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Religious Right Groups Want Pastors to Cross the Partisan Line and Spark Court Showdown

By Rob Boston, Church & State Magazine. Posted June 23, 2008.


The nation's most prominent Religious Right legal group is looking for a pastor who will knowingly break the law and spark an IRS penalty.

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For years, Religious Right groups have complained about the federal tax law that forbids houses of worship and other tax-exempt groups to intervene in political campaigns by endorsing or opposing candidates.

Several organizations pushed Congress to change the statute, without success. The Religious Right suffered another setback in 2000, when a federal appeals court unanimously upheld the constitutionality of the tax law.

Now the nation’s best-funded and most prominent Religious Right legal group is gearing up for another go in court – once it finds a plaintiff who will knowingly break the law and spark an Internal Revenue Service penalty.

The Wall Street Journal reported May 9 that the Alliance Defense Fund (ADF) has started a campaign to urge pastors to discuss candidates for public office from the pulpit, hoping to spark a new test case. The ADF, founded by James Dobson and other religious broadcasters in 1993, claims that about 80 ministers have expressed interest so far.

The newspaper reported that the ADF “hopes 40 or 50 houses of worship will take part in the action, including clerics from liberal-leaning congregations.” Erik Stanley, the ADF’s senior legal counsel, claims that dozens of religious leaders have already expressed interest in taking part in the Sept. 28 event, dubbed “Pulpit Freedom Sunday.”

One of them is the Rev. Steve Riggle, senior pastor of Grace Community Church in Houston.

“The government should not be telling the church what it should or should not be saying,” Riggle said. Riggle told The Journal that he announced from the pulpit in March that he was supporting former Arkansas governor Mike Huckabee in the Texas Republican primary.

“As a pastor, a private citizen, I can speak for myself,” Riggle said. “The IRS cannot quench my voice.”

Riggle later used church letterhead to endorse a Republican candidate in a special congressional election, an action that led Americans United for Separation of Church and State to file a formal complaint with the IRS.

Americans United also condemned the ADF plan.

Said AU Executive Director Barry W. Lynn, “This is a truly deplorable scheme. Federal tax law rightly requires churches and other tax-exempt groups to use their resources for religious and charitable purposes, not partisan politics. When the faithful put their hard-earned dollars in the collection plate, they don’t expect it to wind up pushing some politician’s campaign.

“The Religious Right leaders who lust for political power in America will apparently stop at nothing, not even the sacred character of the church,” Lynn continued. “The vast majority of clergy do not seek to turn their incense-filled sanctuaries into smoke-filled political backrooms.

“I think very few clergy will yield to the Alliance Defense Fund’s worldly temptation,” Lynn said. “And those who do will find their churches’ tax exemptions in jeopardy. I assume the ADF will provide a list of congregations unwise enough to join this move, and we’ll be ready to report those churches to the IRS.”

Lynn said clergy know they are free to speak out on religious, moral and political issues. But they cannot use tax-exempt resources to support or oppose candidates for public office, which includes statements from the pulpit by church officials and other indications of campaign intervention.

The ADF is apparently coordinating its scheme with other Religious Right organizations. On April 22, Kenyn Cureton, the Family Research Council’s vice president for church ministries, appeared on Religious Right activist Janet Folger’s “Faith2Action” radio program, discussing his organization’s plans for mobilizing pastors this year. Cureton, a former official with the Southern Baptist Convention, vowed to urge pastors to “cross the line.”

Cureton’s comment occurred after Folger mentioned that some members of her church were thinking of voting for U.S. Sens. Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton.

“It just seems to me that the messages are somehow not reaching the congregations,” Folger said. “Is it the pastors that need to speak more clearly? What’s the answer?”

“I think that’s the case,” Cureton replied. “The pastors need to speak clearly about it. I’ll tell you we are working with the Alliance Defense Fund on a series of sermons this fall for pastors to preach, so that they educate their people on the issues.


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Rob Boston is associate editor for Church & State magazine.

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Another excellent reason to yank their tax exemption
Posted by: primalscream on Jun 23, 2008 3:19 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There is no logical reason to give churches a tax exemption in the first place. Yank it, and they'll have the same First Amendment speech protections as everyone else.

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Tax exemption
Posted by: FernLee on Jun 23, 2008 3:28 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I agree that there should be no exemption because houses of worship continually violate the law. Of course, they want it both ways: to have unlimited free speech and a tax exemption. At the very least, the exemption should not extend to the entire property, just the main worship area. There is no reason why, just as an example, the property of a church in downtown Chicago that is on a prime real estate corner is tax exempt.
Also, how in the world is Christian heritage "being stripped from all corners"? Everywhere I turn I see or hear prayers, crosses, etc. Maybe the mainstream public is finally pushing back from the religous right's infringments on our liberties. After all, they have been pushing their agenda into public areas for years.

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» RE: Tax exemption Posted by: liberalibrarian
Typical Cowardly Move by Dobson
Posted by: Tim Brown on Jun 23, 2008 3:35 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
You'll notice that James Dobson is not offering to put his own mountain of tax-free money in jeopardy to test the limits of the law. He would rather have someone else do his bidding and encourage them from afar. It reminds me of the chicken hawks in the current administration who send others to fight their wars for them while they reap the economic bebefits from the safety of their air-conditioned offices.

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» Agreed and... Posted by: bobtr900
The tax code strangles free speech
Posted by: leland61 on Jun 23, 2008 4:00 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I just went through the tax code as it affects churches. It is basically a strangle hold on free speech for churches. It is simply designed by a cunning government to prevent groups and their leaders from exercising freedom of speech.

Churches should opt out of the 'tax free' nonsense and preach as they understand they should.

The whole tax ploy to corrupt the church is a simply a back handed way to get the church to serve the state. Many churches are more than willing to do that anyway since they are little more than 21st century incarnations of Constantinian Christianity rather than the real thing.

The tax ploy along with the naked political purchasing of favors by the Bush administration under the guise of 'faith based' funding is little more than a ruse that was invented by Constantine in the 4th century to corrupt religion into supporting the Empire. It worked then and it works now.

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They want
Posted by: charemor1 on Jun 23, 2008 6:13 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
They want to be able to support candidates who will speak out about the value of life, the value of family,and take on the issues of abortion, stem-cell research and the gay agenda? What about candidates who actually support the teachings of Jesus about helping the poor, the hungry and the homeless? To hell with all of the so called religious right - they are the religious wrong.

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» Almost Posted by: photon's feather
» RE: They want Posted by: john mont
Country Lisa
Posted by: demgirlmo on Jun 23, 2008 7:21 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I had been taking my son to a church since he was under a year old and left pretty soon after the 2000 election because of such practices of actually putting the "candidates we should vote for" in the church bulletin. Not coincidentally, I must add, ALL were Republican.

I started to take my son to church because I wanted him to learn about Jesus, Christianity, etc. NOT how to not think for himself and be a mindless sheep.

Besides, the main issue that the congregation was prompted to vote GWB in was Roe v. Wade. Doesn't look like GWB overturned this amendment and he doesn't have much time left.

The whole deal's just truly sad. And disgusting. What about that passage in Matthew...? You know, the one that explains how we'll be judged in our last day(s) proportionately by how we treat "the least of these, my brethren"???

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» RE: Country Lisa Posted by: Longdream
Render unto Ceasar
Posted by: JSquercia on Jun 23, 2008 7:23 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Perhaps they shoud render unto Ceasar that which is Ceasar's and render unto God that which is GOD's
I find it ineresting that many of these who so fervently support the Cluture of Life by their opposition to abortion and things like stem cell reseach have no problem with the Death Peanlty or the Wars of aggression that we have unleashed . Who can foget the "Compassionite" Conservative Gov George Bush not only denying Carla Faye Tucker's Clemency appeal but actually mocking her by saying in a falseto voice " Don't Kill me : Please don't KILL me ". Right then and THERE they should have KNOWN that this man was NO Christian . They love that Fetus but are adamantly opposed to helping the child once it is born . They wouldn't know Christ if they fell over him and would probably call him a Homeless Hippie trying to make us all Communists . It was not to the Pharisees that Jesus revealed his truth but rather to us ordinary sinners

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Sometimes the religious left doesn't cooperate either
Posted by: PaulK on Jun 23, 2008 7:23 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Yes there is something vaguely resembling a religious left, even if it's small. Jesus was a nonviolent pacifist who specifically broke certain laws and had no property to seize.

There are cases of Quaker organizations refusing to cooperate with the IRS, who wanted to levy money of tax-refusing employees of the organization. The IRS came down with heavy fines.

In a more successful plan, a Quaker group allowed a retiree, Wally Nelson, to grow organic vegetables on their land. The retiree then filed a complaining tax document every day of his life, at $500 IRS fines each day. After the IRS levies grew past $100,000, the man died, leaving the IRS with nothing but piles of paper and a lot of internal legal bills.

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» RE: The Society of Friends. Posted by: Longdream
Burn, Baby, Burn
Posted by: QQOblivion on Jun 23, 2008 7:26 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If these churches are so eager to meld religion with the earthly pursuit of politics, then they should wrap their little minds around this one:

Anyone who voted for President Bush will probably go to Hell.

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What if they endorse Obama?
Posted by: Romans1 on Jun 23, 2008 7:47 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There are a nuumber of churches and pastors who have officially endorsed Obama. Is that OK? Or is it just the conservatives who should get in trouble?

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» RE: What if they endorse Obama? Posted by: Longdream
» No, it's not OK... Posted by: hurricane hugo
» RE: What if they endorse Obama? Posted by: mainspark
Follow The Money
Posted by: johnbradleycopeland on Jun 23, 2008 8:08 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The John Dobsonites, Christian Coaltion, Baptist Foundation, Catholic League, Alliance Defence Fund, et al. Where is the money for these political action committee's coming from. I have written to each and every one of these organizations however they refuse to provide any information about their donors. You would think these "good" Christians would be proud to say where the money comes from but they aren't. They want it kept secret. If anyone has any information on this matter please respond. I totally agree witht the posters who support removing "tax exempt" status from ALL chuches. All of these churches have abused their tax free status and build mega-churches with theatres, basketball courts, game rooms, schools, day cares, dining halls and back-door political action committees all at the expense of the tax payer.

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» RE: Follow The Money Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Follow The Money Posted by: SD
Evangelicals need to realize that other churches aren't like them
Posted by: Jasonix on Jun 23, 2008 8:20 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
An evangelical pastor is just a guy giving his opinion, according to his church's theology. A Roman Catholic or Eastern Orthodox priest or bishop is not "just a guy" according their churches. When a priest or bishop proclaims something, the faithful believe that he's speaking with apostolic authority, and they risk their souls by not obeying him. The same is true for the leadership of the Mormon church.

Evangelical Protestants had better think long and hard about whether they want to enable the Catholic, Mormon, and Orthodox churches to overtly tell their people how to vote - how do they know that the Pope will always tell Catholics to vote for the same people the evangelicals want? Churches are already able to do it indirectly by picking particular issues and telling the laity that they have to vote one way on those issues - but allow churches to directly endorse candidates, and we'll have churches proclaiming that particular individuals are ordained by God to govern, not just that certain issues are important. Evangelicals had better think long and hard about whether they want to enable churches that are less democratic and egalitarian than theirs to do this. The Catholic, Mormon, and Orthodox churches go well beyond the evangelicals in their strictures - banning birth control, cremation, the right to pull the plug on the brain dead, and even expressing hostility to public education, religious freedom, and widespread adult literacy, in some cases. (Sure, most Catholics are just "cultural Catholics" who don't even know what their church teaches, let alone follow it - but whose to say what Catholics will be like a generation from now?)

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» RE: Not really. Posted by: Longdream
» Catholics Posted by: BlueTigress
Bush and the Repubs...
Posted by: bobtr900 on Jun 23, 2008 8:26 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
...have tempted religions with money and political power. The religions have bought into this Satanic temptation, including my own religion. They have fallen totally to this temptation.

Bush and the Rethugs have politicized and perverted religion. And religion has become fully complicit in their own politicization. So, now right wing religion is involved in the killing of Iraqis and our own military personnel.

Now the Bush Family Rethugs are attempting to use religions to bring down this nation. Religions have joined the Repub party in a hell of their own making and are trying to drag the entire nation and possibly the entire world down into the abyss. And all for oil profits. All religions, mine included, I'm not pointing fingers at any one religion and exempting my own, should remain far above the stench and foul evil of politics. Religious leaders should be like teachers. They should be about the business of reminding people of the higher values in life and the behaviors related to those values. Instead all we get is hate from them.

Kathleen Kennedy Townsend(Robert Kennedy's oldest child) was Lt. Governor of Maryland, and who then ran for Governor. She reported, when she was in Cleveland speaking before the City Club, about all the hate she got thrown at her during her failed bid for the Governorship. And all of this militant and highly aggressive hate was from our fellow Catholics. The Pope and his deep and staunch alliance with the Rethug party, to me violates Jesus' admonition to NOT merge church and state. Our now shredded Constitution says the very same thing, and rightly so. But all of these right wingers are nothing but 'Moral Relativists' as they just cherry pick the laws of God and the teachings of Jesus that they will and won't follow.

Personally, I am led to the belief that all of this seeming religious crap is nothing more than Republican party hate politics.That party and their right wing religious Theocons are ALL about money and political power.

The last time the Catholic Church, my religion, delved into politics the world got WWII from that diabolical 'hook up', with a total of 60 million dead people. Now, their allies, the Repub party and the Bush Family, father and son, have often talked about WWIII.

It is very easy and quite transparent, to see where they are going and where they are intent on dragging all of the rest us. And all of this is for oil profits.

To me, the real and final question is whether we can stop them and drag ourselves back from the edge of their abyss.

For those of us who believe in judgment in the after life, how will God judge us for what appears to be another impending Holocaust, another killing spree, dsid we learn NOTHING from the last one. It appears that is exactly what we learned from the last one, NOTHING, not one damned thing. Because we are still killing innocent people. The killing may be wrapped in GWOT, but it is nothing more than a Bush Republican religio-political CORPORATE OIL WAR.

St. Reagan and his two religious henchmen started this entire mess. Had Pres. Carter remained in office, he was well on his way to dealing with oil/energy shortages with scientific solutions, not political ones. And he was doing so in a in a time appropriate, late 70's, time frame. Can we all realize now, how prescient Carter was. All of this death dealing might very well have been avoided. And at the very same time Carter was well on his way to steering the America into sustainable living via 'Green' technologies. Which is quite possibly the next step inthe scientific technological revolution. But then a lot of the religious right hates science and thinking, as they adhere to anti-intellictualism. Well, we'll see exactly how far that gets them.

Even to this very day,... Cont'd below.

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Bush and the Repubs. Cont'd from above
Posted by: bobtr900 on Jun 23, 2008 8:23 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Cont'd.

Even to this day, so many years later, I, as a Catholic, continue to regard Pres. Carter as one of my favorite evangelicals. And their are others, such as Jim Wallis. It was he, who said: "God is not a Republican or a Democrat". We, on this forum do not need that reminder, but obviously all of the right wingers do, as they continue to politicize God.

SO, instead of science to solve our problems, we got that jerk Reagan and his corrupt Republican party politics, where the almighty dollar and corporate profits trump all other values, even human life. So it begs the question, where in the hell were the blind, dumb and ignorant Pro-Lifers and Family Values screwballs back then. I know exactly where they were. They were to damn busy playing Republican party politics. And both of those two entities, religious groups, mega religions, know exactly who they are, and so do we on this forum. So I'll not repeat myself by naming names and pointing fingers. But then maybe God, our Heavenly Father, has some special plans for them and their religio- political death dealing.

I caught the end of a telecast from a preacher of a small congregation/church in Oklahoma who put forth the notion that there should be no such thing as mega religions or mega churchs. He seemed to feel that they were tempted by worldly vices, distracted fro their true mission and were a financial burden on their church families. I would like to have heard more of his thoughts but I have not been able to find him, again. If I do I will report his ideas to this forum. His message seemed powerful and prescient and, at least to me, he deserved a much broader audience.

I will have none of the Repub or right wing religious death dealing, for profits and political power. Not for fear of Gods judgment, for He never judges wrongly, but out of my own personal beliefs in what is right and what is so totally wrong.

I remember: Thou shalt not kill. And: Thou shalt not covet thy neighbors goods.

As I recall, Confucius, Hillel, Jesus and The Prophet all said: Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. Exactly how is that NOT clear to the religious right and their Repub thugs running this country. But apparently those right wing religious people just seem to have forgotten the Sermon On The Mount. It is something they all seem to have conveniently forgotten (Moral Relativism) as they were too busy playing the Reagan-Bush Family Republican Party politics of GREED for money and political power and their complicit participation in the 'Culture of Death' for profits.

Other than the trolls, all of the rest of us on this forum, even and especially our brethren the atheists, seem to have a very clear understanding of all of the above while the religious right seem to have none of that understanding. I'll take an honest atheist any day over a religious hypocrite and phony. Honestly is far closer to Godliness than hypocrisy.

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» Atheists in politics Posted by: EinMD
The Religious Right is scared...
Posted by: CanuckKid on Jun 23, 2008 8:56 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"Why is the Religious Right so eager to ramp up church-based politicking? One reason may be that the organizations are terrified that their Republican allies will face setbacks in this November’s elections."

Yep - scared shitless. They know they're going to take a bath at the polls, and they want to proactively rig the game.

Isn't this evidence enough of the need for separation of Church and State? If there's one thing I greatly admire about the States, it's the clause in the constitution that guarantees the separation of the two. If there's one thing that exasperates me about the States, it's the recurring efforts (mainly on the part of politically-ambitious fundies) to obliterate that distinction.

I travel to the States a couple of times a year for professional reasons. I teach in Canada, and my brand of teaching involves family-oriented people who often lean to the devout end of the religious spectrum. When I visit the States, I'm always received well - by my colleagues, by their students and families, by average Americans with whom I interact, by The Homeland Security people, who are always courteous and professional. That said, there are two topics that I avoid discussing when I'm down there: religion and politics. All too often, it ends up being the same conversation.

That being the case, I think our two countries need more church-state separation, not less.

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» /agree Posted by: EinMD
Will Alliance Defense Fund make up lost funds?
Posted by: SgtCedar on Jun 23, 2008 9:44 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If the churches that participate in this extreme idea lose their tax exempt status will the Alliance Defense Fund make up the lost income? It appears the organization is willing to pay the legal expenses of the churches. But is any church willing to run the risk of losing large amounts of money if they lose tax exemption? Unless the Alliance Defense Fund is willing and able to make up any lost income it is a bad deal for the churches.

I don't need to worry about my church. I am Unitarian Universalist and we firmly believe in the separation of church and state.

The irony is churches have a great deal of freedom to discuss politics already. A minister can discuss the moral issues in the political process. He or she can discuss the positions of the various candidates. The only thing a church or minister cannot do is advocate voting for a particular candidate.

In addition to losing all the money a church would have to pay in taxes there is the lose of contributions if people cannot take their contributions as a tax deduction.

I hope the congregations of any minister considering this radical action understand the consequences. Of course, part of me (a part I do not admire) hopes many radical right wing churches participate in this scheme and are driven out of business.

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Douchebaggery
Posted by: EinMD on Jun 23, 2008 9:59 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
“As a pastor, a private citizen, I can speak for myself,” Riggle said. “The IRS cannot quench my voice.”

Yes but if you're speaking as a Pastor then you're not speaking for yourself. You're speaking for your particular vision of what your invisible sky spirit represents on any one particular issue. Something you can't honestly profess to know because if you did then there wouldn't be 1500 different Christian sects.

This tax law is solely from preventing the tax exempted business of churches from coming out and saying "You better damned well vote for X or you're going to hell.". The fact that you want to go into politics is out of sheer intellectual laziness. You can tell your mindless sheep the same thing with a sermon that says "fags and black people are bad." and people will know what you want without saying it.

You want to become a political organization? Then drop your tax exempt status, violate the tenants of your religion, pay your taxes and do what corporations do: hire a lobby group.

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» RE: Douchebaggery Posted by: mainspark
As the pendulum swings......
Posted by: Sherirux on Jun 23, 2008 11:10 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I won't live to see it, but I hope the Xians keep pushing, and pushing their fantasies and their candidates all the way to extinction.
It's all about forcing others.....to do whatever. It's all about power and control of those you feel so superior to. It's all about making themselves feel big by making others feel small. It's a good thing for them Jesus didn't really exist and neither does his Daddy. If they did, all you greedy, lying, bullying, fascists would burn in the hell of your own making.
End the tax breaks for the bastards.....do it now. Better yet.....Repo their Bentleys and mega mansions and 14kt bling and give the proceeds to feed and clothe our poor. You know, like a radical peacenik Rabbi would do.
Like I said, I'll never live to see it.
I started this life as an atheist, was raised a Catholic, read some books, opened my mind instead of closing it, back to atheism but with a tolerance for "believers". Well, I'm at the very bottom of my tolerance barrel. You fascists are really on my nerves. I'm far from alone with those feelings. So, keep pushing and let's see how that works out for you.

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Tax or no tax
Posted by: Spiritgirl on Jun 23, 2008 11:31 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Well, now that James Dobson has finally come out and "said" what he really feels, I think it's high time that we yank the tax exempt status of all "churches, temples, & mosques". For the last few voting cycles, as the emphasis has been on the religious right - the pastors have been saying what they want about which candidates they want to get in office. John McCain snuggling up to Rev. Hagee just to get his endorsement for example; what more needs to be said. Just snatch the tax exempt status from all of them. Also, we can stop that so-called "faith-based" funding - the data on how much good they are actually doing is still out. Truth is Christianity has been in trouble for awhile now - not from the enemy without, this is from the enemy within. How can you blindly oppose a position (e.g.- abortion, homosexuality, etc.), while turning your back on the commandment to love your neighbors and treat them as you would want to be treated. Or how about whomever is without sin, cast the first stone, or what about judge not lest ye be judged. Hopefully this time around the right should have learned a lesson. After all it's touted that they were a critical block in putting this current Mis-Administration back into office. And do they not see where we are: war without end (does anyone even remember Bin Laden?), lies about why we went in (Iraq?), lies about domestic spying, a city under water (New Orleans), lies about the economy and massive hemorrhaging of well paying jobs overseas, etc. Oh, my bad is this supposed to be ushering in the "Rapture"? Well, let me ask the religious right one question - suppose the "Rapture" has already happened, then what does that make you?
Hhmmm, just think about it.

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Tax Them All
Posted by: mgloraine on Jun 23, 2008 12:50 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The First Amendment says: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof;..."

It looks to me like giving a "church" a tax-exempt status constitutes a law respecting the establishment of religion to the extent that it encourages the creation of new religions specifically for tax purposes (e.g., Scientology), and assists existing religions in establishing franchises in every city and town in America.

Churches in America function as major business and political entities. They are taking in millions of dollars annually, then turning around and putting that money into property acquisition and politics. Many are really well off and they want to keep it that way.

"Ministers" typically thump their Bibles and misquote or misinterpret a few self-serving fairy tales periodically to keep the mumbo-jumbo quotient up, but the real message amounts to "Give us money to expand our operations and we will seek to institutionalize your racism, religious intolerance and homophobia through political influence." This poses a serious threat to our Constitution and the rule of secular law; when some fool can enshrine the "Ten Commandments" in a facility dedicated to civil law (as has been attempted and narrowly averted), then we will have replaced the American way of life with a Christianist sharia code.

Religion is deleterious to our society, since most organized religions have devolved into hate groups with aggressive political and economic agendas. Most acts of violence and war taking place in the world today involve actors claiming a religious imperative to oppose or wipe out the "infidels", which is anyone who doesn't agree with them.

We can't make them disappear, but we don't have to keep subsidizing the takeover of our government by "evangelical Christians" or any other bizarre cult. Congress should rescind all tax exemptions for all religious institutions and make them file taxes as normal businesses. If they insist on preaching politics from the pulpit, then they should also be required to register as a political action committee, and be regulated as such.

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Simple solutions
Posted by: LeeAnnG on Jun 23, 2008 1:06 PM   
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Years ago, I attended a Unitarian Church. (Since moving to WV, the closest Unitarian Universalist Church is further away than I'm willing to drive on a Sunday morning.) I was told by someone I trusted that the Unitarian Church decided to pay taxes in order to be able to say anything they wanted. I'd like to know if this is still true - or if indeed it was true 40 years ago.

Any church member or any minister, priest or other church leader can say anything he or she wishes to as long as the church is not tax exempt.

On a slightly different subject, doesn't it seem ironic that the religious right (or religious wrong, as I call it) pushes "freedom" at the same time it also advocates the suppression of certain groups? Gays, atheists, and feminists come to mind. So many of them want everyone to be free as long as that "everyone" believes the same thing they do.

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Jesus supported separation of Church and state, he said so
Posted by: nitsua1023 on Jun 23, 2008 3:05 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
“Render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s, and unto God the things that are God’s”

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Society: Love it or leave it
Posted by: Ellen Remore on Jun 23, 2008 4:03 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Come on. Who's kidding whom? They may have stopped short of literally endorsing political candidates, but the Religious Right has been preaching politics altogether openly for at least the last two decades--certainly openly enough to leave their congregations no doubt whatever about whom Jesus wants them to vote for.

If these people--most of whom have a huge persecution complex and are demonstrably incapable of ceasing to bitch about the rest of society for five consecutive minutes--are too damn arrogant to live within the laws of the United States, maybe it's time they all took a page out of Jim Jones's book, and set up shop someplace offshore.

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I won't be holding my breath.
Posted by: Longdream on Jun 23, 2008 8:27 PM   
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I've been saying this a lot lately about the contortions of the nearly extinct religious, neo-con right. Jeb Bush, as a private citizen, is doing an end-run around the Florida legislature to publicly fund private schools (until the lawsuits hit), Limbaugh and his ilk are up-in-arms about the Fairness Doctrine (it's their ratings that will get them pretty soon).

The pathetic death-throes of these dinosaurs who don't know when it's OVER are all a big yawn in the most exciting election year in my lifetime.

SEVENTEEN PERCENT. That's seventeen percent of the population they're talking to, who think the country is doing fine under the hands of the Republicans, their chosen people. The number doesn't suffice to provide support for unconstitutional and unethical notions, and even if the statistic is minimized to the max--say it's twenty-five percent, just to be nice, and every single one of them voted--it will not be enough to get McCain into the White House.

As for the silly initiative which is the subject of this article, if it were going to fly the article would be about the effects of it happening, not the search for a pastor willing to do it. I say best of luck to them finding one among them who will upend his collection plate and starve for such a cause. The younger members of evangelical churches are moving away from the culture wars and from negativity. They want to be activists for the environment, and want to spread the news in a positive way.

This crap is the last gasp of the obsolete grandpas who will have to change or cede their pulpits if they want to lead their churches into the future.

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Any fundie........
Posted by: tap17x on Jun 24, 2008 1:32 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
........who is ranting about Jesus, etc., but is not wearing an old burlap bag and eating out of dumpsters is a hypocrite who deserves to fry for 100 billion years in God's Great Wok.

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