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Immigration Reform in Living Color

By Marc Cooper, AlterNet. Posted March 27, 2006.


The half-million protesters who flooded Los Angeles this weekend are a glaring sign that Washington needs a rational immigration policy -- not more walls and fences.
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massive immigration protest

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(Editor's Note: this is a slightly edited version of a story originally posted Sunday on MarcCooper.com.)

Saturday saw the largest political demonstration in the history of Los Angeles, and one of the biggest in recent American history.

A half-million people or more flooded two dozen blocks of downtown L.A. to give voice to some sort of rational, realistic immigration reform.

For some months now I have been warning readers that the immigration issue would break wide open this season -- and here it is in full, living color. Similar demonstrations the past couple of weeks drew 100,000 or more in Illinois, more than that in Denver, and tens of thousands in Phoenix and other cities. Similar protests are scheduled through April 10 as the U.S. Senate begins formal debate on reform this coming Tuesday. (If you have fallen behind in this story, you can catch up by reading one of my overview stories here or here.)

I'm struck by several aspects of this story. Primarily by the way neither party can properly get a hold of this issue. Demographics and global economics are simply racing ahead of any practical political response. The Republicans are deeply divided over the issue. Even as the half-million or so were marching in the streets Saturday, President Bush was on the radio more or less endorsing the protestors' two key demands: that a legal channel be created for the immigration already happening, and that some legal acknowledgement be given to the 12 million "illegals" already living here. Viva Bush!

The Democrats are less divided and generally more inclined toward reform. But can you name even two prominent national Democrats who have taken up this cause in a serious way? (One is Ted Kennedy who, along with John McCain, has co-authored the most sensible reform proposal currently under consideration).

As I have argued previously, what we are currently experiencing is the greatest wave of cross-border migration in recorded history -- a virtual "exodus" of millions from a failed Mexican economy to a country where the wage level is 10-20 times higher. Politicians can only come up with after-the-fact gestures, but policy itself (and walls and fences) will do little to nothing to alter the flow.

My otherwise smart guy friends, Mickey Kaus and Bill Bradley have surely gone off the deep end on this one. They both conjecture that these giant marches, full of Mexican flags and Mexicans chanting 'Mexico! Mexico!' are inviting a virulent nativist backlash. They point to increased voter turnout in favor of the restrictive Prop 187 in California after a similar (and smaller) protest march in 1994. That was then. This is now.

The current situation is not analagous to 1994. There is no hot-button ballot proposition up for a vote this season. And the nativist backlash is already here. The media suck-up to the miniscule Minuteman show of a year ago established an ugly frame for the national debate. The House has already acted in a toxic manner when last December it passed an outrageous and impossible-to-implement measure that would make all illegals (and their employers) into felons. While that bill will not become law per se, the Senate is considering some measures almost as Neanderthal.

It seems to me that when an entire population -- who, after all, cleans our offices, cuts our lawns, serves our food, makes our beds, tends to our children and pays taxes but gets no refunds -- is threatened with criminalization, it has the right and necessity to politically mobilize. It's asking them a lot, don't you think, to remain silent and impassive as their arrest and deportation are actively being debated?

One other point: the white backlash of 1994 was immediately followed by a counter-backlash. An enraged and energized Latino constituency accelerated its entrance into citizenship and onto the voter rolls, and within four years it steamrollered the California GOP -- a flattening from which California Republicans may never recover.

So while the grumbling Archie Bunkers might get their ya-yas all worked up by the Mexican flags flapping in Saturday's demos, you can be damn sure that the smarter among Republican strategists looked at the size of those protests with some trepidation. Many of those in the rally were legal, or have legal relatives, or if illegal might soon be legal. And they just didn't look to be likely Republican voters.


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Marc Cooper is a contributing editor to The Nation and maintains a blog at MarcCooper.com.

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This is a good argument
Posted by: HawkSpirit on Mar 27, 2006 1:07 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This weekend posts on AlterNet shows how explosive this issue really is. As the author says there is not easy way to get a handle this issue. People of Color number more than WASPs in many states. This force an be used to change Washington ruling party to also rans. I have no idea on how to change things other than the old fashion mediation process. We did that in the 60s and 70s and it is time to start working towards that end now. No one person has the answers to this question and it will take time to hammer out the right laws to cope with this explosion of energy demanding the attention of our law makers.

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» RE: This is a good argument Posted by: Aussie Kim
It's Time for a REVOLUTION
Posted by: thinkverybig on Mar 27, 2006 1:15 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The immigrant uprising, fair and decent wages to live, corporate abuse of illegal immigrants, failures by the United States government to enforce laws sooner resulting in the present chaos, corporations paying CEO's 2500 times more than the average worker, the government allowing monopolies therefore creating systems where the few control more and so on, unfairness in our justice system where the majority is of one race or those who are poor, unfair trade practices or no trade at all with nations of color, ignoring poverty in the U.S and worldwide, neglect of our own poor and middle class for the benefit of big business, politicians being bought out by lobbyists and corporations, politicians giving themselves pay raises while millions are without jobs and 45 million plus are without healthcare, lack of compassion and help for poor nations worldwide, failure to institute campaign finance reform, government corruption, outsourcing of american jobs and more are reasons America is in need of a revolution. It's time for a change in our political, social, and judicial systems in this country.

With so many other important issues we could be addressing, we choose to invade two other countries, spend over 350 billion in tax payers money, and be responsible for over 2500 U.S. Soldiers lives not counting those who are injured emotionally and physically. And also the tens of thousands of Iraqis and Afghans we have killed and scarred for life. Where are our priorities or is it all about the money.... not the people. It's time for a CHANGE and the sooner the better folks... It's time for a REVOLUTION.

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» RE: It's Time for a REVOLUTION Posted by: oldman52
» RE: It's Time for a REVOLUTION Posted by: YogiBear
a sign
Posted by: rsaxto on Mar 27, 2006 4:40 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This wonderful outpouring of people power shows us the way to get the impeachment we so richly deserve. If we could get this many people out for the impeachment movement, the Bushies could be kicked out for sure and soon for their many blatant criminal acts. With Bushies gone we would have a shot at creating a real people power society.

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» RE: a sign Posted by: patvic1405
"I'm not going to take it any more!"
Posted by: JPHickey on Mar 27, 2006 4:52 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I'd rather be an Archie Bunker than an limo liberal like Marc Cooper. He apparently doesn't give a fig about the Americans who are already poor and underpaid. What matters to him is the convenience of cheap servile labor cleaning his office. Perhaps this country would be a better place to live if people like him cleaned their ofwn officess.

Perhaps these massive demonstrations do serve an important purpose, which is that the United States has passed its prime and the sumg employers welcome the cheap amenable and endlessly explitable labor force. This is a flase ecnomoy in my opinion.

Rationalizing the sacrifice of our nation's autonomy and self-respect as a stepping stone to international competitiveness is another slippery slope. All things considered, the United States is over the hill and sliding down fast. Heads we lose, tails we lose. Who is winning? The thrid world, China, India, and Mexico. Who'se losing? You guess.

I'll tell you who, the international corporate elite that already has the upper hand here.

Mr. Cooper can you stop your slot-machine brain long enough to imagine what the business people would do if this country was isolated like Australia? Indeed, in Australia the penality for illegal aliens is a $10,000 fine and instant deportation.

At least Australians can concentrate on the quality-of-life and well-being of their legal citizens, which is what we should be doing in the U.S. Without the easy solution of cheap, illegal alien labor, our busineses would have to give up their dictatorial management style and restore Constitutional rights to workers.

Workers would be empowered, and the time spent working would meaningful and worthwhile to the worker as well as the employer. Check out "Here’s an Idea: Let Everyone Have Ideas" in yesterday's New York Times.

Our future must be built by means of our legal citizens and their ample capabilities. Of course creating an ever-expanding class of exploitable labor is the easy way out. Really doing a better job of being Americans is more challenging because it requires a paradigm shift. Perhaps people like Marc Cooper and President Bush are just too wrapped up in substantiating theor own predominating position rather than truly identifying with "We the people"!

I just say no to the status quo mentality of effete and supercilious people like Marc Cooper! Like Archie Bunker, at least I have enough balls to stand up and shout "I'm not going to take it any more"!

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» No habla-can't get work Posted by: plantland
» Mexico got it from... Posted by: brunowe
» RE: Mexico got it from... Posted by: YogiBear
Rose Colored Glasses
Posted by: dlf on Mar 27, 2006 5:13 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I think the writer is far too optimistic about the results of the marches. I agree with her friends, that Americans who have been in denial about the extent of the problem, will look at the pictures and wonder how can this government really prevent another terrorist attack. And Americans are tired of paying for government and getting bupkus. We have third tier bureaucrats okaying port deals, that even the President doesn't know about. There is a very real sense of who's minding the store? And part of the the illegal wiretapping and surveillance is rooted in the knowledge that the government has no idea who is in the country. Everyday we hear about how corrupt those who are governing are, we know even federal judges have laughed in the face of our immigration laws, by hiring illegal nannies. Prop. 187 was voted on by the people, and gutted by the politicians.

I think the pressure valve is about to blow, and the pro-illegal lobby has no one to blame but themselves. They have tried for 30 years to make Americans believe that self-interest is racist. Americans aren't buying it anymore. This writer and Alternet are doing their constituents a real disservice, just as the tide has turned on the War In Iraq, so it has on this issue. It is time to mend fences not dig motes, your intractable position does not do that.

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OK, How you gonna keep'em out?
Posted by: O.B.Server on Mar 27, 2006 5:19 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It is entirely unrealistic to believe you can keep out the the "illegal" allens without damaging the US. It is a complete head trip to believe that it can be done. Another Berlin wall? Completely around the US? And Alaska? Militarize the US even much more than it already is? Turn all citizens into Secret Police?

Oh well let them starve to death over there. They were not smart enough to be born in the US and who cares anyway?

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Build the wall and deport "ILLEGAL" immigrants
Posted by: cinattra on Mar 27, 2006 5:49 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I don't see the problem with establishing detention centers where the "ILLEGAL" immigrants we catch can be sent as they wait for their walk back home since that is how most of them got here to begin with. The U.S. will be vilified for exercising it sovereign right to uphold its immigration laws. We will be called racist and inhumane by the world because we'd be doing what the United Mexican States (Mexico) does to its own "ILLEGAL" immigrants. Like Dave Chapelle told the UN in his satire of President Bush, "Sanction me, sanction me with your army... oh, you don't have an army then shut the f*** up!"

I'm becoming more adament about my stance for one particular reason. We treat everyone else better than we treat our very own citizens. It is ridiculous the inequality that ordinary law abiding U.S. citizens have to put up with. Even criminals are treated better than ordinary everyday citizens in this country. I'm sick in my gut about this issue.

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» Spare me the demgougery Posted by: brunowe
Diversity Lottery
Posted by: cinattra on Mar 27, 2006 6:25 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If we need a certain amount of growth through immigration then we can expand the diversity lotto to fill that need. Not kowtowing to a group of people who believe all of our border states belong to them. The Mexican government has allowed their citizens to pour through our borders to force us into submission to basically strong arm us into a symbiotic relationship that benefits no one except business owners and the Mexican government.

We may not be able to deport everyone but we don't have to make it so easy for "ILLEGAL" immigrants to live in this country. They have taken adantage of our helping nature and perverted it into something that is unsustainable in the long run and increasingly unsustainable even in the short run.

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Can Proponents Of Amnesty Agree To Some Terms?
Posted by: dlf on Mar 27, 2006 7:08 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I think that those who have come here after the 1986 Amnesty hoping for another Amnesty should have to pass certain criteria in order to stay.
1. They must speak fluent English.
2. They must either be in school or have graduated from High School.
3. They must have paid into ss and fica. And be able to prove it.
4. They must not have ever been on the public dole.
5. All men of age must register for selective service.
6. All who entered the country illegally or stayed past a visa term have to do 2 years of community service to be eligible for citizenship.

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The ONLY Immigration Fix that will work -- Biometric Social Security Numbers
Posted by: janvdb on Mar 27, 2006 7:13 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We must prevent the employment of illegals at the point of hire.

The solution must combine:

• an effective method to prevent the hire of illegals; the only workable method is biometric Social Security numbers, discussed below.

• sped-up processing of those legally in line now

• the set-up of guest-worker processing stations in various Mexican states and other Latin American locales as a quid pro quo for REFORM there to address root causes for mass departure, discussed below.

• No "amnesty" is necessary. A tightening new-hire system will drive the 12 mn illegals now here home to get their paperwork done, provided the process there is quick, painless and gives priority to English-speakers.

If the system were designed and executed properly, we could reduce border policing eventually.

The biometric Social Security Number

A thumbprint (or palmprint or iris) scanner should be installed in every large Post Office and employment office in the US. This would be updated daily by a central computer maintained by the SS Adm'n. The thumbprint of every person in the US would need to be put into a databank. This should be done when people renew their drivers licenses or change jobs.

To hire a new person, a representative of the employer and the prospective employee must present themselves physically before this device. First the employer would be identified by thumbprint (or palm or iris scan) and the keying-in of their Employer ID #, then the employee would place his thumb on the scanner and key in his SS#.

If the system works the same as those now in use by spas and healthclubs, the true ID of the employee would be instantly ascertained. If the person is fraudulently using the name and SS# of another (legal) person, the system would reject the new hire and the hiring could not legally proceed.

The problem which invalidates the “fix” now being discussed in Congress is: checking the SS# of a new hire on the SS Adm'n website does not weed out the person using the SS# and matching name of another real, legal person. The document mills have already shifted to producing these "good" doc sets as employers of those using unmatched SS#-name sets, unissued SS#s, etc are ALREADY being sent alerts by the SS Adm'n.

The flaw now in the system: the SS Adm'n silently accepts SS payments from two to twenty employees on one SS#. These "double payments are about 5% of SS Adm'n receipts.

Each person would be allowed to process themselves for up to the equivalent of 2 fulltime jobs in the same area.

Then, the machine would issue a card authorizing the hire to be carried by the employee while working. Inspectors of beefed-up workplace enforcement branch of the CIS would spotcheck worksites on unannounced visits, swiping all workers' cards through a machine which would also scan their thumbprints to ascertain that all employees on that worksite were legally hired.

Employers of improperly process workers (or who workers who attempted to flee) would be heavily fined and the employees deported.

"Household employers" hiring temporary workers -- most of this is now done "for cash" -- would be required to do the thumbprinting (and spotchecked) but would not to withhold taxes, SS, medicaid, unemployment, or workman's comp. A "household employer" would be entities exempted by the IRS from 1099ing a contractor -- up to 4 hires per year, up to $2000 per employee per quarter and up to $5000 per year for all employees.

Unless this is done, the "casual labor" market would remain outside the law, where it is today, as "doing payroll" is too complex.

This is the ONLY system which will actually work.

Jan VanDenBerg

Continued below . . .

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Face facts and deal with reality
Posted by: janvdb on Mar 27, 2006 7:20 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Border enforcement is useless showcase violence designed to fail; it continues the status quo, while placating racists. Amnesty without detection of illegals will only invite more illegals in addition to those just legalized. Harsh measures are cruel, hypocritcal and racist and, if they actually worked (which I do not expect as lack of enforcement would be engineered by "the powers that be") would severely damage the economy.

I believe that the biometric Social Security Number is the ONLY system which will work.

Drivers' Licenses are controlled by the 50 states and making them biometric would be much more difficult than the SS number.

We need to combine effective immigration control with an increase in the minimum wage (with exceptions for ex-cons and anyone unemployed for more than a year), remove legal barriers to unionization, use government programs to promote unionization, put in place national health care and enhance enforcement of workplace safety and anti-discrimination laws.

The status quo enables bad government and exploitative labor practices on both sides of the government, while running down wages in the US.

The types of reform we should ask for in return for setting up guest worker processing stations:

* the set-up of free women’s-and-well-baby-care clinics to bring population growth down to match US levels.

* the building of Clerk-and-Recorder and County Surveyor functions adequate that international title companies will issue title insurance on real estate in the state or nation being approved for guess worker processing.

* reforms to local and national legal systems.

We also need to end our disastrous "War on Drugs" which is destabilizing Latin America with huge illicit profits. If we focussed on treatment, rehabilitation and mental health care, not interdiction, the price of drugs would fall, the profits decline and the international mafias would shrink.

Jan VanDenBerg

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» RE: Face facts and deal with reality Posted by: kelly.nickell
Gee. It would've been nice if I could've understood what they were saying.
Posted by: ABetterFuture on Mar 27, 2006 7:51 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The half-million protesters who flooded Los Angeles this weekend are a glaring sign that Washington needs a rational immigration policy -- not more walls and fences.

Is it devisive of me to point out the most of the "glaring signs" that author was speaking about were written in Mexic--err, Spanish?

Really, if the only two English words that one knows are "Bush" plus "any bad word", then I guess I agree with the author. We have a national problem. Perhaps a problem born (on foreign soil) of a fundamental inability to communicate, and a subsequent refusal to integrate into America.

Here, you have a situation where .5M people are protesting, but don't give a damn whether or not the other ~270-290M (out of a total of 295M)of us in this country can understand what they're saying.

Obviously it's because the fringe ~270-290M English speaking people don't matter, but I'll get to that later.

When righties protest, I can understand what they're saying under the accents. When lefties protest, I can make out what they're saying, sometimes even before they put their hair out. I don't always agree with either group, but I always have to the option to ignore, dismiss, or make a concerted effort to attempt to think about what they're saying, and whether or that might help our nation and society.

I can't even begin to fathom what is meant by "Busha el diablo!"? And "Busha va casa!"? Maybe these folks have valid points. Maybe their all idiots. I have no way of knowing. Good thing our president speaks Mexic...err...Spanish!

When a small group of people doesn't bother to give a damn whether ~97% of this country even understands the words they are using in their message of protestation, it indicates that the protesters aren't so much interested in American policy and American legislation, as they are as to how to implement their own policies in America.

But what the hell do I really know about these protests, organized via Mexica...Spanish language radio, and participated in (by some estimates) more foreign nationals than Americans? What could I have possibly contributed to this dialogue over the rightness/wrongness of legislation being mulled by my elected officials in the American congress.

After all, I only speak English, and I only vote.

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» Generally speaking... Posted by: ABetterFuture
» I don't know. Posted by: ABetterFuture
» RE: I don't know. Posted by: dlf
» RE: Generally speaking... Posted by: Allan Stevo
So, here we go again? This time "The Gangs of Los Angeles"?
Posted by: Sojourner on Mar 27, 2006 8:14 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We can agree that the times have changed. We cannot seem to agree on how, exactly.

Immigration until now has been a minor matter; so much so, that an open border was taken forgranted. An irritant, at best.

In our declining age (the list of evidence is growing) the appeal to "we need to grow" falls flat because it translates directly into "we need to grow worse, grow more social chaos, more shattered lives."

Yeah, the good old days of an ascending age are gone. 'Success' now means to contribute to the decline. Everything is topsy-turvey. Get used to it.

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» It's Time for a REVOLUTION Posted by: thinkverybig
» A REVOLUTION? In whose name? Posted by: Sojourner
Viva Bush!
Posted by: freeda on Mar 27, 2006 8:46 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Well I guess that says it all. To hell with American workers and 'up' with the elite classes who want their asses wiped by others.

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Absurd Argument
Posted by: Andie927 on Mar 27, 2006 8:46 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am not against LEGAL immigration! Legal is the key word! I live in an area with a lot of Mexican farm workers, rural North/Central Florida. We are one of the poorest counties in the State.
Of coarse someone who has entered this country is NOT entittled to have a court hearing, they have no legal statues they entered ILLegally!
Some of you may be well off enough to have 'others' mow your lawn, care for your kids, and clean your house or office, but I've always done those things for myself, Thank-You!
The Non-Persons, who benifit the most, are Corporations, and business, who because of the flood of people willing to work for lower wages and NO benifits, are forcing wages down, and thereby everyones (in the middle-class) standard of living!

This is a matter of supply and demand, if we started REALLY enforcement of our Existing Laws, and went after the businesses that hire people without the LEGAL Right to work here, have non-negotiable fines per person sufficient to cover the cost of enforcement, detention, and deportation, so that it acted as a deterint, companies would stop hiring them and without the ability to work here they would stop coming!

This argument that Americans won't do these jobs, is 'Hog-Wash', we won't do them at the wages, work conditions, and benifits, being offered! Most do NOT pay taxes! Most do not come here to make a better life here for their family, but to live in squaller (6 & 7) to a room, to send money back to Mexico! I've read somewhere roughly 40 million a month is sent back to Mexico! All the while 'we' the American tax-payer ends up subsidizing their health care, schooling their children, and subsidizing their housing and food!

The ILLEGAL Immigrant and the American Tax-payer are being Victimized! For Corporate Welfare!

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» RE: Absurd Argument Posted by: JoshuaHolland
» It's Time for a REVOLUTION Posted by: thinkverybig
Not Reciprocal
Posted by: Andie927 on Mar 27, 2006 8:56 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Post Note:

By the way, anyone who thinks we can go to their country, Mexico, Brazil, ect. and work there after they take all the jobs here, and send the money back home; Forget It! They have LAWS PREVENTING anyone from going there to go to work!

To go to live in Mexico, (and most other foreign countries) you either have to have a job skill in demand, or sufficient money to live on without working!

Just like our Import/Export Tariffs, they're NOT equal!

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» RE: Not Reciprocal Posted by: pacto
» RE: Not Reciprocal Posted by: mincemeat
Protect wages- go to www.FAIRUS.org now
Posted by: plantland on Mar 27, 2006 9:24 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This group describes the various immigration bills and helps people write congresspeople. Its website shows that it has been primarily blue collar workers and those who have no more than a high school education who have been hurt by the influx of low wage workers.

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Hooray!
Posted by: Betsy L. Angert on Mar 27, 2006 10:05 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Dear Marc Cooper . . .

While writing my own missive on the current immigration issues, I realized I wanted to include a photograph of the glorious Los Angeles demonstration. I “googled” and stumbled upon you essay.

Hooray! You too feel a need to remind Americans of their own migration history. I am elated to discover that you, Mr. Cooper, also struggle with the hypocrisy that exists. We each recognize the need to assess America, past, present, and future. We are all citizens from elsewhere.

I believe we agree, there are similarities between those that immigrated here, to now work, in hopes of bettering their lives and our parents, our grandparents, and our great grandparents.

It seems the irony of division baffles you as it does me. I thank you for your brilliant treatise. I linked to it in my own post.

Please feel free to read my calm rant, IMMIGRANTS TO AMERICA, PEOPLE WITH OR WITHOUT PAPERS ©

Sincerely . . .

Betsy L. Angert
Be-Think

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» RE: Hooray! Posted by: FedUp
» RE: Hooray! and thanks Posted by: Betsy L. Angert
» RE: Hooray! and thanks Posted by: FedUp
» WithOut Permission Posted by: YogiBear
» RE: Hooray! Posted by: FedUp
no walls
Posted by: tke on Mar 27, 2006 10:06 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This article is not accurate. I just returned from Tucson, AZ, where Dick Cheney appeared on Thursday. People in southern AZ are NOT in favor of opening the border and supporting illegals who manage to sneak in. There are two sides to this argument, but because Dems want latino votes and Repugs want slave labor, Americans are only hearing one side. 3/4 of all the people in Mexico want to come into the U.S. (PEW poll). If you want to be living in "New Mexico USA," then you'll love the open border policy. If not, better think about the other border: Canada.

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walls
Posted by: tke on Mar 27, 2006 10:08 AM   
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Also, I wonder if a lot of "liberals" want an open border because it will be easier to get dope from Mexico.

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» RE: walls Posted by: pacto
» RE: walls Posted by: tke
» RE: walls Posted by: FedUp
» RE: walls Posted by: YogiBear
» RE: walls Posted by: kelly.nickell
not our problem
Posted by: tke on Mar 27, 2006 10:14 AM   
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And what's more, in the 1960s, American activists and government officials tried to talk to the Mexican government about limiting population growth and limiting pollution and creating a better economy and society. Mexico chose to reject these ideas. Their religion forbade birth control and the government chose to be corrupt, caring only about the wealthy. Now, Mexico is exporting the result of their unreasonable policies into the U.S. at a time when our own economy is in shambles and citizens are facing elimination of our own benefits. Americans object to entitlement programs for American citizens, so why would we support entitlement programs for people who are in the country illegally? FIX MEXICO.

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» RE: not our problem Posted by: pacto
» RE: not our problem Posted by: tke
» RE: not our problem Posted by: pacto
Leftists: Protect US Working Poor
Posted by: fairleft on Mar 27, 2006 11:40 AM   
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The data from The Center for Immigration Studies shows that immigrants take jobs from Americans who need jobs the most, the working poor and Americans without college education. The Center "reports that immigrants account for almost 26 percent of construction and extraction workers. The unemployment rate for native-born Americans in those industries is 12.6 percent and 11.3 percent, respectively."

Here are some additional facts you may want to ponder:

"• Looking first at all workers shows that between March 2000 and March 2005 only 9 percent of the net increase in jobs for adults (18 to 64) went to natives. This is striking because natives accounted for 61 percent of the net increase in the overall size of the 18 to 64 year old population.

• As for the less-educated, between March of 2000 and 2005 the number of adult immigrants (legal and illegal) with only a high school degree or less in the labor force increased by 1.6 million.

• At the same time, unemployment among less-educated adult natives increased by nearly one million, and the number of natives who left the labor force altogether increased by 1.5 million. Persons not in the labor force are neither working nor looking for work. "

http://www.cis.org/articles/2006/back206.html

As Cesar Chavez showed us years ago when he fought to protect farmworker from union-busting cheap foreign labor, all real leftists need to start defending the American working class and working poor.

The easy, obvious and humane way to do this -- by the way-- is to hammer employers with huge fines, no "ifs, ands, or buts" allowed.

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» Great Post Posted by: dlf
corporations will never give up slave-labor force
Posted by: gerdhansel on Mar 27, 2006 11:40 AM   
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American corporations will never give up their slave-labor force of undocumented immigrants from Latin America.

Ever since their wings got clipped in the first half of the 20th century, the robber barons have longed for a return to the heady days of the Industrial Revolution when Andrew Carnegie and John D. Rockefeller OWNED their laborers.

They will never give up undocumented slave labor because the minute these laborers become legal the fat cats can no longer pay them next to nothing and treat them like animals.

This is what's really at stake here, but most of us are so fixated on calling each other racists and wetbacks we can't see who the real enemy is.

The robber barons are using this race-baiting business to keep us divided against each other instead of going after the real enemies of the working man.

Force the corporations to pay ALL workers a living wage and treat ALL workers equally, and this problem will take care of itself.

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Half A Million Opposing Immigration Legislation
Posted by: woodford54 on Mar 27, 2006 11:43 AM   
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BUT... there is no way in hell we could get 500,000 to march on DC to impeach Bush or try him for war crimes. PLEASE ask yourself WHY this is? If you figure it out, get back to me. Post here. I'm curious and frustrated. Surely the impeachment of Bush is every bit as important to all of us as this issue is. Where are we?

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» It's Time for a REVOLUTION Posted by: thinkverybig
Offer jobs and they will come
Posted by: macdon1 on Mar 27, 2006 11:57 AM   
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The reason illegal immigrants come here is because employers will hire them and they can make more money than they can at home. Employers hire them because they are cheap labor and don't ask for benefits. It is quite simple and it's human nature. Here in California, it is almost impossible for an American citizen to get any kind of laboring job, period. I know because both my husband and my daughter tried when they were not able to get anything else and we desperately needed the money. Every possible job landscaping, doing construction, housework or even walking dogs is taken by illegals. I used to make extra money cleaning houses after construction and move-outs. All that is gone to illegal immigrants no