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Corporate Accountability and WorkPlace

Will Wall Street's Meltdown Turn America Into a Police State?

By Scott Thill, AlterNet. Posted September 30, 2008.


Failing banks? Endless war? Call Homeland Security.
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"Raw capitalism is dead." -- Henry Paulson, U.S. Treasury secretary

"Can't we just all go out and say things are OK?" -- President Bush, to congressional leaders during bailout negotiations

I'm not much of an Army Times reader, but after reading that a brigade was shipping from Iraq in October to serve as "an on-call federal response force for natural or manmade emergencies and disasters, including terrorist attacks" in the homeland right before the election, my antennae perked up. Same as they did when I read that an electoral college doomsday scenario exists in which Dick Cheney casts the deciding vote that gives McCain-Palin the White House.

That is, if Cheney and Bush don't take it for themselves. That may sound like fantasy, but don't kill the messenger. They are all strands of the Gordian knot the Bush administration has tied around the neck of the American people for the last two presidential terms, best represented today by the failed bailout of banks, brokers and other complicit parties that have since jacked the American people out of trillions. And while the Army Times revelation or election doomsday may turn out to be paranoia rather than prescience, the evidence just isn't there.

Like I said: antennae.

They've come in handy as bullshit detectors since Bush stole the election from a flat-footed Al Gore and set about engineering the greatest transfer of public wealth into private hands in American history. If you factor in Monday's failed takeover, as well as the $5 trillion the American people now owe thanks to the "bailout" of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, not to mention the continuing hyper-expensive occupation of Iraq and so on, our citizenry is now so far in the hole that it's pointless griping about numbers. If you want one, use the figure put forth by Dennis Kucinich: half a quadrillion dollars. We have evolved past the point of economic or geopolitical reality and entered a phase of pure concept.

And all vectors of that phase point toward the conclusion that the proverbial shit has totally hit the fan -- head on, and all over again.

Meet the New Rome, Same as the Old Rome

"Franklin Roosevelt had to save capitalism from itself," Los Angeles Times business editor Tom Petruno told me as Washington Mutual and Wachovia became the latest banking dominoes to fall. "Is history repeating?"

Indeed, it is, as one could tell from the repetitive usage of loaded terms and phrases like "Great Depression," "meltdown," "apocalypse," "Armageddon" and more to describe the just-on-time cratering of the American economy. After the strange bedfellows in both parties torpedoed Bush, Bernanke and Paulson's so-called bailout, more than $1 trillion of market value in American equities disappeared in a single day. The Dow Jones average set a record for quickest suicide dive in a single day. Other indexes sunk to multiyear lows, wiping out years of value, and stocks across the board went negative like Ann Coulter. In fact, the only major stock that actually advanced on Monday was Campbell Soup.

Can there be a more fitting metaphor for the American economy stuck beneath the Bush administration's thumb?

But the reruns, and their loaded terminology, are merging: Bush himself is just another iteration of the infamous "New World Order" instituted by his father while trying to, what else, convince the American public that it needed to go to war against Saddam Hussein. The revisionism is transparent, befitting a government that cares nothing of what its people actually think. Jon Stewart of "The Daily Show" recently juxtaposed Bush's address on the financial cataclysm with his pre-invasion speech in 2003 and found -- surprise! -- they were exactly the same.


Digg!

See more stories tagged with: bush, election08, civil liberties, paulson, bailout

Scott Thill runs the online mag Morphizm.com. His writing has appeared on Salon, XLR8R, All Music Guide, Wired and others.


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View:
The First Thing to Do is Stop This Bailout ...
Posted by: mmckinl on Sep 30, 2008 12:55 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We can not afford to throw $700 billion Dollars to Wall Street. Paulson has already shown he plays favorites. By lending AIG $85 Million he saved his old firm Goldman Sacks $20 billion.

The rest of the $700 Billion will parceled out the same way ... to the Wall Street Boys Club.

Call Capitol Hill Now. I know many of you have called already ... Call Again !

We need to start taking a stand and this is as good a place as any ...


Find Your Reps By Zip

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Paranoia or a rational reaction?
Posted by: NoMcCainPalin on Sep 30, 2008 1:44 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
By definition, "paranoia" is a disturbed thought process characterized by excessive fear.

In my mind, the operative term is "excessive."

If "excessive" fear is created by a president who did that previously to scare the American people --like Bush did before the Iraq invasion -- I think that worrying about a possible police state is completely rational.

The most likely scenario would be an economic meltdown in which panicked people began withdrawing all their funds from banks. If that happened, I could easily see riots breaking out followed by martial law -- especially if Stupid Sarah and her senile running mate are in charge.

Finally, if you are an undecided voter, learn the truth about Mean Old McCain and his so-called "heroic" war record) by clicking on: Vote Against McCain (one of the HOTTEST anti-McCain sites on the Web)

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NSPD51 - the vehicle Bush can use
Posted by: kegbot1 on Sep 30, 2008 4:57 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Thill writes an excellent article but fails to note the mechanics of what Bush could do.

This is the link to Directive 51:

http://tinyurl.com/yqthor

Enacted in May 2007, it allows the POTUS to essentially take over functions of government in the event of what can only be called broadly defined emergencies. Read it and understand that this gives the POTUS incredible leeway (of course Bush has this already with signing statements and a host of other executive orders) to, in essence, declare martial law.

In fact, this crisis gives Bush a golden opportunity to use 51 if he wants to. With Congress out of town, if things get much worse, Bush can say Congress has abdicated their responsibility to the nation and that he, the President, is forced for the good of the country, to invoke 51 and step in.

And who would stop him? Really?

Remember you read it here first.

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» RE: NSPD51 - the vehicle Bush can use Posted by: purplewarrior
» Possible reasons already in place Posted by: truthlover
I AM NOT AFRAID
Posted by: caru on Sep 30, 2008 4:58 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
WE ALL NEED TO MOVE INTO A POST PETROLEUM LOCAL ECONOMY.

PERMACULTURE LIVES!

CAPITALISM DIES!

COOPERATION LIVES!

COMPETITION DIES!

I AM NOT AFRAID OF ANYTHING - THE POLICE STATE WILL COLLAPSE INTO ITS EVIL SELF. I BELIEVE IN LIFE ON EARTH. I ENCOURAGE ALL TO OPEN YOUR HEARTS AND FORGET ABOUT THE ILLUSION OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. WE ARE SPIRITUAL BEINGS ON THE MOST BEAUTIFUL PLANET FOR LIGHT YEARS. WE DO NOT NEED THE MARKET TO FEEL SAFE. WE DO NOT NEED MILLIONAIRES AND BILLIONAIRES TO FEEL SAFE. WE ONLY NEED THE GREEN EARTH AND THE BLUE OCEANS AND SKY.


DISASTER WILL CONSUME ITS OWN DISASTER. LET THE MARKET AND CAPITALISM FAIL. LET THE POLICE STATE FAIL. LET THE FEDERAL RESERVE FAIL. LETS RETURN TO A STATE OF PLANETARY HEALTH.


OM SHANTI.

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» RE: I AM NOT AFRAID. GOODY! Posted by: Nightstallion
» RE: I AM NOT AFRAID. GOODY! Posted by: sirios
» RE: I AM NOT AFRAID Posted by: Dboy
» CARU FOR PRESIDENT Posted by: HoboHomo
» RE: I AM NOT AFRAID Posted by: kittybrat
Ok this is the sixth time on Alternet I've said it
Posted by: witchjug on Sep 30, 2008 5:18 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Come January we will be burning cash to keep warm and beating up old people for their gold fillings.

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MELTDOWN REVEALS RACIST OLIGARCHY
Posted by: Al-Arkam on Sep 30, 2008 5:18 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
From its birth the USA has always been a racist oligarchy, never a true democracy. The current meltdown and the corrupt ruling class' plans to ignite more unjust wars with Iran and Venezuela, while crushing most of the middle class and eradicating most of the poor at home, simply force the masses to see through the facade of liberal democracy. The forty million slave descendants inside the USA, like all 250 million slave descendants in the West, continue to suffer from intense ethnocide and forced assimilation. By imposing these evil practices on us the U.S. government is blatantly violating United Nations Covenants. We the Afrodescendants must accelerate our battle for Human Rights and Reparations, then engage in an orderly Exodus, or face extinction in a dying empire.
As-Salaam-Alalikum,
Minister Malik Al-Arkam
www.allforreparations.org

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» I'VE BEEN HOODWINKED Posted by: hoorah
THE BANKERS HAVE BEEN GIVEN A LEGAL MONOPOLY ON THE DISTRIBUTION OF
Posted by: Raymond Emerson on Sep 30, 2008 5:19 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
the capital necessary for our economy to function. They have now screwed it up. You know and I know that the working stiff is going to catch the results. Lets try to put some padding down so he won't get hit so hard. Then the monopoly needs to be broken.

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Dear author, I grew up in post WWII America when people were not afraid of the police.
Posted by: Nightstallion on Sep 30, 2008 5:25 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
They may now kill or maim on suspicion. ANY movement on your part after police arrive may be considered resisting arrest. You may have a right to a free trial but you do not have the right to be treated with dignity. You will be treated guilty until proven innocent and you will never even complain about the change in behavior because you weren’t born till after the change took place!

NO ONE WAS EVER CUFFED IN A CAR ON SUSPICION OF ANYTHING BEFORE 1962;
ONLY THOSE WHO RESISTED WITH DEADLY FORCE WERE CUFFED BUT, NOW
YOU STUPID ASSHOLES WILL TOLERATE THAT TREATMENT AS COMPLYING
WITH YOUR OPPRESSOR! YOU HAVE BEEN BRAINWASHED INTO ACCEPTING THIS
TREATMENT BY POLICE MENTALITY TELEVISION SHOWS THAT AGGRANDISE
THIS TREATMENT OF YOU AND SOME OF YOU EVEN SWILL YOUR BEER AND
SHOUT HURRAH HEIL AND VIVA AND CRY BRING ON THE POPCORN! YOU
DESERVE THIS FUCKING POLICE STATE AND I HOPE TO RUB YOUR NOSES IN IT!
IT IS YOUR POWERFUL BRAINS WHO HAVE ARRANGED THIS SHIT FOR
EVERYONE! THE ONLY DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE PSYCHOLOGIES OF A POLICE
OFFICER AND A CRIMINAL IS THE FUCKING BADGE! I SERVED TIME IN PULASKI
COUNTY INDIANA IN A COUNTY SHERRIFS OFFICE AS AN RTO IN TRAINING AND
KNOW THIS TO BE TRUE! I WATCHED! I LISTENED! AFTER TWO WEEKS & SOME
DAYS I WALKED OFF, BECAUSE I HAD JOINED TO PROTECT AND SERVE EVERYONE NOT JUST THE RICH ELITE!

You may lie to yourselves and everyone else little men but you cannot lie to me because I was there growing up when this change took place. At first I was cold with fear then I got really pissed off because no one would listen to me about this change I saw or they would say shit to me like: “Oh, gee well what the fuck over: what the fuck out!” Just shut it about that shit you can’t do anything about it anyway!

BTW: Hey Lisa! You still think I am nuts!? Read these articles and ask questions for a change don't just mimic your superiors commission generated crapola!

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» were not afraid of the police. Wow. Posted by: Nightstallion
» The stuff on television Posted by: robert.noll
» RE: The stuff on television Posted by: kegbot1
LOL we already ARE a Police State!
Posted by: GreyFoxThree on Sep 30, 2008 5:48 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
LOL, Dictator Bush and his Regime saw to it a long time ago that the US became a Police State. Are you really that blind?

Jiff
Online Privacy when it Counts

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The Vice President has no role in the electoral college
Posted by: Elmo409 on Sep 30, 2008 6:03 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Read the Constitution -- Article II Section 1 specifically grants to the House of Representatives the job of breaking a tie in the electoral college. The Vice President has no part in so doing.

Also, if there is no election, the terms of the current President and Vice President will expire simultaneously on January 20th which would put the succession onto the Speaker of the House -- whoever that might be at that time.

Military officers take an oath to defend and protect the Constitution first and to obey the orders of the President afterward. If the Constitution says that Nancy Pelosi is the President, my bet is that the military would support even her before they would support a coup led by an idiot and a thief.

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» One Shuddering In The Wilderness Posted by: Direct Democracy
It's like watching a financial 9/11...
Posted by: browsercat on Sep 30, 2008 6:20 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
...in slow motion. We spoke up, we stopped one version of the bailout, now let's stay together and keep up the pressure.

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usterroristnation
Posted by: usterroristnation on Sep 30, 2008 6:48 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We sure are living in some interesting times, are we not ? And not just in the US. Anyone read on the eve of the jewish new year where the chief israeli schmuck Ehud Olmert (where DO they get these names ??)declared his country would HAVE TO withdraw from all the land it illegally catured from the Palestinians and the Syrians in 1967 ! He said " I am not trying to justify retrospectively what we did for 35 years - for a large part of that time I was unwilling to look at reality in all it's depth ". He went on to say that such a move would have to include part of Jerusalem which was also illegally captured in 1967. This is the first honest statement to come out of the mouth of an israeli leader in over 40 years. And on such a momentous day around the world, thanks to the fruits of America's "financial terrorism" what do his jewish colleagues in Washington do ??? Why take a vacation of course. Is it any wonder America has got itself in so much trouble. Like so many things wrong with America the financial institutions are the problem AND the solution.

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» RE: usterroristnation Posted by: Dboy
» RE: usterroristnation Posted by: PirateJesus
If McCain win..yes! and here's why
Posted by: jeffrey7 on Sep 30, 2008 7:20 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
MY HOLIDAY WITH JOHN McCAIN

It was just before John McCain's last run at the presidential nomination in 2000 that my husband and I vacationed in Turtle Island in Fiji with John McCain, Cindy, and their children, including Bridget (their adopted Bangladeshi child).
It was not our intention, but it was our misfortune to be in close quarters with John McCain for almost a week, since Turtle Island has a small number of bungalows and their focus on communal meals force all vacationers who are there at the same time to get to know each other intimately.
He arrived at our first group meal and started reading quotes from a pile of William Faulkner books with a forest of Post-Its sticking out of them. As an English Literature major myself, my first thought was "if he likes this so much, why hasn't he memorized any of this yet?" I soon realized that McCain actually thought we had come on vacation to be a volunteer audience for his "readings" which then became a regular part of each meal. Out of politeness, none of the vacationers initially protested at this intrusion into their blissful holiday, but people's buttons definitely got pushed as the readings continued day after day.
Unfortunately this was not his only contribution to our mealtime entertainment. He waxed on during one meal about how Indo-Chine women had the best figures and that our American corn-fed women just couldn't meet up to this standard. He also made it a point that all of us should stop Cindy from having dessert as her weight was too high and made a few comments to Amy, the 25 year old wife of the honeymooning couple from Nebraska that she should eat less as she needed to lose weight.
McCain's appreciation of the beauty of Asian women was so great that David the American economist had to move his Thai wife to the other side of the table from McCain as McCain kept aggressively flirting with and touching her.
Needless to say I was irritated at his large ego and his rude behavior towards his wife and other women, but decided he must have some redeeming qualities as he had adopted a handicapped child from Bangladesh. I asked him about this one day, and his response was shocking: "Oh, that was Cindy's idea – I didn't have anything to do with it. She just went and adopted this thing without even asking me. You can't imagine how people stare when I wheel this ugly, black thing around in a shopping cart in Arizona . No, it wasn't my idea at all."
I actively avoided McCain after that, but unfortunately one day he engaged me in a political discussion which soon got us on the topic of the active US bombing of Iraq at that time. I was shocked when he said, "If I was in charge, I would nuke Iraq to teach them a lesson". Given McCain's personal experience with the horrors of war, I had expected a more balanced point of view. I commented on the tragic consequences of the nuclear attacks on Japan during WWII –- but no, he was not to be dissuaded. He went on to say that if it was up to him he would have dropped many more nuclear bombs on Japan. I rapidly extricated myself from this conversation as I could tell that his experience being tortured as a POW didn't seem to have mellowed out his perspective, but rather had made him more aggressive and vengeful towards the world.

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Now for the real truth.......
Posted by: jeffrey7 on Sep 30, 2008 7:34 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
America already is a 'Police State'!! Has been for more than 30 years. It started with Nixon and COINTELPRO. It was advanced by Bush 1
by making sure there are TWO OFFICER LEVEL CIA AGENTS in EVERY COUNTY in America spying on US!!!!
If you think you're free,try walking down the street in your underwear. Go to DC and mount a protest,it's our Right,but you'll be arrested for being so 'FREE'.
It's not Wall St melting down that we need to worry about. That will just make living hard on the rich,and,they could use a good 'dressing down'. It's the meltdown of the Bill of Rights that leads us into a 'Police State'. They used the OJ trial,and, Michael Jackson's child molestation case to secretly water down our Rights to Privacy,freedom of speech and our right to gather. That should have been the big story but OJ and Jacko 'buried the lead' as it's known in the business. If we are to get our country and our Rights back,which will not be easy, we need to remove ALL the 'elected ones' and put in fresh blood that owes no one except the people that can only contribute a vote and not $10,000.
Write-in Jeffrey 7 (Smith) for Prez '08

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The keys to defeating the Global Police State
Posted by: SevenStarHand on Sep 30, 2008 8:03 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Those "atop the pyramid" fear two things the most. Those are 1}-you finally learning the truth and growing wise and 2} everyone cooperating. You can thank me for saving your lives after we all cooperate to end this great deception.

Here is truth and wisdom...

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commendation fraud
Posted by: Howard on Sep 30, 2008 8:43 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
According to the atrocious and scandalous information that is beginning to seep into the news about what is really going on, maybe it is time for the Bush Administration to secure outrageous bonus payments for the people responsible for the economic crisis.

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BushCo is preparing for civil unrest - why?
Posted by: mgloraine on Sep 30, 2008 9:42 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The fact that they are preparing to counter civil unrest and possibly armed insurrection indicates that BushCo is planning to do something which could trigger a citizens' rebellion. Starting another war, declaring martial law, suspending the Constitution, dissolving Congress, cancelling elections...the mind fairly boggles at the possibilities.

Every day that Cheney and Bush continue to occupy their offices as if they were elected officials places our nation, our economy, our freedom, and our very lives in jeopardy. Cheney-Bush have already demonstrated their willingness to sacrifice American lives and to torture and murder entire populations for control of resources and personal wealth; is there any doubt that they are willing to start killing Americans at home to carry out the next phase of their crime spree? If we don't give them the $700B via Congressional capitulation, they'll come and take it anyway. If we don't vote for McCain, they'll change the vote counts to suit their whims, then use the army and mercenary death squads (Blackwater) to crush people who rise up in anger.

Extraordinary measures requiring extraordinary powers and the suspension of Constitutional norms have been the most consistent characteristic of all BushCo policies and plans for dealing with events, both foreign and domestic. We can not be surprised that they are planning unconstitutional "unusual solutions" for whatever events they may be engineering for the months to come.

I guess it's time to look for a way to flee the country before the shooting starts. A citizens' rebellion would meet with a brutal slaughter, and most of us are not armed or inclined toward martyrdom. Congress has betrayed us, and the former Supreme Court and Department of Justice are now just appendages of BushCo, so Americans are really on their own and under attack from a hostile fascist regime. What are our options?

I see the end of America coming, and it looks like BushCo is planning for a violent ending.

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» usterroristnation Posted by: usterroristnation
Thomas Jefferson's opinion of banking institutions' effect on Democracy
Posted by: fanny666 on Sep 30, 2008 9:52 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around [the banks] will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs."
-Thomas Jefferson, in a letter to the Secretary of the Treasury Albert Gallatin (1802)

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» usterroristnation Posted by: usterroristnation
End of the Bush Presidency
Posted by: boing007 on Sep 30, 2008 9:54 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I see the end of America coming, and it looks like BushCo is planning for a violent ending.

Sieg Heil! Sieg Heil!

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pure contempt?
Posted by: o on Sep 30, 2008 10:28 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"We have evolved past the point of economic or geopolitical reality and entered a phase of pure concept."

fk concept, its contempt 99.99% pure contempt.

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Beekay
Posted by: purplewarrior on Sep 30, 2008 10:50 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Yesterday, ,in a brief slip, one of the white house reporters stated that Bush was disappointed but had a "directive" that could deal with the problem. Did anyone else hear this? I have been talking about the Continuity of Government provisions issued in 2007 which include a definition of Catastrophe as an "economic" disruption affecting the US population. We need to take the ability of this executive order seriously. If the media and the White House, the Congress and all the experts continue to define this thing as a crisis we may well end up with a CRISIS where the Constitution is suspended and a transfer of power to another regime could well be blocked, in the name of "CONTINUITY". I have written every senator, every news person, and every Congressional leader I can think of and I get the standard thanks for your input bs. I like to think of myself as a concerned citizen performing my civic duty to remain informed...am i over the edge on this thing?

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» RE: Beekay Posted by: cherylholmes
» RE: Beekay Posted by: HoboHomo
» RE: Beekay Posted by: bluebirdella
» RE: Beekay Posted by: hilly7
Right Wing Psychoholic In Denial
Posted by: Right Wing Psychoholic In Denial on Sep 30, 2008 11:36 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I know...I know...the Corporate Evil Empire -or the corporate-military-police state-dumbing down corporate media-run amok economy-so on and so on-industrial complex. But look at the other ones in history like Estruscan Evil Empire or Commie Evil Empire or Roman Evil Empire or Nazi Evil Empire...now I forgot what I was going to say...nevermind.

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Fear Mongering Again, Presidential Threats
Posted by: cherylholmes on Sep 30, 2008 11:58 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
worked in the past...c

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/
2008/09/26/jon-stewart-bush
-bailout_n_129588.html

bear with me..this site wouldn't let me post the entire web address in one line...

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What if Wall Street Doesn't Melt?
Posted by: PaulK on Sep 30, 2008 12:56 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What if the best time for a meltdown was last week, and it didn't actually happen because the free market covers shortages pretty fast when money is involved? What if we are all sitting around waiting for last week's financial Armageddon? The operating term here is "last week"!

Usually, when an apocalyptic cult meets for the end of the world and it doesn't happen, they try four or five times more and assume they just didn't get the exact date right.

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We pay the cops salary,we're their boss too.
Posted by: jeffrey7 on Sep 30, 2008 2:24 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If you go to any city council meeting you see where the cops get their rules of engagement. The city council set out the rules and without great public input we get the corrupted mess we now call 'law enforcement'.
If you want cops to act different,change their rules. Rewrite their working orders. Take away their guns,take away their right to warrantless searches for a burnt out taillight,take away their ability to accuse folks of 'obstructing an officer'. They use that one as badly as they used 'routine road checks' back in the 70's. BTW that action was judged 'Unconstitutional'. So was the first 'Three strikes rule'.
We lost our Liberties because too many folks were soft enough between the ears to believe everything some 'suit' laid out to them as 'problems with society that needed fixing'.
Freedoms lost take a revolution to get back.
Jeffreson knew that and said so but in America if you say those things and not be quoting some 'founding father' they come for you.
The guys on Mt Rushmore would have been calling for revolution for 20 years now. They'd also be called 'Terrorists' now.
It's time to clean house from city hall down to DC. Make new rules,get new people that don't 'owe' some rich asshole. Make the cops true 'Peace officers' by making them work without the protections of unfair laws,excessive abuse of power and the tools of our own destruction of the Bill of Rights via their guns. If they want us to disarm then I say THEY DISARM FIRST!!!!! Anything less is rulership by Tyrants.
Write-in Jeffrey7 for Prez '08

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and obama is out stumping...
Posted by: undrgrndgirl on Sep 30, 2008 3:26 PM   
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FOR the bailout

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It's Not So Much The Police State I'm Afraid Of
Posted by: MJ Fields on Sep 30, 2008 3:39 PM   
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I'm much more afraid of my fellow Americans completely losing their minds when things really get bad. I don't know that we are psychologically equipped for it. We are just not used to going without things like food, power, and services. What about the generations who don't know life before ATMs and the Internet? It'll be like the aftermath of Katrina cranked up to 11 (notice that there has been no post-Ike news coverage or pleas for donations!). People have trampled each other to get the last X Box for Christmas at Walmart. What will they to do to each other for the last ramen noodles at the 99-cent store?

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» There's an old saying... Posted by: QuestionAuthority
Remember LBJ's "guns and butter"?
Posted by: Garvagh on Sep 30, 2008 4:10 PM   
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To maintain public support for the idiotic Vietnam War, Lyndon Johnson acted totally irresponsibly regarding the budget and taxes, because he believed that if Americans were taxed sufficiently to pay for the war on an on-going basis, they would stop the war. G W Bush played the same kind of grossly dishonest game, so that the insane "war" on "terror" could be carried on in the Middle East, "protecting" Israel and risking bankruptcy of the US. The house price bubble was an act of organized deception emanating from the neocon warmongers bunker in Washington, also known as the office of the VP.

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