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Attack Iran? Cheney's Already Tried

By Gareth Porter, IPS News. Posted June 10, 2008.


How Pentagon officials firmly opposed a proposal by Dick Cheney last summer for airstrikes against the Iranian Revolutionary Guards Corps.

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WASHINGTON - Pentagon officials firmly opposed a proposal by Vice President Dick Cheney last summer for airstrikes against the Iranian Revolutionary Guards Corps (IRGC) bases by insisting that the administration would have to make clear decisions about how far the United States would go in escalating the conflict with Iran, according to a former George W Bush administration official.

J Scott Carpenter, who was then deputy assistant secretary of state in the State Department's Bureau of Near Eastern Affairs, recalled in an interview that senior Defense Department (DoD) officials and the Joint Chiefs used the escalation issue as the main argument against the Cheney proposal.

McClatchy newspapers reported last August that Cheney had proposal several weeks earlier "launching airstrikes at suspected training camps in Iran", citing two officials involved in Iran policy.

According to Carpenter, who is now at the Washington Institute on Near East Policy, a strongly pro-Israel think-tank, Pentagon officials argued that no decision should be made about the limited airstrike on Iran without a thorough discussion of the sequence of events that would follow an Iranian retaliation for such an attack. Carpenter said the DoD officials insisted that the Bush administration had to make "a policy decision about how far the administration would go - what would happen after the Iranians would go after our folks".

The question of escalation posed by DoD officials involved not only the potential of Muqtada al-Sadr's Mahdi Army in Iraq to attack, Carpenter said, but possible responses by Hezbollah and by Iran itself across the Middle East.

Carpenter suggested that DoD officials were shifting the debate on a limited strike from the Iraq-based rationale, which they were not contesting, to the much bigger issue of the threat of escalation to full-scale war with Iran, knowing that it would be politically easier to thwart the proposal on that basis.

The former State Department official said DoD "knew that it would be difficult to get interagency consensus on that question".

The Joint Chiefs were fully supportive of the position taken by Secretary of Defense Robert Gates on the Cheney proposal, according to Carpenter. "It's clear that the military leadership was being very conservative on this issue," he said.

At least some DoD and military officials suggested that Iran had more and better options for hitting back at the United States than the United States had for hitting Iran, according to one former Bush administration insider.

Former Bush speechwriter and senior policy adviser Michael Gerson, who had left the administration in 2006, wrote a column in the Washington Post on July 20, 2007, in which he gave no hint of Cheney's proposal, but referred to "options" for striking Iranian targets based on the Cheney line that Iran "smuggles in the advanced explosive devices that kill and maim American soldiers".
Gerson cited two possibilities: "Engaging in hot pursuit against weapon supply lines over the Iranian border or striking explosives factories and staging areas within Iran." But the Pentagon and the military leadership were opposing such options, he reported, because of the fear that Iran has "escalation dominance" in its conflict with the United States.

That meant, according to Gerson that, "in a broadened conflict, the Iranians could complicate our lives in Iraq and the region more than we complicate theirs".

Carpenter's account of the Pentagon's position on the Cheney proposal suggests, however, that civilian and military opponents were saying that Iran's ability to escalate posed the question of whether the United States was going to go to a full-scale air war against Iran.

Pentagon civilian and military opposition to such a strategic attack on Iran had become well-known during 2007. But this is the first evidence from an insider that Cheney's proposal was perceived as a ploy to provoke Iranian retaliation that could used to justify a strategic attack on Iran.

The option of attacking nuclear sites had been raised by Bush with the Joint Chiefs at a meeting in "the tank" at the Pentagon on December 13, 2006, and had been opposed by the Joint Chiefs, according to a report by Time magazine's Joe Klein last June.

After he become head of the Central Command (Centcom) in March 2007, Admiral William Fallon also made his opposition to such a massive attack on Iran known to the White House, according Middle East specialist Hillary Mann, who had developed close working relationships with Pentagon officials when she worked on the National Security Council staff.

It appeared in early 2007, therefore, that a strike at Iran's nuclear program and military power had been blocked by opposition from the Pentagon. Cheney's proposal for an attack on IRGC bases in June 2007, tied to the alleged Iranian role in providing both weapons - especially the highly lethal explosively formed projectiles (EFPs) - and training to Shi'ite militias appears to have been a strategy for getting around the firm resistance of military leaders to such an unprovoked attack.

Although the Pentagon bottled up the Cheney proposal in inter-agency discussions, Cheney had a strategic asset which could he could use to try to overcome that obstacle: his alliance with General David Petraeus.

As Inter Press Service reported earlier last week, Cheney had already used Petraeus' takeover as the top commander of US forces in Iraq in early February 2007 to do an end run about the Washington national security bureaucracy to establish the propaganda line that Iran was manufacturing EFPs and shipping them to the Mahdi Army militiamen.

Petraeus was also a supporter of Cheney's proposal for striking IRGC targets in Iran, going so far as to hint in an interview with Fox News last September that he had passed on to the White House his desire to do something about alleged Iranian assistance to Shi'ites that would require US forces beyond his control.

At that point, Fallon was in a position to deter any effort to go around DoD and military opposition to such a strike because he controlled all military access to the region as a whole. But Fallon's forced resignation in March and the subsequent promotion of Petraeus to become Centcom chief later this year gives Cheney a possible option to ignore the position of his opponents in Washington once more in the final months of the administration.

Gareth Porter is an investigative historian and journalist specializing in US national security policy. The paperback edition of his latest book, Perils of Dominance: Imbalance of Power and the Road to War in Vietnam, was published in 2006.

(Inter Press Service)

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Will They or Won't They?
Posted by: Tom Degan on Jun 10, 2008 2:08 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
That is a really good question. Will these people finally leave office with the USA bogged down on third front? That can't be allowed to happen. Someone must inform the First Fool that he cannot attack Iran without the constitutionally mandated congressional approval. Jeez Louise, What did Laura Bush ever see in this asshole?

Tom Degan
Goshen, NY
Gentlemen, Start Your Rhetoric

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Will They or Won't They? Posted by: editnetwork
» RE: They Won't! Posted by: edgar_michel
» american mentality Posted by: undrgrndgirl
» RE: They Won't? Posted by: editnetwork
» RE: They Won't? (continued) Posted by: editnetwork
» CFR? Posted by: brock_samson
» RE: Will They or Won't They? Posted by: fred_53_99
» "The winds of war" Posted by: carbon-based
» RE: "The winds of war" Posted by: JSquercia
» RE: "The winds of war" Posted by: carbon-based
» The Rant Posted by: carbon-based
» RE: The Rant Posted by: Tom Degan
» RE: The Rant Posted by: carbon-based
» The Kyl-Liberman end-run Posted by: brunowe
» RE: Will They or Won't They? Posted by: dayenta
» RE: Will They or Won't They? Posted by: sasquuatch55
» here's a little outrage for you Posted by: undrgrndgirl
Me Ranting
Posted by: meranting on Jun 10, 2008 2:19 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Well, that's good news in a way because I think it shows that the crooks can't do what they want anymore. I do think that if they wanted to, they already would have done it as time is kind of running out on them. They simply don't have the support or at least unquestioned support by many anymore. I'm thinking (hoping) that many Republicans are realizing that the game is over and that everyone knows who to blame and that any further action will only speed up their defeat. Hell, Tom Delay said on TV he can't even convince his wife to vote Republican - the same Tom Delay who recently was heard on a radio show saying that Obama was a marxist. The Republicans have no arguments left and even the low blows that used to work, seem to have little effect.

I'm trying to stay optimistic here.

Me Ranting
Me Bloggin

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» RE: Me Ranting Posted by: Tom Degan
» RE: Me Ranting Posted by: TagsNOLA
» RE: Me Ranting Posted by: Tom Degan
» RE: Me Ranting Posted by: TagsNOLA
» RE: Me Ranting Posted by: Tom Degan
» RE: Me Ranting Posted by: brunowe
» RE: Me Ranting Posted by: praedor
News Chain
Posted by: chorton on Jun 10, 2008 3:23 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"They must think we're mushrooms ... "

NEWS CHAIN ALERT: The following major news story was carried live on C-span, and carried by Reuters, AP and UPI wire services. In the United States it was picked up by by Yahoo! News, two local TV stations and the Detroit Free Press, and received a one-sentence mention in the St.Louis Post Dispatch. CBS carried it on its website, but it may not have been on the air. That's it!. Among those that did not carry it were: ABC, NBC, MSNBC, FOX, CNN, NPR, PBS, AOL, msn, the New York Times, Chicago Tribune, Dallas Morning News, Los Angeles Times, Little Rock Democrat Gazette, Atlanta Constitution, San Francisco Chronicle, Miami Herald, Denver Post, Baltimore Sun, Boston Globe, Boston Herald, and the Worcester Telegram-Gazette. If you agree that this story should have been on the news, and that the "media barons" had no right to keep it from us, please forward it to your entire e-mail list, and help it spread across the Internet!

**This news article doesn’t necessarily reflect the opinions of the sender.**
………………………………………………..

Kucinich Offers Impeachment Articles Against Bush
By John Bresnahan, CBS website

(The Politico) Rep. Dennis Kucinich (D-Ohio) introduced 35 articles of impeachment against President Bush on Monday night, reading the resolution into the Congressional Record.

Kucinich, who unsuccessfully sought the Democratic presidential nomination this year, unveiled a litany of alleged illegal and improper acts by Bush, including war crimes.

Kucinich has introduced a similar impeachment resolution against Vice President Cheney. That resolution was referred to the House Judiciary Committee, which has taken no action on the measure. Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) and other top House Democratic leaders have stated that there will be no consideration of impeachment proceedings against Bush, calling the idea "off the table."

Kucinich and other liberal Democrats, including Rep. Robert Wexler (D-Fla.), have sought the removal of the current administration, arguing that Bush and Cheney have lied to Congress and the American public about the reasons for invading Iraq in 2003 and abused their offices in order to conduct the "War on Terror" following the 9/11 attacks.

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» RE: News Chain Posted by: edgar_michel
» RE: News Chain Posted by: Quannah
This is...
Posted by: adp3d on Jun 10, 2008 3:36 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
...making the hairs raise on the back of my neck. Its my belief that the primary reason Cheney has for beating this drum is so that the bottom line of Haliburton can be increased with tax payers money. We have to ask the question of who benefits the most from war. It really is a no brainer. That Cheney is willing to risk a global conflict so that his companies can make more money is just scary. He needs to be investigated and stopped now!

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» RE: And This ... Posted by: Quannah
Amazed in PA
Posted by: maggie.henry@gmail.com on Jun 10, 2008 3:41 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Is there no end to the audacity of these puglicans? Both of them shirked their duty and yet they send thousands to do what they were too cowardly to. Both Jenna and Barbara should be in fatigues in Iraq! As should the children of any asshole that makes war on another country. January can't come soon enough!

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Speaking only one language
Posted by: taxidriver on Jun 10, 2008 4:00 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Bush & Co. seem to know only one language--that of power and military attacks. And instead of being "once bitten-twice shy," their answer to the debacle in Iraq is to expand the war. Where have we seen this before? Maybe in Vietnam, when we expanded the war into Laos and Cambodia as we pursued "peace with honor"? And we know where that got us--and don't forget the millions of dead Cambodians and Laotians.

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Attacking Iran
Posted by: hillstar on Jun 10, 2008 4:10 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
My gratitude to those generals...but I find all the recent changes at the Pentagon worrisome. According to what I read, the Bush administration is trying to force Iraq into a security treaty that will allow us to build more bases in Iraq..no wonder Iran is ratcheting up the nuclear program ,and financing terroriststo keep us occupied in Iraq..they are worried sick about our intentions. Can we blame them?Just remember that we interfered with Iran about half a century ago,deposing their elected primeminister and installing the Shah,so we could get at their oil...any wonderthat they do not look at us favorably?

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K-man
Posted by: divetrader on Jun 10, 2008 5:16 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
For a long time I thought that the President and VP were crazy, power hungry maniacs. This belief hasn't changed. Although it appears that President Bush seems more like a little boy who had his toys taken away. VP Cheney wants all the toys and if he can't have them, then NOBODY can.
Aside from people like Kucinich and Wexler, who are willing to Impeach, congress is a huge disappointment. Pelosi and Reid are enablers to Bush and Cheney. All 4 of them hopefully will be out of office very soon.

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» K-man for President Posted by: robbie.seal
» Here here! Posted by: edgar_michel
War what is it good for
Posted by: solrev on Jun 10, 2008 5:28 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I understand that Bush and Chaney invaded Iraq to protect the oil-dollar and establish a military presence in the Middle East, so that they could control the flow of oil. That would give the globalists a pretty big stick in their quest to dominate the world economy. They followed a “bring them on” strategy as long as you do not bring them to Saudi Arabia. Their obsession with Iran is making Iran into the regional super power. The smartest thing they could do is to overthrow the Iranian backed Shia fundamentalist government in Iraq, a government that they created. They have got themselves in a fine mess, give the government to the Iraqi nationalist and lose all, or separate the Iranian backed government in Iraq from Iran with an Iran invasion. Hopefully Obama will choose door number one and give the oil and the country to the nationalists, even at the cost of a small civil war to oust the Shia fundamentalists, then get out of Dodge. There is no love loss between the Iraqi nationalists and Iran, even though the nationalists will take any help from Iran that they can get to fight the invaders. The nationalists will even take Russian aid flowing through Syria. A national alliance between Kurdish Sunni, Arab Sunni, and al-Sadr Shia would go a long way eliminating the Islamic fundamentalist argument for political power in the name of God in Muslim lands. What would the globalists do without enemies?

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The script is written, The Stage is set, Lights, Action, WAR!
Posted by: williameon on Jun 10, 2008 5:44 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
With their dying breath they will carry out
The Greedy
Neo-Zio King's command.
No Nation's with resources shall exist beyond my Corpirate Control.
Behind all the FAUX media's smoke and mirrors is
The Money Lender.
Pulling the strings
The Puppets die as
The Parrots sing.
Watch the Birdie!

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Audacity and Sheer, Blatant Panderers of Alternet..KUCINICH, The True PATRIOT, Thank You, SIR!!!!!!
Posted by: Turiye on Jun 10, 2008 5:50 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The READERS, The Editors of Alternotevergonna print the TRUTH!!!!!!!HOW DARE YOU AND THESE READERS SAY Iraq THIS, bush THAT AND IGNORE DENNIS KUCINICH FOR OVER 5 HOURS LAST NIGHT!!!!
YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO WHINE ANY LONGER!!! YOU ALLL ARE FRAUDS!! FRAUDS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Check Out 'Pastor' Hagees Stratedgy to bring On Armegeddon
Posted by: Purple Girl on Jun 10, 2008 6:56 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Mac's whoring for Hagee's endorsement was beyond foolish, it was extremely disturbing and Posed a National Security threat.Same goes for the WH and Sen LIEberman.
Funny how the only one able to even Squeak this concern out in the MSM Was Racheal Maddow.but was clearly blocked from discussing how this sick alliance posed such a global Danger.
MSM failed to air the Real underlying context of Hagees 'sermons' . HIS plan to bring about 'End of Days' starts with Pre-emptive strikes against Iran, causing a Backlash from Russia and China for such acts of truely unprovoked attacks. Then once WW3 Starts HE's Decided the 2nd Coming will take Place and Wisk His 'Christians' off to heaven while the rest of Us who have failed to 'convert' are Slaughtered. Hey Lieberman that Means any of Your Community of Jewish Followers TOO! Of course You already Know that - has Hagee already Baptised and 'Cleansed' You of you 'Unholy' alliegnece with the jewish Faith??Joey is a traitor to not just the Democratic party and the Country - he's a traitor to his Own community- What a vile P.O.S. !!!
The Truely Faithful should be Screaming About this Heretic , This 'Deceiver' who places is 'Design' over the Almighty's and works for that which Hates mankind..."Could It Be Satan?" Hagee,WHO or WHAT needs YOUR Help? A omnipotent Being certainly does not need a mere mortal to determine Timing,Stratedgy or means to carry out It's OWN design and schedule!
there are some Twisted F*cking 'Minions' at work not just in Political Office- there are 'Enablers' disguised as 'Men of God' who are keepers and Spreaders of this Agenda.
Another Topic this country need to not only discuss but Expose!

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Impeachment--Probably Ought to Think About It
Posted by: JohnJlws on Jun 10, 2008 6:58 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Although the Kucinich ploy to suggest impeachment is great theater the outcome will be inconsequential as there is not enough support to proceed with this course of action and the clock will run out before the proceedings end, so the game will be over.

What the democratic leadership accurately sees is a move that will polarize the right and bring out the screeching “We told you so” pundits in their amazingly large lunatic fringe. As the impeachment proceedings continue into the fall democrats would be seen as “avenging the Clinton impeachment” by having an impeachment party of their own. This is how this would be sold and the majority of the electorate would probably be inclined to buy the argument.

The outcome would be no impeachment, a process viewed as a big waste of time when other things of much greater importance should take precedence and an electorate even more disappointed with Congress than they currently are. Most importantly the historic, monumental, gains the democrats could make in the coming elections in November, which include a substantial ability to raise significant funds, might be wiped out as the population simply gives up the hope that “Washington” may actually move forward.

So Kucinich got his folks all riled up and presents a case for impeachment that is probably sound. But, again, as he did in the primaries, Kucinich misses the bigger picture of why sometimes it’s necessary to fight the right battle and impeachment at this time simply isn’t it.

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Bush
Posted by: GreyFoxThree on Jun 10, 2008 7:12 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I sure hope the Impeachment proceedings against dictator Bush go through. We need to get this War Monger OUT of office before its too late. This guy has GOT to go!

JT
Ultimate Anonymity

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Another good reason to impeach Cheney as fast as possible
Posted by: reelectnoone on Jun 10, 2008 7:33 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Another good reason to impeach Cheney as fast as possible.

Wexler, Kucinich et.al. let's get it done then go after Bush. Never mind their tenure is near an end.

An example needs to be set for future presidents who would drag America down internationally while thumbing their noses as the American people and Congress.

If Congress does not assert itself NOW and get on with it before the elections, look for a major house cleaning when the votes come in.

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Why bother?
Posted by: edgeofnowhere on Jun 10, 2008 8:14 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This administration served as puppet-pols for the cabal that was behind the 9/11 operation. If they will kill their own citizens in an attempt to take full control of the government and subvert the Constitution, why would they worry about a congressional impeachment attempt? Sorry, but these people are ruthless murderers who know that if they fail they will be executed for their crimes, so they will not just give up. Odds are that we will see another "incident" prior to the election that will lead to martial law. So far they seem to be doing just fine with their war and the destruction of the U.S. dollar. Americans are going along with the whole game, refusing to look at the truth of 9/11 which underpins the whole Neocon strategy.

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» RE: Why bother? Posted by: willymack
» RE: Why bother? Posted by: dustdevil
I don't remember seeing anything about
Posted by: Quannah on Jun 10, 2008 8:18 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
timelines for impeachment in the Constitution. It doesn't say, "can only be done with more than a year left in office."

Justice has no deadline. The American People need justice. If we don't impeach these bastards, we will live to regret it. These dangerous precedents will come back and bite us all in the ass.

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One of Kucinich's counts for impeachment
Posted by: Quannah on Jun 10, 2008 8:19 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
was for obstruction of justice in the investigations about 9/11. Just thought I'd throw that out there.

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Take Heart Everyone!
Posted by: weslen1 on Jun 10, 2008 8:26 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Dennis DID get it all out there, read into the Congressional Record, with all the proof that will ever be needed. Once Bush is out of office he can no longer pardon anyone in his administration and those who refused to do their job will be gone too. It took over 4 hours for Dennis to read his entire 35 articles of impeachment and couldn't have done a better job. In the future when he runs for president, he will be the only candidate to tell the American People "the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth" and we will remember that. There is no statute of limitations on war crimes. France has arrest warrants for Rumsfeld and others for war crimes. Last time Rumsfeld was there, he barely got out before they caught him. I'm sure other countries also have warrants for many of the war criminals in the Bush Regime. Bush, et al, think they are living in a bubble where no one can touch them, but that is only temporary due to Pelosi, Reid and Hoyer's dereliction of duty. They will be gone too.
Dennis Kucinich is the best we have in government. Let's all donate to keep him there and vote for him in Ohio and for President in 2012 if he runs. He was my choice too, in MI, but that whole thing was rigged across the country for the media to have their horse race between Clinton and Obama with the choice decided before it even started. Next time it will be different.

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» There was no Arrest Warrant Posted by: robbie.seal
» RE: Take Heart Everyone! Posted by: brock_samson
A modest proposal
Posted by: Ignatz deFyre on Jun 10, 2008 9:38 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Upon completion of his term I would like to see Dick Cheney posted to Iran on a permanent diplomatic mission (bodyguards excluded). Impeachment is not necessary, as long as I have the gratification of knowing he will live out his days among the friends he has made there.

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» RE: A modest proposal Posted by: Walks-in-Storms
simple solutions
Posted by: jstepp590 on Jun 10, 2008 10:04 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The biggest problem to all this is that the solution is so simple.

If you don't want Iran to develop nuclear weapons then sign security agreements with them in a mosque. This is where traditionally Arabs and Muslims have made their agreements as, if they are made before God, are binding to them in ways that agreements made in secular courts cannot be. They are a theocracy and if they broke their word in mosque then they would undercut their own traditions and the very basis of their government.

Trade: security agreements, civilian nuclear power which they are legally entitled to, and an end to support for "terrorist" organizations, Israel having to comply with international law with their nukes

In Return: No nuclear weapons, a binding resolution of the Israeli/Palestinian conflict through the world court, binding security agreements guaranteeing no regime change and an end to legitimate business restrictions

Iran would HAVE to honor agreements made in mosque, period. They would, too. It's cheaper in blood and treasure this way for all of us. Of course, then Bush and especially that dirtbag Cheney wouldn't make any money off of it, would they?

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Impeach THEM
Posted by: Spiritgirl on Jun 10, 2008 10:11 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The sad fact is that these are the same people that "had other things to do" when they were supposed to be fighting in VietNam. It's about time that Congress take IMPEACHMENT off of the table. The fear brought about by 9-11 has been so mis-used that if the wolf ever comes no one will be listening. I think we need to present Haliburton not only with a bill for the fraudulent claims that they have made on our tax $$, but this whole administration should also pony up money. And some of you people think McCain will be better, you people really need to open your eyes to the truth. Should this war move into Iran - I vote for sending them to the Hague for crimes against humanity.

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Will they or won't they?
Posted by: willymack on Jun 10, 2008 10:21 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Asked Tom Degan. I suspect he already knows the answer to that question. My reply is that they'll do whatever they damn well please, whenever they damn well feel like it, without any fear of obstruction or retribution. It's been this way since Jan 20th, 2001, and will go right on after the bush crime family steals yet another "election", with mcchipmunk leading the way.

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Where's the Outrage: 35-Count Resolution To Impeach Bush Last night in Senate and Silence!
Posted by: JoAnne on Jun 10, 2008 10:28 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
From about 7:15p.m (ET)to 11p.m Rep. Dennis Kucinich laid out 35-counts for impeachment. Where is this being reported? Certainly not here. Check your local rag and let them know that we won't sit down for their mlfeasance any longer. The counts themselves are newsworthy, never mind that the lame Judiciaary Committee with a lame public cannot bring this very danger president to trial in the Senate.

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» It was a stunt Posted by: robbie.seal
write-in Kucinich
Posted by: Ripcord on Jun 10, 2008 10:46 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
for President

Wexler for Vice President.

This year I wrote in Kucinich for the Idaho Democratic primary.

Why not?
Also on the ballot was a Texas convict, who paid $1,000 to get his name on the ballot.

It was in 2004 that the State of Idaho refused to put Kucinich on the ballot--go figure.

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Where is a viable 3rd party?
Posted by: PakiBoy on Jun 10, 2008 11:15 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There is no question that for the most part, America is ruled by a two-headed monster known as Democrat-Republican party.

Congress's approval rating is the same as that of Bush.

So where is a 3rd party? How come a population of 300 million people cannot come up with a viable alternative to the current political scheme?

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» Congress' Approval rating Posted by: robbie.seal
What is C-SPAN up to?
Posted by: Dboy on Jun 10, 2008 11:36 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Why is it that when I search for "Bush Impeachment" on C-SPAN I only get 2 hits???? This cannot be possible.


Dboy

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impeachment
Posted by: jjray on Jun 10, 2008 12:21 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I think the only preventing the bombs from dropping at this instance is the election. It's the elephant in the room. What do you want to bet GW authorizes the bombing of Iran after the election but before he leaves office? This is no joke. GW is still dangerous. We need to get on with impeaching GW and Cheney pronto. It matters.

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» impeachment Posted by: robbie.seal
» RE: impeachment Posted by: Dboy
I just wish
Posted by: robbie.seal on Jun 10, 2008 12:49 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I wish Gates had been in place when the plan for Iraq was drawn up. I wish the folks at the Pentagon back then had grabbed themselves between the legs and stood like they did this time.

But we are where we are, and must do our best to change things. Vote.

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Why is Alternet.org enforcing such orthodoxy
Posted by: PGR88 on Jun 10, 2008 12:54 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am new to visiting this site. I can't say I agree with many of the positions here, but was very surprised to find the following comment from Alternet.org

"We also ask our readers to refrain from responding to posts by people who only want to derail the conversation with conservative talking points. Please report these comments; do not respond."

It says to me: "Do not engage in discussions that involve decadent or bourgeois speech. Report all transgressions and revisionists to Public Security immediately!"

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Look Over Here, No, Over There
Posted by: QQOblivion on Jun 10, 2008 1:03 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I fear that Kucinich's "articles of impeachment" are allowing the American people to be distracted while the real action is about to take place over Iran.

Ka-BOOOM!

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» Or Vice Versa Posted by: QQOblivion
BOTH OF YOU 100% CORRECT, IMPEACHMENT CAN STILL BE ACHIEVED AFTER DEATH!!!!
Posted by: Turiye on Jun 10, 2008 1:32 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
n/e

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ELECTION YEAR STRATEGY
Posted by: Aredee on Jun 10, 2008 1:59 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Attacking Iran is the Bushbots' plan to help assure a McCain victory in November. They're going to make it look as if the Iranians attacked us--only later, after the hysteria dies down, will the truth come out.

A widened war is the only way McBush can win in November. It's just like LBJ's Gulf of Tonkien.

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» RE: ELECTION YEAR STRATEGY Posted by: deenie
Dennis Kucinich Full Text of Articles of Impeachment - Some of the Detail is Quite Horrifying
Posted by: opmoc on Jun 10, 2008 2:58 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What is equally horrifying is the failure of any Mainstream Media to publish anything but the bare details and in most cases absolutely nothing.

As far as I can see it hasn't made any of the UK National Newspapers - though it does make the Belfast Telegraph.

Below is a link to a pdf file containing 65 pages of allegations. Some of the content is totally horrendous.

The fact that this is all being completely ignored by virtually all of the Mainstream Media as well as the political and judicial systems is a terrible indictment of the "illusion" of Western Democracy

If it wasn't for the existence of the internet - virtualy no one would know about it

We live in a Dictatorship - so powerfully controlled by a tiny elite - that they dictate virtually all the information that the vast majority of people are exposed to.

They have all the power and the money and you will only see, hear and read - what they want you to see, hear and read.

We have already gone beyond the Orwellian nightmare of 1984

The concentration camps and death squads will be next for anyone who dares to speak up against the Freedoms we have already lost.

The couragous like Dennis Kucinich should be applauded - but those we have "elected" to represent our freedoms - and the journalists who we pay their wages by buying the newspapers they write for - are skulking in a corner too afraid to stand up for honesty, truth and justice.

They are all complicit in our society's descent into tryanny.

linked text

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Neo-Con,madness, Competition.
Posted by: BlueGorilla on Jun 10, 2008 4:13 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Is there a competition,amongst successive Republican leaderships to set out the insanest ,most dangerous,most profitable foreign policy?
"Hey Dick,"says George,"we sure beat my daddy's ,level of psycho-pathecary,you just don't like people,or peace do you Dick !and thats why I like you...your more dangerous,than your daddy Lon when he was playing the wolfman"
"I hate peace,and people George,but I love guns and money,do you mind if I sort out a little cash boo-nanza for myself,for providing services to our troops, in the newly liberated Iran?"

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The real deception is played out right here...
Posted by: kackermann on Jun 10, 2008 5:06 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
and in all the other media. The administration needs to keep everyone talking about it, but the fact is, we are in no position to attack Iran.

Even this article skipped around the central reason why that is: Iran will hit the main Saudi oil terminals in a New York minute if we attack them. Nothing will move in the Strait except warships and salvage ships to clear the old ships Iran will sink in the lanes.

We won't have to worry about high gas prices because a 40% reduction in world supplies will be devistating given the current climate. You will be growing your own vegetables or eating them from cans, because it's tough to sell lettuce at $10 bucks a head.

There are limits to even Bush and Cheney's stupidity.

But don't tell anyone this, they want everyone to think they might attack.

After 8 years of complete freedom to dictate to the US, Israel must be seething that they are worse off today than 8 years ago. Maybe they will finally see that their policies might need some adjusting.

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What the result be by invading Iran.......
Posted by: eosrk on Jun 10, 2008 5:58 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
....just take a look at Iraq and Afghanisistan, then muliply it a few million times, times that a billion, then a trillion, and that's what you're necons are looking at!!!

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Bush et al
Posted by: 2controvert on Jun 10, 2008 6:08 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
One of Bush's final acts will be to pardon all of the criminals in his administration to protect them from prosecution.
Take the whole lot Bush, Cheney, Wolfowitz Rumsfeld, Gonzales et al. to The Hague. Try them like the war criminals they are.

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Olbermann strikes again!
Posted by: Dboy on Jun 10, 2008 7:46 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FCrAf7pqrZQ

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Cheney gave standown order on 9-11-01
Posted by: securacom-wtc on Jun 11, 2008 7:16 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Transportation Secretary Mineta's testimony on Cheney on 9-11-01:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDfdOwt2v3Y

Therefore, regarding alternet story, Cheney cannot be trusted!

Free Documentary on www.video.google.com 'One Nation Under Siege'(1.4hrs). Through the research and personal testimony of over a dozen internationally distinguished authors, journalists, doctors, and military experts (Major General Albert Stubblebine) you will understand the massive and ceaseless control projected onto an unsuspecting populace by a government that may have finally crossed the line from a representative republic to a fascist empire. From the USA PATRIOT Act and the blatant disregard for the Bill of Rights to the outright tracking of every human being on the planet earth, you will be stunned by what U.S. government documents describe for the future of America. http://www.undersiegemovie.com/
USA’s Constitution and currency are being destroyed from within. How? Videos free on www.video.google.com 1) America: Freedom to Fascism, 2 hrs; 2)911 Justice, 18min; 3) The Clinton Chronicles, 1.7 hrs; 4) Endgame: Blueprint for Global Enslavement, 2 hrs, 5) Terrorstorm: A History of False Flag Terror, 2 hrs 6) 911 Mysteries, 2 hrs; 7)The Creature from Jekyll Island, 1hr; 8)Orwell Rolls in His Grave, 2hrs; 9) The War on Democracy, 1.5 hrs; 10) The Energy Non-Crisis, 1 hr; 11)Iraq for Sale 1.2 hr; 12) Zeitgeist, 2 hrs; 13)Ring of Power, 2.5 hrs; 14)Bush link to JFK, 1.5 hrs; 15) The Century of the Self, 4 hrs; 16) Loose Change (2nd ed & Final cut) 2hrs each; 17)John Pilger: The New Rulers of the World; 18) The Money Masters: How International Bankers Gained Control of America, 3.5 hrs 19) Barack Obama CFR info 20) Global Warming or Global Governance 21) The Great Global Warming Swindle 22) Mercury, Autism and The Global Vaccine Agenda 23) The CIA, Mind Control and Satanism 24)George Hunt: UN UNCED Earth Summit 1992 (Population Reduction) 25) End of NAtions - EU Takeover 26) Washington, You're Fired 27) Blackwater: America's Private Army 28) Esoteric Agenda 29) Fiat Empire: Why the Federal Reserve Violates the U.S. COnstitution 30) The Revolution Will not be Televised [USA overthrow of Hugo Chavez] 31) One Nation Under Siege 32)Breaking The Silence - Truth and Lies in the War on Terror, by John Pilger(and all his documentaries) 33)Beyond Treason 1.5hrs

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