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Are Key Obama Advisors in Tune with Neocon Hawks Who Want to Attack Iran?

Think an attack is unlikely now? Ask key Obama cabinet figures why they're still palling around with neocon hardliners on Iran.
December 3, 2008  |  
 
 
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A familiar coalition of hawks, hardliners, and neoconservatives expects Barack Obama's proposed talks with Iran to fail -- and they're already proposing an escalating set of measures instead. Some are meant to occur alongside any future talks. These include steps to enhance coordination with Israel, tougher sanctions against Iran, and a region-wide military buildup of U.S. strike forces, including the prepositioning of military supplies within striking distance of that country.

Once the future negotiations break down, as they are convinced will happen, they propose that Washington quickly escalate to war-like measures, including a U.S. Navy-enforced embargo on Iranian fuel imports and a blockade of that country's oil exports. Finally, of course, comes the strategic military attack against the Islamic Republic of Iran that so many of them have wanted for so long.

It's tempting to dismiss the hawks now as twice-removed from power: first, figures like John Bolton, Paul Wolfowitz, and Douglas Feith were purged from top posts in the Bush administration after 2004; then the election of Barack Obama and the announcement Monday of his centrist, realist-minded team of establishment foreign policy gurus seemed to nail the doors to power shut for the neocons, who have bitterly criticized the president-elect's plans to talk with Iran, withdraw U.S. forces from Iraq, and abandon the reckless Global War on Terrorism rhetoric of the Bush era.

"Kinetic Action" Against Iran

When it comes to Iran, however, it's far too early to dismiss the hawks. To be sure, they are now plying their trade from outside the corridors of power, but they have more friends inside the Obama camp than most people realize. Several top advisers to Obama -- including Tony Lake, UN Ambassador-designate Susan Rice, Tom Daschle, and Dennis Ross, along with leading Democratic hawks like Richard Holbrooke, close to Vice-President-elect Joe Biden or Secretary of State-designate Hillary Clinton -- have made common cause with war-minded think-tank hawks at the Washington Institute for Near East Policy (WINEP), the American Enterprise Institute (AEI), and other hardline institutes.

Last spring, Tony Lake and Susan Rice, for example, took part in a WINEP "2008 Presidential Task Force" study which resulted in a report entitled, "Strengthening the Partnership: How to Deepen U.S.-Israel Cooperation on the Iranian Nuclear Challenge." The Institute, part of the Washington-based Israel lobby, was founded in coordination with the American-Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC), and has been vigorously supporting a confrontation with Iran. The task force report, issued in June, was overseen by four WINEP heavyweights: Robert Satloff, WINEP's executive director, Patrick Clawson, its chief Iran analyst, David Makovsky, a senior fellow, and Dennis Ross, an adviser to Obama who is also a WINEP fellow.

Endorsed by both Lake and Rice, the report opted for an alarmist view of Iran's nuclear program and proposed that the next president set up a formal U.S.-Israeli mechanism for coordinating policy toward Iran (including any future need for "preventive military action"). It drew attention to Israeli fears that "the United States may be reconciling itself to the idea of 'living with an Iranian nuclear bomb,'" and it raised the spurious fear that Iran plans to arm terrorist groups with nuclear weapons.

There is, of course, nothing wrong with consultations between the United States and Israel. But the WINEP report is clearly predisposed to the idea that the United States ought to give undue weight to Israel's inflated concerns about Iran. And it ignores or dismisses a number of facts: that Iran has no nuclear weapon, that Iran has not enriched uranium to weapons grade, that Iran may not have the know-how to actually construct a weapon even if, sometime in the future, it does manage to acquire bomb-grade material, and that Iran has no known mechanism for delivering such a weapon.

WINEP is correct that the United States must communicate closely with Israel about Iran. Practically speaking, however, a U.S.-Israeli dialogue over Iran's "nuclear challenge" will have to focus on matters entirely different from those in WINEP's agenda. First, the United States must make it crystal clear to Israel that under no circumstances will it tolerate or support a unilateral Israeli attack against Iran. Second, Washington must make it clear that if Israel were indeed to carry out such an attack, the United States would condemn it, refuse to widen the war by coming to Israel's aid, and suspend all military aid to the Jewish state. And third, Israel must get the message that, even given the extreme and unlikely possibility that the United States deems it necessary to go to war with Iran, there would be no role for Israel.


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Robert Dreyfuss, an independent journalist in Alexandria, Virginia, is a contributing editor at the Nation magazine, whose website hosts his The Dreyfuss Report, and has written frequently for Rolling Stone, The American Prospect, Mother Jones, and the Washington Monthly. He is the author of Devil's Game: How the United States Helped Unleash Fundamentalist Islam.
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No Sale ... I Don't See It ...
Posted by: mmckinl on Dec 3, 2008 12:25 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As disappointed as Liberals and Progressives are, Neo Cons will be even more so. I look for Obama to give the Iranians every chance to do a deal to settle issues. Obama has already moved to get our troops out of Iraq so there would be no real staging area for a massive attack except from the sea and perhaps Afghanistan.

By negotiating with Iran Obama can firm up the western flank in Afghanistan, something the Iranians are very capable of doing. Iranians are natural enemies of the Taliban. I believe it was in the 90's when Iran sent a high level delegation to meet the Taliban. The Taliban slaughtered them all, A diplomatic mission ! I believe Obama will put the U.S. interests first and foremost and he knows that to get any real traction on his Afghanistan policy the Iranians will have to be counted.

I believe as far as Israel goes, Obama's priority will be the peace process. He may give Bill Clinton his Nobel platform. Clinton knows the issues there intimately and no progress has been made since he left office 8 years ago.

If Obama is anything, he is a pragmatist.

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» RE: Who are you kidding ... Posted by: mmckinl
» RE: No Sale ... I Don't See It ... Posted by: chicagomachine
» No Sale ... I Don't See It ... Posted by: jooljetkmae

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RE: If we are going to go to war with Iran…
Posted by: chicagomachine on Dec 3, 2008 7:08 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We already have Oilastan, that's Iraq. Iran would be about toppling a nuclear regime before they can get all four ICBMs firing from their old soviet launch units. Iran's really not about SUVs and 25000 calories.

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RE: If we are going to go to war with Iran…
Posted by: 2thepoint on Dec 3, 2008 12:02 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
spoken like someone who has no clue!

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It's not exactly fine with me. In fact I'm outraged.
Posted by: tommy_slothrop on Dec 3, 2008 3:27 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
But your point is right on. Make people take responsibility for the consequences of their lifestyle choices.

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Neo Con Jobs
Posted by: Tom Degan on Dec 3, 2008 3:06 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
OK. Let me see if I got this straight....

Am I to believe that Barack Obama is so jaw droppingly stupid, that he would allow his foreign policy to be hijacked by the very people who destroyed the administration of the jackass who preceded him in the White House?

No. I refuse to believe that we're going to go down that road again.

Bu I've got to be honest with you, kiddies. The make up of this administration is starting to give me the jitters. I'm willing to give President Obama the benefit of the doubt for the time being. He's a whole hell of a lot smarter than I am. It's just that my very worst nightmare is that he would turn out to be a dud ala Bill Clinton.

We shall see what we shall see.

The Defacto President

Tom Degan
Goshen, NY

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» RE: Neo Con Jobs Posted by: douglashoyt
» RE: Neo Con Jobs Posted by: Tom Degan
» RE: Neo Con Jobs FEAR Posted by: grkjr
» RE: Neo Con Jobs Posted by: Shehova
» RE: Neo Con Jobs Posted by: douglashoyt
» RE: Neo Con Jobs Posted by: Shehova
» RE: Neo Con Jobs Posted by: Longdream
» RE: Neo Con Jobs Posted by: Shehova
» haha Posted by: theVRWCwhodatesLiberals
» RE: Neo Con Jobs Posted by: fitzjohn

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War is suicidally stupid.
Posted by: pointyhead on Dec 3, 2008 4:41 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I did NOT vote for Barack Obama in order to get a Bush with a suntan. I voted for CHANGE. And "Change that I can believe in recognizes the puerile waste that is war and puts forth the efforts to circumvent such human failure.

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» RE: War is suicidally stupid. Posted by: douglashoyt
» RE: War is suicidally stupid. Posted by: chicagomachine

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Will the real terrorists please be arrested...
Posted by: americansheep on Dec 3, 2008 5:38 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The "United Against Nuclear Iran" lunatics are meeting and planning a shocking scenario that would destroy a nation. How can meeting like this be legal? If I got together with like depraved minded malcontents and plotted out such a scheme, in secret, would we not be infiltrated and dealt with? These UANI maniacs are gathering openly, and laying out the details of murder and destruction.When I plan a trip, and get on the computer looking for lodging and train schedules and money exchange rates, the more I get it together the more anxious I am to put it all into action. I then buy a ticket and make it happen. UANI has made the plans and now is drooling to make it happen. This dark minded mob should be pre-emptively charged and arrested as terrorist plotters, aiming to overthrow a sovereign nation.

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Holdover Gates
Posted by: reinaldok on Dec 3, 2008 5:52 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I sure would like to find out a lot more about the position Holdover Gates will assume regarding Iran. Will he just follow the same old policy he has taken with the Bush neo-cons? Will Mr. Gates be the very first leopard to actually change his spots? Time will tell (and very quickly). I keep thinking of Papa Bush's lame duck incursion into Somalia.

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Disappointed Already?
Posted by: writerman on Dec 3, 2008 6:08 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I feel really sorry for the millions of young, honest, sincere and idealistic young Americans who voted for Obama, believing that he was a different kind of politician, with an alternative agenda. I think they are going to be terribly disappointed.

Despite the rhetoric of 'change' and 'hope' it's extraordinary how timid Obama's choices of ministers have been. None of these people represent real, substantive, change. They represent continuity above all and bi-partisanship across the aisle.

And isn't this the way the political system really works? There's an awful lot of words and bluster during the campaign ritual. A lot of heat, but not much light. Then afterwards things hastily settle down to normal again. The 'twin party' system takes over again.

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» There will be justice... Posted by: Bobsays
» How do you think he won the nomination? Posted by: rfrancis@godisdead.com

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RE: SAd
Posted by: chicagomachine on Dec 3, 2008 7:03 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Because if unchecked, Iran's nuclear ambitions could threaten our security interests in the region. Being idealistic and thinking we can be isolationist is great, though.

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» RE: SAd Posted by: douglashoyt
» RE: SAd Posted by: chicagomachine

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RE: Sad Meddlers We Be
Posted by: americansheep on Dec 3, 2008 8:28 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
You're right. The USA has no right, rhyme or reason to tell Iran what to do. But the USA is NUMBER ONE at meddling... we meddle and create turmoil all around the globe. When we take our tumble, fall off our empire wall and crack our crowns, we will have to answer to some new empire. Will we be on their hit list?

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» RE: Dear Mr. Chicago-Fear-Machine, Posted by: chicagomachine

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Iran anticipated the same from the next president no matter who won.
Posted by: jwverez on Dec 3, 2008 6:39 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
With Mccain, Iran would know it outright. With Obama however, all too hideous. My guess is the neocons wanted the latter just the way Raygun and Nixon engaged in subtle forms of racism during their presidencies. But with 10 trillion to take care of, I seriously doubt Obama will push for war with Iran. Bush/Cheney couldn't do it and even Mccain would have been forced to face the ongoing severe economic collapse unfolding.

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Bomb bomb bomb Iran
Posted by: solrev on Dec 3, 2008 6:42 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Obama seems to be creating a government to fix it, rather than change it. However, I can not believe he would be stupid enough to attack Iran even with little miss bomb Iran as SS. The Shia government in Iran is the most stable government in the Middle East. I believe Obama will give Iran a chance to play their nuke card. While much of his own government behind closed doors will bad mouth him for it, the American people will love him for it. A friendly Shia Iran would be a great asset against the Sunni fundamentalists in Afghanistan and Pakistan. Look at a map, the Sunni fundamentalists will be trapped between Iran and India, the further they are from Palestine, Egypt, and Saudi Arabia the more stable the Middle East will become, devide and conquer. Normalizing relations with Iran would also go a long way in defusing the Russian cold war, especially if we bring our missiles home. Israel would have to rethink their position in the New World also. The key to watch for will be the Obama energy policy, if he continues the oil guzzle policy of the past, we are in trouble. I made a lot of money betting Obama would win, and if he back steps on the energy policy, I will make a lot of money betting he will lose in 2012.

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» Obama is not stupid. Obama is evil. Posted by: salt-of-the-earth

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Barack Obama says US 'will maintain strongest military on planet'
Posted by: chlamor on Dec 3, 2008 7:02 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
But the former Illinois senator, whose rise was built on his opposition to the Iraq war, delivered a message of surprising toughness that at times could have come from George W Bush.

Mr Obama said: "To ensure prosperity here at home and peace abroad, we all share the belief we have to maintain the strongest military on the planet."

With the responsibilities of office just seven weeks away, he added that his administration was "absolutely committed to eliminating the threat of terrorism".

"We cannot tolerate a world where innocents are being killed by extremists," Mr Obama said in the wake of Bombay attacks, adding that he was "heartbroken" by the deaths of six Americans in the massacre.

"We have to bring the full force of our power, not only military but diplomatic and political, to deal with the threats," he said, also vowing that the US would stand with India.

LINK

Tell me again how this is any different than than words spewing from the mouths of any number of right-wing think tank flunkies that litter the Beltway?

You see it's not that Obama is disappointing his legion of fans, and that's all they were, it's that these political consumers did not do their homework and instead relied on political slogans when choosing Brand Obama. It is they, these folk who blindly supported this very conservative corporate tool, who have disappointed the rest of us who have been talking about the very real policies and positions that Obama promotes as well as who he is and has been surrounded by. And so now you who supported Obama also inherit the responsibility of acting on what will soon be his policies. Are you going to just sit back on your hands as you did during the elections and 'hope' for some magical 'change' that is always around the corner? If so that makes you complicit in whatever vulgar actions your man is about to embark upon. Rest easy citizen. The world is watching.

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» To 'chicago machine' Posted by: chlamor
» RE: To 'chicago machine' Posted by: chicagomachine

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IRAN the start of world war III
Posted by: richholland on Dec 3, 2008 7:03 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Europe Union will not support USA and will try to be neutral and what are China and Russia doing.???

An attack on IRAN means profit for the Rich american families, poverty for workers and middle class and death for little innocent children..
For what, for christ sake for what???

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john visher
Posted by: jvisher on Dec 3, 2008 7:21 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Just because war can be cheap, doesn't make it good. The Iraq war is being fought with mercenaries, well paid. Iran could be destroyed with nuclear weapons, completely leveled, for a small fraction of the cost of the Iraq and Afghanistan wars. It will be done to distract us from the crumbling U.S. empire. Obama is a decent man, but will he deny the truly evil men and women who will be circling around daily, whining for war. I fervently hope and solemnly pray for the strength of the goodness of his character. He must find the courage to reject the war industry. He must be told that our struggles will not be resolved with violence, domination, subjugation, and death or threats of death.

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» RE: john visher Posted by: douglashoyt
» What's the point, douglashoyt, Posted by: LeftWright
» Wars are not meant to be won Posted by: bornxeyed

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still waiting
Posted by: grkjr on Dec 3, 2008 7:44 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am waiting for just one progressive to do what they wanted bush to do for so long... admit they were wrong... that a 3rd party is needed in this country and that a vote out of fear, as always, backfired on them ."least of the two evils" mentality... the spoiler, waste your vote.... on and on... now you get what you, in deniel, asked for. Time to push even harder for a 3rd, not just progressive party of which there is none today.. but to demand that the few democrats who are progressive stand up and lead the charge.

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» RE: still waiting Posted by: douglashoyt
» RE: It's not to late to stop shopping Posted by: americansheep

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Let's Hope no wrong turns for Obama
Posted by: US Citizen on Dec 3, 2008 7:59 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I certainly hope that Obama does not turn out to be another hateful warrior President like George W. Bush, who spends our country's future and present resources on unnecessary wars. An early indication will be if we continue to send drones into Pakistan to kill innocent Pakistanis. Those drone bombings are worse than torture.

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Don't kid yourself.
Posted by: symcokid on Dec 3, 2008 8:20 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Just because Obama is at the helm doesn't mean that this country will be letting up on Iran, they are still in our sights and just realize the strong language Barack has been using of late to boot. Nothing has or will change, it will be the same "Bombs away"!

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A War With Iran Will Mean The End of The Human Race
Posted by: opmoc on Dec 3, 2008 8:22 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There will be no way to stop it escalating and becoming Nuclear very quickly.

Iran is a natural FRIEND of the USA and Europe.

If the US feels like taking any Military action in the Region - it should Take Control of Israel to end the Apartheid and Genocide. People of all races and religions must have equal human rights and opportunites. Running a Country on Racist lines is not acceptable.

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» The animosity toward Iran? Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: The animosity toward Iran? Posted by: chicagomachine

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Let's face it, folks
Posted by: willymack on Dec 3, 2008 8:31 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Iranians are scared half to death of the US. Here are a few reasons why:
1. The bushies stole two elections, and our "congress" and people LET THEM DO IT, and get away with it.
2. Unlike our clueless citizens, the Iranians saw through the 911 coverup, and realized how truly pathologically evil this regime is.
3. Iran watched with shocked horror as the US attacked their neighbor, Iraq, based on dirty lies, and even though every reason given for the attack was proven false, proceeded with a brutal occupation, anyway.
4. The Iranians know full well what it's like to be under constant threat from a phony president and a gang of what amounts to homicidal lunatics. Think about the demented orangtan, armed with a straight razor in E. A. Poe's "Murders on the Rue Morgue".
5. Obama seems to be more normal and reasonable, but he won't be president until 12PM, Jan. 20th, 2009. The bushies still have plenty of time to unleash yet another horror. Who in his right mind would put ANYTHING past them?

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» Least of all you Posted by: salt-of-the-earth
» RE: Least of all you Posted by: 2thepoint

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I can assure you, Obama is on board for the Iran strike
Posted by: Bobsays on Dec 3, 2008 9:39 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The strike was always going to happen early 2009. Obama was cool with that. Retired military personnel are getting re-call notices right now, to beef up the military.

Things are going to go very haywire at the beginning of 2009, but that is the right time to do it. And then the war campaign can bed down and accomplish its goals during the term. Better to go crazy at first so you have time to clear up and lock it down for the next election.

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OMG !!!
Posted by: gellero1 on Dec 3, 2008 9:41 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Are the nay-sayers now claiming The Messiah is a Skull&Bones, Bush-Cheney mole placed by the Illuminati/Bilderberg/TriLateral folks to continue their oppressive role over us??

Do you mean "change" was just a con job, and the Messiah is really just a celebrity, just as McLame claimed??

Help !!

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» Yep! Posted by: Bobsays
» Thank You Posted by: opmoc
» The phone is ringing! Posted by: 2thepoint

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Has everyone lost their F'ing minds???!!!
Posted by: 6399 on Dec 3, 2008 10:52 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Anyone looking in on this from the outside must surely conclude that the Americans and Israelis (along with their Zionist AIPAC puppets here in the US) are lunatics.

First, we have the US--the only power to actually utilize such a weapon as the acting barometer for what is acceptable and what is not in terms of nuclear etiquette. You have got to be kidding me.

Second, we have Israel--the smallest country to ever hold sway (overlordship is more like it) over a country more than 45 times its size and hundreds of times wealthier. And while Israel has never openly admitted possessing nukes, it's more or less accepted as fact, and yet we don't hear anyone clamoring for nuclear inspections there.

"It drew attention to Israeli fears that "the United States may be reconciling itself to the idea of 'living with an Iranian nuclear bomb,'" and it raised the spurious fear that Iran plans to arm terrorist groups with nuclear weapons."

That is precisely what is going to happen and Israel is going to damn well learn to accept it. Just how much longer will we allow a smaller combative country to run roughshod over the region and the supposed leader of the free world. Actually, I guess that makes Israel the leader of the free world.

Time to cut the apron strings and allow Israel to sink or swim on its own. Time for Jews in this country to realize that not all of us are interested in propping up their symbolic homeland in the name of Elijah or anyone else.

Israel is committing atrocities in the name of religion and the US is its greatest enabler. Blockades are preventing food and medicine from reaching the Palestinians at this very moment and we wonder why there are so widely detested in the Middle East.

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You gotta "read" the owning class to know what's comin' at ya'
Posted by: DaBear on Dec 3, 2008 10:57 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If there's one thing four decades at the bottom of the class heap has taught me is how to read the owning class, those who make up the rules and pretend there are none. Yes, you do have to listen to what they say because you need to decrypt their codes so you know what they're really saying to or about you (if you don't you're gonna be spanked and hard more often than not). But most importantly you have to know how to read their actions and body language.

Every single person in the new Obama administration is owning class. You cannot watch an owning-classer stack his "team" with other owning-classers who lust for soldiering and the use of our people as fodder (afterall, we're just "the help," "their girl," "their boy"--oh yes, they actually do refer to us at the bottom as pre-Civil War plantation owners referred to their household slaves and that ain't no accident, people) and think that those choices of peers are going to mean something other than the very worst for all of us. well, you can but you're sure to have a really sore backside once the owning-classers begin to act out their snuff-fantasies on us.

Obama's a swell guy, a nice man, smart and open-minded. But he's an owning class guy. And he's not your friend (unless you're an owning classer or a middling serf sycophant). Just watch, the coded excuses are coming already: he's picked his advisors but insists he's still in charge... mmmhmmm. I've heard that one many times just before the owning class master cuts "the help" loose without pay, based on the advice of those advisors we weren't supposed to notice or fear behind the curtains....

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Michelle To Barack: "So What's The Coven Like Now?"
Posted by: opmoc on Dec 3, 2008 11:03 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Barack: "Don't be silly love - I just did all that shit to get in"

Michelle: "You mean you haven't had anal sex with Hilary whilst sucking the blood of a sacrificed goat in front of the entire elite in the firey dunegon under candelight?"

Barack: "Why the fuck do you think I would want to have any kind of sex with that cow?"

Michelle: "Well it's part of the rules - We agreed that when you went up for this thing that you would have sex with Hilary"

Barack: "Look Michelle - You are My Wife - I Love You To Bits. You Are Not Only The Most Sexy Woman In The World - But You Are Also The First Lady"

Michelle: "Thank Fuck For That - But What Do We Do With All The Crazy Neo-cons and The Devil Merchants?"

Barack: "Not a Problem - They Are All On My Team Now - and They Are On Our Side"

Michelle: "Won't They Try and Control You?"

Barack: " You Think Those Stupid Bastards Are Going To Control Me? - I Am The President of America - You Are The First Lady"

Well - if The Protection Team Keeps them Both Alive For another 6 weeks God Willing.

Apologies for any offence

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» bad ass post Posted by: theVRWCwhodatesLiberals
» RE: offens--shit--OFFENCE? Posted by: Longdream

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LEAVE BIRDS OUT OF THIS
Posted by: elidude420 on Dec 3, 2008 11:15 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The hawk is a majestic species of animal that does not spread depleted uranium over other countries.

Stop elevating the evilest of people on the planet to the level of animal (let alone human.)

Stop calling war criminals birds!!!

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» RE: LEAVE BIRDS OUT OF THIS Posted by: chicagomachine

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Israeli militarists continue to scheme for US war with Iran
Posted by: Garvagh on Dec 3, 2008 11:24 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Bravo! More than twenty surprise inspections of Iranian nuclear facilities have shown no diversion of nuclear materials from the civilian nuclear power program Iran is proceeding with (helped by Russia, which opposes any Iranian nuclear weapons capability).

Israeli militarists in alliance with Aipac continue to demonize Iran and deceive the American public into thinking Iran poses a threat. This is a reprise of the vicious lying and scheming that brought us the Iraq War catastrophe.

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» Garvagh hit the nail on the head Posted by: salt-of-the-earth
» RE: Garvagh hit the nail on the head Posted by: salt-of-the-earth

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Obama was raised by Wiccans and now he's handled by Luciferians (same thing really)
Posted by: salt-of-the-earth on Dec 3, 2008 1:18 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What is the big shock that he's planning war with Iran and now Pakistan and Russia and China?

First goodie I want from Obama is a bomb shelter. Forget the free healthcare, the green meanie brigades, the 1 million young tattletales to be armed with machine guns in the tattletale brigade and hired to come and harass us for excuding too much carbon, having hte wrong kind of lightbulbs, or whatever --

You can be sure Obama and the rest of the elites have nice comfy safe places to go UNDERGROUND when the stuff hits the fan.

JUST BUILD US SOME DAMNED BOMB SHELTERS!

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There will be no war with Iran.
Posted by: yellow on Dec 3, 2008 2:22 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Stop with the fuckin hysteria already.

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» RE: All Day Anti-Iran Babble Posted by: americansheep

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It may just be possible.
Posted by: Longdream on Dec 3, 2008 4:53 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It may just be possible that his cabinet and advisors are not going to tell Barack what to do--that it's going to be vice-versa.

It may just be possible that Barack is as sane and sober as he looks, and twice as gifted.

And it may just be possible that he's going to struggle anyway, and maybe fail sometimes, because the problems are so deep and wide.

There isn't anyone on the scene that I would rather have in charge right now than Barack Obama. At least I feel confident that he is who he says he is--I've read enough disinterested third party testimony to support him. I've read him, read about him, listened to him and watched him.

Barack is no fool, he doesn't suffer fools, and he's pretty damned quick. He's our best chance to end up better off than we are now after some years go by.

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» RE: COLIN POWELL A GOOD MAN? Posted by: americansheep

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Well I am Rather Drunk and I have Also Been Smoking and am Litening To AC/DC
Posted by: opmoc on Dec 3, 2008 5:59 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I Reckon We Should at Leat Give

Barack Obama

A Chance

I Reckon He's a Good Guy and I Know His Wife Is Lovely

Our Planet is In Your Hands

Look After Us

Love & Peace,

Tony

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*opens door*
Posted by: Longdream on Dec 3, 2008 8:25 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Thank for coming so quickly.

They're both right here.

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This comment has been removed from the site due to non-compliance with AlterNet's community policies.

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An administration of change?
Posted by: IPF on Dec 3, 2008 9:18 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Exqueeze me? What change - he's appointed all Washington insiders!!!! And Hillary. And he's already talking about facing down Iran!

Obama's Change=more of the same.

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» RE: An administration of change? Posted by: chicagomachine

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Can Someone Please Answer Me a Most Basic Question - When You Have a Cremation...
Posted by: opmoc on Dec 3, 2008 9:20 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Do They Slip The Body out Of The Coffin - and Re-Use It?

It seems a completely unnecessary waste of Wood otherwise.

But I Don't Know.

I'm Conventional

We dig a great big hole - and the body goes down in the coffin - to the bottom of the hole

And we all chuck some Earth on the Coffin to say goodbye

And then the blokes who work at the cemetary cover it up in Earth and we think that is the end of it...

But do these gardners go and dig up the bodies and salvage their coffins to be re-used on the second hand market - well I don't think so in England - but that has not answered the question about cremations

The Environmentalists Will No Doubt Have An Answer

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lets hope not
Posted by: whealeydj on Dec 7, 2008 8:20 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
as we cannot afford another stupid intervention.

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Alternet Comments:

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No Sale ... I Don't See It ...
Posted by: mmckinl on Dec 3, 2008 12:25 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As disappointed as Liberals and Progressives are, Neo Cons will be even more so. I look for Obama to give the Iranians every chance to do a deal to settle issues. Obama has already moved to get our troops out of Iraq so there would be no real staging area for a massive attack except from the sea and perhaps Afghanistan.

By negotiating with Iran Obama can firm up the western flank in Afghanistan, something the Iranians are very capable of doing. Iranians are natural enemies of the Taliban. I believe it was in the 90's when Iran sent a high level delegation to meet the Taliban. The Taliban slaughtered them all, A diplomatic mission ! I believe Obama will put the U.S. interests first and foremost and he knows that to get any real traction on his Afghanistan policy the Iranians will have to be counted.

I believe as far as Israel goes, Obama's priority will be the peace process. He may give Bill Clinton his Nobel platform. Clinton knows the issues there intimately and no progress has been made since he left office 8 years ago.

If Obama is anything, he is a pragmatist.

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» RE: Who are you kidding ... Posted by: mmckinl
» RE: No Sale ... I Don't See It ... Posted by: chicagomachine
» No Sale ... I Don't See It ... Posted by: jooljetkmae

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RE: If we are going to go to war with Iran…
Posted by: chicagomachine on Dec 3, 2008 7:08 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We already have Oilastan, that's Iraq. Iran would be about toppling a nuclear regime before they can get all four ICBMs firing from their old soviet launch units. Iran's really not about SUVs and 25000 calories.

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RE: If we are going to go to war with Iran…
Posted by: 2thepoint on Dec 3, 2008 12:02 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
spoken like someone who has no clue!

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It's not exactly fine with me. In fact I'm outraged.
Posted by: tommy_slothrop on Dec 3, 2008 3:27 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
But your point is right on. Make people take responsibility for the consequences of their lifestyle choices.

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Neo Con Jobs
Posted by: Tom Degan on Dec 3, 2008 3:06 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
OK. Let me see if I got this straight....

Am I to believe that Barack Obama is so jaw droppingly stupid, that he would allow his foreign policy to be hijacked by the very people who destroyed the administration of the jackass who preceded him in the White House?

No. I refuse to believe that we're going to go down that road again.

Bu I've got to be honest with you, kiddies. The make up of this administration is starting to give me the jitters. I'm willing to give President Obama the benefit of the doubt for the time being. He's a whole hell of a lot smarter than I am. It's just that my very worst nightmare is that he would turn out to be a dud ala Bill Clinton.

We shall see what we shall see.

The Defacto President

Tom Degan
Goshen, NY

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» RE: Neo Con Jobs Posted by: douglashoyt
» RE: Neo Con Jobs Posted by: Tom Degan
» RE: Neo Con Jobs FEAR Posted by: grkjr
» RE: Neo Con Jobs Posted by: Shehova
» RE: Neo Con Jobs Posted by: douglashoyt
» RE: Neo Con Jobs Posted by: Shehova
» RE: Neo Con Jobs Posted by: Longdream
» RE: Neo Con Jobs Posted by: Shehova
» haha Posted by: theVRWCwhodatesLiberals
» RE: Neo Con Jobs Posted by: fitzjohn

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War is suicidally stupid.
Posted by: pointyhead on Dec 3, 2008 4:41 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I did NOT vote for Barack Obama in order to get a Bush with a suntan. I voted for CHANGE. And "Change that I can believe in recognizes the puerile waste that is war and puts forth the efforts to circumvent such human failure.

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» RE: War is suicidally stupid. Posted by: douglashoyt
» RE: War is suicidally stupid. Posted by: chicagomachine

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Will the real terrorists please be arrested...
Posted by: americansheep on Dec 3, 2008 5:38 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The "United Against Nuclear Iran" lunatics are meeting and planning a shocking scenario that would destroy a nation. How can meeting like this be legal? If I got together with like depraved minded malcontents and plotted out such a scheme, in secret, would we not be infiltrated and dealt with? These UANI maniacs are gathering openly, and laying out the details of murder and destruction.When I plan a trip, and get on the computer looking for lodging and train schedules and money exchange rates, the more I get it together the more anxious I am to put it all into action. I then buy a ticket and make it happen. UANI has made the plans and now is drooling to make it happen. This dark minded mob should be pre-emptively charged and arrested as terrorist plotters, aiming to overthrow a sovereign nation.

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Holdover Gates
Posted by: reinaldok on Dec 3, 2008 5:52 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I sure would like to find out a lot more about the position Holdover Gates will assume regarding Iran. Will he just follow the same old policy he has taken with the Bush neo-cons? Will Mr. Gates be the very first leopard to actually change his spots? Time will tell (and very quickly). I keep thinking of Papa Bush's lame duck incursion into Somalia.

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Disappointed Already?
Posted by: writerman on Dec 3, 2008 6:08 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I feel really sorry for the millions of young, honest, sincere and idealistic young Americans who voted for Obama, believing that he was a different kind of politician, with an alternative agenda. I think they are going to be terribly disappointed.

Despite the rhetoric of 'change' and 'hope' it's extraordinary how timid Obama's choices of ministers have been. None of these people represent real, substantive, change. They represent continuity above all and bi-partisanship across the aisle.

And isn't this the way the political system really works? There's an awful lot of words and bluster during the campaign ritual. A lot of heat, but not much light. Then afterwards things hastily settle down to normal again. The 'twin party' system takes over again.

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» There will be justice... Posted by: Bobsays
» How do you think he won the nomination? Posted by: rfrancis@godisdead.com

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RE: SAd
Posted by: chicagomachine on Dec 3, 2008 7:03 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Because if unchecked, Iran's nuclear ambitions could threaten our security interests in the region. Being idealistic and thinking we can be isolationist is great, though.

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» RE: SAd Posted by: douglashoyt
» RE: SAd Posted by: chicagomachine

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RE: Sad Meddlers We Be
Posted by: americansheep on Dec 3, 2008 8:28 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
You're right. The USA has no right, rhyme or reason to tell Iran what to do. But the USA is NUMBER ONE at meddling... we meddle and create turmoil all around the globe. When we take our tumble, fall off our empire wall and crack our crowns, we will have to answer to some new empire. Will we be on their hit list?

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» RE: Dear Mr. Chicago-Fear-Machine, Posted by: chicagomachine

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Iran anticipated the same from the next president no matter who won.
Posted by: jwverez on Dec 3, 2008 6:39 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
With Mccain, Iran would know it outright. With Obama however, all too hideous. My guess is the neocons wanted the latter just the way Raygun and Nixon engaged in subtle forms of racism during their presidencies. But with 10 trillion to take care of, I seriously doubt Obama will push for war with Iran. Bush/Cheney couldn't do it and even Mccain would have been forced to face the ongoing severe economic collapse unfolding.

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Bomb bomb bomb Iran
Posted by: solrev on Dec 3, 2008 6:42 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Obama seems to be creating a government to fix it, rather than change it. However, I can not believe he would be stupid enough to attack Iran even with little miss bomb Iran as SS. The Shia government in Iran is the most stable government in the Middle East. I believe Obama will give Iran a chance to play their nuke card. While much of his own government behind closed doors will bad mouth him for it, the American people will love him for it. A friendly Shia Iran would be a great asset against the Sunni fundamentalists in Afghanistan and Pakistan. Look at a map, the Sunni fundamentalists will be trapped between Iran and India, the further they are from Palestine, Egypt, and Saudi Arabia the more stable the Middle East will become, devide and conquer. Normalizing relations with Iran would also go a long way in defusing the Russian cold war, especially if we bring our missiles home. Israel would have to rethink their position in the New World also. The key to watch for will be the Obama energy policy, if he continues the oil guzzle policy of the past, we are in trouble. I made a lot of money betting Obama would win, and if he back steps on the energy policy, I will make a lot of money betting he will lose in 2012.

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» Obama is not stupid. Obama is evil. Posted by: salt-of-the-earth

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Barack Obama says US 'will maintain strongest military on planet'
Posted by: chlamor on Dec 3, 2008 7:02 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
But the former Illinois senator, whose rise was built on his opposition to the Iraq war, delivered a message of surprising toughness that at times could have come from George W Bush.

Mr Obama said: "To ensure prosperity here at home and peace abroad, we all share the belief we have to maintain the strongest military on the planet."

With the responsibilities of office just seven weeks away, he added that his administration was "absolutely committed to eliminating the threat of terrorism".

"We cannot tolerate a world where innocents are being killed by extremists," Mr Obama said in the wake of Bombay attacks, adding that he was "heartbroken" by the deaths of six Americans in the massacre.

"We have to bring the full force of our power, not only military but diplomatic and political, to deal with the threats," he said, also vowing that the US would stand with India.

LINK

Tell me again how this is any different than than words spewing from the mouths of any number of right-wing think tank flunkies that litter the Beltway?

You see it's not that Obama is disappointing his legion of fans, and that's all they were, it's that these political consumers did not do their homework and instead relied on political slogans when choosing Brand Obama. It is they, these folk who blindly supported this very conservative corporate tool, who have disappointed the rest of us who have been talking about the very real policies and positions that Obama promotes as well as who he is and has been surrounded by. And so now you who supported Obama also inherit the responsibility of acting on what will soon be his policies. Are you going to just sit back on your hands as you did during the elections and 'hope' for some magical 'change' that is always around the corner? If so that makes you complicit in whatever vulgar actions your man is about to embark upon. Rest easy citizen. The world is watching.

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» To 'chicago machine' Posted by: chlamor
» RE: To 'chicago machine' Posted by: chicagomachine

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IRAN the start of world war III
Posted by: richholland on Dec 3, 2008 7:03 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Europe Union will not support USA and will try to be neutral and what are China and Russia doing.???

An attack on IRAN means profit for the Rich american families, poverty for workers and middle class and death for little innocent children..
For what, for christ sake for what???

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john visher
Posted by: jvisher on Dec 3, 2008 7:21 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Just because war can be cheap, doesn't make it good. The Iraq war is being fought with mercenaries, well paid. Iran could be destroyed with nuclear weapons, completely leveled, for a small fraction of the cost of the Iraq and Afghanistan wars. It will be done to distract us from the crumbling U.S. empire. Obama is a decent man, but will he deny the truly evil men and women who will be circling around daily, whining for war. I fervently hope and solemnly pray for the strength of the goodness of his character. He must find the courage to reject the war industry. He must be told that our struggles will not be resolved with violence, domination, subjugation, and death or threats of death.

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» RE: john visher Posted by: douglashoyt
» What's the point, douglashoyt, Posted by: LeftWright
» Wars are not meant to be won Posted by: bornxeyed

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still waiting
Posted by: grkjr on Dec 3, 2008 7:44 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am waiting for just one progressive to do what they wanted bush to do for so long... admit they were wrong... that a 3rd party is needed in this country and that a vote out of fear, as always, backfired on them ."least of the two evils" mentality... the spoiler, waste your vote.... on and on... now you get what you, in deniel, asked for. Time to push even harder for a 3rd, not just progressive party of which there is none today.. but to demand that the few democrats who are progressive stand up and lead the charge.

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» RE: still waiting Posted by: douglashoyt
» RE: It's not to late to stop shopping Posted by: americansheep

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Let's Hope no wrong turns for Obama
Posted by: US Citizen on Dec 3, 2008 7:59 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I certainly hope that Obama does not turn out to be another hateful warrior President like George W. Bush, who spends our country's future and present resources on unnecessary wars. An early indication will be if we continue to send drones into Pakistan to kill innocent Pakistanis. Those drone bombings are worse than torture.

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Don't kid yourself.
Posted by: symcokid on Dec 3, 2008 8:20 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Just because Obama is at the helm doesn't mean that this country will be letting up on Iran, they are still in our sights and just realize the strong language Barack has been using of late to boot. Nothing has or will change, it will be the same "Bombs away"!

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A War With Iran Will Mean The End of The Human Race
Posted by: opmoc on Dec 3, 2008 8:22 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There will be no way to stop it escalating and becoming Nuclear very quickly.

Iran is a natural FRIEND of the USA and Europe.

If the US feels like taking any Military action in the Region - it should Take Control of Israel to end the Apartheid and Genocide. People of all races and religions must have equal human rights and opportunites. Running a Country on Racist lines is not acceptable.

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» The animosity toward Iran? Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: The animosity toward Iran? Posted by: chicagomachine

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Let's face it, folks
Posted by: willymack on Dec 3, 2008 8:31 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Iranians are scared half to death of the US. Here are a few reasons why:
1. The bushies stole two elections, and our "congress" and people LET THEM DO IT, and get away with it.
2. Unlike our clueless citizens, the Iranians saw through the 911 coverup, and realized how truly pathologically evil this regime is.
3. Iran watched with shocked horror as the US attacked their neighbor, Iraq, based on dirty lies, and even though every reason given for the attack was proven false, proceeded with a brutal occupation, anyway.
4. The Iranians know full well what it's like to be under constant threat from a phony president and a gang of what amounts to homicidal lunatics. Think about the demented orangtan, armed with a straight razor in E. A. Poe's "Murders on the Rue Morgue".
5. Obama seems to be more normal and reasonable, but he won't be president until 12PM, Jan. 20th, 2009. The bushies still have plenty of time to unleash yet another horror. Who in his right mind would put ANYTHING past them?

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» Least of all you Posted by: salt-of-the-earth
» RE: Least of all you Posted by: 2thepoint

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I can assure you, Obama is on board for the Iran strike
Posted by: Bobsays on Dec 3, 2008 9:39 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The strike was always going to happen early 2009. Obama was cool with that. Retired military personnel are getting re-call notices right now, to beef up the military.

Things are going to go very haywire at the beginning of 2009, but that is the right time to do it. And then the war campaign can bed down and accomplish its goals during the term. Better to go crazy at first so you have time to clear up and lock it down for the next election.

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OMG !!!
Posted by: gellero1 on Dec 3, 2008 9:41 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Are the nay-sayers now claiming The Messiah is a Skull&Bones, Bush-Cheney mole placed by the Illuminati/Bilderberg/TriLateral folks to continue their oppressive role over us??

Do you mean "change" was just a con job, and the Messiah is really just a celebrity, just as McLame claimed??

Help !!

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» Yep! Posted by: Bobsays
» Thank You Posted by: opmoc
» The phone is ringing! Posted by: 2thepoint

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Has everyone lost their F'ing minds???!!!
Posted by: 6399 on Dec 3, 2008 10:52 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Anyone looking in on this from the outside must surely conclude that the Americans and Israelis (along with their Zionist AIPAC puppets here in the US) are lunatics.

First, we have the US--the only power to actually utilize such a weapon as the acting barometer for what is acceptable and what is not in terms of nuclear etiquette. You have got to be kidding me.

Second, we have Israel--the smallest country to ever hold sway (overlordship is more like it) over a country more than 45 times its size and hundreds of times wealthier. And while Israel has never openly admitted possessing nukes, it's more or less accepted as fact, and yet we don't hear anyone clamoring for nuclear inspections there.

"It drew attention to Israeli fears that "the United States may be reconciling itself to the idea of 'living with an Iranian nuclear bomb,'" and it raised the spurious fear that Iran plans to arm terrorist groups with nuclear weapons."

That is precisely what is going to happen and Israel is going to damn well learn to accept it. Just how much longer will we allow a smaller combative country to run roughshod over the region and the supposed leader of the free world. Actually, I guess that makes Israel the leader of the free world.

Time to cut the apron strings and allow Israel to sink or swim on its own. Time for Jews in this country to realize that not all of us are interested in propping up their symbolic homeland in the name of Elijah or anyone else.

Israel is committing atrocities in the name of religion and the US is its greatest enabler. Blockades are preventing food and medicine from reaching the Palestinians at this very moment and we wonder why there are so widely detested in the Middle East.

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You gotta "read" the owning class to know what's comin' at ya'
Posted by: DaBear on Dec 3, 2008 10:57 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If there's one thing four decades at the bottom of the class heap has taught me is how to read the owning class, those who make up the rules and pretend there are none. Yes, you do have to listen to what they say because you need to decrypt their codes so you know what they're really saying to or about you (if you don't you're gonna be spanked and hard more often than not). But most importantly you have to know how to read their actions and body language.

Every single person in the new Obama administration is owning class. You cannot watch an owning-classer stack his "team" with other owning-classers who lust for soldiering and the use of our people as fodder (afterall, we're just "the help," "their girl," "their boy"--oh yes, they actually do refer to us at the bottom as pre-Civil War plantation owners referred to their household slaves and that ain't no accident, people) and think that those choices of peers are going to mean something other than the very worst for all of us. well, you can but you're sure to have a really sore backside once the owning-classers begin to act out their snuff-fantasies on us.

Obama's a swell guy, a nice man, smart and open-minded. But he's an owning class guy. And he's not your friend (unless you're an owning classer or a middling serf sycophant). Just watch, the coded excuses are coming already: he's picked his advisors but insists he's still in charge... mmmhmmm. I've heard that one many times just before the owning class master cuts "the help" loose without pay, based on the advice of those advisors we weren't supposed to notice or fear behind the curtains....

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Michelle To Barack: "So What's The Coven Like Now?"
Posted by: opmoc on Dec 3, 2008 11:03 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Barack: "Don't be silly love - I just did all that shit to get in"

Michelle: "You mean you haven't had anal sex with Hilary whilst sucking the blood of a sacrificed goat in front of the entire elite in the firey dunegon under candelight?"

Barack: "Why the fuck do you think I would want to have any kind of sex with that cow?"

Michelle: "Well it's part of the rules - We agreed that when you went up for this thing that you would have sex with Hilary"

Barack: "Look Michelle - You are My Wife - I Love You To Bits. You Are Not Only The Most Sexy Woman In The World - But You Are Also The First Lady"

Michelle: "Thank Fuck For That - But What Do We Do With All The Crazy Neo-cons and The Devil Merchants?"

Barack: "Not a Problem - They Are All On My Team Now - and They Are On Our Side"

Michelle: "Won't They Try and Control You?"

Barack: " You Think Those Stupid Bastards Are Going To Control Me? - I Am The President of America - You Are The First Lady"

Well - if The Protection Team Keeps them Both Alive For another 6 weeks God Willing.

Apologies for any offence

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» bad ass post Posted by: theVRWCwhodatesLiberals
» RE: offens--shit--OFFENCE? Posted by: Longdream

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LEAVE BIRDS OUT OF THIS
Posted by: elidude420 on Dec 3, 2008 11:15 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The hawk is a majestic species of animal that does not spread depleted uranium over other countries.

Stop elevating the evilest of people on the planet to the level of animal (let alone human.)

Stop calling war criminals birds!!!

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» RE: LEAVE BIRDS OUT OF THIS Posted by: chicagomachine

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Israeli militarists continue to scheme for US war with Iran
Posted by: Garvagh on Dec 3, 2008 11:24 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Bravo! More than twenty surprise inspections of Iranian nuclear facilities have shown no diversion of nuclear materials from the civilian nuclear power program Iran is proceeding with (helped by Russia, which opposes any Iranian nuclear weapons capability).

Israeli militarists in alliance with Aipac continue to demonize Iran and deceive the American public into thinking Iran poses a threat. This is a reprise of the vicious lying and scheming that brought us the Iraq War catastrophe.

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» Garvagh hit the nail on the head Posted by: salt-of-the-earth
» RE: Garvagh hit the nail on the head Posted by: salt-of-the-earth

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Obama was raised by Wiccans and now he's handled by Luciferians (same thing really)
Posted by: salt-of-the-earth on Dec 3, 2008 1:18 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What is the big shock that he's planning war with Iran and now Pakistan and Russia and China?

First goodie I want from Obama is a bomb shelter. Forget the free healthcare, the green meanie brigades, the 1 million young tattletales to be armed with machine guns in the tattletale brigade and hired to come and harass us for excuding too much carbon, having hte wrong kind of lightbulbs, or whatever --

You can be sure Obama and the rest of the elites have nice comfy safe places to go UNDERGROUND when the stuff hits the fan.

JUST BUILD US SOME DAMNED BOMB SHELTERS!

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There will be no war with Iran.
Posted by: yellow on Dec 3, 2008 2:22 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Stop with the fuckin hysteria already.

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» RE: All Day Anti-Iran Babble Posted by: americansheep

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It may just be possible.
Posted by: Longdream on Dec 3, 2008 4:53 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It may just be possible that his cabinet and advisors are not going to tell Barack what to do--that it's going to be vice-versa.

It may just be possible that Barack is as sane and sober as he looks, and twice as gifted.

And it may just be possible that he's going to struggle anyway, and maybe fail sometimes, because the problems are so deep and wide.

There isn't anyone on the scene that I would rather have in charge right now than Barack Obama. At least I feel confident that he is who he says he is--I've read enough disinterested third party testimony to support him. I've read him, read about him, listened to him and watched him.

Barack is no fool, he doesn't suffer fools, and he's pretty damned quick. He's our best chance to end up better off than we are now after some years go by.

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» RE: COLIN POWELL A GOOD MAN? Posted by: americansheep

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Well I am Rather Drunk and I have Also Been Smoking and am Litening To AC/DC
Posted by: opmoc on Dec 3, 2008 5:59 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I Reckon We Should at Leat Give

Barack Obama

A Chance

I Reckon He's a Good Guy and I Know His Wife Is Lovely

Our Planet is In Your Hands

Look After Us

Love & Peace,

Tony

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*opens door*
Posted by: Longdream on Dec 3, 2008 8:25 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Thank for coming so quickly.

They're both right here.

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This comment has been removed from the site due to non-compliance with AlterNet's community policies.

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An administration of change?
Posted by: IPF on Dec 3, 2008 9:18 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Exqueeze me? What change - he's appointed all Washington insiders!!!! And Hillary. And he's already talking about facing down Iran!

Obama's Change=more of the same.

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» RE: An administration of change? Posted by: chicagomachine

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Can Someone Please Answer Me a Most Basic Question - When You Have a Cremation...
Posted by: opmoc on Dec 3, 2008 9:20 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Do They Slip The Body out Of The Coffin - and Re-Use It?

It seems a completely unnecessary waste of Wood otherwise.

But I Don't Know.

I'm Conventional

We dig a great big hole - and the body goes down in the coffin - to the bottom of the hole

And we all chuck some Earth on the Coffin to say goodbye

And then the blokes who work at the cemetary cover it up in Earth and we think that is the end of it...

But do these gardners go and dig up the bodies and salvage their coffins to be re-used on the second hand market - well I don't think so in England - but that has not answered the question about cremations

The Environmentalists Will No Doubt Have An Answer

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lets hope not
Posted by: whealeydj on Dec 7, 2008 8:20 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
as we cannot afford another stupid intervention.

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