Historian warns Trump can still usher in fascism 'without there being a fascist system'

When Donald Trump first ran for president in 2000 as a Reform Party candidate, he ran only a marginal campaign. And in February of that year, he dropped out of the race.

But Trump went on win the GOP presidential nomination three elections in a row, and his 2024 campaign was his most successful so far — marking the first time he won both the popular vote and the electoral vote.

Trump was more of moderate back in 2000, expressing center-right views. But he later moved to the far right, and that far-right turn continues to worry historian/author Timothy Snyder.

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During a late December interview with the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation's (CDC) Jayme Poisson, Snyder discussed the United States' 2024 election results and the implications for democracy.

Snyder emphasized that "fascism" doesn't necessarily take the form of full-fledged military dictatorship. And democracies, he said, don't necessarily "yield to fascism" because of authoritarians in uniforms.

"I mean, compare it to, you know, the first four years of Mussolini or whatever," Snyder told Poisson. "I mean, I think people can be fascist without having total power, right? I mean, Mussolini had to deal with the king for a while. He had to deal with parliament for a while. You know, Trump also had to deal with Congress for a while. So you can be a, you can be a fascist without there being a fascist system. Right? You can try to get to power, it doesn't mean you're going to succeed getting into power, you know. And I think that's Trump, right. But the most meaningful part of Trump from the first time, which I don't think people necessarily really remember, is all the lying. And if you're a Trump supporter, it's hard to remember that because you probably believe the lies. And if you believe the lies, you can't remember them as lies."

Snyder told Poisson that "a lot of the American passivity about Trump depends on this implicit idea that thanks to the Constitution — thanks to American exceptionalism, thanks to our inherent goodness, thanks to something — we have a durable democratic system and it will go on regardless of what one person does. And that's, I think, wrong."

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When Poisson asked Snyder what is "different this time around," the historian responded that "people who would be opposing" Trump "are worn out."

Snyder expressed his concerns about some of Trump's nominees, — especially Kash Patel, his nominee for FBI director. Patel, Snyder warned, has "explicitly said" that he "is going to go after political opponents."

The historian/author pointed out that authoritarians don't necessarily come to power via coups — some are voted into office.

Snyder told Poisson, "People who live in democracies and watch movies, you know, will tend to think that the way authoritarianism comes is because a lot of guys show up with weapons, wearing, you know, black shiny boots and uniforms, and suddenly everything changes. And as a dictator, you can do everything. And that's not how it works."

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Snyder continued, "I mean, there are coups. There are people in uniforms. That all matters. But most of the power is still in the people, and people choose to give it away."

Listen to the full CDC interview with Timothy Snyder at this link.