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Stopping the War Machine: Military Recruiters Must Be Confronted

By Ron Kovic, Truthdig. Posted May 30, 2008.


We must use every means of creative, nonviolent resistance to stop military recruitment across the country.

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As a former United States Marine Corps sergeant who was shot and paralyzed from my mid-chest down during my second tour of duty in Vietnam on Jan. 20, 1968, I am sending my complete support and admiration to all those now involved in the courageous struggle to stop military recruitment in Berkeley and across the country.

Not since the Vietnam War protests of the late 1960s has there been a cause more just than the one you are now engaged in. Who knows better the deep immorality and deception of military recruiters than those of us who, decades ago, entered those same recruiting offices with our fathers, believing in our hearts that we were being told the truth -- only to discover later we had been deceived and terribly betrayed? Many of us paid for that deceit with our lives, years of suffering and bodies and minds that were never the same again. If only someone had warned us, if only someone had had the courage to speak out against the madness that we were being led into, if only someone could have protected us from the recruiters whose only wish was to make their quota, send us to boot camp and hide from us the dark secret of the nightmare which awaited us all.

Over the past five years, I have watched in horror the mirror image of another Vietnam unfolding in Iraq. So many similarities, so many things said that remind me of that war 30 years ago which left me paralyzed and confined to a wheelchair for life. Refusing to learn from the lessons of Vietnam, our government continues to pursue a policy of deception, distortion, manipulation and denial, doing everything it can to hide from the American people their true intentions and agenda in Iraq. As we pass the fifth anniversary of the start of this tragic and senseless war, I cannot help but think of the young men and women who have been wounded, nearly 30,000, flooding Walter Reed, Bethesda, Brooke Army Medical Center and veterans hospitals all across our country. Paraplegics, amputees, burn victims, the blinded, shocked and stunned, brain-damaged and psychologically stressed, a whole new generation of severely maimed men and women who were not even born when I came home wounded to the Bronx Veterans Hospital in New York in 1968.

Post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD), which afflicted so many of us after Vietnam, is just now beginning to appear among soldiers recently returned from the current war. For some the agony and suffering, the sleepless nights, anxiety attacks and awful bouts of insomnia, alienation, anger and rage will last for decades -- if not their whole lives. They will be trapped in a permanent nightmare of that war, of killing another man, a child, watching a friend die ... fighting against an enemy that can never be seen, while at any moment someone, a child, a woman, an old man -- anyone -- might kill them.

These traumas return home with us and we carry them, sometimes hidden, for agonizing decades. They deeply impact our daily lives, and the lives closest to us. To kill another human being, to take another life out of this world with one pull of a trigger, is something that never leaves you. It is as if a part of you dies with that person. If you choose to keep on living, there may be a healing, and even hope and happiness again, but that scar and memory and sorrow will be with you forever. Why did the recruiters never mention these things? This was never in the slick pamphlets they gave us.

Some of these veterans are showing up at homeless shelters around our country, while others have begun to courageously speak out against the senselessness and insanity of this war and to demand answers from the leaders who sent them there. During the 2004 Democratic National Convention, returning soldiers formed a group called Iraq Veterans Against the War, just as we had marched in Miami in August of 1972 as Vietnam Veterans Against the War. Still others have refused deployment to Iraq, gone to Canada and begun resisting this immoral and illegal war. Like many other Americans, I have seen them on television or at the local veterans hospitals, but for the most part, they remain hidden like the flag-draped caskets of our dead returned to Dover Air Force Base in the dark of night, as this administration continues to pursue a policy of censorship, tightly controlling the images coming out of that war and rarely allowing the human cost of its policy to be seen.


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Kovic was born in Ladysmith, Wis., and grew up in Massapequa, N.Y. His autobiography, "Born on the Fourth of July," was adapted as an Academy Award-winning film directed by Oliver Stone and starring Tom Cruise as Kovic. Kovic received a Golden Globe for his screenplay adaptation of his autobiography.

Kovic is an outspoken critic of the war in Iraq.

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Well Said, with a Caveat
Posted by: NoPCZone on May 30, 2008 12:34 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As a veteran, not of combat, but of the Cold War Army of the 1980's, I agree with this statement with but one qualification.

Recruiters are not volunteer positions for the most part. Most recruiters are assigned the position, out under quotas and could have their careers ended if they do not produce. Otherwise, these young men and women are under great pressure and most try to honestly do what they have been assigned and honestly present recruits with an accurate picture. Some probably do not, but that is not the case most or all of the time.

When you protest, as you have a legitimate right as a citizen to do, I ask that you do it respectfully. As most of us cannot know what an individual recruiter does in the discharge of their duty, we should give them, individually, the benefit of the doubt that they are honorable members of our armed forces assigned to do a difficult and sometimes conflicting job.

If one knows of a dishonest recruiter they should be reported to the recruiting command, your Congressional delegation and, if necessary, the media. A dishonest recruiter dishonors the service they are a member of, the honorable tradition of service to our nation, the nation at large, the millions who have served and the young men and women willing to serve.

All I ask is that you conduct your protests in an orderly and respectful, but firm, manner. The young man or woman serving as a recruiter may be doing an honest job and only following orders- even possibly ones they do not desire.

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» Well said, with a clarification. Posted by: ABetterFuture
» Specifically... Posted by: ABetterFuture
» RE: Get Real Posted by: NoPCZone
» Fix it from the bottom up Posted by: countingdaisies
» RE: Well Said, with a Caveat Posted by: NoPCZone
» RE: Well Said, with a Caveat Posted by: daniel1982
» RE: Well Said, with a Caveat Posted by: dr_dredd
» Caveat this Posted by: leafsong1
» RE: Buyer Beware! Posted by: desidid
U.S. Recruiters Out Of Tijuana, MX!
Posted by: Mexitli on May 30, 2008 12:45 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Recruitment of Tijuana, MX Youth by the U.S. Army Denounced

Young people in Tijuana, MX are secretly being recruited in local bars by the U.S. Army, says Fernando Suarez del Solar, founder of The Aztec Warriors for Peace Project aka GuerreroAzteca.org.

Army Recruiters dressed in civilian clothes buy young people beer then encourage them to enlist in exchange for citizenship.

Fernando, father of Jesús Alberto Suárez del Solar Navarro, who was killed in Iraq, would like to see Tijuana, MX become a sanctuary city for conscientious objectors to the war in Iraq.

Recruitment of Tijuana, MX Youth by the U.S. Army Denounced

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Hit the $$$$
Posted by: carbon-based on May 30, 2008 2:54 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
stopping recruiting efforts will have nothing to do with the war effort.. The military will do what it can to make sure we have the staffing to meet requirements.. If that means reinstating the draft, they probably would do that.

Moving our elected politicians to do what we want them to do re protests, hitting their pockets etc, will have a greater effect. Boycott an industry that is supporting politicians that do not work to end the war!

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» RE: Hit the $$$$ Posted by: nochicagoboys
» RE: Hit the $$$$ Posted by: carbon-based
» RE: Hit the $$$$ Posted by: nochicagoboys
Enlistment
Posted by: blogbooks on May 30, 2008 3:27 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I think most people that go into the military are fully aware that the purpose of the military is to fight and die in wars at the pleasure of the United States government.

There are a few factors in play that make them enlist anyway. First, young men typically have more testosterone than good sense. Second, they are willing to "roll the dice" and see what happens.

Sometimes when your choices in life are confined to working at Burger King or taking your chances in the military, you just take your chances. Most young people that join the military know they could end up dead or injured but they hope they won't and sign up anyway.

You can't stop recruitment as long as the wages, bonuses, and benefits are better than what anyone in the bottom 20% of our economic strata could hope to achieve in the civilian market before the age of 35.

However, as a veteran (OEF/OIF, non-combat) I will say that the military sucks whether you're getting shot at or not.

Still, the new G.I. Bill is going to be a huge recruitment boon for the military and I don't think they're going to have any problem finding warm bodies any time soon because of it.

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» RE: Enlistment Posted by: nochicagoboys
» RE: nlistment Posted by: EinMD
» Sure, that's a part of it Posted by: blogbooks
» Excuses Posted by: EinMD
» Life's tough, wear a helmet Posted by: blogbooks
» Shove your helmet Posted by: countingdaisies
» Parents and family can have influence Posted by: countingdaisies
What We Must Acknowledge on Memorial Day
Posted by: WaldoMaui on May 30, 2008 3:33 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Memorial Day is dawning as I write this. Today we remember our American war dead. The rhetoric of our annual ceremonies expresses the pride we feel for those who offered the “last full measure of devotion,” but, in fact, we manage to keep a large portion of that pride for ourselves, as if our warriors’ willingness to sacrifice somehow makes noble our cause.

As Americans, not even in our prayers are we humble, for we see ourselves as the anointed ones, the rightful occupants of our pre-eminent “shining city on a hill.” We suppose that we have forged the most advanced civilization in history.

So how do we as a nation react when faced with a serious challenge? From our lofty perch, what is the most highly evolved response we manage to summon? As a result of engaging all of our intellect and experience and insight, what course of action do we choose to best serve our highest ideals and aspirations?

We send our children out into the streets to kill other people’s children.

Forgive me if I conclude that this is a day not to puff out our chests in national pride, but rather, a day to mournfully acknowledge our grotesque lack of imagination in sending our youth to war.

David L. Wilson

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No Child Left Behind
Posted by: sheena2u on May 30, 2008 3:45 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The "No Child Left Behind" program, under the Bush administration, made it possible for recruiters to have a presence on campus, and to view student's personal records in order to target the interests of the students. This was not only "possible" but mandated under "No Child Left Behind" at risk of the penalty of the school's loss of governmental funding.

Parents were not explained the process beforehand, but the process required parents to send in "Opt Out" forms every semester for each student that had reached the age of 18. Otherwise, the student's were fair game for the recruiters. This also included severely disabled students. An "Opt Out" form is required every semester, and there is a small window of time in which to get it in. If it is not received, every single branch of the services is at liberty to contact the student by phone and mail to try to get them to join the service.

The recruiters are just doing their job. It is the Bush White House that has been responsible for this siege of our innocent students. They could not bring the draft back since it had been so unpopular in the Vietnam war, so they used every possible method of targeting the young and immature, and in keeping in existing soldiers in endlessly recurring tours of duty. Some of the results is that families have disintegrated under the strain, and soldiers have committed suicide at unprecedented rates.

While we face the horrors of war I want everyone to remember that it was the Bush adminstration's failed policies that brought us here.

There were never any Weapons of Mass Destruction. We had no right to invade and attack a sovereign country that had not attacked us, and based on what they might have or what they might think or do if they had the ability. Pre-emptive war is immoral and illegal.

War is always a last, and not a first, resort.

The Bush administration wanted to attack Iraq. There was no relation between Bin Laden and Saddam. There was no problem in Iraq with insurgency and terrorists until we occupied Iraq. We are less safe, thousands of brave soldiers have lost their lives unnecessarily, or are now forced to live with severe disabilities, and thousands of innocent Iraqi civilians have been displaced because of this preciptious, unwise, and badly managed war.

Scott McClellan has written an expose of the Bush administration, and confirmed what most of us have suspected or known all along.

Now we must bring our soldiers home. We must take better care of our veterans. We must be sure the get the best benefits when they get home. No other choice is acceptable. We must support the families. We must build America up again. And we must vote for change in November.

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Wrong, wrong, wrong -- again!
Posted by: Moonray on May 30, 2008 3:57 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The tactics Kovic is suggesting would surely backfire, just as they did in the '60s when egotistical demonstrators managed to alienate a large portion of the population and thereby helped keep the Vietnam War going strong. In fact, these arrogant, loud-mouthed protestors -- perhaps more than any other factor -- helped get Richard Nixon elected in 1968, leading to five more years of U.S. involvement in Vietnam.

Confronting military recruiters is a waste of time and very, very counterproductive. The community IMMEDIATELY turns against the protesters and any confrontation gives pro-war jugheads an opportunity to thump their chests on local and national television.

Contrary to current popular belief, the anti-war protests of the 1960s were almost completely ineffective in stopping the war, and indeed had just the opposite effect. It wasn't until the Watergate scandal of the early '70s resulted in big changes in Congress that the plug was finally pulled on the Vietnam debacle.

Instead of confronting recruiters, anti-war forces should emphasize their own patriotism and military connections, then politely point out the many flaws in the pro-war policies. Lord knows there are plenty to point out. And, by all means, avoid appearing loud, arrogant, flamboyant or otherwise different from other folks.

I know whereof I speak. As an Army enlisted man in uniform, I was at the Pentagon during a mass protest in 1967 and served in Vietnam the next year.

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» Excellent points! Posted by: SufiLizard
» My history may be rusty Posted by: Ayla87
» RE: My history may be rusty Posted by: aonghus36
When parents in Middle America can go out of their way to fight teaching evolution in schools,
Posted by: maxpayne on May 30, 2008 4:11 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
they could sure as hell divert that energy to saving their kids rather than allow Big Military to bribe these poor children with monied scams which will always be out of their reach once in. After all, these same "pro-life" parents would do better to show their consistency in keeping their children's lives out of unjustified wars for corporate profits and oil and in the process giving their children a real future of a quality life ahead.

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End the War -prosecute the Admin & enablers
Posted by: Purple Girl on May 30, 2008 4:14 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We need to give stop the War!
I have no desire to undercut our military Readiness, but I do Not want any more sent over to the M.E. Granted we must Educate our 'enlistment' age citizens regarding the Criminality of this War. But that must be done from the Top. I have been very concerned there has been a Concerted effort to destroy OUR Armed Services so tha tthe Private Profiteer Mercenaries can be incorporated as a form of OUR Defense.Who do they pledge their allegeince Too- the Top Bidder? so I would prefer only those who have Patriotic Blood coursing through their veins to Defend this Country and US.
Military Service is not the Problem, It is solely a matter of the 'mission' and as far as I'm concerned this One is for the Benefit of ou=nly the saudis/UAE and their Oil Industry Minions- A land Grab.This Is NOT what OUR Military is to be used For- Let the 'royals' & Inc's stop sucking off US to defend THEIR inteerests and Global Stratedgies, DO NOT ALLOW THEM TO HIDE BEHIND US- using our reputation, our Treasures and OUR KIDS BLOOD!
In Fact I'd like to see more Recruiters to encourage Everyone to enlist so that WE may Conquer Those who are Domestic Enemies hiding in our Gov't and Industry. I want Our 'Kids' nad Our 'toys' to come home and start arresting the entire Executive Branch, Majority in both Houses of Congress, about 3/4 of SCOTUS ,along with the 'top Criminals' in the Oil, Auto, Banking and 'Investment' Industry.it is time to initiate the 'Protect & Defend the Constitution and the Citizens From Domestic enemies' part of their Mission Statement

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» spoken like the foul jewish princess you are Posted by: CulturalMutilation
» read it again? Posted by: hurricane hugo
Sorry, this comment has been removed from the system.
Sorry, this comment has been removed from the system.
» Interpreter necessary Posted by: countingdaisies
Ineffective
Posted by: Kahomono on May 30, 2008 4:24 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
and a waste of resources. Almost exactly analogous to dealing with an accident victim's severed artery by catching the blood in a bowl.

Stop the imperialist attitude of the government, stop the military adventurism, stop the waste of our military power on non-threats to our national security. THOSE are credible goals. Trying to cut off the supply of personnel? The recruitment strategies are many and varied; old folks like me remember a Vietnam-era recruitment strategy called "the draft."

They will get their bodies. We need to control what they do with them.

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A young man from my church
Posted by: SufiLizard on May 30, 2008 4:36 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There is a young man from my church who is currently dealing with this issue.

A recruiter got him to sign up ON his 18th birthday, even though he was just starting his Junior year of high school.

After consulting with church members and one of our pastors he came to realize the mistake he had made, but the military doesn't want to get their hooks out of him.

Fortunately he has the support of not only our congregation, but there are a lot of resources in our denomination to help him. But his future is still quite uncertain.

I'd like to see a discussion of specific actions a small group could take to help get recruiters out of our schools.

Or barring that, send recruiters from groups like Christian Peacemaker Teams and other, secular peace groups into the schools to recruit right along-side the military recruiters.

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» Hey, READ THIS and help the kid Posted by: blogbooks
How American is the U.S. military?
Posted by: ZombyWoof on May 30, 2008 4:48 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
One of my colleagues, a Mexican, told me that he was in high school in Mexico City during the Bush I years almost 20 years ago. In the school there was a recruiting poster for the U.S. Army offering $1000 for any new recruits. His father wisely stopped him from signing up. If the recruiters cannot get U.S. citizens, they will outsource to other countries for new recruits or to private firms like Blackwater. The domestic recruiters are only one part of a massive international recruiting effort. That begs the question, how American is the U.S. military, and is it becoming the new World Army?

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» BS ALERT!!! Posted by: robbie.seal
Freedom to Fight for our Country
Posted by: KAEL on May 30, 2008 4:49 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Protesting employment opportunities in the worse economy in our life time? Brilliant! Protesting a person's decision to serve their country in uniform? Priceless!

If there were a mass disinformation campaign going on in recruiting offices, we would hear about it or have seen a class action suit. The truth is that the vast majority of the military likes the institution they serve as well as the job they do, even if they do not support this war.

The left's pandering about the military is getting over the top - again. Most members did not enlist as an alternative to McDonalds, but as an alternative to all the jobs that were available at the time they were making a job or career choice - the same way every American chooses a job. And most members do not feel they were lied to. Yes, life after the first day on any job is not what one fantacized, but that awakening is no different for a CEO, bank teller or a firefighter.

Soldiers are just like other Americans, some left, some right, but most in the middle and doing a job they like and chose eyes wide open.

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» Brainwashed . . . Posted by: countingdaisies
Several Different Issues Here
Posted by: redbird30328 on May 30, 2008 5:03 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
No one can deny the tragedy of war anywhere on the globe. The ruined lives left in war's wake is heartbreaking. It is also at least open to discussion whether invading Iraq was a good idea in the first place and whether our overall execution of this strategy has been competent. What I refuse to accept is that people who join the military do not know what circumstances might confront them. You can end up in harm's way at the whim of civilians with muddled agendas. Whether attending school for free at one of the academies, drawing a monthly paycheck from the reserves, or anticipating subsequent college assistance, those who join the military receive benefits in exchange for risking life and limb for this country. This author's solution is another example of the most common theme on this web site - people looking to blame someone else for their problems and circumstances. Harassing military recruiters is not the solution here - electing thoughtful leaders (if we can find any) should be the objective.

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» Don't eat the yellow snow... www.Buyblue.org Posted by: CulturalMutilation
John tolman
Posted by: RedFoxOne on May 30, 2008 5:27 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What 'War Machine" With Dictator Bush at the helm it is a Global Domination machine. Yes, no doubt it does need to be stopped. Sooner we get that War Monger out of office, the better off we will all be.

JT
Ultimate Anonymity

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toothache
Posted by: brer on May 30, 2008 5:29 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
A very close friend of mine has a child who tried to commit suicide last fall. He was given meds and was working on getting his life back together.

This February, he met a Navy recruiter who told him he could become a Navy Seal and talked him into signing up.

The kid asked if there would be a problem with his having tried to commit suicide, and the recruiter told him not to tell anyone about it.

The recruiter also told him not to cut his hair, because it was covering some scars from a motorcycle accident he'd had the year before.

This is the kind of recruiting that's being done!

This is the kind of kid we are recruiting. It's no wonder that the suicide rate is so high if they are recruiting sucidal kids to begin with.

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If you REALLY want to hurt the war effort...
Posted by: Farasien on May 30, 2008 5:56 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
...you have to illustrate its real effects to the dipshits dumb enough to sign on the bottom line. Protests only really help to galvanize those already set in their views- it almost never attracts undecided people to your cause. Sure, there are a few who will allow themselves to get caught up in the zeal of the moment, much like what those same recruiters do when they wave the flag and scream "Patriotism!" to a soft-headed 17 year-old, but those who really have the ability to stop the war won't be impressed, nor will those already caught up in the march to the battlefield. If you really want to stop the machine, you have to show the public the real effects of the war in plain, simple terms. Remember the Terry Schivo thing? It got as big as it did because of the commercials showing her to the public. This caused outcry loud and immediate enough congress intervened immediately. Want the war to really stop? Start showing vets on the way to the hospital after a roadside bomb attack. Put some of the gruesome stuff that's actually happening on national TV. Start interviewing the REAL patriots of Veterans Against The War on the morning dumb-ass interview shows. Start showing the real financial costs of the war. Put the cameramen in the roving patrols in Sadr City or wherever the most gruesome fighting is going on and then broadcast it, UNCENSORED, during prime-time. People don;t protest the war or do much to stop it because of the way its portrayed to us. Most people know, deep down that the government is a seething cesspool of mass corruption but don't do anything because 1. they don't feel there is any real impact they can make and 2. the effects aren't felt at large as yet. As I’ve said in other responses, because there isn't yet mass starvation, people feel as if the war were some bad story on TV that gets regurgitated on a really slow news day' like the unending Israli/Palastinian problem. Yes, it sucks and yes, its tragic, but the tragedy doesn't yet impinge on peoples' everyday lives enough to make them really want to change. Its too easy to change to the newest episode of American Idol or whatever football/basketball/baseball/whatever game is running at the time. Until people get truly uncomfortable, until they truly feel threatened by it, nothing, and I mean NOTHING will change. The effect of the american media is really to mollify and sanitize the news so it doesn't do this. Because we don’t show people the effects of what's happening, the masses don’t really feel as if there is anything to be concerned about, so here we are.

After THAT, setp 2... attacking the monetary support for the war effort...

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» One Proud Dipshit Posted by: robbie.seal
Please guys, stop with the warrior mentality already!
Posted by: nomoreblinders on May 30, 2008 6:08 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I can't believe people are shocked by the lies and deceit regarding ANYTHING the government has to offer! These guys HAVE to sweeten the deal, otherwise, who in their right mind would go? These GIs are forever traumatized----and for what? Killing someone you don't even know for.....WHAT? I'd have a much easier time killing in self defense! My dad landed on Normandy beach in WW11, and as they were running off the boats onto the beach, his buddy was shot in the abdomen, literally spilling his guts out, and this guy was in such shock, he kept running, on his own intestines until he collapsed! My father will bring this up now and again-----60 years later! Preserve yourself----stay in school, take up some kind of trade or go to college, protect your family, neighborhood...don't fall for all the hype and lures....don't be labeled a government issue paid killer...it just isn't worth it! Let the rich dudes fight their own fight, after all, they started it!....rise above the pigs and filth and propaganda, there is so much more honor in that, and that is sooo attractive in a man!

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Who got us into this AVF mess?
Posted by: sausage on May 30, 2008 6:50 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Hey, all you old hippies and anti-Vietnam War activists out there. Got to the bathroom and look in the mirror. Wha'dya see?

Besides an aging white person you're looking at one of the causes for the underhanded, deceptive recruiting practices our All Volunteer Force uses to lure young men and women whose "...choices in life are confined to working at Burger King or taking your chances in the military..."(blogbooks).

Remember how all you college educated, neo-Democrats of draft age, especially you 1-A guys argued, between hits on the bong, in dorm bull sessions, "End the draft now! Let those who want to be there, be there!"

Remember how you cheered in 1969 when the architect of our current rudderless economy and godfather to our anti-government politicians and god-grandfather to today's College Republican chickenhawks, Milton J. Friedman, flummoxed General William Westmoreland over whether volunteer recruits were mercenaries and draftees "slaves" or not during Gates Commission hearings. Oh, haw, haw, haw--lookit how that whimpy lookin' economist jes' made a jackass outta that dumbass general!!!

If you don't think that crappy hourly wage McDonalds, Wal Mart and the meat-packing industry gets away paying their employees, guess again. If civilian employers paid as well with as many benefits as does the U.S. military do you think Jessica Lynch or Lynndie England or millions of other boys and girls from impoverished areas of the country flock to the recruiting station?

And the irony of the All Volunteer Force, lost on libertarians of every stripe, including the late Friedman, is, the U.S. military is nothing but a big socialist program all on the taxpayers' dime!

So remember, aging hippies, it was you who wanted an end to the draft and its your grandchildren who are paying the consequences.

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If you succeed...
Posted by: Axiom69 on May 30, 2008 7:17 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I believe that anti-recruitment efforts are misguided. What happens if you succeed and nobody volunteers? Will the Military just go away? No. We will return to the draft. If you want to change how things are done you must confront your lawmakers. The ones that make the policy not the ones who carry out that policy. This country needs it's military. How that military is used and how it conducts itself depends on who you the voter put into office. This applies to more than just the President. Inspect your Congressional candidates. Vet them. Just don't vote for them because a D or R follows their name on the ballot.

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» RE: If you succeed... Posted by: Dboy
» RE: If you succeed... Posted by: Axiom69
» RE: If you succeed... Posted by: Dboy
responsibility
Posted by: grkjr on May 30, 2008 8:15 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Tis truly a never ending story...Why is there always someone else responsible for our own actions... when, where, how, will it stop...An illegal or immoral war takes place, and the expectation is that someone else, somewhere, somehow, will correct the wrong. That just won't happen.. Unless enough individuals step forward and take the necessary action to STOP THE WRONG, regardless of the consequences, the wrong will continue. The army of individuals who took to the streets over the Vietnam war were those individuals. We would still be occupying Vietnam if it were not for them. Still, the last stand against immoral actions, which a govt may be perpetrating, is the individual. Why is it that we continue to support the troops, who in some twisted rationale, we perceive to be innocent victims doing the right thing in the wrong place. NO, NO, they are deeply responsible for following the "orders" just as the germans were responsible for following theirs during WWII. Does it take an especially brave person to not follow orders that he or she believes to be immoral or wrong??? Certainly. Would they have to face the consequences of their actions? Certainly. But if enough choose the high road, then if this war is as wrong as most citizens think it is, support would come to the streets by the millions and this war would end. Troops who go and fight a war that they believe to be wrong need to be held accountable not excused. And we meed to be giving them a safe haven from which to say "hell no, I will not go" To do less is to simply be kidding our selves and to be a participant and promoter and supporter of this "war". But one may add, that they have been in the streets, written their congressman, did all sorts of things to end this "crime".. yes but your neighbor has not, thus the soul of this country is no longer "above water" and a few heads above the water line can't save the rest of the passengers whose numbers are too great. What we are witnessing is the dying of this nation.

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The Civilian World for HS Grads Must Be Made Competitive With Military Salaries and Benefits
Posted by: sofla100 on May 30, 2008 8:49 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The most effective way of discouraging people from entering the military is to quite simply, significantly raise the civilian minimum wage and provide ample educational benefits to all Americans. One of my friends is a cook in the Air Force, he only has the rank of E-5 (Sargent) and has been in just a few years, but with his housing allowance his salary is close to $60,000 a year. He also has the GI bill and TriCare insurance for his wife and children. So, from his point of view, what alternative is there? Go to Denny's and work for at best $40K or less a year and probably not have health insurance for his family? Military recruiters are smart, they know it's very dismal prospects that face many kids coming out of high school. Many parents cannot afford college, loans are very limited if available at all, and that leaves places like Wal-Mart, McDonalds and stores at the mall for jobs. In Europe, it's a different story. The military economy is not there like it is in the USA. And, in Western Europe, college education is paid for by the state for those with the scores/grades to get into college. This is how America should be! Instead, all our money is just sucked into the military and the war machine. What a waste. Raise the minimum wage, let people go to college, and then military recruiters will starve!

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The insane will lead/defend us
Posted by: Col. Jackleg on May 30, 2008 9:18 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am a lawyer with more trial experience than I care to confess. I have a client that is currently serving as an Army recruiting partner. Her role is to screen applicants for "fitness" and then pass them along to her principals. During the past three years, she has been required to dip into the "other" bin to find those that would honor our nation in military service. Among the others are numerous "candidates" with verified mental problems that are now prime candidates for service because the remaining litter is void. Many are suspicious of where it will all lead, particularly when the head is shaved and they are deployed to some boot camp. Her advice to the recalcitrant is gospel...if you don't like it when you get there, tell them you are gay and you will be on your way home immediately. As we read about the military suicides, and post-deployment syndromes that are very real, let us remember the lunatic that started it and then accept the fact that he is more comfortable with like kind about him and with no regard for accountability. Any veteran will attest to my thesis and the consequences will dwarf the Nam experience. Thankfully, the veterans are beginning to speak up. Will their legitimate pleas reach the media, the politicos and the brain dead public? Sure, we all know that god loves america and we can do no wrong.

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Leave My Child Alone Website and Film
Posted by: emopaul on May 30, 2008 9:29 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Anyone reading these comments should know about these great resources for resisting war recruiters who are taking advantage of our kids:
http://www.leavemychildalone.org/

and this film:
http://tinyurl.com/euofl

or at this link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=75Uog_7WrLk

It's hard to fathom how many lives have been ruined by this insane war.

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stop fueling!
Posted by: sirios on May 30, 2008 9:33 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
stopping the war machine? how about stop fueling the war machine by our national acceptance of war itself. Let face it people, americans are not against war , we are against loosing. We are taught at an early age that winning is everything, in school, sports, business,religion etc. etc. We as individuals and a nation are obsessed with being right and will attack anyone, verbally or otherwise who disagrees with us.

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» RE: stop fueling! Posted by: isnamthere
Let me tell you a different story
Posted by: terrymo on May 30, 2008 9:36 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Of course some join the military as an alternative to a minimum wage job. But not everyone. Some actually see it as a promising future; some join out of a true desire to serve.

Let me tell you about two of them.

Our nephew, Tim, worked long and hard to earn an appointment to West Point. He grew up so much at the Point and learned about discipline and honor. He graduated and went on to helicopter flight school and was quickly promoted to Captain. And he remained the handsome, intelligent, goofy young man he always was. He talked over email to our daughter in March of 2006 and told her that he was proud of his service and of the men and women he was serving with and that his only regret would be if he was not around to see his baby girl grow up.

His helicopter was shot down on April 1, 2006 and he was killed.

Our son-in-law, Ben, met our daughter the very day Tim was killed. He was on leave from his first tour in Iraq. He joined the military after 9/11, not because he had nowhere else to go but because he felt compelled to serve. He was an E5 when Michelle met him and was on his way to his E6 when he deployed for the second time in December 2007, 7 months after they married. He believed strongly in God, his family, his wife, himself and Army discipline.

He was killed on December 26, 2007, an event that was reported and brutally debated in this very forum.

Neither of these young men were lured by an underhanded recruiter nor pushed by economic or educational circumstances. They went with a sense of duty and a belief that they were doing something special for their country.

I find it difficult now to hear young people their age whine and complain and wallow in self-indulgence, when they have done nothing to be of service to anyone.

Do not dishonor the majority of those in the military by tarring all with the same brush.

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» You are a sad commentary Posted by: robbie.seal
» Some of us will not forget Posted by: robbie.seal
Shameful Recruiting Tactics
Posted by: MonkeyDaddy on May 30, 2008 9:43 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Some years ago a distant relative of mine got in trouble after he became one of the top recruiters for one of the service branches. He was getting paid $50 per recruit and was known to take a potential recruit out, get them high on PCP and then sign them up. That's not America and its not a "volunteer" force.

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» I call B.S. on that Posted by: blogbooks
» Stupid monkey... Posted by: robbie.seal
Crosby Stills and Nash said it best...
Posted by: jeffrey7 on May 30, 2008 9:52 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
TEACH YOUR CHILDREN. We must tell our children the truth about the hows and whys of warfare. So them how corrupted Governments use their people as cannon fodder with the promise
of a 'Higher education'. We can't make the legacy of our times to be the idea that if you disagree with someone it's OK to have them wacked. We must teach the truth about how the media co