Rep. James Clyburn (D-S.C.), former Trump White House deputy press secretary Hogan Gidley and CNN host Abby Phillip on CNN on September 23, 2025 (Image: Screengrab via CNN / YouTube)
One exchange on CNN grew heated when one of the Republican panelists on Abby Phillip's "Newsnight" defended controversial remarks from slain far-right activist Charlie Kirk.
On Tuesday's episode, Phillip hosted Rep. James Clyburn (D-S.C.), Democratic strategist Xochitl Hinojosa, Republican strategist Brad Reed and Hogan Gidley, who was deputy White House press secretary during President Donald Trump's first administration. At one point, Reed confronted Clyburn and asked him why he didn't add his name to a resolution honoring Kirk. Clyburn responded that while he was happy to honor anyone's life, he wouldn't sign onto a resolution honoring the legacy of someone who had a history of denigrating civil rights leaders and making racist statements.
"When Iturn on my TV and I seesomeone telling me what an awfulperson Martin Luther King Jr. was, when I see somebody tellingme, 'if I get on an airplane and there's a Black pilot I begin to wonder, is he qualified?' Whatdoes that mean?" Clyburn said. "Thoseare the words that came out ofhis mouth."
Gidley pushed back, insisting that Kirk's comments about Black pilots were being taken out of context and that he was making a larger point about affirmative action.
"Charlie Kirk was very clear: If these companies openly say that they have to somehow fill a quota of people, whether it be a race or gender — not based on merit, but based on their race or gender — the obvious should be clear to everyone, which is, is that person then qualified?" Gidley said.
Phillip didn't let Gidley's argument go unchallenged, turning the former Trump staffer's argument back against him. She reminded Gidley that after the late Supreme Court Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg died in September of 2020, Trump promised that he would nominate a woman to replace her. And she pointed out that the full context of Kirk's central argument was that women and people of color were inherently less qualified to do certain jobs than white people.
"You're suggesting that the standard for people of color filling these roles is lower," she said, as Gidley protested. "You said that they are only getting these jobs because of their race and gender, and not because they are qualified. Are they qualified or not? ... Is a pilot sitting on an airplane, flying a plane — whether he's Black or white or a woman or gay or lesbian — if they are sitting in that seat and they meet the FAA requirements to be in that seat, are they qualified?"
"If they are qualified, I sure hope so," Gidley said.
Watch the exchange below: