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The Freaks of Father's Day
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From noon until 7 most weekdays, I'm a Mr. Mom -- a term that bothers some stay-at-home dads as a knock on their masculinity. Personally, it doesn't bother me. The reader will not be surprised to hear that I'm usually the only dad I see at Liko's swim and music classes. I don't mind that, either. After a hard period of adjustment, I came to accept the relative isolation that goes along with my role.
But on the day in question we stepped through the playground gate into a parallel universe where the laws of gender bent and vanished (cue Twilight Zone theme): Liko and I found ourselves surrounded by … men. Three men playing with three toddlers. No women in sight.
One dad left, but another arrived. At 1 p.m., it was still only dads and kids. Naturally, we dads compared notes about the unprecedented situation in which we found ourselves. It emerged that one of us was a full-time stay-at-home dad but looking for a job; two of us had quit careers to take care of our kids, but still, out of necessity, worked part-time as freelancers; the fourth was finishing a Ph.D. All four of our wives worked more hours than we did.
This was the second time around for the Ph.D., Nick Chapin; he has a 2-year-old and a 7-year-old. "There are definitely more dads on the playgrounds now than there were five years ago," Nick said.
At about 1:30, the first mom arrived with her baby. Liko and I went home for a nap. This incident raised the question: How many of us -- and by "us" I mean men who are primary caregivers -- are out there?
The 2004 census says that there are 143,000 stay-at-home-dads caring for 245,000 kids under 15. That's about 1.7 percent of all U.S. parents who are taking care of children, a pretty marginal group, but it's also double the number who stayed home in 1995, which suggests a trend. And the Bureau of Labor Statistics says that about 2 million dads work part-time for "non-economic reasons" that include child care, a category into which I fit.
So what? Those numbers are small, and it's still mostly women taking care of children, often pulling double shifts as workers and mommies. If there is a trend toward more paternal involvement in child rearing -- and there is, no question, and that's a good thing -- we should still keep it in perspective.
On Father's Day, we stay-at-home dads are the freaks. I'm happy to fly my freak flag, while acknowledging that today it's hard for any parent, male or female, to find enough time for their children. In her report, "One Sick Child Away From Being Fired: When Opting Out is Not an Option," U.C. law professor Joan C. Williams found that only 16 percent of working-class families enjoy the luxury of having one stay-at-home parent.
Williams discovered many, many examples of blue-collar workers (mostly women, but some men) who were fired for offenses like being three minutes late because of a child's asthma attack. For many moms and dads, staying home is not an option, and a "balance" between work and family is not possible. What white-collar workers gain in flexibility, they often lose in boundaries: How many of us have spent evenings and weekends massaging PowerPoints and spreadsheets?
Most stay-at-home dads I've met are relatively privileged, creative guys doing what they want to do, and they're happy doing it.
"None of us at-home fathers go into it in order to be some sort of social role model," says Stephen de las Heras, 38, a digital artist who lives in Manhattan and is the primary caregiver to his 4-year-old son. "We don't deserve medals. At least not for that. If anything, the correct response from people would be a completely neutral one. But we do have to put up with some shit from the less enlightened crowd, and face some additional obstacles in a mom-centric world. For that, a pat on the back once in a while can be nice, but is not required."
Exactly. In my view, dads-at-home are significant primarily to the degree they are bellwethers of a wider change in the culture, toward more flexible definitions of masculinity and femininity. Thanks to feminism -- which has tried to teach us to ride the shockwave created by massive economic change -- women now have more choices. So do men.
When I was born in 1970, my parents debated only whether my mom would work or stay at home. "We opted for her to stay home," says my father, Dan. "That was the question of the day. The idea that a mother could have a career and be a mom was the radical thought of the time. The thought that Dad would stay home was not considered. If it was, nobody told me, and the thought never entered my head."
In caring for Liko, never have I felt more secure in my masculinity; at the same time, never have I felt less "masculine." I'm learning, slowly, to let go of the link between my self-worth and the contribution I make at work; more and more, I measure myself against women I see as successful mothers. Does that make me a girly-man? Does anyone besides the Arnold Schwarzeneggers of the world care? I'm not replacing my wife, who is Liko's mother. For seven or so hours a day, I'm simply adopting a role that in my father's day was automatically assigned to the biological female.
In many respects, a man out in the middle of the afternoon with his toddler, who is known to neighbors and neighborhood shop clerks and waitresses as a "Mr. Mom," is a man in drag, and queer in the most political sense of the term. That's fine with me. Yes, I've gotten criticism from relatives ("A man is supposed to support his family, and a woman is supposed to stay home") and I know that I'm facing an uphill battle when I get back into the full-time job market. I'd be lying if I claimed that I have no doubts.
But mostly, I don't care what anybody says. When Liko and I are blasting Yo La Tengo or the Strokes or Blondie (his favorites; he has a thing for punk, new wave and indie pop; anything that bounces, really) and I'm dancing and he's careening down the hall, arms flailing, hopping from one foot to the other, and then he runs up and hugs my leg and yells "Dada!" -- life can't get any better. I helped make a new life, and that's staggering: a new human being, and a new life for me. I don't want to give him to a nanny; as much as possible, I want to take care of him and see him grow.
Many dads, both breadwinners and caregivers, seem to share my desire. A 2003 careerbuilder.com survey found that 40 percent of guys would consider staying at home with their kids. A 2004 Spike TV poll put that number at a fantastical sounding 56 percent.
Though the exact numbers are questionable (why should anybody trust a Spike TV survey?), it reveals a para-numerical truth about changing attitudes. I suspect the number of dads-at-home will continue to grow, at least in affluent Blue State urban areas, and I'll keep getting more and more male company on the playground.
Now here's the really interesting question: what impact will our choices have on the next generation? My son might not see "mothering" and "fathering" the way I do. If current trends continue, there could be a huge generation gap between us and our children, with many unexpected consequences. Revolutions -- maybe I should say evolutions -- have a way of leaving the revolutionaries behind.
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Posted by: rsaxto on Jun 16, 2006 3:38 AM
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» True, but what does this have to do with feminism and why exactly must 50% of dads stay at home?
Posted by: eocilian
» RE: True, but what does this have to do with feminism and why exactly must 50% of dads stay at home?
Posted by: Ivan_K
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Posted by: fork on Jun 16, 2006 4:09 AM
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Good to have some stats (1.7%, 143,000) and some "perspective" next time someone gives equal billing to SAHDs in a discussion of work and childcare.
I notice from the article that the guys seem reluctant to fully embrace their role though. They still define themselves primarily by their careers first: "Stephen de las Heras,. . . 38, a digital artist who lives in Manhattan and is the primary caregiver to his 4-year-old son", or are quick to point out that they also freelance or are looking for work. It doesn't seem acceptable to say, I am a stay at home dad, full stop. Most women I know will say they are stay at home moms, nothing else required, even though they work part-time.
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» RE: We need more of these guys
Posted by: Jeremy Adam Smith
» RE: We need more of these guys
Posted by: tragula
» RE: We need more of these guys
Posted by: Jeremy Adam Smith
» RE: We need more of these guys
Posted by: fork
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Posted by: warpspasm on Jun 16, 2006 5:17 AM
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Posted by: slowerpez on Jun 16, 2006 5:51 AM
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Posted by: janusville on Jun 16, 2006 6:29 AM
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» RE: housewife dad
Posted by: popsicle67
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Posted by: meadowlake59 on Jun 16, 2006 6:42 AM
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For good or bad, my daughter is much more in character like her father (drives her mom nuts) and like her liberally-minded father, she leans well to the left rather than her narrow-minded (Ayn Rand would say "inactive-minded") conservative-thinking mother. I believe that it is never too early to teach your children to think critically. Voltaire wrote some 250 years ago: "It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong" and it is a parent's responsibility to indoctrine a child in the affairs of politics.
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» RE: veronicasdad
Posted by: popsicle67
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Posted by: Conservativation on Jun 16, 2006 7:29 AM
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I work from home so I am around the kids and involved much more then the typical 9 to 5 dad. And we homeschooled (gasp, I must have toothless kids with eyes on the sides of their heads right, we must be Bible thumping bigots and wear white hoods and robes around the house, right? Not really...its an educational choice though likely to be the focus of any replies here)
The man mom is a recognizable trend to be sure, and performing the tasks that make a home operate is important for perspective for anyone. There is nothing unmanly about doing laundry or dishes, or changing diapers or bathing a child. The bond with the kids is far stronger, and it is more sustainable into teen years because many dads grow to barely know their kids by that time.
It is a conundrum for feminism though. To want everything AND to be favored in divorce court would be the goal. With men trending this way, the notion of equal parenting is catching on, and women may face a 50/50 split of kids time if they divorce, I guess thats bad from the womans point of view.
One important thing I have learned here as we approach Fathers Day is that we dads are always being admonished on our day while moms are gushed over on their day. Cliches about women work never ending abound. But there is a difference, and strangely Chris Rock captures it in a routine. If the parent working outside the home doesnt do the work at the job, there are severe consequences. The work in the home can be put off and the consequence is dirty laundry or such. There is a difference, and women and men who are involved in careers know exactly what I'm talking about.
One post decried that men seem to need to identify themselves by their jobs, and it seemed as if that is bad from the posters perspective. I can't understand why a fundamental male trait need be changed to make men and women more alike. Would it not be equally reasonable to suggest women start indentifying themselves with their work? Why must it be "bad men" doing the accomodating always?
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» RE: One Good Thing
Posted by: medstudgeek
» as a mom and a feminist
Posted by: sln70
» Response to Chris Rock comment
Posted by: scryberwitch
» RE: esponse to Chris Rock comment
Posted by: fork
» RE: esponse to Chris Rock comment
Posted by: FauxPorteno
» RE: esponse to Chris Rock comment
Posted by: Conservativation
» RE: One Good Thing
Posted by: fork
» RE: One Good Thing
Posted by: Conservativation
» RE: One Good Thing
Posted by: fork
» RE: One Good Thing
Posted by: Conservativation
» RE: One Good Thing
Posted by: fork
» RE: One Good Thing
Posted by: Conservativation
» Sports?
Posted by: Conservativation
» RE: Sports?
Posted by: fork
» A Bit Forked
Posted by: Conservativation
» RE: One Good Thing
Posted by: aussidawg
» RE: One Good Thing
Posted by: Ivan_K
» RE: One Good Thing
Posted by: Conservativation
» laughable . . . reallly
Posted by: FauxPorteno
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Posted by: MZ on Jun 16, 2006 7:51 AM
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Posted by: AlienSlave on Jun 16, 2006 7:56 AM
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MAY THE FORCE BE WITH YOU ! AND PASS THE DIAPER POWDER.
DARTH DADDY
ALIENSLAVE
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Posted by: Sojourner on Jun 16, 2006 9:34 AM
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The statistics about Mr. Moms ought to expand to inquiries about grandfathers as well. I have dozens of friends my age who participate in rearing their grandchildren because of the failure of a marriage, or a career and economic demands, etc.
My anecdotal evidence is noticing how men today are not even noticed in supermarkets. When I was doing childrearing, early on I felt like an invader of the females' world. Today I also notice how many women can be found shopping in the hardware store. Something is changing.
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» RE: How about a plug for childcare grandparents?
Posted by: AlienSlave
» RE: How about a plug for childcare grandparents?
Posted by: Sojourner
» PS to AS
Posted by: Sojourner
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Posted by: bugs on Jun 16, 2006 11:50 AM
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What I'm wondering is - where is our beloved troll cry0fan to yell and scream about this article being "divisive" because it's about gender?
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Posted by: marcos on Jun 16, 2006 11:56 AM
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More power to all you Mr. Mom guys!!! Great labor of love, it really is. We really need more guys like this. Granpa included
The fact that the private sphere, family/home, can be part of changes in the public/politcal sphere is vital.
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Posted by: Conservativation on Jun 16, 2006 3:39 PM
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It is the one way that the men's movement can actually create change in the divorce industry. I do not suggest that most men do it for that reason, but you can bet it has played a part. If men wish to not have it assumed that they are the inferior caregiver then it is obvious they must step up, do it, and prove it, and they are.
More importantly would be to slow the divorce industry and keep marriages together in the first place, because divorce hurts kids, no matter how amicable, no matter the circumstances (I am excluding violence and addictions and abuse etc., and focusing on the "fallen out of love" crowd).
Kids are tough but divorce may be one of the only things that we do that knowingly harms kids and we excuse it away by simply saying they can take it.
This trend I hope continues. I hope more and more dads become Mr Moms. If it does impact custodial statistics in a significant way, the divorce rate will plummet. An assumption of equal parenting, w/ at least a 50/50 shot at being the primary when there is dispute would stop those who whimsically file divorce in their tracks as they ponder losing some contact with their kids. That is all a very good thing.
One of the best ways to keep a marriage together is to step up, as a man, and do all this housework and child rearing. It completely removes that topic from the argument radar screen, and it returns benefits to everyone in that home. Add to that a prenuptial agreement that presumes equal parenting in case of divorce (except abuse etc.) and you will actually create a binding contract instead of the wink and nudge we call marriage today.
If we could sort out the divorce epidemic, I believe much would fall into place. Kids clearly benefit, and the whole debate about same sex marriage would go away as people stayed out of other peoples business.
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» ...to keep a marriage together...divorce... knowingly harms kids...
Posted by: Sojourner
» I appreciate what you say
Posted by: Conservativation
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Posted by: Gregor on Jun 16, 2006 3:58 PM
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» RE: DAd's
Posted by: AlienSlave
» stop no fault divorce
Posted by: Conservativation
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Posted by: ricksahm on Jun 16, 2006 6:01 PM
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» RE: ricksahm
Posted by: Jeremy Adam Smith
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Posted by: skewitall on Jun 16, 2006 10:24 PM
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Stay at home Dads are given respect when stay at home Moms are, that would be nice.
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» Within Yourself
Posted by: Conservativation
» RE: Dads or Moms
Posted by: fork
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Posted by: rosesaylavee on Jun 17, 2006 6:17 AM
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» I guess I could have learned, but i have diubts.
Posted by: Lincoln fan
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Posted by: chicagoguy on Jun 17, 2006 7:34 AM
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This article's author alludes to feminism's relevance to men when he writes:
Thanks to feminism . . . women now have more choices. So do men.
This is a great article. Not just on the particular subject of stay-at-home dads. I also add this to my too-brief collection of articles on the relevance of Feminism to men.
As a man I've always found it unfortunate that so many attempts at a "men's movement" have been reactive against feminism, rather than recognizing that feminism is essentially a "gender liberation" movement that, while understandably starting with and primarly focused on women, has much to offer men. The popular stereotype of feminism as "anti-men" (echoed here in an early post by "eocilian," who in 2006 still characterizes feminism as mainly being about not wearing bras) is unfortunate and unwarranted. I've been reading Ms. magazine since I first moved in with a subscriber 13 years ago (and to whom I've been married for the past 7). Not only have I never seen anything in Ms. about wearing or not wearing a bra, I have always found the content to be extremely liberating to me. How is it that so many men fail to see, in women's liberation from confining gender roles, their own liberation as well?
If more men see feminism as relevant to their lives, then hopefully we can then begin, as men, to make contributions to the movement. And a couple of previous posters here have provided a great example of a specific contribution men can make to feminism as they take on more parenting responsibilities (whether as stay-at-homes or not):
"Fork" comments early on that SAHDs "seem reluctant to fully embrace their role" as primary caregivers because the article lists their dollar-earning occupation first and their caregiving role second, as in "a digital artist who lives in Manhattan and is the primary caregiver to ... "
"Conservation" later questions if this is necessarily a bad thing. Which was my thought exactly. In particular, I was thinking of a married het female friend of mine, who is a writer and SAHM. Because she's female, it's a concern that she is seen by society primarily as a mom and that her writing is considered unimportant and maybe even something she will eventually give up. It may be particularly helpful to her that as more men balance their professional / political / creative lives with primary caregiving that we will all begin to see all people, male and female, as multifaceted and not assume that parenting cuts a person off from the world outside the home or that maintaining a presence in that outside world necessarily decreases the quality of one's parenting. So men's lack of comfort with being identified solely as a parent can be a good thing for all parents. Why should anyone be seen as "only a parent" ?
Men's Liberation. Women's Liberation. They go together.
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» RE: Feminism's Relevance to Men
Posted by: Jeremy Adam Smith
» If Women Ruled the World
Posted by: Conservativation
» RE: Feminism's Relevance to Men
Posted by: Conservativation
» RE: Feminism's Relevance to Men
Posted by: fork
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Posted by: popsicle67 on Jun 17, 2006 11:53 AM
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relationships) and my ex too. We are much better at being a family now than when we were married and I was working. The only rough spot has been her sexism. Funny as it sounds she has this notion that while men demanding a clean house and food on the table when they get home is abusive, Her lamentations in the same vein are not. I find it funny after the
whole reversal that similar bad attitudes develop. Have any other Mr. Moms run into this?
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» RE: Fulltime Mr. Mom
Posted by: DaBear
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Posted by: SufiLizard on Jun 17, 2006 3:40 PM
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I'm in a very similar situation (work part-time from home and the primary caregiver to my three kids) and I live in a rural area of a red state.
I haven't encountered ANY of the bigotted remarks about women staying home or not being manly. Everybody I encounter seems genuinely fine with our choice. I haven't noticed even a quietly raised eyebrow from the most stereotypical redneck red stater around here.
I just find that curious.
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» RE: ed State / Blue State?
Posted by: DaBear
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Posted by: DaBear on Jun 17, 2006 4:26 PM
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» RE: The "Mr. Mom" moniker still bugs me
Posted by: Jeremy Adam Smith
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Posted by: nor cal surfer on Jun 18, 2006 3:03 PM
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to all you guys out there doing it: you're my heroes. HAPPY FATHER'S DAY!
see you at the park....
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Posted by: thieflord on Jun 20, 2006 8:37 AM
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» Context is everything
Posted by: Jeremy Adam Smith
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Posted by: rsaxto on Jun 16, 2006 3:38 AM
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» True, but what does this have to do with feminism and why exactly must 50% of dads stay at home?
Posted by: eocilian
» RE: True, but what does this have to do with feminism and why exactly must 50% of dads stay at home?
Posted by: Ivan_K
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Posted by: fork on Jun 16, 2006 4:09 AM
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Good to have some stats (1.7%, 143,000) and some "perspective" next time someone gives equal billing to SAHDs in a discussion of work and childcare.
I notice from the article that the guys seem reluctant to fully embrace their role though. They still define themselves primarily by their careers first: "Stephen de las Heras,. . . 38, a digital artist who lives in Manhattan and is the primary caregiver to his 4-year-old son", or are quick to point out that they also freelance or are looking for work. It doesn't seem acceptable to say, I am a stay at home dad, full stop. Most women I know will say they are stay at home moms, nothing else required, even though they work part-time.
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» RE: We need more of these guys
Posted by: Jeremy Adam Smith
» RE: We need more of these guys
Posted by: tragula
» RE: We need more of these guys
Posted by: Jeremy Adam Smith
» RE: We need more of these guys
Posted by: fork
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Posted by: warpspasm on Jun 16, 2006 5:17 AM
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Posted by: slowerpez on Jun 16, 2006 5:51 AM
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Posted by: janusville on Jun 16, 2006 6:29 AM
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» RE: housewife dad
Posted by: popsicle67
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Posted by: meadowlake59 on Jun 16, 2006 6:42 AM
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For good or bad, my daughter is much more in character like her father (drives her mom nuts) and like her liberally-minded father, she leans well to the left rather than her narrow-minded (Ayn Rand would say "inactive-minded") conservative-thinking mother. I believe that it is never too early to teach your children to think critically. Voltaire wrote some 250 years ago: "It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong" and it is a parent's responsibility to indoctrine a child in the affairs of politics.
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» RE: veronicasdad
Posted by: popsicle67
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Posted by: Conservativation on Jun 16, 2006 7:29 AM
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I work from home so I am around the kids and involved much more then the typical 9 to 5 dad. And we homeschooled (gasp, I must have toothless kids with eyes on the sides of their heads right, we must be Bible thumping bigots and wear white hoods and robes around the house, right? Not really...its an educational choice though likely to be the focus of any replies here)
The man mom is a recognizable trend to be sure, and performing the tasks that make a home operate is important for perspective for anyone. There is nothing unmanly about doing laundry or dishes, or changing diapers or bathing a child. The bond with the kids is far stronger, and it is more sustainable into teen years because many dads grow to barely know their kids by that time.
It is a conundrum for feminism though. To want everything AND to be favored in divorce court would be the goal. With men trending this way, the notion of equal parenting is catching on, and women may face a 50/50 split of kids time if they divorce, I guess thats bad from the womans point of view.
One important thing I have learned here as we approach Fathers Day is that we dads are always being admonished on our day while moms are gushed over on their day. Cliches about women work never ending abound. But there is a difference, and strangely Chris Rock captures it in a routine. If the parent working outside the home doesnt do the work at the job, there are severe consequences. The work in the home can be put off and the consequence is dirty laundry or such. There is a difference, and women and men who are involved in careers know exactly what I'm talking about.
One post decried that men seem to need to identify themselves by their jobs, and it seemed as if that is bad from the posters perspective. I can't understand why a fundamental male trait need be changed to make men and women more alike. Would it not be equally reasonable to suggest women start indentifying themselves with their work? Why must it be "bad men" doing the accomodating always?
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» RE: One Good Thing
Posted by: medstudgeek
» as a mom and a feminist
Posted by: sln70
» Response to Chris Rock comment
Posted by: scryberwitch
» RE: esponse to Chris Rock comment
Posted by: fork
» RE: esponse to Chris Rock comment
Posted by: FauxPorteno
» RE: esponse to Chris Rock comment
Posted by: Conservativation
» RE: One Good Thing
Posted by: fork
» RE: One Good Thing
Posted by: Conservativation
» RE: One Good Thing
Posted by: fork
» RE: One Good Thing
Posted by: Conservativation
» RE: One Good Thing
Posted by: fork
» RE: One Good Thing
Posted by: Conservativation
» Sports?
Posted by: Conservativation
» RE: Sports?
Posted by: fork
» A Bit Forked
Posted by: Conservativation
» RE: One Good Thing
Posted by: aussidawg
» RE: One Good Thing
Posted by: Ivan_K
» RE: One Good Thing
Posted by: Conservativation
» laughable . . . reallly
Posted by: FauxPorteno
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Posted by: MZ on Jun 16, 2006 7:51 AM
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Posted by: AlienSlave on Jun 16, 2006 7:56 AM
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MAY THE FORCE BE WITH YOU ! AND PASS THE DIAPER POWDER.
DARTH DADDY
ALIENSLAVE
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Posted by: Sojourner on Jun 16, 2006 9:34 AM
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The statistics about Mr. Moms ought to expand to inquiries about grandfathers as well. I have dozens of friends my age who participate in rearing their grandchildren because of the failure of a marriage, or a career and economic demands, etc.
My anecdotal evidence is noticing how men today are not even noticed in supermarkets. When I was doing childrearing, early on I felt like an invader of the females' world. Today I also notice how many women can be found shopping in the hardware store. Something is changing.
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» RE: How about a plug for childcare grandparents?
Posted by: AlienSlave
» RE: How about a plug for childcare grandparents?
Posted by: Sojourner
» PS to AS
Posted by: Sojourner
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Posted by: bugs on Jun 16, 2006 11:50 AM
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What I'm wondering is - where is our beloved troll cry0fan to yell and scream about this article being "divisive" because it's about gender?
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Posted by: marcos on Jun 16, 2006 11:56 AM
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More power to all you Mr. Mom guys!!! Great labor of love, it really is. We really need more guys like this. Granpa included
The fact that the private sphere, family/home, can be part of changes in the public/politcal sphere is vital.
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Posted by: Conservativation on Jun 16, 2006 3:39 PM
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It is the one way that the men's movement can actually create change in the divorce industry. I do not suggest that most men do it for that reason, but you can bet it has played a part. If men wish to not have it assumed that they are the inferior caregiver then it is obvious they must step up, do it, and prove it, and they are.
More importantly would be to slow the divorce industry and keep marriages together in the first place, because divorce hurts kids, no matter how amicable, no matter the circumstances (I am excluding violence and addictions and abuse etc., and focusing on the "fallen out of love" crowd).
Kids are tough but divorce may be one of the only things that we do that knowingly harms kids and we excuse it away by simply saying they can take it.
This trend I hope continues. I hope more and more dads become Mr Moms. If it does impact custodial statistics in a significant way, the divorce rate will plummet. An assumption of equal parenting, w/ at least a 50/50 shot at being the primary when there is dispute would stop those who whimsically file divorce in their tracks as they ponder losing some contact with their kids. That is all a very good thing.
One of the best ways to keep a marriage together is to step up, as a man, and do all this housework and child rearing. It completely removes that topic from the argument radar screen, and it returns benefits to everyone in that home. Add to that a prenuptial agreement that presumes equal parenting in case of divorce (except abuse etc.) and you will actually create a binding contract instead of the wink and nudge we call marriage today.
If we could sort out the divorce epidemic, I believe much would fall into place. Kids clearly benefit, and the whole debate about same sex marriage would go away as people stayed out of other peoples business.
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» ...to keep a marriage together...divorce... knowingly harms kids...
Posted by: Sojourner
» I appreciate what you say
Posted by: Conservativation
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Posted by: Gregor on Jun 16, 2006 3:58 PM
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» RE: DAd's
Posted by: AlienSlave
» stop no fault divorce
Posted by: Conservativation
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Posted by: ricksahm on Jun 16, 2006 6:01 PM
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» RE: ricksahm
Posted by: Jeremy Adam Smith
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Posted by: skewitall on Jun 16, 2006 10:24 PM
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Stay at home Dads are given respect when stay at home Moms are, that would be nice.
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» Within Yourself
Posted by: Conservativation
» RE: Dads or Moms
Posted by: fork
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Posted by: rosesaylavee on Jun 17, 2006 6:17 AM
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» I guess I could have learned, but i have diubts.
Posted by: Lincoln fan
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Posted by: chicagoguy on Jun 17, 2006 7:34 AM
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This article's author alludes to feminism's relevance to men when he writes:
Thanks to feminism . . . women now have more choices. So do men.
This is a great article. Not just on the particular subject of stay-at-home dads. I also add this to my too-brief collection of articles on the relevance of Feminism to men.
As a man I've always found it unfortunate that so many attempts at a "men's movement" have been reactive against feminism, rather than recognizing that feminism is essentially a "gender liberation" movement that, while understandably starting with and primarly focused on women, has much to offer men. The popular stereotype of feminism as "anti-men" (echoed here in an early post by "eocilian," who in 2006 still characterizes feminism as mainly being about not wearing bras) is unfortunate and unwarranted. I've been reading Ms. magazine since I first moved in with a subscriber 13 years ago (and to whom I've been married for the past 7). Not only have I never seen anything in Ms. about wearing or not wearing a bra, I have always found the content to be extremely liberating to me. How is it that so many men fail to see, in women's liberation from confining gender roles, their own liberation as well?
If more men see feminism as relevant to their lives, then hopefully we can then begin, as men, to make contributions to the movement. And a couple of previous posters here have provided a great example of a specific contribution men can make to feminism as they take on more parenting responsibilities (whether as stay-at-homes or not):
"Fork" comments early on that SAHDs "seem reluctant to fully embrace their role" as primary caregivers because the article lists their dollar-earning occupation first and their caregiving role second, as in "a digital artist who lives in Manhattan and is the primary caregiver to ... "
"Conservation" later questions if this is necessarily a bad thing. Which was my thought exactly. In particular, I was thinking of a married het female friend of mine, who is a writer and SAHM. Because she's female, it's a concern that she is seen by society primarily as a mom and that her writing is considered unimportant and maybe even something she will eventually give up. It may be particularly helpful to her that as more men balance their professional / political / creative lives with primary caregiving that we will all begin to see all people, male and female, as multifaceted and not assume that parenting cuts a person off from the world outside the home or that maintaining a presence in that outside world necessarily decreases the quality of one's parenting. So men's lack of comfort with being identified solely as a parent can be a good thing for all parents. Why should anyone be seen as "only a parent" ?
Men's Liberation. Women's Liberation. They go together.
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» RE: Feminism's Relevance to Men
Posted by: Jeremy Adam Smith
» If Women Ruled the World
Posted by: Conservativation
» RE: Feminism's Relevance to Men
Posted by: Conservativation
» RE: Feminism's Relevance to Men
Posted by: fork
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Posted by: popsicle67 on Jun 17, 2006 11:53 AM
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relationships) and my ex too. We are much better at being a family now than when we were married and I was working. The only rough spot has been her sexism. Funny as it sounds she has this notion that while men demanding a clean house and food on the table when they get home is abusive, Her lamentations in the same vein are not. I find it funny after the
whole reversal that similar bad attitudes develop. Have any other Mr. Moms run into this?
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» RE: Fulltime Mr. Mom
Posted by: DaBear
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Posted by: SufiLizard on Jun 17, 2006 3:40 PM
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I'm in a very similar situation (work part-time from home and the primary caregiver to my three kids) and I live in a rural area of a red state.
I haven't encountered ANY of the bigotted remarks about women staying home or not being manly. Everybody I encounter seems genuinely fine with our choice. I haven't noticed even a quietly raised eyebrow from the most stereotypical redneck red stater around here.
I just find that curious.
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» RE: ed State / Blue State?
Posted by: DaBear
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Posted by: DaBear on Jun 17, 2006 4:26 PM
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» RE: The "Mr. Mom" moniker still bugs me
Posted by: Jeremy Adam Smith
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Posted by: nor cal surfer on Jun 18, 2006 3:03 PM
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to all you guys out there doing it: you're my heroes. HAPPY FATHER'S DAY!
see you at the park....
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Posted by: thieflord on Jun 20, 2006 8:37 AM
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» Context is everything
Posted by: Jeremy Adam Smith
Vancouver's Games Will Be the Gayest Olympics Ever
Trial Begins for Activist Who Fought to Protect Federal Lands from Drilling -- Join the Protest
Starbucks' Cop-Out to Gun Nuts: Customers Served Coffee While Strapped




