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Creeping Fascism: From Nazi Germany to Post 9/11 America

By Ray McGovern, Consortium News. Posted December 29, 2007.


Americans today are seeing the same sheepish submissiveness that characterized Germany after the burning of the Reichstag.

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"There are few things as odd as the calm, superior indifference with which I and those like me watched the beginnings of the Nazi revolution in Germany, as if from a box at the theater ... Perhaps the only comparably odd thing is the way that now, years later ..."

These are the words of Sebastian Haffner (pen name for Raimund Pretzel), who as a young lawyer in Berlin during the 1930s experienced the Nazi takeover and wrote a firsthand account. His children found the manuscript when he died in 1999 and published it the following year as "Geschichte eines Deutschen" (The Story of a German). The book became an immediate bestseller and has been translated into 20 languages -- in English as "Defying Hitler."

I recently learned from his daughter Sarah, an artist in Berlin, that yesterday was the 100th anniversary of Haffner's birth. She had seen an earlier article in which I quoted her father and emailed to ask me to "write some more about the book and the comparison to Bush's America ... this is almost unbelievable."

More about Haffner below. Let's set the stage first by recapping some of what has been going on that may have resonance for readers familiar with the Nazi ascendancy, noting how "odd" it is that the frontal attack on our Constitutional rights is met with such "calm, superior indifference."

Goebbels would be proud

It has been two years since top New York Times officials decided to let the rest of us in on the fact that the George W. Bush administration had been eavesdropping on American citizens without the court warrants required by the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) of 1978. The Times had learned of this well before the election in 2004 and acquiesced to White House entreaties to suppress the damaging information.

In late fall 2005 when Times correspondent James Risen's book "State of War: the Secret History of the CIA and the Bush Administration," revealing the warrantless eavesdropping, was being printed, Times publisher Arthur Sulzberger Jr. recognized that he could procrastinate no longer. It would simply be too embarrassing to have Risen's book on the street, with Sulzberger and his associates pretending that this explosive eavesdropping story did not fit Adolph Ochs' trademark criterion: All The News That's Fit To Print. (The Times' own ombudsman, Public Editor Byron Calame, branded the newspaper's explanation for the long delay in publishing this story "woefully inadequate.")

When Sulzberger told his friends in the White House that he could no longer hold off on publishing in the newspaper, he was summoned to the Oval Office for a counseling session with the president on Dec. 5, 2005. Bush tried in vain to talk him out of putting the story in the Times. The truth would out; part of it, at least.

Glitches

There were some embarrassing glitches. For example, unfortunately for National Security Agency Director Lt. Gen. Keith Alexander, the White House neglected to tell him that the cat would soon be out of the bag. So on Dec. 6, Alexander spoke from the old talking points in assuring visiting House intelligence committee member Rush Holt, D-N.J., that the NSA did not eavesdrop on Americans without a court order.

Still possessed of the quaint notion that generals and other senior officials are not supposed to lie to congressional oversight committees, Holt wrote a blistering letter to Gen. Alexander after the Times, on Dec. 16, front-paged a feature by Risen and Eric Lichtblau, "Bush Lets U.S. Spy on Callers Without Courts." But House Intelligence Committee chair Pete Hoekstra, R-Mich., apparently found Holt's scruples benighted; Hoekstra did nothing to hold Alexander accountable for misleading Holt, his most experienced committee member, who had served as an intelligence analyst at the State Department.

What followed struck me as bizarre. The day after the Dec. 16 Times feature article, the president of the United States publicly admitted to a demonstrably impeachable offense. Authorizing illegal electronic surveillance was a key provision of the second article of impeachment against President Richard Nixon. On July 27, 1974, this and two other articles of impeachment were approved by bipartisan votes in the House Committee on the Judiciary.

Bush takes frontal approach

Far from expressing regret, the president bragged about having authorized the surveillance "more than 30 times since the September the 11th attacks," and said he would continue to do so. The president also said:

"Leaders in Congress have been briefed more than a dozen times on this authorization and the activities conducted under it."

On Dec. 19, 2005, then-Attorney General Alberto Gonzales and then-NSA Director Michael Hayden held a press conference to answer questions about the as yet unnamed surveillance program. Gonzales was asked why the White House decided to flout FISA rather than attempt to amend it, choosing instead a "backdoor approach." He answered:

"We have had discussions with Congress ... as to whether or not FISA could be amended to allow us to adequately deal with this kind of threat, and we were advised that that would be difficult, if not impossible."

Hmm. Impossible? It strains credulity that a program of the limited scope described would be unable to win ready approval from a Congress that had just passed the "Patriot Act" in record time. James Risen has made the following quip about the prevailing mood: "In October 2001 you could have set up guillotines on the public streets of America." It was not difficult to infer that the surveillance program must have been of such scope and intrusiveness that, even amid highly stoked fear, it didn't have a prayer for passage.

It turns out we didn't know the half of it.

What to call these activities

"Illegal Surveillance Program" didn't seem quite right for White House purposes, and the PR machine was unusually slow off the blocks. It took six weeks to settle on "Terrorist Surveillance Program," with FOX News leading the way, followed by the president himself. This labeling would dovetail nicely with the president's rhetoric on Dec. 17:

"In the weeks following the terrorist attacks on our nation, I authorized the National Security Agency, consistent with U.S. law and the Constitution, to intercept the international communications of people with known links to al Qaeda and related terrorist organizations ... The authorization I gave the National Security Agency after Sept. 11 helped address that problem..."

And Gen. Michael Hayden, who headed NSA from 1999 to 2005, was of course on the same page, dissembling as convincingly as the president. At his May 2006 confirmation hearings to become CIA director, he told of his soul-searching when, as director of NSA, he was asked to eavesdrop on Americans without a court warrant. "I had to make this personal decision in early Oct. 2001," said Hayden. "It was a personal decision ... I could not not do this."

Like so much else, it was all because of 9/11. But we now know ...

It started seven months before 9/11

How many times have you heard it? The mantra "after 9/11 everything changed" has given absolution to all manner of sin.

We are understandably reluctant to believe the worst of our leaders, and this tends to make us negligent. After all, we learned from former Treasury Secretary Paul O'Neill that drastic changes were made in U.S. foreign policy toward the Israeli-Palestinian issue and toward Iraq at the first National Security Council meeting on Jan. 30, 2001. Should we not have anticipated far-reaching changes at home as well?

Reporting by the Rocky Mountain News and court documents and testimony in a case involving Qwest Communications strongly suggest that in February 2001 Hayden saluted smartly when the Bush administration instructed NSA to suborn AT&T, Verizon and Qwest to spy illegally on you, me and other Americans. Bear in mind that this would have had nothing to do with terrorism, which did not really appear on the new administration's radar screen until a week before 9/11, despite the pleading of Clinton aides that the issue deserved extremely high priority.

So this until-recently-unknown pre-9/11 facet of the "Terrorist Surveillance Program" was not related to Osama bin Laden or to whomever he and his associates might be speaking. It had to do with us. We know that the Democrats who were briefed on the "Terrorist Surveillance Program" include House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif. (the one with the longest tenure on the House Intelligence Committee), Rep. Jane Harman, D-Calif., and former and current chairmen of the Senate Intelligence Committee, Bob Graham, D-Fla., and Jay Rockefeller, D-W.Va. May one interpret their lack of public comment on the news that the snooping began well before 9/11 as a sign they were co-opted and then sworn to secrecy?

It is an important question. Were the appropriate leaders in Congress informed that within days of George W. Bush's first inauguration the NSA electronic vacuum cleaner began to suck up information on you and me despite the FISA law and the Fourth Amendment?

Are they all complicit?

And are Democratic leaders about to cave in and grant retroactive immunity to those telecommunications corporations -- AT&T and Verizon -- who made millions by winking at the law and the Constitution? (Qwest, to its credit, heeded the advice of its general counsel, who said that what NSA wanted done was clearly illegal.)

What's going on here? Have congressional leaders no sense for what is at stake? Lately the adjective "spineless" has come into vogue in describing congressional Democrats -- no offense to invertebrates.

Nazis and those who enable them

You don't have to be a Nazi. You can just be, well, a sheep.

In his journal Sebastian Haffner decries what he calls the "sheepish submissiveness" with which the German people reacted to a 9/11-like event, the burning of the German parliament building (Reichstag) on Feb. 27, 1933. Haffner finds it quite telling that none of his acquaintances "saw anything out of the ordinary in the fact that, from then on, one's telephone would be tapped, one's letters opened and one's desk might be broken into."

But it is for the cowardly politicians that Haffner reserves his most vehement condemnation. Do you see any contemporary parallels here?

In the elections of March 4, 1933, shortly after the Reichstag fire, the Nazi party garnered only 44 percent of the vote. Only the "cowardly treachery" of the Social Democrats and other parties to whom 56 percent of the German people had entrusted their votes made it possible for the Nazis to seize full power. Haffner adds:

"It is in the final analysis only that betrayal that explains the almost inexplicable fact that a great nation, which cannot have consisted entirely of cowards, fell into ignominy without a fight."

The Social Democratic leaders betrayed their followers -- "for the most part decent, unimportant individuals." In May they sang the Nazi anthem; in June the Social Democratic party was dissolved.

The middle-class Catholic party Zentrum folded in less than a month and in the end supplied the votes necessary for the two-thirds majority that "legalized" Hitler's dictatorship.

As for the right-wing conservatives and German nationalists: "Oh God," writes Haffner, "what an infinitely dishonorable and cowardly spectacle their leaders made in 1933 and continued to make afterward. ... They went along with everything: the terror, the persecution of Jews. ... They were not even bothered when their own party was banned and their own members arrested." In sum:

"There was not a single example of energetic defense, of courage or principle. There was only panic, flight, and desertion. In March 1933 millions were ready to fight the Nazis. Overnight they found themselves without leaders. ... At the moment of truth, when other nations rise spontaneously to the occasion, the Germans collectively and limply collapsed. They yielded and capitulated, and suffered a nervous breakdown. ... The result is today the nightmare of the rest of the world."

This is what can happen when virtually all are intimidated.

Our founding fathers were not oblivious to this; thus, James Madison wrote:

"I believe there are more instances of the abridgement of freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments by those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations. ... The means of defense against foreign danger historically have become the instruments of tyranny at home."

We cannot say we weren't warned.

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See more stories tagged with: 9/11, fascism, civil liberties, hitler, wiretapping, george bush, george w. bush, september 11, nazi germany

Ray McGovern works with Tell the Word, the publishing arm of the ecumenical Church of the Saviour in Washington, D.C. A former Army officer and CIA analyst, he worked in Germany for five years; he is co-founder of Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity.

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It's heeeeere...........
Posted by: vox persona on Dec 29, 2007 12:19 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
When fascism comes to America, it will be carrying a cross and wrapped in an American flag. -Sinclair Lewis-

EARLY WARNING SIGNS OF FASCISM:
-Powerful and continuing nationalism
-Disdain for human rights
-Identification of enemies as a unifying cause
-Supremacy of the military
-Rampant sexism
-Controlled mass media
-Obsession with national security
-Religion and government intertwined
-Corporate power protected
-Labor power suppressed
-Disdain for intellectuals and the arts
-Obsession with crime and punishment
-Rampant cronyism and corruption
-Fraudulent elections

Sound familiar?
Scary.......

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» Book burnings? Posted by: sliver
» RE: Book burnings? Posted by: Intellect
» RE: It's heeeeere........... Posted by: jlramsey
Time for New Democratic Leadership ...
Posted by: mmckinl on Dec 29, 2007 12:55 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Pelosi and Reid have failed the Democratic Party and The United States of America. Their incompetence, cowardice and capitulation have endangered and put in doubt the very Constitutional freedoms they were sworn to uphold.

Glenn Greenwald has documented much of it :

- Reid and company target the true enemy: "Dodd and his allies"

- Harry Reid -- compare and contrast

- Harry Reid's FISA games

- Democratic complicity in Bush's torture regimen

- Democrats show Beltway "strength," avoid being depicted as weak

- The administration's best friends in Congress come to its defense.

- Harry Reid works to ensure telecom amnesty, warrantless surveillance

- What FISA capitulations are Democrats planning next?

- Democrats' responsibility for Bush radicalism

http://dir.salon.com/topics/glenn_greenwald/

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

With Leaders like these who needs enemies ?

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» Why? It's just a structure Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Why not? Posted by: oregoncharles
» YES!!! Posted by: timemachinist
» RE: YES!!! Please! Posted by: Lauren
» RE: YES!!! Posted by: Intellect
» RE: YES!!! Posted by: Intellect
» RE: YES!!! Posted by: srimbael
» Tell us something we don't know, MoFo. Posted by: common intelligence
The Nazi theme is worn out - try the Stasi line instead.
Posted by: thoughtcriminal on Dec 29, 2007 1:04 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Or at least be a little more specific. Gestapo tactics, maybe? Every totalitarian system of government sets up massive state surveillance of the population, regardless of whether they call themselves national socialists, law-and-order supporters, or communist collectivists.

Why? Because behind all totalitarian systems are relatively small groups of people who enrich themselves while screwing over everyone else. That's who Bush represents, and that's who Hitler represented, and that's who Stalin represented. Of course they want to keep their eyes on the general public, who sooner or later find out what's going on.

The best response is to spy right back, and publicize what you find out. The main story here, the fundamental one, is the international fossil fuel business, which is shored up by the international weapons business. It's the modern equivalent of the slave trade in the 1700s - the slave industry owned entire countries, and entire parliaments as well.

Billionaires in the U.S. and Saudi Arabia and Britain want to keep their hands on their lucrative cash flows, and the last thing they want is to see themselves forced to compete on a level playing field with upstart renewable energy platforms. They'd rather install idiotic but controllable puppets (like Bush) via fraudulent elections and send kids off to die in the Middle East so that they can seize the oilfields of the region.

What we really have here is national socialism - tax dollars are collected by the IRS and handed out to wealthy interests while everyone else gets the shaft. Roosevelt called it 'private socialism.'

Halliburton, Enron, Exxon, Chevorn, Blackwater, BP, Battelle Memorial Institute, Lockheed, Shell, Northrup, SAIC, Dyncorp, AT&T, Gilead - these are just a few of the corporate interests who have been making billions under the modern version of national socialism.

Of course, the Nazis did the same thing - they got in bed with I.G. Farben, and gave huge state subsidies to that megacorporation - such as building labor camps at Auschwitz and providing the slaves, all so that I.G. Farben could have cheap labor for their Buna methanol and synthetic rubber factories. Stalin used similar methods - including outsourcing polluting industries to Soviet satellites like Romania, and creating megacorporate agribusiness systems as he drove farmers off their lands and onto the 'collective farms' (just as Wall Street did to farmers in the U.S. and Mexico). Stalin's Board of Directors was the Central Soviet Committee.

As far as domestic surveillance goes, the Soviets had their KGB and their Stasi, and the Nazis had their Gestapo and their Good German informants. Basically, the power-mad left is really no different than the power-mad right.

So, what's to be done? Demand that your politicians uphold the Constitution. Read them the Bill of Rights, for starters. If they are beholden to corporate interests (i.e. Obama and Clinton, for example), don't vote for them - and remember, the corporate media is owned by these modern reincarnations of Hitler, Stalin and IG Farben - don't buy their spin. Rather, demand the complete breakup of the media conglomerates under antitrust laws.

By the way, the fact is that all this domestic spying is illegal under the constitution's fourth amendment, which should be referenced here:

"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seize."

That does indeed include personal communications of all forms, including written and electronic.

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» Best analysis ever.... Posted by: CatDad
Gays are the litmus test
Posted by: HoboHomo on Dec 29, 2007 1:56 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
NO society can truly consider itself humane, so long as it allows and even encourages persecution of its non-hetero populace, and thinks nothing of draconic laws and tacit sanctions which deny gays the basic rights allowed the hetero majority.

Therefore, as long as gays are legally discriminated against, the Door of Persecution towards any other group remains ajar. It is indeed a false and hideous notion for any person to parade pride in his nation's presumed freedom for all citizens while queers remain terrorized by that very same nation.

No other minority is discriminated against with such blithe cooperation by other sorely persecuted minorities, who see nothing wrong with this!

That is why we sexual minorities are the ultimate litmus test for gauging society's humaneness. For there are times when all other minorities (and women) enjoy relative freedom and respect...yet LGBTs continue to be relegated to 2nd-class citizenship and gov't sanctioned terrorism.

--
Zeke Krahlin
http://www.gay-bible.org/steal

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» I knew it Posted by: Gestalt
» What about Gay Children? Posted by: rjgwood
» RE: I knew it Posted by: HoboHomo
» RE: Gays are the litmus test Posted by: modeler
» RE: Gays are the litmus test Posted by: HoboHomo
» Hi Lauren Posted by: timemachinist
» RE: Hi Lauren Posted by: Lauren
» RE: Gays are the litmus test Posted by: HoboHomo
» Drug Subcultures are MORE Persecuted Posted by: timemachinist
» RE: You too harryf200! ;o) Posted by: channing
» RE: Gays are the litmus test Posted by: parmenicleitus
» RE: Gays are the litmus test Posted by: HoboHomo
» RE: Gays are the litmus test Posted by: parmenicleitus
» RE: Love Posted by: parmenicleitus
» RE: Gays are the litmus test Posted by: racetoinfinity
» RE: Gays are the litmus test Posted by: Geolager
» RE: Gays are the litmus test Posted by: nikolai
maybe Pelosi should think about whether she would prefer a plea bargain to a
Posted by: Suzon on Dec 29, 2007 4:15 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
possible impeachment. I would think that a successful impeachment would deprive the impeached person of their pension and benefits.

Come clean, Nancy, about your involvement and be forgiven. Keeping quiet about wrongdoing is always a more dangerous position.

There are plenty of laws which could be applied, including criminal negligence.

I lived through the McCarthy era. America did come to its senses then and it can come to its senses now!

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Oh no, not again!
Posted by: harryf200 on Dec 29, 2007 5:07 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am not in the least anti-Gay, although as a sometimes writer I still resent the appropriation of a good noun to being a proper noun that inadequately describes homosexuality - after all, Gays are not all gay. Indeed, some of 'em are darn right miserable! But that's a whole different essay. In fact, one of my best friends is Gay. But the World does not revolve around Gays. (It barely revolves around humans, although we also mistakenly think it does, too.) Thus, the persecution of Gays is no more a litmus test of Fascism (as distinct from Nazism - they are usually confused, and I think they are here)than is book burning, persecution of people with views different to those of the leadership (e.g. abortionists? Communists? anti-war? non-Christians?), persecution of various ethnic groups (e.g. blacks, Jews, etc.), people with mental illness, and so on.

It often is about Gays but it isn't JUST about Gays!

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: thank you... Posted by: channing
» RE: "War On Greed" Posted by: Lauren
» RE: "War On Greed" Posted by: channing
» Harry, you are SO wrong Posted by: timemachinist
» RE: points 3,4 and 5 Posted by: channing
» RE: points 3,4 and 5 Posted by: harryf200
Lived through the first disaster as well
Posted by: modeler on Dec 29, 2007 5:25 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I still remember the national security system in the style of SA (storm trooper) gangs on the streets of Berlin and the first concentration camps near the Tempelhof airport and in Oranienburg. I still wonder what happened to schoolmates like Werner Oppenheimer, Haenschen Uri, Brigitte Seif , Hanna Schwarz etc. etc. They came after my father too, luckily that particular Sunday he was out of town and a membership card to the Luftschutzbund (Air defense assn)which he obtained on a friends advice a few days before, got him of the list it seems ,it lay on the table for the SA to see. The telephone, forget it, you did not know who else was on it besides your party on the other end. The Reichstag fire was also blamed on terrorists (like a Dutch communist named van der Lubbe) but a welcome reason for extraordinary powers created by and for Hitler and gang. There was also a national security boss named Himmler and a propaganmdas liar named Goebbels. Between them they subdued anyone who dared to muck up. Sounds familiar? The present opposition is just as gutless as the one in 1933, except that their leaders spent years in KZ lagers (Concentration Camps) which were explained to us as copies of the British camps in South Africa during the Boer war. Wake up America before it is too late,the similarities are obvious.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» USA has always been fascist for some Posted by: timemachinist
WHO NEEDS ENEMIES - PART II
Posted by: wilty on Dec 29, 2007 5:46 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
To mmickinl:

You forgot one more glaring legislative player:
Rep. Jane Harman, bless her little treasonous heart, author of that despicable legislation -
H.R. 1955; which in its essence, makes anyone who even dares "think" about resisting the Nazi/Neocon takeover of our own country, a terrorist, a criminal. To speak up as an American citizen, and to press a viewpoint that would run counter to the Bush Administration stance, would put that individual at great risk as being branded a "Homegrown Terrorist!!"

What has happened to the 1st Amendment?

Also, what is happening with the Mainstream Press, polluted now, to such an extent with
Bush Amerinazi power, is something Goebbels would have gloated over.

Finally, adding insult to injury, the Harman legislation repeatedly refers to information being reported in the netroots, as propaganda.

What nerve!!! Who the hell does she think she is kidding, here? The joke must be on us!!

Haha, I say, with a bitterness so entrenched in my mouth, that I'm having a hard time spitting it out - but, I am SPITTING MAD about this, and none of us should let these bastards walk all over us.

We must, ALL OF US, NOW, stand up, and fight back, or else we are going to lose it all, BIG TIME!!!

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» RE: WHO NEEDS ENEMIES - PART II Posted by: harryf200
Nazi Germany?
Posted by: radical53 on Dec 29, 2007 6:14 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Well, Ray McGovern has gone 'round the bend and over the top. Here's a guy who was been passed off on national TV as an expert critical of the Bush policies on Iraq and the so-called war on terror. Now he is comparing the US to Nazi Germany. This article is not only foolish but it also demonstrates a total lack of understanding of Nazi Germany, the holocaust, and the current situation. I have been angry enough over the past 8 years to draw this type of analogy, but just a few moments of rational thought has been enough to make me drop the idea. Let's lock McGovern in a room with Ann Coulter and let them trade emotional insults based on ignorance and irrationality.

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» Fascism and Drug War are very similar Posted by: timemachinist
» RE: Nazi Germany? Posted by: harryf200
» RE: Nazi Germany? Posted by: 2dogarage
» RE: FDR Posted by: harryf200
» RE: Nazi Germany? Posted by: EdinIowa
» Uncle Teddy Posted by: 2dogarage
» RE: Uncle Teddy Posted by: EdinIowa
» RE: Uncle Teddy Posted by: 2dogarage
» RE: Nazi Germany? Posted by: EdinIowa
» RE: Nazi Germany? Posted by: medicis
» RE: Nazi Germany? Posted by: peacefullaim
Call for action
Posted by: mutualaid on Dec 29, 2007 7:14 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
http://nyc.indymedia.org/en/2007/12/93185.html

here above are some actions already taking place.

Would have been appreciated if McGovern had been less emotional and more practical. S 1959 must, can and WILL be defeated.

Apparently the RAND Corporation is behind it, targeting of anti-globalization, environmental and anarchist activists, and muslim organizations.

Go to link above. Organize demos at your congressperson's office and get media attention to this unpatriotic bill - mention RAND and Sue Collins too. They are the culprits.

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More on 'Drug War' expansion. Take ACTION today!!!
Posted by: mutualaid on Dec 29, 2007 7:30 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
current 'drug war' expansion negotiated by Bush & (Mexican President) Calderon and now being considered as part of Iraq Emergency Appropriations is being fought by network of friends of Brad Will, the U.S. journalist who was killed by Mexican government & security forces as he was covering the teachers' strike in Oaxaca Mexico.

Here's who killed Brad Will:

http://www.rsf.org/article.php3?id_article=19485

Here's more info on Plan Mexico:
http://www.friendsofbradwill.org/category/plan-mexico/

and there's a place on the right column to subscribe to this listserve. They're doing much against the drug war expansion - through lobbying, civil disobedience, media exposure, and public outreach and education.

The context for 'drug war' expansion into mexico is a clamp down on Mexican civil liberties and a bolstering of authoritarian tendencies of the Mexican government as more and more Mexicans are becoming mobilized against the impacts of "free trade' deals, impunity for govt. human rights abuses and corruption which is impoverishing them. More on that on the second page of posts in the Plan Mexico category:

Oh, the steelworkers just came out against Plan Mexico:

www.usw.org/usw/program/content/4377.php

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About that 911 Reichstag...
Posted by: channing on Dec 29, 2007 8:00 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
New Discovery of thermite in WTC dust:

Dr. Steven Jones has already established the chemical signature of thermite reactions in the dust from Lower Manhattan prior to this, but this new analysis identifies thermite itself in tiny 2-sided flakes 1-1,500 microns across existing in relative abundance in both samples taken from two locations. One sample taken within 20 minutes of collapse. The logical implication is that not all thermite was burned off in the WTC demolitions:

Can anyone say "Smoking Gun of Advanced Explosives Planned well in advance, say, January 2001 or so?!

Ray does exquisite work over and over, but he also beats around the "bushit" a little and for good reason... but it's easy for somebody like me to come out and say it:

"PNAC Is Central to the Execution of the 911 False Flag Operation on the United States of America which has been used as a causus beli for a Fascist Coup of the US Constitution, the HiJacking of the US Military, a Terroizing War On Terror and other International War Crimes all in pursuit of World Dominion and Resource Monopolization"

Ray is helping to "quarantine" this Cabal along with other Patriots, like wagons circling, and drawing an inescapable noose that gets tighter and tighter. We're getting very close to a clear picture of the totality of the Crimes and who's who in the pecking-order... Can anyone say "RICO PNAC" yet?

To save our Constitution, I don't believe we have a choice with Congress Petrified and/or Bought by the trillion$ being spewed from the endless fountains of MIC/Energy Plunder.

We don't need a "candidate", we need a RICO PNAC! The candidates will all expose themselves accordingly.

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» 911 truthiness is a cointelpro operation Posted by: thoughtcriminal
Here is a more succinct overview of our situation.
Posted by: TarryFaster on Dec 29, 2007 8:14 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If you are interested in a brief history of what is happening to us, click here.

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Alden
Posted by: alden on Dec 29, 2007 8:22 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What's RICO? What's PNAC? If thermite was found, this is very important. Can you provide sources for this information?

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» RE: Alden Posted by: channing
» Thermite Resources Posted by: makeadifference
Military officer lying
Posted by: fdgsr on Dec 29, 2007 9:00 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I post this as my first introduction to lying in the Army. As a young lieutenant, I was tasked shortly after I was commissioned to write a periodic report for the Post Surgeon at Fort Lee, Virginia. It was supposed to be The Command Health Report. As assistant Preventive Medicine Officer and Laboratory Officer, I was in a position to know about the command health and some things that impacted it. I studied the appropriate Army Regulations concerning the Command Health Report and did one in complete compliance and in the spirit of the intent.

My Adjutant and Executive Officer sent it back for revision. I was told to take out the inspection results of the Officer's Club kitchen because it contained truthful but damaging information about the filthy place where food for the officers was prepared. When I told them that I was reporting on factual inspection results, the report was redone in the office of the Commander of the medical facility with the Executive Officer and Adjutant doing most of it. The resulting document was watered down to a spineless claim that all was well in the area of Command Health. I was asked to sign it, and when threatened with retaliation on my Annual Officer Efficiency, I signed it and forgot about it.

Many times in my career as a Medical Service Officer over about 16 years, I encountered the command necessity to lie to the command structure so that they could present clean documentary reports to the higher level, all the way to the President. I found it in Viet Nam, in Berlin, and in other places. I found it in my own efficiency reports and in the reports I wrote for other officers. After being passed over for promotion, euphemistically called, "Retained in Grade", I made Major in time to retire as a major.

The Army Officer Corps are institutions of liars. It is not surprising that a high ranking General would lie for the president. After all, his promotion to that rank was a result of lies, and his appointment to his position was supported by lies.

God help us,if we ever have a major war like WWII. We could not win it with the leadership we have. There are no more Eisenhowers, MacArthurs, Marshalls, or Bradleys to serve a President like Truman. Hell, we will never have another Truman in our political system.

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» RE: Military officer lying Posted by: makeadifference
» RE: Military officer lying Posted by: Lector
gradual and silent encroachments
Posted by: particle61 on Dec 29, 2007 9:39 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Or perhaps, speedy and appalling encroachments.

redstateupdate.net covers the dedicated dismantling of the constitution, excessively enabling executive orders, heat-rays, space based surveillance, TSA follies, police clamp downs, and other efforts at ‘crowd control’ in the United States of Emergency with humor and prescience- see ‘one nation, under surveillance’ - ‘interpreting the constitution’ and ‘crowd control’ archives

see stories-
Political Surveillance Predates Terrorist Attacks
Documents Reveal Evidence of Widespread Domestic Surveillance
State of Emergency Laws Reduce Congress to Comatose Posse

http://www.redstateupdate.net/interpreting/interpreting.html


and, regarding the government mandate (and business compliance in building) surveillance “back doors” into all telephones and computers and the FBI software that allows instant wiretaps on these devices, see story-
Surveillance Substructure Simplifies Spying on Citizens

and, the recent NSA order that allows federal and local law enforcement agencies to access data from an existing network of spy satellites, see story-
Feds Can Scan Your Face From Outer Space Without Leaving a Trace

http://www.redstateupdate.net/1-nation/surveillance.html

and, the development of Active Denial Technologies and how local police want to get their hands on the weaponry way back in 2005, see story-
Police Forces Won't be Denied in Active Pursuit of Heat-Ray

and, the Transportation Security Administration's recent searches of public bus passengers in Indiana, see story-
TSA Transferred To City Bus Stops

http://www.redstateupdate.net/crowd/crowd.html

www.redstateupdate.net
funny, frightening, free since 2005
and no fake hill-billies

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The comparison is real...
Posted by: makeadifference on Dec 29, 2007 9:54 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am so glad someone else has read the book by Haffner, "Defying Hitler". I also reccommend the book by Milton Mayer, "They Thought They Were Free" which is a detailed account of how ordinary German citizens reacted or didn't react during Hitlers rise to power from 1933-1945. It begs the question... What would you have done? and more applicable, What will you do?

I also recommend Naomi Wolfs recent book, "End of America" and Morris Berman's, "Dark Ages America" to understand the American culture that is allowing or encouraging America's decline.

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Another link
Posted by: stangman89 on Dec 29, 2007 10:27 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Don't forget about NAFTA and the North American Union.

http://www.stopthenorthamericanunion.com/

We are being infiltrated from within. I hope all Americans who believe in the Constitution will wake up in time to stop the insanity. Pick your next president carefully. Most of them are controlled by the military industrial complex so it will not be an easy decision.

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the clock is ticking
Posted by: grkjr on Dec 29, 2007 11:41 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It is no small part of the story that despite all the evidence and historical prospective, we continue to "round around in circles and shout" that if we just stay the course it will all turn out.. that the democrats will change their stripes and return us to a full democracy before it is too late.... goodness, with all the evidence to the contrary we continue to go with the misplaced faith "vote the least of the two evils"
STOP THE TRAIN GET OFF AND LAY NEW TRACK... that means abandone the democratic party as it is today.. it is not the party of your parents that gave us social security, unions and anti monopoly legislation etc etc etc
1. Persuade as many progressive represenetatives to start a new progressive party.. those who have been consistent in their votes to not fund this war for example...
2. All the organizations out there who have continued to bring this info to light would better serve our democracy by getting off the "democratic party support wagon" and start with this movement. With their millions of members and readers.
3. Such orgainizations could immediately put together a list of the most patriotic congressmen voting records in support of this movement versus those who have simply given lip service to the cause and voted with the admistration and the republicans such as the house leader. They have hidden their votes from view via their public talk.
4, That list could be the basis for recalls, , in all progressive districts.

THE CONTINUED SUPPORT OF THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY GIVEN WHAT IS KNOWN, IS TRULY FOOLHARDY.

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This is so sad....
Posted by: Pirate1 on Dec 29, 2007 12:19 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I read stuff like this all the time now, people doing their best to draw the lines, point out the similarities but I don't get the sense that anyone other than the minority of folks who post here and other like online columns even care. I mean, come on... Joe Humphead out there is more concerned that he's driving the biggest truck available and gets the parking place closest to the door of his favorite shopping center than to be bothered with any of this. As long as "the game" is broadcast and his favorite light beer is on sale and they're only going after "illegals" and Muslims he doesn't give a rats ass about eroding rights because he doesn't see that any of it applies to him. He listens to Rush and O'Reilly and all those modern day crackers on his radio while he idles his mega truck through traffic jams to and from work and yells his approval when some idiot calls in with some kind of final solution.

We are in BIG trouble, folks. I look at who we have running to replace Bush and see status quo or worse in store if any of the current front runners succeed, no matter what party they hail from. Maybe it has to fall that way once things get so big and complex... I used to see the future as bright and hopeful, now I feel bad for the children who will be military age in 10 years... I predict Blackwater trained regional warlords controling large sections of a broken USA. Climate change will be what pushes it all over, a few years of crop failures and lost coastal cities will give such people a foothold to start their break away republics... it'll be like Afganistan with technology.

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» RE: This is so sad.... Posted by: Bright Penny
Grassroots Activism for Emancipation
Posted by: A. Servant on Dec 29, 2007 12:44 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Don't wait for a "centralized solution" to arise. Historically, what you will receive won't be in your best interest. AlterNet and the mainstream "alternative" news sources are strongly biased toward publishing articles that offer no solutions or advocate centralized solutions that can be distorted to harm all but a few at the top. Solutions for the common person have been and will be grassroots ones that emerge organically from you and your communities.

Rising fascism in America today leads to subtle yet direct effects that touch almost all persons irrespective of background. Our reality is that most of us are being kept as slaves in a matrix of control; and we are acting in ways that maintain this system of slavery. Our voices are ignored by the powerful, and our true needs are overlooked. And as slaves, we are being dominated and imprisoned or threatened with imprisonment when we are bad producers or bad consumers. We are being sickened by limited access to healthy water, nutritious foods, dietary supplementation, vital health information and health cures--not just treatment. And when our usefulness is over, we will be left to die or be killed. The lack of caring that we experience and too often fail to offer to others is not accidental--our indoctrination has been intentionally planned and executed by the slave masters.

If you're tired of being enslaved and seeing others threatened with more enslavement, join us in Slaves Anonymous to start making grassroots changes that will improve the security of you and your family. You and your neighbors have the autonomy, creativity, diversity, passion and transcendence to become self-owners and create the conditions necessary for emancipation of your local community from the global tyranny of slavery or serfdom or corporatism or government or fascism or empire or debt-based money or psychopathy or whatever-you-want-to-call-it. You can create ways that lead to less bondage and more humane treatment for yourselves and your neighbors.

Let's work together: You stop it in your community; I'll stop it in mine.

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Why is there no mention of the Total Information Awareness program in this story?
Posted by: Rune on Dec 29, 2007 1:17 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
In 2003, Congress voted to eliminate funding for the Total Information Awareness program because it was an unconstitutional effort on the part of the Bush administration to vacuum up electronic communications and sift through them without a warrant. Clearly, when the full Congress became aware of such blatant trampling on the privacy rights of all Americans, it wanted no part of it, even though the usually loyal Republicans were in power and covering for Bush at almost every turn. The Bush administration then went right on developing and using the system, getting around the block on funding by moving all the components of the program into black budget operations that only those in Congress with security clearances could know about, but could not talk about.

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The remedy for rising fascism lies within the Constitution!
Posted by: aharlib on Dec 29, 2007 2:27 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The remedy for rising fascism lies within the Constitution! IMPEACHMENT!

Impeach Bush and Cheney NOW

Defense of the Constitution Knows No Party


The Bush administration has illegally seized and imprisoned Americans without benefit of their trial by jury, has spied on Americans without warrant in violation of the Fourth Amendment of the Constitution, has lied America into a disastrous war, and has betrayed an American intelligence officer, who was working on weapons of mass destruction networks, to our enemies (Valerie Plame.)

Impeachment hearings against Vice President Dick Cheney are now a distinct possibility, thanks to a recent outpouring of public support for impeachment by Americans across the political spectrum. Your calls and faxes to House Judiciary Committee members are needed to keep up the pressure.

Leave a message for your Congressman, to demand he obey his oath to "defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic." Act now to restore your rights and the rule of law bequeathed to us by our Founding Fathers, which brave men have died defending throughout our history.

Call the House Judiciary Committee

202-225-3951
and demand that Impeachment hearings begin ASAP!





*What Happened to Make This All Possible?

On November 6, 2007, Rep. Dennis Kucinich brought H.Res.333, for the impeachment of Cheney, to the House Floor for debate. It was broadcast on CSPAN. A sudden outpouring of public support for impeachment forced lawmakers to keep the resolution alive. Democrats, most of whom currently resist demands for impeachment, were unwilling to kill the bill with the public watching. Republicans and some Democrats, mindful of impeachment sentiment, voted to debate the bill, but failed. At the end of the day, Americans of both parties had made it clear whose "table" this is, and that they want to see impeachment on it.



For more information go to
NEImpeach.org

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» reintroduced as HR 799 Posted by: undrgrndgirl
» RE: reintroduced as HR 799 Posted by: peacefullaim
The Fascist Connection
Posted by: pdxstudent on Dec 29, 2007 2:33 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It has its place, but I think at this point we carry our problems too far on the backs of analogies. We have real problems, right here and now in the United States. We can learn how to recognize them from our ability to analyze history and ideology, but we set people up to look the other way when we make it easy for them to think, "Oh, it's not entirely like Fascism; those who say it's a problem because it's like Fascism are therefore wrong."

Of course, that's something of a simplification, but I think it fits a trend in how people avoid thinking about the real world, much like Freud's "masochism of small differences." Is it true that there all kinds of homologies between the ideological milieu of today and Germany of the late '20s and '30s? Sure. That's as far as it goes though. The real task at hand is not (just) unveiling those connections, but understanding what the differences are, and why, perhaps in virtue of them, we must still treat the situation as a problem.

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it started ... months before 9/11
Posted by: undrgrndgirl on Dec 29, 2007 6:17 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
this may be a little off topic, but i've not seen or heard anyone mention something that struck me after 9/11: the rapid, overnight marketing of patriotism...EVERYTHING (for sale) suddenly was wrapped in an american flag (from soap dispensers to tennis shoes to franklin mint collectibles)...movies (that sometimes take years to produce) such as Proof of Life seemed to me to be a little too convenient...i know the market is fast, but it seemed too fast...almost as if the trans-nationals knew it was gonna happen; and of course, much of the stuff was manufactured in china, so, for me, it raises questions of who knew what, when...i mean there were production and shipping times to be considered and businesses don't warehouse stuff "just-in-case"...they wanna SELL it...even flags themselves seemed to be, well, a little too available - no reports of flags on back order...i seems to me it was almost as if someone went to "KitschCorp." and said "you better start making a lot of schlock adorned with american flags, trust me, it'll sell"...

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Power Corrupts
Posted by: ronheri on Dec 29, 2007 8:30 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
These neo-con nazis who have trampled on the Constitution along with their co-conspirators in the Congress and the mass media have led us down the path to enslavement and tyranny. I hope and pray a Ron Paul victory in 08 can return America back to the freedom loving citizens. We are in deep trouble.

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"...we are going to get our evidence one way or the other."-Ft Worth Police Chief Ralph Mendoza
Posted by: wmp2304 on Dec 29, 2007 9:07 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
linked text

Fort Worth Police are Launching a DWI "No Refusal Campaign

"If you are stopped by a Fort Worth police officer and you are arrested for DWI, we are going to get a sample," said prosecutor Richard Alpert, who specializes in the prosecution of DWI and intoxication manslaughter cases. "We are going to get the evidence we need in court to prove your guilt. There is no way around it."

Motorists on Fort Worth roads who refuse to take a breath test after being stopped for suspected drunken driving on New Year's Eve and New Year's Day will have their blood drawn to determine whether they are impaired.

"If you refuse to take that blood test, we are going to ask for a warrant from a magistrate (on-site - ed.) and come back and take your blood," said Fort Worth Police Chief Ralph Mendoza. "Basically, we are going to get our evidence one way or the other."

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All politicians are Fascists
Posted by: cashelboylo on Dec 29, 2007 11:34 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"govern" = "control"
"ment" = "mind"
"government" = "mind control"
All politicians are mad wannabee world masters.
Who else would want the job?
And Americans are probably the most submissive people in the world -- submission being passed off as "loyalty" "patriotism" "duty" -- even "protecting freedom"
It would be funny if it were not so sad.

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Wake Up Call
Posted by: HeKnew on Dec 30, 2007 6:42 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Fascism isn't "creeping", it's here.

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THE POLICE STATE IS HERE AND NOW
Posted by: nikolai on Dec 30, 2007 11:04 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Look at the very first comment from vox personna; it has listed the 14 steps to facism which have been or are being completed NOW. Do yourselves a favor and check out this site: http://www.tackamarks.freeservers.com/ and read on if you don't believe we are being prepared as sheep for the slaughter. It doesn't take a scholar to see we are living in a police state, it just hasn't gotten that bad...yet. When the politicians REPEATEDLY IGNORE THE MAJORITY WILL OF THE PEOPLE which the '06 elections have proven, it becomes obvious that WE THE PEOPLE are living in a non-democratic society. Since the politicians are not going to respond to the will of the people, something drastic MUST be done. Look at Hillary, for instance. THe FRONT RUNNER of the democratic party, and she is VOTING WITH THE NEOCONS. Are we hoping that she is merely "playing along" and that once she is elected she will jump up and say, "HAH! FOOLED YA, NEOS!" "NOW WE'RE GONNA HAVE A REAL DEMOCRACY!" I DON'T THINK SO!!! She and Bill have shown their true colors promoting NAFTA, etc. This is what the neocons want, GLOBALIZATION. The politicians are ALL wealthy folks who want to cover their ass(ets)es and to hell with the rest of us. They are only looking out for their own. People, it's our country and the country of our forefathers. WE MUST TAKE IT BACK NOW. To do less is a shame on the American people and their heritage. IF WE STAY DIVIDED AS WE ARE NOW, WE ARE DOOMED AS THE GERMAN PEOPLE WERE. WAKE UP AND ACT NOW!

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No New President In 2008... or after
Posted by: zyclop on Dec 30, 2007 11:12 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It is still my bet [as in 2005] that there will be no elections next year in this country.
The RightWings are ruthless no matter what country they are in.
And they are not as stupid as the Leftists as to throw bombs.
They just grab all legal parts of the government "legally".
Then there are no reactions and no complaints.
It is all "legal".

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A Family of Nazi Sympathizers
Posted by: macdon1 on Dec 30, 2007 2:53 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As I have pointed out many times, history clearly tells us that George W. Bush's grandfather and the founder of the Bush dynasty was a Nazi sympathizer who was in business with the man (Theissen) who bankrolled Hitler. The greedy power hungry rich seem to take to fascism like a duck takes to water. W is not the first Bush to regard the Constitution as "just a piece of paper" and the richest elite as his "base". As for the rest of us we can just go to he--.

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VOCA, now !
Posted by: HeKnew on Dec 30, 2007 6:21 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
A Vote of Confidence Amendment will enable the American voting public to dismiss any elected official who fails in their obligation to serve the people of the United States.

VOCA, now

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The Nazis were fighting the neocons
Posted by: Dietrich on Dec 30, 2007 8:52 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Nazis were fighting their neocons.

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One difference between '30's German and 2008 USA is...
Posted by: aka_bozo on Dec 31, 2007 1:38 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The peasants here are rich by comparison with their ‘30’s German counterparts. In fact, superrich by COMPARISION; the Germans had just gotten defeated in a war and had hyper-inflation. The US has won every war it’s ever fought (and YES, I’m including Vietnam, which ANY dumb-ass `merican peasant knows Rambo won – in spite of “those liberals”) and EVERYBODY has an SUV.

The average US peasant is unaffected by anything “their” government does. They pay their taxes – which aren’t onerous enough to get upset about – and live their lives. If the average peasant isn’t worked up about Iraq, why would something like “surveillance” be important (unless it involves football, of course).

What you liberals (progressives, leftists, socialists, whatEVER) are really upset about is that the dumb-ass `merican peasants have embraced a “big government” philosophy of life, but NOT your big government. The peasants like their kick-ass “big daddy” government "watching over them" instead of your preference of a “smothering mommy” government. But still, how ironic to listen to “big government” types complaining about peasants loving big government!

Save us Hillary, you’re our only hope to make the government bigger so the fascist will go away.

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The ones that have what it takes..
Posted by: coñoloco on Jan 1, 2008 12:42 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Some people know how its done,like Ray McGovern .He,and others excia operatives
others like general Battista,know how to topple
regimes,they are masters of intrigue,plots etc.
They expect us,mr nobody to do the job ?
Come on,some needs ass wetting,if those fish
are to be fried.

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» RE: run on AK47's Posted by: aka_bozo
Both Parties are Owned
Posted by: ronheri on Jan 2, 2008 3:52 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Only Ron Paul can begin to get us out of this foreign policy/financial nightmare our politicians have created. He's our last hope.

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Arie
Posted by: arieden on Jan 2, 2008 4:03 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Someone above has already suggested it, but it is worth repeating: Read THE END OF AMERICA by Naomi Wolf and then give it to a friend to read. It will scare the hell out of a lot of people and hopefully wake them up.

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Lead, follow or get the hell out of the way. Stop the rhetoric. Stop Participating in the Matrix
Posted by: common intelligence on Jan 2, 2008 8:48 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Everyone is whining but who's takling to the voters and who's listening to the candidates instead of the issues. I don't even know how those in office can be called leadship.

Even my favorite Senator Russel Feingold can't scream loud enough or has the balls to jump down the presidents throat and cut out his gizzard.

All this wallaring around this stinking soup of political BS is useless.

Unless the media is taken over and truth is instilled the matrix illusion will be contued to be broadcasted 24/7 in HDTV.
(Ever notice how we're being lured into buying one of these plasm/LCD/LED Hd monitors more and more at in credibly low prices while gas prices keep everyone closer to home?)

Stop Participating in the Matrix. It's no coincidense such a movie or book is made just for entertainment. We've all been warned but you all continue to play the game.

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Can the Nazi crap
Posted by: Staggo on Jan 3, 2008 12:21 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This incessant drumbeat regarding the US going the way of Nazi Germany is incredibly ignorant and pathetically lame. Learn History, folks. The difference is incredible. While the incursions against our civil liberties are real and disturbing, this superficial Nazi obsession has run its course. Learn history, not pick and choose from it.

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» RE: Can the Nazi crap Posted by: RSOlive
» Couldn't have said it better. Posted by: thekidde
Germans will have nothing on American Fascism.
Posted by: Dyolfknip on Jan 4, 2008 8:36 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I don't think American fascism will be much like Nazi Germany... It will be worse: Stronger, Smarter, and globally accepted. In many ways there already are the typical fascist elements: Supremacy of the state, Extreme nationalism, glorification of the military, the us vs them doctrine, trading of freedom for "security" etc etc. But what will make American fascism so successful is that it is already accepted worldwide! We buy their products, their culture and thirst for their lifestyle (their perceived lifestyle that is).

Never did the Germans have the world wide support the Americans have traditionally held. The reason is simple: Hitler did not hide what he was after, he wanted complete control, "living space for the master race", and the eradication of "international Jewery". The only people who sided with him were like minded psychos or countries too close and too weak to oppose him. On the other hand America has always been perceived as the "good guys"; Even after atrocities such as the Vietnam war, the backing of Pinochet and the funding of wars the world over everybody seems to trust that America always had the best intentions for everyone. This trust has allowed American institutions and corporations to infect almost every nation on the planet leading to the adoption of American interests alongside one's own national interests.

The appeasement policy which aided Hitler in his rise to power has been re-run these last six decades only exponentially more so; Truly, American appeasement is still an important factor in many governments decisions. Even though America is engaging in a war that can be described anywhere from needlessly bellicose to Genocidal they still have enormous world wide support. Many countries that did not support the neocon resource grab... sorry "the War on terror" still have American bases and troops in their country. History shows that a policy of appeasement will only embolden a belligerent power to greater excesses as was the case in 1938 when Germany annexed Austria and the Sudetenland portion of Czechoslovakia. Both these acts were condemned by the international community but allowed and there was "peace in (their) time". Instead of outright invasion American style imperialism has taken a more financial and supportive role, some examples include: Vietnam, Cuba, Columbia, Chile, Nicaragua, Iran, and Iraq 1 amongst many many others. In march 1939 Germany brazenly defied the international community and annexed the rest of Czechoslovakia but still everyone avoided confrontation and appeased the Germans much the same way the USA defied the world community by invading Iraq. The next question is what will be America's "Poland"? What will it take to spark a full scale world wide opposition to American imperialism?

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» RE: You are right Pink Floyd!!! Posted by: riotoustanpdx
HITLER/BUSH
Posted by: PROFPETE on Jan 5, 2008 11:48 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
RAY:
Thanks for an interesting article.
Professor Emeritus Pete Bagnolo, here, student of the current fascist/Nazi regime. When I began citing the Bushites© as Fascists and those who elected them as similar in submissiveness to the rapt people of Germany in the 1930's-'40's, I was excoriated even by many of my own readers-that was in mid-2002, when I objected to an attempt of war upon Iraq.

When I referred to the Bushites© as having 3 bibles: Mein Kampf, Orwell's 1984 and a distorted version of the New and Old Testaments, I was lambasted more.

When My short story; LOST SEASONS: THE ONCE AND FUTURE LEGENDS OF MYTHIC BASEBALL-1996-1998, was expanded to a novel in 2000 and kicked around the publishing rounds until picked up in 2002 and released in 2003/04 which predicted everything that has happened since, I was attacked by fascists once more, but a few critics called it “Prophetic.” It was poorly edited, and worsely marketed and resulting in selling like Radio-active Manhole covers. However, later when it was realized that it was at least prophetic, it resulted in a three-book deal upon which I now labor.

While I am certain that you were also among the early doubters or adversaries of the Bushites©, I am so happy that now many others have joined those of us who were there first, voices crying out in a wilderness of cyber paper and ink, even if they came along after the fact.

When I have the time my hobby aside from reading, is writing op-eds for opednews.com. Peek at my stuff if you have a chance under the WRITERS ARCHIVES button and listed as PROFESSOR EMERITUS PETER BAGNOLO.

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parallels and differences.
Posted by: whealeydj on Jan 5, 2008 12:27 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We alternet types are too ready easy to use Nazi to label the Bushites. as the end of the article indicates all political parties were disbanded within six months of Hitler becoming chancellor.. 2006 showed that although wars are initially popular, when they become dragged out and more is revealed about domestic spying American have begun begin to rebel. If you are a registered Democrat run for Congress against your go along Democrat or your loyal Bushie Republican. Run as a dDmocrat even if you there is little difference; the liberals and progressives have to take the control away from the DLC types that are as pro militarist and pro interventionist as the neo cons. Just don't expect to actually win since so many Americans are conservative or apolitical. Remember that Nader only got 3% in 2000 whereas Perot got 18% in 1992 so there are six time as many right wingers as left wingers. If your congressperson voted for patriot act or for ending habeas corpus use that as your primary issue against him. maybe he will reconsider his position when you get 40% of the vote in primary

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fascism is america
Posted by: HANGTRAITORS on Jan 6, 2008 7:31 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
weve been fascist for a hundred years... the takeover began with kennedys death

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Creeping Fascism 2008
Posted by: Dianka on Jan 8, 2008 2:02 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Fascism is built on a foundation of scapegoatism, and scapegoatism defines our politics and policies today, from our welfare "reform" agenda to our profitable prison system to health care to our international policies. It can exist only with the consent (or implied consent) of the masses.

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