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The Mystery of the Marine Massacre in Iraq - Updated

By Joshua Holland, AlterNet. Posted May 27, 2006.


A group of enraged Marines entered homes in the Iraqi town of Haditha and murdered their occupants, including children, in cold blood. And it's not an isolated incident.

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Last month, the details of a horrific atrocity emerged from Haditha, a town in the Sunni-dominated Anbar province.

In November, a roadside bomb killed Marine Lance Cpl. Miguel Terrazas, a 20-year-old Texan, on a road not far from Haditha. According to Time magazine, "The next day a Marine communique from Camp Blue Diamond in Ramadi reported that Terrazas and 15 Iraqi civilians were killed by the blast and that 'gunmen attacked the convoy with small-arms fire,' prompting the Marines to return fire, killing eight insurgents." Another military official later said the military command in Baghdad "knew of no civilian deaths in the engagement."

Marine officials have now confirmed that those accounts were false. What really happened, according to reports confirmed by the Pentagon, was this: A group of enraged Marines entered several homes in Haditha and murdered their occupants, including children, in cold blood. A video of the aftermath -- showing that the residents were unarmed when they were shot at point-blank range -- was obtained by Time. Some were still in their nightclothes.

Five Iraqis in a taxi were also killed. It remains unclear whether they were trying to flee on foot, or drive away from the scene, and the chronology of events hasn't been established. The military is conducting two separate investigations into the events that day.

According to MSNBC, the video was confirmed by the Marines' own investigation: "Military officials say Marine Corps photos taken immediately after the incident show many of the victims were shot at close range, in the head and chest, execution-style." Women and children were among the 24 civilians murdered: "One photo shows a mother and young child bent over on the floor as if in prayer, shot dead, said the officials. ..."

The scene was so grim, the two Marines who took the after-action photos are reportedly suffering from post-traumatic stress disorder.

Last week, Rep. Jack Murtha, D-Pa., told reporters that "sources within the military" told him that "there was no firefight, there was no IED that killed these innocent people. Our troops overreacted because of the pressure on them, and they killed innocent civilians in cold blood."

According to the Marine Corps Times, up to a dozen soldiers face possible court-martial. Three officers were relieved of duty in April.

The Associated Press reported that Military officials expect Haditha to become a major scandal. On Saturday, Marine Gen. Michael W. Hagee, the top Marine official, headed to Iraq to admonish his troops to use deadly force "only when justified, proportional and, most importantly, lawful."

The media, hectored by the administration's charges that they don't report the illusory "good news" from Iraq, showed little stomach for the story until Murtha until Murtha's statement last week. Most of the reporting has focused on the Congressman, a former hawk who has become a vocal opponent of the war. It's a tidy storyline that reduces the horrific images of innocent children being blown away by vengeful Marines to a palpable and familiar partisan squabble.

But there's more going on than just the usual simplistic he said/she said reporting; the media's uncritical acceptance of the Iraq hawks' spin in the months leading up to the invasion -- with notable exceptions like Knight-Ridder's Washington Bureau -- makes them complicit in crimes like those alleged in Haditha. They promised America a clean war; smart bombs would spare the innocent, a high-tech military would be finished in a fortnight and casualties on both sides would be limited. Now, the editors at places like the Washington Post and the New York Times have little interest in turning Haditha into the Iraq war's My Lai and exposing the lie behind their clean war narrative.

The storyline has provoked the expected reaction from the war's dwindling number of supporters. As writer Steve Benen, perusing the right-wing blogs, noted:

Some are calling Murtha "dishonorable." Others labeled him a 'traitor' and recommended that he be sent to "jail." Another added, "Murtha has no honor left, no dignity, and will never be considered as a Marine except by his liberal buddies, who would hate him for wearing that uniform in the first place."
The other wholly predictable reaction was voiced by Duncan Hunter, R-Calif., chairman of the House Armed Services Committee, who told reporters that the Haditha massacre was a case of a few bad apples, an isolated incident -- just as he had said after the abuses at Abu Ghraib were revealed. "I don't want the actions of one squad in one city on one morning to be used to symbolize or characterize or tar the actions of our great troops," he said.

But the truth is that the story is unique only in that the evidence that a terrible crime took place appears to be too great for "plausible deniability."

Consider just a few reports:


  • A team of eight Amnesty International staffers reported on a host of abuses by coalition forces, including the killing of two unarmed kids -- one 12 years old -- during house to house searches. "Many of the coalition soldiers and military police engaged in law enforcement do not have basic skills and tools in civilian policing," Curt Goering, a member of the Amnesty team in Iraq, noted.


  • The Associated Press reported that "Iraq's U.N. ambassador accused U.S. Marines of killing his unarmed young cousin in what appeared to be 'cold blood'" during another house search in Anbar province. The ambassador, Samir Sumaidaie, wrote that the troops had smiled after the "killing of an unarmed innocent civilian." He believed it was "a crime that may be repeated up and down Al-Anbar."


  • In early 2004, senior British commanders condemned "American military tactics in Iraq as heavy-handed and disproportionate." One officer told reporters "the view of the British chain of command is that the Americans' use of violence is not proportionate and is over-responsive to the threat they are facing. They don't see the Iraqi people the way we see them. They view them as untermenschen." (The Brits have been accused of their own share of crimes in Iraq.)


  • In April of 2004, there were widespread reports -- in the foreign press -- that civilians were targeted during the "Siege of Fallujah." The Pentagon was outraged when journalists reported the number of civilians killed in the city. One report quoted Dr. Rafa Hayad al-Issawi, director of the city's main hospital, saying "the dead mostly included women, children and elderly." The Iraqi minister of health, Khudair Abbas, confirmed that U.S. forces had shot at ambulances -- in Fallujah and elsewhere -- and condemned the acts as possible war crimes. Snipers who served in Fallujah told the Los Angeles Times that "there might not have been such a 'target-rich' battlefield" since the World War II battle for Stalingrad.


  • In March, Knight-Ridder reported that senior Iraqi police officials had accused U.S. soldiers of executing 11 Iraqi civilians, including four children and a 6-month-old baby, in a raid near the city of Balad. The local police chief, Col. Farouq Hussein, said that the civilians had all been shot in the head. "It's a clear and perfect crime," he said.



Journalists like Dahr Jamail and Robert Fisk have all reported on other instances of civilians caught in the sites of American gunners. And those stories don't capture the "collateral damage" done by bombs and missiles. Jamail wrote: "while the media spotlight shines squarely on the Haditha massacre, countless atrocities continue daily, conveniently out of the awareness of the general public."

Incidents like those alleged in Haditha, Ramallah and Fallujah are entirely predictable. And while there's no excuse for the actions of the troops in Haditha -- according to military officials the atrocities were "methodically" carried out in an operation that lasted several hours -- ultimately, these crimes originated in the decision to go to war in the first place. These are, after all, members of the most highly trained military in the world who have been put into a situation where they're under constant threat in an environment where it's hard to tell the good guys from the bad. They've seen 20,000 of their buddies killed or injured, and, according to a recent poll almost 9 out of 10 soldiers think the war in Iraq is "retaliation for Saddam's role in 9/11." It's no surprise that there are itchy trigger-fingers among them.

Ultimately, after Iraq's civilian population, those troops will pay the price for this war. Paul Rockwell, who interviewed a number of U.S. soldiers who claim to have committed atrocities in Iraq for the book Ten Excellent Reasons Not To Join The Military, wrote that American troops are not only "expected to follow unlawful orders, they are also expected to bear life-long burdens of shame, guilt, and legal culpability for the arrogance of their own commanders -- who dispense life and death from an office computer."

The real moral tragedy is that while some number of soldiers may face prosecution, the real culprits won't be punished. There are just too many of them.

They include not only the Bush administration's hardliners who conjured up this war, but also the Democratic hawks that enabled them and the media that spun their glorious war narrative and convinced so many ordinary citizens to jump on board. It's the Tom Friedmans and Kenneth Pollacks and Peter Beinarts, who only realized this war was a mistake when its execution proved disastrous.

Those of us who said that the war would be hell on the Iraqis were called "pacifists" and "appeasers." The hawks got their war and now we know that it's not a video game and it's not just glowing green explosions on CNN; it's a bloody and uncontrolled mess and civilians are paying the price, as they always do.

This article has been updated to include new facts and reporting released since the article was first published.

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Joshua Holland is an AlterNet staff writer.

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Most highly trained military in the world?
Posted by: fairywearsboots on May 27, 2006 12:59 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Well, probably, concerning the use of their weapons.

"...and according to a recent poll, almost nine out of 10 believe the war in Iraq is "retaliation for Saddam's role in 9/11."

After three years of this miserable war they still believe this Bushshit? That's downright frightening, to say the very least.

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» No they don't Posted by: lawstudent08
» RE: No they don't Posted by: nbrown
The Bushies need their noses rubbed in it
Posted by: Moonray on May 27, 2006 1:07 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As a Vietnam veteran, I watched the run-up to the current war with a sickening sense of deja vu. And the premonition turned out to be all too accurate.

As bad as this latest atrocity is, it will serve some purpose if it causes more Americans to realize what is being done in their name.

But don't look to George W., Donald Rumsfeld or any other top Bushie for a display of genuine concern for the countless thousands being killed in Iraq. Bush, Rummy and the others invariably reply to such questions with a shrug, as if to say, "Well, that's the way it goes." Of course, none of them has ever heard a shot fired in anger, much less the anguished wails of a mother whose child has been killed in crossfire.

Of course, the MSM will have to be shamed by the blogosphere into covering this atrocity story even minimally. The MSM doesn't like unpleasant stories about Our Beloved Military Forces.

The really sad thing is that not just these latest murdered folks will have died in vain; it's likely that all of those killed there in the past three years died for nothing as well.

Let's not forget to remind Bush, Rummy & Co. about those deaths in the years to come.

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» A simple 'Amen' to that Posted by: Sojourner
Finally some historical context, but for the crimes of the overclass, only for those of the grunts
Posted by: cry0fan on May 27, 2006 2:23 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
typical pseudoLeft, falling in line with the overclass idea of evil as being something from the masses, as opposed to being something from the overclass.

Why not put this Iraq war in historical context with respect to how those at the top manipulated the media and public prior to the start of the war, and compare that to past wars?

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» A wise statement Posted by: jreinhart1
» RE: Another wise statement Posted by: Smiggsy
» Armchair journalist strikes again! Posted by: churchofone
day0527
Posted by: day0527 on May 27, 2006 2:28 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As one commenter has already mentioned, this incident might just let the nation know what is going on over there in the name of the American people. I am a Vietnam vet myself and was there not too far (Chu Lai) from where My Lai occurred. When they sent me over the first time, (same year as the Tet offensive) the steady beat from those in power (civilian and military alike) was "we are fighting them over there so we don't have to fight them here." (Sound familiar to the Iraq situation?) As extra warmongering, the domino theory was thrown in also. The same war mongering was going on when they sent me back a second time. Those of us old enough to remember now know how the Vietnam war started: with fabricated reasons, such as the Gulf of Tonkin incident. When we sent our guys into Iraq, the drum beat was those alleged WMDs and the alleged imminent threat, now repainted by the administration as "taking democracy to Iraq." (There go those fabrications again!) There was no mention of democracy for Iraq in the run up to the war and we now know that the WMDs and imminent threat was just an excuse to lead this nation into an unnecessary war, already costing us the lives of over 2,400 of our finest, with thousands more maimed and had their lives ruined. This war is a trumped up war, being fought simply to satisfy the egos of this excuse for a president and his underlings! Now, he has told the West Point graduates that THEY will be in control when all this mess he has created is finally resolved. I fear that unless the American people wake up and put a stop to this man's ego trip, there will be another black granite wall in Arlington!

Retired Vietnam Vet

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» RE: day0527 Posted by: feller
» RE: day0527 Posted by: day0527
» RE: day0527 Posted by: peacefulaim
» RE: day0527 Posted by: babs
There's More to This Story
Posted by: StuartH on May 27, 2006 4:09 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Even AlterNet wouldn't publish material about this until the incident that sparked this report balooned to its present state.

I happen to have designed a website for a photographer who was a combat medic in Vietnam. His experience there caused him to create a career out of documenting human situations crying out for justice. But recently he and a freelance writer from Los Angeles raised money to rescue a little girl from
the Anbar province. One little girl amidst all the carnage.

But if you read the blog from late last year carefully, what comes across is the experience in a landscape where the US military seems to be targeting residential neighborhoods and killing a lot of women and children. In the town where the little girl came from, a sniper's nest is set up on a high point and the victims are clearly visible pregnant women, children and old people as well as livestock.
http://www.documentaryphotographs.com

The whole landscape seems to be a killing field. My sense is that we need to pull out of there like yesterday.

We are not only not exactly winning the hearts and minds of the Iraqi people. We are fostering a whole generation of future terrorists whose lives will never be healed after their childhood friends were killed at a birthday party or some similarly incongruous visitation by battlefield death into childhood's happiness.

Apparently the right wing has gone insane and the media cannot face the morality questions. How can a soldier who comes back from duty as a sniper shooting innocent civilians like fish in a barrel be a normal adult? What are we doing to ourselves? What are we doing to people just like us in the Middle East?

Good Germans were those who had faith in their country and their leaders and turned their thoughts anywhere else but towards the questions they needed to ask.

Is the "Good German" syndrome what is happening here?

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» Great post. Posted by: jreinhart1
» Both great posts. Posted by: the poet
Truth or spin
Posted by: Somedaysoon on May 27, 2006 4:20 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I'm sick and tired of people calling someone a traitor because he/she has either a difference of opinion or they speak the truth. When a person tells the truth it can never hurt our cause. We are big enough to take the truth and the consequences of our actions. But for whatever reason the GOP had rather smear the messenger than deal with the truth in an honorable way. Murtha speaks from his head and heart against a political world that favors only spin. I appreciate him for standing true to the truth.

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» RE: Murtha the Truthor Posted by: cold2touch
Support the Troops?
Posted by: kooz on May 27, 2006 4:47 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Which ones? The ones who arecrazed killers who love smokin hajis? Or rabid born again Christian zealots? Or perhaps the many rapists among them? Fuck the troops. It's time to take sides.

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» RE: Support the Troops? Posted by: famouspipeliner
» RE: Support the Troops? Posted by: kooz
» RE: Support the Troops? Posted by: kryptx
» RE: Support the Troops? Posted by: FastEddy
» RE: Support the Troops? Posted by: kryptx
we never mean to kill good people
Posted by: Boronia on May 27, 2006 5:21 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Assassinations that kill and maim beyond their intended target are a CIA staple, assisted by robotic planes and false information extracted by torture. The claim, "we never mean to kill good people", no longer applies, unless you believe that babies have criminal intent. So how shall we update this mantra for the third millennium? "We only kill good people when they are in the company of a bad person and we don't want to look them in the eye". This position is openly argued by political leaders and the New York Times. In January, when a CIA strike on Damadola village in Pakistan missed an Al Qaeda fugitive and wiped out five women and five children, there was not only a lack of an official apology but a rebuke to the weeping relatives. You shouldn't hang out with bad guys. While US Senator John McCain did apologize, unlike Bush, he didn't seem to mean it, "I can't tell you that we wouldn't do the same thing again". A New York Times editorial decided the Damadola strike had been "legitimately aimed". So there you have it. A pinheaded Goliath unleashes Hellfire missiles at an impoverished village in a friendly nation, liquidates children, and is defended by moderates. It doesn't make sense. If it is "legitimate" to kill innocents, then it is legitimate for bin Laden to strike the World Trade Centre. This is absurd. Therefore the argument is false.

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» RE: So, "Opps" pretty well covers it? Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: So, "Opps" pretty well covers it? Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: well... Posted by: radnar
Okay. . .
Posted by: owleyes on May 27, 2006 7:12 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Is there any new information here? All Things Considered aired a report very similar to this article about four days ago. I though Alternet was supposed to be the place you could go to find out things the corporate media didn't want you to know. Is it true that Alternet really is only yesterday's news re-heated and dipped in pseudo-radical spin sauce?

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» I used to be an NPR fan. Posted by: Sojourner
» RE: I used to be an NPR fan. Posted by: owleyes
» RE: Okay. . . Posted by: the poet
» RE: Okay. . . Posted by: owleyes
More of the same.
Posted by: clp1024 on May 27, 2006 11:07 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"according to reports confirmed by the Pentagon, was this: A group of enraged Marines entered several homes in Haditha and murdered their occupants, including children, in cold blood"

That statement is a downright bold faced lie, the pentagon has never confirmed that the civilians were killed in cold blood. The investigation is still under way and the pentagon has never released an official comment on this incident other than "still under investigation". Since we now know the author is willing to lie to incite the Bush-haters, why would you believe anything he say from this point forward?

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» RE: More of the same. Posted by: insulafortune
» RE: More of the same...indeed! Posted by: Jonnikhan
» We did not create bin-Laden Posted by: brunowe
» RE: More of the same. Posted by: day0527
» RE: More of the same. Posted by: Brown's mule
» Lame "gotcha" attempt Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Lame "gotcha" attempt Posted by: kryptx
» RE: Lame "gotcha" attempt Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Lame "gotcha" attempt Posted by: kryptx
There is much much more beyond this story.
Posted by: jreinhart1 on May 28, 2006 6:13 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Like Vietnam, this is hardly an isolated incident. Unfortunately, StuartH is correct that blogs have been no better than the MSM on stories like this that have been flooding out of the area, from white phosphorus, cluster bombs, high levels of collateral damage from air strikes, breaking down doors and gunning down families at night, prisons filled with innocent people becoming places of a turkey shoot for American soldiers, finding dead bodies of a mixture of sunni and shi'a civilians in open pits and road side areas. With the exception of some sites outside of the US, American blogs have been almost as bad as screening this type of information from the public.

Harry Milgram (LOOK UP HIS RESEARCH) proved that Americans would make good killers as 100% of the test group followed authorities and went all the way to killing innocent people when following orders. The Stanford psychological studies showed that even people that knew each other, when one group was allowed to act as guards, would become torturers within a few weeks without any guidance to do so on people they knew that were the inmates of this test.

Americans would make great SS men and fascists and that is exactly what is happening in places of high stress, in America but especially in war. My Lia was NOT AN ISOLATED INCIDENT!

Another UGLY FACT that these blogs leave out is the creation, funding and training of US death squads. The torture and razing of entire villages and towns is nothing new to US covert activities.

I find that the most disgusting part of this whole incident is that the American people are surprised! America cannot be a legitimate representative republic based on democratic ideals if the people are uninformed. To say that the US is anywhere near the country that we think we are is absurd, considering that Americans have lived in an information vacuum for the last 115 years which is reaching ever greater highs of propaganda the greater the technology becomes to inform. Our history is one of propaganda that would make Joseph Goebbels proud. Ironically, the CIA was created around the German propaganda machine and the people that the US snuck out of Germany to help create our NSA and CIA covert operations such as Klaus Barbie. Speaking of which, the US runs the majority of the distribution and money laundering of drug money around the world. For more information, read about Ralph McGehee and his CIABase of American activities abroad on his 25 years with the CIA and death squads and drug protection and distribution, or Katheran Austin Fits of Solari investments and her experience with the dark side of destroying our own communities to pad 401Ks through the drug trade. Sibel Edmonds has to keep quiet about just how bad the flow of money has become from illegal sources and the willingness of covert operations to get it.

Incredibly, the BBC has many documentaries on our behavior such as the four part documentary of US propaganda since WWI; Happiness Machines, The Engineering of Consent, There is a Policeman Inside All Our Heads, and Eight People Sipping Wine in Kettering. This is just one of hundreds of films and documentaries of American activities of which less than a dozen are from the US.

Tell’em what they want to hear is the motto of almost every thing in the US anymore. Packaged products as a result of focus groups and are little more than reinforcement for good behavior. People “choose” the products which they are nothing more than a target market for including our “leadership”. Many Americans are living a life of slogans, cliches and talking points that have been created just for them. From TV ads for children to political ads for voters, it’s much all the same.

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Think about it
Posted by: ghoster on May 28, 2006 6:49 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Well, if you step back from over hyping this and look at it, these kids are taken away from familiar environment, stripped and exercised till they don't think then they are taught to "Kill" and Kill again. Bond with your squad mates, and when one gets killed it is a loss, a heart rending loss. No what? It is predictable. When we returned from VN there was no camaraderie here, you never contacted your "buddies" you never told anyone you were a vet, not if you wanted a job. Just seems that you never got one if you mentioned it. This war, if you want to call it that, is just one more in a series of conflicts that the oligarchs want stupid, desperate people to fight for their resources.

What choices do these kids have in reality? College funds, what a load of crap, how many actually get to college after something like this? Nope, continuing to do the same thing, is going to get you the same outcome, time after time. 90% believe that they are fighting for something that happened to us on 9/11? Yeh, there is intelligent critical thinking. If you want to get scared, imagine that the high school down the street issued machine guns to those kids and told them to go out and patrol the area around the school. What do you think would happen? In the service they learn how to clean, care for their weapons. And use them against anyone in front of them that threatens them. Their goal is to get their ass home in one piece, and their buddies too. Nothing more, not defending freedom or any other BS that is sold to the american dumbasses watching the tube daily. Nope, dumbed down, and run on down to sign up for the tour of Iraq, coming soon Iran on the list. Get rid of all incumbents in Nov, and we might have a chance. Otherwise saddle up and get your war gear, this is going to last a long time.

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Check out the history of Lt. Calley to see that he eventually got an honorable discharge.
Posted by: Sojourner on May 28, 2006 7:37 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
At the first trial, he was sentenced and punished. The first appeal, during which he was incarcerated, lifted the deprivation of funds, etc. The second appeal, during which he was not incarcerated, sent him home for time-served with an honorable discharge.

Once people stop paying attention, the military takes care of its own. It's the same in all bureaucracies.

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Our Collective RESPONSE
Posted by: queerpower.blogspot.com on May 28, 2006 8:59 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We have gone through this before!

Abu Ghraib, as mentioned in the article, was a previous incident which the U.S. government minimized as an "isolated incident".

Our cowardly corporate media decided to take the administration's stance word for word. One only hopes that now with dangerously low approval ratings across the board for Republicans, the media will be a bit more challenging.

For some reason, I'm not too encouraged that they will be more challenging. If not the mainstream media, the blogosphere must serve as an inadequate substitute. Let's face it, blogs have not replaced the media.

How can we exact pressure on media companies to become more independent and critical? That is the question beyond this current crisis, and it is a question that absolutely must be addressed.

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An email I sent to friends and family
Posted by: TDyl on May 28, 2006 9:34 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Yup, OK, they're "only" soldiers without a unifying command or even a good reason to be there, but that does not, can never and bloody well does not give them any damn right whatsoever to abandon their humanity and go ape.
If all these worthless specimens get is the loss of a rank/stripe, several months in gaol and then multi-million dollar book and movie deals then I guess I will give up any hope I had for the future of our planet. We only have "enemies" because our politicians can't get on - we are all the same species for God's sake. Only several thousand people actually run the planet while the remaining 6 billion of us just want to try and get on with life without being trampled on by the pillocks that think they know what to do. We have seen them kow-tow to "big business" and start a chain reaction that may, according to James Lovelock, kill almost 85% of the population by the end of this century. It IS time to end this madness. I don't think Galloway was right when he was asked by a journalist about whether or not it would morally justifiable to assassinate bliar (sorry, Blair, for those of you not used to my emails); what is morally unjustifiable is NOT assassinating bliar and shrubbie.
I've run out of steam now. These issues get me so mad that all I really feel left able to do is commit gross acts of violence upon those that seek to control and manipulate us in the name of their "greater good" ideas/ideals; when that happens I just reach a point where words no longer make any sense and I want to lash out.
Thank you for listening. Rant ends.
Chris/TDyl

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» Part 1 Posted by: dave236412
» Part 2 Posted by: dave236412
"SUCKER BAIT " FOR GEORGE W. BUSH
Posted by: SALLY EVANS on May 28, 2006 2:25 PM   
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Our military use to serve an honorable profession before the stealth of the 2000 election by the fascist crooks of the "right". Now they are no more than sucker bait for Bush who delights in his blood-thirsty escapades! Anybody care to tell me that Bush is pro-life? That's just another of Bush's filthy LIES!

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» posh on the people Posted by: feller
sigh.
Posted by: Erik1968 on May 28, 2006 2:29 PM   
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We're not getting within 100 miles of the truth.

Anyone who believes that only 600 people were killed in Fallujah, a city of 200,000 that was reduced to rubble, is insane.

And that's the "truth" we're celebrating getting out. Wonderful.

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» RE: sigh. Posted by: Erik1968
» RE: sigh. Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: sigh: we should have nuked em Posted by: Joshua Holland
Moral relativism
Posted by: dave236412 on May 28, 2006 3:44 PM   
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I think we need to co-opt some of the language of the right, specifically "moral values" and rage against "moral relativism." It's moral relativism to say, "it's wrong when they do it, it's right when we do it." It's moral relativism to dismiss moral outrage against these atrocities as merely coming from "liberals," and therefore invalid. We should pick up on the idea of "political correctness." It's political correctness to say, "to criticize the military, means you don't support the troops," or that "to criticize American foreign policy, means you hate America," or that "to criticize Christian fundamentalism, makes you anti-Christian," or that "to talk of poverty and class, is class warfare or Communism." Today, to maintain that compassion is a virtue, that peace and justice are ideals, earns you contempt and ridicule.

Every American soldier or marine involved in these crimes is personally responsible. It doesn't matter that they were acting on orders, or that they were not responsible for being sent to Iraq in the first place, or that they were misinformed. You have an obligation to disobey orders that are unlawful and immoral. You have an obligation to inform yourself as well as possible. If we don't hold individuals accountable for their actions, we will create a culture of impunity. That being said, Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice, and the rest of the gang need also be held accountable. There are domestic laws under which they can be charged and receive a severe penalty, and they ought to. And the rest of the American people ought to acknowledge their complicity, and feel a sense of shame and humility.

"The worst crimes were dared by a few, willed by more and tolerated by all." - Tacitus

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Guilty! Guilty! Guilty!
Posted by: Tom Degan on May 29, 2006 12:53 AM   
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It was bad enough that so many (although not most) people voted for a disgusting, incompetent, deranged, half-witted little piece of shit named George W. Bush in 2000. The very fact that alot of these same (although, again, not most) people repeated the sin four years later - yes, a vote for Bush was a sin against God - is difficult to comprehend.

The 2000 vote can be attributed to ingnorance. By 2004 it was obvious to anyone with half a brain where this this maniacal little Hitler-wannabe was going. If you voted for Bush the second time around, you are as guilty as he is for the war crimes that are now being visited down, in your name, without a shred of mercy, apon the men, women and little children of Iraq. You could have put a stop to it but you insisted on being a good little German...I mean, American.

One of my greatest fears is going to hell. I've tried to be a good human being, a good Christian and a good Catholic all of my life but in some respects I have failed. And yet I beleve that on judgement day I will at least be secure in knowing that, when it really counted, I refused to have anything to do with the corrupt and muderous agenda of the "selected" officials of my country and that I did everything humanly possible to stop it.

Pray for peace - like your life depended on it because just maybe it does.

Tom Degan
Goshen, NY
tomdegan@frontiernet.net

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When soldiers behave in this way...
Posted by: Nigelthebriton on May 29, 2006 1:50 AM   
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...it's only a question of time before they turn their guns on their own people. I believe it'll happen in the UK too.

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Most Highly Trained Military?
Posted by: American Reflections on May 29, 2006 7:58 AM   
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None of this is to suggest that U.S. troops are a bunch of bloodthirsty maniacs. These are America's sons and daughters, members of the most highly trained military in the world. They've been put into a situation where they're under constant threat in a country where it's hard to tell the good guys from the bad.

American troops can't tell the good guys from the bad? They perceive a six month old infant as a threat?

And this is the most "highly trained" military in the world? Trained for WHAT? To kill anything that moves? Women, children, the elderly, even livestock?

Part of the tragedy of this illegal war in Iraq is that good soldiers, decent men and women who would never fire a gun at an unarmed citizen, much less a child, will carry with them the shame of those murderous few who allow themselves to rampage through a country and murder at will simply because they can. And so will the rest of us.

With apologies to whoever wrote the following, whose name I don't remember, who said in "A Message to America:"

"You have the grit and the guts, I know,
You are ready to anwer blow for blow,
You are virile, combative, stubborn, hard,
But your honor ends with your own backyard;
Each man intent on his private goal,
You have no feeling for the whole;
What singly none would tolerate
You let unpunished hit the state,
Unmindful that each man must share
The stain he lets his country wear.

That is a harsh indictment, but can we deny it? And if we can't, God help us.

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Killing floor blues
Posted by: thoughtcriminal on May 29, 2006 10:53 AM   
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Here is a story for you: When the Germans invaded Greece, there was an incident where two German soldiers were killed by Greek resistance fighters. The Germans lined up then next fifty civilians who walked down the road, men women and children. I always viewed this as the example of the kind of atrocity that invading and occupying a country will result in. And you know what? - for the first time, I feel sorry for those German soldiers.

The numbers are eerily similar in Iraq: one dead soldier, 24 dead civilians. This is what happens when you invade and occupy a country - when you think you are going to use the military as the local cops. Policing a community and engaging the enemy are very different activities, as anyone but a ranking idiot would know. The military PR team is run by Rumsfeld - no guesses there. He has adjuncts , like the above quote: Duncan Hunter, R-Calif: "I don't want the actions of one squad in one city on one morning to be used to symbolize or characterize or tar the actions of our great troops," he said. This is an attempt to frame the issue - really, Bush is to blame, not the troops.

The only solution is to get the military out of Iraq in a series of staggered withdrawals. The National Guard should be taken out first. Murtha has the right idea. He's also right about the reasons for the slaughter - 18 year old troops under pressure are likely to respond this way. This isn't the only incident by far, Isahaqi Film Link shows another one... probably.

Meanwhile, life goes on in the American dreamland as ever - SUVs roll down the roads, shoppers run around Home Depot and Walmart, and the soldiers return to this weird Disneyland - looking around through changed eyes, struggling with massive 'cognitive dissonance'... no ticker tape parades, just a vast silence, an avoidance, a desire 'not to know' on the part of their families and friends. Smiling soccer moms thanking them for their 'services'... yeah.

"oh man - the shit piled up so fast in Vietnam you needed wings to stay above it" - Apocalypse Now.

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IRAKI MASSACRES AND FULL-SPECTRUM WAR
Posted by: MagmaReport on May 29, 2006 11:17 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The massive televisual diffusion of the massacres of innocent Iraqi civilians--"worse than Abu Ghraib"--and of the ensuing cover-up, will be threatening the will to win the Iraq War like nothing else before, because TV diffusion of violent images has the power to neutralize the legitimacy of the US government and its Army.

The military post-Cold War doctrine, post-MAD, is called `full-spectrum force'. And Bush's wars are so closely linked to the functioning of the mass-media that TV must be considered to belong to the `full-spectrum' of military force. On the far end of the spectrum of force is full-scale warfare, including massive invasion and the tactical use of WMDs.
In the middle of the new power spectrum are policing and peace-keeping operations.
At the opposite end from full-scale invasion is permanent surveillance.
The question is: Since TV is part of the full-spectrum force, how will the Military use it in order to neutralize to disastrous effect of the massacres' images?

Read more on the http://MagmaReport.Net

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War is Hell. Love is Heaven!
Posted by: Betsy L. Angert on May 29, 2006 9:32 PM   
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Dear Joshua Holland . . .

I thank you for writing of a topic I find quite troubling. Just as you say here, there is so much more to this story. The name-calling we are witnessing is sadly, conventional, as is war. For me, what would be novel is a worldwide promoting of peace. While I do not [yet] have the power or influence to offer that, I will bestow my missive on the topic.

In this treatise, I draw no conclusion other than a desire for peace. I invite you and your readers to reflect and reply to the dilemma this revelation presents.
MARINES KILL INNOCENT IRAQI FAMILY. VERDICT “NOT GUILTY”? ©


May your life be full and fulfilling. May [spiritual, emotional, intellectual, and conjointly physical] abundance be yours . . . Betsy
Be-Think

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all the atrocities
Posted by: rsaxto on May 30, 2006 4:51 AM   
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If all the atrocities commited by US forces in Iraq were made public then even the Bushies would be forced to withdraw all US forces from from Iraq. The Iraq war would be over and soon. If all the atrocities commited by US forces in all countries for all past time were made public, the US would be forced to remove all troups from all of its foreign bases and close all of its foreign bases and stop all its insane and counterproductive wars of aggression for all time and become a decent nation with decent leadership.

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2 Points: 1. Media leaders should be tried as War criminals, and 2.
Posted by: Prophit on May 30, 2006 6:44 AM   
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Military trained personnel should NEVER be used for occupation. They are not trained for that task.

Having said that, I believe the day will come and I have written the editors of the NY Times to tell them , that Nuremberg type trials will be held where they must be tried for their part in "Crimes against Humanity" and tried for treason against the American people.

Those are the things we need to begin to say loud and clear and to act in accordance with that idea. The commanders in the Military who have sent these troops to 'occupy' civilian populations should also be tried and hung for their part in all of this.

Those are my two goals. The political slimes who created this should also see the gallows as well. KICK OUT ALL INCUMBANTS AND LET THE TRIALS BEGIN.

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» La Guillotine a la gauche Posted by: feller
What do you expect?
Posted by: pheephee on May 30, 2006 7:59 AM   
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As a survivor of the Vietnam era, I am wondering where the memory of that war is in the collective memory of this country.

War is hell, stress, and will result in events such as this when humans are sent into chaos over and over again. It was true in Vietnam and it is true in Iraq.

What will it take for the American people to finally stand up and tell the fascist who are in power that we have had enough? Your wages are not moving, the middle class is being eliminated, the dollar is falling, we have no international credibility, and we are committing war crimes against a population that happen to live on top of the oil we want for our oversized SUV's. So, what will it take?

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» Whoa... dude... Posted by: CanuckKid
War is Hell or should be
Posted by: solrev on May 30, 2006 10:26 AM   
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It surprises me that so many people sound like they did not expect atrocities to happen in Iraq. In the past, present, and future emotional men with guns will kill people. That is who we are, maybe another thousand years of evolution will change who we are. It dose not take a Nam or Iraq either, remember four dead in Ohio. I was in the Nam so I feel sorry for the troops in Iraq. Thirty days in country being a target, they just want to get even with somebody. Unfortunately, it might be an Iraqi child. At least us draftees in the Nam fraged the right people. Again, there will not be any John Wayne or Audy Murphy types coming home from Iraq. Just a bunch of disillusion soldiers with head problems will return. I have been there and done that, so some innocent civilians being killed, just does not seem like an atrocity to me. That is what war will always be like. At least there was some pissed off soldier getting even for something, someone too at least feel bad in the future. The real atrocities are those smart bombs. They blow up a restaurant and a couple of neighboring buildings, kill hundreds of men women and children. No one feels bad about it. They just say dam Soddam was not there. The atrocities of war should be personal.

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War is sanctioned murder
Posted by: hotlipsin61 on May 30, 2006 11:41 AM   
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You've heard this story before: soldiers seeking revenge of a fellow comrade killed in action.
Nearly every war has featured some kind of massacre of civilians, such as Leningrad, Vietnam, Crecy, Lidice, Czechoslovakia, the Crusades, etc. and the story line's the same: unarmed civilans are blown away.
It's no surprise, then, that American troops have committed atrocities in Iraq. So what ever happened to all those embedded reporters? See what happened after they all left?
The killing is easy because American troops can't distinguish between an "insurgent" and a civilian. The enemy isn't wearing a uniform.
As long as the world continues to wage war we will hear of these stories until we get sick of the killing. Diplomacy is a lost art long forgotten in American foreign policy. War is the American Way now.

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» RE: War is sanctioned murder Posted by: CanuckKid
WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU AMERICANS!!!??????
Posted by: newf on May 30, 2006 12:51 PM   
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I'M SICKENED BY THIS STORY. I know that the audience of Alternet is most likely sickened by it to.

But there is something wrong with your nation. If you have children - how can you not empathize with the grief caused by these murders described? I can't even write the words...

YOU live in the Evil Empire. You live amongst evildoers. Put a stop to these atrocities - PLEASE DO SOMETHING!

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WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU AMERICANS!!!??????
Posted by: newf on May 30, 2006 12:51 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I'M SICKENED BY THIS STORY. I know that the audience of Alternet is most likely sickened by it to.

But there is something wrong with your nation. If you have children - how can you not empathize with the grief caused by these murders described? I can't even write the words...

YOU live in the Evil Empire. You live amongst evildoers. Put a stop to these atrocities - PLEASE DO SOMETHING!

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» RE: WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU WIMP? Posted by: Aussie Kim
» Canadians will kick ass too Posted by: feller
» hey newf Posted by: Michelle
» RE: hey newf Posted by: newf
» RE: WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU WIMP? Posted by: famouspipeliner
» you are so full of luuuuuv Posted by: feller
» RE: Get help. . . Posted by: peacefulaim
MASSACRES OF CIVILIANS AND FULL-SPECTRUM WAR
Posted by: MagmaReport on May 30, 2006 1:13 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
MASSACRES OF CIVILIANS AND FULL-SPECTRUM WAR

The massive broadcasting of the massacres of innocent Iraqi civilians--"worse than Abu Ghraib"--and of the ensuing cover-up, will threaten the will to win the Iraq War like nothing else before, because TV diffusion of violent images has the power to neutralize the legitimacy of the US government and its Army.
The military post-Cold War doctrine, post-MAD, is called 'full-spectrum force'. After the Cold War, the explicit aim of the US government mentioned in documents on foreign and military policy is 'domination.'
And Bush's wars are so closely linked to the functioning of the mass-media that TV must be considered part of the 'full-spectrum' of military force. On the far end of the spectrum of force is full-scale warfare, including massive invasion and the tactical use of WMDs.
In the middle of the new power spectrum are policing and peace-keeping operations.
At the opposite end from full-scale invasion is permanent surveillance.
Now my question is: Since TV is part of the full-spectrum force, how will the Military use it to neutralize the disastrous effect of the massacres' images?

More on the MagMa Report

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Our Glorious Commander-in-Chief
Posted by: Jersey Devil on May 30, 2006 5:34 PM   
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If George W. Bush can use being the Commander-in-Chief to justify his actions of spying on Americans, Gitmo, Abu Grab, Rendition, torture, and now Marine Death Squads - then he must bear responsibility for these actions and should be tried for the many War Crimes he has ordered. There is no way to have the glory without the responsibility that a Commander of forces has when he sends his forces to attack an innocent country. The entire Bush Administration should be hauled in front of an International Tribunal - preferably in Nuremberg Germany and tried for their War Crimes.

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Joshua Holland is a liar
Posted by: sidewinder on May 30, 2006 8:45 PM   
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This "story" may eventually turn out to be true but, as of this date, an investigation has not been completed. This is about par for the course for this site.

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» You are an ass ... Posted by: Joshua Holland
Ain't this terrorism?
Posted by: Stardust on May 30, 2006 10:55 PM   
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The way I figure, the killing of civilians in cold blood is a case of terrorism. American Marines are guilty of this crime and anybody who aids them in their flight from justice is also accessory and should be imprisoned for this reason.

I truly wonder what would happen if America judged her actions with the same yardstick that she judges Iraqi insurgents, Taliban nutcases and the like? I figure that Georgie would probably be in the dock next to Saddam.

Maybe they could share a cell. Cause Saddam was an actual soldier (didn't go AWOL) I figure he a better scrapper. George would probably be his b**ch , if you know what I mean.

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» No, it ain't Posted by: feller
» RE: No, it ain't Posted by: Aussie Kim
» RE: No, it ain't Posted by: Stardust
» Clean Up, Shape UP Posted by: feller
» RE: Clean Up, Shape UP Posted by: Stardust
» RE: Clean Up, Shape UP Posted by: peacefulaim
We Own This!
Posted by: yellow on May 31, 2006 12:21 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The horrendous massacre at Haditha goes to the very heart of who we are as a nation! Far from an isolated incident perpetrated by a stressed out group of "bad apples", the occurance is the expression of US racist and murderous attitudes which were carefully prepared since 9/11 by the consolidated corporate media propagandists and a failed and immoral leadership who deliberately associated anyone east of the Suez Canal with terrorist images using various kinds of subliminal code and often outright racist stereotypes. After 9/11 gave the neo-cons the excuse they sought to attack the Gulf's Oil fields Rumsfeld was heard to say, "sweep it all up, go massive" as a way of telling the media to conflate 9/11 with ALL Muslims in an endeavor to whip up mindless war hysteria against anyone designated an enemy by the neo-cons. The hysteria is why there can be no thoughtful and reflective debate on this topic. The crimes at Abu Ghraib were the result of the highest US authorities telling the troops that breaking the law is OK and that the international law and international conventions to which have long been signatories no longer have a place in US codes of conduct despite US civil and military law being awash in prohibitions against such violations. General Sanchez condemned the Geneva Conventions as "quaint" and irrelavent. So did General Karpinski, the commandante of the Abu Ghraib prison. Bush, Cheney, and Rumsfled repeatedly approved the use of torture in public and private. One Bush Administration official scowled, "I don't ever want to hear the term International law!" The message to our troops--there are no individuals, only good nations against evil ones, hence you can "take the gloves off." The BBC caught on tape female US soldiers torturing innocent Iraqi internees with one carving the word "Rapist" into the forehead of one internee presumably in retribution for the alleged assault on Jessica Lynch. That the female soldier in question couldn't even correctly spell a simple word like rapist much less know if the individual she was torturing was in fact guilty of being one, is testimony to far more than her being simple minded, brutal white trash. It is a sorry picture of a huge and ignorant swath of America and what we have sunk to as a nation! So to has the massacre at Fallujah in November of 2004 and now the one at Haditha last November an indication of years of intense racist agitation by respected authority and exhortation to our troops to commit mindless murder. Our behavior also reflects on the brutal inequality in US society. The lack of compassion and caring toward an increasing number of working poor, elderly, infirm, and others is consistent with our foreign policy's reflection of our brutalization. Surely a country that spends trillions for war and military buildup and nothing at the federal level on a universal single payer health care system, even when all it would cost is the exact amount of the money now wasted in duplicate administrative costs, is a country that is so inhumane that it should not count itself among the civilized world. Surely a country where the income ratio of the lowest paid worker to the highest CEO is nearing a factor of 500 while in our much more successful allies' societies the ratio is often a third or less, is a country that is so morally bankrupt and incapable of world leadership that the only thing decent left for it to do is stand down and allow the international community to take the reigns in international affairs. Surely a country where many working people can't adequately feed their families that harbors leaders who want to eliminate the minimum wage (which hasn't increased in ten years) and overtime pay for the millions of working poor, is so far removed from civilized norms as to be justifiably pariahized. Like Natalie Maines I am deeply ashamed of my country, my president, my society. All I can really feel these days is profound shame!

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» Buy a Style Book Posted by: feller
Whoa Nelly! The ACLU types are now real ornery string-em-up guys!
Posted by: feller on May 31, 2006 10:29 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The discussion will be a an amusing reminder of the hypocrisy of liberal ACLU types the next time some thug kills a cop and claims "political" defense. Let's see the leftist outrage about murder and out of control killers then.

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truth is spelled t r u t h
Posted by: ravin on May 31, 2006 4:11 PM   
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to set the record straight...before this incident if one goes back to sept `05 (not sure it could of been june of `05) when there were just reports of how haditha was a 'stronghold' of terrorists...there was a report of 2 3-man sniper teams that were found dead by haditha (they were sent to haditha their mission was unclear)...story was that military intel believed that they were ambushed by iraqi civilians dressed as iraqi soldiers...my question back was...was there a note pinned on their chest or did they ask the dead bodies???...with that said...it was inevitable that iraqi civilians were going to be blamed for something that they had nothing to do with...talk to u later!!!

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THE MARINE CORPS, “HONORABLE PEOPLE” KILL HADITHA FAMILIES ©
Posted by: Betsy L. Angert on May 31, 2006 8:17 PM   
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Dear Joshua Holland . . .

I too have updated my missive; actually, I penned another that might be of interest to you and your readers.
THE MARINE CORPS, “HONORABLE PEOPLE” KILL HADITHA FAMILIES ©

In my first treatise on the topic, I drew no conclusions. I only offered my desire for peace. I invite you and your readers to reflect and respond to either. This is a growing dilemma.
MARINES KILL INNOCENT IRAQI FAMILY. VERDICT “NOT GUILTY”? ©

May your life be full and fulfilling. May [spiritual, emotional, intellectual, and conjointly physical] abundance be yours . . . Betsy
Be-Think

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Perhaps we are witnessing a systematic policy
Posted by: tmwright on Jun 1, 2006 11:26 AM   
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I was in the military during Vietnam and I well remember the establishment of free fire zones where US forces were greenlighted to basically shoot anything that moves. The message was support the Viet Cong and face the wrath of the US military.

It is just now come out that the killing of the villagers under the bridge during the Korean war was not an isolated incident but rather official policy.

Perhaps something similar is manifesting in Iraq. The killing of civilians sends a message that cooperating with the insurgents comes with a terrible price. These people in all likelihood knew who set the roadside bomb and could have warned the marines. Of course, if they did warn the marines, they probably would be targeted by the insurgents. Seems like Iraqi civilians are caught between a rock and a hard place.

A lot of our soldiers are going to come back from this war haunted by what they saw or did -- not unlike Vietnam.

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thorlives
Posted by: thorlives on Jun 1, 2006 5:11 PM   
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Things like this always happen when you don't have enough boots on the ground and the "enemy" wears no uniforms.It happened in Russia, it happened in 'Nam and it will continue to happen in Iraq.

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Iraqi Prime Minister Confirms Ongoing Atrocities
Posted by: ZPaul on Jun 2, 2006 2:01 AM   
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You know things are bad when the guy the Bush Adminstration hoped would be docile and follow Washington´s instructions, says enough is enough. The Prime Minister of Iraq has just stated(you can read about it in the NYTimes) that U.S. troops are killing civilians every day, whether shooting them, running them over with their vehicles, etc. with an utter disdain for the lives of innocent Iraqi men, women, and children.

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» Haditha is It Posted by: feller
The Barbarians have arrived!
Posted by: Zemiti on Jun 2, 2006 5:55 AM   
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This dastardly and barbaric act only underlines the whole ethos of the US government. The New Barbarians have arrived! I suppose we should all run for cover and bunker down from the threat within now, who knows what lies in wait for us? Remember, tyranny and fascism breed where the populace has been paralysed into silence or has been co-opted into feeling cosy about the reign of terror their governments get up to. For the victims, it is a constant dogs day funeral. Makes mean mister mustard suddenly look appealing and cosy, not?

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Estoborian
Posted by: Estoborian on Jun 2, 2006 3:44 PM   
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They are sending specialists to Iraq to 'counsel' those who have committed the massacres. I can imagine what they will tell them 'You must not kill in cold blood an old blind man in a wheel chair" "Babies of 1 to 5 are also taboo" "o.k. boys?" "Oh, and also, no killing in cold blood of a Pregnant mother holding the hand of a 4 year-old' and 'whatever you do don't kill any Grandmas." "If you have any problem with that the only answer is to desert like the other 8,000 of your comrades who had no stomach for massacres."
What do they expect of a human being who is on his third posting to Iraq? The U.S. is going to have to leave Iraq eventually in total defeat. They should pull out now and save any more massacres of this nature. Where is the outrage in the U.S? Where are all the holier than thou Democrats, like Hillary Clinton who still think the war in Iraq is 'winnable.'?Give me a Break!

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Bil
Posted by: Bil on Dec 31, 2006 9:17 PM   
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new1
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