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Michael Pollan on What's Wrong with Environmentalism

By Kate Cheney Davidson, Yale Environment 360. Posted July 8, 2008.


Michael Pollan talks about biofuels and the food crisis, the glories of grass-fed beef, and how environmentalists should think about sustainability.

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It's easy to think of Michael Pollan as a food writer. After all, his most successful books-- including his most recent, In Defense of Food: An Eater's Manifesto-- focus on food and the implications of the choices we make about what we eat. But Pollan's work also delves deeply into the environmental effects of those choices-- from the impact of America's corn-based agriculture on its ecosystems to the carbon impact of industrial-scale farming. And Pollan, who serves as Knight Professor of Science and Environmental Journalism at the University of California at Berkeley, has emerged as a staunch advocate of buying local food, growing one's own produce, and generally making the kind of individual lifestyle choices that could lead to society-wide change in consumption habits.

San Francisco-based journalist Kate Cheney Davidson recently interviewed Pollan at his home in Berkeley, California. In a wide-ranging discussion, Pollan talked about the need to cut back U.S. ethanol subsidies, why victory gardens worked, and why environmentalism needs to shift its focus from preserving wilderness to creating sustainability.

Kate Cheney Davidson: In your book An Omnivore's Dilemma, you explore the environmental, ethical, and political implications of our food system. Increasingly you hear people talk about the environmental or "carbon" impact of food. Do you think the footprint of our food has gotten any smaller since that book came out a couple of years ago?

Michael Pollan: I don't think there's been any significant change. There are basically two food chains that we have in this country, one a lot bigger than the other. First is a heavily fossil fuel-based food chain, the industrial food chain. The other is a more solar-based food chain, and in that I include things like organic agriculture, pastured meat production. To me, that's kind of the key distinction. The fossil fuel-based food chain takes about ten calories of fossil fuel energy to produce one calorie of food energy. So it's highly reliant on petroleum, and as a result is largely responsible for the greenhouse gas emissions associated with food production.

The other food chain is not innocent of an impact on the atmosphere, but it's a whole lot smaller. It's still essentially relying on photosynthesis, on solar collection by grasses, on sequestering carbon in the soil through feeding it with compost and things like that so its impact on the climate is much smaller. That solar-based food chain is growing, and this is where a lot of interest in agriculture is today, but it's still tiny. Organic represents less than two percent of the food economy. Local is probably well under one percent. So I don't think we've made a huge dent yet. But the models are there, and the models are becoming more popular.

KCD: What sorts of models?

MP: You can compare conventional beef production to a grass-based system of beef production, which is how we used to produce beef. Cattle are evolved to eat grass-- they have rumens so they can digest it. So when they [cows] are getting grass, you have a really exquisite and sustainable food chain-- where the sun feeds the grass, and the grass feeds the ruminant, and the ruminant feeds us. They are not competing with us for food, and it doesn't take vast amounts of fossil-fuel fertilizer to produce that food. It takes none, until you start trucking the animal off of the ranch.

The problem with that system for the marketplace was that it's a slower way to produce beef, and it takes more skill. It's a lot easier just to put them on a feedlot, give them lots of corn, give them antibiotics so they can survive the corn, give them hormones to speed up their growth. Suddenly you take a two-year process and get it down to 13-14 months. Time is money, so we moved that way.

But now the economics are changing because fuel is so expensive, and fertilizer is so expensive that the economics of grass-finished beef are starting to look a lot better. Certainly from a sustainability point of view it's a thousand times better. Grass is the original solar technology. Every blade of grass is a little solar collector. That's the free lunch-- sun growing grass, and feeding grass to animals you can eat.

KCD: Climate change is already disproportionately impacting the people who can least tolerate it: the poor. One of those manifestations, it's feared, will be massive food shortages due to things like changing weather patterns and the demand for biofuels. We may have already begun to see this, as prices of staples like corn and rice skyrocket and people begin to riot over food they can no longer afford. What do you think can be done on a global scale to alleviate what may be the beginning of a food crisis on a level we've never seen before?

MP: From one level, it's very simple. Grain is the basis of the diet for most of the people in the world, and grain prices have suffered this surge in prices over the last year that's unprecedented. That's because we began making this huge investment in ethanol and subsidizing ethanol production. That led to a spike in corn prices because we were making corn-based ethanol. But when you have a spike in one grain's prices, all the farmers rush to produce more of that grain. So you had wheat and soybean farmers getting into corn and out of soy and wheat, so that reduced the supply of wheat and soy and the prices there went crazy too. So that's the big cause.


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Too much "Feel good"
Posted by: jpjmarti on Jul 9, 2008 1:38 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
gut feelings and not enough critical thinking. Farming is inherently unecological and to talk about organic farming somehow improving the ecosystem is complete nonsense. Without a farm there would be, for example, a forest in its place and by any reasonable standard that is ecologically better than an area devoted to satisfying the food requirements of a single species...us. As for carbon storage, a typical growing forest ties down perhaps around (or even more) 2000 kg of carbon per hectare per year. An industrial US corn field apparently consumes around 1000 liters of fuel for each hectare which would translate to perhaps around 600 kg of carbon emissions a year. A hectare of industrial farm next to a hectare of planted forest ties down well over a ton of carbon each year.

Organic farming is reported to do things between 30-50 % more energy efficiently which would mean emission at a level of around 300 kg per year for similar amount of food. However, if the yield is substantially lower the organic farm will take more space and this space could have been used to plant trees. The energy saving in organic farming come nowhere close to compensating for increased land use when the yields are lower. While industrial farm with part of the area devoted to growing forest is a carbon sink, organic farm would still be a carbon source. From a climate change perspective it is much better to do our farming on as little space as possible and plant more forests. Farms are never ecological. The main question is how much damage do they cause. The biggest ecological problem globally is the destruction of habitats and agriculture is one of main culprits.

On the other hand fossil fuel use in agriculture is to a large extent a technological issue and not fundamental. Tractors etc. can, in principle, run on other things than gasoline and fossil fuel use in the production of fertilizers is also not a necessity. Correct me if I am wrong, but the main fossil fuel input in agriculture is in the production of hydrogen which is required in the production of nitrogen fertilizers. With the past gas prices the cheapest way to produce hydrogen has been to use natural gas, but in principle hydrogen can also be produced without natural gas. Its a question of, for example, how much natural gas costs compared to electricity.


Last and not least, let us keep in mind that most of the energy consumption in the food production comes from the bakery or from the stove at home. If you are after substantial energy savings, you should pay attention to the stove you have and how you are using it. (Microwave oven uses far less energy than than a stove.)

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Too much "Feel good" Posted by: mandiwrite
» RE: Too much "Feel good" Posted by: harryf200
» RE: Too much "Feel good" Posted by: buffeliscious
» RE: Too much "Feel good" Posted by: harryf200
» RE: Too much "Feel good" Posted by: dcr386az
» Not quite correct Posted by: HeroesAll
» RE: Not quite correct Posted by: jpjmarti
» RE: Not quite correct Posted by: abatto
» RE: Not quite correct Posted by: dallis
» RE: not enough critical thought Posted by: richholland
» When "technology" Posted by: buffeliscious
» RE: When "technology" Posted by: PopRox80
Opting into another System
Posted by: Timberbee on Jul 9, 2008 3:45 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am beginning to see that there is another system that we, Americans, can opt into. Here I am, able to hew timbers from logs, scribe one, marginal timber to another to construct a house, a barn, an outbuilding, walls of straw, dung, sticks, clay and lime, and roofs of... whatever, and I have built primarily for wealthy clients for the last 20 years, as have so many of my peers and... I am just now seeing that these skills can fit in what is becoming a movement.

I do see small scale, organic farming as part of a new system. One in which we can think locally, act locally, and affect globally. For thousands of years we were not dependent upon fossil fuels. Farms, in those days, contributed to the spread of humans, but, not to the spread of plastics. Not to global warming.

For me, in America, there seemed to have been one choice; Join the ranks. Consume. "Work for a living", save for retirement. Succeed or fail in a system that was centered around commercialism, around "money". Everything, absolutely everything had a price. Everything was about progress, and progress has been defined with a dollar sign. Agriculture is money. so we pick the most profitable way, regardless of whether or not this way destroys the soil, regardless of whether or not this way degrades those who consume the products, regardless of most anything other than the bottom line.

Everything has been about the bottom line. Efficiency. Control of wealth. Concentration of wealth. Why do we even have but one major source of energy? The Entire world reliant on Oil. Of course consumption does not drop significantly as the price soars. It is so very neccesary to this current Civilization. Everything would grind to a halt if the flow stopped tomorrow. Food. Transportation. Industry. Petroleum has become the basis for absolutely everything.

Someone has gotten the World of humans addicted to Oil, and, look how rich they have become doing so, and, just like addicts, our lives are ragged. We degrade our immediate surroundings, our lives hang in tatters. We feel that the tiny pleasures, the little highs of microwave ovens, driving at 60+ m.p.h., cheap, McDonald's burgers, cheap tennis shoes, blenders, and air conditioners are worth having this monkey on our backs.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Opting into another System Posted by: richholland
» I'm sorry... Posted by: buffeliscious
» For Thousands of Years Posted by: pdxstudent
» RE: For Thousands of Years Posted by: richholland
No high tech food production
Posted by: Last Chance on Jul 9, 2008 5:45 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
would be necessary if the human population would regulate itself to live locally in balance with the natural environment, but so little of it is left, and there are SO many human beings, they can't be fed except by mass production that grows with the relentlessly growing number of people = ecocide. So, how many people can live on a dead planet?

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» RE: No high tech food production Posted by: richholland
» RE: No high tech food production Posted by: Last Chance
brer
Posted by: brer on Jul 9, 2008 6:27 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Wouldn't it be a beautiful sight to see small gardens on what are now the large expanses of grass, that invasive weed we imported from some south sea island?

A well-cared for garden is a lovely sight. All we need is some local or national leadership to push us toward this goal.

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» Brer Rabbit says Posted by: Last Chance
» The more of us... Posted by: buffeliscious
The day more environmentalists associate hemp with environment is the day they'll start winning !
Posted by: maxpayne on Jul 9, 2008 6:42 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Until then, they can just SHUT THE HELL UP and keep staying the LOSER'S approach of letting the powerful elites divide people on the "economy vs environment" myth despite the reality that the economy and the environment are not like "oil and water".

Do a google search on "hemp" and "environment" and you'll see what I'm getting at and you might even be outraged at even the environmentalists for letting Big Oil laugh its ways to the bank thanks to their PISS POOR ideas of going on the defensive instead of on the offensive.

And don't forget. A vote for the GOP, the Democrats, or even self-righteous "libertarians" such as Bob Barr, are votes against the environment !

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» It won't work. Posted by: Last Chance
» Gardening is hard work Posted by: Last Chance
And here's another SUPER BREAKTHROUGH for "Last Chance" to suck on !
Posted by: jwverez on Jul 9, 2008 7:58 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Nanotechnology food coming to a fridge near you

http://www.nanowerk.com/spotlight/spotid=1360.php

If you really care for both the environment and sustainability in both food and the economy, give nanotechnology a CHANCE !

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Regulars on this site
Posted by: LeeAnnG on Jul 9, 2008 8:25 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
might note that I sound like a broken record. But here goes anyhow: gardening, although it is a great deal of work, is a wonderful, healthy, satisfying enterprise.

It is possible to grow an amazing amount of food in a rather small area. I noted in a previous post to the article "Turning Your Lawn into a Victory Garden Won't Save You -- Fighting the Corporations Will," that I grew enough lettuce in a 4'X4' raised bed to give away bags of it several times a week and had way, way more than I could use.

In the same post, I also said in effect that the time and effort required to fight big corporations produces minor results while gardening has immediate benefits. I have a fulltime job and a multitude of activities which make it nearly impossible to dedicate my life to causes, however important, but I have plenty of time to grow and process nearly all the vegetables my husband and I eat. (For some reason my point of view must have really irritated someone, as I got a "2" rating.)

Gardening is certainly time-consuming, but the benefits are amazing. It keeps one fit (I don't even use a tiller or plow; instead I dig up my entire 50'X 50' area with a small hand tool to prevent the top soil from being turned under the all-pervasive clay), it provides healthy organic produce, I have a large supply of great Christmas gifts, and it's great for the environment.

My parents lived in the middle of Allentown, PA, and they had a very productive garden for years. I have friends who live in smaller cities who also grow a wide variety of food. It's possible for many people to at least suppliment their food with vegetables they grow themselves.

It's not a comprehensive solution, but it doesn't seem as if there are really any single solutions. Hemp production would be a wonderful thing, so is political and environmental activism, and there are many other ways to contribute. Gardening is just one path to take, but it's one I have found to be enriching and highly rewarding.

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» RE: egulars on this site Posted by: Knot_Rich
» Hey to old Allentowners! Posted by: LeeAnnG
» RE: egulars on this site Posted by: Illiteratilumen
» RE: egulars on this site Posted by: jwverez
» Good points, so ... Posted by: harryf200
» RE: egulars on this site Posted by: maxpayne
» maxpayne maybe a broken record Posted by: undrgrndgirl
» RE: egulars on this site Posted by: jwverez
Ethanol good
Posted by: g50 on Jul 9, 2008 8:38 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Okay, it's real easy to be a professor out in California pontificating on ethanol subsidies, but it's entirely different when you're in the Midwest. The economy in a lot of towns ranging in the 1,000 to 250,000 range is really bleak - you'll go to a town of 50,000 and find out that in the last decade as many as 5,000 jobs have been lost by deindustrialization, and that added onto the already decades long hemorrhaging of factory jobs. Town to town it's like that - substantial percentage of the employment opportunities gone and with few opportunities to replace them. Places like Youngstown are considering just closing shop - sure, they're out of the way of San Francisco, but these are people who have a stake in this country too, and rights in our democracy to demand economic opportunity. Ethanol is essential in these communities because you have the prospect of an industry that can last - we will always grow corn - and jobs throughout the process of growing to fueling. And of course there are nationwide benefits of a cheap and reliable source of fueling. I will be the first to admit that a lot of these alternate fuel sources don't answer the question of carbon, but there are many factors to consider and I hope people's access to economic opportunity is one of those factors.

Furthermore, while it is apparently shocking to some that corn could be used for something other than eating, there are several reasons this shock is misplaced. First, the goal is not to have biofuels require corn but the cellulosic biomass that agriculture generates - inedible leftovers or plants like switchgrass. The research and development is going on now. Second, we only eat 4% of our corn anyway. Third, give me a break on the food prices. Show me where rice and wheat used in biofuel production raised prices. What's actually happening is that agricultural commodities markets are the next big boom, with everything from organic oriented policies to expansion of biofuels to biomedicine and many more fields in the hopper. Our next president is from a farm state and will have a close ear to the ground in Illinois, Iowa, Indiana, Wisconsin, etc. - you really think this criticism of ethanol is going to change things? Ethanol is just getting started. And when you see things from the closed-down mainstreets in hundreds of mid-sized towns and thousands of small towns across the Midwest, you'll have a different view on Archer Daniels Midland and ConAgra. Even if these companies benefit, so do the people who can earn a paycheck instead of nothing.

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» RE: thanol good Posted by: Knot_Rich
» RE: thanol good Posted by: richholland
» RE: thanol good Posted by: g50
» RE: thanol good Posted by: Tom Tele
» RE: thanol good Posted by: g50
» RE: thanol good Posted by: g50
» Obama the Magic Dragon Posted by: edith
Advice from an old goat.
Posted by: FURonnie on Jul 9, 2008 4:27 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
My wife and I have goats and they're great! Unlike cattle they require very little maintainace. They eat a wide variety of vegatable matter, some of which no other animal will. They are smart, control weeds and are cheap to raise. The milk makes great cheese and milk which is very easy to digest. The feces is unlike cows which makes big ugly piles and attracts flies. Goat's fecal matter is a very small dry round pellets about 1 cm in dia. which is spread evenly over the ground and does not need composting as the matter is completely broken down by their very efficient digestive system. This makes great soil on barren land. Our goats are pure white Angora, the wool we spin into the best yarn on the planet. They are combed of their wool and do not need shearing. They can have two kids a year and soon your herd will be large. They can graze on rocky soil that cattle and other animals cannot. The meat is lean and tasty and when marinated is very good. It can be dryed into jerky. Many Hispanic friends raise them and love the meat and it is an intrigal part of their diet. They have very few ailments and they are fun to watch as they are very comical and can grow to love people.

In the future we need to be consevative of out resources, frugal and think outside the box. There is a lot of good food going to waste in yard work that goats would be just to happy to veg on. The only problen is we don't have goat punchers and rodeo's centered around goats and you have to have a pretty good pen or fencing. Baaaaaaah!

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We're taking his advice seriously
Posted by: SufiLizard on Jul 9, 2008 5:19 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Mr. Pollan might find it interesting that I have spent the last week building my first chicken tractor, I just have to get the roof on it and we're ready to move in 80 hens.

We already have a small herd of grass-fed cattle. And of course we get most of our produce from our organic garden.

My wife and I both work outside the home so our farm is more of a hobby, but it provides "safer" food for us and our three young children as well as being more environmentally friendly than the factory farm system.

You don't have to wait for hydrogen cars and cold fusion, this is something many of us can do right now. Not everyone has the land to graze cattle, but gardens are possible for most people and even raising a few chickens is feasible for many people who may not think of it.

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prove it
Posted by: edith on Jul 9, 2008 5:28 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"Climate change is already disproportionately impacting the people who can least tolerate it: the poor"

Prove it. You can't.

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» RE: prove it,easy Posted by: Tom Tele
sweet corn
Posted by: Fat Man at the Buffet Line on Jul 9, 2008 5:34 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
does not ethanol make.OR For that matter a cattle or pig etc
Organic agriculture is not innocent in the use of petroleum products by a long shot
Yields on a good organic farm can be close to commercial yields...

Average age of farmer in US is 55...That is a big problem
There are not enough people ballsy enough to do agriculture for a living anymore...
These are things on my mind.

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This comment has been removed from the site due to non-compliance with AlterNet's community policies.
RE: Less cows more vegetables will save on food and fuel.
Posted by: dallis on Jul 14, 2008 3:19 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
we don't need more food to reduce hunger in the world. Every country in the world, barring temporary extreme circumstances, already produces enough food to feed everyone who lives there. The problem is a shortage of political and economic power among the poor. There is no obvious profit in feeding the poor, so it is not a priority.

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