COMMENTS: 78
On the Catwalk, How Thin is Too Thin?
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The Sept. 13 decision from the Madrid regional government to enforce a ban on underweight models for Madrid Fashion Week catwalks has sent shock waves through the global fashion industry and set off a chorus of calls to expand the ban and formulate a new industry standard. The government's decision is intended to promote a healthier body image.
The unprecedented move marked the first time organizers of a major fashion show imposed weight limits in line with World Health Organization guidelines for healthy height-to-weight ratios used to calculate a person's body mass index, which estimates the portion of fat in the body.
Over 30 percent of the models who appeared in Madrid shows last year were disqualified under the new guidelines that will likely prevent the participation of top models such as Brazil's Fabiana, Spain's Esther Canadas, Britain's Kate Moss and Estonia native Carmen Kass.
"This is a great call to global action," says Lynn Grefe, chief executive officer of the Seattle-based National Eating Disorders Association.
"We worked hard to restrict advertising for alcohol and tobacco because of the potential dangers to our young people, and fashion is now the only major industry without health guidelines," Grefe said. "It is high time we ask for some responsibility from within the industry for the impact fashion has on potentially life-threatening eating disorders."
International Reaction
Reaction from the international fashion industry was varied, but many governments seem prepared to pick up Spain's cue, as the enforcement decision spread through news outlets around the world.
British Culture Minister Tessa Jowell publicly applauded the move to comply by the organizers of Pasarela Cibeles, Spain's premiere fashion event, while Letizia Moratti, the mayor of Milan, Italy, threatened a similar ban on too-thin models if the city could not negotiate voluntary terms with fashion designers and agencies.
India's Health Minister Anbumani Ramadoss said his country is also concerned with stick-thin models and their admirers, and hoped Madrid's move "makes young girls focus more on being healthy and lean rather than starving and skinny."
Edinburgh, Scotland, announced it would follow Madrid's lead, banning any model with a BMI of less than 18. A BMI of 18.5 or below is considered underweight by the World Health Organization, anything 25 or over is considered overweight. The average BMI for top models is 16.3, according to data from the National Eating Disorders Association. Top U.S. designer Michael Kors also jumped into the fray.
"Thin is fine but it has to be healthy," Kors said at a press conference last week. "When I see a model come in and I can tell this is not naturally how they're supposed to look, we won't book them."
Other Shows Stick to Status Quo
Madrid is considered a major player on the European fashion scene and is no stranger to controversial shows. But the city lacks the clout of fashion capitals like Paris, London and New York, where the topic has been hotly debated in the last two weeks. All three cities went ahead with plans for their fashion weeks without imposing any weight restrictions.
While some within the fashion world chafed at the industry being made a scapegoat for contributing to a rise in eating disorders, New York-based DNA Models' Chief Executive David Bonnouvrier said during New York's fashion week that the industry standard should focus on "beauty and luxury, not famished-looking people that look pale and sick."
Cathy Gould, North America director for New York agency Elite, told journalists the ban was "outrageous and discriminatory" to naturally super-slim models and designers though she appreciated the sentiment behind the move.
For decades health care professionals and eating disorder specialists have expressed concern over changes in the fashion, media and entertainment industries and their contribution to triggering eating disorders.
In 1965, models weighed an average of 8 percent less than the typical woman in the United States; the average model now weighs 23 percent less than the average woman, according to the National Eating Disorders Association.
"No one is saying fashion causes all eating disorders, but the industry does set the standard young girls are holding up as an ideal, and that can have a real effect on those who are vulnerable to eating disorders," says Grefe.
Eating Disorders Have Doubled
In the United States the number of eating disorder sufferers has more than doubled since the 1960s, according to the Washington-based American Academy of Child and Adolescent Psychiatry, with an estimated 10 million girls and women and 1 million men affected by anorexia nervosa, bulimia nervosa, binge-eating and other eating disorders.
Anorexia is a mental illness that progressively damages the body, is fatal to between 15 to 20 percent of sufferers, and causes more deaths among females aged 15 to 24 than all other causes combined. Forty-seven percent of U.S. females in fifth through 12th grade say they want to lose weight because of magazine pictures and 60 percent say magazines influence their ideas of desirable body types, according to the Philadelphia-based Renfrew Center Foundation.
"The worst part is that the images being portrayed in popular culture are completely unrealistic, airbrushed, manipulated . . . while putting a lot of pressure on young people to look a certain way," says Grefe. "Simply put, this is dangerous."
Eating disorders drive many sufferers into isolation, overcome by feelings of deficiency in the single-minded obsessive pursuit of perfection. To allay the ensuing loneliness, many young people turn to the Internet where scores of Web sites are devoted to their friends "Ana," "Bella" and "Mia," cyberspace nicknames for anorexia and bulimia. While anorexia proponents cite the Web pages and communities they spawn as places to draw strength, health care advocates have spent the last decade condemning them.
Scouring through magazines, clothing catalogs, newspapers, television and the movies, some eating-disordered women seize upon super-skinny celebrities for "thinspiration," a term used on pro-anorexia Web sites to describe admiration for their role models.
Supporters post pictures of their thinspiration favorites on Internet sites and community discussion boards. Popular thinspiration celebrities include movie star Keira Knightley, tennis star Anna Kournikova, and models Kate Moss and Oksana Pautova. Even those like Mary-Kate Olsen and Victoria "Posh Spice" Beckham, who have publicly admitted to their battles with eating disorders, are held up as templates for success.
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Posted by: browngoddess on Sep 28, 2006 1:20 AM
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» It's not necessarily all on the models
Posted by: kc4choice
» RE: i don't understand
Posted by: mizkaye
» RE: i don't understand
Posted by: vangogh69
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Posted by: rsaxto on Sep 28, 2006 1:47 AM
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» RE: decent
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» RE: decent
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» $1,000 for each pound under the government standard!!!
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» RE: $1,000 for each pound under the government standard!!!
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» R E A D I N G Comprehension.. it's so important!
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» RE: $1,000 for each pound under the government standard!!!
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» RE: $1,000 for each pound under the government standard!!!
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» RE: decent
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» RE: decent
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Posted by: ShoShenQ on Sep 28, 2006 2:03 AM
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Imho its because most of the fashion makers are old homosexuals who prefer the women to look like the gorgeous young guys they crave, or like very young women at the very least.
I mean heterosexual men prefer more or less curvy women, for the majority of us anyway, so this is my 0.02 $, although i could care less.
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» The fashion industry should be run by construction workers.
Posted by: kepstein7777
» RE: ver asked youself why do they like them so slim ?
Posted by: mazel
» Spot on
Posted by: ezilla
» RE: Spot on
Posted by: jmoore
» You are so right Mazel
Posted by: leftisright
» RE: ver asked youself why do they like them so slim ?
Posted by: Paul D
» RE: ver asked youself why do they like them so slim ?
Posted by: Shame-us
» Burp
Posted by: Shame-us
» Common ground
Posted by: Conservasaurus
» RE: ver asked youself why do they like them so slim ?
Posted by: yellow
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Posted by: ISlamIslam on Sep 28, 2006 3:08 AM
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» RE: Paternalism
Posted by: MartianBachelor
» RE: Paternalism
Posted by: Moosehead
» RE: Paternalism--"[W]here are the bans on football players bulking up . . .?"
Posted by: aida1200
» RE: Paternalism
Posted by: Gravitas
» good points
Posted by: Conservasaurus
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Posted by: talkville on Sep 28, 2006 3:25 AM
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Posted by: kepstein7777 on Sep 28, 2006 3:56 AM
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I guess they make money somehow, which is the bottom line.
They can ban all they want in Europe. They'll just move the industry to 3rd-world countries like they did with manufacturing and tech.
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Posted by: isdnelson on Sep 28, 2006 4:21 AM
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Posted by: cold2touch on Sep 28, 2006 5:57 AM
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Posted by: jpinder on Sep 28, 2006 6:37 AM
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» RE: This is a repressive idea
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» RE: This is a repressive idea
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» RE: This is a repressive idea
Posted by: kismyash
» RE: This is a repressive idea
Posted by: talkville
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Posted by: NoPCZone on Sep 28, 2006 7:02 AM
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2 A lot of the models I see in print ads look like they need 2 things: a good meal and a shower.
BTW-Those that have tattoos should go to a dermatologist and have them removed. Who decided that beautiful women need to get inked like truck drivers, sailors and bikers?
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» RE: 2 Thoughts - 1 useless afterthought
Posted by: ezilla
» RE: 2 Thoughts - 1 useless afterthought
Posted by: NoPCZone
» RE: 2 Thoughts - 1 useless afterthought
Posted by: ezilla
» RE: 2 Thoughts - 1 useless afterthought
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Posted by: Sparks on Sep 28, 2006 7:06 AM
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» RE: Sparks
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Posted by: karyse on Sep 28, 2006 8:13 AM
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The claims of fact (in argumentation, claims that can be proven true or false) presented in the article that caused me to think "holy shit" were:
1. Anorexia is a mental illness that ... causes more deaths among females aged 15 to 24 than all other causes combined.
If this is true (though with the journalist tendency to just make up statistics whole cloth, I would have to confirm them before believing it), it is a major problem. Holy shit, does anyone understand "ALL OTHER CAUSES COMBINED"?
2. ... an estimated 10 million girls and women and 1 million men affected by anorexia nervosa, bulimia nervosa, binge-eating and other eating disorders.
Holy shit. Men too.
And one of the posters actually made up his/her own "fact" that being thin increases lifespan. Absolutely no science behind this "statistic." In fact, quite the opposite is true. Being slightly "overweight" has been shown time and time again to be healthier. Do you think that the weight loss industry, which is worth billions of dollars each year, is going to tell you that?
3. In 1965, models weighed an average of 8 percent less than the typical woman in the United States; the average model now weighs 23 percent less than the average woman, according to the National Eating Disorders Association.
Holy shit, "23 percent less" -- there is someting seriously wrong with the fashion industry, and the first designer to seriously design for "normal" wieght women, will make a fortune.
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» RE: dying to be thin
Posted by: MartianBachelor
» RE: dying to be thin
Posted by: NoPCZone
» Lots of designers for "normal" weight women
Posted by: demidesigrrl
» RE: Lots of designers for "normal" weight women
Posted by: Burton
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Posted by: alicelillie on Sep 28, 2006 8:42 AM
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What about the freedom to decide what and how much to eat and what not to eat, or *whether* to eat?
Can't the government just leave people alone? They have no more right to regulate the modeling industry than they have to spy on us or force "democracy" on Iraq.
Another thing. I am 5' 9" and weigh 156. Pretty normal. But as a 20 year old I weighed in at 120. As a teen, even thinner. I ate like a pig but never started gaining weight until I was 30. I do love to eat so it was a blessing. Now I have to curb my appetite which, fortunately, has diminished with age.
But the point is, in my case at least this was natural. What would have happened if there had been government standards about this then? How would I have fared in school? Would I have been barred from precious sport activities? Being of athletic build and a very high energy level it would have ruined my youth. And, would I have been forced to take medications?
No. I would have run.
Even if this is not natural in a particular woman, she has the right to decide what to do. And a modeling agency has the right to decide whether to hire her or discriminate against her.
Also, where are your pro-choicers? Does she not have the right to control her own body?
I know these models are ridiculously unlike us ordinary mortals in their dimensions. We all know that. I don't know about you, but I pay no attention to what is on the runways. I pay attention to what I see in the fitting room mirror.
Be independent!
http://www.alicelillieandher.blogspot.com
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» RE: WHEN ARE THEY GOING TO STOP PROTECTING US AND LET US ALONE???
Posted by: LeslieGem
» RE: WHEN ARE THEY GOING TO STOP PROTECTING US AND LET US ALONE???
Posted by: mazel
» RE: WHEN ARE THEY GOING TO STOP PROTECTING US AND LET US ALONE???
Posted by: talkville
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Posted by: yank in london on Sep 28, 2006 8:44 AM
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Posted by: meander on Sep 28, 2006 11:20 AM
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Posted by: aussidawg on Sep 28, 2006 11:25 AM
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Posted by: Gravitas on Sep 28, 2006 11:41 AM
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I am also sick of the new religion of "healthism." Are they next going to ban plus sized models based on all those antifat scare studies (mostly sponsored by the diet/pharmaecutical industry to increase profits)? I think subjecting art to health standards is as perverse as censorship due to religious reasons. Will it get to the point only models with the latest junk science approved BMI be allowed!
On the other hand, eating disorders are rampant. Women and girls are killing themselves to achieve unrealistic standards. And it is not just anorexia and bulemia. Most people don't realize that the diet/binge phenomena which contributes to weight gain is also a result of weight obsession.
I think they should look at each model individually. Certainly practices like drug use and bulemia should be outlawed. No model should have to go through that. But if she is naturally thin, she should not be discriminated against either!
"Weight obsession is a social disease. If we cared more about CO2 than BMI there would still be time."
and
"If you don't like the size of my rear kindly kiss my cellulite!"
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» RE: Mixed Feelings!
Posted by: Gravitas
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Posted by: mviscid on Sep 28, 2006 12:02 PM
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But here in my reality-bubble of plenty, yes, I think this progress. The fashion industry set standards. It's like the one case I can point to where trickle-down actually happens. Not that ripped-gauze & safety-pin shirts stock Target shelves but there is some continuity between runway trends and stores for us regular people. (Me, I don't have much money but try to always buy from second-hand shops or homegrown designers like Mode Merr and Lilli Jean when I can, usually after my tax refund!)
It's my understanding that fashion photography trends spread to television, movies, and other visual media. If someone's buying Vanity Fair, Cosmo et al., it seems to me their self-esteem may already be vulnerable. It's preying on the weak! If measures like the one in Madrid aren't taken, where will the push for change come from? How long did the skinny/low-rise jean thing last before companies relented, despite repeated pleas from women? 10 years?
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» I'll sign the petition to ban low-rise jeans...
Posted by: ezilla
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Posted by: janefleming on Sep 28, 2006 12:56 PM
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In my work in the eating disorder field at the Renfrew Center and at an eating disorder lobby group called the Eating Disorders Coalition, I met lots of ex-models—every single one of them was in recovery and every single one of them had long term health complications because of it.
There is no reason not to have a minimum weight for models in order to work. Now, I don’t want them to do public weigh-ins, since that will spawn unnecessary competition among the women and men—but we should always keep employees healthy—even in the fashion industry, even with models.
There is a great documentary that has been featured at Sundance and other indie festivals and will air on HBO on Nov. 14th- its called THIN and when you watch it you will see just how life threatening and complicated eating disorders are and how hard it is to fully recover.
And in the political world, we continue to ignore eating disorders, they get cut out of the few mental health bills that are put on the Congressional floor—until recently where Clinton and Kennedy have been making sure they are included in mental health parity bills and prevention bills (as did Wellstone before he passed away).
While nothing has passed because of a Republican led Congress—I have hope that things are turning around, especially if the fashion industry is even having the dialogue about how serious and life threatening eating disorders are to women and men.
-jane fleming
Eating Politics Blog
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Posted by: JCR on Sep 28, 2006 3:50 PM
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Yes big brother is now at work in virtually every aspect of our lives. As another poster mentioned earlier, we'll soon be barring overweight folks from the public spotlight as well. After all, which ailment kills more people - anorexia or heart disease and/or diabetes? While were at it let's just start regulating everyone and everything that promotes an unhealthy lifestyle. I know I'll sleep better tonight knowing that Kate Moss may think twice before skipping that piece of cheese cake . . .
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Posted by: jmooney on Sep 28, 2006 4:37 PM
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The man most responsible for our modern, massive U. S. federal government, Abraham Lincoln, once said: "You can fool some of the people some of the time and all of the people some of the time, but you can't fool all of the people all of the time." To that I'd add, "Government can protect some of the people some of the time, but it can't protect all of the people all of the time."
I say, "Let 'em NOT eat cake!"
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» RE: Jay M.
Posted by: Burton
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Posted by: cinattra on Sep 29, 2006 3:17 PM
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Weighing models before they do go out and do the catwalk is just stupid.
There are some sports that encourage behavior that can be just as wreckless if not more so than being skinny. Wrestling, boxing or any sport that requires the athelete to "cut-weight".
If you're not familiar with cutting weight it is when an athelete about a couple of weeks (sometimes just days) before his sporting event drastically tries to lose weight so when he weighs in he will weigh less than his normal weight. Weigh ins or typically the day before the event so that participants have time to recover from the extreme weight loss.
Government is supposed to grease the wheels of commerce not hinder. The industry should self-regulate if anything. The last thing need is a law written by a group of men that will regulate what women can do with their bodies.
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Posted by: eastcoker on Sep 29, 2006 7:34 PM
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» RE: Bravo the Inqusition!
Posted by: Burton
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Posted by: Whistler on Sep 30, 2006 12:09 AM
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All this "concern" over the physical hazzards of being a model is bogus. The rationale is that when it gets to the extreme of anorexia, its unhealthy. Fine, except that most models are not anorexic. The hypocrisy is that I can think right off the top of my head at least 20 other professions (just for starters) that are a whole lot more dangerous than eating too little. When was the last time anyone was so "concerned" about the world's top high jumpers, most of whom have purposely waifed themselves - male and female? What about the soldiers Spain sent to Iraq purely for sport. Then there is the obesity epidemic which is actually on the rise. Fat people, on average, suffer a whole more ill health than their skinny counterparts. Fat folks are even less secure because they cannot do much running when shit hits the fan. Remember the Lebanon scenes of July? Who do you think were the slowest to haul ass - not counting the infirm, the elderly and the infants? Take one guess.
Should they ban all the martial arts? Hardly a single participant goes through a career without serious brain damage.
American football? After their careers, they're all limping.
So why all this focus on super thin models. Believe it or not if you watch most of the runways, the anorexic ones are in the minority. Anorexia is a sickness no worse than all the other life-threatening sicknesses. One thing I do know for sure, after modeling, most models live healthy normal lives - free of chronic conditions caused as a direct result of being skinny for a few years. The same cannot be said about all the other dangerous professions.
The real attack is - as usual - against pretty and glamorous women. The focus on the waif is just used as a piss-poor excuse. So many folks always seem to be soooo "concerned" about the mental and physical health of the pretty woman. They wonder out loud if she has anything "upstairs." However, no one ever seems to be "concerned" about the women who are short or ugly or fat. When was the last time anyone was so "concerned" about their health as a result of their lifestyle or whether they had something "upstairs?" Truth be told, nobody seems to give a damn. So the yardstick for measuring pretty women is not the same as the one measuring all people - male and female.
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» RE: Bullsh!t is R!ght
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» RE: Bullsh!t
Posted by: Aussie Kim
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Posted by: Aussie Kim on Oct 1, 2006 9:16 PM
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That should help too, although there's almost no way to enforce any of this...
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» RE: Ban women's magazines and...
Posted by: Aussie Kim
» And they wonder why we call them femi-nazis
Posted by: Burton
» RE: And they wonder why we call them femi-nazis
Posted by: Aussie Kim
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Posted by: browngoddess on Sep 28, 2006 1:20 AM
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» It's not necessarily all on the models
Posted by: kc4choice
» RE: i don't understand
Posted by: mizkaye
» RE: i don't understand
Posted by: vangogh69
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Posted by: rsaxto on Sep 28, 2006 1:47 AM
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» RE: decent
Posted by: MartianBachelor
» RE: decent
Posted by: rsaxto
» $1,000 for each pound under the government standard!!!
Posted by: Conservasaurus
» RE: $1,000 for each pound under the government standard!!!
Posted by: yellow
» R E A D I N G Comprehension.. it's so important!
Posted by: Conservasaurus
» RE: $1,000 for each pound under the government standard!!!
Posted by: rsaxto
» RE: $1,000 for each pound under the government standard!!!
Posted by: Conservasaurus
» RE: decent
Posted by: edith
» RE: decent
Posted by: rsaxto
» RE: decent
Posted by: yellow
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Posted by: ShoShenQ on Sep 28, 2006 2:03 AM
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Imho its because most of the fashion makers are old homosexuals who prefer the women to look like the gorgeous young guys they crave, or like very young women at the very least.
I mean heterosexual men prefer more or less curvy women, for the majority of us anyway, so this is my 0.02 $, although i could care less.
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» The fashion industry should be run by construction workers.
Posted by: kepstein7777
» RE: ver asked youself why do they like them so slim ?
Posted by: mazel
» Spot on
Posted by: ezilla
» RE: Spot on
Posted by: jmoore
» You are so right Mazel
Posted by: leftisright
» RE: ver asked youself why do they like them so slim ?
Posted by: Paul D
» RE: ver asked youself why do they like them so slim ?
Posted by: Shame-us
» Burp
Posted by: Shame-us
» Common ground
Posted by: Conservasaurus
» RE: ver asked youself why do they like them so slim ?
Posted by: yellow
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Posted by: ISlamIslam on Sep 28, 2006 3:08 AM
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» RE: Paternalism
Posted by: MartianBachelor
» RE: Paternalism
Posted by: Moosehead
» RE: Paternalism--"[W]here are the bans on football players bulking up . . .?"
Posted by: aida1200
» RE: Paternalism
Posted by: Gravitas
» good points
Posted by: Conservasaurus
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Posted by: talkville on Sep 28, 2006 3:25 AM
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Posted by: kepstein7777 on Sep 28, 2006 3:56 AM
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I guess they make money somehow, which is the bottom line.
They can ban all they want in Europe. They'll just move the industry to 3rd-world countries like they did with manufacturing and tech.
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Posted by: isdnelson on Sep 28, 2006 4:21 AM
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Posted by: cold2touch on Sep 28, 2006 5:57 AM
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Posted by: jpinder on Sep 28, 2006 6:37 AM
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» RE: This is a repressive idea
Posted by: scryberwitch
» RE: This is a repressive idea
Posted by: vangogh69
» RE: This is a repressive idea
Posted by: kismyash
» RE: This is a repressive idea
Posted by: talkville
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Posted by: NoPCZone on Sep 28, 2006 7:02 AM
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2 A lot of the models I see in print ads look like they need 2 things: a good meal and a shower.
BTW-Those that have tattoos should go to a dermatologist and have them removed. Who decided that beautiful women need to get inked like truck drivers, sailors and bikers?
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» RE: 2 Thoughts - 1 useless afterthought
Posted by: ezilla
» RE: 2 Thoughts - 1 useless afterthought
Posted by: NoPCZone
» RE: 2 Thoughts - 1 useless afterthought
Posted by: ezilla
» RE: 2 Thoughts - 1 useless afterthought
Posted by: jmooney
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Posted by: Sparks on Sep 28, 2006 7:06 AM
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» RE: Sparks
Posted by: krystal
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Posted by: karyse on Sep 28, 2006 8:13 AM
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The claims of fact (in argumentation, claims that can be proven true or false) presented in the article that caused me to think "holy shit" were:
1. Anorexia is a mental illness that ... causes more deaths among females aged 15 to 24 than all other causes combined.
If this is true (though with the journalist tendency to just make up statistics whole cloth, I would have to confirm them before believing it), it is a major problem. Holy shit, does anyone understand "ALL OTHER CAUSES COMBINED"?
2. ... an estimated 10 million girls and women and 1 million men affected by anorexia nervosa, bulimia nervosa, binge-eating and other eating disorders.
Holy shit. Men too.
And one of the posters actually made up his/her own "fact" that being thin increases lifespan. Absolutely no science behind this "statistic." In fact, quite the opposite is true. Being slightly "overweight" has been shown time and time again to be healthier. Do you think that the weight loss industry, which is worth billions of dollars each year, is going to tell you that?
3. In 1965, models weighed an average of 8 percent less than the typical woman in the United States; the average model now weighs 23 percent less than the average woman, according to the National Eating Disorders Association.
Holy shit, "23 percent less" -- there is someting seriously wrong with the fashion industry, and the first designer to seriously design for "normal" wieght women, will make a fortune.
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» RE: dying to be thin
Posted by: MartianBachelor
» RE: dying to be thin
Posted by: NoPCZone
» Lots of designers for "normal" weight women
Posted by: demidesigrrl
» RE: Lots of designers for "normal" weight women
Posted by: Burton
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Posted by: alicelillie on Sep 28, 2006 8:42 AM
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What about the freedom to decide what and how much to eat and what not to eat, or *whether* to eat?
Can't the government just leave people alone? They have no more right to regulate the modeling industry than they have to spy on us or force "democracy" on Iraq.
Another thing. I am 5' 9" and weigh 156. Pretty normal. But as a 20 year old I weighed in at 120. As a teen, even thinner. I ate like a pig but never started gaining weight until I was 30. I do love to eat so it was a blessing. Now I have to curb my appetite which, fortunately, has diminished with age.
But the point is, in my case at least this was natural. What would have happened if there had been government standards about this then? How would I have fared in school? Would I have been barred from precious sport activities? Being of athletic build and a very high energy level it would have ruined my youth. And, would I have been forced to take medications?
No. I would have run.
Even if this is not natural in a particular woman, she has the right to decide what to do. And a modeling agency has the right to decide whether to hire her or discriminate against her.
Also, where are your pro-choicers? Does she not have the right to control her own body?
I know these models are ridiculously unlike us ordinary mortals in their dimensions. We all know that. I don't know about you, but I pay no attention to what is on the runways. I pay attention to what I see in the fitting room mirror.
Be independent!
http://www.alicelillieandher.blogspot.com
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» RE: WHEN ARE THEY GOING TO STOP PROTECTING US AND LET US ALONE???
Posted by: LeslieGem
» RE: WHEN ARE THEY GOING TO STOP PROTECTING US AND LET US ALONE???
Posted by: mazel
» RE: WHEN ARE THEY GOING TO STOP PROTECTING US AND LET US ALONE???
Posted by: talkville
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Posted by: yank in london on Sep 28, 2006 8:44 AM
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Posted by: meander on Sep 28, 2006 11:20 AM
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Posted by: aussidawg on Sep 28, 2006 11:25 AM
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Posted by: Gravitas on Sep 28, 2006 11:41 AM
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I am also sick of the new religion of "healthism." Are they next going to ban plus sized models based on all those antifat scare studies (mostly sponsored by the diet/pharmaecutical industry to increase profits)? I think subjecting art to health standards is as perverse as censorship due to religious reasons. Will it get to the point only models with the latest junk science approved BMI be allowed!
On the other hand, eating disorders are rampant. Women and girls are killing themselves to achieve unrealistic standards. And it is not just anorexia and bulemia. Most people don't realize that the diet/binge phenomena which contributes to weight gain is also a result of weight obsession.
I think they should look at each model individually. Certainly practices like drug use and bulemia should be outlawed. No model should have to go through that. But if she is naturally thin, she should not be discriminated against either!
"Weight obsession is a social disease. If we cared more about CO2 than BMI there would still be time."
and
"If you don't like the size of my rear kindly kiss my cellulite!"
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» RE: Mixed Feelings!
Posted by: Gravitas
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Posted by: mviscid on Sep 28, 2006 12:02 PM
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But here in my reality-bubble of plenty, yes, I think this progress. The fashion industry set standards. It's like the one case I can point to where trickle-down actually happens. Not that ripped-gauze & safety-pin shirts stock Target shelves but there is some continuity between runway trends and stores for us regular people. (Me, I don't have much money but try to always buy from second-hand shops or homegrown designers like Mode Merr and Lilli Jean when I can, usually after my tax refund!)
It's my understanding that fashion photography trends spread to television, movies, and other visual media. If someone's buying Vanity Fair, Cosmo et al., it seems to me their self-esteem may already be vulnerable. It's preying on the weak! If measures like the one in Madrid aren't taken, where will the push for change come from? How long did the skinny/low-rise jean thing last before companies relented, despite repeated pleas from women? 10 years?
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» I'll sign the petition to ban low-rise jeans...
Posted by: ezilla
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Posted by: janefleming on Sep 28, 2006 12:56 PM
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In my work in the eating disorder field at the Renfrew Center and at an eating disorder lobby group called the Eating Disorders Coalition, I met lots of ex-models—every single one of them was in recovery and every single one of them had long term health complications because of it.
There is no reason not to have a minimum weight for models in order to work. Now, I don’t want them to do public weigh-ins, since that will spawn unnecessary competition among the women and men—but we should always keep employees healthy—even in the fashion industry, even with models.
There is a great documentary that has been featured at Sundance and other indie festivals and will air on HBO on Nov. 14th- its called THIN and when you watch it you will see just how life threatening and complicated eating disorders are and how hard it is to fully recover.
And in the political world, we continue to ignore eating disorders, they get cut out of the few mental health bills that are put on the Congressional floor—until recently where Clinton and Kennedy have been making sure they are included in mental health parity bills and prevention bills (as did Wellstone before he passed away).
While nothing has passed because of a Republican led Congress—I have hope that things are turning around, especially if the fashion industry is even having the dialogue about how serious and life threatening eating disorders are to women and men.
-jane fleming
Eating Politics Blog
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Posted by: JCR on Sep 28, 2006 3:50 PM
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Yes big brother is now at work in virtually every aspect of our lives. As another poster mentioned earlier, we'll soon be barring overweight folks from the public spotlight as well. After all, which ailment kills more people - anorexia or heart disease and/or diabetes? While were at it let's just start regulating everyone and everything that promotes an unhealthy lifestyle. I know I'll sleep better tonight knowing that Kate Moss may think twice before skipping that piece of cheese cake . . .
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Posted by: jmooney on Sep 28, 2006 4:37 PM
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The man most responsible for our modern, massive U. S. federal government, Abraham Lincoln, once said: "You can fool some of the people some of the time and all of the people some of the time, but you can't fool all of the people all of the time." To that I'd add, "Government can protect some of the people some of the time, but it can't protect all of the people all of the time."
I say, "Let 'em NOT eat cake!"
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» RE: Jay M.
Posted by: Burton
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Posted by: cinattra on Sep 29, 2006 3:17 PM
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Weighing models before they do go out and do the catwalk is just stupid.
There are some sports that encourage behavior that can be just as wreckless if not more so than being skinny. Wrestling, boxing or any sport that requires the athelete to "cut-weight".
If you're not familiar with cutting weight it is when an athelete about a couple of weeks (sometimes just days) before his sporting event drastically tries to lose weight so when he weighs in he will weigh less than his normal weight. Weigh ins or typically the day before the event so that participants have time to recover from the extreme weight loss.
Government is supposed to grease the wheels of commerce not hinder. The industry should self-regulate if anything. The last thing need is a law written by a group of men that will regulate what women can do with their bodies.
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Posted by: eastcoker on Sep 29, 2006 7:34 PM
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» RE: Bravo the Inqusition!
Posted by: Burton
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Posted by: Whistler on Sep 30, 2006 12:09 AM
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All this "concern" over the physical hazzards of being a model is bogus. The rationale is that when it gets to the extreme of anorexia, its unhealthy. Fine, except that most models are not anorexic. The hypocrisy is that I can think right off the top of my head at least 20 other professions (just for starters) that are a whole lot more dangerous than eating too little. When was the last time anyone was so "concerned" about the world's top high jumpers, most of whom have purposely waifed themselves - male and female? What about the soldiers Spain sent to Iraq purely for sport. Then there is the obesity epidemic which is actually on the rise. Fat people, on average, suffer a whole more ill health than their skinny counterparts. Fat folks are even less secure because they cannot do much running when shit hits the fan. Remember the Lebanon scenes of July? Who do you think were the slowest to haul ass - not counting the infirm, the elderly and the infants? Take one guess.
Should they ban all the martial arts? Hardly a single participant goes through a career without serious brain damage.
American football? After their careers, they're all limping.
So why all this focus on super thin models. Believe it or not if you watch most of the runways, the anorexic ones are in the minority. Anorexia is a sickness no worse than all the other life-threatening sicknesses. One thing I do know for sure, after modeling, most models live healthy normal lives - free of chronic conditions caused as a direct result of being skinny for a few years. The same cannot be said about all the other dangerous professions.
The real attack is - as usual - against pretty and glamorous women. The focus on the waif is just used as a piss-poor excuse. So many folks always seem to be soooo "concerned" about the mental and physical health of the pretty woman. They wonder out loud if she has anything "upstairs." However, no one ever seems to be "concerned" about the women who are short or ugly or fat. When was the last time anyone was so "concerned" about their health as a result of their lifestyle or whether they had something "upstairs?" Truth be told, nobody seems to give a damn. So the yardstick for measuring pretty women is not the same as the one measuring all people - male and female.
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» RE: Bullsh!t is R!ght
Posted by: Burton
» RE: Bullsh!t
Posted by: Aussie Kim
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Posted by: Aussie Kim on Oct 1, 2006 9:16 PM
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That should help too, although there's almost no way to enforce any of this...
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» RE: Ban women's magazines and...
Posted by: Aussie Kim
» And they wonder why we call them femi-nazis
Posted by: Burton
» RE: And they wonder why we call them femi-nazis
Posted by: Aussie Kim
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