Home
Archive
Newsletters
Video
Blogs
Discuss
About
Search
Donate
Advertise
Advertisement
Advertisement
Advertisement
Advertisement
Advertisement
Advertisement
  • AlterNetYour turn

Support AlterNet
Do you value the information you're getting from AlterNet? Please show your support with a tax-deductible donation.


Feedback
Tell us how we're doing.

Advertisement
Advertisement

Thirty Ways of Looking at Hillary

By Helaine Olen, AlterNet. Posted January 31, 2008.


Some heroize her. Some hate her. There's something about Hillary, but what is it?
20080131story
20080131story

Share and save this post:

      

      

Share on Facebook       

AlterNet Social Networks:
follow us on twitter
find us on Facebook

More stories by Helaine Olen

Advertisement
Upcoming AlterNet stories on Digg

Hillary Clinton elicits reactions so intense, so vehement and at times so odd it's a wonder the poor woman manages to continue performing on the political stage. She's been called everything from a doormat to a drag queen, and her public image somehow manages to encompass both the story of Chaucer's Patient Griselda and the tale of Shakespeare's Lady Macbeth. She plays a large role in the internal psychodrama of many American women, who often seem convinced that Hillary Clinton finds them personally wanting.

There's something about Hillary, but what is it? Susan Morrison, a longtime editor at the New Yorker, decided to try to get to the bottom of our obsession with the former first lady and current presidential candidate by asking 30 well-known female writers and journalists to explore their thoughts about her. The result is a compulsively readable but ultimately erratic anthology devoted to all things Hillary: Thirty Ways of Looking at Hillary: Reflections by Women Writers (Harper 2008).

Morrison's goal was worthy, but one wishes she had gone about it by, well, mixing it up a bit. The vast majority of the contributors to her book are card-carrying members of the chattering classes, with more than half residing in New York City or the immediate surrounding area. Almost all identify as feminists and Democrats. As a result, there is a lot of hand-wringing over female competitiveness and the persistence of double standards for everything from grooming to likeability for men vs. women. A few more red staters, women who don't identify as feminists, or even a male viewpoint or two might have gone a long way toward shedding light on the topic of Hillary Clinton.

That's not to say the conversation isn't sometimes enlightening. Two of the best pieces in the collection are written by lawyers, who might well have a greater understanding than most of us for the environment that molded Clinton into the person she is today. Susan Lehman's piece "Firm Hillary: How the Culture of Corporate Law Shaped Hillary," ultimately attributes her controlled and controlling public persona, at least in part, to the 15 years she spent at the Rose Law Firm in Little Rock. She makes a compelling argument about what makes Clinton tick, even if you don't agree with her ultimate conclusion that after eight years of George W. Bush, a successful corporate lawyer is just what the United States needs.

In addition, Slate's Supreme Court correspondent Dahlia Lithwick writes a compelling brief about what women do and don't like to see in other members of their sex. In her view, Hillary Clinton reminds us of "someone shrill and judgmental" like a know-it-all neighbor. The genius of the piece lies in Lithwick's refusal to let either herself or us off the hook for feeling that way, arguing we are unlikely to elect any American female politician to the top job until we learn to "judge female candidates less brutally."

Nonetheless, a number of the essays in Morrison's anthology are intensely self-involved, more about the authors' reactions to Hillary Clinton than Hillary Clinton herself. There's little examination of Clinton's political skills or her record in the Senate. Despite what some of the essayists in this anthology think, the personal is not always political. Our need for action on problems ranging from healthcare reform to ending the war in Iraq go way beyond what these writers think of Hillary Clinton's -- or any other candidate's -- various haircuts or personal life. And whether one is pro-Hillary, anti-Hillary or an agnostic on Hillary, that's a sentiment all voters should share.

AlterNet sat down with Morrison in her New York office to see what insight she could offer into our fascination with Hillary Clinton, why she chose to approach her subject in the way she did and how she plans to vote in her state's primary on Feb. 5.

Helaine Olen: Why did you decide to edit an anthology on Hillary Clinton?

Susan Morrison: She clearly pushed different kinds of buttons than other politicians pushed. When people are talking about her, they were, more often than not, not talking about policy and ideas. They were talking about kind of strange, personal, emotional reactions. We have different expectations of her just because she's a woman. That's the jumping off point for the essays in this book.


Digg!    Share on facebook   submit to reddit    Bookmark on Delicious   Stumble This  

See more stories tagged with: hillary, election08, hillary clinton, hillary rodham clinton, women politicians, female politicians, women in power, thirty ways of looking at

Helaine Olen is a freelance writer whose work has appeared in the New York Times, the Los Angeles Times, the Wall Street Journal, Salon.com and numerous other publications. Her book, co-written with Stephanie Losee, Office Mate: The Employee Handbook for Finding -- and Managing -- Romance on the Job, was published in 2007. Her Web site in progress is www.helaineolen.com.

Liked this story? Get top stories in your inbox each week from AlterNet! Sign up now »

Advertisement
Advertisement

 

Comments Turn comments off sitewide Give us feedback »
Comments closed.
The comments for this story have been closed. Thank you to everyone who participated.
View:
Give it up.
Posted by: magus65 on Jan 31, 2008 12:24 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Hillary cannot win. She is hated, and rightfully so by men and women alike. She is a republican in sheepskin clothing. A corporate shill that will continue to screw the working (productive) people just as she did at Walmart.

She will lie to you just like she did when affecting a horribly fake accent because she thinks you are stupid.

She will walk blindly like a drunken idiot into nuclear war with Iran.

Her idea of change is YOU with no rights at all.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: She can't Give up all of her baggage. Posted by: left_libertarian
» RE: Give it up. Posted by: peacelover
» RE: Give it up. Posted by: Benson986
Her presidency would not be pretty
Posted by: vox persona on Jan 31, 2008 12:44 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
All that Goldwater gal has to do is just get in there, and we're back again to politics as usual. Remember the 90's? The Chinese connections, Marc Rich pardon, more 'gates' (Whitewater-gate, Travel-gate, FBI file-gate, et al ad nauseum) than I care to remember. There are no decent choices this year. Are there ever? Is this the best we can put up there, or does our very system negate having the good people run that we need? The process is ugly, and only a major egotist would even venture into that cesspool voluntarily. Statesmanship and bipartisanship has been replaced with petty party politics and career politicians. What happened to the citizen public servants our founders envisioned? Oh, yeah, that was probably as big a myth as life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. It's now government of the people, by the corporation, and for the corporation.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» Remember the 90's? Posted by: Nebris
» RE: emember the 90's? Posted by: dsmidiman
» RE: emember the 90's? Posted by: Bibsi
Fixation on Citizen Hillary is Pointless
Posted by: LookOut on Jan 31, 2008 2:13 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Most of what people think of her as a pop political celeb is equally meaningless.

The woman (and her slick Willie) is a transparent self-serve stooge for a global corporate crime syndicate that runs Washington / MSM like a private piggy bank.

There hasn't been a real "leader" at the oval office since JFK was cut down by the same corporate Mafia that owns BushCo, Clintons and sordid circus performers at Washington.

Until sheep on the ground realize this they will remain sheep and the wolves will have their way...

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Wake up, you schmucks!!
Posted by: Nebris on Jan 31, 2008 2:17 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Remember the whole "Bush and Gore are just the same" meme from 2000? Any of you stupid or willful enough to still believe that anymore?

I thought not.....

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: No Gore Posted by: Andie927
» RE: No Gore Posted by: Timba
» pull yer head outta yer @ss! Posted by: KaptainSpiffy
» RE: No Gore Posted by: omatravel
» RE: No Gore Posted by: 2dogarage
» RE: No Gore Posted by: omatravel
» RE: No Gore Posted by: Bibsi
It's not about the person
Posted by: profmarcus on Jan 31, 2008 3:15 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
if we were just considering hillary as a person, i would have a completely different opinion, but, sadly, we're not... when we choose hillary, we are required to choose the entire package, including mark penn and her entire stable of noxious national security and foreign policy advisors, a gang who amply demonstrate that not a goddam thing is going to change under a hillary presidency... (of course, the unfortunate fact is that all the other candidates, both dem and r, have equally noxious advisors...) would i love to see a woman president...? absolutely... but hillary is not the one... would i love to see a black president... no question, but i think that barack may be just as co-opted as hillary... where's the REAL change...? where are our best and brightest...? who is going to return our constitution to we, the people...? who is even going to TALK about doing it...? we're in deep, deep doo-doo, folks...

And, yes, I DO take it personally

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: It's not about the person Posted by: CoatesMoe
» RE: It's not about the person Posted by: Raina Dale
» RE: It's not about the person Posted by: cmaciain
Fun book idea
Posted by: kepstein7777 on Jan 31, 2008 3:54 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The picking apart of Hillary has been an interesting reflection on our culture, and what different people's personal demons are. If I see this book in the library, I might consider flipping through it.

The author's point about likability is a good one. From my experience, I've found that sometimes the most boring people are the ones who come through and get the job done. Plus, likability and a teflon personality can be dangerous in a leader, as we all know. I'm not saying that's all true in Hillary's case, but...

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

I am fully aware that many of the so called progressives at this site are stealth trolls that
Posted by: johngary66 on Jan 31, 2008 4:08 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
will continue smearing one or both of the two remaining candidates. Would the grown ups now step forward and work to make sure we do not have another four years of rethugs running the government? Anyone who thinks that whoever the rethug candidate is will be better than Clinton or Obama is just plain blind and stupid. There is of course a great deal of difference. The trolls are already trying to split the democrats and there is no need to help them. I would have loved to see John Edwards as the next president, but that isn't going to happen. Now I would like to see him continue to serve in a democratic administration where he could continue the good fight for us. Chris Dodd has stepped forward as have other good progressives. They can still work for us if we elect a democratic president. That won't happen if progressives can't even get behind the nominee. How can a third party ever succeed when even the progressives can't agree on anything. We have to close ranks so that we know who the trolls are and who is with us all the way to the election. That means not smearing either of the remaining candidates.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Typical Dem.Party Sheepel Posted by: Andie927
» RE: Typical Dem.Party Sheepel Posted by: nochicagoboys
I liked this peice.
Posted by: Raina Dale on Jan 31, 2008 5:16 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am an Obama supporter. But I really liked this peice. As a woman, and a graduate of Mills, a woman's college, I have found this primary season very interesting. I think it is good for our nation to look at the issue of the differing expectations of a woman canidate. A thought provoking article, and one I would like to share with other voters, esp. women.

That said, I feel that Obama is in a league of his own, both in terms of sound policies, and personal wisdom. Yes, I agree with Alternet journalist that issues ought to weigh heavier than personality for voters. I agree with Obama on most major issues, and he also has gained my unwavering trust and respect as a human being. His speeches are inspiring, and his website (www.barackobama.com)provides all the substance and specifics any voter could dream of.

A thousand books sympathetic to Hillary wouldn't even come close to moving me. Obama has won my head and my heart. He is the President America needs.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Party Propaganda Posted by: Andie927
» RE: Party Propaganda Posted by: omatravel
» RE: Party Propaganda Posted by: CatDad
» RE: Party Propaganda Posted by: Fencerider
» RE: I liked this peice. Posted by: 2dogarage
» RE: I liked this peice. Posted by: 2dogarage
» RE: I liked this peice. Posted by: babs
» RE: I liked this peice. Posted by: Bibsi
» RE: I liked this peice. [sic] Posted by: nochicagoboys
» RE: I liked this peice. [sic] Posted by: nochicagoboys
» RE: I liked this peice. [sic] Posted by: foreverhope
redhawk
Posted by: redhawk on Jan 31, 2008 5:41 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Well since on average we have 30 days per month, hate Shillery or love Shillery .. If you do not like her position to day, stick around as she'll change them at least a dozen times by the end of the month... same with her currently "leashed" Lovey dovey Consort... He'll blow up again, so strong is his Wish to return to the Practices of his while at the WH... Remember that DC hasa 4-2 ratio of women to men....

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: redhawk Posted by: Timba
JT Barrie
Posted by: rimchamp77 on Jan 31, 2008 5:43 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It has been said that it is better to vote for what you want and fail - than to vote for what you don't want and succeed. Hillary does not stand up for my most important issues: government intervention in the lives of our citizen taxpayers and citizen taxpayers abroad. She doesn't get "shrill" about suspension of habeas corpus or the scam that masquerades as the War on Drugs. She voted to authorize violence in Iraq and she will continue our presence in Afghanistan indefinitely as McCain will in Iraq. If an incident should arise [or be concocted] she will authorize violence against Iran. She has no backbone on issues I care most about. Why should I waste my vote for a lesser evil?

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: JT Barrie Posted by: Bibsi
» RE: JT Barrie Posted by: nochicagoboys
Terrorist
Posted by: HeKnew on Jan 31, 2008 6:06 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Thirty-one...she's a stealth moderate Republican.

Government of the people, by the people and for the people.

Direct Democracy

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

let's not over-analyze it
Posted by: zooeyhall on Jan 31, 2008 6:47 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Let's not over-analyze why people "hate Hillary". Don't try to make flimsy connections with anti-feminisim, misogyny, blah blah.

The simple truth is that most people who are opposed to her--on the Progressive side of the fence--know that she is a corporate shill, a "Republicrat": in cahoots with Walmart, a booster for the Iraq war, a "compassionate conservative". She is a proponent of the brutal free trade and ruthless globalization endorsed and supported by her hubby when he was pres. She is nothing but Reagan with ovaries.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

I'LL READ THIS ARTICLE WHEN
Posted by: VZEQICVA on Jan 31, 2008 6:57 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
a comparable article about Obama & other candidates appears. The analysis and all out attack on Hillary Clinton is unprecendented. But that's not my only reason. I still haven't decided who will get my vote in the primaries and I don't know much about Obama. It would help me decide if we were to closely examine him and his past, for informational purposes only. It's only fair that a presidential hopeful be closely scrutinized. Haven't we learned? Thanks, ANNA

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» What? Ruin the illusion? Posted by: anothername
» RE: I'LL READ THIS ARTICLE WHEN Posted by: left_libertarian
Limit Two Terms for USA Presidents
Posted by: jackbauer2 on Jan 31, 2008 6:57 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If Senator Clinton is elected President
both Bill Clinton and George Bush will
have a third term as president.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Issues and Positions
Posted by: Southern Gal on Jan 31, 2008 7:39 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am looking at Hillary's and Obama's positions on issues as shared on their campaign websites. It would be helpful to have some knowledgable progressive experts look at these positions and share their opinions on whether these ideas would work or not. It seems that with Alternet's vast participatory readers and with Alternet's access to various experts we could get some substantial assistance in looking at these candidates in depth.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Issues and Positions Posted by: VZEQICVA
Who is a Real Democrat
Posted by: Peacekeeper on Jan 31, 2008 7:50 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I thought the Idea that Democrats should work together, is Gteat Idea but How Can we trust any of them to do the right thing. The problem is, we don't know what the Democratic party means, when they talk about Change. the Democrats need to lay it out for us, in a way that a 6 year old will understand. Its OK to tell us what they really think. then let the Candidates get behind the platform. We have had so many lies, for so many years.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Who is a Real Democrat Posted by: NoPCZone
» RE: mick3 Posted by: ejcleath
It's simple math
Posted by: zeitgeist1979 on Jan 31, 2008 8:33 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If Hillary gets the Dem nomination, we will have President McCain next year. The only people that actually support Hillary is the Democratic Establishment. The rest: real progressives, independents, and even some Republicans, will vote against her.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» Diebold knows the math the best Posted by: fifthworld
» RE: It's simple math Posted by: Bibsi
The Idiots Will get What They Deserve: A Calculated Cold Power Hungry Couple
Posted by: aamer923 on Jan 31, 2008 8:52 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Dem establishment likes her or will be bullied to support her. Many idiots would vote for her just because she is a women. Character, Honesty, Morality, truthfulness, dedication to one's nation all do not seem to matter as much as loyalty, partisanship, gender. How stupid are we. In the end we will get what we deserve.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

skysage
Posted by: Skysage on Jan 31, 2008 8:57 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
According to a well known astrologer, Hillary has the chart of a dictator more ruthless than the average person could ever realize. If she gains the White House, it will be a terrible day for our country. It is power, position and control that she wants. If she gains it, she will be the most arrogant president we have ever had. If we wake up to who she and Bill really are we could make a better choice in someone more humane and who cares more for our country and our people, rather than choosing two people who are self-adoring egomaniacs.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» And Obama wants what? Posted by: anothername
» RE: skysage Posted by: cmaciain
» RE: skysage Posted by: Bibsi
From one who hates her... (and still doesn't trust Obama honestly)
Posted by: fifthworld on Jan 31, 2008 9:14 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"There's something about Hillary" -- how banal! I'll tell you what it is, if we need an answer here. I've never known a public woman figure so shrill, insincere, manipulative, and untrustworthy with the common good. For that matter, isn't it enough to know that she sits on the board of Walmart? What does that say? While they squash union organizing, what has she done???

This stuffed shirt gives "ice queen" a bad name. 'Fugghetaboutit'!

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Since when is a spouse a co-employee...
Posted by: heraldmage on Jan 31, 2008 9:21 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
and entitled to all the accomplishments and experiences of thier husband or wife? Does this mean that the spouse of a doctor, lawyer, fireman, policeman is qualified by virtue of marriage to employment in their spouses field?

Why hasn't the corporate news or other candidated questioned her claim of 35 years of public service? First Lady is not an official position it's just a classification given for the spouse of the president or governor by the media.

Could it be that the rich and corporate America are looking for a return on their multi-million $ investment in the Clinton therefore this mispresentation of the facts is being ignored?

Actually, the more experience candidate is Obama not Clinton who has been employed as a public servant for only ~8 years(1 1/2 terms as Senator from NY)

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

I Have A Doctoral Degree in Clinton
Posted by: NoPCZone on Jan 31, 2008 9:32 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am a 46 year old living in Arkansas. Bill and Hillary Clinton have been screwing things up since I was in High School. I have met both, in person, a number of times. I do not trust either of them any farther than I could throw my car.

I'll spare you the litany, but would advise you to look elsewhere.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

So, here it is, huh?
Posted by: willymack on Jan 31, 2008 9:42 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Lots of negative stuff on Ms. Clinton. You've got to ask yourself how much of it is nothing but gas and how much is pure karl rove. Subtract these from the equation and maybe you'll have the TRUTH, maybe not. One thing for certain is that the neocrooks are trying mightily to discredit Clinton, now and they haven't even started on Obama, yet. This says something about Clinton, and I think that something is that she's considered the more formidable opponent at present. Compare her to the eventual "winner" of the rethug dogfight. Do you dislike her so much that you'd vote for one of the vainglorious fools, hoping to ape bush without mentionong him? Oh, yeah; that'd show her, all right!

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: So, here it is, huh? Posted by: heraldmage
» RE: So, here it is, huh? Posted by: left_libertarian
the Clintons
Posted by: laurababy0105 on Jan 31, 2008 9:49 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Well, would she be any different than BUSH? NO. I watched a documentary last night titled America Freedom to Fascism, and the Clintons were wire tapping phones long before 9/11. If I remember right, Bill Clintons Speech reflected the words, "Welcome to the New World Order". What makes ANYONE think, that the puppet master Hillary is any different?

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: the Clintons Posted by: nochicagoboys
Tine to quit focusing on President and focus on Congress
Posted by: Rod on Jan 31, 2008 10:55 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The presidents power is very limited if we vote in a congress that is progressive and willing to use it. Time to see some articles on who is running in the states for senate and house, and who is progressive/independent. Then we need to work for those candidates. We will not get in someone progressive as president, that battle is lost.

Realistically if a veto needs to be overridden and the democrats do not have a clear majority then they have to compromise with these independents. There is the start of a solution.

Same for governors of states. They are usually the crop for future presidents. They may not make it to president because of the media attention, right Gov. Dean, but they have considerable power.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

No matter how one views Hillary -
Posted by: symcokid on Jan 31, 2008 11:17 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
her live in would still be calling the shots. Bill did his eight years and doesn't deserve another eight to corrupt the minds of elementary school age children. This is in reference to declaring, "I did not have sex with that woman". He tried to redefine what sex is by declaring fellatio not to be a sex act. The guy is sick in a sense and screwed up a lot of young minds.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

bitch English teacher
Posted by: zooeyhall on Jan 31, 2008 12:53 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I think I know what makes me dislike Hillary Clinton. She reminds me of that bitch English teacher I had in high school.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: bitch English teacher Posted by: VZEQICVA
» RE: bitch English teacher Posted by: Bibsi
30 ways of looking at Hillary
Posted by: manor-tom on Jan 31, 2008 2:58 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am not an American citizen, so I have no voting rights. Nevertheless non-Americans are also closely watching the current primaries, because whoever makes it to the White House is going to effect everyone on the globe. I am inclined to agree with the views of the first contributor in these columns. Its just a guts feeling, but I do not trust the lady. She is for "CHANGE" but I have a distinct feeling that she means CHANGING HER OWN MIND WHEN EVER THAT SUITS HER.
What are her views on IRAQ ? Is she going to end the occupation of that country AT SHORT NOTICE (!!) AND NOT JUST PULL OUT A HANDFUL OF TROOPS WHICH IS JUST MEANINGLESS ?

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

verycold
Posted by: verycold on Jan 31, 2008 4:43 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am a republican and would never vote for Hillary because she doesn't match up well with me. Still, I have written many comments in support of her because I think as a woman she is treated differently. In some ways, she did that to herself by relying on Bill to help out. She needed to do this campaign thing on her own with him helping out behind the scenes. So I would ask her first why make Bill a big presence in your campaign? This woman was used by this man for so many years. I guess "stand by her man" is her motto but it wouldn't be mine no matter what was in it for me. For a moment during her campaign when she said she found her voice, I was hopeful she had actually stepped out on that stage by herself for the first time. But alas, old habits are hard to break. I think she only knows how to be like an attack dog because if she bites first she might not get bitten herself. As a woman, I never judge another woman by their looks. I have never really looked at Hillary because the outside package doesn't matter at all to me. I don't care if a candidate is black, white, tall, short, in a wheelchair, missing a leg, fat, thin, none of those physical characteristics matter at all. I can even forgive campaign blunders if I think the candidate learned from the mistake. I give the benefit of the doubt to all that campaigning is extremely tiring and often candidates are just not at their best on every single day.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Two Reasons I Won't Vote For Her
Posted by: left_libertarian on Jan 31, 2008 7:45 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
1 - She voted for the Iraq War Resolution

2 - She voted for the Patriot Act


A one two slap to truth and liberty.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Two Reasons I Won't Vote For Her Posted by: left_libertarian
I wish Hillary was on our side...
Posted by: BobS on Jan 31, 2008 8:13 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Hillary Clinton gets a lot of criticism for being hard driving, calculating, politically ruthless and focused on winning at all costs.

I don't have a problem with any of those characteristics in a political leader. I don't vote for people based on whether "I want to have a beer with them."

In fact working class people could a tough President who has been battle-tested by years of savage attacks from all sides.

The trouble with Hillary Clinton is that she's not on our side.... she's on the side of wealthy corporate power.

The BobboSphere

Bob Simpson

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: I wish Hillary was on our side... Posted by: nochicagoboys
Yank-Kiwi
Posted by: Yank-Kiwi on Jan 31, 2008 10:28 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Hillary reminds me a lot of Helen -- the prime minister of New Zealand, another New Age woman and another who'll never run out of pant-suits. Both seem to take great pride in being more ruthless than men in clawing their way to the top, then have it both ways by turning on the tears to get their own way. When Helen was attacked the tears started flowing until one of her loyal male minions came to her rescue. Within weeks he was fired from her cabinet for an accusation that was never proven or even charged, from a young woman. But with John Edwards gone and Obama only offering Hillary lite where's the choice?

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Hillary reality check
Posted by: Col. Jackleg on Jan 31, 2008 11:24 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
She has done nothing in the Senate to inspire confidence that she is anything but a lackey. If you want Bush-lite, she's the pick. Worse than that, this nation does not need a co-president and the role Bill Clinton would play is a menace that is unthinkable. The dark side of his presidency is emerging daily and his ties to some of the world's biggest scumbags can only breed concern about him and his ability to lead his "wife" in a presidency that would grimly resemble his.

This nation needs hope and healing, an updated New Deal if you please and that requires someone with the ability to unify and uplift a troubled populace. Hillary can only divide and bring more acrimony and hatred than we have experienced during the Clinton and Bush years. Its time for it to end and Obama is now the only realistic option available to us.

Some time ago, it was reported that Hillary had struck a deal with Harry Reid and the Dems in the Senate that called for Reid to retire in 2009 and Hillary to replace hime as majority leader. The idea was to give her time to develop her personal leadership skills and demonstrate her ability to promote bi-partisan relations in the now utterly fractious Senate. That development would have provided her with much better public approval and a run for the presidency in 2012 would be more solidly-based. BUT....along came Bill, alot of special interests money and the nomination acrimony that only desperation can produce. She was misled and she will never be elected president in 2008. She couldn't be more wrong in her choice to run and she is utterly wrong for America. We can do better and we should.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Hillary reality check Posted by: Bibsi
» RE: Hillary reality check Posted by: left_libertarian
Corruption
Posted by: rjs on Jan 31, 2008 11:32 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"Some heroize her. Some hate her. There's something about Hillary, but what is it?"


I call it corruption. Bill was impeached, their family a disgrace and embarrassment to the highest office in the United States. What do they do?, They keep going. Bill won't stay out of his wifes microphone, he won't sit down or go away. Hillary has no business being in the white house at all anyhow. Just because her impeached husband was there doesn't make it open game for her.

It would be nice if after totally embarrassing our country globally, if our class clowns would just evaporate after their terms. But no, we get to see them over and over and over and over like a bad dream. They just won't go away.

Then we thought the country couldn't be embarrassed any worse and we end up with King George the dictator.

If all the world is a stage... We certainly have had our share of bad actors starting with Reagan. It's been lunacy is what it is and it's time for the United States to reclaim our faded and tarnished reputation.

A 20 year old smart college kid could run our highest office better than we have had and seen with the last two presidents. They just don't understand that the globalists concept will never work nor ever happen. No matter how hard they work to destroy the Constitution.

None of the Dems did anything to bring the troops home or impeach the criminals in the White House, Oh no, they joined them.

We are guaranteed to have a criminal supporter in the White House in 2008 if America doesn't wise up to what is really going on.

Vote Ron Paul, he certainly isn't the savior, but he isn't a globalist wanting to destroy the American Constitution either. You won't ever hear Ron Paul say that the basis for all law in the US is "Just a god damn piece of paper".

--rjs

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

The Natal Chart of Hillary confirms
Posted by: Candleinheart on Feb 1, 2008 7:43 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
everything that is spoken of her. I am a professional astrologer of 45 years and published. Hillary is a Scorpio with Mercury Retrograd(mind) in Scorpio, and her Venus(affections, love, money) also in Scorpio. In a nutshell positive traits: motivated, executive, resourceful, determined, investigative, intense.
Negative traits: vengeful,secretive,sarcastc,intolerant. She has a Pisces Moon. caring, empathetic, deep, intuitive, good listener etc. Embodies all the qualities of the feminine. Her moon in the career house. Someone who comes before the public.(FDR's moon in tenth). I do believe if elected she certainly would champion more the concerns of women, children, community, the elderly, homeless etc. (Yes! She would!) her intelligence comes from the sign Gemini (duel sign) rising giving the duality people see. Gemini's are great writers, speakers, teachers, debators. She has several Leo placements: There is great strength with Leo energy, organizers, powerful. These fall in her department of communications. Her Jupiter in high- minded philosophical Sagittarius. (FDR was a very complex person, he was many things to many people), yet look at what he accomplished! With a Scorpio you never understand their depths.Engimatic. Hence the public's confusion as to who is the real Hillary? Do we ever truly know ourselves completely? Psychology 101: What we say of another is hidden 'stuff' in ourselves we don't see or deny. Her Saturn cycle is right where FDR'S was when he was elected Governor of NY. His political climb just beginning after adjusting to Polio. Her progressed Sun in Capricorn....perfect for government work. A dictator? Well, take a look at Obama's chart . Could be a second Hitler or Mussolini!! or a great leader. While all speak negatively of Bill, he's a saint compared to the two we've had in office these almost 8 years.!! I heard someone speak (had doctorete) on Hillary,stated one on one she is wonderful, her public image nothing like her private image. Those who know her personally like her very much. With Scorpio's you really like them or you dislike them. No in between. Is there one person on these boards that doesn't have a bundle of 'stuff' in their closeted past? My mother used to say: Words are cheap. No one knows how they'll be in the presidency. Either one would be good. How will they use their power?Wisely? Few do. Both call for change. Obama more inspirational, visionary. Hillary in the sense that a woman's mind sees things differently. Perhaps we just would see a change from past tactics. The Empress of Russia certainly healed her nation in ways a man never would have. Whoever wins I surely hope they give dennis kucinich his Cabinet For peace, and John Edwards a top post. Too GOOD people along with Gravel. They walk their talk.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: The Natal Chart of Hillary confirms Posted by: left_libertarian
IndependentVoter
Posted by: IndependentVoter on Feb 1, 2008 9:52 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I voted for Senator Clinton in her 2000 campaign, I have not nor will I ever vote for her again. I am a construction worker, she stands for Illegal alien workers. I believe in freedom of speech, she wants an amendmest to the constitution banning flag burning. She wants to change the rules to the game when they don't work for her. She is an articulate version of George Bush; whom I dispise with an intensity that defies words. All of the points I have listed are Bush's Positons, that should tell you enough about her.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

CARPET BAGGER
Posted by: willyd on Feb 1, 2008 12:11 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
She is willing to do anything to get elected. The best way to view hil. is falling from a plane

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Presidential Candidates and the People; Politics is Personal
Posted by: Betsy L. Angert on Feb 1, 2008 1:08 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Dearest Helaine Olen . . .

As I read and enjoyed your introduction to the interview, I marveled at moments. Then, suddenly, I was taken aback by a thought you expressed. "Despite what some of the essayists in this anthology think, the personal is not always political." I continued to peruse; however, distracted by this premise. For me, the contrary was evident throughout the thread.

Might I offer; people do not know, they forget, or choose not to acknowledge that all that enters our sphere of knowledge comes in through the amygdala, the “emotional sentinel.” In humans, amydgalas are the “seat of all passion.” They have a hold on us. We interpret the world through this almond shaped cluster of interconnections.

After individuals internalize information, we rationalize, justify, and intellectualize. The amygdala guards our world; and thus, people are on guard. In large part, we see what we do in political campaigns for we are not physically able to disconnect ourselves from our emotions.

While I have much to say about Senator Clinton and her stance on the issues, separate from who she seems to be as a person, I invite you to consider various scenarios offered in . . .
Presidential Candidates and the People; Politics is Personal

Please share your insights. I welcome any thoughts you might have. I love to learn. You may recall, you are among my mentors.

Betsy L. Angert
BeThink.org

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

There's something about Hillary--what is it?
Posted by: Longdream on Feb 1, 2008 9:03 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Big Brass Ones.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

FOR GOD'S SAKE, YOU PEOPLE!!
Posted by: Longdream on Feb 2, 2008 5:02 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What is it with you?

It's Hillary Clinton. You may not like her or agree with her or some of the things she's done. I know I sometimes don't, and she's not my first pick. But if she's the Democratic candidate in this election, I'm not only going to vote for her, I'm going to work for her. And I'm going to hitch myself to the hem of her jacket as the only lifeline that will get us out of hell.

For the detractors in here, who haven't got much in the way of facts to go on, outrageous hate-speech seems to do you in place of any rational alternative.

Ruthless you want to call her? Try the worthless fucks who outed Valerie Plame.

Corruption? Where's the 8 or 10 Billion missing from the war funds? Where's the internal investigation? Why do we pass a budget without the cost of the war in it? What's the total value of the no-bid contracts to Halliburton facilitated by Dick Cheney? How much value did the American people and the people of Iraq receive for the money? How did Halliburton avoid being investigated?

She's done nothing in the Senate? Can you even read? If you can, ever read Fred Thompson's record?

Bush-Lite? Wouldn't that be more like Huckabee, who's smarter, more genuinely religious, and dedicated to improving the Constitution for our own good?

This discussion, and a lot more like it I've seen, defies comparison. It's like kids in a schoolyard feeding each other's aggression to make themselves whole, or better yet, a bunch of wrong-ways trying to shoot their asses off with a 12-gauge, and succeeding.

Figure out who the enemy is. It's not Hillary.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: FOR GOD'S SAKE, YOU PEOPLE!! Posted by: left_libertarian
» RE: FOR GOD'S SAKE, YOU PEOPLE!! Posted by: nochicagoboys
» RE: FOR GOD'S SAKE, YOU PEOPLE!! Posted by: nochicagoboys
» RE: FOR GOD'S SAKE, YOU PEOPLE!! Posted by: left_libertarian
» RE: FOR GOD'S SAKE, YOU PEOPLE!! Posted by: left_libertarian
» RE: FOR GOD'S SAKE, YOU PEOPLE!! Posted by: left_libertarian
OBAMA ARGUES WITH HIMSELF
Posted by: bbfmail on Feb 2, 2008 12:05 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
WASHINGTON TIMES - Barack Obama, the senatorial candidate of 2004, might have a bone to pick with Barack Obama, the presidential candidate of 2008. Videotapes of debates and speeches that were obtained by The Washington Times show that Mr. Obama took positions during his Senate campaign on nearly a half-dozen issues ranging from the Cuba embargo to health care for illegal aliens that conflict with statements that he has made during his run for the White House.

For example, in MSNBC's Oct. 30 presidential debate, Mr. Obama hesitantly raised his hand and joined with most of his Democratic rivals to declare he opposed decriminalizing marijuana.
But as a U.S. Senate candidate, Mr. Obama told Illinois college students in January 2004 he supported eliminating criminal penalties for marijuana use or possession, a debate video shows. "I think we need to rethink and decriminalize our marijuana laws," Mr. Obama said during a debate at Northwestern University. "But I'm not somebody who believes in legalization of marijuana

When confronted with the statements on the video, Obama's campaign offered two explanations to The Times in less than 24 hours. At first, Obama spokesman Tommy Vietor said the candidate had "always" supported decriminalizing marijuana, suggesting that his 2004 statement was correct. Then after The Times posted copies of the video on its Web site, his campaign reversed course and declared he does not support eliminating criminal penalties for marijuana possession and use.
The spokesman blamed confusion over the meaning of decriminalization for the conflicting answers.

Mr. Obama's differing answers on marijuana are among five conflicts between positions he took while running for Senate in 2004 and those he now articulates while running for president, a review of debate tapes shows. Experts said the likely reason for the changes was that Mr. Obama ran as a liberal during his Senate run but has become more centrist as he pursues the broad coalition required to win the White House. . .
The position changes include:

- In a 2003 forum on health care, Mr. Obama said he supported the children of illegal aliens' receiving the same benefits as citizens, "whether it's medical, whether it's in-state tuition." Asked specifically whether he included "undocumented" people, Mr. Obama replied, "Absolutely." But in a CNN debate Jan. 21, when Mr. Obama was asked whether his health care proposal covers illegal aliens, he said "no" and that he first wants to cover the U.S. citizens and legal residents without health care.

- In 2004, Mr. Obama told an audience at Southern Illinois University, "I think it's time for us to end the embargo with Cuba. . . It's time for us to acknowledge that that particular policy has failed." However, he stopped short of calling for an end to the embargo in a Miami Herald op-ed in August. He said he would rely on diplomacy, with a message that if a post-Fidel Castro government made democratic changes, the U.S. "is prepared to take steps to normalize relations and ease the embargo."

- In an October 2003 NAACP debate, Mr. Obama said he would "vote to abolish" mandatory minimum sentences. "The mandatory minimums take too much discretion away from judges," he said. Mr. Obama now says on his web site that he would "immediately review sentences to see where we can be smarter on crime and reduce the ineffective warehousing of nonviolent drug offenders."
- Mr. Obama told an AFL-CIO group in June 2003: "I happen to be a proponent of a single-payer, universal health care plan." But in a recent debate he said he has never endorsed such a plan. "Senator Obama has always said that single-payer universal care is a good idea because it would increase efficiency in the system, but the problem is that it's not achievable," Mr. Vietor said.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Don't Underestimate Hil the Shill
Posted by: macdon1 on Feb 2, 2008 4:17 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I agree with those who view Mrs. Clinton as a corporate shill. She is definitely one of THEM and not one of US. However, she is an exceptionally intelligent woman, which makes her decision to go over to the dark side even more unconscionable. It also makes her a dangerous force for more of the same vile policies as Bush Inc.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Don't Underestimate Hil the Shill Posted by: nochicagoboys
Thank you!
Posted by: schnak on Feb 3, 2008 1:10 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
For this comment. The Hillary bashing is out of control on this site. You people really do act like Hillary is another Bush and you're insane! All one has to do is take a good look at all that she's done for the state of New York as Senator - she's far more progressive and effective than she gets credit for. She's just made a couple of mistakes in Congress. All of these vitrolic comments confirm exactly what the author is trying to say in this article.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Thank you! Posted by: left_libertarian
» RE: Thank you! Posted by: Bibsi
» RE: Thank you! Posted by: nochicagoboys
» RE: Thank you! Posted by: left_libertarian
» RE: Thank you! Posted by: left_libertarian
CARPET BAGGER #2
Posted by: willyd1962 on Feb 4, 2008 2:33 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
She was the presidents wife, ( i guess we should elect our politicians based on who they are married to now) couldnt get elected in her home state so she had to go to NY so her ultra left wingnut ideas would pass the mustard with the yanks. She would move to siberia if they would elect her dog catcher.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: CARPET LINT IS SMARTER Posted by: Longdream
» RE: CARPET LINT IS SMARTER Posted by: nochicagoboys
» RE: CARPET LINT IS SMARTER Posted by: Longdream
» RE: CARPET LINT IS SMARTER Posted by: nochicagoboys
» RE: CARPET LINT IS SMARTER Posted by: Longdream
» RE: CARPET LINT IS SMARTER Posted by: nochicagoboys
» RE: CARPET LINT IS SMARTER Posted by: Longdream
» RE: CARPET LINT IS SMARTER Posted by: willyd1962
» RE: CARPET LINT IS SMARTER Posted by: Longdream
I See A Clinton - Bibsi Ticket!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted by: left_libertarian on Feb 7, 2008 8:34 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Clinton can keep the Iraq war going and her VP Bibsi can feed us the excuses for why it must continue.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Hillary
Posted by: Gail Kerr on Feb 14, 2008 12:54 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I think that is one of the worst articles and aptly represents why women are still disrespected, thought of as a second class citizen, and still should not have the right to vote...because of a lack of substance!!! I have tried all my life to get fellow women to respect each other regardless of looks or station in life..this article explains why that is still a failure....

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]