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White House Leak: Cheney's Plan for Iran Attack Starts With Israeli Missile Strike

By Gregor Peter Schmitz and Cordula Meyer, Der Spiegel. Posted October 26, 2007.


High-ranking military experts say an attack would lead to world economic chaos, or even what Bush calls 'World War III.'

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US Vice President Dick Cheney -- the power behind the throne, the eminence grise, the man with the (very) occasional grandfatherly smile -- is notorious for his propensity for secretiveness and behind-the-scenes manipulation. He's capable of anything, say friends as well as enemies. Given this reputation, it's no big surprise that Cheney has already asked for a backroom analysis of how a war with Iran might begin.

In the scenario concocted by Cheney's strategists, Washington's first step would be to convince Israel to fire missiles at Iran's uranium enrichment plant in Natanz. Tehran would retaliate with its own strike, providing the US with an excuse to attack military targets and nuclear facilities in Iran.

This information was leaked by an official close to the vice president. Cheney himself hasn't denied engaging in such war games. For years, in fact, he's been open about his opinion that an attack on Iran, a member of US President George W. Bush's "Axis of Evil," is inevitable.

Given these not-too-secret designs, Democrats and Republicans alike have wondered what to make of the still mysterious Israeli bombing run in Syria on Sept. 6. Was it part of an existing war plan? A test run, perhaps? For days after the attack, one question dominated conversation at Washington receptions: How great is the risk of war, really?

Grandiose Plans, East and West

In the September strike, Israeli bombers were likely targeting a nuclear reactor under construction, parts of which are alleged to have come from North Korea. It is possible that key secretaries in the Bush cabinet even tried to stop Israel. To this day, the administration has neither confirmed nor commented on the attack.

Nevertheless, in Washington, Israel's strike against Syria has revived the specter of war with Iran. For the neoconservatives it could represent a glimmer of hope that the grandiose dream of a democratic Middle East has not yet been buried in the ashes of Iraq. But for realists in the corridors of the State Department and the Pentagon, military action against Iran is a nightmare they have sought to avert by asking a simple question: "What then?"

The Israeli strike, or something like it, could easily mark the beginning of the "World War III," which President Bush warned against last week. With his usual apocalyptic rhetoric, he said Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad could lead the region to a new world war if his nation builds a nuclear bomb.

Conditions do look ripe for disaster. Iran continues to acquire and develop the fundamental prerequisites for a nuclear weapon. The mullah regime receives support -- at least moral support, if not technology -- from a newly strengthened Russia, which these days reaches for every chance to provoke the United States. President Vladimir Putin's own (self-described) "grandiose plan" to restore Russia's armed forces includes a nuclear buildup. The war in Iraq continues to drag on without an end in sight or even an opportunity for US troops to withdraw in a way that doesn't smack of retreat. In Afghanistan, NATO troops are struggling to prevent a return of the Taliban and al-Qaida terrorists. The Palestinian conflict could still reignite on any front.

In Washington, Bush has 15 months left in office. He may have few successes to show for himself, but he's already thinking of his legacy. Bush says he wants diplomacy to settle the nuclear dispute with Tehran, and hopes international pressure will finally convince Ahmadinejad to come to his senses. Nevertheless, the way pressure has been building in Washington, preparations for war could be underway.

In late September, the US Senate voted to declare the 125,000-man Iranian Revolutionary Guard a terrorist organization. High-ranking US generals have accused Iran of waging a "proxy war" against the United States through its support of Shiite militias in Iraq. And strategists at the Pentagon, apparently at Cheney's request, have developed detailed plans for an attack against Tehran.

Instead of the previous scenario of a large-scale bombardment of the country's many nuclear facilities, the current emphasis is, once again, on so-called surgical strikes, primarily against the quarters of the Revolutionary Guards. This sort of attack would be less massive than a major strike against Iran's nuclear facilities.

Conservative think tanks and pundits who sense this could be their last chance to implement their agenda in the Middle East have supported and disseminated such plans in the press. Despite America's many failures in Iraq, these hawks have urged the weakened president to act now, accusing him of having lost sight of his principal agenda and no longer daring to apply his own doctrine of pre-emptive strikes.

Sheer Lunacy?

The notion of war with Iran has spilled over into other circles, too. Last Monday Nancy Pelosi, the Democratic Speaker of the US House of Representatives, made it clear that the president would first need Congressional approval to launch an attack. Meanwhile, Republican candidates for the White House have debated whether they would even allow such details to get in their way. Former Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney said he would consult his attorneys to determine whether the US Constitution does, in fact, require a president to ask for Congressional approval before going to war. Vietnam veteran John McCain said war with Iran was "maybe closer to reality than we are discussing tonight."

Democratic frontrunner Hillary Clinton has also adopted a hawkish stance, voting in favor of the Senate measure to classify the Revolutionary Guard as a terrorist organization. Her rivals criticized Clinton for giving the administration a blank check to go to war.

The US military is building a base in Iraq less than 10 kilometers (about six miles) from Iran's border. The facility, known as Combat Outpost Shocker, is meant for American soldiers preventing Iranian weapons from being smuggled into Iraq. But it's also rumored that Bush authorized US intelligence agencies in April to run sabotage missions against the mullah regime on Iranian soil.

Gary Sick is an expert on Iran who served as a military adviser under three presidents. He believes that such preparations mark a significant shift in the government's strategy. "Since August," says Sick, "the emphasis is no longer on the Iranian nuclear threat," but on Iran's support for terrorism in Iraq. "This is a complete change and is potentially dangerous."

It would be relatively easy for Bush to prove that Tehran, by supporting insurgents in Iraq, is responsible for the deaths of American soldiers. It might be harder to prove that Iran's nuclear plans pose an immediate threat to the world. Besides, the nuclear argument is reminiscent of an embarrassing precedent, when the Bush administration used the claim that Saddam Hussein possessed weapons of mass destruction -- which he didn't -- as a reason to invade Iraq. Even if the evidence against Tehran proves to be more damning, the American public will find it difficult to swallow this argument again.

The forces urging a diplomatic resolution also look stronger than they were before Iraq. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice wants the next step to be a third round of even tighter sanctions against Iran in the UN Security Council. Rice has powerful allies at the Pentagon: Defense Secretary Robert Gates and Admiral William Fallon, head of US Central Command, which is responsible for American forces throughout the region.

Rice and her cohorts all favor diplomacy, partly because they know the military is under strain. After four years in Iraq and Afghanistan, the US lacks manpower for another major war, especially one against a relatively well-prepared adversary. "For many senior people at the Pentagon, the CIA and the State Department, a war would be sheer lunacy," says security expert Sick.

Bruce Riedel, a former CIA officer and now a Middle East expert at the Brookings Institution, agrees. A war against Tehran would be "a disaster for the entire world," says Riedel, who worries about a "battlefield extending from the Mediterranean to the Indian subcontinent." Nevertheless, he believes there is a "realistic risk of a military conflict," because both sides look willing to carry things to the brink.

On the one hand, says Riedel, Iran is playing with fire, challenging the West by sending weapons to Shiite insurgents in Iraq. On the other hand, hotheads in Washington are by no means powerless. Although many neoconservative hawks have left the Bush administration, Cheney remains their reliable partner. "The vice president is the closest adviser to the president, and a dominant figure," says Riedel. "One shouldn't underestimate how much power he still wields."

'Is it 1938 Again?'

Russian President Vladimir Putin's visit to Tehran last week also played into the hands of hardliners in Washington, who read it as proof that Putin isn't serious about joining the West's effort to convince Tehran to abandon its drive for a nuclear weapon. Moreover, the countries bordering the Caspian Sea, including Central Asian nations Washington has courted energetically in recent years, have said they would not allow a war against Tehran to be launched from their territory.

Cheney derives much of his support from hawks outside the administration who fear their days are as numbered as the President's. "The neocons see Iran as their last chance to prove something," says analyst Riedel. This aim is reflected in their tone. Conservative columnist Norman Podhoretz, for example -- a father figure to all neocons -- wrote in the Wall Street Journal that he "hopes and prays" that Bush will finally bomb Iran. Podhoretz sees the United States engaged in a global war against "Islamofascism," a conflict he defines as World War IV, and he likens Iran to Nazi Germany. "Is it 1938 again?" he asks in a speech he repeats regularly at conferences.

Podhoretz is by no means an eccentric outsider. He now serves as a senior foreign-policy adviser to Republican presidential candidate Rudolph Giuliani. President Bush has also met with Podhoretz at the White House to hear his opinions.

Nevertheless, most experts in Washington warn against attacking Tehran. They assume the Iranians would retaliate. "It would be foolish to believe surgical strikes will be enough," says Riedel, who believes that precision attacks would quickly escalate to war.

Former presidential adviser Sick thinks Iran would strike back with terrorist attacks. "The generals of the Revolutionary Guard have had several years to think about asymmetrical warfare," says Sick. "They probably have a few rather interesting ideas."

According to Sick, detonating well-placed bombs at oil terminals in the Persian Gulf would be enough to wreak havoc. "Insurance costs would skyrocket, causing oil prices to triple and triggering a global recession," Sick warns. "The economic consequences would be enormous, far greater than anything we have experienced with Iraq so far."

Because the catastrophic consequences of an attack on Iran are obvious, many in Washington have a fairly benign take on the current round of saber rattling. They believe the sheer dread of war is being used to bolster diplomatic efforts to solve the crisis and encourage hesitant members of the United Nations Security Council to take more decisive action. The Security Council, this argument goes, will be more likely to approve tighter sanctions if it believes that war is the only alternative.

Translated from the German by Christopher Sultan

AlterNet is making this material available in accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107: This article is distributed without profit to those who have expressed a prior interest in receiving the included information for research and educational purposes.

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I hate to agreed with a right winger
Posted by: compu on Oct 26, 2007 12:53 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I think this is wrong,read this instead;

http://buchanan.org/blog/?p=869

-- from a newly strengthened Russia, which these days reaches for every chance to provoke the United States. President Vladimir Putin's own (self-described) "grandiose plan" to restore Russia's armed forces inclu
------------------

It is time to STOP the insanity.
Posted by: Susan Kipping on Oct 26, 2007 1:40 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Cheney and his masters cannot have their New World Order with the United States standing as a super power. The United States is being destroyed from within for this reason. The Illuminati and powerful elite have wanted to control the US for a long time. They have slowly plotted. Secrecy, lies and misinformation have kept the citizens confused, divided and misled. Constructive chaos at any cost is their motto. There are no rules. So of course torture, murder and rape are o.k. Why wouldn't they be when your eye is on total world dominance.

Our Congress and Senate are in on this. It is difficult for people to believe. But stop and think about what has been happening. Look at the craziness all around us and we can't seem to do a thing about it. Our economy, these wars, our rights, our constitution, our media; all out of control. There is no war on drugs. Drugs, guns and oil are big business. There is not war on poverty. There is no war on Terrorism. There is only a war on us.

We need to impeach Bush and Cheney now. This will start an investigation into other problems were are having. Possibly the answers around 9/11 will become available. People need to be held accountable. Enough excuses from our officials. We need action now. The '08 election is not going to solve a thing. It is too far away and will have let this administration off the hook without answering for their actions (crimes).

Impeach.

» Jefferson and the Declaration Posted by: daytripper
» Also, Jefferson: Posted by: justAnEgg
Richard B. Cheney 1941-2007
Posted by: Tom Degan on Oct 26, 2007 2:50 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Dick Cheney is a very sick man. Yeah, I know what you're thinking, he's crazier than a bed bug. But I wasn't referring to the state of his mental health. I was talking about his physical condition. It in my opinion that he will be the first vice-president since Garrett Hobart (McKinley's first VP) to die in office. Believe me it gives me neither joy nor smug satisfaction to have to tell you this. After all, the man is a human being....I think....But we have to look at this realistically: He is sixty-six years old, he is in terrible condition, he has had a history of heart attacks. It is not a mere hypothesis, it is almost assured:

Dick Cheney is going to drop dead any day now.

Don't feel sorry for him when the end comes. It'll probably be so fast, the old bastard won't even know what hit him. Hopefully he'll be tucked soundly asleep in his bed. Don't weep for him. Even though he never led a good life, he did have a jolly fun time not leading a good life! He was a Congressman; then a Secretary of Defence; then a CEO of a major corporation, then the vice-President of the United States! That's about as far as a body can go, Bubbah! And he made money! Lots and lots and lots and lots and lots and lots of money while making the lives of scores of millions of people around the globe fucking miserable! No. Don't weep for Dick Cheney.

Are these calumnous things to say on my part? I don't believe so. When a crazed gunman enters a public eatery, starts shooting at every man, woman and child in sight and suddenly drops dead of a massive stroke, you don't feel any sense of grief for the guy - you feel relieved! Duh! Trust me on this one campers: His imminent demise can only be seen as the best thing for our beloved, once-great nation.

A dead Dick Cheney is a safe Dick Cheney.

Let's hope the end of his life comes before the lives of so many innocent people in Iran.

Tom Degan
Goshen, NY
"The Rant" by Tom Degan

» RE: ichard B. Cheney 1941-2007 Posted by: andrushka
» Eminem will be happy! Posted by: andy
» RE: minem will be happy! Posted by: hellofriends
» RE: minem will be happy! Posted by: andy
» RE:Dirt nap Posted by: Sushi
» RE: Richard B. Cheney 1941-2007 Posted by: TruthBeTold
» RE: Richard B. Cheney 1941-2007 Posted by: starvinmarvy
Afterthought
Posted by: Tom Degan on Oct 26, 2007 3:29 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I was just wondering:

Would it be a federal offence to send a Tripple Whopper with Bacon and Cheese to the vice-president's residence?

Just a thought....

Tom Degan

» RE: Afterthought Posted by: Grandma Crabby
» RE: Afterthought Posted by: Tom Degan
» RE: Afterthought Posted by: K_for_Kansas
Israeli Nazis, Zionists, Fascists are used by Amerikan fascists.
Posted by: Perfectclue on Oct 26, 2007 3:46 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I have always said that the only way the elites can become a unifed fascist shock force is not for the U.S. first to attack, as then the servile class liberals, a few handful of them might find a critique on the way they attacked, rathter than it is flat out criminal and aggression.

To avoid this, my argument always has been that the U.S. needs Israeli nazis to carry out the aggression, because the corporate democrats have just as many zionist thugs in their ranks, neocon appeasers, and have proven in every war that involves Israeli aggression that they will defend their fascism.
If Israel attacks, the majority of corporate democrats, especially its front runner Presidential candidates, and its corporate leadership, Pelosi, Reid, have already voted several times for threats, sanctions, illegal aggressions by taking out the provision for Congress to force Bush to seek a declaration of war required by Congress.

Of course what most class liberals here do not understand, the class ideology of liberalism is not about cowardice, but about servility to corporate interests, fascist imperial class nationalism, and Empire. Every democrat except a handful, particularly Kucinich and Gravels will condemn these Nazis, aggressors, whether they are American thugs, or Zionist Israeli thugs. Most of the front tier candidates will capitulate, appease as they always have done, as the Corporate media has done, by echoing the lies, and propaganda for Zionism.

These rogue states, Israel and America, particularly their ideological support for these fascist foreign policies must be taken on directly, by demanding every class whore who routinely shows up at AIPAC, The Israeli lobby for corporate money, must declare that such an invasion is completely illegal and anyone who fudges the answer must be put on the list for impeachment. I suspect we will have many war criminals, democrats and republicans already signed up for the Hague international trials, as many of them already are complicit war criminals for their enabling, appeasing support of the illegal Iraqi invasion,and endless occupation, torture, and capitulation to spying. Time for a social revolution. Throw this system out, i.e. class oligarchy for real democracy and social wealth, a fully developed middle class, not subordinated, corrupted by class masters, oligarchies.

This comment has been removed from the site due to non-compliance with AlterNet's community policies.
» RE: ODNOX Posted by: diarmaid
» RE: ODNOX Posted by: Joshua Holland
logi_bare
Posted by: logi_bare on Oct 26, 2007 6:00 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What concerns me is the level of apathy of the American people. Bush , Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice, and Powell lied about the reasons to go to war with Iraq. Paul Bremer set up a puppet government in Iraq with the purpose of directing the sell of Iraqi resources on the world market. American troops have been charged with the deaths of Iraqi citizens and once back in the US they are found innocent of the war crime of murdering non combatant's. Over a million Iraqi's have been forced out their country and are now refugee's in Jordan, and Syria. (Doesn't anyone remember that right after 9-11-01 Bush wanted the UN to allow Syria to join the UN Security Council?). Our military leaders are arming the same Iraqi's militia's that we claimed were killing our troops. The Democrats will not impeach Bush. They sold out the voters that trusted them to fight for our rights. Hillary Clinton is the best Republican, (let's not kid ourselves she is no democrat) that money can buy. If elected does anyone really think that she won't try a follow through with the planned occupation of the middle east under US military control? War in Iran will not make our country safe. World War 3 is the endgame that Bush wants to secure his sick vision of his place in history. Wake up people. We need to take our country back before the feared mushroom cloud comes from the warhead of a cruise missile, and not from a dirty bomber from Saudi Arabia. By the way I have met marines that have returned from Iraq, and they have all mentioned the presence of Saudis fighting along with the militias. Not Iranians. Don't believe the hype.

» RE: logi_bare Posted by: douglashoyt
» RE: logi_bare Posted by: hellofriends
» Apathy runs deep Posted by: jbur816
» RE: Apathy Runs Deep Posted by: Bright Penny
» RE: Apathy Runs Deep Posted by: jbur816
» RE: Apathy Runs Deep Posted by: Sissi_phus
OBJECTION!
Posted by: Ipsi Dixit on Oct 26, 2007 6:09 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I object to the following passages as showing undue bias: -

"The mullah regime receives support -- at least moral support, if not technology -- from a newly strengthened Russia, which these days reaches for every chance to provoke the United States."

THE USA HAS, EVER SINCE THE END OF THE COLD WAR, BEEN PROVOKING RUSSIA, ADVANCING RIGHT TO THE BORDERS OF THE COUNTRY, SUBVERTING OR ATTEMPTING TO SUBVERT THE GOVERNMENTS OF THE REGION IN MULTI-COLOURED 'REVOLUTIONS' SPONSORED BY THE WEST; SWALLOWED UP THE FORMER WARSAW-PACT COUNTRIES - EVEN THOUGH THEY SAID THEY WOULN'T; PUTTING NATO INTO A RE-UNIFIED GERMANY - EVEN THOUGH GORBOCHEV ALLOWED RE-UNIFICATION ON THE STRICT UNDERSTANDING THIS WOULDN'T HAPPEN; DESTROYED YUGOSLAVIA - A RUSSIAN ALLY; AND NOW TRYING TO PUT NUCLEAR MISSILES IN POLAND, THERBY ALTERING THE BALANCE-OF-POWER IN THE REGION.

"Former presidential adviser Sick thinks Iran would strike back with terrorist attacks."

SO, ATTACKING IRAN WOULDN'T BE A TERRORIST ACT THEN? THE REASONING SEEMS TO BE: I KILL TENS OF THOUSANDS OF YOUR CIVILIANS WITH MY BOMBING AND THAT'S A LEGITIMATE ACT OF WAR (THEY WERE 'COLLATERAL DAMAGE'). YOU KILL A FEW DOZENS, OR A FEW HUNDREDS OF MY PEOPLE IN CAR-BOMB EXPLOSION OR WHAT-HAVE-YOU AND THAT'S 'TERRORISM' (AND BY DEFINITION, ILLEGITIMATE), ALLOWING THE U.S. TO DECLARE THEM 'UNLAWFUL ENEMY COMBATANTS' AND INCARCERATE THEM IN 'BLACK SITES' LIKE ABU GRAIB WHERE THEY CAN BE TORTURED WITH IMPUNITY.

I also object to the use of the term 'regime'. It is obviously being used to de-legitimise the government, implying that, unlike Parliamentary or Liberal democracy as supposedly practiced in The West, the Iranian government is a dictatorship and therefore not a 'proper' government. Just to remind you, the Islamic Republic of Iran IS a democracy (yes, that's right). You might not like it's government, and it might not be a perfect or ideal democracy (is the U.S.A? Is Britian?) but it is still democratic within the constraints laid down by the mullahs (in much the same way as we are democracies within the constraints laid down by corporate facism and it's 'free' market).

» RE: OBJECTION! Posted by: shanaza
» OBJECTION! Posted by: maddy
» RE: OBJECTION! Posted by: dingo
» RE: OBJECTION! Posted by: donl51
And why is Europe still sitting on its ASS instead of standing up to tyranny?
Posted by: maxpayne on Oct 26, 2007 6:28 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If they don't like what the US is doing, they could stand up to tyranny by breaking away from "free" trade pacts and cutting off US ties economically. At least that would go a long ways in forcing the US to stand up to bad leadership. Oh but wait, I forgot that if it were not for the US back in the 1940s, Europe would be speaking German and wearing LEDERHOSEN already !

» A tired old argument. Posted by: colinmeister
» RE: A tired old argument. Posted by: jbur816
I just wish they'd get it over with... the stench reaches to the heights of Heaven
Posted by: xbj on Oct 26, 2007 6:31 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Republican democracy in America has been dead for too long, and it's time to bury its stinking rotting corpse.

Bring it on. But BushCheneyCo: Know that God will not allow you to harm one single hair on any Iranian child's head.

Through China and Russia's nuclear and noncoventional arsenals and handy super-tsunami generating volcano landslides in the Pacific and the Atlantic. Fully ready to stop you at any and all possible cost.

Of course you know this but don't believe they'd dare because your Master Lucifer has promised you the earth. He's lying, as usual.

I'm telling you, THEY WILL DARE. And they will win.

Try it and your country is washed out to sea on both coasts and what little is left will be glowing toast and your pitiful seven-year Empire is taken over by your Rivals. Of course, that's always been the real goal of your Master, hasn't it?

Enjoy hell, boys, enjoy hell. Until he eats you and you are no more. You will be assimilated, last, after seeing everyone else cease to exist.

An all out U.S. police state
Posted by: daw13 on Oct 26, 2007 6:47 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
might be a not unlikely consequence of attacking Iran. Every seems to agree that the Iranians would surely mine the straits of Ormuz creating gigantic oil shortages, causing gasoline at the pumps to go up to ... say, ten dollars a gallon? Immediately millions out of work (no longer earn enough to pay for the fuel to get to work), and soon after homeless. And pissed. How to deal with them? In a country at war it'll be easy (maybe).

Regardless of the risks, this must be the Incumbent's assumption. Is it possible, therefore, that Cheney's war gaming includes a whole 'nother dimension? How to manage a nation likely to become more pissed off whether or not Iran is attacked? Just as a result of the failure of U.S. foreign policy in general? The Incumbent has pushed the neo-con football up the field in spite of being unpopular. Is his last assignment to cross the goal line, finally, from democracy to fascism?

effects of assymetric warfare do not work in total war.
Posted by: andy on Oct 26, 2007 6:49 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If a strike does occur, I can assure the author that the assymetric warfare does not apply when the US and Israel have permission for total war (assuming martial law).

Of course it will still be assymetric but the principles involved in assymetric warfare are only effective due to the political constraints on the more powerful country.
With no political constraints they will be just plain annailated.

They better hope to build that bomb quick smart, cos thats the only form of deterrence in total warfare.

» apology accepted Posted by: andy
Hold On A Second...
Posted by: InsertNameHere on Oct 26, 2007 7:08 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
...The Israeli strike, or something like it, could easily mark the beginning of the "World War III," which President Bush warned against last week. With his usual apocalyptic rhetoric, he said Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad could lead the region to a new world war if his nation builds a nuclear bomb...


The Iranian President does not have the power to start a war, that power lies in the hands of the Supreme Leader, who is likely not insane. This is an inconvenient fact for George, not that he has ever let reality get in his way before.

» Seriously! Posted by: hellofriends
USA acting unilaterally?
Posted by: pammers on Oct 26, 2007 7:19 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
France is against Iran getting Nuclear weapons. So is Great Britain, Germany, Jordan, Lebanon, Israel, Turkey, not to mention numerous other countries.

» RE: USA acting unilaterally? Posted by: hellofriends
» RE: USA acting unilaterally? Posted by: Joshua Holland
» Nuclear Hypocrites Posted by: Jeff Hoffman
» RE: Nuclear Hypocrites....well Posted by: Captainmagic
» Reply to Pammers Posted by: Perfectclue
CHENEY DOESN'T LEAK
Posted by: VZEQICVA on Oct 26, 2007 7:20 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If it's out there that's the way Cheney wants it. He and Bush are a dangerous combination. Two guys with nothing left to lose. They have complete control and enjoy watching everything crumble. Like it or not, everyone is afraid of them. As long as Bush can veto and use his signing statement no one can take them on. He has the power to bring the country to a halt. His reasons don't matter. He is the president. I don't like it either. Thanks, ANNA

war and collapse are inevitable
Posted by: Grandma Crabby on Oct 26, 2007 7:22 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
In my observations, Bush and Cheney would rather be seen as incompetent fools (Gosh-durn-golly-gee, we THOUGHT Sa-damn had WMD) than allow the truth to come out which is that they WANT to sink the U.S.

They will not leave office without starting additional war with Iran. they don't care about the consequences cuz they got their fortunes and safe houses in areas OUT of the US.

$10/gallon gas won't bother them and their buddies personally, and they WANT to collapse the economy in order to rebuild it with their lunatic ideals. They want to go back to surfs and aristocrats.

Bush believes he has been chosen by God to start Armageddon. Cheney just likes to make money and see people suffer and die.

They are both mentally ill.

Nothing can stop it now. IF impeachment proceedings had been started by the spineless dems the instant they took over congress, there MIGHT have been a snowballs chance in hell. But not anymore. they're gonna do it.

Several months back, congress quietly passed a resolution saying that

» RE: war and collapse are inevitable Posted by: Grandma Crabby
» RE: war and collapse are inevitable Posted by: starvinmarvy
This is how they planned 9/11
Posted by: jeffrey7 on Oct 26, 2007 7:53 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Nothing new here. Back in '92 VP Quayle's assistant told us,while walking a muzzled attack dog given him by the VP, 'We don't care about the poor and homeless,we're planning Armagedden'. Shortly thereafter the 'first' Twin towers attack happened. This attack made the 'internal' structure weakened from cracks in the protective coatings of the beams holding it up. Cracks they knew would rot these beams in 10 years or less. That made it easy for the planes to knock them down 9 years later. All to raise American fighting Spirit.
Isreal would be no different. We would rush to their aide because of long standing treaties.
This is just the kind of idiocy we've come to expect from this Government. This is the bullshit we must stand against. That's why we cannot elect anyone who's running for office now. Because they are part of this scheme. This warmongering governance must be stopped. It's time to disband the government in it's current form. It's a failed system that feeds itself on genocide,theft,lies and disinformation. It is the rotting fish we had 25 years ago. 35 years ago or even 65 years ago.
When good people stand by and 'let' corrupt officals run the country into the ground,then we become the very thing we hate. Totalitarian Rulership. We had the chance to not be this way after WW2. We chose the other direction. Anti- Constitution,anti- Bill of Rights, anti-human.
It's time to form a blockade around DC, cut off their phone and internet, cut off the utilities and close their doors.
We are a great nation with a bullshit governance. We can reclaim our greaterness by shutting down this governance and sending the Executive Branch with the NSC and the DHS,CIA NSA heads all over to the Hague for High Crimes Against Humanity. Perhaps the sentence will be the same as Saddams. Perhaps we might just learn that Peace and Co-operation will always be better than war,threats of war and hostile actions. I log in on the side of Peace and Co-operation. How about you?
Jeffrey7 for Prez '08

Alternet crassly exploits anti-Jewish hysteria for ratings and shock value. Enough is enough!!
Posted by: yellow on Oct 26, 2007 8:20 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This article is pure speculation and accordingly none of the much maligned Main stream media, ie. those with journalistic standards, carried this so called "story" in their broadcasts or pages. Alternet has sought fit to carry a number of contrived, nonsensical stories about Israel and its evil machinations much of it having little to do with the relevant aspects of the Israel/Palestine conflict and the occupation itself. The childish, sensationalistic insanity about summer campers with guns and attacks on the USS Liberty over 40 years ago are not legitimate issues except for those who want to promote hate and paranoia. Judging from the many hateful responses from the usual suspects they have succeeded.

Over the past five years, millions have been brutally killed in Central Africa with little word about this real story from the Alternet who, in the midst of an actual genocide, prefers headlines akin to, Israeli Soldier steps on Palestinian's foot, refuses to say "excuse me", international public outraged!! This is done in order to crassly stir up the usual conspiricy mongering opprobrium amongst Alternet's mostly uneducated, simple minded readers. I'm utterly sick of this crap. The Alternet has a decent staff and many good writers at their disposal. They don't to reach toward the bottom of the barrel for stories. They don't even publish good stuff on the occupation or the Israel/Palestine conflict like the stories on increasing popularity of Marwan Burgouthi and the Palestine National Initiative or the future of Fatah, or even on Abbas's handling of local Palestinian politics or daily life in the occupied territories. Instead, were treated to a left wing version of vapid Tabloid style sensationalism. This reflects on the low intellectual level of much of Alternet's readership. This is really a shame. Maybe better stories will bring better readers. I notice that the well thought out stories on highly complex topics, like international trade and the effect of economic globalization of labor conditions in the US and elsewhere usually get very little reader response. Interesting.

Enough is enough!! Get serious already!!

A very disgusted, YELLOW.

Sorry, this comment has been removed from the system.
Sorry, this comment has been removed from the system.
Helpful to Keep in Mind
Posted by: hellofriends on Oct 26, 2007 9:04 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
These facts need to be addressed in every single article about Iran. It is crucial.

1.) Iran is not a "mullah regime." This is hateful and inaccurate speech. If the purpose of your article is to help prevent a war with Iran, learn something about Iran and do not proliferate derogatory libel. although mullah is actually a term of respect, in the islamophobic axis of evil context we try not to live in, it's been imbued with an unabashedly negative resonance. mullah's do funerals and lead prayers and teach sometimes. they are like ministers. the people leading the country---the supreme leader, the council of guardians, the assembly of experts---are not "mullahs."

2.) we must talk about saudi arabia. if the call to war is now founded upon the supposed involvement of iranians in iraq, we must point out that the saudi involvement in iraq is much more prevalent and dangerous. the bush admin. is counting on americans not to know this, and not to know that saudi arabia is the primary financial and idealogical supporter of islamic terrorism worldwide---putting forth 90% of the funding for islamic education and spreading violent, fundamentalist Wahabi doctrines. they fund hamas, they crashed planes into the twin towers, they commit terrible human rights abuses, and We fund them. now i know that we're not going to invade saudi arabia ($,) but bringing up this issue reveals tremendous duplicity on the iran hawks.

3.) Ahmadenijad is an eccentric and symbolic non-leader of Iran. he is not the commander in chief. he can't do anything regarding starting or not starting wars. he's not popular in iran and will lose the next election in 2009, unless he is impeached beforehand (and there have been calls for this within Iran,) or we bomb iran and he regains support. he's been publicly censured by the Supreme Leader, who himself has issued a fatwa against nuclear weapons and is continuously trying to explain in calmer, saner terms the inflammatory rhetoric of Ahmadenijad. officials in Iran have stated publicly that it is outrageous and ignorant to suggest that the Holocaust never happened, and people who know Persian have tried to point out that Ahmadenijad did not call for israel to be wiped off the map, but rather said something like: "the policies of the regime that currently occupies jerusalem will lead to its being erased from the pages of history." this is not a call to nuclear war against israel. bush says stupid crap like this everyday.

» Helpful, indeed Posted by: maddy
» RE: Helpful to Keep in Mind Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Helpful to Keep in Mind Posted by: hellofriends
» RE: Helpful to Keep in Mind Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Helpful to Keep in Mind Posted by: hellofriends
» RE: Helpful to Keep in Mind Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Helpful to Keep in Mind Posted by: jbur816
» RE: Helpful to Keep in Mind Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Helpful to Keep in Mind Posted by: abraxas
» What????? Posted by: Joshua Holland
» Excellent Posted by: worldwide65
What do you think the rest of the world...
Posted by: babs on Oct 26, 2007 9:47 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
... is doing while Bush/Cheney beat the drum for war?

Watching and keeping their collective fingers crossed that big, bad America will not launch yet another illegal attack?

No. They are making their own plans to defend themselves. Might want to remind those DC dipshits that Iran has allies who are truly sick of the meddling and deaths caused by Bushco and will not let him repeat the Iraq adventure.

Who are they? China, Russia and most of the gulf states, not to mention India. All armed to the teeth, mobilized and waiting for the depleted U.S. military to try it.

None of these states want war but they will definitely go to the mat to punish the world-challenging hawks that are Bush and Cheney. There is much pent up rage in the world now and if Iran is hit, her allies will react and tiny Israel would be wise to stay out of it unless they favor glass craters rather than their country.

Indeed, if Israel's leaders were smart (they're not), they would distance themselves from Bushco as fast as possible. War on Iran would be a death sentence for them.

Another misadventure in the middle east will be the last nail in America's coffin. Will you let them do it?

Sorry, this comment has been removed from the system.
Cheney's plan for attack on IRAN
Posted by: ehsan on Oct 26, 2007 9:55 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Susan Kipping is dead right:the US is being destroyed from within.when you have the likes of Bush,Cheney,Rummy etc ruling the country under NeoCon hubbris and have a spineless opposition,you donot really need enemies abroad.in their rulership of six years plus,USA has lost most of its friends and the admiration of American institutional ethics.this morning when i heard Ms Condy Rice broadcast of the new stiff sanctions against IRAN and how IRAN was helping the "insurgents" to kill american soldiers,i was amazed at her temerity treating the listeners,even the americans,as idiots.she conveniently forgets that Iraq and Iran are neighbours in the same region while the americans have come from seven seas across ten thousand miles for ostensible reason of teaching the iraqis virtues of democracy which the americans have already begun to decry at home.look at the laws that have been promulgated during the Bush Regime and how the american citizen has been disparaged by new legislation in the bastion of democracy.
O dear american friends mark words:your country invaded or went to war almost 700 times during the last one hundred years while the Iranians did not aggress against any country during the last almost 400 years of its history.they are a civilised people,not the up-starts of yester years.Have a heart telling the world that your soldiers are being killed by iranian arms in iraq,hence SANCTIONS.Bright boys. first of all tell me what are the american soldiers doing in Iraq.the US boys invaded iraq and the iraqis are fully justified in resisting this brutally immoral act of the americans.those in iraq who are resisting this dastardly action of the aggressor can justifiably seek help form neighbours and friends at a distance.do not forget when the americans colonies revolted against the British King in 1776,the French came to their help. that act France is a golden chapter in the country's history.Iran is perhaps doing not enough for its stupid neighbour who at the instance and support of the US waged a war aganist her for 8 years.to cut a long story short,be warned O ye US citizens going to war against Iran is against your national interests.believe me,do not be mislead by Cheney and the sick maniacal senator(i forget his name) who ran elections as vice prsidential candidate with GORE against the Republicans.Do not do it what they say;that is poison.you are already in grave economic troubles. they would land you into further troubles.see the writings on the wall.do not loose all the friends that you may still have.trust me.

Grousefeather
Posted by: Grousefeather on Oct 26, 2007 10:49 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Do reptiles have a heaven?

yelow,
Posted by: maxloen on Oct 26, 2007 11:15 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I can't understand what upsets you so much about this article. It's all about the Bush/Cheney deceits you don't usually support, with a few paragraphs about Podhoretz, a self-acknowledged neocon, a group which you have admitted, albeit tangentially, having a similar DNA than the Likudniks. If as you always say, Jerusalem is but a pawn in the geostrategic games of the U.S., it doesn't seem too implausible that Washington would require some action in exchange for the solid (stolid?) support it provides Greater-Israel. Also, as some other reader pointed out recently, although you want Alternet to focus on, say, Africa, you never write anything anywhere else than in response to commentaries about what seems to be your only concern> Israel, and international finances.

» Just a small point of fact Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Just a small point of fact Posted by: Joshua Holland
» Re: Yellow Posted by: jbur816
Truth Cowboy
Posted by: COmac on Oct 26, 2007 11:20 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The only ones capable of flying the planes and hitting the Trade Center towers on 9/11 among the listed terrorists were Saudi ex-airforce.

Over 30% of the terrorists on the 9/11 flights were Saudi. None were from Iraq.

Prior to 9/11 a strong faction of Saudi royals were trying to convert all the U.S. dollar debt they hold (many billions) into euros and thereby crushing the US financial market.

How come no news source strings together these things to show where this insanity is truly coming from and why?? I don't want the US to be destroyed defending Israel and some fat cats over some land or oil that they covet. I'll bet a majority of Americans will agree.

Fight for truth and against those that use position or power to hide from the truth.

Wider War and "War Fascisim"
Posted by: Glennk1949 on Oct 26, 2007 11:33 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Neo-Cons and their Corpirate and Religious Wingnut allies know with the War in Iraq going so badly and BV$H having only 14 more mos. its time to double down and start another War. They'll then use this new war to finish off whats left of the Constitution and the opposition. Everything has been put into place for a full scale Fascist state. Its just a matter of time now.

Here's some speculation:
Posted by: thoughtcriminal on Oct 26, 2007 11:34 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
From the opener: "US Vice President Dick Cheney -- the power behind the throne, the eminence grise, the man with the (very) occasional grandfatherly smile -- is notorious for his propensity for secretiveness and behind-the-scenes manipulation."

Now, what are the actual facts about nuclear weapons in the Middle East?

First, Israel has a large arsenal that they refuse to declare, and for some reason the U.S. supports Israel in that. Why? Speculation: the U.S. played a major role in arming Israel with nuclear weapons but doesn't want that known.

Second, Pakistan has a large arsenal, as does India (who refuses to sign the Non-Proliferation Treaty, as does Pakistan and Israel). Pakistan has close ties with Saudi Arabia. Could Saudi Arabia get their hands on nukes, and would they if they could? See Saudia Arabia working on secret nuclear program with Pakistan help - report, Forbes, 03.28.2006,.

Third, Russia is working closely with Iran over nuclear power, and has stated there is no evidence that Iran is seeking a nuclear weapon. Putin Denounces `Madman' With Knife Approach to Iran Oct. 25 (Bloomberg)

So, what's really up here? What is Cheney's twisted mind thinking? One possibility is that this is a little Cold-War era brinkmanship game - using the threat of assault to gain some economic objective. Sometimes, far more information can be gleaned from financial business news than from any other source - see Russia: Bigger Than Big Oil, By David Lee Smith May 25, 2007

"Perhaps most astoundingly, late last year Russia quietly passed Saudi Arabia to become the world's biggest oil producer. After Russian President Vladimir Putin and U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice recently agreed, face to face, to tone down their increasingly inflammatory rhetoric and concentrate instead on business, Russia's growing oil output and the U.S.'s corresponding decline seem increasingly meaningful, if not ominous."

So, my unsupported speculation here is that Cheney wants to kick Russia out of Iran, and that all his talk of launching an assault is just Cold War era brinkmanship by an aging dinosaur.

Or he really could be a stark, raving lunatic who is only one step away from starting World War III. Hard to say.

Understanding Iran's legal rights
Posted by: Earthian on Oct 26, 2007 12:16 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I think we need to consider the situation from Iran’s point of view with international law in mind. Article 2 (4) of the UN Charter (and by extension the US Constitution via Article 6 (2)) forbids threats of or attacks against member states. The Nuremberg and the Tokyo precedents establish illegal aggression as the supreme international crime–a crime against peace. The US government is violating the law, not only in Iraq with the invasion and occupation; not only via the threats against Iran; but is actually building up troops and naval forces to strike Iran. The president and the candidates in both major parties are threatening war including nuclear war by saying “all options are on the table”–a war crime.

Consider what this means. If some nation did all of this to us, via UN Charter Article 51, we would have the legal right to inform the UNSC that we are invoking the Article 51 right of self-defense, and while we strike those preparing to strike us, we ask the SC to restore peace and prevent war. This is the legal right of preemption.

But the US government is the aggressor.

Iran has never invaded or occupied another nation, not in modern times. Iran has an inalienable right to their commercial nuclear enrichment program via Article 4 of the NPT. In fact the US has the obligation to help them develop it, while we have the obligation to engage in good faith efforts to negotiate for complete nuclear disarmament (via Article 6).

What does all this mean for progressives regarding a likely crime against peace by the US against Iran?

Simply this: Iran increasingly has a legal right to strike US forces provided they invoke Article 51 with the UNSC. They could destroy the so-called Green Zone. They could sink US carriers. They have a real military. The US could lose more soldiers in a day than so far in Iraq during the invasion and occupation.

So if and when Iran strikes out to defend itself from US government aggression, it is important for progressives to have a clear understanding of the legal and constitutional situation. The way to deal with such an outbreak of hostilities is not to rally behind US government leaders, but to hold them accountable for their crimes and seek peace with the Iranians.

This comment has been removed from the site due to non-compliance with AlterNet's community policies.
» RE: USA and the Nutty Left Posted by: tap17x
Propaganda always looks the same, no matter the source
Posted by: thoughtcriminal on Oct 26, 2007 2:00 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Take the above post. Switch a few words here and there:

"I read comments by Hitler and Germany haters all day long and I am just amazed at the level of complete ignorance on the part of the so many in this country and abroad. The left, social elite, god haters in both Germany and America are for the most part nothing more than ignorant snobs and they not Hitler are the greatest threat to world peace. Might I remind Europe that before Germany became a world power / policeman, it was the Oh-so-smart British, French and Russians that created war after war resulting in the slaughter of millions for thousands of years.

It was the "o-so-smart" British and French that lead the world into World War I then had the balls to call on the ignorant god believing Americans to help bail them out.

If one studies the bible (Which those on both the left are to smart to believe) it again will be the British, Russia and France NOT Germany or Hitler that start World War 2 resulting in the death of 2/3 of all life on the planet.

The problem is most on the left are to dam ignorant to believe in any type of god much less waste their time reading the bible. They would rather lecture us from their positions of snobbery and superior intellect. Let me just say one thing when you become to dam smart to believe in god you have become to dam smart. Romans 1:22 Professing themselves to be wise they became fools.

I read and study the bible and so yes I guess I am just an ignorant god fearing flag waving German. But hear me now, and hear me good. From what I can tell in bible prophecy we are right on track for the Jewish Communist Alliance to be the next global world leader. Soon you will get your wish and the Germany will be out of the picture. When that happens and you fools are left to your own Superior Intellect god help you and all life on this planet.
You Will then cry out to the GOD you don't currently believe in and he will not hear you.

My last comment is this if you had half a brain you on the left and in Europe would get behind Germany and Hitler and support him rather than snob him and the good he is trying to do. But if history is any lesson I don't expect any one on the left, Europe or Russia to do so. You all would rather go down the path spelled out in the bible and watch the Jews and Communists become a global power. Watch then what your ignorance has brought you."


Try it with Stalin, Russia, Fascists, and in place of the bible put the words of Lenin and Karl Marx, and you get the same effect. Propaganda is always the same - no facts and a lot of blather.

» Hey! You removed the original! Posted by: thoughtcriminal
king george ..the only way to stop WW III is for me to start it...
Posted by: Annapurna1 on Oct 26, 2007 2:29 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
:rolleyes:...

Bullshit
Posted by: opeluboy on Oct 26, 2007 4:48 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I'm not going to bother even reading this crap since just a few paragraphs in the writer makes the completely unsubstantiated claim that the Israeli's were likely targeting a nuclear reactor under construction.

There is less than zero evidence for this. Does anyone really think we would not know about this? Think for a moment.

For more on this, read Philip Giraldi here

Iran: Daring Not to Accept USA/Israel Hegemony in the Middle East
Posted by: sofla100 on Oct 26, 2007 4:52 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
By refusing to accept USA/Israel hegemony in the Middle East, Iran is being targeted and threatened. As for having a nuke, even if this were going to be the case, doesn't Israel and Pakistan already have a nuclear capability? And, what evidence is there that Iran has ever supported terrorism or attacks on the USA? Evidence from the basements of the Pentagon and CIA doesn't count either. We are being fed the same pack of lies we were fed by Bush in the run-up to the Iraq invasion. And, the American people are starting to buy it, perhaps with some skepticism but it's been a constant drum-beat now for months on end. The FOX news litany of lies. And, by the way, the USA is already supporting incursions into Iran by Kurdish separtists and has sent in its own special ops, but you won't hear this on the American news.

It might be worth dropping just one bomb
Posted by: Chloe2005 on Oct 26, 2007 6:35 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If Cheney would jump on board just like in the picture. How about just one little test somewhere far far away?

Cannot Afford Another Fiasco
Posted by: JRedfern on Oct 27, 2007 9:19 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
With $1 TRILLION spent on the Iraq fiasco and the national debt reaching $10 TRILLION, US bogged down in Iraq and Afghanistan, this country can ill afford another fiasco, not to mention the bleeding of middle class jobs to the global economy.

Mahmoud Ahmadinejad has already stated his “Mein Kampf”
Posted by: DrColes on Oct 27, 2007 1:37 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Der Spiegel ? Is an Anti-America source, so how biased/propagandist is it. Nevertheless, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad has already stated his “Mein Kampf” to the world; he is an enemy of the state to all non-Muslims nations. Does history have to repeat it self?

Islamic Fascism declared war against the U.S. and all non-Islamic nations. The truth is the truth. Why would any free human want to suppress this? http://tinyurl.com/2znnvl

It IS 1938 again
Posted by: mwildfire on Oct 27, 2007 1:40 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
When Hitler's armies took over Poland and Austria, and the British and French and Americans understandably didn't want another war and looked the other way, they set themselves up for a bigger, worse and longer one. Podhoretz is right; we do have a similar situation today and it's high time we step up to the plate to take action. Only Podoretz gets one little thing wrong--it's not Iran stomping around taking over countries--it's the US. First Afghanistan, then Iraq on flimsy pretexts, now they're threatening Iran on even flimsier pretexts. Iran hasn't attacked any other country and is years away from building WMD's...meanwhile, the country stomping around taking over countries has 7000 to 10,000 nuclear bombs and the means to deliver them anywhere in the world! And madmen in control! And a germ warfare program. And is the only country that already HAS used nuclear weapons. And the madmen running the government are allied with religious nuts who want to impose their religion on the whole world and force women into seclusion! My God, they've got to be stopped! Rather than waiting for the rest of the world to do it, can't we SOMEHOW put a stop to the madness ourselves? Congress is refusing to do the necessary thing, impeachment, so we have to impeach Congress--a general strike is the likeliest means to accomplish the regime change we so desperately need. We can't wait for the 2008 elections, which won't change anything anyway--the media has already made it clear that the successor to Cheney, and the one who will carry out his policies after the cosmetic change is Hilary Clinton, whom the media assures us, we all really love. She's not as stupid as Georgie boy but she's just as willing to do the bidding of the Powers that Be, just as unhindered by any considerations of conscience. It's time for a second American Revolution, to reclaim the ground won in the first one.

Crying Shame
Posted by: weslen1 on Oct 27, 2007 2:15 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It's a crying shame when a President of the United States of America, Pushed by an even more EVIL vice president, wants his "LEGACY" to be that he started a WORLD WAR. And I have NO DOUBT that this complicit and cowardly congress will let him do it.

gerald.sutliff@gmail.com
Posted by: Gerald on Oct 27, 2007 2:37 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Iran has the opportunity and means to greatly harm us. The naval task forces in the Persian Gulf are sitting ducks. There's not enough room to maneuver or take evasive action. The carriers and other larger vessels don't have any ability to repel high speed power boats loaded with explosives and piloted by someone who's willing to die. Iran could sink enough ships to make Pearl Harbor look like a tea party.
Our navy know doubt knows this but our pilot-in-chief can't think that big.

» RE: gerald.sutliff@gmail.com Posted by: dutch46
we have better things to do
Posted by: lukitas on Oct 27, 2007 8:20 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
That Saddam was going to lose was obvious. He'd lost to daddy shrub, didn't he? Obvious. The way Iran, and the rest of the world, will react to an American (Israeli?) attack on Iran however, is not obvious. And quite possibly catastrophic.
We need to be focusing on saving ourselves from global warming and petrol deprivation. We don't need global warfare.
And other people's oil will run out too. Whatever we do, we need to learn how to make do without petrol, because when all is said and done, it's gone. Whether it takes five years, fifty or a hundred for the wells to run dry is no matter. I am willing to take a very large bet that oil will become very expensive in a very short time - years rather than decades - to such an extent that car use will become the privilege of the very rich.
Millions of people will lack heat, and food, and have wet feet, or graves, the weather will be mostly bad - aridity contrasted with exceptional rainfall and high storms; we have prepared a peach of a future for ourselves. Do we really want the US to go to war with another smallish republic? Granted, it's a muslim republic, but what is so wrong about that? God talks to W., doesn't he? And anyhow, the war is already lost. They'll never get at the oil the way they wanted, Iraq is a worse mess than Vietnam. The day the U.S. attacks Iran, they are threatening planetary suicide. 'Give us anything we want or we nuke you'. Even Mao and Stalin or Hitler weren't as scary as that.

SteveMD2
Posted by: SteveMD2 on Oct 27, 2007 9:55 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Bush and Cheney are both mentally ill. A psychiatrist I met who did profiles of terrorists for the cia said that Bush reminds her of a sociopath, who could care less how much he hurts anyone else, as long as he satisfies his infantile beliefs and desires.

And Bush is the worst kind - he is not only imbued with a desire for unlimited power, but it is religious based. If you look at his face when he talks, you see this weird smile. The same kind of weird smile as that nut case minister Fred Phelps who celebrates at the funerals of our dead soldiers. So you have a nazi - sociopathic type personality mixed with a religious mentality that is as totally blind to decency and reality as those who gave us 9/11. He is also the equivalent of the combination of the evil roman emperors and totally corrupt Popes who gave the world the 1000+ years of the dark ages, when the world went nowhere economically, and 'christian' armies committed total sin against God, ravaging the middle east, killing 10's of millions of Muslims in order to steal the treasures of the advanced for its time Muslim civilization. No wonder they find it so easy to hate us, for they haven't forgotten their holocaust and more then the Jews will forget what happened to them even thousands of years in the future.

What Bush has done in Iraq, and may do with Iran, is to fall totally into the trap of Osama Bin Laden. By attacking a Muslim nation that had nothing to do with 9/11, Bush and co. have validated to Muslims worldwide that we are the enemy, and reminded their society that for 600 years, Christian armies ravaged the middle east, killing tens of millions "in the name of God", but really just to steal the treasures of their advanced for its time civilization. And the Iraq war is about stealing Iraqs oil, giving Iraq 10c on the dollar for their oil, while the rest goes to the profit pockets of our big oil buddies of the Bush family and Cheney's Halliburton.
And what has Bush and co. done to help the US end our fuel dependence on the middle east. Raise the US gas mileage standards significantly? NO. Put a $5/bulb tax on the old incandescents, and use it to subsidize the sale of compact fluorescents that save - really - 2/3 of the power of the old bulbs. NO. Put a gargantuan annual tax on the worst gas hogs, and use some of that money to subsidize home and business energy efficiency, e.g new high efficiency heaters / coolers, and building insulation. NO. Why, because he would attack the profits of his oil buddies who are behind the Iraq attack as much as any other reason. Exxons 2006 profits of $40 billion are sacred to the power of those who support Bush's neo-con or is it nazi agenda. The key reason for the Iraq war was oil profits, to steal the Iraqi's oil for the profits of the big oil companies who are pals and business partners of Cheney and the Bush family.

Compare that with Iraq. Bush and his gang will surely go to hell, most likely the same hell as Hitler, Stalin, and others of their ilk . Maybe his cellmate in hell will be Saddam. They certainly could find common ground.

Iran and Saudi Arabia Should Have Nuclear Defense
Posted by: Dominic Jermano on Oct 27, 2007 11:10 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Actually I hope Iran and Saudi Arabia gets the Atomic Bomb for their defense, because it will stop all this nonsense, of acquiring WMD and sanctions, and threats. A new level of respect will unfold and peace will engulf the region. Bush may not get the democratic process he hoped for there, but we all know he really doesn't have the democratic process he really wants in the USA either.

Saudi Arabia and Iran are 2 of the most vulnerable countries in the world with no defense from super powers who may turn on them. They strategically control most of the Worlds Natural Oil resources. Look at how this looks now. America has no Oil resources; attacks the countries that do. Now who is the Bully here? Sure they devise plans to stir instability by making out the guys who have the Oil are bad guys, but how do they get away with being so arrogant?

Iran's President may have said Israel should be wiped off the map, but in reality it is Israel who always has live nuclear weapons pointing at Iran. Who really wants who wiped off the map? Cetainly Israel does.

With Saudi Arabia and Iran unarmed they are fish in a barrel to any political heists from any super powers. If you were an Iranian or Saudi would you feel secure that one of the other super powers will stick up for you if another decides to invade? I know I would feel helpless. I would want the bomb to use as a deterent.

For the sake of argument, the reason we have terror is because rich resource oil countries have no access to the bomb. Israel has no Oil, but they have the bomb, just like the USA. They invaded Iraq who did not have the bomb. I think terror will remain, until Iran and Saudi Arabia have the bomb. If America bombs Iran, they will still keep trying to develop nuclear weapons, if not out right buying one from Russia, or Pakistan. They will hide it, and move it, and keep the US and other non-Oil super power countries on their good behavior so Oil deals are fair.

I think if we want peace, we should allow Iran and Saudi Arabia to have the Bomb. They will never use it. If they do, it is the end to their lives. Even Allah is not totally suicidal. Because his soldiers might be, does not mean he intends their whole society to perish from the planet, because of irresponsibility from a leader. They are in my opinion not out to destroy their peoples. Even Saddam was not that mad. Our invasion proved his unwillingness to unleash chemical or WMD even at war.

Our greatest threat is our own countries leadership Bush and Cheney and the money backers to their syndicate. I feel more threatened that they will destroy Americans with the bomb, before I feel threatened that Iran or Saudi Arabia would attack us if they had the bomb. Iran and Saudi Arabia are not PRE-EMPTIVE lunatics. I know Bush did 911, what's stopping them from annhiliating Chicago? The fact that they know they are wrong, can't bring themselves to admit it, can't face the embarrassment, and only biding time for their exit or strategy to wage another war. And they don't want radiation drifting to the Washington DC.

The only way is to impeach and cut off the power. I declare Bush and Cheney are no longer our leaders, so do not obey their orders or threats.

Dr. Ron Paul the only candidate that will stop the War
Posted by: Reader11722 on Oct 28, 2007 7:11 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Cheney is a zionist puppet. Only Israel benefits from these endless Middle East wars. Iraq is the beginning. As we commit war-crimes in Baghdad, the US gov't commits treason at home by opening mail, eliminating habeas corpus, using the judiciary to steal private lands, banning books like America Deceived (book) from Amazon and Wikipedia, conducting warrantless wiretaps and engaging in illegal wars on behalf of AIPAC's 'money-men'. Soon, another US false-flag operation will occur (sinking of an Aircraft Carrier by Mossad) and the US will invade Iran.. Then we'll invade Syria, then Saudi Arabia, then Lebanon (again) then ....

Vote for Dr. Ron Paul, the only anti-war, pro-freedom candidate.

This article fails miserably to assess Iran's military response.
Posted by: humanity101 on Oct 28, 2007 10:10 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The author fails to even acknowledge the fact that the hundreds of thousands of US troops in Iraq and Afghanistan are within range of Iran's missiles. It is just complete madness to to attack Iran because of the speculation that they gave Shiite militants weapons responsible for killing US soldiers because this would put more US soldiers will be in danger. The argument is simply idiotic: "since you killed my people, we'll kill some of yours, then you'll kill some more of ours, then we'll still kill all of yours". When is it gonna stop? If we have "proves" Iran is responsible for killing US soldiers, bring it to the Security Council and face them with the evidence. Sounds to me like another Gulf of Tonkin incident or Colin Powell's evidence at best. According to the NPT, Iran has every right to develop nuclear power for civilian use. Putin said recently he saw no evidence for suggesting otherwise. I'm a little disappointed Putin hasn't completed his work on the reactor at Bushir or some place and hasn't the guts to stand up to the the bullying Americans. The world needs a balance of power or the lone superpower will go nuts and eventually destroy itself. So we must attack right? Ok, here's the argument. Why wouldn't we attack North Korea? They, after all, did test a nuclear device and gave us the middle finger. Why didn't we bomb them? The Iran thing is getting more an more ridiculous and down right stupid. If any country in possession of a nuclear bomb would use it on their worst enemy, why haven't Pakistan and India mutually annihilated each other? What if Putin will provide Iran with missiles to shoot at us, are we gonna bomb Russia or sanction them? Then they would probably give every freaking terrorist who hates America the technology for how to make the bomb. Then the freaking world will go completely mad. Please stop all the nonsense and stupidity for God's sake. How much land does a man need any way? 6 feet? Just because Dick Cheney comes out of his little hole making a stupid statement doesn't mean everyone has to act on it.

This comment has been removed from the site due to non-compliance with AlterNet's community policies.
Peter Biddulph, Worcestershire, England
Posted by: peter_maryb on Oct 29, 2007 1:54 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
You comment, "For the neoconservatives it could represent a glimmer of hope that the grandiose dream of a democratic Middle East has not yet been buried in the ashes of Iraq."

How can you Americans be so naive? Democracy has nothing to do with it.

As I write (10/29/07), the king of a corrupt regime as tough as Soviet East Germany ever was is being entertained with a State visit to Buckingham Palace and Whitehall. King Abdulla of Saudi Arabia is getting the full treatment.

When we speak of Africa, we often mention in the same breath "Corruption". This absolute monarch and his family preside over public decapitations and floggings of women caught in the act of adultery [Documented in "Death of a Princess", a film which the Saudis tried to ban in Britain - yes in a free speech democracy.], amputations of limbs of criminals, total banning of women's rights, mass arrests of anyone who opposes the regime, secret prisons, torture of innocent and guilty alike, and the acceptance of huge bribes - all widely and independently documented - as part of their arms purchases from the United Kingdom. Indeed, the Blair government ordered the British Serious Fraud Office to cease it's investigation of BAE bribes totalling millions of dollars to a senior member of the Saudi Royal family on the grounds that it would "prejudice national security".

One other thing. The Saudis have oil, lots of it. And massive US and CIA presence across all the Saudi states. Or maybe we shouldn't talk about that. In our "informed democracies".

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