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Environmentalism for Billionaires

By Glenn Hurowitz, The American Prospect. Posted August 6, 2007.


Big business is trying to cash in on extremely dangerous projects painted green by their unscrupulous backers.

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This article is reprinted from The American Prospect website. The author of this article, Glenn Hurowitz, was former Deputy National Field Director for the U.S. Public Interest Research Group where he fought to preserve the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge and protect America's national forests.

Lately, I've been inundated with phone calls from venture capitalists, private equity guys, and hedge fundistas. They're coming to me because I'm their environmentalist friend and they all want to know one thing: how they can make a buck off the surge in interest in combating global warming.
In a way, that's a sign that the environmental movement has finally arrived. After decades of struggling to convince the titans of finance that protecting the planet and making money weren't mutually exclusive, the tycoons are now coming to us.

But many of these capitalist converts need watching. While Wall Street's eco-splurge has generated a flood of financing for legitimately clean ventures like wind and solar power, it's also spawned extremely dangerous projects that are painted green by their unscrupulous backers, but that at their core are as black as, well, coal.

The green sheen plastered on some of these projects -- like burning down the rainforest to generate electricity for homes -- has actually convinced some members of Congress to start throwing billions of taxpayer dollars their way. Of course, not all those representatives and senators are gullible enough to believe that making forests into electricity is really good for the planet. Some just think voters will be so dazzled by the spin doctors' lovingly applied emerald veneer that they won't notice them pocketing these eco-pretenders' campaign donations.



Take that burning-the-rainforest-to-power-your-iPhone proposal. All over the tropics, international agribusiness giants like Cargill, as well as smaller domestic operators, have turned pristine rainforests into millions of acres of soy, sugar, and palm oil plantations. Much of that provides raw material to make biodiesel, touted by its numerous backers as a quintessential green fuel.

Unfortunately, rainforest biodiesel is triply bad for the planet. When rainforest is burned to clear the land, the carbon that had been safely stored in tree trunks, orangutans, and other living matter gets incinerated and becomes the carbon dioxide responsible for warming the planet. Also incinerated: vital habitat for endangered species (like the orangutans) and indigenous people who need intact rainforests to survive.

Then, the farms that replace the forests spew out greenhouse gases as workers drive their tractors and spray pesticides made in factories running on coal, natural gas, or more biofuels. And when that biofuel finally arrives in your gas tank or the local power plant, it may actually produce slightly more cancer-causing toxins than regular old gasoline, according to a recent Stanford University study published in the journal Environmental Science and Technology (though the study didn't evaluate rainforest biodiesel, but other biofuels instead).

But you don't have to go to the tropics to see billionaire faux-environmentalism at work. Just drive out to West Virginia, where Big Coal executives are hoping for a renewed mining bonanza if they can somehow convince members of Congress that coal is clean and that liquefied coal can replace gasoline. They're lobbying hard for taxpayer guarantees for liquid coal projects that they argue can help free America from its reliance on foreign oil. That's the kind of sweetheart deal that could make even oil executives jealous.

But not only is the proposal expensive, it's also extremely dangerous to the environment. Turning hard coal into an automotive fuel takes a lot of energy, which is why liquid coal produces twice the greenhouse gas emissions of regular coal. Liquid coal backers claim that, with the right amount of additional taxpayer support, they can use advanced technology to capture and store that extra global warming pollution. Even if that's true (and taxpayers are willing to take the hit), it doesn't do anything about coal's remaining non-climate environmental hazards: the soot and smog that kill more than 30,000 people every year and the destruction of mountaintops across Appalachia and elsewhere.



That's bad, but it's nothing compared to the scam being pushed by the timber lobby. The logging industry not only cuts down the forests that act as the planet's lungs, they also use tremendous amounts of energy to turn dead trees into furniture and paper. If Congress takes serious action to stop global warming, the loggers would have to clean up their act. But their resident wonks at the American Forest and Paper Association have found a way to reap a financial windfall from likely climate legislation.

Call it the Sofa Scheme. They're arguing that every sofa, Post-It note, and Kleenex tissue they produce should be counted as carbon storage, just like forests are. Their logic is that even when these forest products are discarded and put in a landfill, they're keeping that carbon safely in the ground rather than sending it into the atmosphere in the form of carbon dioxide.

If the timber lobby gets its way, that could mean big money for the logging companies. Under the carbon trading schemes likely to be a part of any global warming legislation, they could use all the credits they get from producing furniture and paper to avoid having to make any actual reductions in their greenhouse gas emissions or preserving actual living forests. Alternately, they could sell those credits to other polluters who would use them to avoid making their own reductions.

That could perversely endanger recycling programs, which are huge energy savers (it takes less energy to make paper from paper than from virgin trees). If wood and paper are given value just for lying in a landfill, it could create an incentive for trash operators to dispose of them that way, rather than recycling them. Indeed, whoever is able to get credit for landfilling the 59 million tons of forest products disposed of annually would reap more than $1 billion in profit, based on the price of carbon pollution permits being traded in European markets.

The good news is that some lawmakers are starting to get wise to these polluter schemes. Facing worries about the impact of increasing demand for palm oil grown in ecologically sensitive parts of Southeast Asia and Colombia, Europe may ban biofuels grown unsustainably. During the debate over the energy bill, the Senate defeated an attempt to provide billions of dollars in subsidies and loan guarantees for liquid coal. And there's growing support for giving financial value to living forests instead of forests that have been turned into toilet paper.

But even if these particular scams are beaten back, environmentalists and others must remain vigilant. Capitalism is, for good and bad, an infinitely creative phenomenon. America must be sure to harness that creativity to solve the climate crisis rather than letting rogue billionaires make it worse.


This article is available on The American Prospect website.
© 2007 by The American Prospect, Inc.

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See more stories tagged with: global warming, climate change, carbon offsets

Glenn Hurowitz, who runs the website DemocraticCourage.com, is the author of the forthcoming book, Fear and Courage in the Democratic Party.

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When will morticians lodge their claims?
Posted by: Sojourner on Aug 6, 2007 12:14 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Every time someone dies, it is one less individual causing pollution. And how about wrecking yards? Each automobile they haul away reduces emissions. If shutting down old coal-fired powerplants entitles a credit, I want my kids to get a credit when I go to my reward.

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» RE: Poorly fought war? Posted by: LeftCoastProgressive
» RE: Poorly fought war? Posted by: mrcentrist
Slogans
Posted by: talkville on Aug 6, 2007 2:34 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It ought to be remembered that slogans and catch-phrases can refer to many different things to many different people. Green is a pleasant color to any corporation or other capitalists, just as much as to those whose interests reside in an ecologic metabolism. We always should be aware of who is speaking when 'green issues' are involved.

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If drowning was profitable.....
Posted by: Smiggsy on Aug 6, 2007 3:19 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If drowning new born kittens suddenly became fashionable to the masses I'm sure that too would be a target for corporate investment & financial exploitation. What people seem easy to dismiss is that in today's business community there exists a null-reality to the concept of general morals & perhaps common sense. This includes the current trend or popularity of the "green" movement. For fu@ks sake petrochemical companies adopting green logos & philosophies in media-spun TV commercials; I vomit from stupidity every time I see one...

Of course people in the realms of financial accumulation have no conscious grasp of morality or honor or compassionate reality. Making money is immoral because for someone to make more money - someone else has to effectively lose their money. How does this work with going green?......Doesn't going "green" effectively mean actually consuming less therefore spending less $$$$......?

The collapse of the US sub-prime loans market is a true indication of this (lend money to people who can't reasonably repay it at whatever cost). I still can't figure out how that was ever supposed to make money......but really, making money out of true green ecological behaviors & spending practices is insane. Investments in this trend is not just greedy but inherently stupid.

As for Wall St....I hope they all get burnt.

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» hoping for disaster Posted by: frederick
» RE: hoping for disaster Posted by: Lincoln fan
» RE: Whistling in the coal cinders! Posted by: LeftCoastProgressive
» It's all about the churn. Posted by: eddie torres
Protecting the Planet =/= Making Money
Posted by: pdxstudent on Aug 6, 2007 5:13 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"In a way, that's a sign that the environmental movement has finally arrived. After decades of struggling to convince the titans of finance that protecting the planet and making money weren't mutually exclusive, the tycoons are now coming to us."

In a way, this is a sign that evironmentalism is undergoing its most destructive gutting. I mean, and not even in some naive or vulgar sense, "protecting the planet and making money" ARE mutually exclusive. One of most dangerous propositions to come out of the environmental movement is precisely this notion that we can save the planet through consumption. In a sense, this makes even recycling programs suspect, which in their material effects change the content of our consumption and not the form. The point should really be not how do we make consumption more okay but how to make it okay to consume less.

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The greatest waste of Paper
Posted by: machaventia on Aug 6, 2007 5:25 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Perhaps you have read your economics primer in the Greed Channel, following the antics of Wall St., wherein every movement is like one made in the bathroom, as we eat the differential effluvia known as "profits" they garner at our collective expense.
A quick glance at the worth of the Dollar since the 1975 Gold Dump reveals the printing on those recycled jeans is worth more than the paper prommisary notes being printed.
This has been a concerted effort to deliberately devalue the Buck to shove us all into Plastic Money and credits, which are a damn sight easier to freeze when we get uppity and demand an answer of our overlords sitting astride the walrus of commerce.
With our money worthless, our homes freshly remortgaged at the request of Greenspan's cheapo money..we are ripe for takeover, as the currency plunges into the abyss.
Oh what a sight that will be...as we scramble for the remaining 50-day supply of food left in the ADM/Cargill loop, and the gasoline dries up...and we all panic.
obviously the next step is Martial Law..as King George declares himself Dick tator for life...
Don't look for help from those in the halls of Congress, as they are bought, sold or blocked from effective and meaningful legislations by their own club. They have been each and every one been assured they will ride on the golden carpet as we scratch in the dumpsters for a meal...
Bridges falling down you say?
Congress in the past few days renewed the Whitehouse permit to peer into our trash, and sent 460+ Billion to the Halliburton War Games...that might have been used to fix our crumbling infrastructure, from the Electric Grid to meaningful alternative energy stategies.
Peace makes no instantaneous profits, nor grants hidden stock options to lawmakers, bent on seeing us last on equality's list.
The system is not just broken...it's Post Mortem.
We find no candidates worthy of attention...no accountability for high crimes...no future for our grandkids except to line up, to sign up, for the next concocted war.

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» Hemp, hemp, hemp!!! Posted by: garry minor
» RE: Hemp, hemp, hemp!!! Posted by: maxpayne
» RE: Hemp, hemp, hemp!!! Posted by: bkvwd57
» RE: Hemp, hemp, hemp!!! Posted by: Lincoln fan
» RE: Hemp, hemp, hemp!!! Posted by: aussidawg
To those who say it must be profitable
Posted by: greentime on Aug 6, 2007 5:31 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
To those who say it must be profitable to save the environment:

How profitable will it be if we don't?

I just cannot believe we are not moving... RUNNING... in the directions that truly will save our beautiful planet. Even if it is too late we must try. We must do everything positive and truly useful to get this planet healthy and sustainable again.

Please, let us stop wasting time on the greedy. They are not going to change. Let us focus on those doing things to help. As Wangari Maathai says - "If you don't like the direction the bus is going, either you have to drive the bus or get off the bus."

Please, lets get off their bus.

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» RE:Cute answer, but wrong. Posted by: Lincoln fan
Hybrids
Posted by: ewingja1 on Aug 6, 2007 5:37 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Let's all run out and buy hybrids. THen in 20 years we can have a whole new crisis on where we should bury the batteries. !!!

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» Batteries Posted by: mrcentrist
read books
Posted by: richholland on Aug 6, 2007 6:01 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Jared Diamond wrote the book "Colapse"
He analysed 5 factors about the distruction of civilisation.

1. climate change
2. destroying environment
3. unable to learn from other cultures
4. destruction of tradenetworks

5. The Elite who doesnot change their attitudes, in spite of the formentioned parameters they stay GREEDY, they still want their profits.
This applies to Roman, Vikings, Mayas etc etc.
I fear it also applies to the economical system in the USA,
capital used to serve the country isOK.
But health insurence as a profit center results in bad health.
Environment protecting as a profit making vehicle will result in
the end of nature.
Ofcourse CEO and big shareholders can afford their own landscape, woods,rivers and fresh air.
We are on the planet to live not to make MONEY.

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» RE: read books Posted by: Lincoln fan
Our Lifestyles are Killing Us
Posted by: theshadowknows on Aug 6, 2007 6:18 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I read an article recently that made the bigger picture stand out. This is part one: http://www.orionmagazine.org/index.php/articles/article/233

This is part two:
http://www.orionmagazine.org/index.php/articles/article/267

We all should examine how we contribute to this.

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» Thanks Posted by: Jeff G
And then there's HEMP, the correct plant that causes ZERO global warming.
Posted by: maxpayne on Aug 6, 2007 7:28 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As much as I appreciate the author for sounding the alarm on eco-pretenders, his article is still another example of doom and gloom baloney with no solutions whatsoever. If America had legalized INDUSTRIAL HEMP already, we wouldn't be burning rainforests just to produce INEFFICIENT and FINITE biodiesel and then crying about it causing global warming. Contrary to what the naysayers would tell you, hemp does NOT cause global warming, does NOT deplete the soil, can be grown in any climate whether we're talking Alaska or Africa, helps preserve all forests, and does not take long to grow and produce. Besides, think of the good paying jobs you'd get with it all. As long as the Left ignores the idea of HEMP for fuel, they'll continue to SEVERELY LOSE every time.

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» Say yes to hemp!! Posted by: garry minor
The House of Usher
Posted by: willymack on Aug 6, 2007 7:28 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
For anyone who's read Poe, the horror of that story was that the family was insane. Our modern-day House is in the same situation and is ready to fall down in flames. Our collective insanity is threatening our very existence, while those in power are in a state of denial. I don't think the human race DESERVES to die off, but we can't blame anything or anyone else if it does.

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» Well said! Posted by: Sojourner
“Enlightened” elite
Posted by: shangrilalad on Aug 6, 2007 7:59 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Socialism ad Liberalism are dirty words in America, everyone knows that, but who made the decision to demonize them, and why? Republicans and greed.

Socialism and Liberalism are a lot closer to egalitarianism (which many claim to believe in, but don’t) than capitalism, a rightwing religion which preaches selfishness and greed. Capitalism is preached by an “enlightened” elite who happen to control the wealth, power and government in America. This “enlightened” elite also controls Big Media, which has resulted in plutocratic lies and propaganda being our sole source of information.

What we have is the “Haves” teaching the “Have-Nots,” Morality and the “American Way.”

Have you ever, even for a moment, thought about that?

No ISM, is essentially good or evil. It’s always a matter of how it’s implemented. Uncorrupted communism, socialism or capitalism has never existed. All countries have an “enlightened” elite who make the rules and determine policy which is always in their own self-interest. Our “enlightened” elite attack socialism and liberalism as evil, when in reality, it’s democracy and egalitarianism they despise.

Servile and mindless acceptance of rightwing capitalistic religion, is not the American Way.

We've accepted a "system" that bring out the worst in us.

.

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» RE: “Enlightened” elite Posted by: EncinoM
Capitalism can think profit but it can’t think nature.
Posted by: wmGreybeard on Aug 6, 2007 8:10 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The following is a quote from the link provided by ,theshadowknows, a couple of comments back. Our Lifestyles are Killing Us
An essay by Curtis White

I highly recomend reading it, if you missed it.

"Capitalism can think profit but it can’t think nature. It’s not in its nature to think nature. What is part of its nature is marketing ("We’re organic! Buy us!"), even while its actions—industrial livestock practices that masquerade as Earth-friendly, for instance—are really only about market share, dividends, and stock value.

Capitalism as a system of ever-accelerating production and consumption is, as we environmentalists continually insist, not sustainable. That is, it is a system intent on its own death. Yet the capitalist will stoically look destruction in the face before he will stop what he’s doing, especially if he believes that it is somebody else whose destruction is in question. Unlike most of the people living under him, the capitalist is a great risk-taker largely because he believes that his wealth insulates him from the consequences of risks gone bad. Ever the optimistic gambler with other people’s money, the capitalist is willing to wager that, while there may be costs to pay, he won’t have to pay them."

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Moore's Law,
Posted by: Trazom on Aug 6, 2007 10:21 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
simply put, states that the number of transistors on a given electrical circuit component roughly doubles every 18 months due to advances in technology. For quite a long time this was true, but anyone in the technology business knows that we will soon be hitting a wall with this theory. The wall being the law of physics itself, as you build smaller and smaller you begin to approach the angstrom (0.1 nanometers), which is a measure of the size of atoms. But the real interesting thing is before that happens, before we hit the wall, we will have to deal with other physical side-effects of this process that also get worse with shrinking devices. One such side effect is heat. More transistors packed into a smaller area means more heat generated, which means more consideration must be given to heat flow and device tolerance. So while it may be possible to continue to shrink electrical devices, it may not be practical.

The parallels between Moore's Law and capitalism are many. Both are driven by a perpetual ratcheting up of expectations in pursuit of a self-fulfilling prophecy (2x transistors, doubling of wealth). Both theories were constructed without a clear or meaningful end to signify that the theory was indeed successful (will go on for ad-infinitum). Both theories push the boundaries as far as to what is physically possible (shrinking devices down to the size of atoms, consuming more and more resources in a limited resource environment).

And like Moore's Law, the cracks are beginning to show in the theory of capitalism, as perceived as nasty little side effects. We have: increasing inequality, an insatiable religion of globalization hell bent on producing the cheapest product at any human or environmental cost, the dimishing of worker's rights, the destruction of the traditional pension system, easy credit, hedge funds, and on and on. But while the computer industry has finally come to grips with the end of Moore's Law and started re-tooling for a different technology all-together (quantum computers), what is being done about capitalism?

At what point will we realize that capitalism will hit its wall?

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» RE: Moore's Law, Posted by: Smiggsy
» Better to look at the Kondratiev wave Posted by: ReallyBearish
Hey... why not..
Posted by: JoshuaLudd on Aug 6, 2007 10:53 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
... after all... its not like they are the only ones our economy caters to or anything...

Its not like the vast majority of us who aren't wealthy matter or anything...

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screwed from the get-go
Posted by: zooeyhall on Aug 6, 2007 11:01 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"protecting the planet and making money "

If you accept that premise, you're screwed from the get-go.

As far as I am concerned, the tagline on this article kills it before it even gets out the gate.

For all you free-market and "capitalisim is gooood" people out there, who are also trying to be environmentalists--I am afraid you are in denial.

There is NO way capitalism, by it's very nature, can do this.

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Believe the brand or we will wiretap your phone
Posted by: applepie on Aug 6, 2007 11:14 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The whole idea of branding environmentatlism is so hopeslessly wrong it must have been dreamt up by some inbred tragic family, like the Sherwood family in Raymond Chandler's The Big Sleep...and the truth is that the madness and twisted perversion is within the system itself.

After spending decades in the environmental movement, of getting arrested, and of being ignored, after the real and visible signs that something drastic is neccesary if we are to continue our civilization, and then now seeing the scummy investor class move in and try to co-opt the inherent good of the project for profit means to me that their war on humanity, and their war on the planets biosphere that supports humanity, gets closer to that unforgivable ending where the planet will just balance itself by snuffing billions of us out.

What will our representatives due with this newfound intelligence I wonder? How many private armies and tropical ecosystem biodeisel generators will it take to protect the teak and mahogany lawn chairs from damage while the rest of the planets bioforce scratches it's diminished existence along?

Get off the bus! It's about to go over a cliff.

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» Nuh uh. Sing a song as we go! Posted by: Sojourner
We're living on Easter Island
Posted by: sausage on Aug 6, 2007 12:48 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Jared Diamond in Collaspse How Societies Choose To Fail Or Succeed writes:
I have often asked myself, "What did the Easter Islander who cut down the last palm tree say while he was doing it?" Like modern loggers, did he shout "Jobs, not trees!" Or: "Technology will solve our problems, never fear, we'll find a substitute for wood"? Or: "We don't have proof that there arent' palms somewhere else on Easter, we need more research, your proposed ban on logging is premature and driven by fear-mongering"?

So now the corporate investment crowd, seeing a buck to be made, have suddenly converted to Green technologies: wind turbines, ethanol, biodiesel, passive solar electricity generation. All designed to clean the air and water while turning a nice profit on a rather small initial investment.

Yet little or no mention, even by many in the old-line ecology movement, of mass public transportation or the end of urban sprawl. Americans love cars. Americans need houses. Higher fuel efficiency standards and nitrogen will solve our energy need, food needs and housing needs without sacrifice.

Diamond concludes:Our television documentaries and books show us in graphic detail why the Easter Islanders, Classic Maya, and other past societies collapsed. Thus, we have the opportunity to learn from the mistakes of distant peoples and past peoples. That's an opportunity that no past society enjoyed to such a degree. My hope in writing this book has been that enough people will choose to profit from that opportunity to make a difference.

Personally, I am not as optimistic as Dr. Diamond.

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The death of capitalism:
Posted by: pzzp on Aug 6, 2007 1:51 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
by William Sanjour
"Making money and avoiding risk in doing so is what capitalism is all about. But it is precisely in the risk taking that society draws its benefits from capitalism. That is the dilemma. Risk promotes wise investment resulting in efficiency, innovation and the creation of wealth, not just for the capitalist but for society as a whole. But a lot of capitalists fall by the wayside in the process. It is in the capitalist’s interest to eliminate risk and society’s interest to prevent them from doing so. The way to avoid risk is to control the market and to do that they must also control the government. This struggle has been going on for hundreds of years: capitalists forming monopolies, oligarchies and trusts and society breaking them up.

So long as society can keep pace with all the tricks and turns that capitalists take to avoid risk, the world would continue to reap the blessings of capitalism. But for the capitalists to succeed in eliminating risk, they would have to eliminate competition resulting in a monopoly of corporations with as much efficiency and innovation as any government bureaucracy. The ultimate risk-free climax would be monopoly and oligarchy and the corporate-run government necessary to keep it that way — functionally indistinguishable from a Mafia run state or a Stalinist one. Capitalism, instead of an engine which pumps wealth to society and makes some capitalist wealthy in the process, would become an engine which sucks the wealth out of society, making a handful wealthy by impoverishing the rest"

See the rest here:
http://pwp.lincs.net/sanjour/ The%20Death%20of%20Capitalism.htm
(remove the space before "The" if you copy and paste)

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Our food supply is being held hostage by greed
Posted by: ld7440 on Aug 9, 2007 10:39 AM   
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It's great that astute politicians are recognizing the questionable motives of unscrupulous mega-corporations, but they won't give up easily. With agribusinesses like Cargil, gmo manufacturers like Monsanto, coal miners and other interests wooing politicians with money, what chance do consumers have to have an uncorrupted food supply? Whatever effects our environment affects our food supply. We all need to continue to stay informed on the "green" and "organic" revolutions, if we want to enjoy the freedom to choose what we feed our families.

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~~~S.O.S.~~~MayDay***
Posted by: CaptainChurch on Aug 9, 2007 12:40 PM   
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Please help me save young [ & old] lives, now NEEDLESSLY lost!
Help spread these [volunteer sites] planet-wide and express real
empathy!~~~

~~~~~SUICIDE VACCINE~~~~~[It works, which is the only point, Eh?!]
http://CaptainChurch.proboards57.com
http://s2.excoboard.com/exco/index.php?boardid=24582
http://s2.excoboard.com/exco/index.php?boardid=15311
http://b4.boards2go.com/boards/board.cgi?user=ChurchCaptain
~~~On sites above: "A New fact about Jesus Christ" and "666 finally
explained"~~~
*
http://groups.google.com/group/TeenAnswers
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BestTeenAnswers
http://groups.google.com/group/answers-for-teens
[~~~All groups:::5 permanent monographs & no chat~~~
like, "Who are YOU?!?" , "The useless War of the Sexes" and "LOVE is
the Real Thing".]

http://www.bev.net/users/homepages/JamesSorrell [My first web
page-2003]

Jim Sorrell [CaptainChurch]
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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Capitalism is "creative"?
Posted by: WitchyNy on Aug 13, 2007 3:03 PM   
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Well then just think how much more so Socialism would be!

This is what is so fustrating about Alternet. It takes us..ALMOST there!!!AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHH!

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save the planet - HEAL the humans
Posted by: unity1 on Aug 13, 2007 8:37 PM   
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If only people could become conscious of the bigger picture -of course these parasistes are going to want to cash in on green - its the nature of the beast -it never changes - meanwhile the bigger picture surrounds us without most being aware of it - seeing old growth forrests as lumber - like Honda who pronouced way back in the 70's these old growth trees will proudly become timber to pack our cars - ancient forrests clear cut around the world for profit - animal mineral and vegetable species gone forever without so much as a murmerr from most unconscious folk - we are a civilisation that is devouring itself - we devoured firstly all the indigenous we came across then their/our landbase and we stand here today paying the price - green investment be dammed - there is no way out of this - not untill we stop pretending everything is ok - billionaries will always want more - that is the nature of greed - the beast is never full and always wants more and for over 5000 years without any major changes in belief humanity has aqsciesed to it

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