Doing the Right Thing

Sage Francis ain't for your everyday Nike-clad rap fan. The Rhode Island native's music has been labeled "nerd rap" and "emo-hop," probably because he makes more references to Jack Kerouac and Johnny Cash than 2pac and John Gotti. Politically-charged and poetically-versed, his messages, buried in metaphors and witty wordplay, might take several listens to catch.

It's been a busy year for the one half of Non-Prophets (the other half is producer Joe Beats) and seasoned rap battle veteran. He released "A Healthy Distrust" earlier this year on Epitaph Records, recently released the "Life Is Easy" DVD, and is currently on tour in support of KnowMore.org, an online community website co-founded with his friend and fellow poet Bernard Dolan. The goal of the new site is to provide consumers with detailed information on corporations including -- business history, statement of ethics, shareholders, employee relations, and more.

Sage spoke to Pop and Politics in early November.

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You were the first hip-hop act to sign to Epitaph, is that true?

That's true.

Now their roster includes Atmosphere, Blackalicious, MF Doom, and the Coup…

Yeah, that's a pretty strong hip-hop lineup. It's probably the best hip-hop label out there, strangely enough.

But it's a punk label.

What makes it a punk label?

Well, most of their artists were predominantly punk.

They're a label that collectively puts out the hip-hop that I think is most important and the best hip-hop of right now. To me, it's a hip-hop label. But I don't care if it's a hip-hop label or not. I wish I was the only rapper on the label so I could have the novelty of bragging rights. But yeah, I'm really proud to be on a label with other artists of this era that I think are doing some really cool stuff.

Why is it that Epitaph is enlisting some of the most powerful hip-hop acts out there today, as opposed to hip-hop labels? Is it that they allow more artistic freedom?

SF:They do allow more artistic freedom. I think they have a better understanding of the hip-hop we do and how it came about and why there's an audience for it and how it actually is shared by some of their audience. Although, I think the punk pop contingent fan-base of a lot of Epitaph artists' aren't really into hip-hop or even whatever we're doing.

But personally when I went to Epitaph, I got a big kick out of giving the finger to all the hip-hop labels. I could have gone with Atlantic or Epic or whoever is putting out hip-hop that is "eh" to me. A lot of them have talked to me and talked about signing me, but when they realized I didn't fit the face of what they wanted from a white hip-hop artist, they tried to urge me to fill that role, and I fled to be a pretty good selling artist on Epitaph. I like making Epitaph the money rather than those labels that were trying to make me fit the white rapper role.

What is the stereotypical white rapper role?

You know, you gotta co-opt black culture just like Eminem, be a white man in black face without the black face. It's insulting. We could get into a big racial debate about it, but I come from Rhode Island. I come from a white community, a small town Irish Catholic community and I was given different opportunities in life and I accept that and I acknowledge that. I lived a unique life and that's what I reflect. I can't reflect street life.

Coming up through the years, I've had managers… trying to push me to talk about drugs or even sell drugs in real life so I would have fodder for songs. I look at Eminem's career and I'm like, this dude fell into that. I feel like he did what I could have done and I don't feel worse for not doing it. I see where he's at, it's incredibly successful. He has incredible skills. I don't think he would have been used if he was talentless. I think Dr. Dre is a very brilliant man who saw the potential in it all. And when I first saw they came together as a unit, I was like "Man, it's over now."