'Lousy witness': Analysts detail 'difference' between Giuliani and 'steward' Meadows’ roles in GA case

28 November 2023

Several co-defendants charged in the Fulton County, Georgia 2020 election criminal case alongside former President Donald Trump, including attorneys Jenna Ellis, Sidney Powell and Kenneth Chesebro, have all accepted plea deals in efforts to avoid time behind bars.

According to a Tuesday, November 28 exclusive report from The Guardian, Fulton County prosecutors do not plan to extend plea deals to the 2024 MAGA hopeful, former Trump attorney Rudy Giuliani and ex-White House Chief of Staff Mark Meadows, however, "Fulton county district attorney Fani Willis has opened plea talks or has left open the possibility of talks with the remaining co-defendants in the hope that they ultimately decide to become cooperating witnesses against the former president," sources said.

During Tuesday's episode of Deadline: White House, guest host Ari Melber asked legal analysts Lisa Rubin and Harry P. Litman to lay out the clear "difference" between "what Rudy Giuliani is to this case and what Mark Meadows is to this case."

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Rubin said, "That's a very good question. I think Mark Meadows was further away from the sort of granular evidence collecting that Rudy Giuliani, Sidney Powell, Jenna Ellis and some of others were involved in. But Rudy Giuliani is also connective tissue in a way, that Mark Meadows is not out. Anna Bower at Lawfare, who Harry and I know for her reporting about the Fulton County case, today connected some social media posts about a meeting at the Willard Hotel with Kathy Latham said to be involved in the Coffee County voting machine scheme. And the story Anna is telling is she met that day at the Willard Hotel with Rudy Giuliani, took pictures with Sidney Powell and Mike Flynn, and then that night, those folks went to the White House, had that infamous meeting with trump that got kind of crazy, out of control where they talked about an executive order to seize the voting machines. So, when I think about Rudy Giuliani, I think about a person whose hands were sort of in all of the cookie jars, right, and the fake elector scheme, and the Coffee County voting machine breach and in communicating directly with Trump. Meadows was at somewhat of a remove, on the other hand, what he allowed to happen and what he encouraged to happen, and the way he talked to both sides, trying to encourage team normal he was with them, encourage team crazy that he was with them. Different in degrees and in-kind Ali."

Velshi replied, "Harry, we've heard a lot from both of these guys, the whole world has heard a lot from Rudy Giuliani whether you wanted to or not over the last few years but heard a lot from Mark Meadows because he got up and spoke. He was trying to get his trial moved and trying to get severed from the main case. So, we know a lot about what he's saying, and Lisa makes a good point. He sort of tried to describe himself as part of team normal. What did he say? 'I was just trying to land the plane for the president. I wasn't really involved in the shenanigans. Tell me what you make of the distinctions between these two guys."

Litman said, "Sure. Lisa makes good points. I'll add. First, we have heard a lot from him and among other things, he is a lousy witness. He can do nothing for them because the cross-examination with all the lies he told in public would completely destroy him. That's one point. Second, he was much more aggressive and brow-beating in Georgia. Remember, she's a local elected prosecutor and he came down and bullied the election workers with the false tale about suitcases, he came down and told tales to the Georgia commission, and Meadows, as you say, could at least say 'I'm trying to steward Trump along.' There are other reasons why he's very culpable, but Giuliani, really terrible witness and really especially involved in beating up on Georgians, and that's something Fani Willis really cares about."

Watch the video below or at this link.

'Lousy': Analysts detail difference between Giuliani and Meadows' roles in fake elector schemeyoutu.be

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