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Juan Crow: The Deep South's New Second-Class Citizens

By Roberto Lovato, The Nation. Posted May 15, 2008.


Latinos' subordinate status in Georgia strongly resembles that of African-Americans who lived under Jim Crow.

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Justeen Mancha's dream of becoming a psychologist was born of the tropical heat and exploitation that have shaped farmworker life around Reidsville, Georgia, for centuries. The wiry, freckle-faced 17-year-old high school junior has toiled in drought-dry onion fields to help her mother, Maria Christina Martinez. But early one September morning in 2006, Mancha's dream was abruptly deferred.

From the living room of the battered trailer she and her mother call home, Mancha described what happened when she came out of the shower that morning. "My mother went out, and I was alone," she said. "I was getting ready for school, getting dressed, when I heard this noise. I thought it was my mother coming back." She went on in the Tex-Mex Spanish-inflected Georgia accent now heard throughout Dixie: "Some people were slamming car doors outside the trailer. I heard footsteps and then a loud boom and then somebody screaming, asking if we were 'illegals,' 'Mexicans.' These big men were standing in my living room holding guns. One man blocked my doorway. Another guy grabbed a gun on his side. I freaked out. 'Oh, my God!' I yelled."

As more than twenty Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) agents surrounded the trailer, said Mancha, agents inside interrogated her. They asked her where her mother was; they wanted to know if her mother was "Mexican" and whether she had "papers" or a green card. They told her they were looking for "illegals."

After about five minutes of interrogation, the agents -- who, according to the women's lawyer, Mary Bauer of the Southern Poverty Law Center, showed no warrants and had neither probable cause nor consent to enter the home -- simply left. They left in all likelihood because Mancha and her mother didn't fit the profile of the workers at the nearby Crider poultry plant, who had been targeted by the raid in nearby Stilwell. They were the wrong kind of "Mexicans"; they were US citizens.

Though she had experienced discrimination before the raid -- in the fields, in the supermarket and in school -- Mancha, who testified before Congress in February, never imagined such an incident would befall her, since she and her mother had migrated from Texas to Reidsville. Best known for harvesting poultry and agricultural products, Reidsville, a farm town about 200 miles southeast of Atlanta, is also known for harvesting Klan culture behind the walls of the state's oldest and largest prison. But its most famous former inmate is Jim Crow slayer and dreamer Martin Luther King Jr. His example inspires Mancha's new dream: lawyering "for the poor."

The toll this increasingly oppressive climate has taken on Mancha represents but a small part of its effects on noncitizen immigrants, especially undocumented immigrants, and other Latinos. Mancha and the younger children of the mostly immigrant Latinos in Georgia are learning and internalizing that they are different from white -- and black -- children not just because they have the wrong skin color but also because many of their parents lack the right papers. They are growing up in a racial and political climate in which Latinos' subordinate status in Georgia and in the Deep South bears more than a passing resemblance to that of African-Americans who were living under Jim Crow. Call it Juan Crow: the matrix of laws, social customs, economic institutions and symbolic systems enabling the physical and psychic isolation needed to control and exploit undocumented immigrants. Listening to the effects of Juan Crow on immigrants and citizens like Mancha ("I can't sleep sometimes because of nightmares," she says. "My arms still twitch. I see ICE agents and men in uniform, and it still scares me") reminds me of the trauma I heard among the men, women and children controlled and exploited by state violence in wartime El Salvador. Juan Crow has roots in the US South, but it stirs traumas bred in the hemispheric South.

In fact, the surge in Latino migration (the Southeast is home to the fastest-growing Latino population in the United States) is moving many of the institutions and actors responsible for enforcing Jim Crow to resurrect and reconfigure themselves in line with new demographics. Along with the almost daily arrests, raids and home invasions by federal, state and other authorities, newly resurgent civilian groups like the Ku Klux Klan, in addition to more than 144 new "nativist extremist" groups and 300 anti-immigrant organizations born in the past three years, mostly based in the South, are harassing immigrants as a way to grow their ranks.

Meanwhile, a legal regime of distinctions between the rights of undocumented immigrants and citizens has emerged and is being continually refined and expanded. A 2006 Georgia law denies undocumented immigrants driver's licenses. Federal laws that allowed local and state authorities to pursue blacks under the Fugitive Slave Act appear to be the model for the Bush Administration's Agreements of Cooperation in Communities to Enhance Safety and Security (ACCESS) program, which allows states to deputize law enforcement officials to chase, detain, arrest and jail the undocumented. Georgia's lowest-paid workers, the undocumented, now occupy a separate, unequal and clandestine place that has made it increasingly difficult for them to work, rent homes or attend school.


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See more stories tagged with: racism, south, immigration, latinos, georgia, ice

Roberto Lovato is a New York-based writer with New America Media.

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View:
Institutionalizing and Provoking 'White Fear'
Posted by: Purple Girl on May 15, 2008 3:46 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As a White female of europena descent (6th generation)I need not read Sinclair's 'the Jungle' to understand ethicnic & racial prejudice & discrimination. I'm a ethinic Mutt- Scotch-Irish, Italian, Luthuanian...for the most part my ancestors bore the brunt of such sociological burdens. I thank them. But I find it now my Duty to honor their sacrifics by helping groups who still must face the heartaches tha tcome along with trying to 'Find a better life'.
There has been improvements in this country since they immigrated- but appear to be perpetuated and given CPR regularly by media and Their Corp sponsors.The results in WV and the interviews with some of it's voters was tell tale. One said she voted against Obama becasue he was a Muslim -Who told her He was a Muslim ..the media. Another 'sweetie' said because he was black (failing to recognize he is actually Bi racial) and 'we've been having Problems with them'..How many Blacks live near her to give her 'problems', Is she under the impression there are Race riots going on somewhere?The Other stated becasue of His middle name "Hussein'- and she's had enough of any 'Hussein'- Saddam did not attack US on 9/11- Who ever gave her thta impression - The administration and the Media.
The hispanic population is gettting the Same BS media spin without ever getting th echance to PROVE it is the INC's who are Stealing Their Jobs and ship them overseas. It is th eFault of the Inc's Profit driven greed which got you replaced dby an Illegal. The immigrant worker did not come in and start haggling to undercut any worker to steal their job. The Inc's cut you to save money, and found a desperate person to take Your place- wherther an Illegal or a Young Fresh in the market Kid.
The Inc's, The Gov't & the Media use such disinformation as a tool to divided and conquer- always have and if WE let them they will continue into this New Millenia.Obviously it is OUR respsonsiblity to Educate our own citizens. WV said more About US then anything Good about Hillary (she should be ashamed as to WHY she won WV)There is a serious Societial and sociolgical Black Hole in certian areas of our Country which are not Indictive of our Nation as a Whole- but an indictment on how we must Regain control over it from the Inc's, Media and Self promoting Politicians.I'm angry for the Black community, the hardworking Hispanic immigrants and my ill informed & isolated predominately scotch Irish Fellow Americans- Hillbillys (look up original meaning)

» JUST GOOGLE F THE SOUTH Posted by: HistArch
Atlanta In Trouble
Posted by: steveruff on May 15, 2008 4:31 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Having lived in Atlanta my whole life I can say that the "city to busy to hate" is anything but that. I find this story to be rather selective in its presentation. You cannot compare the illegal immigration issue to the struggle for civil rites - far from it. This is an extremely one-sided article and detracts from everything that really surrounds this argument.

Atlanta is one of the most racially divided cities that I have been in, granted I do live here so I probably see more than most. Atlanta has a myriad of issues, from the corrupt police force, to the irresponsible heads that run public transportation, to Clayton County's looming issue of losing school accredidation, to the 70+ million dollar budget shortfall due to Mayor Franklin's office making a 'clerical error' which they will not release documentation of, to racism, gang violence that has all but overtaken Gwinett County, etc.

Atlanta threatens to implode upon itself in the community issues that affect most of us. I just think this article was lop-sided, narrowly written from one perspective, and I do not think that comparing illegal immigration to the struggle for civil rites is even in the same ballpark simply because African American who struggled then, and now, were/are legal citizens of this nation. That's a major difference... racism must be rooted out in our communities and on a national level in Washington/White House for things to change.

» RE: Atlanta In Trouble Posted by: Joshua Holland
» A huge difference Posted by: brunowe
» Not so huge ... Posted by: Joshua Holland
» Reading comprehension issue? Posted by: Joshua Holland
» Democrats and Liberals need new victiums Posted by: TheJibreelaMonsters
» RE: Atlanta In Trouble Posted by: SOWILO
» Is the dishonesty automatic? Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Is the dishonesty automatic? Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Is the dishonesty automatic? Posted by: Joshua Holland
» Politics Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: personal attack Posted by: Lector
» RE: personal attack Posted by: Lector
» RE: personal attack Posted by: Lector
» RE: personal attack Posted by: YogiBear
» RE: personal attack Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Atlanta In Trouble Posted by: ianfan
"The South"?
Posted by: marykmusic on May 15, 2008 5:43 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
To imply that this is a Southern problem is geographically challenged. Suggesting that the KKK only exists because of Southern whites is equally biased.

Throughout history, any entrenched group has fears perpetrated by the appearance of "The Other." Sure, there were real problems with racism, perpetrated by a fear of a slave uprising... but remember that the first slaves were not in the American South, but Massachussets. And the Irish who managed to escape from the Great Hunger in the late 1840's were considered lower in the Northern states than the free blacks against whom they had to compete for the available unskilled labor jobs. "No Irish need apply" was the reigning attitude of the day.

It's politically correct to teach that Black people are the only ones who have suffered racism. It's alive and well all over the world.

» RE: "The South"? Posted by: beaubeau
» RE: "The South"? Posted by: desidid
Quibble
Posted by: 8 nontheist on May 15, 2008 6:17 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Latinos are an ambitious & creative lot. I'm waiting for Latinos to create a Spanish friendly term for the laws & practices which are used to deny them rights. Juan Crow is a Gringo created term which doesn't fit the Spanglish we speak in the USA.
Our Latino neighbors will create a Spanglish term for the discrimination you call Juan Crow for want of a better term as they create a term to replace la migra which was appilied to the old INS to be the Spanglish term for the thugs of ICE.

» RE: Quibble Posted by: Xynyx
» RE: Quibble Posted by: DaBear
I am sick and tired of the South branded as racist!
Posted by: Ky Lake Dave on May 15, 2008 6:45 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I have lived all across the USA and in a few foreign countries. The worst racists I have seen were in San Diego Ca. The Grand Wizard of the KKK is or was living in San Diego. (I do not know if he still is or if they have elections or whatever.) The Illegal Immigration problem there is so out of hand that the Mexicans are loathed in San Diego. I am American Indian and have the completion of the Mexican people. I have had to explain my race several times. Blacks in the inner city of San Diego are assumed to be crack dealers and prostitutes. In Dayton Ohio the "N" word is thrown around by whites as just a normal way to address blacks. Atlanta Ga is just paralyzed in fear. The people of Atlanta try so very hard not to offend any race, to call the white citizens of the City of Atlanta racist is nuts. But it is the only city were I was told to be out of the city before the sun when down by the BLACKS in the inner city. Tripoli Libya is a tough town to be a light colored family. Our home was actually attacked. Our family dog was hung and our furniture and all our belongings were burned.
Western Ky is a peaceful area. The races seem to gel together very nicely. I hear that damn "N" word occasionally by some very few very ignorant people. But I am happy to see those shouted down by the majority.
It is so easy to blast the south for racism. The West Coast and the North East look down their noses at the South and Midwest. Of course I remember Rodney King was in LA. Race riots have been enjoyed in LA, NY, Detroit and Chicago. No riots in the South. I would bet a months salary that the writer of this article is from New York or California. The South is a beautiful proud part of the United States. It is as much a part of the US as California or even New York.

» You found a racist in Marietta! Posted by: Ky Lake Dave
» RE: You found a racist in Marietta! Posted by: Joshua Holland
» Joshua I must apologize. Posted by: Ky Lake Dave
» RE: Joshua I must apologize. Posted by: Joshua Holland
Not a good lead
Posted by: war_on_tara on May 15, 2008 7:13 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"After about five minutes of interrogation" that resulted in the ICE agents going away after they realize she's documented, Mancha's mother still has nightmares a year and a half later? Quelle horreur, or rather, que lastima! Her son should stick to his original dream of becoming a psychologist.

Some of the other examples would have made a much better lead - for instance, the pregnant woman who was beaten, then deported after the ER. That is indeed a depressing story, and one in no way on the same level as the first.

Roberto Lovato is a bad writer who mashes all this stuff into a weepy blob of sentimental goo. He has absolutely no sense of proportion and invariably defeats his own purpose.

» RE: Not a good lead Posted by: newtype_alpha
» RE: Not a good lead Posted by: war_on_tara
This is the whole point of free-trade/NAFTA...
Posted by: CatDad on May 15, 2008 7:41 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
..bringing in an army of legal and illegal Hispanic migrants who will increase the labor supply by the millions...thereby putting more strains on the living standards of those at the economic bottom. This way, existing American citizens will be less likely to demand things like real living wages, health insurance or union representation.

Our ruling elites WANT a vast army of illegal workers who will be too fearful to fight back against workplace injustices...in the Hispanic worker they think they've found a docile drone.

Free trade decimates the agricultural sectors of nations like Mexico...which in this case has led to massive displacement and immigration to the USA...which was deliberate. We need to put an end to these free trade scams. Nations like Mexico need to be self-sufficient in agriculture...Their workers need to stay with their own families in their native land and work for higher living standards in Mexico. They don't need to become slaves in the USA.

Could Internation Laws Solve Immagration Issues?
Posted by: peacekeepertwo on May 15, 2008 8:07 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There are so many countries in the world, That have illegal workers. Maybe it would be wise, to have international laws that Would require things like safe Working Conditions,a living wage. laws that hold Corporations to account for poluting the ground water, or any other damage they Cause. We have to solve these problems together.

'Supply side' economics again!
Posted by: frantaylor on May 15, 2008 8:42 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Remember 'Supply-side economics'? This is Republican-speak for 'control'. People have been endlessly brainwashed into only thinking about economics from the supply (the rich people's) side, and not from the demand (the poor people's) side.

We try to solve our budget problems from the supply side. We try to solve our drug problems from the supply side. We try to solve our immigration problems from the supply side.

The demand side is a little harder to work with. Dealing with our budget problems from the demand side means asking the people to make sacrifices. Dealing with the drug problem from the demand side means taking on social issues, which conservatives don't know how to do. Dealing with the immigration problem from the demand side means dealing with unscrupulous employers and the conditions of the countries people emigrate from, which, again, is something conservative neither want to do or even know how to do.

Illegal Immigrants in the South
Posted by: megawo on May 15, 2008 8:46 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This article is tripe. You have no idea what you are talking about.

» Menudo! Posted by: war_on_tara
» RE: Menudo! Posted by: Mexitli
rn
Posted by: mnatra on May 15, 2008 9:58 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Who Cares?

» RE: rn Posted by: Mexitli
Solid South
Posted by: immigrationman on May 15, 2008 10:07 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The South has its problems, but so does everywhere else. I grew up in Macon, GA, and things are different 'cause they have to be. Illegals are everywhere, and enforcement is key. After all, I've got enough problems to deal with, so the last thing I can be concerned about is how federal agents in general interract with US Citizens in trailer parks. Still, I'm just as concerned about immigration fraud and wondered if anyone else is aware of this problem. I just read the new book "Legal US Immigration: Truth, Fraud and the American Way" by Adam Edward Rothwell, an immigration lawyer, and I couldn't believe how much fraud there is in the system. And the book's website (www.immigrationisamess.com ) says it all. This is all a huge mess.

» RE: Solid South Posted by: ianfan
» illegals are everywhere? Posted by: Mexitli
» RE: illegals are everywhere? Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: illegals are everywhere? Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: illegals are everywhere? Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: illegals are everywhere? Posted by: Joshua Holland
» Dawg Posted by: Mexitli
» RE: Dawg Posted by: SOWILO
» RE: Dawg Posted by: Mexitli
» RE: Solid South Posted by: immigrationman
Citizens..?
Posted by: TJ-stars4peace on May 15, 2008 10:18 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Citizens..?

Or is the issue that 12-20 million are Not Citizens..?

People should learn basic civics..

For me the well being of my fellow American Citizens comes first..

If people who think they are enlightened don't realize how "The Ruling Elite Class" are using these Illegal non-citizens to reduce wages, crush unions, and destroy the social safety net and middle and working class, then they aren't half as bright as they would have others believe them to be..

But what they hell let's just say everyone in the whole "F"ing world is an American citizen..and all benefits thereof are universal..!

» RE: Citizens..? Posted by: newtype_alpha
» RE: Citizens..? Posted by: DaBear
This comment has been removed from the site due to non-compliance with AlterNet's community policies.
Sorry, this comment has been removed from the system.
THE DIFFERENCE IS!!
Posted by: beaubeau on May 15, 2008 2:23 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
TO EQUATE 'ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS WITH THE STRUGGLE OF BLACK AMERICANS IS VERY INSULTING!! THE DIFFERENCE-BLACK AMERICANS ARE JUST THAT,AMERICANS!! ILLEGALS, ARE PEOPLE WHO CAME INTO THIS COUNTRY AND BROKE THE FIRST RULE -THEY DID NOT ANBIDE BY THE IMMIGRATION LAWS. THE U.S.A. HAS A HISTORY OF WELCOMING IMMIGRANTS FROM OTHER COUNTRIES AND GOD KNOWS WE ARE A MELTING POT! PEOPLE WHO WALK INTO THIS COUNTRY ARE DOING SO ILLEGALLY. HAVING SAID ALL THAT, THESE PEOPLE ARE HUMAN BEINGS AND DESERVE HUMANE TREATMENT, BUT SINCE THEY BROKE THE LAWS OF THIS COUNTRY BY ENTERING ILLEGALLY -THEN OF COURSE, THEY ARE AFRAID OF BEING CAUGHT!! WE HAVE LAWS IN THIS COUNTRY AND BY ENTERING ILLEGALLY, YOU HAVE BROKEN THE LAW. YOU ARE HERE ILLEGALLY!!~

Here we go again.
Posted by: SOWILO on May 15, 2008 2:23 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
1. By local.

2. Repeal NAFTA and CAFTA.

3. If you are here illegally, you're going to have problems, just like an illegal immigrant in ANY country is going to have problems. The left keeps blowing it with this issue. If they are here legally, then fine.

Come on, alternet!!! This is getting a bit absurd.

Being pro-illegal immigration is stoking racist fires. THESE SENTIMENTS WILL GROW IN PROPORTION TO YOUR SUPPORT OF IT AND IN PROPORTION TO THE AMOUNT COMING.

Legal= fine.

Illegal = always going to have trouble. ALWAYS. No matter what.

Grow up.

NOW.

» RE: Here we go again. Posted by: CatDad
» Wait, this makes no sense at all ... Posted by: Joshua Holland
» Not back-peddling? Funny ... Posted by: Joshua Holland
» wee lito Posted by: Mexitli
Pity the "documented' ( AKA 'Legal' ) Mexicans
Posted by: gellero1 on May 15, 2008 2:36 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Our fellow 'documented' citizens should have the sense enough to see that this horror has been foisted upon them by the 'undocumented' ILLEGAL millions.

They should be in the forefront of the movement to send them back where they came from.

And I certainly don't accept blame for any Mexican economic policies. If the Mexicans don't like the treaties their government signs, let them have their own revolution.

No guilt trip here !

» so what Posted by: Mexitli
» i dont care about you either Posted by: Mexitli
RE: Are infomercials allowed on Alternet?
Posted by: Mexitli on May 15, 2008 6:17 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I like Potok.

He coo with me lol

Interesting but a bit simplistic
Posted by: dbatterman on May 15, 2008 3:10 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As a lifelong Georgian, most of which has been in Atlanta, I see some glaring problems with the author's references to our city. First of all, the "gentrification" of Sweet Auburn. Perhaps he is referring a couple of miles down the road from there, but to say that Sweet Auburn has been gentrified by yuppies is a blatant falsehood. It is always going to be a center of black history, and since I just attended the Sweet Auburn festival last week, I can assure you it is thriving still.
I am well aware of the political shenanigans our Assembly has passed in the last year or two, much of which has to do with pandering to a very small but vocal minority. But honestly, the author is not going to get much sympathy by referring to the woman who "scared because she's driving without a license." I would be scared too, because it's illegal, I've done it and paid the consequences. I do think that our immigration policies are terribly restrictive and outdated, and whether or not she should have to be illegal in the first place is definitely debatable. But that particular example does nothing to bolster his case.
And one more note, while there are raids and governmental bullheadedness, there is a thriving community here of not only Latinos but people of every nationality. There are whole cities that are known for their wide cultural demographics, and community events that celebrate these things in an open and joyous atmosphere. I would hate to see someone read this article and think we are a city of cultures so demonized that we are all hiding ourselves away from each other, because it's not true.

The new negro class is multicolored
Posted by: billwald on May 15, 2008 3:13 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The new negro class is mostly poor whites but our owners don't the whites to realize it. As long as the poor whites have blacks to pick on and blacks has hispanics to pick on then our owners are safe to keep the assets flowing from the poor to the rich.

Stupid Americans think they are free because we can vote for whomever tax collector we choose. After the election, nothing will change.

Illegal immigrants not taking jobs?
Posted by: Democratic Socialist on May 15, 2008 5:16 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
You all will be pleased to note that the largest immigration raid in American history happened the other day when the biggest kosher meat packing plant in the USA, Agriprocessors of Iowa, was raided and HUNDREDS of illegal workers were detained for not only being here illegally but also stealing social security numbers and American identities, etc.

All of you people for illegal immigration can be pleased that these hundreds of workers were being paid slave wages and being abused by their bosses to do work that native born Americans used to be paid living wages for.

Good job immigrant labor activists!

linked text

» RE: Blaming poor people for working Posted by: newtype_alpha
» ahhh Posted by: Mexitli
Time For A History Lesson
Posted by: desidid on May 15, 2008 5:26 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Blacks weren't legal citizens until they demanded their rights to become legal citizens. They were workers contributing to the economy without the rights and responsibilities of citizenship, just like today's unauthorized workers.

Blacks were clearly citizens during Jim Crow. We had the responsibilities of citizenship we didn't have the rights. The huge difference is we were probably somewhere around 7th generation or higher, Americans at the time. The other difference is we had no choice in how or if we came here. This is an old ploy that has been used by every movement from women to gays. And as each group has progressed they used the backs of Blacks to lift themselves above us. Now we find ourselves being compared to people who are neither citizens or here legally. You have just proved that Blacks still haven't cleared the bar to citizenship.

» History Lessons are good Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: History Lessons are good Posted by: desidid
» RE: History Lessons are good Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: History Lessons are good Posted by: desidid
» Missed the point Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Missed the point Posted by: desidid
» RE: Missed the point Posted by: desidid
» RE: Missed the point Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Missed the point Posted by: desidid
» RE: Missed the point Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: History Lessons are good Posted by: newtype_alpha
» A common misperception ... Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: A common misperception ... Posted by: newtype_alpha
» RE: A common misperception ... Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: A common misperception ... Posted by: newtype_alpha
» RE: A common misperception ... Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: A common misperception ... Posted by: newtype_alpha
» RE: A common misperception ... Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: A common misperception ... Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: A common misperception ... Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: A common misperception ... Posted by: Joshua Holland
» It is a sad day in America Posted by: Mexitli
» RE: It is a sad day in America Posted by: Joshua Holland
» You are the illegal Posted by: Mexitli
» RE: You are the illegal Posted by: desidid
» RE: It is a sad day in America Posted by: newtype_alpha
» another liar. Posted by: Mexitli
» RE: another liar. Posted by: newtype_alpha
» Your post is pure spin Posted by: Mexitli
» RE: Your post is pure spin Posted by: newtype_alpha
» RE: Your post is pure spin Posted by: desidid
Greensboro NC Gestapo Stops
Posted by: gradioc on May 15, 2008 5:42 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I would wonder how many of the people commenting here interact with hispanic guys here legally to work on a regular basis. Well, I would, but I'm pretty sure the answer is zero. I do talk to these guys and the way local cops treat them is horrible. They get stopped walking home, walking mind you, for no reason other than their skin, and harrassed on a regular basis. "Okay, you're legal til August, but in August, YOU GO HOME! I'm looking for you, and if I see you after that, JAIL FOR YOU! COMPRENDE?" I work for a company that uses seasonal immigrant workers, here quite legally. It is shameful that they are treated as presumptive criminals.

» prove it Posted by: Mexitli
» RE: Greensboro NC Gestapo Stops Posted by: newtype_alpha
What a team!!!
Posted by: rickiey on May 15, 2008 6:35 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Corporate America, and illegal immigrants, teaming up to destroy the middle class.

» naa. Posted by: Mexitli
Democrats and Liberals need new victims and New Voters
Posted by: TheJibreelaMonsters on May 15, 2008 8:05 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Who cares if someone is breaking the law or being shipped to America like cattle. Who care if someone is working 80 hours below minimum wage. Who cares if illegals are doing jobs so called Americans wont do (they just wont do them for those prices). This is another fell good Midtown Manhattan, do nothing to solve the problem because it dose not directly affects you however someone with a High School education like myself who rely on simple "work with your hands" jobs for employment and would like to work hard to become something and I have to bite my tongue when I have to take a 8 dollar an hour job, when i could possibly get 10 or 12 dollars and hour however maybe I should of took my ass to college, because who give a flying (bleep) about a hard working American because NAFTA or the fact Mexico can't get there shit together after over around 200 years of independence!
What do you people want: victims, dependence. Who is going to look out for me? I live here in America oh but wait. I would vote republican because I have the willingness to not be a dependent, thus casting me off into the abyss .
A nation with out borders is not a nation at all, just maybe thats the goal. More Liberal Polices that do not work however dont affect the direct policy makers just hurt who they think that helps.
Thanks for nothing.

Wouldn't the proper neologism be "Jaime Crow?" N/T
Posted by: doctorsquared on May 15, 2008 11:22 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]

» lol Posted by: Mexitli
Mexitli - even though you're a racist hater (against euros)
Posted by: ptown on May 16, 2008 6:24 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
One of my best friends is in a deportation jail in Arizona. He's been here since he was 7 years old. Can you find me an educated young activist between 20 and 25 years old to marry him? He is 18 and his entire family is here...it's urgent. I would marry him myself but I'm 28 years older than him and already married (to a former illegal South African).

the "jobs americans won't do" myth--and John Dillinger
Posted by: zooeyhall on May 16, 2008 7:26 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It is wrong when the pro-illegal immigrant people keep trotting-out the usual line "they do the jobs native Americans won't do".

BULLSHIT!

I live in the rural midwest. In the 60's and 70's the local meat packing plants provided and excellent middle-class income for people around here. Paying the equivalent of $25/hour. There was a good union and full benefits. Yes, the job--as it is today--was hard dirty work. But that didn't bother farm kids who were used to such things. And they had no trouble getting people to work in the packing plants. In fact, it was tough to get into one. Unless you had a parent or relative that could get you in the door.

Usually, when I tell this to the pro-illegal alien people--they condescend me by saying something to the effect "well, dont' blame the poor illegals, blame the corporation that exploits them". To which I say that; yes John Dillinger killed people with bullets, but are you going to stop him by giving him more bullets to shoot?

As A Southerner
Posted by: Southern Gal on May 16, 2008 9:16 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
In defense of Southerners, I was born in the South and have lived in three states in the South as an adult. I find the people to be friendly, generous, congenial, and respectful of privacy. People in the South and in this country joined together to demand equal rights for all citizens from their government during the Civil Rights movement. We must join together now in demanding worker's rights, because we are in a war with the corporations against the workers. Illegal immigrants come to this country to find work. The legal workers in this country are being exploited along with the illegal workers as wages are driven lower and lower and benefits are cut. Generally when people are doing okay financially and can take care of their families they are less likely to behave with racism and violence against other groups. In a tight economy with competition for fewer jobs, the illegal part of the worker situation fuels righteous outrage and potentially violent actions.

This comment has been removed from the site due to non-compliance with AlterNet's community policies.
Sorry, this comment has been removed from the system.
A native born American.
Posted by: tatamchwh on May 16, 2008 5:38 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
My ancestors were illegal immigrants in Massachusetts in 1620. It is ironic that the former victims of Jim Crow so enthusiastically support the suppression of these newer hard-working arrivals. That shows that these former victims are not for equal rights, just for their own rights.

» RE: A native born American. Posted by: desidid
» RE: A native born American. Posted by: desidid
Joshua
Posted by: countingdaisies on May 17, 2008 9:23 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
My post to pfeifer999 and desidid was removed! There was no valid reason for you to do that or have it done. This leads me to believe I must have hit the nail on the head.

» The topic is immigration Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: The topic is immigration Posted by: countingdaisies
» RE: The topic is immigration Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: The topic is immigration Posted by: desidid
» RE: The topic is immigration Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: The topic is immigration Posted by: desidid
This comment has been removed from the site due to non-compliance with AlterNet's community policies.
» Darkhorse, see last comment above ... Posted by: Joshua Holland
rn
Posted by: mnatra on May 17, 2008 3:54 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We grow tired of these arguments.Illegal immigration is a federal govt issue. Leave the people in Georgia alone.I don't like to see Latin graffiti on our public streets. If you welcome
immigrants to our shores, will you clean up after them, like we do with our property taxes/?