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Debunked: Ten Conservative Myths About National Security

By Sara Robinson, Campaign for America's Future. Posted September 15, 2008.


Going after the most dangerous myths spun by conservatives after 9/11.

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True confession: I was terrified on 9/11 -- for all the right reasons.

I wasn't afraid of the terrorists. There are plenty of countries where people have lived for decades under the constant threat of unholy acts of terror -- and yet people still get on buses and subways and airplanes, and life goes on. I'd like to think that Americans are at least as courageous as Israelis or Indonesians. Our "land of the free and home of the brave" mythos insists we should be. So I was damned if I was going to respond to the crisis by giving into irrational fears and thereby, as we used to say, "let the terrorists win."


No, what I was really afraid of was that too many of my fellow Americans would forget the lessons of their own history -- that they'd lose track of who we are and where we've been and what we're made of. I knew there was a real possibility that this time, we'd fail to live up to our reputation for cool, calm clarity in the face of crisis, and instead be goaded into taking counsel of our fears. I feared the bad choices that would inevitably follow if we stampeded down that road. And I dreaded that it would be the soul death of the country I loved.



I hate having been right about this, though I can hardly blame average citizens for succumbing to the sirens of chaos. Americans trying to make correct sense of the new reality found their efforts stymied everywhere they turned. With the White House distorting intelligence to sell a war, corporate opportunists fanning the coals of panic to heat up vast new business opportunities, media editors milking the drama to keep their ratings high, and terrified hordes quick to shout "treason" whenever anyone dared to question the path we were taking, it was hard for even thoughtful Americans to locate the truth of the matter. And as long as confusion reigned, the terrorists really did keep winning.

Seven years later, as the miasma dissipates, more and more of us are able to calm down, take a step back, draw a big, cleansing breath and start to sort things out more rationally. Unfortunately, though, a few of the myths promulgated in those first few years have hardened firmly into a new conventional wisdom -- some so stubbornly that you often won't even find progressives questioning them any more. The time has come to call out a few of these persistent myths that are still being taken as fact and start firing back on them.
1. "Islamofascism" is America's biggest national security threat.

Not hardly. This is the hot new idea among far-right demagogues who literally can't define who they are without a devil to contrast themselves against, and military hawks looking for an excuse to keep the military-industrial complex's big all-night party rolling in the bleary morning-after of a post-Cold War world. But, as the Center for American Progress notes in this article, it's a dangerous meme that disables our ability to think clearly, and it will almost certainly lead us into even more catastrophic misadventures.

To begin with, "Islamofascism" itself is an impossible idea, and those who promote it betray a fundamental political ignorance. True fascism can only occur within an industrialized nation-state, few of which exist in the Islamic world. And many of our most intransigent problems with terrorism come from the opposite problem: modern terrorists have no state affiliations, and are thus free to drift across international borders with fluid ease. Defeating them means coming to grips with this fact. Calling them "fascists" makes it that much harder to grasp.

Worse, "Islamofascism" suggests that the Muslim world is some kind of vast monolithic conspiracy, equal in might and will to the Soviet Union or Nazi Germany back in the day -- and that's another dangerous delusion. Just like Christianity, Islam covers a widely diverse range of cultures and political attitudes. In fact, the overwhelming majority of the world's 1.6 billion Muslims are not jihadis, and consider terrorism abhorrent. Turning one-quarter of the world's people into The Enemy will blind us to the subtle but critical distinctions within Islam. It will doom us to serious blunders, alienate potential allies, and cost us important opportunities to make real inroads against terrorism.

Spencer Ackerman suggests the term "anti-Western Salafist jihadism" as a replacement. Less catchy, perhaps, but more specific and not nearly so fraught with wrong assumptions that can cloud our thinking.

Having dispatched "Islamofascism," though, the more important point remains: Anti-Western Salafist jihadism isn't even America's biggest security threat. It's on the short list -- but so are global pandemics, loose nukes, our dependence on foreign energy, the catastrophic effects of climate change, the U.S.'s vast and bloated national debt, and our growing helplessness at producing essential goods for ourselves. As long as we're mired in an endless war to "defeat Islamofascism," we're going to remain weak, distracted, and grossly unprepared for the other serious security threats we face.
2. We're fighting them there so we don't have to fight them here.

False. The image here is that Iraq is some kind of roach hotel for global terrorism. The truth is, it's become the international finishing school where a new generation of terrorists is getting a front-line, real-time education against the American war machine -- and perfecting low-tech ways to close the gap against a high-tech army.

The U.S. official National Intelligence Estimate concludes that the war in Iraq has made new Islamic radicals where none existed before, greatly increasing the terror threat around the world. The number of significant terrorist incidents worldwide has risen every year of the war. In a bipartisan survey of national security experts last year, the consensus found that that the war in Iraq is making the world more dangerous for Americans. (To be fair, this same panel is a bit more upbeat this year, but still thinks the war is a grave mistake.) In the meantime, al-Qaida has regrouped in Pakistan, and is back at full strength -- while we've suffered more than 35,000 casualties and spent more than $550 billion, while alienating friends around the world.

"Fighting them there" hasn't been nearly the solution we were promised it would be. But too many of us were eager to buy into that promise, because we'd already been sold on another persistent myth:
3. Military solutions are the only effective national security solutions.

Wrong. So wrong that Boston University professor Andrew Bacevich (who is nobody's liberal) has written an entire book on America's dangerously nave faith in the military as the only viable solution to everything that ails us.

Which is ridiculous, when you consider all the things military force can't do. Smart bombs won't stop global warming. Battlefield nukes won't cure pandemics. Air strikes won't reduce our reliance on foreign energy sources. Sending in the Marines is no way to reduce the national debt. As we saw above in No. 1, terrorism is just one of a number of real national security threats we're facing -- and as we'll see, it's not even clear that that the military is the right answer there, either.

On the other hand, there's a surprising level of consensus among security experts on both the left and right on what real, effective national security would look like:



  • We need to beef up our intelligence agencies -- in a way that's consistent with the Constitution -- so they can monitor terrorist groups and keep dangerous technologies out of their hands.
  • We need to provide consistent and effective domestic security around ports, chemical plants, and other high-risk targets -- something that should have been done immediately after 9/11, but is still largely neglected.
  • We need to revisit our national infrastructure for disaster preparedness and response. Whether it's floods or fires, evacuation or epidemic, insurgents or industrial accidents, we will be more secure if we have a well-planned, coordinated response, and trained people prepared and in place to handle it.
  • We need our friends. Diplomacy, alliances, international cooperation, intelligence sharing and police work are the essential tools for pre-empting real threats to our security.
  • We need to become more self-sufficient. Asked by the Foreign Policy Index to rate strategies for strengthening the nation's security, 55% of Americans listed "Becoming less dependent on other countries for our supply of energy. Only 17% said "Attacking countries that develop weapons of mass destruction" would enhance our security.



America has very few problems that can best be solved by military means -- and a great many problems that require us to look for other strategies.
4. But -- what we're doing is working! After all, we haven't had another 9/11…

True, we haven't -- but not for the reasons you think. Which leads us to another myth….
5. Everybody knows that "law enforcement" approaches to terrorism don't work.

False. They do work. In fact, they're about the only thing that really does work. Every single terrorist plot that's been prevented since 9/11 -- both the serious ones, and the ones that were "more aspirational than operational" -- were prevented through good old-fashioned police and intelligence work.

Taking the wide view, the fateful choice to send in soldiers rather than international cops turned out to be a major win for the terrorists. Conservative blogger Steve Chapman explained it this way: "By framing the fight as a global war, we have helped Osama bin Laden and hurt ourselves. Had we treated him and his confederates as the moral equivalent of international drug lords or sex traffickers, the organization might not have the romantic image it has acquired. By exaggerating the potential impact, we also magnified the disruptive effect of any plots, which is just what the terrorists seek."
6. We don't need allies: we can do this on our own. Besides, moral authority doesn't matter when you have superior firepower.

More fatal hubris. One of the more noxious side effects of American exceptionalism is that we cling stubbornly to the idea that we're the only country on earth that matters and owe nothing to anyone else.

That wasn't even true back in 1776, when Thomas Jefferson duly noted the new nation's obligation to have "a decent respect" for "the opinions of mankind" in the first paragraph of the Declaration of Independence. It's considerably less true now that we are so dependent on so many for so much. Insisting that we can go it alone in this deeply interconnected world -- where our oil comes from the Saudis, our cars come from the Japanese, and our money and everything else comes from China -- is very much like a headstrong 14-year-old who insists that they don't need Mom and Dad for anything -- except maybe housing and food and an allowance and a ride to the mall.

And that's about how Americans look to the rest of the world whenever we strike this "I'll do it myself, so there" posture: immature, petulant, spoiled and ignorant of all the ways we depend on the family of nations for our continued well-being. Yes, we're big and strong and capable of doing tremendous damage if we get angry. But we can only throw that weight around for so long -- by and by, the other nations will band together to find alternatives to dealing with us, and may even start actively looking for ways to knock us down to size. In some places, this is already happening, and it's not in our long-term interest for it to continue.

It's time for us to remember our grown-up manners and return to our seat at the global family table.
7. Negotiating with "irrational" dictators is pointless, and a sign of weakness.

Catastrophically dumb. Conservatives condemn the idea of presidents talking to their counterparts from "enemy" countries, but 67 percent of Americans disagree, according to a June 2 Gallup poll. "Large majorities of Democrats and independents, and even half of Republicans, believe the president of the United States should meet with the leaders of countries that are considered enemies of the United States," the poll says. Fifty-nine percent of Americans, for example, would support the U.S. president meeting with the president of Iran, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad.

If FDR could confer with Stalin and JFK could negotiate with Khrushchev and Nixon could go to China and sit down with Mao, there's no reason whatsoever our current president can't arrange a meeting with Ahmedinejad. Bush's refusal to do this is a sign of his essential smallness of character and the narrowness of his worldview. The problem with all ideologues is that once they decide that "you're with us or against us," then no further discussion -- let alone compromise -- with the other side is possible. That's a dangerous trait in a president, and one we should watch out carefully for in the future.
8. Government spending on national security is different than pork-barrel spending on other programs.

Another myth busted. Recall that when the Republicans controlled Congress, they devised a formula that diverted security money from high-risk (and mostly liberal) states like New York and California to lower-risk (and mostly conservative) places like Wyoming and Nebraska. This made no logical sense from a security standpoint -- the only explanation was that the Republican Congress was using 9/11 as an excuse to dole out pork.

Homeland security has grown up to become one of the biggest pork barrels in American politics. Security professionals are quick to point out that too many of these efforts aren't designed to provide objectively effective security -- in fact, as we'll see below, many of them are based on flawed assumptions about how effective security works. Instead, the contracts are written in such a way that the only way to fulfill them is to funnel our tax dollars into the pockets of well-connected conservative cronies. The upshot is that we spend more than we should, and get less real protection than we deserve.

And perhaps worst of all: Seven years of this unregulated, unfocused spending has created a booming new industry that can only survive as long as it keeps selling us on new threats to fear -- which has long-term implications for our entire national culture.
9. Airport security is a critical part of our anti-terrorism effort.

True, but not as true as it should be. Security experts are still deeply concerned about at least two big holes in the system that make the high drama of the passenger screening area into nothing much more than a farce.

The first one is that we're still not adequately inspecting air cargo. Any competent engineering student can make and ship a timed bomb, which is why the 9/11 Commission Report insisted on aggressive inspection of all air cargo. At this point, most airports are doing random profiling and screening of parcels; but it's a far cry from the careful one-by-one inspection being given to people and luggage traveling on the same plane. In 2007, the Transportation Security Administration spent $5 billion inspecting passengers and luggage, and just $55 million on cargo going on the same planes. Cargo inspectors comprise less than 1 percent of the TSA workforce. Feeling safer yet?

The other security hole big enough to fly another 9/11 through comprises the various programs that allow crew members, frequent fliers, people with security clearances, and other "trusted travelers" to bypass inspection. As Bruce Schneier points out, these programs are based on the dangerous myth that terrorists match a particular profile, and that we can somehow pick terrorists out of a crowd if we only can identify everyone and get them all on watch lists.

Schneier, who has consulted with the TSA, is emphatic that dividing the world into "trusted travelers" and people on watch lists creates more security problems than it solves. "Most of the 9/11 terrorists were unknown and not on any watch list. Timothy McVeigh was an upstanding U.S. citizen before he blew up the Oklahoma City Federal Building. Palestinian suicide bombers in Israel are normal, nondescript people. Intelligence reports indicate that al-Qaida is recruiting non-Arab terrorists for U.S. operations." Furthermore, if you create a low-inspection loophole in the system, would-be terrorists will aim for that loophole -- and are more likely to get through it. The only way to prevent this is to throw out the watch lists and inspect everyone -- no exceptions.

Schneier and other airline security experts will tell you that most of the safety gains since 9/11 come about through just two developments: hardening cockpit doors, and passengers who now know that they may have to fight back. "Everything else -- Secure Flight and Trusted Traveler included -- is security theater," writes Schneier. "We would all be a lot safer if, instead, we implemented enhanced baggage security -- both ensuring that a passenger's bags don't fly unless he does, and explosives screening for all baggage -- as well as background checks and increased screening for airport employees."
10. It's always necessary to give up our civil liberties in a time of war.

Wrong. So horribly wrong, in fact, that my very conservative eighth-grade civics teacher wouldn't have graduated a kid who failed this part of the exam. She put the fear of the Founders in us, along with a clear sense of our obligations and rights as citizens. There hasn't been a day since 9/11 that I haven't mourned the fact that America has not produced nearly enough Mrs. Hermans.

Last night, I was watching NBC's presentation of "9/11: As It Happened," a two-hour summary of its coverage that awful morning seven years ago. At one point, late in the broadcast, Tom Brokaw made a comment: "We are a country at war now….we're going to have to reconsider some of the freedoms we now enjoy." The smoke of the towers was still rolling up the streets of Manhattan, and NBC's senior anchor was already declaring a new era in which patriotic Americans must be willing to surrender their liberty for security. I was left wondering how someone who wouldn't have made it out of eighth grade at Home Street School ended up in a national anchor spot -- and remembering all over again just what it was on that day that made me so deeply, truly afraid for my country.

Lincoln suspended habeus corpus during the Civil War, and FDR claimed extraordinary powers for himself during World War II -- but neither of them ever tried to argue that being at war was a natural excuse for suspending the entire Bill of Rights. In fact (as we have seen) the more dangerous the times, the more important those liberties become. In times of huge social transformation or economic upheaval, when everything else is up for grabs, our worldview and our values -- the internal qualities that define who we are, the things nobody can ever take away from us -- move to the front and center. Everything else can go up in smoke; but as long as we hold onto those core beliefs, we will be able to survive the worst, and find everything we need within us to rebuild the world anew.

The Declaration and the Constitution are the defining documents of our country, expressing the central ideals that determine who we are. If we abandon those ideals, we will simply cease to be American -- and, perhaps, lose the chance of ever restoring America again. If we are truly concerned about national security, this is, beyond a doubt, the worst thing we could ever allow to happen.

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Sara Robinson is a twenty-year veteran of Silicon Valley, and is launching a second career as a strategic foresight analyst. When she's not studying change theories and reactionary movements, you can find her singing the alto part over at Orcinus. She lives in Vancouver, BC with her husband and two teenagers.

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View:
Before Israel, Islam was of little concern to America
Posted by: weathered on Sep 15, 2008 3:47 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Americans traversed the ME like near royalty, so what happened Sara to disolve this once affable climate so profoundly over the past 30 yrs.?

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» What Israel hates most? Posted by: weathered
one more myth
Posted by: taxidriver on Sep 15, 2008 5:49 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
One more myth: "support our troops" = support every war the Bush Administration wants to fight. And those who dare to speak out against war = unpatriotic. This is perhaps the most dangerous myth of all.

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» RE: one more myth Posted by: weathered
» RE: one more myth Posted by: sunlakedude
Great and Important Information...
Posted by: OldRedleg on Sep 15, 2008 5:56 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Now "all" that the rest of us have to do is summon up and maintain the intestinal fortitude to challenge and inform the real facts to those who we hear spout off these stupid myths. It definitely isn't and won't be easy, especially if any of those folks are friends or relatives, or complete strangers, but planting the seed of truth just may take root and grow in the minds of the possibly more reasonable or open-minded fence-sitters or less fanatic McCain/Palin supporters. It is very important, though, to ensure that your own comments are backed by solid and current facts.

The alternative is sitting and suffering in silence while the BS continues to spread and grow. Pick your own poison.

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Irony much?
Posted by: amphead on Sep 15, 2008 7:07 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"There are plenty of countries where people have lived for decades under the constant threat of unholy acts of terror... I'd like to think that Americans are at least as courageous as Israelis..."

An article about myths with a whopper in the first paragraph! How can I take your article seriously with a bone-headed error like that one in it?

How about substituting Palestinians for Israelis in that last sentence? Israelis have US made helicopter gunships, warplanes, tanks and armored bulldozers. And impunity to kill at will. Palestinians have AK-47s, rocks and unguided, homemade missiles. Palestinians are murdered by Israelis on a daily basis. Occasionally, an Israeli is killed by a suicide bomber or missile. Who is the terrorist and who is the victim? I think you got it backwards, pal.

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» RE: Irony much? Posted by: gzuckier
» RE: Irony much? - More irony? Posted by: blurider
» RE: Irony much? - More irony? Posted by: leTerrassier
» Err .. no Posted by: themotie
Insane
Posted by: GreyFoxThree on Sep 15, 2008 7:08 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
That is just totally insane if you ask me.

Ultimate Anonymity

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Myth #11: Threatening violence against Middle East Muslims will help make us secure.
Posted by: VetAgainst McCain on Sep 15, 2008 7:14 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Iraq is a great example of how little Bush and his neocon pals understand human nature.

Take the "sweep and clear" tactics our troops used in Baghdad.

I’m not an expert on the Middle East, but I do have good common sense. And it doesn't compute in my brain that for the last five years the way to win hearts and minds in Iraq was by breaking into Baghdad homes, terrifying women and children with M16s, shouting orders in pigin Arabic, hauling away traditional weapons like the AK47 along with blindfolded relatives suspected of being Baath Party loyalists, whom we financed in the war against Iran.

How angry would you get if Iraqi soldiers in a white pickup truck stopped in front of your house tonight, busted down your door, aimed AK47s at your family, confiscated your shotgun, and demanded to know in broken English if you were a Republican?

Would not such treatment make you want to retaliate with pipe bombs and Molotov cocktails?

God, I hope so. If not, the American Revolution was fought in vain.

Vet against McCain
To find out why, click on the links below:

Songbird McCain
(Popular anti-McCain Web site)
American View (My favorite anti-GOP Web site
Vietnam Veterans Against McCain
(self-explanatory)
Vote Vets
(supported by 100,000 by Iraq and Afghan war vets)

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

But!
Posted by: EinMD on Sep 15, 2008 7:39 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Bu..bu...but, this is a post 9/11 world!

Everything changed!

The police are just doing their jobs when they kill people with tasers.

If you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear!

BU-Gawk! 9/11! 9/11

I think what's saddest about this is that our countrymen are too fricken stupid to even realize that they've been played for fools. You can't eat breakfast without some NSA Spook watching, yet they still think that somewhere, somehow they're still free and still have rights.

Land of the free my ass.

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» RE: But! Posted by: clvngodess
» RE: But! Posted by: gzuckier
» You got it right! Posted by: countingdaisies
» RE: You got it right! Posted by: leTerrassier
Imperialism is dead, and the "emporer is naked"......
Posted by: Spiritgirl on Sep 15, 2008 7:55 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Excellent points, but you've missed a few things: (1)extremely divided political parties (a)Rupugnikan hubris that continues to believe that the US military are "their" personal G.I.Joe's to move around at will, (b)Democrats that are trying to play catch-up the money trail voting against the interests of the people! (2)A populace that has given up and given into the divided politics of fear! (3)Those dumbed down divide and conquer politics of the "culture" wars!

The truth is that Americans today have forgotten those civics lessons they should have learned long ago. The other truth is that because our corporate controlled media are no longer willing to be the informational institutions that they once were; as a result the public does not receive the information on what has become the hubris of government actions done around the world in the name of we the people! As a result of dumbing down with a bit of Madison Ave. help, the populace at large are quite unaware of the ways in which our government props up dictators, sanctions virtual slavery in other countries, and over-all doesn't play fairly with people in other countries!

The celebrity "journalists" William Kristol, Tom Friedman, Charles Krauthamer, and others, that so mercilessly promoted the war with Iraq were so wrong in their hubris, yet, do they get fired no, they get rewarded for their errant prognostications and are promoted! The nerve! As more and more media have been consolidated and profit is the driving motive, the country is continuous being given pablum and info-tainment as news to our own detriment!

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Quick, somebody drum this article into Obama/Biden's heads !
Posted by: maxpayne on Sep 15, 2008 8:21 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
At least they'll have a clue as to how to attack the rightwing "conservative" ideology that is morally bankrupt and has been killing this country for 28 years.

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Ah thanks. I forgot to mention that.
Posted by: maxpayne on Sep 15, 2008 10:32 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I really have gotten caught up today ! Hehe.

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A special response to LionHeart who wants proof about Songbird McCain
Posted by: VetAgainst McCain on Sep 15, 2008 10:36 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
In his reply today on another thread (titled, "Start providing proof!"), Lionheart wrote the following -- beginning with a quote from my comment:

"Despite his claim in the U.S. News & World Report account that the enemy "couldn't ‘bust' me again," during his hospital stay and for months afterwards, McCain continued to cooperate with NVA interrogators, made more radio broadcasts for the enemy and met with foreign dignitaries in comfy settings while back at the Hanoi Hilton, the other POWs continued to suffer."

Provide proof....


Here's enough evidence to satisfy reasonable people:

1. By his own admission, McCain met with Cuban journalist Fernando Barral in 1970 -- more than two years after being captured when he, McCain, was no longer being tortured.

2. On June 4, 1969, again two years after McCain was shot down, a U.S. wire service story headlined, “PW Songbird Is Pilot Son of Admiral,” described one of his radio recordings: “Hanoi has aired a broadcast in which the pilot son of the United States commander in the Pacific, Adm. John McCain, purportedly admits to having bombed civilian targets in North Vietnam and praises medical treatment he has received since being taken prisoner.”

Both events occurred after the NVA stopped physically abusing POWs. Thus the self-serving Barral meeting, McCain accepting enemy favors and his radio broadcasts were completely voluntary and violated the Code of Conduct.

3. In 1987, the CIA released 35 pages of original documents which were intercept reports from the Agency's Foreign Broadcast Information Service and the Message Center of the U.S. Department of Defense National Military Command Center.

The Foreign Broadcast Information Service (FBIS) is an open source intelligence component of the CIA’s Directorate of Science and Technology that monitors, translates, and disseminates within the US Government openly available news and information from non-US media sources. In 2005, FBIS became known as the Open Source Center (OSC).

The files on McCain, which dated from October 11, 1967 to February 20, 1973, were released in response to Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) requests relating to POW/MIA issues.

Most of the broadcasts were part of a systematic propagation of a doctrine, reflecting the views and interests of the North Vietnamese during the Vietnam War.

The broadcasts translated and/or transcribed include:

(1) a Vietnam News Agency international broadcast of an interview with McCain,
(2) an interview of McCain, conducted by French journalist Bernard-Joseph Cabanes,
(3) Radio Moscow domestic Russian report on a Pravda Review article concerning the air defenses in Hanoi, featuring North Vietnamese interview content of McCain,
(4) an article written by French TV reporter Francois Chalais concerning American pilots held in North Vietnam, which included interviews of McCain.

Also reported by the CIA, in January 1970, Radio Havana broadcast McCain's interview by Fernando Barral. The broadcast received attention because McCain mentioned Lyndon Johnson’s management of the war.

Is that enough proof against Songbird McCain, LionHeart?

Vet against McCain
To find out why, click on the links below:

Songbird McCain
(Popular anti-McCain Web site)
American View (My favorite anti-GOP Web site
Vietnam Veterans Against McCain
(self-explanatory)
Vote Vets
(supported by 100,000 Iraq and Afghan war vets)

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Songbird
Posted by: blurider on Sep 15, 2008 1:26 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
John McWayne also voluntarily spoke Spanish with Barral, a further violation of conduct.

Slightly off topic - the DOW just closed down 504.48 - the S & P broke through the July low!

Now is the time for America's true come-to-Jesus moment!
Can you imagine McWayne slobbering in his bib while Palin meets with Paulsen, Bernanke and the like? Can you imagine being them and trying to make her understand? Can you imagine more of the same Reagan, Republican, waste-of-war, cronyism and Keynesian, military economic theories.? Can you imagine Sarah trying to 'pray' us out of the hell they've created?

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Armaments manufacturers love war, even if one has to be invented
Posted by: Garvagh on Sep 15, 2008 2:42 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The sheer idiocy of the "War on Terror" can be seen in the simple fact that bringing stability of even modest dimensions to Afghanistan requres the substantial assistance of Iran. The total fools frightening America with various "enemies" see Iran as a target when Iran is part of the solution! Why is this? Part of the reason is that religious fanatics, Jewish and evangelical Christian, want to steal large portions of the West Bank and they see Iran as not standing still for the next hundreds years, to allow the theft to be consolidated.

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TOP "Conservative" and "Progressive" MYTH = 9/11 COVERUP
Posted by: Mister_PsyOps on Sep 15, 2008 2:44 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
9/11 and its Washington-MSM coverup is an event that turned the entire globe upside down. A flagrant coverup that even stooges Kean with Hamilton of the so-called "9/11 Commission" won't even stand behind.

Ditto for genocide 9/11 "war on terror" of a thousand lies and the transparent Fascist U.S. police state that has come as a result.

Blaming ONLY phony neocon "conservatives" for 9/11 coverup and its bogus 9/11 "war on terror" does not fly. Never will. Not when "progressives" have helped neocons bloat DC 50% larger in under 8 years to create their FISA spy corporate police state.

Both major parties are controlled by Fascist corporate crime. The difference between a crock and crock-lite is largely imaginary.

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That is all they have
Posted by: LAThinker on Sep 15, 2008 3:59 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Some people have no brain and no immagination, so whats left is blaming the Jews

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» RE: That is all they have Posted by: countingdaisies
» RE: That is all they have Posted by: leTerrassier
GOP TROLL ALERT: Another Karl Rove Club member accuses me of being a fake veteran
Posted by: VetAgainst McCain on Sep 15, 2008 5:38 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Today on another thread, a poster named Illiteratilumen surfaced after (his words) "giving Alternet a break for awhile because of the hard-on the editors have for Sarah Palin.".

Here's what Illiteratilumen said about me:

My bet is that you are a fraud who cannot be honest with himself or with the people who stumble upon your website or any other works you have out there.

My bet is that you are nothing more than a wanna-be journalist with too much time on your hands.

My bet is that you are so egotistical and morally bankrupt that you don't have a problem retending to be a Vietnam veteran when you are probably not.

It is an insult to the Americans and Vietnamese who actually got caught up in that war.


End of Illiteratilumen's comment.

Last week, I responded to another GOP troll named Lionheart also has also personally attacked me in spite of AlterNet's NON-enforced policy against such postings. In my rebuttal to LionHeart, I wrote about "gettting caught up in the Vietnam War" this way:

I served my country honorably during the Vietnam War as a combat crewmember in the 320th SAC bomb wing stationed at Mather AFB, California.

One June 26, 1965, we flew "Arc Light One" -- the Strategic Air Command's first bombing mission of the war. Tragically, while flying through a typhoon at night, the historic operation turned into horror when two B52s from my wing collided and went down in flames in the South China Sea, killing eight crewmembers.

Years later, I wrote about Arc Light One in a nonfiction book this way:

To our rear, the second B52 wave, consisting of three-ship cells on five refueling tracks, approached the Air Refueling Controll Points where their tankers should have been orbiting for the refueling rendezvous. To close the gap, the KCs were flying faster than normal and the bombers had slowed.

One cell of B52s used a different method to kill time -― the wrong one. Inexplicably, the three-ship cell made a 360-degree turn and flew through a formation on the adjacent track.

Two bombers from the 320th, one in each cell, collided and went down in flames. At least six crewmembers ejected and made it to the water, a surging maelstrom of churning waves. I knew some guys were alive because I could hear their emergency radio beacons in my headset.

I remember the noise as a high-pitched whine that tailed off at the end, then repeated itself. In my brain, it sounded like “Help me...help me...help me...”

I couldn’t help thinking what a terrible and sad way to die -— alone, soaked and seasick in a one-man dinghy thousands of miles from home.

If I’d been alone in the cockpit, I would have cried.


Imagine how you would feel after living through that experience, and then to be called a "fake" veteran by Lionheart.

I can't begin to express my outrage over such a scurrilous charge, one of many by LionHeart that AlerNet has tolerated despite its policy against personal attacks on other posters.

That goes double for.Illiteratilumen.

Vet against McCain
To find out why, click on the links below:

Songbird McCain
(Popular anti-McCain Web site)
American View (My favorite anti-GOP Web site
Vietnam Veterans Against McCain
(self-explanatory)
Vote Vets
(supported by 100,000 Iraq and Afghan war vets)

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So there
Posted by: themotie on Sep 16, 2008 4:18 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"And that's about how Americans look to the rest of the world whenever we strike this 'I'll do it myself, so there" posture: immature, petulant, spoiled and ignorant' ..."

Hallelujah, sister.

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Lies! Distortions! Sarcasm!
Posted by: i_17bingo on Sep 16, 2008 6:52 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Bush Administration would never take away the whole Bill of Rights! How dare you suggest that? I'd like to see one Republican keep his job if he suggested putting even the slightest restriction on the Second Amendment. And because of that, your entire argument is invalid, just like one forged memo invalidated the Bush AWOL story. So there!

Right-wing campaign logic. It's easier than thinking(tm).

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» RE: Lies! Distortions! Sarcasm! Posted by: democracynowiniraq
SOMEBODY, PLEASE STOP THE RHETORIC.
Posted by: AlteredStates on Sep 16, 2008 2:22 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Watching any of the plethora of talk/news programs is like watching an old movie. You know what the "experts" are going to say before they speak by just looking at the "labels" next to their names near the bottom of your TV screen. Liberal, Conservative, Neocon, Socialist, Libertarian, Progressive, Right Wing, Ultra Right Wing, Christian Conservative/Religious Right/Family- Values-Nut-Job, you name it. They are all talking through their collective asses. Whenever one group, any group, gets together, you can see and feel the phony cum bye yah. "He Ain't Heavy He's My Brother", yeah, sure, until someone disagrees. Then the same old shit hits the same old fan. Who do we think we are fooling? Everyone; except the ruling class. They stay in power no matter what happens, just like the aristocracy in Europe. Two world wars didn't displace all of the Kings and Queens, Dukes, Duchesses, Lords, Barrons, etc. Oh by-the-way, did I mention that they are all related? Nothing like keeping it all in the family. And the ruling class in this country are just like the ruling class in the rest of the world. They run and own the military/industrial/governmental/religious complex and make money and "win" no matter who the "enemy" is. If there is one thing the ruling class likes AND wants, it is, turmoil!! The more the merrier...for them, until they have milked the system dry. Then, they start over again with another "crisis". Will we ever learn? No, not really. We think we win every time we change Presidents. But somehow, everything evens-out and remains the same with a few superficial changes that are put in place to pacify the blind and ignorant, who wait for "His Master's Voice" to reassure them that it is "safe".
Today, Sen. Barack Obama is going to speak in Las Vegas, where I live. I was invited last night via a phone call to attend. Being a life-long Democrat, I will probably be there when he speaks. I can almost hear what he will say, but I won't do that, because I want to be "surprised". This election should have been a shoo-in for the challenger (any challenger), but the political machines on both sides want it to be a horse race to make us think that we have a part in the political process. Well, dream on folks, the show has just begun.

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