotype of someone else's design and the money you earn is a condition of your willingness to be exploited and humiliated on a regular basis.

Men are hard-wired to enjoy the sight of naked nubile women. Well, straight men are; gay men I'm sure must be hard wired to enjoy naked nubile men. We are sexual animals. But no man with half a brain or a shred of decency believes for an instant that dancing nude around a pole for dollar bills gives a woman power. We are under no illusion regarding who has the power in that transaction.

Say it was fun for you. Say it was a kick. Say you were stoned or desperate for the dough. Say it satisfied some psychological need even. I might give you a pass on those rationales - we were all young once and did stupid stuff we hope no one remembers or took pictures of. But build a justification around an imagined empowerment? That's pure fantasy and insults your audience's intelligence.

Stripping is not empowerment. A living wage and the right to live free from exploitation is empowerment.

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» Yeah, but... Posted by: pdxstudent
» RE: Yeah, but... Posted by: jasonk
» RE: Yeah, but... Posted by: delphyne
» RE: Yeah, but... Posted by: jasonk
» RE: Yeah, but... Posted by: mimosa4real
» RE: Yeah, but... Posted by: Ian MacLeod
» RE: A Feminist Stripper? Posted by: MartianBachelor
» idiot! Posted by: Cathyblj
» RE: $75 - not including tips Posted by: MartianBachelor
» RE: $75 - not including tips Posted by: delphyne
Degrading for all
Posted by: Fade on May 4, 2007 7:30 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As a bouncer who worked unpaid at a local strip club for a couple of years, and who eventually married, then divorced a stripper- I saw it all. As an young man I entered into the world of strip clubs with wide eyes and an ear to ear smile. I loved my "girls" at the club. But man, it gets old quick, for the strippers and the men who frequent these places. You hang around long enough, and you see the worst in both sexes. The men for the most part actually end up hating the women, and the women end up hating the men. Not all strippers are prostitutes, but in "the life" things get fuzzy now and then, especially when a girl needs that extra dollar, or more dope to kill her awareness of how disgusting it actually is, beyond the wide-eyed initial impression. Some people boil it down to the essentials - money for sex/simulated sex/attention. But most are mired in all the abstracts-

In the end, you end up hating yourself for being a part of it all. I know that I can't go into a strip club now, without feeling a little used and tainted just by being there. "The life" strips away your sense of humanity and respect. So, can I say that for a woman to be able to choose to live this life is a form of empowerment? Yes. But Empowerment is about being able make choices you want, whether good or bad. And choosing the life, empowered or not- is just a bad choice in the end.

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» RE: Degrading for all Posted by: acidicjazzhead
» RE: Degrading for all Posted by: mememe
Red Brown and Blue Party comment
Posted by: redbrownandblueparty on May 4, 2007 7:45 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
From all this discussion, one thought jumped out at me: women have been "entertaining men since the beginning of time." I believe this is a false myth, introduced by patriarchy, which men and women have bought into hook, line and sucker. "In the beginning" women entertained themselves, and men served the needs of women and their children. That is the natural order, not the perverted partriarchic system we suffer under now. Women living in this corrupted world make the best choices they can; but don't mistake the damaged world of the last 6000 years with reality. A real woman/feminist follows her heart and that involves character, morality and spirituality; subjects which are for the most part off the table in our pale-male sicksociety (sic). The Lover Government honors Love, a womam's (spelling intentional) virtue given to her by nature.

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» RE: ed Brown and Blue Party comment Posted by: Logic's Edge
» RE: ed Brown and Blue Party comment Posted by: MartianBachelor
What About Male Strippers?
Posted by: Bab5nutz on May 4, 2007 8:17 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Okay, there are probably not as many of them as there are male strippers. But they exist. And I bet that there are young men who have stripped their way through college. And what about the women who go to see them? Are they being feminist? Or exploitative?

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» RE: What About Male Strippers? Posted by: schnoggi
» RE: What About Male Strippers? Posted by: pdxstudent
» RE: What About Male Strippers? Posted by: Beanphed
» RE: What About Male Strippers? Posted by: Beanphed
» RE: What About Male Strippers? Posted by: Beanphed