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War on Iraq

Tension Mounts as Antiwar Movement Challenges Dems' Commitment to Stop the War

By Matt Taibbi, RollingStone.com. Posted May 10, 2007.


The Democrats' endorsement of this crude neocolonial exploitation plan makes them accomplices in the occupation, and further legitimizes the insurgency.
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There is a growing number of people out there who believe the Reid-Pelosi Iraq war supplemental is a gigantic crock of shit, and who think the Democratic Party leadership should now officially be labeled conspirators in the war effort. I've even seen it suggested that Reid and Pelosi should now be sent official "certificates of war ownership," to formally put them in a club with Bush, Cheney, Richard Perle and the rest of the actual war authors.

The growing tension between the real antiwar movement and the Democratic Party was reflected in a long article over the weekend in the New York Times. "Antiwar Groups Use New Clout to Influence Democrats." The piece that described how an umbrella group of antiwar activists called Americans Against the Escalation in Iraq was ready to drop the public relations hammer on the Dems, should they cave too easily in their negotiations with the president.

The thinking goes something like this: the Democrats, who are mostly the same people who voted for the war in the first place, don't really want to end it. They do, however, want to take political advantage of antiwar sentiment. So they will appear to be against the conflict but set things up in such a way that their "efforts" to end the war will fall just slightly short, like a fourth-quarter pass thrown by a point-shaving quarterback.

I was squarely in that camp until recently, when it occurred to me to wonder; if Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi were to wake up one morning with innocent, uncorrupted brains and decide, really decide, to end the war in Iraq, how exactly would they do it? And the answer, I think we all have to admit, is: they would do it exactly the way they're doing it now.

Neither of these Democratic leaders, after all, are Huey Newton, or even Benjamin Spock. They are not going to get up on a table, shake a shoe in the direction of the White House, shout "Fuck you, pig!" and just turn off the money, consequences be damned. No, these are career bureaucrats, political herd animals who survive year after year by clinging for dear life to the concept of safety in numbers. They will watch the bushes with great big eyes to see what is rustling back there, and when exactly two-thirds of the herd decides to bolt, they all will -- not just the Democrats, but the Boehners and McConnells too, leaping over logs, tearing off big chunks of fur against the bark of trees, etc.

I can certainly see a scenario in which people like Reid and Pelosi would make a secret deal to compromise now and give Bush his money, in exchange for another bite at the apple later this year -- by which time a veto-overriding coalition of Democrats and "moderate" Republicans will have magically coalesced. The Republicans crossing the picket line later this summer will inevitably claim to have done so with heavy heart, out of principle and "concern for the safety of the troops," and yet at the same time there will mysteriously appear a new raft of appropriations calling for expensive dam and highway projects in certain districts. That tends to be the blueprint for how 67% of congress will catch up to 67% of the population on major issues like these.

So maybe Reid and Pelosi really are working the phones on this one, who knows. What I do know is this; there are elements of the Democratic-crafted Iraq supplemental that are not only severely regressive but would actually tend to encourage the continuation of the insurgency. Anyone who wants an example of why the areas in which the Democrats and Republicans are in agreement are more significant than the ones in which they differ need only look at the two parties nearly unanimous endorsement of the "Benchmarks" the Iraqi government must meet, according to the supplemental. The key passage reads as follows:

(2) whether the Government of Iraq is making substantial progress in meeting its commitment to pursue reconciliation initiatives, including a hydro-carbon law...

It is notable that the hydrocarbon law comes in first place in this clause, ahead of "legislation necessary for the conduct of provincial and local elections," reform of de-Baathification laws, amendments to the constitution and allocation of revenues for reconstruction projects. For whether or not it really was "all about oil" at the beginning of the war, the fate of the occupation really does hinge almost entirely upon oil initiatives now, as the continued presence of U.S. troops in the region may depend on whether or not the Iraqi government bites the bullet and decides to eat the proposed hydrocarbon law in question.


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See more stories tagged with: iraq, oil law, neocolonialism

Matt Taibbi is a writer for Rolling Stone.

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View:
oh god
Posted by: Eat Politicians on May 10, 2007 12:42 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
the horror...

America deserves to burn in flames. Myself included. I like fast cars and chocolate.

Poop on America.

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Same ol same ol
Posted by: UnEasyOne on May 10, 2007 1:05 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Dems are really confused now. Nobody in congress is used to the idea that the American electorate actually wants a say in policy and that the "official story" they hear in the corporate media isn't flying any more. Token opposition has been sufficient since the days in which the Reagan tax givaways to the rich were passed by the Democratic congress. As the netroots gains more and more power to inform and act, this will become more and more frequent. Keep it up, Matt!

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» Oy... Posted by: ~Fiona~
» RE: Oy... Posted by: ekipnrut
The beginning of the end of democracy and the US as a superpower
Posted by: skoog5600 on May 10, 2007 2:00 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Do you think that other countries are open to wanting to follow the US model of democracy? What a joke, both dems and repubs.

You are seeing the beginning of the end of the US as a superpower. Your country has lost all credibility on so many levels. I would suggest that Americans start scaling back on spending money, start to save, grow your own food, stop driving cars, push for mass transit, get on a diet, start reading books, learn not only your own history but world history - there is so much more, but hey I don't think the average American will do more than one of those listed above.

Goodbye US of A

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Univerrsal
Posted by: Universal on May 10, 2007 4:27 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Our failure, continuously, in light of all the exposed connections, confirmed examples, and stories, history, which shows that the left and anti war had the truth nailed down, shows that the wishy washy liberal class ideology, still corrupts, and limits our understanding of reality, and the need for a universal ideology, a universal principle and mechanism, to create a universal middle class and social wealth, macro economic theories, that transforms, the class elites, as class mercenaries, and fearful shock troops for corporate fascism.

The first fundamental theoretical reconstruction, towards a universal ideology, is to understand that we must separate ourselves from the appeasing class liberals, and reclaim the historical mantle, revolutionary outlook of the Enlightenment, and revolutionary liberals, whose social, macro theories of Reason, classical, universal values were betrayed by the emerging commercial classes, merchants, whose ideology was to put property rights, over the democratic principles and social theories in the Age of Reason. The collapse of the French Revolution and its betrayal produced both the Naopelonic Order of Laws, class laws, and the immediate corruption of national links, tied to universal social ideological values, internationalism based on Proto Socialist Democratic values, into their opposite, class nationalism, the false unity and falsely claimed social principle of the Enlightenment, hence class ideology and the march of Napoleon, as the first capitalist empire, class empire since the Feudal class oligarchy was overthrown.

Beethoven, Hegel, and the German intellectuals of the Post Enlightenment, already knew what we still are talking about today in this article. He ripped up his musical piece for Napoleon, having assumed the goal of revolutionary liberals was to overthrow the feudal class oligarchies, and class elites, the clerical Catholic hierarchy, and the construction of a universal middle mechanism, social wealth, whose theories were based on Smith, Ricardo, and yes, Karl Marx. Beethoven renamed the musical piece as Eroica, and the struggle to reclaim revolutionary liberalism, whose values passed into the hands of its heirs, Marxist socialists, in the struggle between appeasing class liberals, corrupt class elites, vs both the democratic movements of the Enlightenment, and Marx's socialism.

Face it folks, we are not only fighting this or that imperial class war, this or that corrupt politician, we are fighting a class ideology, class nationalism, imperial, fascist foreign policies, not individual failures, but historical failures, institutional failures, that go back, even before the betrayals of both the Marxist movement, by Stalinism, and the Enlightenment, by class liberals, whose middle layers, were corrupted either within a class state, or externally by a global class empire, of couse with the help of dictators like Napoelon and Stalin, whose nationalism was corrupted by class, national strategies and who failed the international tests of reconstructing a universal mechanism, that does not corrupt democracy and socialism.

A lot of "liberals" fail to make these fundamental historical distinctions between original revolutionary liberals, and revolutionary Marxism, having accepted the polluted version of class ideologists, who continue to confuse history through mislabled concepts, deliberately so, because it serves their ends, the same way Hitler used "socialism" to serve German corporate fascism, and Bush "democracy" to serve Amerikan corporate fascism. Today's liberalism, like Stalin's communism, are mislabled as the original versions that they completely betrayed. Class corrupts democracy, and did so even before the Enligtenment, when Plato of ancient Greek city states, , tried to graft democracy onto an existing class system, class patriarchy, with the same corrupting results.

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» RE: Univerrsal Posted by: mviscid
» RE: Univerrsal Posted by: LeftCoastProgressive
» RE: Univerrsal Posted by: Universal
» Old Marxists Posted by: Sparks56
» RE: Old Marxists Posted by: Universal
» RE: Old Marxists Posted by: Sparks56
» RE: Old Marxists Posted by: Universal
» RE: Old Marxists Posted by: davidbdr
» RE: Univerrsal Posted by: joefranks72
Feinstein - Blum
Posted by: Teller on May 10, 2007 5:04 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
And then there's the gross war profiteering of magnate Richard Blum, husband of Diane Feinstein.

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» RE: Feinstein - Blum Posted by: opeluboy
Dems can stop with just no more bills; it's on GWB's head now....
Posted by: scott.gregory on May 10, 2007 5:52 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Democrats gave Bush everything he wanted and more in the first bill he vetoed. They should not waste anymore time on the issue. Hold a press conference and say Bush can sign the same bill he first vetoed, or he needs to start an orderly evacuation from Iraq. He has plenty of money left from the October 2006 supplemental spending bill, that lasts through early July, to accomplish an orderly evacuation. Or he can sign the bill he vetoed.
That's all --- The isssue is no more on the Dems head, so long as they don't let it be put there.

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If I were Huey....
Posted by: rpenn on May 10, 2007 6:01 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Mr. Taibbi,

As Huey Newton would surely say after reading this grand analysis, "Right on, Brother."

Thank you.

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Fascinating Stuff
Posted by: Wacre on May 10, 2007 6:20 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"Another condition was the liberalization of the economy, and the opening up of the oil industry to foreign interests. To recap: Saddam Hussein rips off Iraqi people, America "liberates" said people from Saddam, then bludgeons them with Saddam's debts until they hand over the keys to the oil industry. Nice deal, yes?"

Fascinating stuff because it reminds of me of something I read about Vietnam. If I recall this happened a few years ago and involved one of our senators visiting and having the audacity to say relations wouldn't be renewed unless the Vietnamese people paid 'reparations' (my word, probably not the word used in the article) for the role the United States paid in the conflict.

What audacity! Let's see...I invade your country (which is remarkable in and of itself considering the French had just been driven out) and as if the invasion weren't enough, I am going to make you pay me after the fact.

As I said, fascinating (in a schizoid kind of way).

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» RE: Fascinating Stuff Posted by: Danger2008
Dems are the faux opposition party
Posted by: MartianBachelor on May 10, 2007 6:24 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The thinking goes something like this: the Democrats, who are mostly the same people who voted for the war in the first place, don't really want to end it. They do, however, want to take political advantage of antiwar sentiment. So they will appear to be against the conflict but set things up in such a way that their "efforts" to end the war will fall just slightly short...

So far, so good.

I was squarely in that camp until recently... They [Pelosi & friends] are not going to ... just turn off the money, consequences be damned.

Why not?

The rest of Matt's elaboration on this point then seems like little more than a justification/excuse for why their efforts to end the war will fall just slightly short, as predicted.

If they stop putting gas in the damned Hummer it will run out of gas. It's then the Commander-In-Chief's job to steer it safely over to the shoulder while it coasts to a stop. Duh.

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I'm still waiting...
Posted by: JoshuaLudd on May 10, 2007 6:36 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Someone tell me how it is they are going to make any change when they don't have the votes to override a veto.

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» RE: I'm still waiting... Posted by: mwildfire
» RE: I'm still waiting... Posted by: Lincoln fan
» RE: An answer... Posted by: oregoncharles
» Just imagine ... Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Just imagine ... Posted by: oregoncharles
» RE: Just imagine ... Posted by: Joshua Holland
» One more point ... Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: I'm still waiting... Posted by: Sparks56
» RE: I'm still waiting... Posted by: leafsong1
What a nerve!
Posted by: Democritus on May 10, 2007 6:42 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"What a nerve this Iraqi government has not to be able to quell the violence our occupation has fueled; and what a nerve they have not to give away their oil rights to foreign companies." Those are the sentiments shared by Republicans and Democrats alike when they insist on "benchmarks" to be met by Iraq to deserve our continuing military "protection." Matt Taibbi thinks that the best the Iraqi government can do when being squeezed in this vise is to comply until all our troops are gone and then renege. Sorry, Matt, not a chance. You forgot to mention all those billion-dollar permanent bases we constructed. When the bulk of our military forces leave, those bases will still be there to ensure that those oil agreements are kept. You just don't mess around with Big Brother.

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» RE: What a nerve! Posted by: mwildfire
What's the takeaway message here?
Posted by: Rebel with a cause on May 10, 2007 6:50 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The takeaway message is that is you want a quick pullout and no more bludgeoning Iraq with sanctions later, replace all the Democrats AND Republicans you can in 2008 with Libertarians. Start getting on board with Ron Paul, who voted against the war in the first place, not just when anti-war got popular.

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Grow an Effing Backbone
Posted by: NoPCZone on May 10, 2007 6:55 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Excuse me, I must be confused.
I thought that in a Democracy the government was supposed to be responsive to the clearly stated will of the people. If that were the case our troops would already be home or headed home.

MS Pelosi,
You serve one of the most securely Democratic seats in Congress and are now the big boss in the chamber with the purse strings. Cut Dubya & Cheney off. Send the vetoed bill back and clearly state that there will be no other bill until after the August recess. Otherwise sign it or live with the consequences.
Deal or No Deal

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why do we tolerate this corruption and exploitation?
Posted by: antiapathy on May 10, 2007 7:04 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
serisously, are the voters all idiots, or do they just not care? How is it the majority of Americans agree with leaders like Kucinich, yet he is still considered a fringe candidate?

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» How is it? Posted by: JoshuaLudd
Iraq and Afghanistan Supplemental Spending, 2008 By JEFF LEYS
Posted by: rwa on May 10, 2007 7:05 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Don't lose the forest for the trees.

Congress is now considering President Bush's request for an additional $145 billion to pay for the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan through September 30, 2008. The House Armed Services Committee is including these funds in the Defense Authorization Bill for Fiscal Year 2008, which runs from October 1, 2007 to September 30, 2008. Of this, $142 billion will be for the military and $3 billion will be for the State Department.

President Bush submitted this request on February 5, the same date on which he requested $93 billion for the wars for this year's budget and $482 billion for the regular baseline military budget for FY 2008 (a 62% increase over the baseline military budget in 2001).

While political gamesmanship will continue over war funding for this fiscal year (which ends on September 30), the substantive debate on this year's supplemental bill is all but over. Congress will most likely approve these funds, including "benchmark" requirements placed upon Iraq's government. These "benchmarks" are meaningless in terms of ending U.S. military action in Iraq. Most likely, not even a "goal" date for withdrawal from Iraq will be included in the final supplemental bill for this year.

The antiwar movement must quickly shift its focus to the $145 billion supplemental spending request for FY 08. If the focus doesn't shift, the war will end up being fully funded through September 30, 2008 and beyond.

But then: What is to be done?

Congress could, if it so chooses-and if there is sufficient public pressure--exercise "the power of the purse" and bring the Iraq war to an end. The time to act is short...

full article: http://www.counterpunch.org/

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frank67
Posted by: frank67 on May 10, 2007 7:24 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Money Party is winning again as usual. It's well beyond "What's the Matter with Kansas." A substancial majority of the People want to end the occupation, but the Money wants the occupation to continue. You know the old saying about what talks and what walks.

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Regardless, ultimate responsibility lies with Bush & the Republicans
Posted by: thoughtcriminal on May 10, 2007 8:28 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Take Cheney's recent trip to the Mideast, reported on NPR as a 'push for political progress'.

What's actually going on is that he wants to see the oil law passed and ratified before the May 27-28 "Iraq Oil and Gas Summit" in Dubai, where the Iraqi oil will be auctioned off - but only if international oil companies are give guarantees that they'll be able to control the oil. They already had to push this meeting back from April 11-12 in Jordan.

See also union solidarity with striking Iraqi oil workers

"I am confident that most members of the Out of Iraq Congressional Caucus embraced this concept in the belief that adoption of an oil law that assures a fair and equitable distribution of oil revenues to all parts of Iraq is a condition for national unity and national progress in Iraq. I am equally certain that in doing so, they did not realize that the oil law contemplated would have such deleterious effects on the Iraqi people - and the exact opposite of the intended result:
It would instead establish the conditions for the continuing presence of U.S. troops (to protect U.S. "vital" interests - read corporate investment in oil field development).
"

So, the Democratic party and the American people are being sold yet another fake bill of goods: first it was "Saddam's WMDs" and now it is "equitable distribution of Iraqi oil wealth".

Who is selling this false story? The same media outlets who sold the WMD story: the NYT, NPR, WSJ, CNN, FOX, WP, LAT, ABC, CBS, MSNBC - etc. They're running headlines like "Cheney encourages Iraqis to embrace political progress".

Yes, the Democrats are gutless and seem to be willing to be fooled - but it was Bush&Cheney who cooked up the lies about Iraqi WMDs, and it is Bush&Cheney who are still lying through their teeth - but they'd never get away with it without the willing cooperation of the US corporate media (who are owned by the same Wall Street and London banks that control the oil corporations)

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thank you
Posted by: bemf on May 10, 2007 9:07 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Thank you for saying this. The "progressive blogosphere" has been too silent on this issue, repeatedly referring to the bill as a "withdrawal" bill and praising the Democrats' for their stand and putting the blame exclusively on the Bush administration. The fact is, the Democrats' bill would have allowed the slaughter to continue, imposed "benchmarks" friendly to US and corporate interests (imperialism), and given the Democrats the PR that they are seeking to end the war. Had the bill passed, it would have only given the Democrats the appearance of being antiwar while doing little to actually end the occupation.

We need to start holding these folks accountable and we need and independent movement against the war. No longer can we have Senators like Carl Levin claiming to be against the war while their positions are being praised by the Bush administration.

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Wow!
Posted by: oregoncharles on May 10, 2007 9:13 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I've been critical of Taibbi in the past, but he came through this time.

It leaves one big question: what are we going to do about it? We can march, we can sit in in their offices (I recommend it - exhilarating. Check out the Occupation Project.), and they can ignore us completely unless we're willing to

VOTE FOR SOMEONE ELSE.

I'm a Green, so I'm hoping that's who you'll vote and work for, but this is past partisanship. Ron Paul, a Libertarian Republican, would let New Orleans stew in its own floodwaters, but at least he'd end the war. Of course, he has exactly the same chance at the nomination as Kucinich, who is really a Green. (How many times do you have to say "I'm a loyal Democrat", if you really are?)

Let me be blunt: if you're still a Democrat, you're still a sucker.

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» VOTE FOR SOMEONE ELSE. Posted by: Lincoln fan
The Pelosi-Reid Plan to Abolish America
Posted by: Tony Christini on May 10, 2007 9:41 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Pelosi and Reid have returned to their plan for controlling Iraq – popularly known as the PR Plan.

They vowed, “We will work with the President in whatever way we can.” They meant the statement to be totally ambiguous, but unfortunately for them, upon uttering it, the official pair instantly collapsed to the ground, apparently for lack of some vital measure of blood and bone, as well as some bizarre overabundance of scales, claws, and oozing oil.

“Defunding the war immediately is totally impossible,” uttered Pelosi and Reid in unison while slithering across the ground, sliming their way back to their Gang of Democrats. The Republican Gang applauded silently from the side. ...

linked text

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» Reptilian? Posted by: Knowmad
Who's guilty here?
Posted by: veive on May 10, 2007 12:49 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The authorization to attack Iraq was given to Bush on the condition that Iraq refused to give up its weapons of mass destruction. Since Iraq had none, and offered to let anyone to come on in and inspect away, our war launch was obviously precipitous and unwarranted. The sole blame for this silly war rests on the office where the buck stops. Congress members who okayed the attack IF THE WMD CONDITION WAS NOT MET, can't be faulted for anything other than not impeaching the asshole running our country into the ground once they learned THE WMD CONDITION WAS NOT MET and that Bush had used lies and subterfuge to get his way.

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» RE: Who's guilty here? Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Who's guilty here? Posted by: oregoncharles
» RE: Who's guilty here? Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Who's guilty here? Posted by: leafsong1
"Just cancel the service--Just cancel the service--Just cancel the service..."
Posted by: Mr. Heathen on May 10, 2007 1:18 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Your government is "AOL".

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Interesting read
Posted by: RobNLA on May 10, 2007 1:20 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It was clear the invasion and subsequent occupation has been to control the oil in Iraq.

And yes, the USA unfortunately is on the downhill curve of it's place as a superpower. The reason is simple, we don't invest in our own people and infrastructure enough. Instead, we overspend on the military.

This same pattern has occurred with many superpowers in history, take a look at England...that is the USA in a couple hundred years.

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Held Hostage
Posted by: peaceandcharity on May 10, 2007 2:06 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The congress (including the democrats) are negotiating with an imperialistic terrorist government while over 150,000 troups (human being) are being held hostage and forced to kill and maim civilians while sacrificing their own lives. This has never been a "war". This was and invasion and massacre resulting in an occupation. It is illegal, criminal and most of all immoral.

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jeffreydj
Posted by: jeffreydj on May 10, 2007 3:22 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"the Democrats, who are mostly the same people who voted for the war in the first place"

So, does this item by now merit "urban myth" status? One more time, I must remind yet another pundit that The Majority of Democrats in Both Houses of Congress voted against the Iraq war authorization. In 2002, both houses were controlled by the Repubs, who provided the overwhelming bulk of the "yea" votes to Bush' scheme. My Democratic rep voted against the bill that day. But his vote means nothing to the Matt Taibbis of the world, who cannot be bothered to support their function as windbags with facts.

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» RE: jeffreydj Posted by: Joshua Holland
jeffreydj
Posted by: jeffreydj on May 10, 2007 3:41 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Having excoriated Taibbi on his ahistoricity, I guess I oughta congratulate him on his otherwise incisive article. Though it does seem to assume that any Dem collusion on the Iraqi Hydrocarbon Law is a Very Bad Thing. Admittedly, it sounds like a rotten deal for the Iraqis, but what of the Home Team? If bilking the Iraqis out of their oil puts our Camrys that much further down the road, are we to expect the American readership to protest?

In the end, I worry about how difficult it will be to argue for the complete withdrawal of American troops from Iraq, when somebody must be held responsible for insuring that our oil is gotten out from under their sand.

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» RE: jeffreydj Posted by: joefranks72
Don't vote 2008 n/t
Posted by: Dboy on May 10, 2007 6:51 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Voting for anyone is a vote FOR this current system.

Dboy

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» RE: Don't vote 2008 n/t Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Don't vote 2008 n/t Posted by: Lincoln fan
Great article
Posted by: smchris on May 10, 2007 8:24 PM   
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Basic Follow the Money 101