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A Vote for Mukasey Is a Vote for Torture

By Amy Goodman, King Features Syndicate. Posted November 7, 2007.


If a U.S. citizen, soldier or official were waterboarded somewhere overseas, would Americans hesitate for a moment to call it torture?

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Judge Michael Mukasey admits waterboarding is repugnant, but refuses to say whether it amounts to torture. Yet Democratic Sens. Charles Schumer and Dianne Feinstein voted for his confirmation as U.S. attorney general anyway. Mukasey, Schumer and Feinstein should talk to French journalist Henri Alleg. An editor of a paper in Algeria, he was waterboarded by the French military in 1957, when the French were trying to crush the Algerian independence movement. The 86-year-old journalist spoke to me from his home in Paris:

"I was put on a plank, on a board, fastened to it and taken to a tap [water faucet]. And my face was covered with a rag. Very quickly, the rag was completely full of water. You have the impression of being drowned. And the water ran all over my face. I couldn't breathe. It's a terrible, terrible impression of torture and of death, being near death."

Journalist Stephen Grey, whose documentary "Extraordinary Rendition" airs on PBS stations this week, told me: "I, like many journalists, should issue a correction, an apology really, because we all reported waterboarding as a simulated drowning. It is clear from those who did it, this is actual drowning ... this is something that shocks the conscience and therefore is torture."

In a remarkable demonstration of commitment to his job, former acting Assistant Attorney General Daniel Levin, according to ABC News, underwent waterboarding when tasked by the White House to rework its official position on torture in 2004. Concluding that waterboarding is torture, he was forced out of his job.

On Monday, Nov. 5, anti-torture activists engaged in an actual demonstration of waterboarding outside the Department of Justice. Twenty-six-year-old actor Maboud Ebrahimzadeh volunteered to be the victim. After the session, he was near tears: "It is the most terrifying experience I have ever had. And although this is a controlled environment, when water goes into your lungs and you want to scream and you cannot, as soon as you do you will choke."

Four retired military judge advocates general wrote a letter to Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Patrick Leahy stating, "Waterboarding is inhumane, it is torture, and it is illegal." Twenty-four former intelligence agents and analysts agreed with the JAGs, adding, "Whether or not the practice is currently in use by U.S. intelligence, it should in fact be easy for him to respond."

Yet Mukasey told the Senate Judiciary Committee, "I don't know what's involved in the technique, if waterboarding is torture."

In the Judiciary hearing when the votes were cast, Leahy said: "No senator should abet this administration's legalistic obfuscations by those such as Alberto Gonzales, John Yoo and David Addington by agreeing that the laws on the books do not already make waterboarding illegal. We have been prosecuting water torture for more than 100 years."

U.S. soldiers have been prosecuted for participating in waterboarding in the Philippines in 1901 and Vietnam in 1968. The U.S. imprisoned a Japanese officer in 1947 for using waterboarding against U.S. troops in World War II.

Sen. Edward Kennedy added: "Make no mistake about it: Waterboarding is already illegal under United States law. It is illegal under the Geneva Conventions, which prohibit 'outrages upon personal dignity,' including cruel, humiliating and degrading treatment. It is illegal under the Torture Act, which prohibits acts 'specifically intended to inflict severe physical or mental pain or suffering.' It is illegal under the Detainee Treatment Act, which prohibits 'cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment.' And it violates the Constitution."

He went on: "Waterboarding is slow-motion suffocation with enough time to contemplate the inevitability of blackout and expiration--usually the person goes into hysterics on the board. For the uninitiated, it is horrifying to watch, and if it goes wrong, it can lead straight to terminal hypoxia. When done right, it is controlled death."

Republican Sen. Arlen Specter, who voted for Mukasey's confirmation, said Congress should pass a law forbidding waterboarding, having received assurances from Mukasey that he would uphold such a law. What if President Bush vetoed the law, or if he issued one of his signing statements used to sidestep bills he signs into law?

Despite all this, Schumer's and Feinstein's votes for Mukasey mean the Judiciary Committee has voted 11 to 8 to recommend his appointment as attorney general to the full Senate. From war funding to torture, you have to ask, If the Republicans were in the majority, would there be any difference?

Now only the full Senate can block Mukasey's appointment. Maybe at least one senator will step up and filibuster the confirmation, just long enough for Mukasey to research and announce his opinion on whether waterboarding amounts to torture. If a U.S. citizen, soldier or official were waterboarded somewhere overseas, would Americans hesitate for a moment to call it torture? A filibuster might give the Mukasey supporters like Schumer and Feinstein pause to reconsider. For starters, they should talk to Henri Alleg.


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Amy Goodman is the host of the nationally syndicated radio news program, Democracy Now!

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No...
Posted by: JoshuaLudd on Nov 7, 2007 12:33 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Any votes for the Dems who allowed this are votes for torture.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» VIOLENCE IS THE ANSWER Posted by: goatse
» Other Options Posted by: EKSwitaj
Our state of affairs
Posted by: Drclaw on Nov 7, 2007 1:02 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
An anonymous public servant subjects himself to waterboarding as part of his effort to understand it, and craft a legal opinon on its use. He recognizes its true natue and names it torture. His opinion is supressed by our government, he is discredited and fired.

A feckless lawyer testifies before Congress, using legal mumbo-jumbo to avoid stating the truth: water boarding is torture. He is praised for his judicious temperment, wisdom and honor, and nominated for the position of upholding the laws of our land.

We are a nation of cowards, led by a lying, bumbling hypocrite who is aided by by a sycophantic congress of clowns and blackguards. The majority of us belive waterboarding is torture, yet nearly 50% of us believe we should be allowed to do it.

May god have mercy on us all-although we clearly do not deserve it.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» Mercy is undeserved. Posted by: PJAW
Not an inch!
Posted by: talkville on Nov 8, 2007 1:57 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There's a declared, express and articulated objective of expropriating and appropriating human and juridical control of the very definition of the word "torture" - deliberately set against and in contradiction to prior agreed upon limits as set by the Geneva Conventions and other international documentation dealing with conditions of war and allowable treatments of human beings. The effort is theoretical and it is very disturbingly practical.

The USA wants expressly to control and command what precisely "fits" or "does not fit" under specific actions of one human against another and included under the word "torture". This governing use of the word is to stand above and outside ANY other person, country or entity. It expressly excludes any participation whatsoever by inter-national and global institutions and organizations concerned with the issue. It is non-democratic on its face and a solid argument can be made to describe this very effort as the effort of a despot -- not only domestically but on the world stage. This is a totalitarian assertion by the Radical Right sectors in OUR government and in control of its direction and policies. An assertion of exclusionary property rights to language as such is becoming normalized, naturalized and is bringing a fundamental barbarism back into vogue. Not an inch! It's time to seriously look at another word: "owner-ship"

Not an inch to Tyranny; not an inch to Despotism; not an inch to fascism and Private Government in any aspect of our lives. A developed, and CIVILIZED person would want to EXTEND and not NARROW the general acts of degradation, indignity and humanity which fall into the generalized conception of "torture".

ANY of the representatives of the people who vote to allow Mukasey into the top position of the top LAW enforcement agency of the USA deserves not an inch of support -- whatever party affiliation they may labor under.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Good Point.
Posted by: PJAW on Nov 8, 2007 5:26 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
A good point is made by "Talkville" above. Bush and his minions have persistently claimed they are not in violation of the law by simply redefining what the law says, and more importantly what it means.

"I'm not standing on my head, everyone knows that when you stand, your feet are on the bottom. That's obvious, so how can I be violating the law against standing on your head, it can't be done." His and their arguments are just that juvenile. It's as if Pee Wee Herman fell into the White House and became President and then revealed the malevolent side of his character.

It's been said before, but it's so far outside the personal experience of most people that they don't grasp the significance of it. Throughout his entire life, Bush has never been held accountable for anything or suffered any consequences for his actions. Not that I've seen anyway. Because of this, he no doubt feels that he is incapable of doing wrong and therefore anything he does should be redefined as right. If it's presently defined as wrong, well then someone has the definition backwards and we need to straighten that out.

As far as torture goes, I knew we were in trouble when someone asked his brother Jeb if he thought George was "tough enough" to be president. Jeb related the story of how George would come home from school and chase the younger boys around the house with a BB gun. This is the Bush family definition of toughness, tormenting those over whom you hold power. It doesn't have to be done for any particular reason other than you enjoy it.

These guys don't torture people to get information, they torture people to create terror among everyone who disagrees with their personal view of how the world should be. And they enjoy it.

Impeachment will not happen until we the people demand it. It's the most important political action of your life, right now. Study it, understand it, demand it.

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It goes way beyond "waterboarding".
Posted by: PJAW on Nov 8, 2007 5:37 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The idea that "waterboarding" must be specifically designated as torture in a "new" law, give carte blanc permission to do anything and everything else not specifically included in that law, at least in the way that these jackals interpret things. And it would also provide them a legal argument that all the evil things they have done thus far (most specifically waterboarding) are completely acceptable, because they weren't previously defined as torture.

Of course they are, but passage of a law would be the new starting point. Kind of like getting "overs".

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

So...
Posted by: JoshuaLudd on Nov 8, 2007 6:27 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
So at this point a vote for a Republican is a vote for Torture... and a vote for a number of democrats is a vote for torture.

About time we break with the strict two party system.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

The soldiers of the USA have always suffered from being tortured
Posted by: mindportal1 on Nov 8, 2007 7:08 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It doesn't matter if it was WWII or Korea or Vietnam. Torture was the norm. It didn't matter what our thoughts and perspectives were on the subject as our enemies perpetrated it. So there is no argument that it will only make it worse for our troops. The argument is the difference between enhanced interrogation and torture.

Is the putting of underwear on the head of a prisoner or piling them naked in a room torture? NO! That is bad conduct. And those that do that have and should be punished. But what about prisoners that have information about the possible killing of innocents. When I take the subway or go to a ball game, I want to be protected from those that want to blow me up. If a conspiracy is discovered thru a wiretap that had a warrant, how do they get the info from those people?

Now I have heard all kinds of ways to torture someone. Is sleep deprivation different than using electrodes to the gonads? I think so. When waterboarding is used versus using a drill on a hand, what is the outcome? An hour after waterboarding you might need to piss, but an hour after the drill, there is permanent damage and loss of blood, not to mention immense pain.
But the USA does not use a drill, or shocks to the 'nads. But our enemies do . Who has the high ground here?

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Blue Skeletons
Posted by: jim_altman on Nov 8, 2007 8:29 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Travel back in time to the 1970's. During the trial of Soviet dissident Anatoly Shcharansky, United Nations Ambassador Andrew Young whipped up a controversy when he told a French newspaper that there are "hundreds, maybe thousands, of people I would categorize as political prisoners" in the US Young later said he did not mean to equate political freedom in the US and the Soviet Union. But he did not retract his statement about the number of U. S. political prisoners - even though he never said exactly what he meant. (You can look it up)

Bush and Company are counting on the Democrats to avoid revealing their own blue skeletons hidden in CIA closets. There is the usual bluster, followed by the occasional filibuster, concluding with strangely reticent resignation. Aw shucks! Everyone else has done it, so why shouldn't we?

The fact that our congress can't answer that with binding legislation proves both blue and red are up to their well-covered posteriority in culpability.

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Yet another scumbag
Posted by: willymack on Nov 8, 2007 9:14 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
For the bush menagerie. If our gutless "congress" doesn't comfirm him, he'll merely give him-or someone even worse- a recess appointment, and the neocom juggernaut will continue rolling merrily along.

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Mukasey is AG
Posted by: Jeanne on Nov 8, 2007 10:02 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Mukasey was approved and the following notable turncoats and wimpouts voted (or didn't).
Bayh (D-IN), Yea
Biden (D-DE), Not Voting
Carper (D-DE), Yea
Clinton (D-NY), Not Voting
Dodd (D-CT), Not Voting
Feinstein (D-CA), Yea
Landrieu (D-LA), Yea
Lieberman (ID-CT), Yea
McCain (R-AZ), Not Voting
Nelson (D-NE), Yea
Obama (D-IL), Not Voting
Schumer (D-NY), Yea

It is notable that a vast majority of the cowards-who-would-be-president failed to register their votes. Even John McCain could not bring himself to stand up to the Republican minority (?). The Republicans, to the last member (save McCain), voted to uphold their hapless leader's appointment of another puppet AG. And the Democrats, as usual, folded or failed to vote. What is this I heard about a Democratic majority in both houses of Congress? Someone can't count.

So this makes it official: Torture is the policy of the US government. It has now been endorsed by the executive, judicial and legislative branches.

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» RE: Mukasey is AG Posted by: UnEasyOne
No to your question
Posted by: DesertStone on Nov 9, 2007 6:58 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"If a U.S. citizen, soldier or official were waterboarded somewhere overseas, would Americans hesitate for a moment to call it torture? "

NO ABSOLUTELY NOT. I recall reading message boards and the out rage people had over the British sailors being captured in Iran. The racist epithets were really flying with that one. These same people make light of torture and liken Abu Ghraib to “hazing”.

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And Regretably
Posted by: talkville on Nov 11, 2007 3:25 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Both sides of the Party of Capital capitulated, refused to filibuster and thus expressed their tolerance for nuance in the struggle to abolish torture, metaphysics and barbarism in social relations, further weakening and invalidating the very costly and tragic expressions of the Geneva Conventions.

Just another Turn in the Business Cycle. Torture's on the path to legitimation -- re-call the Monks and prepare for the Return of the Repressed. Civitas Dei In Mundus! Ad Gloriam Deus -- Confess!

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And in the case where the victim is innocent?
Posted by: EinMD on Nov 12, 2007 11:58 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What is it then? Pay per view?

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Drowning
Posted by: janelynne on Nov 14, 2007 7:39 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If during waterboarding, water enters the lungs, pneumonia can ensue. If the person is not treated aggressively, they can drown later in their own body fluid. It is torture, it is attempted murder, battery, and unmitigated cruelty. The over arching excuse for this is to extract the truth. No truth can derive from such brutality. Feinstein and Schumer have demonstrated a mentality that is defacto conservative. They must be stripped of the trusted influence that they have enjoyed. The masks are off in the definitive dichotomy of separate values in our culture. Democrats need to be willing to stand up for what is right, and band together, however the chips may fall.

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