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Only a Roosevelt-Scale Counterrevolution Can Prevent Great Depression II

By Robert Kuttner, The American Prospect. Posted September 18, 2008.


Free-market extremists brought us this needless economic collapse. Here's a rundown of the mistakes we've made and the reforms we need now.

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The current carnage on Wall Street, with dire spillover effects on Main Street, is the result of a failed ideology -- the idea that financial markets could regulate themselves. Serial deregulation fed on itself. Deliberate repeal of regulations became entangled with failure to carry out laws still on the books. Corruption mingled with simple incompetence. And though the ideology was largely Republican, it was abetted by Wall Street Democrats.

Why regulate?
As we have seen ever since the sub-prime market blew up in the summer of 2007, government cannot stand by when a financial crash threatens to turn into a general depression -- even a government like the Bush administration that fervently believes in free markets. But if government must act to contain wider damage when large banks fail, then it is obliged to act to prevent damage from occurring in the first place. Otherwise, the result is what economists term "moral hazard"-- an invitation to take excessive risks.

Government, under Franklin Roosevelt, got serious about regulating financial markets after the first cycle of financial bubble and economic ruin in the 1920s. Then, as now, the abuses were complex in their detail but very simple in their essence. They included the sale of complex securities packaged in deceptive and misleading ways; far too much borrowing to finance speculative investments; and gross conflicts of interest on the part of insiders who stood to profit from flim-flams. When the speculative bubble burst in 1929, sellers overwhelmed buyers, many investors were wiped out, and the system of credit contracted, choking the rest of the economy.

In the 1930s, the Roosevelt administration acted to prevent a repetition of the ruinous 1920s. Commercial banks were separated from investment banks, so that bankers could not prosper by underwriting bogus securities and foisting them on retail customers. Leverage was limited in order to rein in speculation with borrowed money. Investment banks, stock exchanges, and companies that publicly traded stocks were required to disclose more information to investors. Pyramid schemes and conflicts of interest were limited. The system worked very nicely until the 1970s -- when financial innovators devised end-runs around the regulated system, and regulators stopped keeping up with them.

Seven Deadly Sins
Sin One: Allowing Mortgage Lending to Become a Casino. Until 1969, Fannie Mae was part of the government. Mortgage lenders were tightly regulated. Homeownership rates soared throughout the postwar era, from about 44 percent on the eve of World War II to 64 percent by the mid-1960s. Nobody in the mortgage business got filthy rich, and hardly anyone lost money. Fannie's job was to buy mortgages from banks and thrift institutions, to replenish their money to make mortgages, and along the way to set standards. Fannie financed its operations by selling bonds. In the late 1970s, private Wall Street firms started emulating Fannie. They packaged mortgages, and converted them into bonds. Over time, their standards deteriorated, because they could make more money creating riskier products. In order to avoid losing market share, Fannie emulated some of the same abuses. Government did not step in to regulate the affair -- which was a time bomb waiting for the creation of the sub-prime mortgage business.

Sin Two: Allowing Unregulated Bond Rating Agencies to Decide What was Safe. Sub-prime is only the best known of a widespread fad known as "securitization." The idea is to turn loans into bonds. Bonds are given ratings by private companies that have official government recognition, such as Moody's and Standard and Poors, but no government regulation. These rating agencies have become thoroughly corrupted by conflicts of interest. If you want to package and sell bonds backed by risky loans, you go to a bond-rating agency and pay it a hefty fee. In return, the agency helps you manipulate the bond so that it qualifies for a triple-A rating, even if the underlying loans include many that are high-risk. Without the collusion of the bond-rating agencies, sub-prime lending never would have gotten off the ground, because it would not have found a mass market. Had regulators looked inside this black box, they would have shut it down. They might have needed new legislation, but they never asked for it. And public-minded regulators might have done a lot under existing law, since banks (which are regulated) were heavily implicated in the financing of sub-prime.

Sin Three: Failing to Police Sub-prime. The core idea of bank regulation is that government inspectors periodically examine the quality of bank assets. If too large a portion of a bank's loan portfolio is behind in its interest payments, the bank is made to raise more capital as a cushion against losses. Problems are nipped in the bud. But complex securities require more sophisticated regulation than simple loans. Regulators basically waived the rule on adequate capital for the new wave of mortgage lenders who created sub-prime. Many mortgage companies were not banks. They made loans only to sell them off to the Wall Street sinners of Deadly Sin No. 1 (see above). So there was no loan portfolio to examine, and no real capital. The Democratic Congress anticipated this problem in 1994, when it passed the Homeownership Opportunity and Equity Protection Act. This prescient law required the Federal Reserve to regulate the loan-origination standards of mortgage companies that were not otherwise government-regulated. But Alan Greenspan, a free-market zealot, never implemented the law. And when Republicans took over Congress in 1995, they never called him on the carpet.

Sin Four: Failure to Stop Excess Leverage. The financial economy is crashing today because so much speculation was done with borrowed money. A typical leverage ratio of a hedge fund or private equity company is 30 to one. That means $30 of debt for $1 of actual capital. If you make one serious miscalculation, you are out of business. And in the case of sub-prime mortgage companies, the leverage ratio was infinite, because they had no capital. The game was entirely based on creating debt. As long as times were good, financial firms could keep borrowing to finance their deals. But once investors looked down, they panicked. Some parts of the system are unregulated, such as hedge funds and private-equity companies. But they all ultimately get a lot of their funding from banks. And regulators do retain the power to look closely at banks' books (see Sin No.3 above). Had they used that power to police the kind of highly risky stuff banks were underwriting, they could have shut it down.

Sin Five: Failure to Police Conflicts of Interest. Remember the accounting scandals of the 1990s? In those scandals, accounting firms were paid once to audit corporate books and then again to help clients cook the books and still pass muster with the audit. That was a sheer conflict of interest. Though accountants were (loosely) regulated, Congress did not crack down until cooked books caused the stock market to crash. A second conflict of interest was the corruption of stock analysts, who were telling customers to buy dubious stocks because their bosses were profiting from underwriting the same stocks. In the aftermath of the dot-com bust, Congress narrowly cracked down on these two abuses with the Sarbanes-Oxley Act but simply ignored others -- such as the role of bond-rating agencies and the habit of basing executive bonuses on stock prices that could easily be manipulated by the same executives.

Sin Six: Failing to Regulate Hedge Funds and Private Equity. When Roosevelt's New Deal acted to rein in the abuses in financial markets, it regulated the major players -- commercial banks, investment banks, stock brokers, holding companies, and stock exchanges. But two of the biggest purveyors of risk today -- hedge funds and private-equity firms -- simply did not exist. Today, private-equity firms and hedge funds do most of the things banks and investment banks do. They basically create credit by making markets in exotic securities. They buy and sell firms. They speculate in financial markets with borrowed money, taking much bigger risks than regulated banks. According to House Banking Committee Chair Barney Frank, more than half the credit created in recent years has been created by essentially unregulated institutions. The people in charge of the government -- conservative Republicans -- took the view that these new-wave financial players offered transactions between consenting adults who needed no special consumer protection. But they were oblivious to the risks to the larger system.

Sin Seven: Repeal of the Glass-Steagall Act. This action, in 1999, was one of two major cases when a cornerstone of New Deal regulation was explicitly repealed. (The other was the repeal of the Public Utility Holding Company Act, and if your utility rates are sky-high, you can thank Congress for that, too.) Glass-Steagall provided that if you wanted to speculate as an investment bank, good luck to you. But commercial banks were part of the banking system. They created credit. They were regulated, supervised, usually enjoyed FDIC insurance, and had access to advances from the Fed in emergencies. So commercial banks and investment banks were two different creatures that should stay out of each other's knitting.

But beginning in the 1980s, regulators who didn't believe in regulation either allowed explicit waivers of some aspects of Glass-Steagall or looked the other way as commercial banks and investment banks became more alike. By 1999, when Citigroup had jumped the gun and assembled a supermarket that included a commercial bank, investment bank, stock brokerage, and insurance company, Glass Steagall was so hollowed out that it was effectively dead. The coup de grace was its official repeal, in the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act. That's Gramm as in former Sen. Phil Gramm, a deregulation zealot and top adviser to John McCain.

Three Basic Reforms


What all of these sins had in common was that they led financial markets to misprice assets. In plain English, that means buyers were purchasing securities based on bad information, often with borrowed money. When firms started losing money on sub-prime in mid-2007 and other owners decided it was time to get their money out, the whole miracle of leverage went into reverse. And it spilled over into other securities that had been mispriced thanks to all the conflicts of interest tolerated by regulators.

That's why, no matter how much taxpayer money the Federal Reserve and the Treasury keep pumping in, they can't turn dross back into gold. The next administration and the Congress need to return the financial economy to its historic task of supplying capital to the real economy -- of connecting investors to entrepreneurs -- and shut down the purely casino aspects of the system that have only enriched middlemen and passed along huge risks to everyone else.

Reform One: If it Quacks Like a Bank, Regulate it Like a Bank. Barack Obama said it well in his historic speech on the financial emergency last March 27 in New York. "We need to regulate financial institutions for what they do, not what they are." Increasingly, different kinds of financial firms do the same kinds of things, and they are all capable of infusing toxic products into the nation's financial bloodstream. That's why Treasury Secretary Hank Paulson has had to extend the government's financial safety net to all kinds of large financial firms like A.I.G. that have no technical right to the aid and no regulation to keep them from taking outlandish risks. Going forward, all financial firms that buy and sell products in money markets need the same regulation and examination. That will be the essence of the 2009 version of the Glass-Steagall Act.

Reform Two: Limit Leverage. At the very heart of the financial meltdown was extreme speculation with esoteric financial securities, using astronomical rates of leverage. Commercial banks are limited to something like 10 to one, or less, depending on their conditions. These leverage limits need to be extended to all financial players, as part of the same 2009 banking reform.

Reform Three: Police Conflicts of Interest. The conflicts of interest at the core of bond-raising agencies are only one of the conflicts that have been permitted to pervade financial markets. Bond-rating agencies should probably become public institutions. Other conflicts of interest should be made explicitly illegal. Yes, financial markets keep "innovating." But some innovations are good, and some are abusive subterfuges. And if regulators who actually believe in regulation are empowered to examine all financial institutions, they can issue cease-and-desist orders when they encounter dangerous conflicts.

We're talking about a Roosevelt-scale counterrevolution here. But nothing less will prevent the financial collapse from cascading into Great Depression II. And the public should never again forget that this needless collapse was brought to us by free-market extremists.

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See more stories tagged with: economy, wall street, market regulation, great depression, free market, financial crisis, financial collapse

Robert Kuttner is co-founder and co-editor of The American Prospect magazine, as well as a Distinguished Senior Fellow of the think tank Demos. He was a longtime columnist for Business Week, and continues to write columns in the Boston Globe. He is the author of Obama's Challenge and other books.

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The Horse is Out of the Barn ...
Posted by: mmckinl on Sep 18, 2008 12:33 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Kuttner has written a great analysis of how we went wrong and new regulation that is needed, BUT, he never explains how we get out of the mess we are in now ...

What we need is a truly public central bank that prints our money without debt. The treasury just prints it or credits to our accounts to do government business without borrowing it from the Fed. The country is essentially insolvent now, that is we can't pay, have no hope of paying our principle and interest payments.

How do we get out of a debt spiral by printing more money ? We can't. But the banks will never give up their money making monopoly through debt creation. They will crash the economy before they relinquish the biggest welfare program in history.

Sure we can't print too much, but historical models such as Franklin's Bank in Pennsylvania have shown it works and works well when properly managed.

debt free money

Why should the banks, who caused this fiasco, retain a monopoly on our Constitutional Right to create money ?

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» Why should the banks... Posted by: The Old Hippie
Beating That Dead Horse...
Posted by: The Old Hippie on Sep 18, 2008 12:34 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
 
The Complex Simplicity of the Simplistic Complexity...
by The Old Hippie Because You Keep “Allowing,” Hasn’t Sunk In Yet.

The Federal Reserve, is not federal, nor has any reserves.
It is a private corporation, and controls the money, all of it, in this nation.
Free Speech Zones, mean you do not have free speech by definition.
They are not incompetent, nor stupid, they do know what they are doing.
Absolutely nothing matters to them, other than that they control the wealth.
You, and I, and the rest of the lower 99.?% of us, are not them.
50% of all populations, (e.g. America,) have below average IQs.
The myth of Christ proved to be very powerful, and very-very profitable.
Our media, in reality, is owned and controlled by just five corporations.
Whose majority of Boards of Directors are all share by the same people.
Those shared directors are also shared with the extractive energy, pharmaceutical, HMO,
ag-chem, and the military-industrial-complex corporations.
All of which are experiencing record profits, as the cost of everything you need climbs.
This nation’s military budget is 54% of our total budget.
And that 54% of our budget is greater than the combined military budgets of all the other nations.
As of the most recent figures, .001% now control 1/5 of the planet’s total wealth.
None of them care about you, nor your family, nor your friends.
Nor do they care about your job, or your health, or your environment, or your future.
You are not one of them.  You are not their friend.

But yet. . .

You keep allowing yourself to react to their manipulations of your needs, as if you are.

Ask yourself - What have you done to prove that wrong?  “Revolting,” isn’t it?
 

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» RE:Right on nuke them all Posted by: solrev
» RE: Beating That Dead Horse... Posted by: stopthemaddness2
It's probably too late.
Posted by: NoMcCainPalin on Sep 18, 2008 1:16 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I hate to sound pessimistic but after eight years of George Bush who believes shared sacrifice during wartime is to go shopping -- a greed-riven concept most Americans have accepted -- it would take a miracle for that national attitude to change.

The only glimmer of hope I have is for Barack Obama to be elected.

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» RE: It's probably too late. Posted by: LaRayaAsul
» RE: It's probably too late. Posted by: PointMan
Solutions are known. Implementing them is the problem.
Posted by: LMNOP on Sep 18, 2008 2:55 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The problem isn't what to do. Roosevelt showed us. All we need do is undo the deregulating by the Republicans of the last thirty or so years and return to the New Deal. The problem is implementing it.

Could Roosevelt (or Obama if he gets the chance) have been as effective in 2008 given the present Congress, Supreme Court and citizenry as he was in the thirties? Probably not.

If we go through a depression like the Americans of the thirties endured, would that make a difference? Probably, because that would make some of the conservatives whose businesses had suffered see value in a restorative effort, but it's very difficult to say if that difference would be enough.

This is a different America. It's globally connected more so than then, but I don't know if that would be relevant - would that help, hurt or neither. I also think that we are a weaker people than our great grandparents were. But again, I don't really know that, or whether that matters.

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FASCISM & FASCISTS caused the CRASH -- NOT "Free Market Extremists"
Posted by: Mister_PsyOps on Sep 18, 2008 4:06 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Whatever you may thing of "free markets" or "capitalism" they DO NOT EXIST under American brand FASCISM. There is no such animal.

Many of Kuttner's suggestions are good and necessary no-brainers for a nation run by a parasite ruling class thru organized corporate crime. But the reality of what got us here and a practical path to get out is missing. Like most MSM pundits, Kuttner deals in a broken red herring.

The top step is to abolish the illegal and private "Federal Reserve" Corp (not federal, no reserves) Ponzi Fascist bank scheme and get organized corporate crime out of Washington and the MSM. Until this happens, the corporate monopoly vampire class stays in command and people will remain out of power and out of options.

Depend on it.

For all his issues, President Jackson was the last president to completely defeat what he called "this organized money power from its secret conclave".

FDR would have said the same about of all of this and did say it:


“The real truth of the matter is, as you and I know, that a financial element in the larger centers has owned the government of the U.S. ever since the days of Andrew Jackson. History depicts Andrew Jackson as the last truly honorable and incorruptible American president.”
President FDR (on Fascist rule in a letter to corporate con man “Colonel” Edward M. House, a founder of the Council on Foreign Relations and political fixer for the ruling class. House also handled President Wilson for the foisting of the privately rigged “Federal Reserve” Corp bank monopoly. 11/21/ 1933)

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» RE:Free Markets Posted by: BeckyD
» RE: Free Markets and a rose Posted by: setterwoman
» RE: Free Markets and a rose Posted by: yellow
» Andrew Jackson Not a Fascist? Posted by: curiousdwk
» understanding "fascism" Posted by: wefearwhatwedontunderstand
» RE: understanding "fascism" Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: understanding "fascism" Posted by: wefearwhatwedontunderstand
» RE: understanding "fascism" Posted by: EncinoM
Roosevelt
Posted by: Tom Degan on Sep 18, 2008 4:30 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If you ever have the chance to read the blog that I write (Link below - shameless plug) you will see that I have, in recent months, made numerous references to Franklin Delano Roosevelt, Herbert Clark Hoover and the campaign of 1932. The similarities are too many to ignore; analolgies are just screaming to be made.

Not in seventy-six years has the need to go in a totally new direction been as stupidly obvious as it is in 2008. Honestly, how are we going to look in the eyes of the rest of this planet if we foolishly continue down the self-destructive road we have been traveling these last eight years? We're going to look like a nation of racists, masochists and fools, don'cha think?

The Republican party has cut the throats of the poor and middle classes; they have looted our national treasure; they have abandoned their constituancy in favor of a multi-national behemoth and an out-of-control military industrial complex; they have created a global, geo-politcal catastrophe in the Middle East that will take at least a century to remedy; they have shoveled a generation of children into an untenable quagire in Iraq; they have engendered an economic nightmare so immense that generations yet unborn will still be bearing its burden; they have sold our beloved nation's soul to the highest corporate bidder; they have made a mockery of the First Ammendment; They have squandered a multi-trillion dollar surplus on a tax break for a class of people who already had more money than they knew what to do with; they have gutted vital social programs that aid the poor and elderly that have been in place for over seventy years; they have turned federal emergancy management into a sick joke; they have knocked the teeth out of laws meant to help working men and women; they have plundered the environment; they have deleted our educational system; they have hijacked this nation's political dialogue; they have ruined America's international reputation; they have handed our domestic agenda over to religious fanatics; they have denied voting rights to people of color in three states; they have stolen two national elections; they have trampled our Constitution; they have sent our Bill of Rights through the sausage grinder....

They must never, ever be alloud to govern this country again.

The grand old party is over.

Tom Degan
Goshen, NY
"Crappy Days are Here Again

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» RE: oosevelt Posted by: drich
» "The grand old party is over." Posted by: GuitarBill
» Once Upon A Time Posted by: Last Chance
» Not an accident.... Posted by: CatDad
» RE: oosevelt Posted by: stopthemaddness2
tvgypsy
Posted by: tvgypsy on Sep 18, 2008 4:53 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Perhaps I do not have the financial acumen that our great leaders on Wall St. and the Fed possess but I cannot help but wonder why the US government must step in with 85 billion dollars to save a privately/publicly owned business that has reaped billions in profits over the years on bogus mythical securties that had, at best, some cloudy asset value. Where were the reserves that would have been necessary to be retained to pay off their insurance clients? Isn't the insurance industry regulated or was that also eliminated when the wonderful and insightful Congress granted the keys to the asylum to the avaricious lunatics of Wall St?

I will feel sorry for Mr. Obama if he is unfortunate enough to win the election. On the other hand, I would feel worse for the rest of the world if Mr. McCain were to.

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» RE: tvgypsy Posted by: Tom Degan
» If Elected -- Posted by: Last Chance
» Why? Posted by: Evelyn
» RE: Why? Posted by: nochicagoboys
One final thought:
Posted by: Tom Degan on Sep 18, 2008 5:06 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Read Robert Kuttner's book

Obama's Challenge
America's Economic Crisis and the Power of a
Transformative Presidency

It's well worth your time.

By the way, did you see the slap down Kuttner gave to Sean Hannity on FOX Noise last week? Look it up on AlterNet's video!

Tom Degan
"The Rant"

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bold new moves
Posted by: willd4change on Sep 18, 2008 5:12 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What would be a welcome change is if the FED actually went after the folks that caused the problems. They should seize all their assets try them for defrauding the economy as a national security risk. That would be a beautifull reality show for all the major networks.

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and..
Posted by: maxfactor on Sep 18, 2008 5:13 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
tax shortterm speculation with 1% and the whole thing will implode.

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FDIC? Hard questions...
Posted by: warrior woman on Sep 18, 2008 5:14 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
So this morning on the CBS morning news, the head of the FDIC is interviewed and says something to the effect: "but you have to remember, much of what occuring is outside of the banking industry."

Yah, so? Make excuses. Why didn't the news caster ask any questions such as:"So why isn't this mess within the purvue of the banking or other appropriately regulated industry?? How did this proceed so far? WHat can be done to stop the bleeding? Who is being investigated? Do you forsee anyone going to jail or being held accountable?" And about 10,000 other questions that need answers.

AIG was one of my competitors over my 25+ years in the insurance industry. The entire time, those others of us always wondered how they could do the deals they did, seeming to often times teeter on the edge of legality. Well, now we know. They've sent people to jail from there in the past, they should now too.

We need to call our legislators and demand regulation be "re-installed". Now.

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» RE: FDIC? Hard questions... Posted by: EncinoM
Revamping Business Education
Posted by: Urstrly on Sep 18, 2008 5:18 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Starting with the University of Chicago, the nation's business schools share a lot of the responsibility for the little missionaries they have been sending out in support of free markets since the 1980s. It's really hard to find an MBA who will not spout the "markets are self-regulating" dogma at the drop of a penny. It's a mass delusion, but one that has made a lot of people megarich. And now we're going to see what 21st century poverty looks like. Really ugly.

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» You hit the nail on the head! Posted by: zooeyhall
malaparte
Posted by: malaparte on Sep 18, 2008 5:27 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
One point not mentioned in the article is that when LBJ had the Nam war as well as the Great Society bills to pay for he needed to raise money. Looked around the government for some help and found those to obscure agencies, Fannie and Freddy, which he convinced others that it made sense to privatise. Will be interesting if whoever gets in, in Nov. follows that path to lessen the debt of ours.

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repeat?
Posted by: hoppingfrog on Sep 18, 2008 5:29 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
everybody on this site likes to talk about repeats: another Viet Nam, another watergate, another depression. Time to move on. This is a different time and we are trying to meet the challenges like we did in the past. Obviously regulation doesn't work because we stop using it! It is the financial market equivalent of abstinence only sex-ed. It is like removing the tumor from McCain's face, yeah it will work for awhile, but the guy is probably going to be dead in a few years anyway. It is time to grow up. If something doesn't work as badly as our financial markets don't work, we need to find something that does, and not just keep putting lipstick on the pig (or pitbull, I wouldn't want to kiss either)

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If you limit leverage
Posted by: corazon on Sep 18, 2008 5:33 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Of course you will force everybody to live within their means, including government. Which is good. Politicians have promised the moon on the backs of generations not even born yet. Is this fair or moral? Get rich quick will be gone and replaced by hard work and thrift hopefully. We need to change the ways we look at wealth; is it what you have or what you save?

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I Appreciate This Article
Posted by: curiousdwk on Sep 18, 2008 6:08 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I really appreciate this article. It takes the time to explain in everyday parlance what has gone and and what needs to go on. I won't claim to know enough to rebut or promote the arguments here, but I found it stimulating and informative.

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Until the progressives and liberals can reframe the debate and LIMIT the Wall $treet forces, nothing
Posted by: GrantBurkeVT on Sep 18, 2008 6:18 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
will fundamentally change. My father remembers the FDR days when FDR and Truman faced tremendous difficulties getting pro-populist legislation passed through Congress and even faced pro-corporate injustices. On top of that, FDR faced up to 4 potential assassination attempts. Until the corporate, military, and religious monied elite forces can be weakened, we're all stuck in the losers' column.

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we just came out of a 4 day blackout and this is what I learned...
Posted by: ellie on Sep 18, 2008 6:18 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
we the people are as stupid as the feds... when the credit cards didn't work in the only store that was open because they had a generator people took it out on the clerks... people bought all kinds of crap that made no sense from scanning shopping carts... example: 30 pkgs of hot dog rolls and 1 flashlight no batteries, lady complaining the entire time due to long lines to check out...

almost a fistfight between 2 women over the last bag of ice... ok, so I was in the store for ice to keep meds cold that need to remain cold and a lady tried to swipe the bag out of my cart!!! her cart was loaded down with fresh meats... wandered over to the pharmacy isle and noticed that the pepto section was wiped out, food poisoning anyone???

sadly, passed the toy section and saw a huge isle of simple books to read, coloring books, stuff for kids to do that doesn't need batteries or an electrical socket and kids were out of school for 3 days... the isle was untouched and kids ran in packs around here bored out of their skulls getting into trouble while parents sat in stone silence...

tantrums tossed at the 2 women who work at a closed gas station (no power, no gas pumps) who took the time to set up shop to sell what water and drinks were in the store from the sidewalk... one of the women I noticed had a concealed weapon in the back of her jeans in a holster, guess she has a concealed permit... good for her...

people don't remember how to work a 4 way stop when the lights were out, paramedics were constantly untangling those that don't know left from right...

the only info from state or local authorities, let alone the electric company was on tv, now no lights means no tv, the radio stations were out after they ran out of fuel for their generators...

no help for people with medical or elderly emergencies, no red cross, water boil alerts only passed on from neighbors, hospital generators barely working but there is a fine water feature in the hospital lobby that looks like a hotel lobby...

this is the mindset of america we are dealing with in general, no wonder we are in a financial meltdown... seems like no one took the time to think ahead to what if... the general public allows those in power to have power, no not the electrical kind, but power over them to make what is assumed to be sound decisions...

note to me, put a bag of ice in the back of the freezer and leave it there for the next time which is bound to happen...

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» Good Advice Posted by: Last Chance
» RE: Good Advice Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Good Advice Posted by: Last Chance
» It's Mad Max time Posted by: zooeyhall
Would Some One Please Explain
Posted by: Last Chance on Sep 18, 2008 6:21 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Who exactly walked away with the billions of dollars? Was it speculators? So, who are they and how exactly did they do it? If we know their methods perhaps they can be prevented from doing it again? If not, then why stay with an economic system that steals from itself and everyone within reach? Better to devolve to a network of gardening and farming villages that do everything for themselves, like the Amish of Pennsylvania. Farm for family and community and to hell with the market!

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» It's a BASIC question Posted by: Last Chance
It wasn't the hedge funds and private equity this time
Posted by: everton9 on Sep 18, 2008 6:47 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"A typical leverage ratio of a hedge fund or private equity company is 30 to one." This is blatantly incorrect. Most PE firms are about max 8 times levered, and any hedge fund other than stat arb funds (which trade thousands of securities a day via computer algorithms) that has leverage above 5x will be out of business soon if not already.

Prior to the collapse, popular belief held that it was the hedge funds that brought excessive risk into the market, however, though there have been some notable collapses, overall hedge funds are down but not broken. More importantly, the hedge funds that did collapse did not cause an increase in systemic risk. They were little more than a tiny blip on the radar.

The real problem was the giant investment banks, once thought to be the paradigms of free-market capitalism. Not only were they to big to be let fail, they were also to big to actually fail. It was believed that they risk was spread so well that they were diversified enough to sustain any market troubles.

However, the real problem is exemplified in the case of Lehman. As opposed to HFs and PE, Lehman was levered almost 50x. According to the bankruptcy filing, they had $639bn in assets and $613bn in liabilities. Thats $26bn net assets and $1.252tn gross assets. A 1% loss on gross assets would be a 50% loss on their actual capital.

Though I agree with the recommendation is this article, I recommend that the author be more sophisticated and not just attack the standard scapegoats: HF and PE. The argument would be more effective if it avoided such factual errors and misunderstandings.

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Lilly
Posted by: Lilly on Sep 18, 2008 7:04 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
1) The collapse of Wall Street. 2) Drugs rushed to market by Big Pharma---followed by heart attacks and strokes. 3) Airline passengers stuffed into 12-inch seats so unregulated airlines can make more money from more passengers. Just three examples of what has happened without regulation. This doesn't even touch the same thing, worse, that happens in super-unregulated China, the latest instance being >6000 babies sickened, some of them killed, by baby milk contaminated with melamine. As long as "increasing profit" trumps "the public well-being", greed will win out every time. It is incredible to me that so many in our present world failed to know what the ancients knew: radix malorum est cupiditas, the love of money is the root of all evil.

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Trickle down...
Posted by: jmndodge on Sep 18, 2008 7:07 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
just doesn't work. You can't prop up the losses for millionaires on the backs of the un/underemployed, indeed we all know that the workers on the first rungs of the ladder have to help with their health care and housing. When this group is overburdened, there just isn't enough to pad the pockets and line the coffers of the mega rich.

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Lilly
Posted by: Lilly on Sep 18, 2008 7:16 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
To tvgpsy: You stated the thought that has been in my head this week with Wall Street shattering around our feet. I hang out a lot on conservative websites where the old reliable canons include that Roosevelt caused the Depression and that Clinton took the United States into a recession which George Bush then alleviated; current problems, conservatives say, stem from the election of a Democratic Congress. (I swear I am not making this up---go read townhall.com for yourself.) The deregulatory policies that began with Reagan have now done their work. And you can absolutely bet that if Obama should be elected President, he will immediately be blamed for the collapse of Wall Street. I support Obama. I believe in the policies he promises. When he speaks I am ready to lay down my stuff and follow him. But growing in me is a wish that this bright, courageous man might have a pleasant life. And he will not have this in the presidency, where Republicans will blame him for the results of their own wrongdoing.

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The Bush Regime
Posted by: GreyFoxThree on Sep 18, 2008 7:45 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
the Bush regime consists of IDIOTs. I include John McBush in this category. They all have hundreds of millions in the bank so of course everything is just peachy for them.The Regime has lost total and complete touch with the common citizen. Bush is a Liar, McBush is the biggest Liar of the mall and Failin is not far behind. Seems the country has literally gone to hell in a hand basket but according to the Regime, everything is just peachy keen!

Jiff
Online Privacy Center

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Now we're getting a discussion of short selling
Posted by: ReallyBearish on Sep 18, 2008 7:47 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Stocks aren't going down because of short selling. Short selling in the traditional, legal sense is a zero sum game. What we're getting is NAKED short selling: the selling of stocks you don't own or haven't borrowed and that you have no intention of buying back. If you can run a company like Bear Sterns into the ground with unlimited short selling, you not only make loads of money, IT'S ALL TAX FREE! (That's because the stock sale transaction was never completed.)

How bad is the problem? Really bad. J.P. Morgan has authorized the issuance of no more than 3,440 million shares, but the largest block holders of J.P. Morgan stock hold 4,800 million shares. The additional shares are counterfit, resulting from naked short selling. And this isn't the exception.

Read Dr. Patrick Burns from Overstock.com regarding the problem of naked short selling.

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It started with Reagan
Posted by: zooeyhall on Sep 18, 2008 8:11 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I could see this coming for the past 28 years. Ever since the election of (Saint) Reagan in 1980. I still remember the cold feeling I had listening to the election news that night. A lot of the younger people think this started with Bush II, but it goes MUCH further than that. It was Reagan who really laid the groundwork. It was Reagan who was the John the Baptist of the "Greed is GOOD!!!" idea that really blossomed in the 1980's. Please study your history, because messes like the one now do NOT happen overnight. There are clear steps for anyone to see that lead to these sorts of things. In this case, you can trace it from the savings and loan crisis of the late 80's, to the Enron and Worldcom collapse of 2000-2001. But it was Mr. Reagan who really turned loose the economic wolves, the economic Darwinists, the people whose life motto is "if it makes money, you don't make apologies". Until these attitudes in America change, we will not have learned anything from this current crisis, and will just be headed for another one in the near future.

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» Reagan on the dime Posted by: zooeyhall
"Too Big to fail"=too big to be permitted
Posted by: kroenung58 on Sep 18, 2008 8:14 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Can some financial genius please explain the logic of permitting corporations to grow to such size that they become "too big to fail"? Seems to me that's just allowing them to gain such power over the economy that they hold all of the cards. Their debts get socialized down to all of us and their profits mostly keep flowing to them.
If free market competition is such a good thing, why do capitalist politicians keep permitting enormous mergers to undercut it? Why not put a ceiling on how large any corporation can get?
This is an honest question, not a rant. Why is bigger automatically better?

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Let's fix it!
Posted by: Spot on Sep 18, 2008 8:47 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We must not forget that the reason FDR was able to pass the new deal through a hostile congress was because of the masses of citizens who were ready to support legislation which was even more radical.
FDR pitched the new deal to the financial elites as an alternative to REBELLION and CIVIL WAR.

What happens to the elites get if we don't get what we want? They won't lose representation in government, 90% of the posters on this site seem to support the Democrats despite their inability to enact any change or even challenge the status quo. Bush's approval rating is constantly under 20% and they tell us there's no political will for impeachment? There's plenty of will out here, but we keep electing cowards and representatives of the elite we're fighting against.

So if we can identify the problem, but constantly refuse to manifest our collective voice in a way that brings our needs or any possible solutions to the table, why should they care?

If you work two jobs, but can't pay the bills, the Democrats won't save you. If you want an end to stationing of American troops in foreign countries, the Democrats won't listen. If you want an end to the Bush doctrine, you don't want the Democrats. If the loss of manufacturing jobs in America is important to you, the Democrats are also to blame. If government regulation of financial markets is something you value, the Democrats have defaulted on your loan of political power.
Our decades of blind investment in the two major parties' American dreams have bred naivete and ignorance; there has been no return on our support, there has been no dividend or sustained appreciation in quality of life for 80% of Americans in the past 30 years!

I can't see how anyone can believe that the Democratic party is not entirely complicit in this disaster. The two major parties won't save us. We need political rebellion! We need an electoral map which takes into account more than red and blue! We must entirely reject the failed policies of the Reaganomic Era! We must elect a new group of representatives beholden to the electorate, and replace the twin, intermingled, corrupt networks of patronage and pork!

Every two years we get the opportunity to throw them out, to end careers which depend on the population for their legitimacy but which derive their ideology from the elite. Every two years I hear "voting for anyone but (insert Democrat here) is the same as voting for (insert Republican here)". That is simply not the case. Voting for Democrats is nearly always as counterproductive to progressive politics as voting Republican. Our only real option for change is to vote neither R nor D.

Vote for Obama if you must. But learn about the candidates down the ticket, and vote for one who shares your ideals. Politics starts in our own communities. It is our will to act made manifest, or it is nothing at all.

Refuse to re-elect politicians whose careers bank on safe decisions that you won't remember. Safe means suckling at the teat of the powers that keep us out of the process. Represent yourself through your vote, and hold on to your babies, cause the bathwater needs to go bye bye.

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» RE: Let's fix it! Posted by: jackyD
» RE: Let's fix it! Posted by: Spot
They work for us, take money from them
Posted by: jlohman on Sep 18, 2008 8:51 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Only when we get public funding of campaigns will these guys start voting for the people rather than their pocketbooks. Politicians did what they did because they were paid to do so.

Jack Lohman
MoneyedPoliticians.net

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They work for us, take money from them
Posted by: jlohman on Sep 18, 2008 8:51 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Only when we get public funding of campaigns will these guys start voting for the people rather than their pocketbooks. Politicians did what they did because they were paid to do so.

Jack Lohman
MoneyedPoliticians.net

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The will to do......
Posted by: Spiritgirl on Sep 18, 2008 9:01 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As we have seen over the last 30 years, Congress in collusion with Wall Street has repealed the laws put in place to prevent exactly what is happening again another depression! American people were sold a bill of goods known as "free markets, independence, BIG GOVERNMENT, welfare states, ad nauseum!" All the while greedy corporations, and greedy lobbiests participated in the theft that was rampant! So now that the 3-card Monty is collapsing we the tax payers are forced to bear the burden!

As the majority of Americans didn't share in the growth of the wealth distributed, we should neither have to share in propping up these failed policies! I hate to say it but these corporations need to fail! Regulation is a must, just as when you apply for a loan there needs to be some collateral obliged, we the people need collateral in the form of serious Regulations, otherwise this will happen again! Contrary to the Repugnikan spin on how the "free markets" will correct themselves, these mafiosa will not learn and need to be taught a lesson. These top grossing CEO's should be required to repay some (if not most)of their salaries back to the companies thru their hubris-tic malfeasance they ran into the ground!

The American people deserve no less than full accountability and transparency from both Government (Congress & regulatory offices) along with these corporations! As a full participant in the deregulation of corporate America John McShame has a lot of nerve even pretending that he has an inkling of understanding of what is going on! So his hollow talk of love of country is just that, hollow talk! He, his wife, and their cronies have all profited extremely well during this time, he should not even be considered for the presidency for his part in all of this!

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No way on earth -----
Posted by: symcokid on Sep 18, 2008 9:18 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
any of the King's horses or any of the King's men are going to change anything around, it is going to be a full blown (worst) Depression this country has ever seen. All the stop gap measures, propping up and IOU's, nothing has and nothing will make a difference at this point in time.

First of all we should get to hell out of Iraq and the entire Middle East right now, then!

If we were to get our 1,000,000 troops out of the 130 foreign countries we are in and rid ourselves of the 716 military bases worldwide, then we would be talking very serious and substantial savings!!!

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» RE: No way on earth ----- Posted by: edgar1
I CAN'T BELIEVE THIS!!!
Posted by: alicelillie on Sep 18, 2008 9:20 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I cannot believe that anyone says with a straight face that we have an unfettered free market!

Or that the Bush administration is "free market extremist!!!"

Our economy in the U.S. is riddled with a crazy-quilt of regulation at the federal, state and local level that all business (particularly small business but also the huge corporations) is fairly chocking on it! Of course, it is true that the regs do favor the big guy, but nevertheless, we are regulated up to our eyeballs.

And, with our high taxes, we (especially the middle class) are paying to be told what to do!

I won't belabor here, but FDR did so much *harm* to us all... You on the left are so gung-ho on civil liberties that you are right alongside us libertarians in many areas, but yet you rever FDR! He was *not* in our camp! He did sign off on the false imprisonment of 110,000 Japanese Americans don't forget, and that was by no means all!!!

See my FDR section in my essay _The Three Worst American Enemies of Freedom_.

Warning...the whole essay is *very* politically incorrect, so if you wish you can scroll about halfway down to FDR.

Then read my screed against Bush, then maybe you will reconsider stringing me up...:/

It's at http://alicelillieandher.blogspot.com And, because the url is too long for this application, at the end you need to add /2005_05_01_archive.html

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» Are you having fun yet? Posted by: jlohman
» Read History --> Posted by: Last Chance
All MSM Rethoric is about keeping up the debt based Pyramid Scam
Posted by: common intelligence on Sep 18, 2008 11:05 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The whole perpetual capitalistic growth model is a pyamid scam.
The powers scurrying about to save it have all been caught with their pants down.

The "jig is up". The only financial crisis is "theirs". for the rest of us, be happy their game is almost over. Except for Bush working to push through an other war in order to postpone and distract everyone from the fascist economic faud they have played on everyone (except me!).

So don't worry. Be happy. Now we call see and begin to face reality instead of being in denial. Dreams are only dreams.
But the American dream is a nightmare that has lead the nation into
fear.

A lot of Alternet likes to talk FDR.
well remember what he said.....
" The only thing we need to fear is fear itself."

We need not fear the truth. For the truth really does set us free.

Soon now we will be free from the illusion and we can build a truly new future. What that looks like is up to us.

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The lesson is
Posted by: edgar1 on Sep 18, 2008 2:14 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
that we need a third party that is antimonopoly, proworker, and understands that the current two party duopoly represents unhealthy alliance between corporate interests, both US and international, and the US govt. The bailouts engineered by the Fed and Treasury are supported by Pelosi and Reid. Obama is speechless, because Wall St is his campaign banker. McCain was a reformer on some issues, but not on corporate monopolies, so his efforts to be a trustbuster like TR are phony. TR really went after Wall St; McCain has always accepted Wall St and saves his wrath for fellow politicians who are only stooges of Wall St.

Vote for Barr or Nader, depending on your emotional affinity for the libertarian right or the libertarian left. But don't vote for Obama or McCain.

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this is what LaRouche has been telling for some years -but anglo media wants his voice suppressed.
Posted by: avatar_singh on Sep 18, 2008 2:34 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
http://www.larouchepac.com/news/2008/03/29/

"


LESSONS FOR DENVER: FDR's 1932 Victory Over London's Wall Street Fascists
Increase Decrease

By Jeffrey Steinberg

On July 1, 1932, New York Gov. Franklin Delano Roosevelt won the Democratic Party Presidential nomination by a landslide vote of 945-190, over his nearest rival and avowed political enemy, the former New York governor and J.P. Morgan tool, Alfred E. Smith. On Nov. 8, 1932, Roosevelt won a second landslide victory, this time over incumbent Republican President Herbert Hoover. Roosevelt won 57% of the popular vote, and swept the Electoral College by 472-59. It was the greatest mandate for change in memory, and FDR immediately set out to return the U.S.A. to the tradition of the American System of political-economy, and, in so doing, brought the country out of the depths of the Great Depression, and prepared the nation for the great battles to come, against Nazism and Fascism--and an expected post-war battle to end the scourge of Anglo-Dutch colonialism.

Most Americans, with even a slight degree of historical literacy, know these basic facts about the election of 1932. Few, however, know how close the nation came to a disaster at the Democratic nominating convention in Chicago; how close FDR came to being deprived of the Presidential nomination, despite a groundswell of popular support; and how ruthlessly his Wall Street and City of London enemies sought to overturn the outcome of the 1932 election, through attempted assassination and coup d'etat.

It is that story, rarely told, that offers a vital lesson today to the Democratic Party, and to the American people, as the nation faces another monumental Presidential election--an election, like 1932, that once again may determine whether the United States survives for another generation, as the sovereign republic established by the Founding Fathers.

- A Challenge to Wall Street -

From the time that Franklin Roosevelt was reelected governor of New York in November 1930, by a sweeping majority, he emerged as the clear frontrunner for the Democratic Party Presidential nomination in 1932. He had already staked out a new direction for the nation, through his published writings and speeches, and some of the emergency measures he had taken as governor, to deal with the crushing impact of the 1929 Wall Street stock market crash, and the ensuing collapse of the U.S. economy.

In 1931, he pushed legislation through the Republican-majority New York State Legislature, which created the Temporary Emergency Relief Administration (TERA), with Harry Hopkins as the executive director. The $20 million program created jobs for the construction of hospitals, schools, and other vital infrastructure in the state, and provided other relief for the growing legions of unemployed. But Roosevelt made it clear that his efforts in New York were being countered, at every turn, by the Hoover Administration in Washington, that was more committed to bailing out the bankrupt financial institutions, than it was to providing for the welfare of an increasingly desperate American people.

In July 1928, FDR had penned an article for Foreign Affairs, the journal of the Council on Foreign Relations, which presented a ``Democratic View'' of ``Our Foreign Policy,'' in which he boldly spelled out a radical overhaul of American foreign policy, in the tradition of John Quincy Adams and the Treaty of Westphalia. Before being striken with polio in 1921, FDR had been Assistant Secretary of the Navy under President Woodrow Wilson, and had been the unsuccessful Democratic Party Vice Presidential candidate in 1920."

FDR wrote in Foreign Affairs, ``The time has come when we must accept not only certain facts but many new principles of a higher law, a newer and better standard in international

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What a Woeful Mess
Posted by: Shankari46 on Sep 18, 2008 2:50 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Well, Bush ran the country into the ground like he ran his own company into the ground. We knew this would happen and of course no one listened. We need a very qualified individual to make some tough decisions. I fear that if the government keeps taking on debt it too will collapse. We are currently borrowing money from China, Japan and elsewhere. If we can't control our own backyard why would anyone else loan money to us. What is to be done? It's pretty obvious that we will have to totally slash the military, and next we will have to stop importing so much oil. How? Stop selling vehicles that use it. If the vehicle doesn't get 40+ miles to the gallon, don't sell it. Encourage mass transit. AND the companies that are failing need to fail. It's going to hurt, but these people need to go down financially and possibly need to be jailed. What happened in the Depression was a huge transfer of money from the poor to the wealthy. That will probably happen now too unless we step up and stop this nonsense. Great Depressions bring revolution and that also may be necessary.

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» McCain's Tax Cuts for the Wealthy Posted by: thinks4herself2008
Communism
Posted by: Godfather89 on Sep 18, 2008 2:50 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am not a communist, the government should not step in. Besides our economy is run by credit not sound money. Neo-Cons are not FREE-MARKET people. They have a policy that is similar to a command and control ideal.

So I ask you "The New World Order" is a socialist / communist run command control economic theory. If personal rights and economic rights are the same (and they are) than wouldn't controlling the economy like the way we do now only lead to the inevitable lose of liberties?

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Turn the Page
Posted by: Direct Democracy on Sep 18, 2008 4:52 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Representative democracy was a great way to govern people who were disconnected and illiterate. It's obsolete.

FREE AMERICA

REVOLUTIONARY (DIRECT) DEMOCRACY

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Only Nader will fight for a Rooseveltian counter-revolution. Obama will not !
Posted by: maxpayne on Sep 18, 2008 5:15 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
You people who are planning to vote Democrat or Republican are just voting to force this country to LOSE a great opportunity to rescue this country from total meltdown. Well, don't come crying when China takes over ! James Trafficant was sure as hell right about China being prepared to shackle America to its heels !

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Accidents happen?
Posted by: boing007 on Sep 18, 2008 5:23 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
No. I think they knew what they were doing and are very pleased with the results.

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From the bottom up
Posted by: boing007 on Sep 18, 2008 5:31 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
My father once told me when I was a teenager that change does not begin with leaders at the top. It all starts local.

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TRICK TRICK EM DOWN ECONOMICS AND THE DUBUA BOYS
Posted by: stopthemaddness2 on Sep 18, 2008 5:50 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Trickle Down Economics equals Trick Trick em down to no money economics, that way we have total control.... Americans please wake up! Wake up before we all find ourselves starving on the streets....

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IF MORE FINANCIAL FAILURES HAPPEN, MAYBE PEOPLE WILL WAKE UP AND SEE REPUKS HAVE ROBBED US ALL
Posted by: stopthemaddness2 on Sep 18, 2008 6:04 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
IT is time for Americans to wake up. This is just the beginning. A domino affect is on the horizon, and the screw up crew and the powers that be are controlling all commerce and purse strings in the more corrupt government that has ever crossed the white house lawn,and MCCain is connected in the direction this nation has taken; which is down the tubes. If more financial institutions fail, maybe then, Americans will wake up and SEE that the CURRENT government officials, now in place, have helped to create this mess, ignored this fall by looking the other way, as hands in the cookie jar have created significant losses. DO NOT make the mistake of electing anyone into office that even remotely smells like a REPUKE-LICAN. Please wake up! Vote for true Change...Stop the maddness now!

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Entirely true! Keynes redux
Posted by: Malbone on Sep 18, 2008 6:27 PM   
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Finally an insightful comment worthy of Kuttner's expert analysis.

I also have a blog entry on this issue:

My Plan for the First Hundred Days

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Unlike FDR
Posted by: amacd on Sep 18, 2008 6:36 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Friends, Americans, countrymen, lend me your ears;
I come to bury capitalism, not to praise it.

Unlike FDR, we will not save capitalism from itself, but rather complete the American Revolution and establish a democracy of men to govern ourselves in a society of our whole political economy.

Our entire political AND economic system will be democratic --- rather than pretending to have political freedom while actually being ruled by an elite economic Empire.

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Don't forget utility and communications anarchy ...
Posted by: Malbone on Sep 18, 2008 7:02 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
One might also add the 30-year-old mania to turn the purveyors of basic services like electricity, water and phone lines from quiet, stable companies earning a modest profit and delivering reliable service into commodities casinos offering new opportunities for quick profit. That led to Enron and to the California energy debacle that nearly bankrupted the state government for the benefit of private investors.

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Economic Free-Fall Hits Workers Harder than Wall Street
Posted by: CA NOW on Sep 18, 2008 7:31 PM   
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We're writing about how the economic crisis is affecting women and families at the CA NOW blog: Economic Free-Fall Hits Workers Harder than Wall Street

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Short Video on Repeal of Glass-Steagall
Posted by: sfpearce on Sep 18, 2008 8:14 PM   
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Here is an interesting short video on Glass-Steagall.

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Fundamental election change
Posted by: PaulK on Sep 18, 2008 8:16 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Do you imagine that the bankruptcy of AIG, Merrill Lynch, Bear Sterns, Countrywide, etc, is the end of it all? I don't.

This next great depression is first and foremost going to be a 1930 Britain-style depression, characterized at first by nothing but debts backing the currency. The war ate everything, cleaned Uncle Sam out, whatever the domestic crooks didn't take. The corporations are all in the Cayman Islands and have forgotten their homeland now. During the 1929 panic we had a pyramid of a banking/investing system collapsing, but the actual wealth never left the country. Not so this time. In addition our country is hollowed out. We don't seem to have the cash to educate our kids or to see a doctor anymore. Nothing works anymore because the money is nearly gone starting at the top, so the states are broke, so the cities are broke, so the services are all gutted. We have a hollowing out of our government.

We will have a great depression every 75 years or so, depending on the average human lifespan. We always have. The new generation always forgets. Our democratic government, while better than most of the rotten kings of Europe, is still subject to being bought by the country's barons (or lately, foreign barons).

Get your grandchildren something they can really use: electoral reform.

My top recommendation is to switch many governments, one at a time, over to a "choice" or "voting by numbers" form of proportional representation. That's where you select your first, second and third choices for city council with the numbers 1, 2 and 3. If you don't get your first choice, you tend to get your second and third, so your vote really counts. No more "safe" districts anywhere!

Cambridge, MA has beat off 5 revoke attempts (everyone bankrolled by the political crooks in my opinion) in its 67 years of using proportional representation. It's hard to say if the city of Cambridge is rich because it has two outstanding universities, or if the city government has contributed to its two outstanding universities. In any case, it's nearly impossible to buy a majority of the city council off. The city council always has several women, black members, hispanic members, white members, liberal members, conservative members. They watch each others' budgets like hawks.

Elections are completely free of mudslinging. Mudslinging only works against one opponent, never against ten of them.

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Obama in entirely capable of a Roosevelt-Scale Counterrevolution
Posted by: foreverhope on Sep 18, 2008 8:17 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I believe Obama has the ability and desire to lead a Roosevelt type of counter revolution. I believe without any doubts that Barack has the same type of overall leadership abilities as Roosevelt.

BE HAPPY DEMOCRATS!! THIS IS OUR TIME TO SHINE!

It had to get this bad for enough people to understand how wrong everything has been. The repuglicans are screwed.

This country is going to elect Barack Obama for president in November and give him a mandate in both houses of Congress. It's going to take time and hard work but I think we have hit rock bottom, the only way is up, and the democratic leaders, with Barack Obama as our president, can begin fixing the mess repugs have created since Reagan took office in 1981. That is how long it has taken to get here. Our Idiot Decider and Sick Dick aren't responsible for all of this! NOOOOOOOOO! It has been coming for a long long time, and for whatever reasons, ever since Reagan, the democrats have had a difficult time finding their voices and their balls.

All that is changing before our eyes, if you haven't noticed you will. We are entering an age of enlightenment. Intellectuals won't be called elitists anymore. Children won't have to eat ketchup as a vegetable for school lunch . We WILL have health care. We WILL have equal pay for equal work. We WILL regulate banks and other businesses to protect the consumer. We WILL have reproductive freedom. We absolutely WILL get out of Iraq! We WILL take care of our veterans. We WILL sort out the mess in Pakistan and Afghanistan. We WILL make peace with Putin to end fears of a new cold war. We WILL win back the respect of the world that's been lost over the past eight long years!

The list is endless, but we WILL do it, we CAN do it, and we MUST do it. We have no choice and with Obama's leadership it's going to happen, I have no doubts. So let's get out the vote.

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our gov financial woes
Posted by: katee on Sep 18, 2008 9:15 PM   
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We need to get rid of the Federal Reserve and we need to start printing our own money. We also need ot clean house and get rid of the ones that got us in this mess or did nothing to prevent it....

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ba
Posted by: mnstra on Sep 18, 2008 9:59 PM   
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Good article. I can't imagine any person walking around today who is not in the most unbearable rage and anger over what has happened on Wall Street this week and the Government's response. Basically you and i have handed money out of our savings to the big fat cats on wall street after they have fleeced the public out of money for the last few years,. How can anybody be calm after all that give away to the bastards on Wall street. Th Fannie MAE s the Freddie Macs the AIGs the Bear Sterns to name a few.Their rip off is tantamount to a nuclear attack on the US. And what do we all do? Go on with our heads up our collective asses.!!!!!!!!
We need to string them up by their balls and
now.........

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Gov't Regulation of Capitalism is a Delusion
Posted by: shinseiji on Sep 18, 2008 11:07 PM   
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The first poster asked the right question: If the New Deal was so great, how did matters eventually get to this pass anyway? People didn't just "forget".

Capitalism is not a system capable of equilibrium or stability, government or no government. It is the very nature of capitalism to find ways around barriers to maximum profit that leads to overaccumulation of capital and destabilization of the system. Attempting to put up such barriers is futile, only postponing the overaccumulation crisis until it explodes on an even grander scale.

Example: the Soviet Union. They though they could coexist with capitalism controlling most of world productive capacity while creating "socialism in one country". Well they were wrong, weren't they. If a state as powerful as the Soviet Union could not "contain" capitalism, why should we expect any better of the US? It won't contain it either.

The only solution is the abolition of capitalism worldwide.

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Only the Great Depression II...
Posted by: BlackbirdHighway on Sep 19, 2008 3:46 AM   
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Can bring about a Roosevelt Scale Counterrevolution.

Still to be decided: who is playing Hoover? Bush or McCain?

The one question I want to ask in the presidential debates is a very simple one:

Keynes or Friedman?

I can already predict Palin's answer: "Huh? In what respect???"

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Worse than '29 this time
Posted by: Daniel35 on Sep 19, 2008 5:26 PM   
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In '29 it was just a matter of corrupt economics. This time it's that of course, but also growing global shortages and environmental problems, both starting mainly with oil, and our continued subservience to our addictions for growth and cheap energy. '29 was just a glitch in an inherently growing economy, which Roosevelt failed to properly counter. This time many more of us will die, and those few who have seen it coming will be prepared and adapt, and a few will hopefully survive, to continue adapting.

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Yes, but...
Posted by: talkville on Sep 20, 2008 2:17 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Especially today, and especially for working people and the working classes as a whole, communication and words are important.

Anyone aligning themselves as "Left" ought to consider the terms of this 'debate': why does this article refer to New Deal actions and policies as "Counter-revolutionary"?? This concedes far, far too much to the Right Wing. What has occurred for the last 40 years or so is definitely not "a revolution"; especially since Reagan through the present, this has been a Reaction!! What has occurred to the working classes during these last decades is definitely not what any leftist, regardless of particular perspective, would call "revolutionary"; we have been beaten, thrashed, pounded, dis-possessed and dis-empowered and thoroughly immiserated by precisely the Right. In now way was that a Revolution -- that is Reaction incarnate!

It needs to be said and plainly: policies and strategies needed today by the vast majorities are the revolutionary ones -- including such reforms, ideas and policies which were used during the New Deal, but not excluding others either.

Where on earth can anyone consider themselves 'leftist' in any sense if this is characterized, as the title of this article advocates, as counterrevolution??!! Progress is never counter-revolutionary, only Reaction is. And it's time to act, and not re-act. Although beaten and bruised and perhaps compromised in many ways, the left is not dead by any means! Nor can we ever be 'counter-revolutionary' which would be a contradiction and terms.

Communications and words matter, especially these days. What needs to be opposed is Reaction plain and simple; that is definitely not counterrevolutionary.

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since when?
Posted by: zuse000 on Sep 20, 2008 7:53 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
According to the constitution,our duly elected congress is charged with controling the money spent by our government. Where are they in this billions/trillions bailout stuff? Congress should just go home and give up, they aren't doing their duty and apparently are irrelevant. Do Americans realize that the Federal reserve, who decided to bail out and buy debt, is private, for profit, and run by non elected officials? Since they can print all the money they want, they can pay off anything in newly printed money, but the result is money for you and me that is worth nothing. Its like a hidden government running the show. Since when did they get the authority to do this? I am sure that these bailed out company's executives, who no doubt received huge bonuses within the last year, are still driving their maserates. Let me ask, how is this free market anyway? Free to run with risky ventures within the marketplace and free to become wealthy until it collapses , and then free to be bailed out by the government with tax payer and newly printed money? Privatized profits and socialized risk is not free market.

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This is no "Free Market"
Posted by: gwhitejr on Sep 24, 2008 4:44 PM   
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Though I have great respect for Mr. Kuttner and all the posters here...I must disagree on a few points.
If the U.S. economy was allowed to be a true "Free Market" we would not have any of these problems. Roosevelt's new deal was a bailout much like this one. The major difference was that it's solutions were more punitive to the offenders than this is likely to be.
In a real free market companies, banks etc. who did business this way would simply fail. The gov't should lend money to SOLVENT companies to purchase these unethical failures...not bail out and allow them to continue to operate.
Captalism is darwinism...the role of regulation is to keep the playing field fair.
The U.S. is a Fascist society...and I mean the ORIGINAL meaning of the term...where CORPORATE interests BECOME GOVERNMENT interests.
The people who manage these companies should be prosecuted for mishandling of investor funds.
The proposed solution is to hand $Billions$ of dollars to people who have demonstrated their inability to manage it correctly. As with any ideology, Capitalism is not the offender...it is the lying, greedy, unethical PEOPLE!
Why not give the money to families who cant pay their mortgages...then they would pay them and the problem would be solved...right? {yeah right}

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Good column, but headline was a bit overdone-- proposals were more common sense than any big FDR
Posted by: doinaheckuvajob on Sep 25, 2008 7:24 PM   
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make work style measures like the WPA and the Tenessee Valley Authority.

These proposals are more like moderate liberal Democratic ones than FDR.

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