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It’s Time for a Declaration of Independence From Israel

By Chris Hedges, Truthdig. Posted July 6, 2007.


The former New York Times Mideast bureau chief warns that America’s foreign policy, particularly under the Bush administration, has been subverted by an aggressive and dangerous Israeli agenda that could launch a nightmarish regional war.

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Israel, without the United States, would probably not exist. The country came perilously close to extinction during the October 1973 war when Egypt, trained and backed by the Soviet Union, crossed the Suez and the Syrians poured in over the Golan Heights. Huge American military transport planes came to the rescue. They began landing every half-hour to refit the battered Israeli army, which had lost most of its heavy armor. By the time the war was over, the United States had given Israel $2.2 billion in emergency military aid.

The intervention, which enraged the Arab world, triggered the OPEC oil embargo that for a time wreaked havoc on Western economies. This was perhaps the most dramatic example of the sustained life-support system the United States has provided to the Jewish state.

Israel was born at midnight May 14, 1948. The U.S. recognized the new state 11 minutes later. The two countries have been locked in a deadly embrace ever since.

Washington, at the beginning of the relationship, was able to be a moderating influence. An incensed President Eisenhower demanded and got Israel's withdrawal after the Israelis occupied Gaza in 1956. During the Six-Day War in 1967, Israeli warplanes bombed the USS Liberty. The ship, flying the U.S. flag and stationed 15 miles off the Israeli coast, was intercepting tactical and strategic communications from both sides. The Israeli strikes killed 34 U.S. sailors and wounded 171. The deliberate attack froze, for a while, Washington's enthusiasm for Israel. But ruptures like this one proved to be only bumps, soon smoothed out by an increasingly sophisticated and well-financed Israel lobby that set out to merge Israeli and American foreign policy in the Middle East.

Israel has reaped tremendous rewards from this alliance. It has been given more than $140 billion in U.S. direct economic and military assistance. It receives about $3 billion in direct assistance annually, roughly one-fifth of the U.S. foreign aid budget. Although most American foreign aid packages stipulate that related military purchases have to be made in the United States, Israel is allowed to use about 25 percent of the money to subsidize its own growing and profitable defense industry. It is exempt, unlike other nations, from accounting for how it spends the aid money. And funds are routinely siphoned off to build new Jewish settlements, bolster the Israeli occupation in the Palestinian territories and construct the security barrier, which costs an estimated $1 million a mile.

The barrier weaves its way through the West Bank, creating isolated pockets of impoverished Palestinians in ringed ghettos. By the time the barrier is finished it will probably in effect seize up to 40 percent of Palestinian land. This is the largest land grab by Israel since the 1967 war. And although the United States officially opposes settlement expansion and the barrier, it also funds them.

The U.S. has provided Israel with nearly $3 billion to develop weapons systems and given Israel access to some of the most sophisticated items in its own military arsenal, including Blackhawk attack helicopters and F-16 fighter jets. The United States also gives Israel access to intelligence it denies to its NATO allies. And when Israel refused to sign the nuclear nonproliferation treaty, the United States stood by without a word of protest as the Israelis built the region's first nuclear weapons program.

U.S. foreign policy, especially under the current Bush administration, has become little more than an extension of Israeli foreign policy. The United States since 1982 has vetoed 32 Security Council resolutions critical of Israel, more than the total number of vetoes cast by all the other Security Council members. It refuses to enforce the Security Council resolutions it claims to support. These resolutions call on Israel to withdraw from the occupied territories.

There is now volcanic anger and revulsion by Arabs at this blatant favoritism. Few in the Middle East see any distinction between Israeli and American policies, nor should they. And when the Islamic radicals speak of U.S. support of Israel as a prime reason for their hatred of the United States, we should listen. The consequences of this one-sided relationship are being played out in the disastrous war in Iraq, growing tension with Iran, and the humanitarian and political crisis in Gaza. It is being played out in Lebanon, where Hezbollah is gearing up for another war with Israel, one most Middle East analysts say is inevitable. The U.S. foreign policy in the Middle East is unraveling. And it is doing so because of this special relationship. The eruption of a regional conflict would usher in a nightmare of catastrophic proportions.

There were many in the American foreign policy establishment and State Department who saw this situation coming. The decision to throw our lot in with Israel in the Middle East was not initially a popular one with an array of foreign policy experts, including President Harry Truman's secretary of state, Gen. George Marshall. They warned there would be a backlash. They knew the cost the United States would pay in the oil-rich region for this decision, which they feared would be one of the greatest strategic blunders of the postwar era. And they were right. The decision has jeopardized American and Israeli security and created the kindling for a regional conflagration.

The alliance, which makes no sense in geopolitical terms, does makes sense when seen through the lens of domestic politics. The Israel lobby has become a potent force in the American political system. No major candidate, Democrat or Republican, dares to challenge it. The lobby successfully purged the State Department of Arab experts who challenged the notion that Israeli and American interests were identical. Backers of Israel have doled out hundreds of millions of dollars to support U.S. political candidates deemed favorable to Israel. They have brutally punished those who strayed, including the first President Bush, who they said was not vigorous enough in his defense of Israeli interests. This was a lesson the next Bush White House did not forget. George W. Bush did not want to be a one-term president like his father.

Israel advocated removing Saddam Hussein from power and currently advocates striking Iran to prevent it from acquiring nuclear weapons. Direct Israeli involvement in American military operations in the Middle East is impossible. It would reignite a war between Arab states and Israel. The United States, which during the Cold War avoided direct military involvement in the region, now does the direct bidding of Israel while Israel watches from the sidelines. During the 1991 Gulf War, Israel was a spectator, just as it is in the war with Iraq.

President Bush, facing dwindling support for the war in Iraq, publicly holds Israel up as a model for what he would like Iraq to become. Imagine how this idea plays out on the Arab street, which views Israel as the Algerians viewed the French colonizers during the war of liberation.

"In Israel," Bush said recently, "terrorists have taken innocent human life for years in suicide attacks. The difference is that Israel is a functioning democracy and it's not prevented from carrying out its responsibilities. And that's a good indicator of success that we're looking for in Iraq."

Americans are increasingly isolated and reviled in the world. They remain blissfully ignorant of their own culpability for this isolation. U.S. "spin" paints the rest of the world as unreasonable, but Israel, Americans are assured, will always be on our side.

Israel is reaping economic as well as political rewards from its lock-down apartheid state. In the "gated community" market it has begun to sell systems and techniques that allow the nation to cope with terrorism. Israel, in 2006, exported $3.4 billion in defense products -- well over a billion dollars more than it received in American military aid. Israel has grown into the fourth largest arms dealer in the world. Most of this growth has come in the so-called homeland security sector.

"The key products and services," as Naomi Klein wrote in The Nation, "are hi-tech fences, unmanned drones, biometric IDs, video and audio surveillance gear, air passenger profiling and prisoner interrogation systems -- precisely the tools and technologies Israel has used to lock in the occupied territories. And that is why the chaos in Gaza and the rest of the region doesn't threaten the bottom line in Tel Aviv, and may actually boost it. Israel has learned to turn endless war into a brand asset, pitching its uprooting, occupation and containment of the Palestinian people as a half-century head start in the 'global war on terror.' "

The United States, at least officially, does not support the occupation and calls for a viable Palestinian state. It is a global player, with interests that stretch well beyond the boundaries of the Middle East, and the equation that Israel's enemies are our enemies is not that simple.

"Terrorism is not a single adversary," John Mearsheimer and Stephen Walt wrote in The London Review of Books, "but a tactic employed by a wide array of political groups. The terrorist organizations that threaten Israel do not threaten the United States, except when it intervenes against them (as in Lebanon in 1982). Moreover, Palestinian terrorism is not random violence directed against Israel or 'the West'; it is largely a response to Israel's prolonged campaign to colonize the West Bank and Gaza Strip. More important, saying that Israel and the US are united by a shared terrorist threat has the causal relationship backwards: the US has a terrorism problem in good part because it is so closely allied with Israel, not the other way around."

Middle Eastern policy is shaped in the United States by those with very close ties to the Israel lobby. Those who attempt to counter the virulent Israeli position, such as former Secretary of State Colin Powell, are ruthlessly slapped down. This alliance was true also during the Clinton administration, with its array of Israel-first Middle East experts, including special Middle East coordinator Dennis Ross and Martin Indyk, the former deputy director of the American Israel Public Affairs Committee, AIPAC, one of the most powerful Israel lobbying groups in Washington. But at least people like Indyk and Ross are sane, willing to consider a Palestinian state, however unviable, as long as it is palatable to Israel. The Bush administration turned to the far-right wing of the Israel lobby, those who have not a shred of compassion for the Palestinians or a word of criticism for Israel. These new Middle East experts include Elliott Abrams, John Bolton, Douglas Feith, the disgraced I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby, Richard Perle, Paul Wolfowitz and David Wurmser.

Washington was once willing to stay Israel's hand. It intervened to thwart some of its most extreme violations of human rights. This administration, however, has signed on for every disastrous Israeli blunder, from building the security barrier in the West Bank, to sealing off Gaza and triggering a humanitarian crisis, to the ruinous invasion and saturation bombing of Lebanon.

The few tepid attempts by the Bush White House to criticize Israeli actions have all ended in hasty and humiliating retreats in the face of Israeli pressure. When the Israel Defense Forces in April 2002 reoccupied the West Bank, President Bush called on then-Prime Minister Ariel Sharon to "halt the incursions and begin withdrawal." It never happened. After a week of heavy pressure from the Israel lobby and Israel's allies in Congress, meaning just about everyone in Congress, the president gave up, calling Sharon "a man of peace." It was a humiliating moment for the United States, a clear sign of who pulled the strings.

There were several reasons for the war in Iraq. The desire for American control of oil, the belief that Washington could build puppet states in the region, and a real, if misplaced, fear of Saddam Hussein played a part in the current disaster. But it was also strongly shaped by the notion that what is good for Israel is good for the United States. Israel wanted Iraq neutralized. Israeli intelligence, in the lead-up to the war, gave faulty information to the U.S. about Iraq's alleged arsenal of weapons of mass destruction. And when Baghdad was taken in April 2003, the Israeli government immediately began to push for an attack on Syria. The lust for this attack has waned, in no small part because the Americans don't have enough troops to hang on in Iraq, much less launch a new occupation.

Israel is currently lobbying the United States to launch aerial strikes on Iran, despite the debacle in Lebanon. Israel's iron determination to forcibly prevent a nuclear Iran makes it probable that before the end of the Bush administration an attack on Iran will take place. The efforts to halt nuclear development through diplomatic means have failed. It does not matter that Iran poses no threat to the United States. It does not matter that it does not even pose a threat to Israel, which has several hundred nuclear weapons in its arsenal. It matters only that Israel demands total military domination of the Middle East.

The alliance between Israel and the United States has culminated after 50 years in direct U.S. military involvement in the Middle East. This involvement, which is not furthering American interests, is unleashing a geopolitical nightmare. American soldiers and Marines are dying in droves in a useless war. The impotence of the United States in the face of Israeli pressure is complete. The White House and the Congress have become, for perhaps the first time, a direct extension of Israeli interests. There is no longer any debate within the United States. This is evidenced by the obsequious nods to Israel by all the current presidential candidates with the exception of Dennis Kucinich. The political cost for those who challenge Israel is too high.

This means there will be no peaceful resolution of the Palestinian-Israeli conflict. It means the incidents of Islamic terrorism against the U.S. and Israel will grow. It means that American power and prestige are on a steep, irreversible decline. And I fear it also means the ultimate end of the Jewish experiment in the Middle East.

The weakening of the United States, economically and militarily, is giving rise to new centers of power. The U.S. economy, mismanaged and drained by the Iraq war, is increasingly dependent on Chinese trade imports and on Chinese holdings of U.S. Treasury securities. China holds dollar reserves worth $825 billion. If Beijing decides to abandon the U.S. bond market, even in part, it would cause a free fall by the dollar. It would lead to the collapse of the $7-trillion U.S. real estate market. There would be a wave of U.S. bank failures and huge unemployment. The growing dependence on China has been accompanied by aggressive work by the Chinese to build alliances with many of the world's major exporters of oil, such as Iran, Nigeria, Sudan and Venezuela. The Chinese are preparing for the looming worldwide clash over dwindling resources.

The future is ominous. Not only do Israel's foreign policy objectives not coincide with American interests, they actively hurt them. The growing belligerence in the Middle East, the calls for an attack against Iran, the collapse of the imperial project in Iraq have all given an opening, where there was none before, to America's rivals. It is not in Israel's interests to ignite a regional conflict. It is not in ours. But those who have their hands on the wheel seem determined, in the name of freedom and democracy, to keep the American ship of state headed at breakneck speed into the cliffs before us.

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Chris Hedges is the former Middle East bureau chief for The New York Times and the author of "War Is a Force That Gives Us Meaning."

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Sure, scapegoat Bush.
Posted by: ateo on Jul 6, 2007 1:37 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This has been going on for decades upon decades people.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

It is time for an isolationist foreign policy.
Posted by: White middleclass male on Jul 6, 2007 1:57 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
No America has no business funding Israel.

We also have no business providing tsunami relief, aid to Africa, military intervention in Haiti, Bosnia, Liberia or what ever other dirt bag country is slaughtering its minorities.

I hope I live to see the day when America expels all of the illegal immigrants and cuts itself out of the worlds problems.

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» Except that without trade... Posted by: justaguy
» Hahahahaha. Posted by: justaguy
» Another strawman? Posted by: justaguy
Editor
Posted by: Nebris on Jul 6, 2007 2:36 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There are some serious typos in this piece. The section about the USS Liberty for example. Please correct.

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USA - Second state of Israel
Posted by: Conservasaurus on Jul 6, 2007 2:59 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Originally, the dems were the close allies of Israel for years and set the course in this country for continuation of that policy.

The truth is that, based on comments by leading dems (and repubs as well), especially Pelosi & Clinton comes to mind, concerning support of Israel, this policy will be going on for a long time to come.

No politician is going to walk away from what is probably the strongest and best organized lobby in this country, unless of course they do not rely on their funds to get elected.

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» Kucinich... Posted by: WhuThe?!?
I absolutely agree
Posted by: paul_revere on Jul 6, 2007 3:24 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
First of all, let's establish a core concept or two.

1. It was stupid to carve out a country for the JEWS of the world. Why did they need their own country after World War II? After the Holocaust, people around the world were sympathetic to the persecution of the Jews by Hitler and the Nazis. Jews could have been accepted wherever they were to live. A better idea would have been to simply make Jerusalem an international city, a center of peace where people of all faiths could visit and worship. Matter of fact, the United Nations should have moved their headquarters there. The areas outside of Jerusalem could have stayed the same and Jews in Europe and elsewhere could have emigrated there and mixed in with the local population if they desired instead of claiming the land and removing and pushing out the people who already inhabited the area.

2. I don't know about anyone else but the god I know and believe in is NOT a god of real estate and didn't promise shit to anyone. Period. How insane to think of this as something godlike -- to be exclusive to a race or group of people! Just like when people say GOD BLESS AMERICA or God allowed us to win a game or other horseshit like that. God is not a respecter of persons. There is no chosen people or race. The only way the Jews were chosen is that Jesus needed to be born into an area of people that had the closest concept of a single godhead so that the message of Jesus might be more easily understood and accepted. That is, the only thing necessary for mortal salvation is to love God and love your fellow human being. That's it! So this "God promised the land" and "chosen people" and other crap is pure bullshit and lies.

Moving on .. years ago I remember watching Benjamin Netanyahu on CNN's Crossfire and witnessed how he didn't give a crap about killing Palestinians because all that was important was establishing settlements and pushing out the non-Jews. I could see that he was one of the most evil men in the world and how his policy and attitude would cause great problems for both Israel and the rest of the world. I was much a much younger man then, but I could see plain as day what an asshole he truly was (is). Well, Netanyahu is doing it again. He's like Dick Cheney -- evil to the core and running things behind the scenes. He's the main person pushing the neocon and Zionist agenda -- he doesn't care who lives or dies as long as the Jewish nation continues to expand and push out all the Palestinians.

Israel has the nerve to call itself a democracy, but when the Palestinians democratically elected a government that Israel didn't like, Israel illegally withheld taxes owed to the Palestinians just like the evil banker did in the Christmas movie - 'It's a Wonderful Life!'

They have denied them clean water, food, medicine, electricity, and they have bombarded them, killed them, bulldozed them, assassinated their leaders, illegally arrested their leaders, etc.

It is pure genocide by the Israelis - with U.S. taxpayer money.

Bottom line -- the good Israelis need to overthrow the Likud and Orthodox cancers in their government and create a single state and convert Jerusalem to an International city. And we need to keep the Israeli lobby from stinking up the halls of Congress any further -- the Repukes have done plenty of that already.

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» Very well said! Posted by: WhuThe?!?
Hedges: A man to be trusted
Posted by: Dee1276 on Jul 6, 2007 4:44 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Thank you Mr Hedges for speaking the truth. I hope you will not be "punished" by Israeli sympathizers for speaking out.

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Have You Seen These Video's?
Posted by: wawa on Jul 6, 2007 5:05 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If Americans Knew What Israel Is Doing!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=brfNxtFdK9o


VIEW 5 CLIPS of Occupation 101- MAKE SURE YOU TURN THE MUSIC OFF FIRST!!!

DO NOT SKIP NUMBER 4: US Financial Aid to Israel

http://www.myspace.com/occupation101


publis service message from WAWA
http://www.wearewideawake.org/

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frederick
Posted by: sport on Jul 6, 2007 5:11 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Hedges and others might somehow believe their prejudices against Israel but I doubt it. Israel is our greatest ally in the world next to the U.K. They are also our great friends. They are also wonderful people who have been under siege since the founding of their nation by the U.N. Our embrace of one another is not deadly, it is full of love, respect and admiration. Americans are not isolated and reviled in the world except by those who think like Hedges and live within their little cocoons of self-important arrogance. Neither the U.S. nor Israel nor anywhere else is perfect or without flaws, but despite the hate-America international and national media, most people in the world love America. Don't believe fools like Hedges and the lies they disseminate-go to Israel yourself and see for yourselves what an amazing country and people it is. Bless Israel that it sells and shares what it has learned in having to defend itself for so long against such attacks as it has endured. Imagine a country in history who continuously returns lands it rightfully won in wars of aggression against it. Imagine an occupying force who has ensured hospitals, schools and infrastructure utilities are built for the indigenous populations. Stuff now destroyed or left unused by those same populations. Hedges is so off base with his assertions that it's difficult to know where to begin. People, you are being led astray and it will not be through Israel or its alliance with the U.S. that a conflagration may be coming in the mid-East. The blood will be on the hands of those who want it and those who choose to remain blind to the real issues over there. This doomsayer may get what he predicts is coming if we naively choose to believe what he has to say.

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» RE: frederick Posted by: paschn
» RE: frederick Posted by: sport
» I blame all sides.... Posted by: CatDad
» RE: frederick Posted by: maestra
» RE: frederick Posted by: sport
» RE: frederick Posted by: sport
» RE: frederick Posted by: brasilaron
» RE: frederick Posted by: jareilly
» Can you say... Posted by: WhuThe?!?
» RE: frederick Posted by: opeluboy
» RE: sport Posted by: asilsfable
» RE: frederick Posted by: mpetrigh
» Nonsense. Posted by: justaguy
» The cost is much greater...... Posted by: justaguy
Francis
Posted by: Francis on Jul 6, 2007 5:20 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The virus has completely taken over the host. There is no medicine available which can rid America of the Zionist cancer. The contempt for humanity displayed by it's brainwashed zombies is perfectly obvious to anyone paying the slightest bit of attention. The only hope is that their current state of extreme intoxication from overindulgence in the prerogatives they have swindled for themselves, somehow causes them to trip up, or causes America to wake up, before they can drag us into Iran for Act 1 of Armaggedon. I do not believe there is much likelihood of either event occurring.

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» RE: Francis Posted by: sport
Kudos to David Duke
Posted by: gistre on Jul 6, 2007 5:41 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
He was saying this stuff YEARS ago and everyone shouted him down and called him anti-Semitic. Well, it's taken seven years of Bush, the Pollard case, a criminal war and occupation, and thousands of dead American kids for people to wake up and realize that Duke was right all along - and years ahead of his time.

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» RE: Kudos to David Duke Posted by: rinthy
» Fuck David Duke. Posted by: ekipnrut
» Seconded. Posted by: justaguy
» Re: Thirded Posted by: DCBeltway
» RE: Kudos to David Duke Posted by: opeluboy
» RE: Kudos to David Duke Posted by: Tacticsb
One cannot question Zionism. One cannot question the US involvement
Posted by: albrechtkrausse on Jul 6, 2007 5:45 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
and support of Isreal, even after they are on record spying against the US, bombing the USS Liberty, selling nuclear material to other parties, committing 'extra-judicial' capital punishment, and committing acts of terrorism (Isreal was created, partly, by anti-British, anti-Arab, and even anti-Jew terrorism by the Stern gang.) We aren't allowed to know that MANY Jews were, and some still are, against Zionism and the creation of the secular state of Isreal (because this is against God's prophecy and predictions.) We aren't allow to learn that, initially, many of the Zionists accepted/promoted the Nazis because they thought they would force Jews to 'return home' to Isreal (this was before Hitler's regime started killing and rounding up Jews and others.) We aren't told about Balfour Declaration and the intrigues that led to the State of Isreal. Having said that we need to also stop aide to all Moslem countries, they are even worse than Israel and we need to cut off all support/aide immediately.

We need to recall the words of George Washington when he advised us to 'avoid entangling alliances'. America first. No more foreign wars (unless we are attacked on our shore and we know who did it and can win), no more foreign aide (hurricane, earthquakes, famine), no more foreign meddling (WB, IMF, etc), no more UN membership, etc. Use our troops to seal the borders and remove illegals and surveil Moslems. Then let the vast majority become civilian, a huge standing army lends itself to want to fight wars (use it or lose it mentality.)

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lobsterman
Posted by: lobsterman on Jul 6, 2007 5:46 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The oppressed have become the oppressors.

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Overstating the influence of the lobby
Posted by: stevewilkesuk on Jul 6, 2007 6:07 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"The alliance" of the US with Israel "makes no sense in geopolitical terms"? What - it makes no sense for the US to have a nuclear-armed US army outpost right in the heart of the Middle East? In the heart of the most strategically important area of the world? Of course it does!

If the oil all disappeared and reappeared in Australia Israel would be dropped in a heartbeat - lobby or no lobby. The US / Israeli alliance is almost completely for geopolitical advantage and internal US planning documents confirm this. Check out what Chomsky has to say on the matter:

http://www.zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?ItemID=9999

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» And it works for.... Posted by: WhuThe?!?
» It waxes and wanes. Posted by: justaguy
» RE: It waxes and wanes. Posted by: DCBeltway
» RE: It waxes and wanes. Posted by: stevewilkesuk
» RE: Thanks, but... Posted by: stevewilkesuk
» RE: Thanks, but... Posted by: IPF
» RE: arguing by tautology Posted by: stevewilkesuk
» Happy co-incidences Posted by: stevewilkesuk
Not all Jews support the State of Israel.
Posted by: veggiegrrrl on Jul 6, 2007 7:01 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Before the haters begin their anti-semitic ravings, let's separate the Jews from the nation.

As an American of Jewish ancestry who has traveled to Israel/Palestine, my personal feeling is that Israel is too dangerous to continue as a nation and the Jews should relocate to the USA, Europe, Australia, etc... and let the Arabs have the land. If I were a Jew living in Israel, I would want and choose to leave. No small area of dirt and history is worth risking the safety and security of the entire planet. Yes, families in Cameroon, Laos and Bolivia (and the rest of the world) are affected by what happens in Israel. Nobody is God's chose people. Nobody should hold onto territory at all costs. The cost of middle east instability is just too great.

And let me make one thing clear. There should be no Jewish state, no Christian state, no Muslim state and no Hindu state. If Israel should not exist as a Jewish nation, than America should not trample the planet proclaiming itself a Christian nation.

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» Personally..... Posted by: mjabele
» RE: Personally..... Posted by: cosmofur
» RE: Personally..... Posted by: asilsfable
» RE: Personally..... Posted by: asilsfable
OKBullfrog
Posted by: OKbullfrog on Jul 6, 2007 7:13 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Interesting editing by whom? Going from "page 1" of this article to "page 2" there appears to be something missing.

Page 1. "Israeli war planes bombed the ..."

Page 2. "there is now volcanic anger ..."

Israeli war planes bombed volcanic anger?

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Bush and cronies are waiting for the RAPTURE
Posted by: veggiegrrrl on Jul 6, 2007 7:19 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Bush and cronies are waiting for the RAPTURE. Isn't creating and support of middle east chaos, terror, and bloodshed one of the ways to cause Armageddon and bring Jesus back to earth?

These wackos are killing the planet for Jesus.

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» Honky Jesus is funny Posted by: White middleclass male
» Can you translate that? Posted by: veggiegrrrl
Zionists
Posted by: Gisele on Jul 6, 2007 7:39 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Before we start defending/castigating Israel...we need to realize an important point: Not all Jews are Zionists..not all Zionists are Jews. There are many Jews in the world who hate what Israel has done, and is doing - but we seem to be unable to hear their voices.

Is it because they're not speaking loudly enough? Is it because media doesn't want us to hear their message? Could the Christian Right in America be drowning out their voices, with pastors like John Hagee advocating the bombing of Iran?

We need to pull back from the precipice and separate the two, to take time and effort doing our own research from ALL available texts before lending our support to either side. For those Christians and Zionists who will quickly label me anti-semetic - I pray for "my PEOPLE Israel"...not the country of Israel. If the man Israel could see what Zionism has done to his country, and his people - he'd probably flay them alive.

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» RE: Zionists Posted by: DCBeltway
» RE: Zionists Posted by: gracefounddog
» RE: Zionists Posted by: gracefounddog
» RE: Zionists=most USJews. Posted by: edith
» RE: Zionists=most USJews. Posted by: opeluboy
Coexistence
Posted by: barbz77 on Jul 6, 2007 8:02 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
While I disagree with so many of the actions of Israel, I won't deny. I don't like the wall. Israel however is a pluralist democracy, that is often under attack from theocracies who simply don't want anyone different around. The Palestinians have sadly been used as pawns by others state who try to foster hatred against Israel. The Palestinians deserve a viable state. Peace and Coexistence are possible--can't we try to work for that? Hasn't there been enough blood shed? Aren't we all made of the same dough anyway? What kind suggestions do you have so that everyone can win? Why must a solution involve more blood?

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» RE: Coexistence Posted by: DCBeltway
» Israel is not a democracy Posted by: edith
» RE: Coexistence Posted by: opeluboy
» Israel is a theocracy Posted by: daksha
» Israel is a Secular State. Posted by: yellow
Democracy is the real problem
Posted by: andy on Jul 6, 2007 8:15 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This my friends is the pathetic paradox of so called 'Democracy". When will people realize it for the sham that it is. Singapore and China are thriving under an authoritarian capitalist system. (not totalitarian or dictatorship).

Democracy = politicians. Politicians are just a mechanism of accountability required for democracy. They do not serve any purpose other than middle men, selling their accountability to the highest bidder.

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» You are right and wrong Posted by: WhuThe?!?
» Switzerland. Posted by: justaguy
» RE: About Swiss humour Posted by: pierrot
Israel was never to be a geographical area
Posted by: Fog on Jul 6, 2007 8:16 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
www.wethepeoplefoundation.org/UPDATE/Update2007-04-15.htm


"...What we learned directly from the Holy Bible is that He gives one meaning to the word “Israel” in the Old Testament, and an entirely different meaning to the word “Israel” in the New Testament.

In the Old Testament Israel is a man named Jacob (a man who gained a spiritual victory after wrestling with God), and Jacob’s ancestors Isaac and Abraham, and all of Abraham’s seed. The word “Israel” first appears in Genesis where God says to Jacob, “Your name shall no longer be called Jacob, but Israel.” The word “Israel” then appears many times throughout the rest of the Old Testament, where it means corporate Israel, that is, the collective assembly of all those to whom He promised the Kingdom – i.e., Abraham’s seed.

According to the New Testament, Jesus fulfilled the promise by becoming Israel. According to the New Testament, Israel is now Jesus (another man who gained a spiritual victory - in the wilderness), together with His spiritual descendants. According to the New Testament, all who have accepted Jesus are included in Israel, having been “grafted in” by their faith. According to the New Testament, if you are in Christ, you are Abraham’s seed. According to the New Testament, Peter and Paul spoke to the Gentiles and the Romans the promises Moses spoke to the Israelites; there is now “neither Jew nor Greek.”

Nowhere in the Holy Scriptures did we find the Kingdom of God being promised to those occupying any piece of geography, or to the members of any nationality, race, creed or religion. Nowhere did we find it written in the Holy Scriptures that God’s ultimate plan would be implemented by a specific nation of people (Americans or Israelis) acting pursuant to the direction of their secular government leaders.

Pastor Asscherick concludes his lecture by sharing some personal knowledge and insight into current events. He argues that based on their misunderstanding of Bible prophesy, apostate Protestantism and apostate Evangelical Christian groups are pressuring politicians to support Israel, unconditionally, “if you want to stay in office.”

It seems to us the Biblical meaning of the word “Israel” has been hijacked by the “Israel” Lobby and apostate Evangelical Christian groups for the purpose of duping the People of the United States into believing: 1) that the promises of God will be frustrated unless the State of Israel gains total control of Palestine and Jerusalem; and 2), the United States will be cursed if the United States does not unconditionally support the State of Israel.

Indeed, it would seem that this further understanding of the true etymology of the word “Israel’ is of the utmost importance in considering and critically evaluating both our individual and national collective justifications for the support of Israel...."


-more-

www.wethepeoplefoundation.org/UPDATE/Update2007-04-15.htm

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How soon they forget
Posted by: darby1936 on Jul 6, 2007 8:54 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The majority of the people of Isreal have emerged from persecuted people of Europe in the 1930's and 40's to a people who persecute the Palestinian people without a second thought. Politicians of both parties in the U.S. have bought into Isreal's occupation and control of Gaza and the West Bank. Both countries have lost all moral crdibility. The God of Isreal punished it for its hubris. I fear HE is in the process of punishing Isreal and the U.S. once more.

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» RE: How soon they forget Posted by: leerhok
» RE: How soon they forget Posted by: opeluboy
» Jewish History. Posted by: yellow
» You forgot to research Posted by: IPF
It's not only the politicians to blame!
Posted by: leerhok on Jul 6, 2007 9:29 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
In Europe as in the US in the 1970's polls showed 80-20 favoring Israel and Palestine respectively. Today it has changed to 20-80 in Europe but is still about 80-20 in the US.

To Europeans it looks like US-citizens are immune to what actually takes place on the ground, who is occupier and who occupied, who kills and maims more and who destroys more neighboring infrastructure, who grabs land and who looses it,.......

And maybe mainstream media biased reporting and mainstream US-citizens media consuming habits are the reasons for their blindness?

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Where is equal representation
Posted by: Nick on Jul 6, 2007 10:10 AM   
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This country needs equal representation in Congress.
Right now Wall Street ( the Zionists snake pit) is in charge

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"Judaism and Israeli Nationalism are Two Completely Diffferent Things!!"
Posted by: gracefounddog on Jul 6, 2007 10:24 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
My husband has taken a lot of heat over the years for saying this.

"If you were to ask an Orthodox Jewish scholar if the Jewish and Christian business people who have been working so hard to install "democracy" in the Middle East by arming Israel, suppressing its neighbors' defensive capabilities and promoting its expansionist agenda are actual "Zionists" in the Jewish tradition, they would say "Absolutely NOT."
What was originally sold as the designation of a "promised land" for an oppressed people has become a tool for elitists who claim to be Jewish or Christian "Zionists" to assume dominance over any people who harbor a coveted natural resource and to pursue a power and bottom-line agenda. This is by no means to say that there are no good Jews in Israel- it's just that the Jewish peoples of deep faith and conviction are not the ones setting up political systems that oppress other cultures in the pursuit of geographic dominance.

What bothers me is that the real Jews- the fine people of deep heritage, who love others, promote harmony and peace, who strive to build communities, and who's search for Zion was built on the need for identity and a place to call home- a place from which to radiate and promote goodness and humanity, are now bundled with the devolved elitists who kill and victimize in the name of God. "In the name of God" should be the equivalent of "In the name of Love." I don't see a lot of people operating weapons or banks in Israel functioning in the name of love.

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» RE: Orthodox Jews in US=Zionists Posted by: gracefounddog
» Hang on. Posted by: justaguy
...with the exception of Dennis Kucinich
Posted by: alternetrose on Jul 6, 2007 10:29 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
C'mon, people, the choice for '08 President is obvious! Why do you think the media and the big money slam, ridicule, malign and marginalize Dennis Kucinich? Be smart - think for yourselves! Support the funny looking short guy who isn't owned by AIPAC. Take back America, for Americans! Put honesty, integrity and peace back on the table. America is starving for a main course of Constitutional Cuisine, and as a side dish we need healthcare!
To quote the author of this article:
"The alliance between Israel and the United States has culminated after 50 years in direct U.S. military involvement in the Middle East. This involvement, which is not furthering American interests, is unleashing a geopolitical nightmare. American soldiers and Marines are dying in droves in a useless war. The impotence of the United States in the face of Israeli pressure is complete. The White House and the Congress have become, for perhaps the first time, a direct extension of Israeli interests. There is no longer any debate within the United States. This is evidenced by the obsequious nods to Israel by all the current presidential candidates with the exception of Dennis Kucinich. The political cost for those who challenge Israel is too high."

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» YES! Posted by: WhuThe?!?
» RE: YES! Posted by: DCBeltway
» Thanks for the excellent link Posted by: WhuThe?!?
The Leona Helmsley syndrome
Posted by: reinaldok on Jul 6, 2007 10:45 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Remember Leona Helmsley squaking about the "Little People".
Just like the neocons and many of the so called liberals. Israel is US. Give them all the weapons they might or might not need. Everything up to the most sophisticated nukes. Iran - they are the "Little People". Don't let them get close to nukes or anything similar. They are not US. Time to wake up the AIPAC followers before it is way too late.

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Wow!
Posted by: WhuThe?!? on Jul 6, 2007 12:46 PM   
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If that wasn't depressing, I don't know what is!
Thanks for reminding us why they say ignorance is bliss!

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Everyone else has done it, why can't I?
Posted by: christastropher on Jul 6, 2007 12:49 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Bush is the one who has pushed this unholy alliance to it's logical end, i.e. an imperialist war on behalf of another nation. Therefore, he is the one who should shoulder the blame for our current state of affairs as they pertain to the Middle East. It isn't Clinton's or his father's foreign policy that created this quagmire, although neither one of them did much to prevent the climate that made it possible while they were in office. His whole-hearted acceptance of the Israeli view of Middle East politics has proven disastrous for this country. It is about time we stopped doing the bidding of a foreign power and begin to straighten out our own state of affairs, and then maybe we could involve ourselves in our nations-like stopping the genocide in Darfur, or relieving the crushing debts of Third World nations. You know, using our power to help people instead of kill them. Something tells me that there would be a lot less anger towards us if our foreign policy leaned more in that direction.

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Thanks for the Wiki hyperlink re: USS Liberty, even though you ignored its import.
Posted by: Sojourner on Jul 6, 2007 1:25 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
From Wiki:
"Israel's official position is that the attack was not the result of an intentional targeting of an American ship. Israeli officials say they were assured by the United States that no U.S. ships were in the area, [1] and that its air and naval forces mistakenly identified Liberty as the Egyptian vessel El Quseir. Supporters of this position say Israel had no motive for a surprise attack on an important ally. They also note that the tense atmosphere of the Six-Day War created the possibility of such mistakes, and point out that the U.S. government, concerned about such dangers, ordered the Liberty further away from shore (although the Liberty — despite being an NSA electronics signals listening ship with extensive communications equipment — claims that communications failures kept the order from arriving in time).
"[2] Finally, they note that the United States has several times mistakenly attacked its own and allied forces in so-called friendly fire incidents."

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» Nonsense. Posted by: justaguy
Israel is a racist theocracy
Posted by: persian on Jul 6, 2007 1:29 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The rise of islamic fanatacism in middle east is partially due to failure of secular-nationalist politician to end occupation and reach an honorable resolution to the palestinian- israel conflict. Israel armed by us with the most sophisticated weapons senses no need to compromise. The daily humiliation of millions ansd a sense of hoplessness drives many youth to seek guidance from religious hate merchants. They don't hate us because we are free, they hate us for our blind support for a racist theocracy.

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» You are a joke yellow. Posted by: justaguy
A view from the land
Posted by: MrLucky on Jul 6, 2007 1:33 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Having just returned from Israel as part of a Labor delegation I would disagree with the Times correspondent's perspective. We met with many sides of the conflict and many groups both opposed and supportive of resolution to the problems of the area. There is no one solution or one prespective. Within groups there were heated arguements within over what were pathways to reduce conflict, who was an honest broker and who could be trusted on agreements towards peace. The main phrase from all when asked for a solution was," It's complicated".
As for the Iranian Nuclear bomb capacity. It is difficult for a people that have experienced a holocust to not take seriously an Iranian President's threat that the extermination of every Jewish man, woman and child would be worth the price of the extermination of all Iranian people in retaliation for such nuclear action.
Overall the majority of all people in the land (Jewish, Muslim, Christian) were for peaceful co-exsistance and a better future for the people they loved. It is the extremes of the forces of all sides, that kill the peacemakers, that makes life for most of the people dangerous and/or deadly. It's complicated, way beyond a simple sentance or paragraph or article.

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» RE: A view from the land Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: A view from the land Posted by: josephq
» RE: A view from the land Posted by: gracefounddog
» RE: A view from the land Posted by: opeluboy
» RE: A view from the land Posted by: maxloen
» No, it's really quite simple. Posted by: justaguy
Let's face the fact that US Jews on the whole endorse zionist crimes
Posted by: edith on Jul 6, 2007 2:56 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
About one-half of US Jews according to population surveys taken by major US Jewish organizations conisider themselves "affiliated" Jews-that is, they belong to a synogogue, are active in Jewish community activities and participate in Jewish religious activities to some extent. The vast majority of synagogues in the US-whether the realtively "modern" liberal Reform groups- or the more "Orthodox" traditionalist conservative groups, support zionism actively. Young people are encouraged to visit Israel for studies, with the eventual objective of increases in emigration of US Jews to Israel. Israel is considered by active US Jews as "our" country, the USA notwithstanding. Of course very few US Jews have parents or grandparents who came from Israel; the affiliation with Israel is the result of interpretations of religious mysticism and heavily censored history that ignores the legitimate rights of Palestinian Arabs.

Supporters of the human rights of Palestinians and Americans who are sick and tired of the US govt's acting like a branch office of the Israel Defense Forces, therefore must be willing to take on the big, wealthy influential Jewish organizations in the US: the United Jewish Communities, the United Synagogue of America, the Synagogue Council of the US, and the Reform Jewish Movement. It is neither anti-Semitism nor anti-Jewish/religion to denounce Jewish groups for their substitution of Zionism and racism for Judaism and its humanistic traditions.

Unfortunately, for most active affiliated US Jews, Judaism is indistinguishable from Zionism, and they find that identity to be just fine. Like the Southern state governments in the 1950's, these racists must be confronted even though it appears almost as hopeless as the Freedom Riders' initial efforts ito challenge these wealthy and powerful Zionist/Jewish groups.

How many wars in Iraq or Iran will it take before the US public realizes that Zionist Jews are the real enemy of the US? But do not kid yourself: If you are against Zionism, you are in fact against the prevalent form of institutionalized Judaism in the US today, and you will be ostracized by powerful forces if you are in politics or business. Thus the despicable groveling of nearly all the US Presidential candidates to the dictates of AIPAC and other foreign agent tools of the Israel regime.

Like the Inquisition Catholic Church of the Renaissance, it is sometimes necessary to oppose a religion when it has been hijacked by zealots who cause death and injury to opponents and when that religion has become an ideology of hate and greed.
US Judaism as a whole is riddled with bigotry and ultra-nationalist loyalty to a foreign nation. These particular Jews expect the US govt to send US kids to die on behalf of Israel and for the US if necessary to fight a nuclear world war to preserve the hegemony of the aggressor "state" of Israel.

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» So what? Posted by: justaguy
No more
Posted by: JoshuaLudd on Jul 6, 2007 3:36 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
No more support for murderous war criminals.

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Exactly
Posted by: opeluboy on Jul 6, 2007 3:50 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I can't add anything to Hedges concise evaluation of this deadly symbiosis. I do, however, remain amazed that he was ever the Mid East Bureau Chief for the NYT but can be certain that this article would not be published there today.

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A must read:
Posted by: WhuThe?!? on Jul 6, 2007 4:23 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This was sent to me by 'DCBeltway' a must read about the pro-war power of AIPAC and Kucinich's honesty about truth.

We must ALL rally behind Kucinich as hopeless as it seems he is the only honest one of the bunch that hasn't sold his soul!

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» Oh yeah, the link: Posted by: WhuThe?!?
» RE: A must read: Posted by: humanity101
Read Heschel and Douglas Rushkoff- Religion verses Materialism and Land
Posted by: drricklippin on Jul 6, 2007 4:56 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Read Heschel (many books) and Douglas Rushkoff's (Nothing Sacred) for a deeper understanding of Judaism verses Zionism

We need to separate the great religious traditions from land.

Also these great traditions transcend land and the excesses (or as Chopra says "superstition") of materialism.

Dr. Rick Lippin
Southampton, Pa

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Why do the Jews need a country/
Posted by: ModerateLiberal on Jul 6, 2007 6:08 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
After the Holocaust, it is clear why Jews need a country. Antisemitic incidents still happen all over the world. Google, feels it must apologize for what you find (the hate websites) when you Google on the word Jew. Jews have lived in the land of Israel continuously for over 2,000 years. That is the place where they had been living until the Romans kicked many of them out, until the Arabs kicked most of the post-Romans out. Jews have been there continuously. But, historical arguments are pointless. Israel is there now. They have not committed a Holocaust like many accuse them of, if they had there would be no Palestinians living in Gaza or the West Bank. Israel may take many things too far, but their opposition will settle for nothing less than their expulsion or death.

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Give Israel credit. They know how to run America.
Posted by: humanity101 on Jul 6, 2007 8:00 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It reminds me of an episode on the Discovery Channel where a little wasp has just stung a huge cockroach but did not give a full treatment to kill it. It injected just the right amount to keep the roach dazed enough to drag it by its antennae. So this huge cockroach was fetched home and the wasp immediately laid several eggs in its neck. The roach dies slowly enough just in time for the eggs to hatch and the young wasps to feed on its carcass. That pretty much sums up the story. Israel has injected the US with this potent shot and the big roach is dazed and numb. This potent shot is AIPAC. No one in the Congress dares to fall out of line. It is apparently political suicide to criticize Israel, period. The venom is so potent and wide-spread even the two professors at Havard and Chicago couldn't get their work published in the US. The had to take it to Europe. It turned out they did the right thing. If they had it published here, Alan Dershowitz and his one hundred strong team of lawyers could have got their tenures revoked or denied. Now with Rubert Murdock buying out all the major media outlets, the damage will be irreversible. The cockroach is nearing its end. There is no stronger evidence than the fact that no one, no one has challenged Joe Liberman's lies recently on ABC News (and yes they keep giving him the platform) that if we don't fight them over there, they will follow us home and that Iran must be bombed. Barack Obama probably accidently blabbered "nobody suffers more than the Palestinians" and was hit repeatedly by Brian Williams for his stance on Israel in a presidential debate on NBC. Imagine if he'd said something more overtly critical of Israel, not even his almighty God can save him. The wasp is actually an octopus with its limbs in every nook and cranny in America. I told you, the roach is stunned. It is deafeningly silent. No one dares to speak. Israel rules!

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Anti-Semitism - no more, no less
Posted by: ebs1953 on Jul 6, 2007 8:37 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
While I respect Mr. Hedges right to his opinion, his views are flat out anti-Semitism. To make Israel the scapegoat for Bush's fiasco in Iraq is in line with what anti-Semites have done for nearly 2,000 years; blame the Jews when things go bad. As an American Jew, I strongly resent it.

Even though they were dispersed throughout the world, Jews lived continually in what today constitutes Israel. Initially Israel comprised a tiny part of the Palestine Mandate, the area set aside after World War I as a future homeland for Jews. But this wasn't good enough for the Arabs. When Israel declared its independence in 1948, armies from five Arab nations invaded vowing to drive the Jews "into the sea."

This precipitated the refugee crisis since most of the the Arabs who fled the new Jewish state never were resettled. Meanwhile, Israel absorbed hundreds of thousands of Jewish refugees from Iraq, Syria, Egypt and other Arab states.

Despite its obstacles, the Israelis built a modern, democratic nation while their Arab neighbors remained in squalor despite their oil wealth. Generous American aid helped achieve that, but that aid is in keeping with our democratic values. Israel is the region's only democracy and was a hedge against Sovet influence in the region during the Cold War.

Much of the blame for today problems between Israel and the Palestinians must be assigned to Yassir Arafat, the corrupt Palestinian leader who turned away from a permanent agreement with Israel in the final days of the Clinton administration and looked the other way as Palestinian terrorists wreaked havoc on the Israeli populace during the Infitada. Also, a critical eye must be turned toward President Bush, who disengaged from Palestinian-Israeli negotiations.

Sadly, the Palestinians became a serious threat to Israeli security, which lead to erection of the much-hated wall around the West Bank. But, we Jews who have survived the Inquistion in Spain, pogroms in Russia and the Holocaust in Europe - have vowed "never again." We have a right to defend ourselves, and that is what Israel did. Any other nation would do the same.

As for the U.S. going to war with Iraq for Israel's sake, I ain't buying. Yes, Saddam talked tought against Israel to maintain his "cred" with the "Arab street," but Israel's Mossad probably had a better handle on conditions in Iraq under Hussein that our CIA did. And, push comes to shove, Israel probably could have easily defeated Saddam's weakened military. If anything, Iran's new militancy and its support for Hezbollah and Syria has put Israel in a more precarious position than before 2003.

We can criticize Israel's actions and the Bush administration's stewardship of our relationship with that nation, but Israel's legitimacy and sovereignty as a nation are beyond question. United States support for and aid to Israel is legitimate and consistent with the foreign policies of 10 previous Presidents.

To favor Israel's elimination - by force or by other means - is tantamount to anti-Semitism. As Jews we are taught he who saves one life it is as if he has saved the entire world. Conversely, he who would kill one of us kills all of us.

It is not surprising that many progressives harbor sympathies toward the Palestinians and other Arabs who suffer because of violence and poverty in their midst. By our nature, we tend to side with the underdog. However, do not forgot that nearly 60 years after Israel declared its independence many Arabs remain sworn to its destruction. Even if Israel's enemies were to prevail, this would do nothing to improve the lives of Arabs suffering in Gaza and Iraq. Lets not drive a wedge among progressives by falsely tying the conflict between Israel and the Palestinians with America's debacle in Iraq.

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» What? Posted by: justaguy
» Strawman. Posted by: justaguy
Israel Has Nuclear Weapons – This Should be Cause for Consternation for Everyone
Posted by: freethink7 on Jul 6, 2007 9:36 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
in U.S. and entire planet. They (Israel) did not achieve all their objectives in 9/11 (yes, they were involved in 9/11 + blamed the Arabs). Israel realizes that they will need something much bigger than 9/11 tragedy to achieve their nefarious and otherwise vile objectives……hegemony and dominance over entire Middle East and U.S. Israel wants total control over the world’s oil + gas supplies.

Please, no “you’re anti jewish, anti-semitic” comments, nothing could be further from the truth. Israel is engaging in criminal behavior, therefore I am anti-criminal behavior. This is an important distinction to make…..a distinction that will save our planet from total extinction and obliteration.

ChrisBollyn
judicial-inc.biz
iamthewitness.com

I post this comment because as idealistic as it seems, I want to make the world a better place

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The US, a State of Israel?
Posted by: phindrup on Jul 7, 2007 8:00 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There is no question that without the support of the US Israel would not exist. Without Israel, one of the worst ever human rights abuses would not have occurred, nor continue to occur, and one of the most brutal regimes ever, would not exist.
If all support for Israel was withdrawn, Israel would be forced to negotiate for its existence in a meaningful manner. This could be the beginning of a state of normalcy in the Middle East.

This is the only article I have seen that refers to the susceptibility of the US to an assault on its financial base. I used to trade Futures, and I have been certain for some time that the US is being setup for an attack on its financial stability.
The pieces are already in place, and the integrity of the US $ could be utterly destroyed in anything ranging from days to weeks. In fact if it were engineered by middle eastern oil producing countries they would make money in the process.
A bankrupt US is of no financial value to anybody, so everybody hosting a US base for the financial benefits would, I believe order the bases out.
The US at the present time bestrides the world, dripping with the symbols of wealth whereas in fact they are no different from the mug lair who wears fancy clothes, gold chains, drives a flashy, hire-purchase car, whose credit cards are all overdrawn and who is dodging the debt collectors.
Those who believe that the US is ‘invincible’ do not understand just how vulnerable America is.

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» You're an idiot. Posted by: justaguy
the fairness fella
Posted by: the fairness fella on Jul 8, 2007 5:51 AM   
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I have a modest proposal to extricate the US from this horrible war. The solution is to have Israeli soldiers replace Americans.

After all, the war was started for Israel by Zionist neocons controlling the White house and cooking the intelligence books, so its only fair that the country for which they fronted do its share of the fighting and pacifying.

Wars are resolved when the proxies step away and the true animosities confront.

Why should America wear all the hate and the loss of global prestige when these outcomes properly belong to Israel first?

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ATTENTION.. Nearly everyone posting on this thread will find this to be of interest....
Posted by: ekipnrut on Jul 8, 2007 3:44 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
[Intro to interview broadcast on Democracy Now on 7/6/07,
go to the DN website for the entire program and transcript..
it is without a doubt one of the singularly most timely and instructive DN broadcasts..bar none]
Founder of Iraq Oil Workers Union Rejects U.S.-Backed Oil Law as "Robbery"
As the Iraqi cabinet approves part of a controversial oil law, we speak with Faleh Abood Umara, the general secretary of the Federation of Oil Unions and a founding member of the oil workers union in Iraq. He calls on Iraqi lawmakers to reject the legislation. We also speak with Hashmeya Muhsin Hussein, president of the Electrical Utility Workers Union and the first woman to head a national union in Iraq. [includes rush transcript] In Iraq, opposition is growing among some Sunni, Shia and Kurdish factions to a controversial oil law backed by Washington. Draft legislation on the distribution of oil wealth in Iraq was approved by the Iraqi cabinet on Tuesday and could go to parliament for review as early as next week.

Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki called the bill "the "most important law in Iraq," and U.S. lawmakers have demanded Iraq advance the measure before Congress approves additional war funding. But critics say the law would leave Iraq's oil open to foreign takeover. A parliamentary boycott by Sunni and Shia factions is expected to slow the bill's passage.

In addition, six Nobel Peace Prize Laureates have released a statement in opposition to the legislation. The laureates include Betty Williams, Mairead Corrigan Maguire, Rigoberta Menchu, Jody Williams, Shirin Ebadi and Wangari Maathai. The statement read, in part, "The Iraq Oil Law could benefit foreign oil companies at the expense of the Iraqi people, deny the Iraqi people economic security, create greater instability, and move the country further away from peace."
Last month, the Iraqi oil workers union went on a strike to protest the law. Two leading union members recently traveled to the United States to meet with members of Congress and attend last week's U.S. Social Forum in Atlanta.
Hashmeya Muhsin Hussein is the president of the Electrical Utility Workers Union, she is the first woman to head a national union in Iraq. Faleh Abood Umara is the general secretary of the Federation of Oil Unions and a founding member of the oil workers union in Iraq. In 1998, he was detained by the Saddam Hussein regime for his activities on behalf of his coworkers. They recently joined us in our firehouse studio. I began by asking Faleh Abood Umara to describe the current situation for oil workers in Iraq and why he is protesting the proposed oil law.
* Faleh Abood Umara, general secretary of the Federation of Oil Unions.
* Hashmeya Muhsin Hussein, president of the Electrical Utility Workers Union in Iraq.
...Both were absolutely dynamic and compelling in their comments..an ABSOLUTE MUST if you are involved in the ME debate...
[We now return to our regularly scheduled threadcast :
Yellow vs Planet Earth]... :O)

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Deaf ears??...SHOUT and HOWL all the more....Use the NYT...
Posted by: ekipnrut on Jul 8, 2007 7:03 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
...for whatever it's worth,,,,,


CONSORTNYT

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Ekipnrut, you clearly haven't listened to what I've said. Now you've posted the truth as I see it.
Posted by: yellow on Jul 8, 2007 10:27 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Your post on the Democracy Now Website about the oil law is exactly everthing I've been talking about for the last five years. That this is a war about US corporations and Iraqi oil is obvious. That the progressive forces in Iraq, the trade union movement and those with secular democratic beliefs and agenda are the real enemies of US Imperialism, not fundamentalist muslim clerics who get the bulk of US material and logistical support is clear. A fear of democracy not terrorism is what drove the Iraq War policy. And finally, long term oil contracts and "production sharing agreements" were designed to boost corporate profits, not lead to higher world production levels and lower gasoline prices for global consumers.

I finally agree with my friend Ekipnrut. He has now hit the nail dead on the head!!

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Yellow Oil
Posted by: maxloen on Jul 8, 2007 11:39 PM   
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Sure, the energy companies get a substantial benefit from this war, as it befits when someone like Cheney, with his roll in their industry, is handling the clown, but... to limit it to that, as if it is the only motive, it's actually nothing more than an push for manipulation pure and simple, no matter how much you set aside your habitual bullying with insults and putdowns as a way for intimidation.

When no Neocon was hands-on involved in oil exploration, exploitation, processing, distribuition, or commercialization, why is it that this very involved group of Zionists wouldn't have a say in what really interests them, especially when this is not something that came into being just in the year 2000, but it's the culmination of the long drawn policy of assuring that the U.S. will do the bidding for Israel so it won't have to send their few and precious conscripted soldiers to die. In the U.S. the soldiers and reservists are *volunteering* their lives so that -regardless of their patriotism- they can get an education, a house for their family, or even just a 'green card.' Nearly all of them are non-jew.

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» Sticking to the non-controversial.... Posted by: stevewilkesuk
» RE: Yellow Oil Posted by: stevewilkesuk
Egregious Padding of the Facts
Posted by: IPF on Jul 9, 2007 3:59 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Of course the writer finds it eminently convenient to distort the facts.

To wit - the only reason why Egypt nearly defeated Israel in 1973 was that Nixon & Kissinger convinced the Israelis that Egypt, Jordan and Syria would not attack. Therefore, Israel was not on high alert as recommended by its intelligence service and several high ranking generals of its leadership.

Also, it should be pointed out the recent events - primarily Israels agreement to release 240 Palestinian terrorists from prison, as well as its support for Abbas AND the Arab legion's historical first visit to Israel - basically nullify the whole premise of the article - that Israel will spark the powder keg of the Middle East.

Israel has a deep commitment to peace and always has demonstrated this - as peace with Egypt and Jordan has shown. At the same time, many anti-semites advocate for Israel's destruction both abroad and here, as this article clearly shows.

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» Well, 1 out of 3 isn't bad. Posted by: stevewilkesuk
» Complete bullsh*t. Posted by: justaguy
» RE: Complete bullsh*t. Posted by: IPF
» Impressive Posted by: stevewilkesuk
» Impressive Indeed Posted by: IPF
» La la la la la Posted by: stevewilkesuk
The shame of Ertas.
Posted by: justaguy on Jul 10, 2007 1:14 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=cjwI26-zV74

And this is with a camera on them.

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» That didn't really happen. Posted by: stevewilkesuk
» Oh bollocks! Posted by: moflard
» The 'Israel is Perfect' Fantasy Posted by: stevewilkesuk
» You're HILARIOUS Posted by: stevewilkesuk
Conspiricy mongering is easier than critical thought. Some people just aren't that smart.
Posted by: yellow on Jul 11, 2007 12:22 PM   
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Why rack your brains trying to understand the complexity of the world and its history when it just so much easier to blame...Da Jooooz?

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Deadly Embrace Ever Since? Not
Posted by: IPF on Jul 11, 2007 4:21 PM   
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The US under the Eisenhower administration was actually quite careful NOT to take sides - oil was important to the US too - so weapons sales to Israel did not start until the Yom Kippur war really. And this can be misconstrued as this author has, but in reality, there was a responsibility factor there.

Israel knew there was something going on on its borders, but the Nixon Administration overrode the IDF and Intelligence so as to allow the Arabs to get an upper hand, Golda going along with their assessment. On retrospect this may have been the quickest way to a pace treaty, but the cost was enourmous in terms of human life, both to Israel and Egypt, and definitely to the US for weapons.

Nor does this change the fact that it was a political manipulation. Hence Israel's partial mistrust for some time of the US, and independent attitude.

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Zionism and Nazism
Posted by: bernarda on Jul 12, 2007 7:09 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I have asked elsewhere for someone to tell me the difference. No on has so far.

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