Home
Archive
Columnists
Video
Blogs
Discuss
About
Search
Donate
Advertise
Advertisement
Advertisement
Advertisement
Advertisement
Register to Vote: Rock the Vote, powered by Working Assets Wireless
Advertisement
  • AlterNetYour turn

Support AlterNet
Do you value the information you're getting from AlterNet? Please show your support with a tax-deductible donation.


Feedback
Tell us how we're doing.

Back to (Public vs. Private) School

By Ruth Conniff, The Progressive. Posted August 28, 2006.


For this mother, sending her children to public instead of private school is about investing in her community, and working to make it good for everyone -- at least, that's the idea she would like her kids to grow up with.
082806story
Advertisement

Our oldest child is going to kindergarten this fall, and we are caught up in the back-to-school frenzy. We have to get school supplies, and I notice one telling change since we were kids: The list now includes not just supplies for our child, but a share of the pens, crayons, scissors, and glue the whole class will need this year. I guess budget cuts have reached the supply cabinet. We have to make doctors' appointments, fill out forms, find out who the teacher will be, and talk to our neighbors about finding the bus stop. It's a thrilling, poignant, nervous time.

I'm proud of the parents who are keeping their kids in our community school, and who have decided that the best way to help their kids get a great education is to work to support the staff and help make the school as good as it can be.

"Will I be scared?" my daughter asked yesterday, when we stopped by the school building to pick up some forms, and she tried out the playground equipment and peeked in the disassembled classrooms. Maybe at first, I said, but you'll like it. I'm sure that she will. Her friends from the neighborhood will be there. And I've heard enough good things from other parents -- many of whom volunteer in the classroom, go to meetings, and otherwise stay involved -- that I have a comfortable feeling of community support for my daughter's big leap to kindergarten.

But as I stepped over a condom wrapper on the playground and looked past my beaming five-year-old showing off on the monkey bars and noticed the spray paint on the slide, I had my own little twinge.

All parents worry about sending their kids out into the world. The short ride on the yellow bus to school is the first big step. I don't blame the parents who are fretting enough to wonder whether they should pony up for private education if they can afford to.

There's an interesting piece on MSNBC's website about public versus private school. It notes that much of parents' nervous gossip about schools conveys less about the quality of the schools themselves than it does about the values of the parents. And while most people assume that private schools are generally of higher quality than public schools, a recent study shows better scores, controlling for economic background, among public school students.

At any rate, sending your child off to school for the first time feels momentous, and parents feel pressed to do the best they can for their kids.

And, in our free-market preschool system, we are used to shopping for child-care arrangements that suit us. We are consumers, and the babysitters and daycare centers and preschools pitch their services to us, giving us at least the illusion that we are in control (even if the trade-offs are high cost, short supply and no guarantee of quality).

There is a seismic shift when school starts. Just being in the school building -- with the bells ringing and lockers slamming and the unforgettable school-lunch smell -- marks the beginning of something entirely different. The principal at our daughter's school -- a tough-looking, middle-aged woman who has been around the block a few times -- sat all the new parents down in the library and went over the rules, giving me, at least, the feeling of being a kid again, listening to what I was supposed to do, not making any demands.


Digg!

Liked this story? Get top stories in your inbox each week from AlterNet! Sign up now »


Advertisement

 

Comments Turn comments off sitewide Give us feedback »
Comments closed.
The comments for this story have been closed. Thank you to everyone who participated.
View:
Good luck to you!
Posted by: Aussie Kim on Aug 28, 2006 12:19 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Nice to see someone who thinks the same way I do, and I _went_ to a private school! (even if it was a fairly affordable and not a particularly well resourced school).

My aim is that if I ever have children, I will send them to a public school but save money as if I were sending them to a private school so my family can afford to go overseas for holidays so my kids (and I!) can learn more about the world and ourselves.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Good luck to you! Posted by: edith
76
Posted by: rsaxto on Aug 28, 2006 12:42 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This 76 yr old started (no kindergarten) in a 1 room all elementary grades country school in the great depression with no minorities. I salute your spunk and determination to give your kids a great school experience. My experience was heavily laced with numerous prejudices. Some progress has been made but there are still great problems in our education system. With active and aware people like you progress can still be made.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Yeah
Posted by: kit79 on Aug 28, 2006 1:01 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
They were a diverse bunch, and there was something great about going to meets and seeing them all together -- boys and girls, white, African-American, Asian and Latino -- cheering for each other, fooling around, and generally getting along

That's what I'd want for any kid.

My siblings when to private school, while I went through public school. I went to school in the ghetto, but I can honestly say I got a better more-rounded, more open-minded education free of a creepy religious agenda. Maybe there were a few more fights at my school, but now that I look back I realize how "liberal" my education was, and I wouldn't trade that for anything.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Limitations
Posted by: 1qa on Aug 28, 2006 1:31 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
My daughter is entering Kindergarten this year too. And, we're sending her public, and plan to be involved in the district (I've already started volunteering on certain district committees).

I'll admit that we were on that public vs private schooling fence, and it was close. The attraction of some private schools was smaller class size, foreign language and parental involvement.

In the end, we decided it was about being part of the community, and about her peers, and fortunately, we know a number of the kids in her class, and felt comfortable that she would have a positive experience, despite the limitations of the public system.

Still trying to figure out how to introduce foreign language to the early grades, instead of first being offered in grade 8.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» Not all public schools are the same Posted by: psychochurch
» Ignore PSYCHOchurch Posted by: truly scrumptious
» RE: Ignore PSYCHOchurch Posted by: liberalibrarian
» RE:There are no limitations Posted by: wereallfukked
» RE: Limitations Posted by: kt1066
» RE: Limitations Posted by: FauxPorteno
good luck
Posted by: JuanPeron on Aug 28, 2006 1:39 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I have a relative who works for the public fool system, so I know how bad it really is. Your kid is going to come out innumerate and illiterate, but with loads of self esteem. God forbid we should hurt the little dears' self esteem by demanding that they actually learn the three Rs.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: good luck Posted by: Lizmv
» RE: good luck Posted by: Annarisse
» RE: good luck Posted by: woogawooga
» RE: good luck Posted by: Camin Harner
» RE: good luck Posted by: Ktflake
» RE: good luck Posted by: woogawooga
You only learn to read once
Posted by: hquain on Aug 28, 2006 3:52 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Kindergarten is not going to make or break anyone's education. We can only hope, for the sake of Conniff's kids, that her feverish miasma of wishful thinking dies down enough to let in some of the local facts, whatever they are. She should look long and hard at the first grade teachers -- and beyond -- before she submits her kid to their hardened mercies.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: You only learn to read once Posted by: Lincoln fan
» RE: You only learn to read once Posted by: doctorsquared
elementary inner-city isn't so bad.
Posted by: SekhmetsatRa on Aug 28, 2006 3:55 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
unless you are in a suburban school, be ready to homeschool or private school in middle school. elementary isn't so bad in the inner city, it is the older brainwashed ignorant (by choice and culture) ones who are...

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: elementary inner-city isn't so bad. Posted by: Samantha Vimes
WELL STATED!
Posted by: garyoke on Aug 28, 2006 4:04 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It seems like only yesterday; and this year my youngest is looking for colleges. I enjoyed this thoughtful, well articulated piece. It captures the thoguhts, concerns, hopes, aspirations, and ideals of so many young parents. My kids went to public schools, found their niche, and received great educations. While they have chosen to attend private colleges, one of their selection criteria was campus diversity. Given the state of the world, one of the goals of contemporary education should be learning tolerance and respect; what good is knowledge if we can't get along with other people?

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

blah
Posted by: daniel1982 on Aug 28, 2006 4:33 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The public school system isn't bad (as some of the comments might suggest), its simply adequate. However, to the writer the quality of the education doesn't seem to matter either way. Instead she treats her daughter's first day as some sort of a social statement (experiment?). Good for her. Her privileged white child will go to school with poor blacks, and Hispanics. In the end though, her daughter will have a order of magnitude greater chance of finishing high school and going to university than the poorer kids she mingled with in Grade 1. Its a start I suppose.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Going Public
Posted by: Urstrly on Aug 28, 2006 4:39 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
For every parent who decides as you did our public schools become more viable. I took my daughter out of public school in junior high, because I (not she) couldn't tolerate the chaos in the hallways, the raucous language, the physicality of all those hormones untempered by a genteel authority. She has never forgiven me, because as a middle class kid, she always felt "poor," detested the elitism and emphasis on designer clothes, and the loss of status she suffered at being a new kid whose parents were neither rich or famous. As the divide between rich and poor has grown wider and wider, we in the middle must work to re-establish public education as vital and substantive. The rich could care less, and the poor are usually preoccupied with trying to survive. Vouchers, charter schools, "choice" are distractions. No child left behind? Give me a break!

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Going Public Posted by: Guy
Kril
Posted by: Kril on Aug 28, 2006 5:11 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I wish you and your family luck. After completing elementary in a public charter school - we are off to a very modest secular private school with high academic standards. The charter school, while providing smaller class sizes, was not able to remove itself from the necessity to teach either to the middle or at times to the least common denominator - not enough time, discipline, resources, or prepared children to do things differently. Our child, very bright, began to fall behind (not his class - but national standards) due to a growing lack of interest and boredom. Our local public schools - are similar. They are so vested in test results that they love to have the bright children because these children will do well with little instruction - thus leaving the teachers time to work with those who need it the most.
After these years, we determined that we could no longer sacrifice our child to the experiment of the charter school, nor return to the mediocre public school. It is very sad and not in necessarily in line with our values - but what parent is willing to sacrifice their child's education to make a statement supporting inferior public education? I find I am not that parent.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Kril Posted by: JERSEYDAN
» RE: Kril Posted by: Kril
Private Schools
Posted by: davidl.cooper on Aug 28, 2006 5:28 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I think the decision should be based on the quality of the education and the safety of your child. Where we live the quality of public schools is spotty. Some public schools are as good or better than private schools; however, it is very difficult to get your child into one of the better schools. Sometimes you have to know the principal. The public school in my daughter's district is underachieving;therefore, we are shelling out the money to send her to a private school. Again, I think a parent's number one concern should be getting his or her child the best possible education. Many of our public schools fall short of the mark. In addition to private school our daughter in in Kumon math and reading. This is an excellent supplemental program. In math the goal is to have children doing algebra by 5th grade. In the final analysis, for those of us who are not rich, a quality education is the best thing that we can give our children.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Private Schools Posted by: Sushi
ups and downs on both sides
Posted by: sln70 on Aug 28, 2006 5:37 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am a parent (In Canada) whose daughter has attended both public and private school. Grade K through 3 in public, 4 through 6 in private, now back to public.

It's heartbreaking at times in both types of institution. Bullying and bad teachers are everywhere. Favoritism and elitism rear their ugly heads at public and at private schools. Bad grades and good grades are simlarly hard to pin down.. is it an institutional issue or is your child struggling? You will find it difficult to tell no matter where you are in some cases.

The loss of 'childishness' in your child will tear you apart in grade one, and the sudden disinterest in happy-go-lucky fun will rip your heart out in grade 6.

Schools are very individual, and you have to work with them, keep your eye on them, and stay somewhat involved no matter what if you want the best for your kid.

:) good luck.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

The Home is Just as Important
Posted by: Poe on Aug 28, 2006 5:56 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Private, parochial or public. It doesn’t matter. What’s important is that kid’s have a home where adults, preferably parents, are interested in what they did at school each and every day.

You can teach kids by candlelight in a cave and they’ll soak it up, as long as there’s someone at home truly excited to hear what they're learning.

Poe

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Indoctrination is fun!
Posted by: warpspasm on Aug 28, 2006 5:57 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Public schools exist to turn out a product. Like factory farming, factory schooling churns out a reasonable facsimile of the real thing. The Public school system in America was designed and instigated by rich progressives who wanted to make sure that workers "fit for the economy" were created as well as to create a uniform citizenry. Check out the Underground History of American Education by John Gatto. (Please don't check out the discussion forum on his website as it's been hijacked by paleolibertarian Jesus freaks). Or for a short and concise essay do a search for Gatto's The Seven Lesson School teacher.

I homeschool my son and would never subject him to the factory like aspects of compulsory government education.. The status quo support for welfare schooling among progressives is scary. Why is compulsory government education(call it what it is instead of the quaint "public school) so important? I'm in agreement with much of the progressive agenda but goverment schools are a joke.

Public school is child abuse.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Indoctrination is fun! Posted by: JERSEYDAN
» RE: Individual vs. group hegemony Posted by: liberalibrarian
Letting the wolves teach the sheep
Posted by: BJT on Aug 28, 2006 5:58 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
News story after news story on this site points out how the US government has been acting against its people, harrassing them, using them, extorting them. It spies, it humiliates, it steals, kills and destroys.

And it runs the schools. Do you honestly think a government-run school is going to tell the truth about the government?

I went to a private school and still was taught the ridiculous fiction the textbooks call American History.

History educationists are fond of the "those who don't study history are doomed to repeat it" mantra, but the version of history taught in schools today is not useful for avoiding the mistakes of past generations. Because of this, we sit ripe for totalitarian takeover, with only ourselves to blame.

And you still trust the government to not abuse the power it has through government schools. I would call that insanity.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Yet you said the same Posted by: liberalibrarian
Congrats being concerned over kids' education, but why include the malarky?
Posted by: ABetterFuture on Aug 28, 2006 6:23 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If parents can find a school that prepares their youngsters with rigorous academics, reflects their values, and is reasonably safe in the public sector, then great. The idea, however, that parents who opt to send their kids to private school are somehow not supporting their "community school" is complete and total bupkus. Everyone foots the bill for Big Education; parents that send their kids to private schools have simply chosen to pay for that education twice--once for their kids, and again for the child of someone else. Progressives are mostly pro-choice, right?

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» hold on, Cipp Posted by: owleyes
» RE: owleyes Posted by: cipp
» Uh, whoo...whaa? Posted by: ABetterFuture
» RE: Uh, whoo...whaa? Posted by: JERSEYDAN
» Wrong! Posted by: ABetterFuture
It goes beyond private vs. public
Posted by: Ruby on Aug 28, 2006 6:26 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Private schools are not all equal to each other and neither are public. They come in all different sizes and economic makeup, and what your child requires in elementary school is different from middle school which is different from high school--you cannot boil this down to just public vs. private.

I have four children, ages 7-16. We live in a rural/suburban area where the schools are okay, except for the rotting buildings, but the money is not there to support them. My kids all began in one Montessori school, then we switched to a better Montessori one. Private schools do not all have the same quality teachers or programs, just because the philosophy might be the same. Private is not better just because you pay for it.

One of my children does not function in Montessori but does very well in a traditionally-structured setting. He is now in a private school only because the public school building is mold-ridden (he went there for a year and loved it).

I have never had a problem with the "elite" types as many people, myself included, are on financial aid. Many are not. No one really cares. At least I don't and my children don't care either. I would not let any preconceived notions about that stopping you from looking at private.

My oldest is in our public high school and is thriving. He is an independent, self-motivated student with no special needs. I think the level of education is mediocre but the lifestyle and community involvement is terrific for him. One does not need to be in the public schools from day one to attain that. I have always kept my kids involved in town sports, scouts etc. That said, I won't put my next children in the high school here because they are not as motivated as my oldest, and I know this school does not have the resources to deal with certain, minor learning issues of theirs.

The drawbacks in general with public schools are that the administration is not accountable to the parents (many times neither are private, but they do want to keep their "customers"), larger high schools can be a nightmare with social problems not able to be dealt with and the adminstration not knowing your children well enough, and there are unfortunately some groups of kids in public schools that you don't want your kids to be around that you won't find in a private school (although they do have quite a few individuals who seem to get away with anything in private schools).

If I had to do it over, I would have chosen a small town to live in where the public schools had an excellent reputation, and taken my chances. I think you're on the right track to want the public schools to work, and think that you can make any problems go away merely by being involved. The money for private is certainly a huge consideration, too.

However, be prepared to abandon your commitment to public schools for your commitment to your child should it not work out. Same thing for private--don't put all your hopes into that being perfect either. This is why many people homeschool. Everything has a potential drawback so just be flexible.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

The Purpose of Any School
Posted by: woogawooga on Aug 28, 2006 6:39 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
1) The adjustive or adaptive function. Schools are to establish fixed habits of reaction to authority. This, of course, precludes critical judgment completely. It also pretty much destroys the idea that useful or interesting material should be taught, because you can't test for reflexive obedience until you know whether you can make kids learn, and do, foolish and boring things.

2) The integrating function. This might well be called "the conformity function," because its intention is to make children as alike as possible. People who conform are predictable, and this is of great use to those who wish to harness and manipulate a large labor force.

3) The diagnostic and directive function. School is meant to determine each student's proper social role. This is done by logging evidence mathematically and anecdotally on cumulative records. As in "your permanent record." Yes, you do have one.

4) The differentiating function. Once their social role has been "diagnosed," children are to be sorted by role and trained only so far as their destination in the social machine merits - and not one step further. So much for making kids their personal best.

5) The selective function. This refers not to human choice at all but to Darwin's theory of natural selection as applied to what he called "the favored races." In short, the idea is to help things along by consciously attempting to improve the breeding stock. Schools are meant to tag the unfit - with poor grades, remedial placement, and other punishments - clearly enough that their peers will accept them as inferior and effectively bar them from the reproductive sweepstakes. That's what all those little humiliations from first grade onward were intended to do: wash the dirt down the drain.

6) The propaedeutic function. The societal system implied by these rules will require an elite group of caretakers. To that end, a small fraction of the kids will quietly be taught how to manage this continuing project, how to watch over and control a population deliberately dumbed down and declawed in order that government might proceed unchallenged and corporations might never want for obedient labor.

Try UNSCHOOLING or http://alternet.org/story/24548/

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: The Purpose of Any School Posted by: flairndip
» RE: The Purpose of Any School Posted by: woogawooga
Kril
Posted by: Kril on Aug 28, 2006 6:48 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
After reading many of these comments - the discussion reminds me a bit like the debate over stay-at-home moms - or working moms. It is common for us to seek validation of our own choices by looking at the choices of others.
There is no one RIGHT answer for everyone. We all have our own situations and circumstances and hopefully we will find ways to respect others' choices - even when they are different than ours.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» YES!! Posted by: mke_jim
» RE: Kril Posted by: woogawooga
My own experience
Posted by: PJH67 on Aug 28, 2006 7:04 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I grew up thinking that all private school kids were a bunch of snooty snobs. I couldn't imagine ever wanting to go to one. However, we recently moved to a new house in a more urban school district. From day one, my 13 year old son hated it. Probably because he was a new kid who started midterm, he was immediately ostracized. About every day, he was challenged to a fight. He would complain about how the teachers would spend half of the class time trying to manage unruly kids. Many teachers would just ignore problem behavior until it escalated so much they had to respond.
After about 2 months at his new school, he was attacked by four other kids while boarding the bus. It seems earlier that day he was being picked on and my son defended himself. The kid who he had problems with earlier that day rounded up some of his friends and they circled my son and beat him until finally my son was able to break away and get on his bus. The school police officer, by the way, was busy breaking up another fight at the other end of the parking lot.
When we went to talk to the school administration, they kind of had a "these things happen" attitude. They mentioned the fact that our son should be less "confrontational". I guess that's what they call defending yourself these days in public school.
We quickly pulled him out and got him into private school and it has made all of the difference. His grades and attitude have both improved. He was welcomed immediately at his new school and has made many friends. He went from class sizes of 30 to 35 kids to class sizes of 10 to 15 kids. Best of all, his teachers really seem to give a damn about the kids and their progress.
Ms. Coniff mentioned "the obsession with money and designer labels" that she assumes happens at all private schools. At my son's school, they wear uniforms. No child is made to feel bad because he can't afford fancy jeans or $200.00 Nikes. At his old public school, however, it was all about bling and designer labels. Believe me, it was alot cheaper buying the uniforms.
Is there less diversity? Racially, not by much. My son, however, no longer has to attend classes with the children of crackheads, drug dealers, convicted felons and parents that just don't give a damn about their kids. At his old school, less than 15% of graduates went on to get a bachelor's degree. At his new school, over 90% of graduates obtain one.
He is also learning important life lessons. Children who are habitual behavior problems at his private school are told they are no longer welcome. Like real life, he is seeing that there are consequences for this kind of behavior. At his old public school, they had to provide for these children at the expense of the other kids.
My wife and I are not rich. We started a weekend office cleaning business to pay for his schooling. My son comes along and helps us clean the offices. He told us he doesn't mind helping pay for his education. His exact words were, "I'd do anything to keep from being sent back to that dump."

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: My own experience Posted by: ethansmom
Why did SOCIALIST Karl Marx call for PUBLIC EDUCATION?
Posted by: ChrisBieber on Aug 28, 2006 7:34 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
in his Communist Manifesto, guidebook and plan to SOCIALIZE the world, the 10 Planks were the blueprint to be applied to SOCIALIZE a nation.

1st Plank - Abolition of Private Property(do you really OWN anything land/house/car/business?
2nd Plank - an INCOME TAX... how on earth did the United States become the wealthiest and most productive country on earth before 1913 and the Income Tax installation on our republic?
5th Plank - a Central Bank......the Federal Reserve...a PRIVATE bank with LEGAL MONOPOLY.
6th Plank - Government CONTROL of Transportation and Communication.....FCC and Dept of Transportation

and the 10th Plank
Free public education for all.

GOVERNMENT CONTROL OF EDUCATION...seizing the kids through compulsory attendence laws, forcing ALL OF US TO PAY FOR OTHERS EDUCATION, and FORCING A SOCIALIST AND HUMANISTIC AGENDA with a specific intent...to create a mass of controlled and obedient and entertained ILLITERATE serfs unable to refer to the past and realize the present and warn about the future.....6 generations in America have been dumbed down by the State and its John Dewey heirs at the NEA to JUST THAT.....

and conservatives want to make GOVERNMENT education "better"??????????

the new cry for all..

SEPARATION OF SCHOOL AND STATE
PS so WHO won the Cold War?
or whose IDEAS won the Cold War?

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» Please, get a clue... Posted by: IntnsRed
» RE: Please, get a clue... Posted by: Iconoclast421
» Really? Posted by: warpspasm
» RE: eally? Posted by: JERSEYDAN
Sports Vs. Education
Posted by: lively56 on Aug 28, 2006 7:55 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The problem I have with the public school system is the imbalance in the amount of money that goes for sports programs vs. education. Start by taking about 50% of the budget they spend each year on sports programs and use it for what it's intended for, and that is to educate our children. When my son graduated from highschool, they handed out very few academic scholarships, but man they were handing out sports scholarships like candy. That way they could pay teachers decent wages. One other example, one of my nieces just graduated with a BA in Social Work. She decided that she wanted to work in the school district where her children are attending. They offered her a starting pay of $20,000 a yr. That's absolutely incredible. I don't know forsure how much a highschool football coach makes, but I dare say 10 to 20 fold that amount. In my opinion that is the primary reason our public school systems are in the shape they're in.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Sports Vs. Education Posted by: IntnsRed
» RE: Sports Vs. Education Posted by: zinnia
» RE: Sports Vs. Education Posted by: JERSEYDAN
public school experience
Posted by: angryyoungwoman on Aug 28, 2006 8:03 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I (and my five siblings) all went to public school. We all also went to university, learned foreign languages, and most went on to graduate programs. A public school education doesn't guarantee that a child won't have the same academic chances that those with private educations have. I think, though, that ensuring academic progress takes some extra work on the part of both the parents and the student. My dad had his masters in education and all of us knew how to read before we went to kindergarten. He wasn't demanding about grades, but he did insist upon intelligence.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Public School Experience: It's for the parent as well as the children
Posted by: hiro on Aug 28, 2006 8:09 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
My wife and I are the parents of eight children who attended public schools in an integrated communty we chose because of its excellent school system. As parents of children of color we felt it was very important for their identity development to have positive experiences in their school and community. It was exhausting for my wife and me as we participated in the many school open houses, parent teacher associations, sporting events, curriculum planning committees, etc. at all levels until our last child graduated from high school. As I look back it was particularly invigorating experience because the families involved reflected the entire community. We met wonderful parents; we worked together and sometimes discussed issues pointedly with each other. We learned from each other and found that we could compromise in order to come to a decision. We loved it and as it turns out so did our children. Now that they are adults making decisions for their own children they often remark on how pleased they were with their own educational experience. I don't think that a private school, even if we could have afforded it, would have given them the experience and tools to deal with the global, multicultural world which they and their children face. So my advice to Ruth as her child starts her school year is that you are about to venture on a journey which will enrich not only your child's life but your own.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

For all the naysayers on public ed. Part I
Posted by: Ktflake on Aug 28, 2006 8:27 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
NY Times
July 15, 2006

Public Schools Perform Near Private Ones in Study

By DIANA JEAN SCHEMO
WASHINGTON, July 14 — The Education Department reported on Friday that children in public schools generally performed as well or better in reading and mathematics than comparable children in private schools. The exception was in eighth-grade reading, where the private school counterparts fared better.

The report, which compared fourth- and eighth-grade reading and math scores in 2003 from nearly 7,000 public schools and more than 530 private schools, also found that conservative Christian schools lagged significantly behind public schools on eighth-grade math.

The study, carrying the imprimatur of the National Center for
Education Statistics, part of the Education Department, was
contracted to the Educational Testing Service and delivered to the department last year.

It went through a lengthy peer review and includes an extended section of caveats about its limitations and calling such a comparison of public and private schools “of modest utility.”

Its release, on a summer Friday, was made with without a news conference or comment from Education Secretary Margaret Spellings.

Reg Weaver, president of the National Education Association, the union for millions of teachers, said the findings showed that public schools were “doing an outstanding job” and that if the results had been favorable to private schools, “there would have been press conferences and glowing statements about private schools.”

“The administration has been giving public schools a beating since the beginning” to advance his political agenda, Mr. Weaver said, of promoting charter schools and taxpayer-financed vouchers for private schools as alternatives to failing traditional public schools.

A spokesman for the Education Department, Chad Colby, offered no praise for public schools and said he did not expect the findings to influence policy. Mr. Colby emphasized the caveat, “An overall comparison of the two types of schools is of modest utility.”

“We’re not just for public schools or private schools,’’ he said. “We’re for good schools.”

The report mirrors and expands on similar findings this year by Christopher and Sarah Theule Lubienski, a husband-and-wife team at the University of Illinois who examined just math scores. The new study looked at reading scores, too.

The study, along with one of charter schools, was commissioned by the former head of the national Center for Education Statistics, Robert Lerner, an appointee of President Bush, at a time preliminary data suggested that charter schools, which are given public money but are run by private groups, fared no better at educating children than traditional public schools.

Proponents of charter schools had said the data did not take into account the predominance of children in their schools who had already had problems in neighborhood schools.

The two new studies put test scores in context by studying the children’s backgrounds and taking into account factors like race, ethnicity, income and parents’ educational backgrounds to make the comparisons more meaningful. The extended study of charter schools has not been released.

Findings favorable to private schools would likely have given a lift to administration efforts to offer children in ailing public schools the option of attending private schools.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

For all the naysayers of public ed. Part II
Posted by: Ktflake on Aug 28, 2006 8:30 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
An Education Department official who insisted on anonymity because of the climate surrounding the report, said researchers were "extra cautious" in reviewing it and were aware of its “political sensitivity.”

The official said the warning against drawing unsupported conclusions was expanded somewhat as the report went through in the review.

The report cautions, for example, against concluding that children do better because of the type of school as opposed to unknown factors. It also warns of great variations of performance among private schools, making a blanket comparison of public and private schools “of modest utility.” And the scores on which its findings are based reflect only a snapshot of student performance at a point in time and say nothing about individual student progress in different settings.

Arnold Goldstein of the National Center for Education Statistics said that the review was meticulous, but that it was not unusual for the center.

Mr. Goldstein said there was no political pressure to alter the
findings.

Students in private schools typically score higher than those in public schools, a finding confirmed in the study. The report then dug deeper to compare students of like racial, economic and social backgrounds. When it did that, the private school advantage disappeared in all areas except eighth-grade reading.

The report separated private schools by type and found that among private school students, those in Lutheran schools performed best, while those in conservative Christian schools did worst.

In eighth-grade reading, children in conservative Christian schools scored no better than comparable children in public schools.

In eighth-grade math, children in Lutheran schools scored
significantly better than children in public schools, but those in conservative Christian schools fared worse.

Joseph McTighe, executive director of the Council for American Private Education, an umbrella organization that represents 80 percent of private elementary and secondary schools, said the statistical analysis had little to do with parents’ choices on educating their children.

"In the real world, private school kids outperform public school kids," Mr. McTighe said. "That’s the real world, and the way things actually are."

Two weeks ago, the American Federation of Teachers, on its Web log, predicted that the report would be released on a Friday, suggesting that the Bush administration saw it as "bad news to be buried at the bottom of the news cycle."

The deputy director for administration and policy at the Institute of Education Sciences, Sue Betka, said the report was not released so it would go unnoticed. Ms. Betka said her office typically gave senior officials two weeks’ notice before releasing reports. "The report was ready two weeks ago Friday,’’ she said, “and so today was the first day, according to longstanding practice, that it could come out."

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: