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Has Canada Got the Cure?

By Holly Dressel, YES! Magazine. Posted August 29, 2006.


Since 1970, Canada has had a publicly funded, single-payer health system. Today, all Canadians are equally healthy, regardless of income.

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Should the United States implement a more inclusive, publicly funded health care system? That's a big debate throughout the country. But even as it rages, most Americans are unaware that the United States is the only country in the developed world that doesn't already have a fundamentally public--that is, tax-supported--health care system.

That means that the United States has been the unwitting control subject in a 30-year, worldwide experiment comparing the merits of private versus public health care funding. For the people living in the United States, the results of this experiment with privately funded health care have been grim. The United States now has the most expensive health care system on earth and, despite remarkable technology, the general health of the U.S. population is lower than in most industrialized countries. Worse, Americans' mortality rates--both general and infant--are shockingly high.

Different paths

Beginning in the 1930s, both the Americans and the Canadians tried to alleviate health care gaps by increasing use of employment-based insurance plans. Both countries encouraged nonprofit private insurance plans like Blue Cross, as well as for-profit insurance plans. The difference between the United States and Canada is that Americans are still doing this, ignoring decades of international statistics that show that this type of funding inevitably leads to poorer public health.

Meanwhile, according to author Terry Boychuk, the rest of the industrialized world, including many developing countries like Mexico, Korea, and India, viscerally understood that private insurance would [never be able to] cover all necessary hospital procedures and services; and that even minimal protection [is] beyond the reach of the poor, the working poor, and those with the most serious health problems. Today, over half the family bankruptcies filed every year in the United States are directly related to medical expenses, and a recent study shows that 75 percent of those are filed by people with health insurance.

The United States spends far more per capita on health care than any comparable country. In fact, the gap is so enormous that a recent University of California, San Francisco, study estimates that the United States would save over $161 billion every year in paperwork alone if it switched to a singlepayer system like Canada's. These billions of dollars are not abstract amounts deducted from government budgets; they come directly out of the pockets of people who are sick.

The year 2000 marked the beginning of a crucial period, when international trade rules, economic theory, and political action had begun to fully reflect the belief in the superiority of private, as opposed to public, management, especially in the United States. By that year the U.S. health care system had undergone what has been called "the health management organization revolution." U.S. government figures show that medical care costs have spiked since 2000, with total spending on prescriptions nearly doubling.

Cutting costs, cutting care

There are two criteria used to judge a country's health care system: the overall success of creating and sustaining health in the population, and the ability to control costs while doing so. One recent study published in the Canadian Medical Association Journal compares mortality rates in private forprofit and nonprofit hospitals in the United States. Research on 38 million adult patients in 26,000 U.S. hospitals revealed that death rates in for-profit hospitals are signifi cantly higher than in nonprofit hospitals: for-profit patients have a 2 percent higher chance of dying in the hospital or within 30 days of discharge. The increased death rates were clearly linked to "the corners that for-profit hospitals must cut in order to achieve a profit margin for investors, as well as to pay high salaries for administrators."

"To ease cost pressures, administrators tend to hire less highly skilled personnel, including doctors, nurses, and pharmacists...," wrote P. J. Devereaux, a cardiologist at McMaster University and the lead researcher. "The U.S. statistics clearly show that when the need for profits drives hospital decisionmaking, more patients die."

The value of care for all

Historically, one of the cruelest aspects of unequal income distribution is that poor people not only experience material want all their lives, they also suffer more illness and die younger. But in Canada there is no association between income inequality and mortality rates--none whatsoever.

In a massive study undertaken by Statistics Canada in the early 1990s, income and mortality census data were analyzed from all Canadian provinces and all U.S. states, as well as 53 Canadian and 282 American metropolitan areas. The study concluded that "the relationship between income inequality and mortality is not universal, but instead depends on social and political characteristics specific to place." In other words, government health policies have an effect.

"Income inequality is strongly associated with mortality in the United States and in North America as a whole," the study found, "but there is no relation within Canada at either the province or metropolitan area level &ndash between income inequality and mortality."

The same study revealed that among the poorest people in the United States, even a one percent increase in income resulted in a mortality decline of nearly 22 out of 100,000.

What makes this study so interesting is that Canada used to have statistics that mirrored those in the United States. In 1970, U.S. and Canadian mortality rates calculated along income lines were virtually identical. But 1970 also marked the introduction of Medicare in Canada -- universal, singlepayer coverage. The simple explanation for how Canadians have all become equally healthy, regardless of income, most likely lies in the fact that they have a publicly funded, single-payer health system and the control group, the United States, does not.

Infant mortality

Infant mortality rates, which reflect the health of the mother and her access to prenatal and postnatal care, are considered one of the most reliable measures of the general health of a population. Today, U.S. government statistics rank Canada's infant mortality rate of 4.7 per thousand 23rd out of 225 countries, in the company of the Netherlands, Luxembourg, Australia, and Denmark. The U.S. is 43rd--in the company of Croatia and Lithuania, below Taiwan and Cuba.

All the countries surrounding Canada or above it in the rankings have tax-supported health care systems. The countries surrounding the United States and below have mixed systems or are, in general, extremely poor in comparison to the United States and the other G8 industrial powerhouses.

There are no major industrialized countries near the United States in the rankings. The closest is Italy, at 5.83 infants dying per thousand, but it is still ranked five places higher.

In the United States, infant mortality rates are 7.1 per 1,000, the highest in the industrialized world -- much higher than some of the poorer states in India, for example, which have public health systems in place, at least for mothers and infants. Among the inner-city poor in the United States, more than 8 percent of mothers receive no prenatal care at all before giving birth.

Overall U.S. mortality

We would have expected to see steady decreases in deaths per thousand in the mid-twentieth century, because so many new drugs and procedures were becoming available. But neither the Canadian nor the American mortality rate declined much; in fact, Canada's leveled off for an entire decade, throughout the 1960s. This was a period in which private care was increasing in Canadian hospitals, and the steady mortality rates reflect the fact that most people simply couldn't afford the new therapies that were being offered. However, beginning in 1971, the same year that Canada's Medicare was fully applied, official statistics show that death rates suddenly plummeted, maintaining a steep decline to their present rate.

In the United States, during the same period, overall mortality rates also dropped, reflecting medical advances. But they did not drop nearly so precipitously as those in Canada after 1971. But given that the United States is the richest country on earth, today's overall mortality rates are shockingly high, at 8.4 per thousand, compared to Canada's 6.5.

Rich and poor

It has become increasingly apparent, as data accumulate, that the overall improvement in health in a society with tax-supported health care translates to better health even for the rich, the group assumed to be the main beneficiaries of the American-style private system. If we look just at the 5.7 deaths per thousand among presumably richer, white babies in the United States, Canada still does better at 4.7, even though the Canadian figure includes all ethnic groups and all income levels. Perhaps a one-per-thousand difference doesn't sound like much. But when measuring mortality, it's huge. If the U.S. infant mortality rate were the same as Canada's, almost 15,000 more babies would survive in the United States every year.

If we consider the statistics for the poor, which in the United States have been classified by race, we find that in 2001, infants born of black mothers were dying at a rate of 14.2 per thousand. That's a Third World figure, comparable to Russia's.8 But now that the United States has begun to do studies based on income levels instead of race, these "cultural" and genetic explanations are turning out to be baseless. Infant mortality is highest among the poor, regardless of race.

Vive la différence!

Genetically, Canadians and Americans are quite similar. Our health habits, too, are very much alike -- people in both countries eat too much and exercise too little. And, like the United States, there is plenty of inequality in Canada, too. In terms of health care, that inequality falls primarily on Canadians in isolated communities, particularly Native groups, who have poorer access to medical care and are exposed to greater environmental contamination. The only major difference between the two countries that could account for the remarkable disparity in their infant and adult mortality rates, as well as the amount they spend on health care, is how they manage their health care systems.

The facts are clear: Before 1971, when both countries had similar, largely privately funded health care systems, overall survival and mortality rates were almost identical. The divergence appeared with the introduction of the single-payer health system in Canada.

The solid statistics amassed since the 1970s point to only one conclusion: like it or not, believe it makes sense or not, publicly funded, universally available health care is simply the most powerful contributing factor to the overall health of the people who live in any country. And in the United States, we have got the bodies to prove it.

This article was reprinted from Yes! A Journal of Positive Futures, PO Box 10818, Bainbridge Island, WA 98110. Subscriptions: 800/937-4451.

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Holly Dressel is the co-author of Good News for a Change. This article was adapted from her forthcoming book, "God Save the Queen--God Save Us All: An Examination of Canadian Hospital Care via the Life and Death of Montreal's Queen Elizabeth Hospital" (McGill/Queen's Press, 2007).

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Spend money now...
Posted by: Aussie Kim on Aug 29, 2006 12:41 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
...Save money later.

Easy.

Keep people healthier and you have a more productive workforce, for example.

(Amazing - and think how useful an extra $161 billion a year would be in continuing to keep the mortality rates in countries like Iraq sky high)

((or you could spend it on the US health care system, I suppose. RADICAL!))

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Spend money now... Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Spend money now... Posted by: Aussie Kim
» RE: Spend money now... Posted by: joe2171
love
Posted by: rsaxto on Aug 29, 2006 1:50 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Bushies love our current system of care because it kills off poor "worthless" people faster than rich folks. That is why they so fervently push no change in our current health care system and no withdrawal from mass murder in Iraq. Another reason they love our current "health" system is that it makes the rich richer and the poor poorer which is the major push of the Cheney presidency (for he really calls all the important shots in their path toward doomsday).

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: love Posted by: aislinnluv
» RE: passive genocide Posted by: jedson
Holy COW! After months of Identity Politics articles, FINALLY ONE ARTICLE on universal healthcare!
Posted by: rebel_pig on Aug 29, 2006 2:44 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
After month after month of fakeLeft articles on Identity Politics, race and gender politics, consumer-politics, enviromental articles, politician-butt-kissing articles, electoral politics trivia and gossip. vegetarian articles, Bush-is-the-devil articles, The-world-is-gonna-end-tomorrow-if-you-don't-elect-democrats articles, FINALLY ONE LOUSY ARTICLE on what is the CENTERPIECE of leftism in EVERY OTHER WESTERN NATION--->universal healthcare. And it does what it should do--compare the American healthcare system to another western nation's unversal healthcare system. Hip hip hurray!

And it looks like a pretty darn good article, too. It talks about numbers, about money. About how it would help everyone, not just the poor. Good job, Holly Dressel!

Now let's do some analysis and use our noodles, shall we?

In the box at the top of this pseudoLeft propaganda organ known as Alternet, there are 4 stories every day. 4 new stories every weekday, and one set of new stories for the weekend. That is 4 times 6 == 24 new stories every week in the top box. 52 weeks in a year. So 312 stories every year in the box, which is the primary focus of Alternet every day. These 4 stories are the primary focus of Alternet each weekday and each weekend.

Over the last year, this is the FIRST TIME I have ever seen an article of this type in the box. NEVER have I seen such an article "in the box" on this website. So out of 312 box stories in the last year, this is the only story like this on this website. THe only story "in the box," with the focus, that dealt primarily with the nuts and bolts of universal healthcare, and touched on what should be the primary evidence for enacting such a plan--namely that every other goddamn western nation has such a plan.

FIRST TIME I HAVE EVER SEEN SUCH A STORY IN THE BOX ON ALTERNET.

ONE STORY OUT OF 312 STORIES THIS PAST YEAR.

Why is that?

I am going to make a prediction: there are 3 other articles in the box today:
one about Katrina:
When Government Shrugs: Lessons of Katrina
One about Cheney:
Cheney's the real president. It'd be nice if the press noticed.
One about abortion:
States Expand Fetal Homicide Laws

I predict that these other 3 articles will have posts on them.
I say this because those articles represent the typical fare on this site and other FakeLeft/Democratic sites. The FakeLeft activists have been programmed to accept that as the focus of activism.

And that is why America is headed downhill--because we have a fakeLeft that is not concerned with political activism on topics that affect the daily lives of the entire working class. Instead we have a fake Left that is focused on electoral politics (Cheney), racial minorities (Katrina) and moral wedge religious issues (abortion).

THat is why we have no Left in America. Because of you. YOU are to blame, not Cheney, not Bush, not Rove, not Jomentum, not Walmart. YOU.

Yes, it is true that fakeLeft propaganda organs like Alternet are funded by the upper class through rich nonprofit organizations. But YOU are the ones who failed to notice this year in and year out. So you are to blame.

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» Opinions are like a$$holes. Posted by: Paul D
You helped me to realize how lucky I am.
Posted by: akai ringo on Aug 29, 2006 4:49 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
An excellent article and at last one to which I, a non-American living in Japan, can relate to some extent. I know I'm ignorant about a lot of things in the U.S., which I've never visited, but Holly Dressel's assertion that "most Americans are unaware that the United States is the only country in the developed world that doesn't already have a fundamentally public--that is, tax-supported--health care system" was still something of a shock. If I, or any member of my family, get ill, we go to any clinic, any hospital in the country, and pay a proportion of the cost, but by far the largest part is paid for by the state, funded by the national health insurance system. For me, and I guess for virtually everyone in Japan, the U.S. is simply the richest, most powerful nation in the world, and the notion that so many people are without proper health care coverage is, with all due respect, somewhat shocking. But if this is so, why has it not become a major election issue? In my own home country of Britain, health care and the future of the British National Health Service is shaping up to become one of, and perhaps the major issue in the next election.

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» RE: We have an anti-socialist stance... Posted by: longlivecheney
» RE: We have an anti-socialist stance... Posted by: longlivecheney
Different view.
Posted by: Lincoln fan on Aug 29, 2006 5:11 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am in very good health and only go to the doctor when I think I have to which usually means years berween visits. I am also covered by good health insurance and yet I have a complaint and I wonder if it's a common complaint.
I had a small problem which required a biopsy and in-office minor surgery. The biopsy was negative but after surgery the problem recurred. The doctor sent me as an out patient to specialists in a hospital. They wanted to perform the same surgery over again. I told them that the original doctor was competent and asked why their operation would have a better result. They hemmed and hawed and said that I needed more tests. I already had several x-rays but they gave me a CAT scan which cost my insurance co big bucks. It's been a couple of years ago and I forget what they diagnosed but I doubt if it was serious or I would have remembered. They had me going back to the hospital time after time seeing different specialists. In the end I just stopped going because after a month or two they couldn't find any thing wrong with me. I think that my insurance is too good and if I ever fall into the clutches of the medical profession again I won't get out. They have no incentive to cure me. I want universal health care so that if I ever get sick they'll want to cure me to make way for another sick person.
Bob Reichenbach,
Director, The Lincoln Initiative

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» You have been lucky. Posted by: colinmeister
» RE: You have been lucky. Posted by: akai ringo
» RE: You have been lucky. Posted by: colinmeister
Writing to you from the north...
Posted by: Eager on Aug 29, 2006 5:13 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It would be great to see health care for our neighbours in the States. However, we don't have the perfect solution here in Canada. We have many problems with the system - shortages of doctors, lack of funding, hospital closures, long waiting lists and coruption. But for all its imperfections I would not want to change systems. Here is a perfect example - in a couple of hours I am off to my midwife's appointment which is covered by the health care system. And in a couple of months when my child is due I don't have the added worry about cost if I require a c-section yet I know of several mothers in the U.S. who have had to cope with such horrible stress.

It has been said that the true test of a society is how it treats its most vulnerable...

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» RE: Writing to you from the north... Posted by: Samantha Vimes
» RE: Writing to you from the north... Posted by: longlivecheney
» RE: Writing to you from the north... Posted by: longlivecheney
» RE: Writing to you from the north... Posted by: longlivecheney
» Drop dead, ditto head Posted by: LMNOP
Frame the argument
Posted by: COC on Aug 29, 2006 5:15 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
that private healthcare is a hidden tax. Costs for healthcare and insurance have skyrocketed and will continue so. The reasons are complex, but one reason cannot be denied--161 billion in administrative costs. Then add in the increases to recoup the losses of those unable to pay their medical bills and declare bankruptcy. In 2001, there were 1.5 million family bankruptcies. If the article is correct that 75% were precipitated by illness, the amount of unpaid medical bills must be staggering.

Someone makes up the difference, or lots of someones. The difference is made up in the increase in healthcare costs contributing to the increase in insurance to those that can afford it, i.e., a hidden tax.

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We have trouble with our system too...
Posted by: JohnnyM on Aug 29, 2006 5:37 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Hi from Canada.

Cancer is an epidemic here, as it probably is in the US too. You cannot find a Canadian who doesn't know someone with some form of cancer. It's pretty disgusting how our government continues to support the big businesses that are causing this epidemic.

Unfortunatley, if you get cancer here you have to wait many months to see a specialist, unless you have the money to travel to Buffalo (or whereever) and see a private specialist there. Many people die before getting treatment because they don't have the money and they are misdiagnosed as to the severity of their illness... Our system is two-tier, even though our government would never admit this, because we all live so close to the US border. If you've got money, you travel south. If you don't you wait...and wait...and wait.

So our system is far from perfect. Nurse shortages everywhere, doctor shortages, particularly GP's in small towns. Administratively, our hospitals are very poorly managed... it's a big sink hole for our tax dollars. And they're always asking for more.

So our numbers are better, for now, but we have our frustrations too.

And with our current bush-ite as president (the ass-kissing un-honourable stephen harper) I see Canada moving more towards a US-type system. You know, one step back, two steps back.

See you in the waiting room...

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» As if Posted by: famouspipeliner
Surgery
Posted by: ChaimGarciaNJ on Aug 29, 2006 5:54 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If Canada's system is so good (and I am NOT knocking Canada!!!), why do most Canadians who need serious surgeries come to the U.S to get them? Why do they come to the U.S. to see 'top' specialists? I used to agree with this form of health care, but now I'm not so sure. I think both systems have their faults. But is one really any better than the other? For each positive there seems to be a negative on both sides. It seems like every other issue facing us these days, the 'lesser' of two evils.

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» RE: Surgery Posted by: Lincoln fan
» RE: Surgery Posted by: JERSEYDAN
» RE: Evidence? Posted by: markh007
» RE: vidence? Posted by: Jesse
» RE: vidence? Posted by: ezilla
» Right wing canard Posted by: sausage
» RE: Surgery Posted by: shannonwhite
» RE: Surgery Posted by: Aussie Kim
» RE: Surgery Posted by: tisuzanne
Universal Coverage Yes, Run By Our Government????? NO
Posted by: NoPCZone on Aug 29, 2006 6:30 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Having seen the mess in New Orleans do you really want to trust BushCo (a.k.a. The Bush Crime Family) with your healthcare?

Back when Hillary was having hearings during the early Clinton Administration Dr Louis Sullivan hit the nail on the head.

This doctor, former HHS Secretary and Med School Dean answered a question about US Government run healthcare with the following:
"What you would end up with is the efficiency of the US Postal Service combined with the sensitivity of the IRS."

What we need is Universal Coverage-- not government run healthcare.

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» You can't beat the Post Office Posted by: DCostello2
» RE: That's The Problem Posted by: NoPCZone
Canada's system is under assault
Posted by: britchestoobig on Aug 29, 2006 6:47 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As a Canadian, I think its worthwhile to note that our medical system is facing a determined assault.

"Wait times" has been used to rally support for what is being called a two-tier system of public-private health care. The idea is being sold as a solution to problems faced by our (Canadian) system.

Just last week, our Canadian Medical Association faced an important election, with two candidates - one supporting our current system and the other strongly in favor of adopting a public-private model. The latter won.

The CMA of course has no legislative power, but it is now one more element among a larger strategy to end universal health care. The wheels are in motion to undermine our medical care system. There is ample evidence to suggest that two-tier systems in no way improves medical care for the majority. Two-tier vastly improves access to the wealthiest people, because they can afford to pay, but for the majority wait times are unchanged (actually in some cases even *lengthened* because paying customers get better access to limited facilities). There are also serious implications under NAFTA with respect to what happens to our public medical system once we let in private for-profit medicine. Unfortunately, as in the American political discourse, facts do not often play a starring role in policy debates in Canada.

Things aren't so green up here in the frozen North. The emperor's clothing of class-war is not confined to the United States...

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» RE: Canada's system is under assault Posted by: Logic's Edge
How about consulting an economist?
Posted by: sausage on Aug 29, 2006 7:36 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
In the United States we already have an alternative to private health insurance, Medicare.

Writes Dean Baker, macroeconomist and Co-Director of the Center for Economic and Policy Research in Washington, D.C.:"The government could simply open the Medicare system on a voluntary basis to any employer or individual who wanted to sign up.12 The Medicare program could charge standard insurance rates based on age, and compete with existing private sector plans.13

14 It would be necessary to include a system of subsidies to low income families, with the government paying most, or all, of the premium, in order to achieve universal coverage.
It is likely that the vast majority of employers and individuals not insured through an employer would quickly sign up with a Medicare-run plan.14 The savings in administrative costs would allow Medicare to provide better service to patients at a lower price. In addition, its already enormous size gives Medicare the bargaining power to push down the price it pays to health care providers for medical services. This gives Medicare a further advantage compared with private sector insurers."

The Conservative Nanny State

I suggest everyone read Baker's latest book The Conservative Nanny State, How the Wealthy Use the Government to Stay Rich and Get Richer. And the best part is that it's free. Click Here to download it.

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» thanks for the link Posted by: WhatNow?
No real debate
Posted by: JSquercia on Aug 29, 2006 7:41 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Sadly the idea that there is debate about the issue is NOT true
While the public may finally be starting to get it , there is absolutely no sign that the politicians are . I can not think of politician who is pushing this idea as the Central point of his campaign .
We have only to look at the abomination called Medicare Part D to see what the Corporate Congress thinks of Government health care . Strange isn't it that part of Canda's success in health may be attributable to their treatment of Perscription Drugs .
I agree with those who say that particularly among Republicans this is a class issue and that the have no use for
the majority of Americans who may not be part of their class.
We are useful to them only as Fodder for their wars which keep the profits rolling in to the Military Industrial Complex and the Carlyle Group .
Sadly the Democrats are not much better but they are better
Just the other day there was an article concerning Part D in which it was pointed out just how much money the Government could save if it allowed the plan to get the same prices the VA pays for Drugs . It would be more than enough to wipe out the need for that ridiculous Donought Hole .
The West Wing had one canidate tackling the issue and calling for Medicare for all . The Republicans talk about the inefficiency of Government but REFUSE to discuss the FACT that Medicare spends FAR less on Administrative Costs than Private Plans . This probably reflects the fact thater are no sahreholders to pay and no exorbitant CEO salaries and benefits . The Republican answers always favor the well to do with things like Health Savings Accounts which do you no good if you can't afford them.

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» RE: No real debate Posted by: grazianoml
» RE: No real debate Posted by: JERSEYDAN
But Can We Keep Public Health?
Posted by: rkewen on Aug 29, 2006 9:00 AM   
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One very significant aspect your article fails to mention is that our health care system in Canada has been under attack by the same neo-con greed based elements responsible for so much that is wrong with the United States. (think Health care or lack of health care, Enron, Halliburton, lack of response to Katrina or investigation of 9-11, Iraq, and on and on)

Ever since Ronnie Raygun's singing buddy and lackey, Brian Mulroney, spent nine years transferring wealth from poor and middle class Canadians to the wealthy elite and the corporations who honor no flag other than the greenback, our once proud health care system has been under siege. Just as in the US the Dems and ReThugs just seem to be two different faces surrounding the same corporate asslicking tongues, even 13 years of Liberal rule in Ottawa did little to stem the withdrawal of funds from and resulting degradation of our system.

Now in BC we are under attack by Gordon Campbell and his triple A provincial team of minor league criminals which has divided the province into so-called "health authorities" to coordinate the elimination of services previously available to the citizens. These authorities have been indulging in a frenzy of bed closings, whole hospital closings, delisting of services previously covered by BC Medical and so forth. The executives of the regional authorities who make these decisions are motivated by visions of bonuses, bigger bonuses to those that can save the most health care dollars by depriving their region of the most services. An approaching bulge in the demographics indicates record numbers of elderly boomers threatening astronomical costs. Hell, just close extended care facilities, nobody has to pay to look after these folks if there's no place to put them. It also helps keep old people out of the system to threaten to send them 200-300 miles away to find a care bed, they'll probably prefer to live in a tent in the back yard of a relative than go where they are so likely to never again see an old friend or relative - and the kids there can easily fit 24/7 care in, maybe while they are changing clothes to go from one McJob to the other.

Here in BC they've just about starved the system enough that private health care is starting to look good to anyone with any hope of being able to afford better. I haven't even mentioned our richest province Alberta, which hates to spend any of those ill-gotten oil riches on anything so wasteful as infrastructure, be it education, health or highways, under the gimlet eyed watch of King Ralphie Klein. Much better to send every body a "bonus" check they can spend on booze or electronic poker, how can they not vote for anyone who sponsors their vices.

So when looking north for inspiration, think of Tommy Douglas’ dream and then
consider the nightmare being plotted now by newly elected Canadian Medical Association president – Dr. Brian Day. Dr. Day just happens to hold the largest interest in private clinics that are supposed to “expedite” procedures and shorten the queues in the public system. The only part of the public system Dr. Day wants to be involved with is the money part, in other words bill the public system for private profit AND accept queue jumpers with bucks. The fact that British Columbia (or Canada) are not rife with unemployed DOCTORS, so all staff will of necessity be hovered out of the public system. Hooray Dr. Day, the Ray Kroc of orthopedic medicine.

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» RE: But Can We Keep Public Health? Posted by: PartTimeOptimist
California Assembly may send state-un health care bill to Ah'no'd
Posted by: sausage on Aug 29, 2006 9:42 AM   
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"(08-29) 04:00 PDT Sacramento -- The Democratic-controlled Legislature is on the verge of sending Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger a bill that would create a state-run universal health care system, testing him on an issue that voters rate as one of their top concerns in this election year.

On a largely party-line 43-30 vote, the Assembly approved a bill by state Sen. Sheila Kuehl, D-Santa Monica, that would eliminate private medical insurance plans and establish a statewide health insurance system that would provide coverage to all Californians. The state Senate has already approved the plan once and is expected this week to approve changes that the Assembly made to the bill."

SFGate.com

However, the same story has this caveat:
"Democratic gubernatorial candidate Phil Angelides is not supporting the Kuehl bill.

'He supports moving toward universal health care by first covering all children and then requiring businesses to cover their employees,' said Angelides spokesman Nick Pappas."

op.cit

Sounds like Democratic gubernatorial candidate Phil Angelides is another DLC wienie-boy, afraid to cut Ma Corporation's apon strings.

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Not the whole story
Posted by: quvinbunty on Aug 29, 2006 10:38 AM   
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Who knows about this? Is there "private" health care for profit available in Canada too still?

When [I] was in Canada the people who happen to have to use their health care system were not pleased with the way the system works.You would have to start at the low end of there health care system no matter how sick you were and work your way up to the specialist.America is a for profit economy, you pay you get serviced.The government should probably take it over health care but then they would out source to a for profit management group maybe even from Canada which would put us back to where we are.

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» RE: Not the whole story Posted by: babs
Universal health care has other economic benefits...
Posted by: babs on Aug 29, 2006 10:46 AM   
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... like attracting industry. Toyota recently made the decision to build a 7,000 employee plant near Toronto. The reason to build it in Canada as opposed to another site in the southern US was because of the cost to cover employee's healthcare, which can run up to $5000 per employee per year. (the other main reason cited by the auto maker was worker literacy, but that's a whole different discussion...)

Also, layoffs by other auto makers (GM mostly) have been much lower in Canada, again because of public health care. Employers that don't have to pay health insurance premiums can then offer other health insurance benefits like extended care, vision, dental and drug plans. It makes economic sense to employ people that cost you only their salaries and if additional benefits are offered, it is at the discretion of the employer (most large and medium employers offer competitive packages anyway).

The system in Canada works, despite the spoiled whiners that complain about it. I am 52 and have never had trouble seeing doctors, getting hospital care and testing (even MRIs).

My sister was living in Florida when her husband had a serious intestinal problem and no insurance (he was an independent building contractor). One week in hospital, surgery, and many tests added up to a $56,000 bill. Without help from parents and in-laws, they would have had to sell their house and start from scratch. That alone caused me to value a system that I took for granted, like many Canadians who have never seen the other side.

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ALTER-natives---Stop supporting the Medical Establishment
Posted by: WitchyNy on Aug 29, 2006 11:08 AM   
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I. Stop eating meat. It is not healthy for our environment, our bodies, or our economy.

2. Grow a garden. Chard and Squash and Tomato plants are very easy to grow.

3. Eat whole wheat bread -not white. Make your own. I have a grain grinder and the difference in taste of fresh ground grains is amazing. You will never want to go back.

4. Start shopping at health food stores-and ask questions.

5. Read books. Natural Cures is a good book. It is not bunk. It IS a good book...there are others too. Educate yourself about your illness-you can cure yourself with nutrition.

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» Try "Nourishing Traditions" ... Posted by: Loopylafae
Give us single-payer health care
Posted by: pianojo on Aug 29, 2006 11:40 AM   
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I live in NY and have REPEATEDLY written to Hillary Clinton requesting that the government simply extend Medicare to the ENTIRE country. Have never even received the courtesy of a response.

In olden times, in China, it was the policy that you paid a doctor as long as you were healthy. The minute you became ill, you stopped paying the doctor. Thus, there was NO economic incentive to be sick because the doctors didn't make a penny off of you. They ONLY made money when you were well.

Seems to me the American mis-named "health care system" is backwards. We should do the same thing the Chinese did.

In this country doctors get paid whether they help you or not. This is RIDICULOUS! Why the devil should you have to pay a doctor who doesn't help? Talk about a SCAM!

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Americans Should be Embarrassed to not Have Universal Health Care
Posted by: PartTimeOptimist on Aug 29, 2006 12:08 PM   
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I am from Canada, and we tend to have pretty strong feelings in favour of our universal health care system. So you know my socio-cultural bias.

However, the US is the wealthiest country in the world per capita, next to Switzerland, the Netherlands, Luxembourg and maybe a couple of other small countries. It has no excuse to not provide what we in Canada have come to think of as a basic, fundamental service that provides its citizenry with the minimum human dignity, and reduces the chance of something random and horrible happening to one's family.

Back in the day, when Canada was uncivilized and barbarous, when a family member got a terrible disease, that family would spend all their money and often mortgage their house, sometimes in vain, to save their relative. The unjust randomness was devastating, and these people ended up impoverished, without the same opportunities as others to pursue hapiness and livelihood. Pure bad luck.

This is why health insurance is a more important type of insurance coverage than any other insurance provided by the government, except maybe for welfare. But the two go together.

No citizen of any country should not benefit from the historical benefits produced by the country. Previous generations built a country with an economy and current generations are inheritors of that. The economy that we inherited is quite capable of providing a minmum safety net for all citizens, including welfare and health insurance. Although the current generation might manage the economy well, even increasing the economic might of the country, it is only the products of the current generation's labour and intelligence that is theirs. That which was inherited belongs to everyone, including the poor.

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portclyde dem
Posted by: portclyde dem on Aug 29, 2006 12:42 PM   
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Make no mistake about the fact that those of us to the south have the same problems as those of you in the great white north. Waiting to see specialists, lack of doctors (especially in poor rural areas), and corruption -- mostly by profit hungry insurance companies. At least our Canadian brothers and sisters can afford to see a doctor, because many of us here in the States wait until problems are serious because of the cost of doctor visits. The fact remains that there is way too much money being made off the health care of americans. Until people realize they have the ability to change things it will remain the same.
One more election like 2004 and a move further north will look very appealing.

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would Canada type health work for a US population?
Posted by: edith on Aug 29, 2006 12:50 PM   
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Are the demographics so different in USA than Canada that comparisons are risky? Our poor are poorer and have less healthy habits than Canada. Canada ironically is a more "middle class" nation than the US, which is sliding into Third World status in some cities and metropolitan areas.

I pose this as a question and would be interested in your answers.

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otto
Posted by: otto on Aug 29, 2006 1:49 PM   
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Not quite 100% correct, but close! The scary thing is that with NAFTA and other corporate led grabs (plus the help of mass media - most Canadian media is under control of about 4 companies) we Canadians are being led and pushed to adopt a "better American way" of privatization so that waits in hospitals can be cut down. That's the big hope for PM Harper and his conservative government, as he ass-kisses Bush in every way he can.

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Off Topic - Canadian Political Sites
Posted by: rivka_m on Aug 29, 2006 2:09 PM   
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So many Canadians coming out as such so I thought I'd give it a try ...

I'm from the US but I somewhat follow Canadian politics.
Well, as much as I can off "This Hour Has 22 Minutes" (I
have the luck to live in a border city and I get CBC).
Are there good Canadian political web sites? All the ones
I ever run into are American. Thanks!

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» RE: Off Topic - Canadian Political Sites Posted by: famouspipeliner
Big Pharma's wars against Canadian and generic drugs
Posted by: thoughtcriminal on Aug 29, 2006 2:22 PM   
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First of all, the drugs are cheaper in Canada - why?

From Bush Opposes Cheaper Drugs For Americans by Stewart Nusbaumer

“The reason the Republicans won’t allow cheaper drugs from Canada,” a Washington lobbyist, who insisted on remaining anonymous, said to this reporter, “is because the pharmaceutical companies make huge financial contributions to their election campaigns. It’s as simple as being bought off.”

This is the second time in less than one year that the Senate has voted to allow the resale of Canadian drugs in this country. The House previously voted for legislation like the Senate bill.

“In both chambers,” the lobbyist said, “many Republicans vote to allow the importation of Canadian drugs to cover themselves politically, while knowing the Bush Administration will reject the bill.”


That is not the only factor in the pharmaceutical drug wars, which are flying well below the radar. The fact is, pharma patents are expiring or on the verge of expiring for a wide variety of drugs, meaning that generic companies will be able to come in and produce them for far cheaper, and that means that drug prices will go down. Shareholders in pharmaceuticals hate the idea of losing their juicy returns on investment and are doing everything the can to prevent this from happening.

Thus, Big Pharma can try and come up with a new round of poorly tested experimental drugs that are patent-eligible (Vioxx and Celebrex for example), or they can try and shut down the generic companies.

In this respect, Arnold Schwarzenegger's new California drug deal bears a little inspection on the generics issue:

http://www.news10.net/storyfull2.aspx?storyid=19536
"Under the proposal, drug makers would have three years to voluntarily negotiate discounts with the state for anyone earning no more than three times the federal poverty level, or about $60,000 for a family of four. Those eligible would receive up to 40 percent savings on brand name medicines and up to 60 percent savings on generic prescription drugs.

After opposing similar legislation, Schwarzenegger agreed to cut Medi-Cal contracts with companies who failed to strike discount deals with the state within three years.


Thus, the generic companies are being forced to accept deeper discounts then the patent-based companies, even though the patent-based companies inflate their prices through their monopoly position. They claim they need high prices to make up for their R&D spending, but the truth is they spend more on marketing than on R&D. So who does the initial R&D? American public university chemistry departments that enter into exclusive nondisclosure proprietary contracts with drug companies yet use taxpayer funds for their research (Bush and Cheney and Rumsfeld love this - Rumsfeld is the pharmaceutical agent within the government - but this arrangement has its roots in Bayh-Dole legislation from the 80's).

This California Drug Plan seems designed to drive the generic companies out of business, while ensuring a future of high profits for the brand-name majors. The overall intention is clearly to cause generics to lose their Medi-Cal contracts. Generics operate on a tight budget since there is a competitive market not controlled by patent issues; a 60% discount will drive them out of business.

Don't expect the corporate media to breathe a word of this to anyone.

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Focus on mortality is a bit misleading...
Posted by: eeeeeeee on Aug 29, 2006 3:04 PM   
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To add another Canadian voice to the mix...

Altough I agree with the premise of this article, it is logically flawed to equate the health of any population with mortality rates (i.e. death rates). There are many living people in both the US and Canada who are extremely unhealthy - in fact, access to a physician is actually a very poor indicator of population health in developed countries. It is generally recognized that the rich-poor income gap is one of the most accurate indicators of a variety of country-level health indicators, followed closely by general income levels, education, culture, physical and social environments, and a few others.

For example, one of the true differences in having public vs. private health care, in terms of health outcomes, is that less financial stress means lower stress in general - which leads to a better quality of life, and better health status at the population level.

Canada does a bit better than the US because it has a lower income gap, a better-performing educational system, and a better social "safety net". However, I wouldn't go so far as to say that Canada is a model in these areas - it's actually following the US in a southward direction on the "health status in developed countries" list. Our ignorance of child poverty and First Nations health are nothing less than shameful for the wealth we have; further, there are plenty of advocates for a private user-pay system, including the recently elected leader of the Canadian Medical Association. So, although it's better than the States, it's not exactly cheery up here.

If you want to see some major differences in health, look at Scandinavia - they have the best social systems in the world, and consequently the best health. Most of the rest of Europe puts even Canada to shame, and it's not because they have better (or more) doctors.

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Another classic American reason to resist universal health care
Posted by: VannaLaRoche on Aug 29, 2006 3:48 PM   
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There's a certain segment of the population who believe that universal health care will just mean "more n-----s makin' babies, and I won't pay for it!"

I'm sure there's more than the one I overheard.

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US Prioirty is on Military, not Healthcare
Posted by: sofla100 on Aug 29, 2006 4:35 PM   
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A big reason America does not have universal health care is due to our countries priorities. The USA spends, on national defense, the EQUIVALENT of all the other countries of the world combined. It employs 100,000 people just to gather national intelligence. It has already spent hundreds of billions on the Iraq war. The priority of the USA is the military and national security appartus, not its citizens.

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classical
Posted by: ShoShenQ on Aug 29, 2006 5:48 PM   
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Its funny to see how many americans are ditching the canadian healthcare by saying its not perfect or "they come over here".

Hide your head in the sand and continue filing bankrupty cases because you got ill, thats all what the vast majority of yanks deserve anyway.

I for one will continue enjoying the free although slow health care, what is more waiting while I could be losing my house the other side of the fence ?

Hahaha

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Universal Health Care and Ideology
Posted by: yellow on Aug 29, 2006 5:54 PM   
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Most analysis of the lack of universal health care in the US understandably focuses on the economic, political, and logistical constraints on developing and implementing such a system. I would like to propose an additional consideration to be included with the others in explaining why the US has failed to implement such a plan despite the fact that it is in the interests of all to do so: that it would save private businesses millions of dollars making US products more internationally competitive, save money in redundant administrative costs, serve an unprecedented 47 million or nearly 16% uninsured, and increase economic productivity by creating a healthier workforce.

The reason that the US doesn't join the rest of the Western industrial democratic world in universal health care coverage is somewhat ideological. Universal health care coverage is often associated with the inclusive welfare state societies in Europe and elsewhere where being healthy along with old age insurance, job security, and a minimum wage standard are all considered rights and indicative of social belonging or having national CITIZENSHIP! Citizenship and the deep sense people have of it being confered upon them by public provision of a social wage and a certain amount of public goods is a concept that is today under attack and changing profoundly. In an age of globalization and neo-liberal economics the market is thought to reign supreme and be the solution to every problem whether it is effective or not. At a time when market power is replacing democratic rights we are no longer citizens but consumers. This is an essential point to grasp with regard to contemporary global society and the denationalization of modern political economy and political consciousness. The idea of citizenship is being replaced because of the sense of rights and entitlement it confers. In its place we are now seeing the misleading idea of "consumer choice" which is truely available to fewer and fewer people as the US median income declines in real value and over one third of American families struggle at or near the poverty line: according to the 2005 US census, 34% of families have household incomes at or below $32,000/year. Clearly these families have very little consumer choice as extolled by the pundits of the free market.

As we continue on toward increasing globalization and a skewing of the distribution of wealth, pressure to tax the rich in order to provide for the redistribution of resources for public goods will be heartily resisted by the rich and their political supporters. As this trend deepens it can be expected that the concept of citizenship will be downgraded in favor of consumerism. Except where necessary to imbue people with nationalism and jingoism in wartime, or to use racism to identify "alien" and "dangerous" elements, Citizenship will become a thing of the past. Universal health care is one institution and national right that conveys the idea of being a citizen with rights apart from the market that is one of the most powerful and compelling.

In the future struggles for democratic rights and for economic and social accountability to local communities on the part of corporate globalizers, national health care struggles can serve to restore the idea of national citizenship over the unfettered market in the overall struggle for democracy and inclusion. The fact that universal health care is it also an economically rational policy should not hurt its chances for success.

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The unspoken REAL reason we don't have national health care...
Posted by: zooeyhall on Aug 29, 2006 6:37 PM   
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and it's not only because the wealthy would possibly have to pay more taxes. A BIG reason we don't have national health care is because: in businesses that do provide some health care for employees, it provides a VERY big stick to keep employees in line. Lose your job and you lose health care coverage! Especially for the professional middle/managerial class, I know lots who absolutely hate their jobs and put-up with the most brazen exploitation and stress; but stay at it solely because they receive health care through their tyrant employer.

As an ancilliary benefit to corporations, the above also gives the employing class a way to keep a lid on wages. If people won't leave their job because it is the only way they can get health care coverage, then why try to get higher wages from your boss?

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ill or not
Posted by: john henry on Aug 29, 2006 6:44 PM   
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this will not happen until we the people say we have had enough of profit take at the hospital bed or at the drug store an still feel bad

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The system is already in place
Posted by: eyespy on Aug 29, 2006 6:57 PM   
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The US actually has a very efficient and effective system--when it works, which is rarely. The answer is really quite simple. Pass nationwide legislation prohibiting profit on health insurance. Does anyone really care if a bunch of middle managers making $200K and doing nothing but telling your grandma she can't get a new hip get the axe? Entire layers of bureaucracy could be eliminated as bloated health insurers streamline to eliminate waste. Some things are too important for the free market to decide, which is why no other Western government leaves its citizens at the mercy of the bottom line.

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Gary J Minter
Posted by: garyjminter on Aug 29, 2006 7:01 PM   
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Many of us have been fighting for years to reform our healthcare system, to no avail. The drug companies, insurance companies, AMA, and AHA have too much money and power, and are happy the way things are!

I've worked for a state government public health department for over 12 years. I've also done lots of volunteer work with HIV/AIDS, and also with various groups related to autoimmune disorders like lupus, Sjogren's syndrome, fibromyalgia, rheumatoid arthritis, etc...

During that time I've seen firsthand how health care officials dare not buck "the system" because their bosses, the elected officials (Congress, state legislatures, Governors, and of course the President) receive hundreds of millions of dollars in campaign donations from those who benefit from our current health care system, especially the pharmaceutical industry.

Those in government have no real power to change the system, because their election or re-election prospects would be nil if they dared to oppose the drug lobby, the doctors lobby, the hospital lobby....

For example, as chronicled in the Raleigh News and Observer, at one dinner several years ago in Washington, DC, the drug companies donated millions of dollars to the Republican Senatorial campaign. The guest speaker was George W. Bush, and the host and MC of the dinner was Bob Ingram, CEO (now retired) of the US division (Research Triangle Park, NC) of GlaxoSmithKline (formerly Burroughs-Wellcome), the major manufacturer and government contractor of AIDS drugs.

Twenty years ago Burroughs-Wellcome got the exclusive US license to market the first FDA-approved AIDS drug, AZT (zidovudine, Retrovir), which made billions of dollars for their company. Yet, Burroughs-Wellcome did not even develop AZT, but purchased the license for this "orphan drug" for a song from the US government. AZT was originally developed as an anti-cancer drug in 1963 by Dr. Jerome Horwitz of the Detroit Cancer Institute, but was never patented because it was too toxic and failed to cure cancer.

It turned out that AZT, developed 20 years before the word "AIDS" was coined, also failed to cure, or even prolong life, for those infected with the AIDS virus (joint British-French Concorde Study).

But as long as Burroughs-Wellcome (now GlaxoSmithKline Beecham) made over a billion dollars per year in sales from AZT, most of it paid for by the US taxpayers via DHHS, who cared? Certtainly not the politicians who got the campaign donations, the researchers who got grants from the drug firms to do clinical studies supporting the drugs for FDA approval and marketing PR, the doctors who get generous stipends for attending "continuing education" seminars which are sales pitches for these drugs, the medical journals who derive most of their revenue from drug ads....

Who cares about the HIV+ people who aren't getting treatment that actually works, the working taxpayers who pay for these drugs through US government programs, and the people overseas in developing countries who are prohibited by WTO rules from making their own generic versions of US and European drugs?

(The facts about AZT are well-documented in the book Good Intentions by Bruce Nussbaum, a Pulitzer-prize-winning author and an editor of Business Week magazine)

The AZT story is just one example of how the drug industry has bought and paid for our politicians, lawmakers, and health officials.

Gary James Minter
garyjminter@alumni.duke.edu
http://spaces.msn.com/aidschina
www.healthchina.org

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Bob you nailed it right on ...
Posted by: Loopylafae on Aug 29, 2006 9:08 PM   
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when you said that the battle is between the rich & poor, corporations and citizens ...big time true ... & also true that the evil ones benefit when we " regular" folk get mired in side issues --of their or our creation! ...The problem that I see, as a Canadian --and thereby decried as a "beneficiary" of public health care ...i feel compelled to point out that Canada's "sick-care, symptom management system is much more for the permanent drugging of the population with inherent huge profits for the corps, rather than a real focus on healing --finding & treating the Causes of illnesses ...Naturopathic care, which IS about real healing, is not covered by medicare ( though some private systems give partial coverage ) ...The corp's of the world profit most mightily when we allow ourselves to be fooled into buying their disease mongering/pill pushing marketing tools ...& they do that very very well :-(

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This issue makes me sick.
Posted by: antiapathy on Aug 30, 2006 12:28 PM   
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Literally. I am sickened by the politicians and corporations who can sit there with a straight face and tell us that universal health care will not work. In the face of overwhelming evidence about how many americans cannot afford health insurance, and how as a country we pay more per-capita than any other industrialized nation, they close their eyes and cover their ears and scream about long lines in Canada and government inefficiency.

Why do we allow this to continue? Our politicians have been bribed. We know it. They know it. They know we know it, and yet they don't worry about being re-elected, because Americans are unwilling to take a chance on the honest candidates who don't run under the Democratic or Rebublican wing of the Corporate Party.

For me, the answer seems simple. Put the Pols on notice. Tell them to stop taking bribes, to stop putting corporations' interests ahead of the people's. And when they continue to serve their corporate masters, then VOTE THE A**HOLES OUT!

I know plenty of candidates who support universal health care. I will be voting for them in November. But it sickens me to realize that my fellow citizens are too apathetic to join me in supporting candidates who serve the people instead of the corporations. Sick and disgusted. Grow a spine, America.

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Have lousy pay but fab benefits now- how will the union deal?
Posted by: Inky1ofMany on Aug 30, 2006 8:29 PM   
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How us skilled, responsible, hardworking schoolbus drivers would love to get paid better. Our union opted for making the district pay for our benefits instead of giving us more pay. When we renegotiate, how can the union write it in that we want the money saved by the district to come to us schoolbusdrivers? Right now, if we had to pay for our own benefits, it would cost us a quarter or more of our paycheck! Blue Cross is out of control. We need a single payer health program, and I hope California, where I live, will do it AND help the employees who are suffering from lack of income get a living wage.

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Canadian health system being screwed by Americans
Posted by: Bobsays on Aug 31, 2006 1:43 AM   
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Both the Canadian and British public health systems are being torn to pieces by American healthcare companies and American policy advice.

I agree with this article's findings (and have worked in public health care for over ten years), but I have also witnessed in the past ten years the fragmentation and destruction of this sytem by the introduction of market forces and American companies.

Americans should not be misled: go to the UK or Canada and you will find public health systems in massive crisis, and being ripped to peices by market-led schemes.

I don't give the public model we have come to like lasting more than the next five years. We shall all be screwed by the American health model sooner than we expect.

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» whyh not explain what you mean Posted by: rebel_pig
It's American society that's sick
Posted by: zooeyhall on Aug 31, 2006 8:55 AM   
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If only it were as simple as the author of the article wants it to be: just implement what Canada has.

However, I feel that the mess we have for health care is symptomatic of larger issues in American society. Especially attitudes that seem so prevalent among people I talk to:

"I've got mine---to hell with everyone else"

"Greed is good"

"If it makes money, you don't make apologies"

" If you're successful, it means that you are just a more morally superior--better Christian--smarter (pick your choice) than the other poor schmuck who landed on his ass."

This is reinforced in our culture by a media that daily bombards young people with this message.

I fear that there may be a retribution for this country for it's enshrining of greed culture---just as the Civil War was for our toleration and excuses for slavery.
And God only knows what that could be---social breakdown, violent revolution, other countries turning on us--take your pick.

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