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Did God Send the Hurricane?

By Deborah Caldwell, Beliefnet. Posted September 1, 2005.


This natural disaster is bringing together a perfect storm of environmentalist and religious doomsday sayers.

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What caused Hurricane Katrina to slam the U.S. Gulf Coast? Was it a typical late-summer tropical storm caused by wind, water, and heat? Mother Nature crying out on behalf of the earth's pain? An angry God?

Depends whom you ask. All along the theological and political spectrum, Katrina has crystallized people's fears into a now-familiar brew of apocalyptic theories similar to what we saw after September 11 and after the Asian tsunami several months ago.

At least one New Orleans-area resident believes God created the storm as punishment because of the recent role the United States played in expelling Jews from Gaza. On Sunday evening, Bridgett Magee of Slidell, La., told the Christian website Jerusalem Newswire that she saw the hurricane "as a direct 'coming back on us' [for] what we did to Israel: a home for a home." Stan Goodenough, a website columnist, described Katrina as "the fist of God" in a Monday column. "What America is about to experience is the lifting of God's hand of protection; the implementation of His judgment on the nation most responsible for endangering the land and people of Israel," Goodenough writes. "The Bible talks about Him shaking His fist over bodies of water, and striking them."

Meanwhile, spiritual and political environmentalists say that massive hurricanes such as Katrina, along with the Asian tsunami, are messages from the earth, letting humanity know of the earth's pain. These hurricanes are caused by global warming, environmentalists say, which are the result of using too much fossil fuel. They see the catastrophic consequences as a kind of comeuppance.

Katrina forced oil workers to evacuate rigs in the Gulf of Mexico; meanwhile, seven oil refineries and a major oil import terminal have been closed. The Gulf Coast region is home to a quarter of U.S. oil refining. As a result, Common Dreams wrote Monday: "Oil may be achieving a new impact on daily news, people's pocketbooks and world history--perhaps even the end of history and the world."

James Howard Kunstler, author of "The Long Emergency: Surviving the Converging Catastrophes of the 21st Century," predicted in his Monday blog: "It seems possible to me that we will be seeing gas station lines all over America within the week." In another area of his website, Kunstler writes: "We are entering a period of economic hardship and declining incomes...The suburbs as are going to tank spectacularly. We are going to see an unprecedented loss of equity value and, of course, basic usefulness. We are going to see an amazing distress sale of properties, with few buyers. We're going to see a fight over the table scraps of the 20th century."

Stephen O'Leary, a professor at the Annenberg School for Communication at the University of Southern California and an expert on the media and apocalypticism, says, "God's got a two-fer here. Both sides are eager to see America punished for her sins; on one side it's sexual immorality and porn and Hollywood, and on the other side it's conspicuous consumption and Hummers."

In some ways, these are mainstream feelings: In a recent CNN poll, 55% of those responding believe that global warming is causing the severe weather we've experienced recently, which is a kind of admission that a huge hurricane is part of the wages of (environmental) sin. Meanwhile, most polls show that 40% of all U.S. adults believe the physical world will eventually end as a result of a supernatural intervention, perhaps with a literal Rapture, Tribulation, Antichrist, and Battle of Armageddon described in the Book of Revelation. Nearly half of all Americans believe the Middle East will be "heavily involved" in the events surrounding the end of the world. And 40% believe the end of the world will come in their lifetime.

The rush to doomsday thinking, O'Leary says, is related to our need to process emotion in the face of suffering. "The mass media confront us with emotion that is almost impossible to process, and the only way we have to deal with that is to put it in terms of the drama of apocalypse and redemption--you transform suffering into a story of God's plan. If you don't have that, then what you do is turn off the TV and have despair."

It's not just conservative Christians who tune in to this cycle of apocalypse and redemption, however. New Agers and some environmentalists subscribe to a theory that the world is undergoing what they call Earth Changes--a time when, because of humanity's degradation, the climate severely reacts. Many of these believers say the United States will be almost completely submerged in seawater when the Earth Changes are complete.

"When people leave behind the Christian version of the apocalypse, they don't quit being apocalyptic," O'Leary says. "They switch brands."

Even the media, perhaps reacting to their own cycle of hype and emotion of this moment, have been priming the doomsday pump. The normally bloodless Associated Press wrote this description: "When Hurricane Katrina hits New Orleans on Monday, it could turn one of America's most charming cities into a vast cesspool tainted with toxic chemicals, human waste and even coffins released by floodwaters from the city's legendary cemeteries."

Interestingly, last year's string of Florida hurricanes didn't seem to cause much doomsday rhetoric. But Katrina is different for a few important reasons: It's much larger than usual storms; it hit a region that is home to one-fourth of U.S. oil production at a time when Americans are feeling tremendous anxiety over rising fuel costs; it happened a couple weeks after Israel pulled out of Gaza; and it conjures horrific images of fetid water contaminating a city with a Sodom and Gomorrah reputation.

The thought of this region, or even the nation, being somehow punished for its sins, conjures twin feelings of excitement and dread among apocalyptic thinkers. On one hand, they seem delighted that a divine plan appears to be unfolding. With horrific events such as this, they believe, God (or Mother Nature) has shown them the world is so evil that it is closer than ever to the end of human history--which means they will spend eternity in a happier place. Yet they also believe God (or Mother Nature) is punishing Americans. That gives rise to their urgent need to stave off destruction through prayer, scolding, and trying to convert people to their way of thinking.

It's worth noting that end-times fever also broke out during the Persian Gulf War, around the turn of the millennium five years ago, and then around September 11, as it has many times in history. Each time it happens, Americans (and humanity for millennia before) become convinced the End is upon them because they've sinned and that God or Mother Nature is angry.

Yet if people actually read the Bible, they can just as easily find an alternate view of the divine, a view that is diametrically opposite the wrathful avenger. The Book of I Kings reads: "Behold, the Lord passed by, and a great and strong wind rent the mountains, and broke in pieces the rocks before the Lord; but the Lord was not in the wind: and after the wind and earthquake; but the Lord was not in the earthquake: And after the earthquake a fire; but the Lord was not in the fire: and after the fire a still small voice."

This article appeared originally on www.beliefnet.com, the multifaith website for religion, spirituality, inspiration & more. Used with permission. All rights reserved.

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Deborah Caldwell is a senior editor of Beliefnet.

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What Would Jerry Fallwell Say?
Posted by: LMNOP on Sep 1, 2005 12:21 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Yeah, God brought the hurricane to punish America for its homophobia and for not burning Pat Robertson at the stake.

By the way, how long can it be before the chimp in the cowboy hat starts using this episode of human misery to his advantage to claim that this is proof that America needs to drill Alaska and anywhere else that he can leave an oil slick (besides Wolfowitz's hair)?

And I like the way the Commander-in-Chimp flew over the gulf coast to personally survey the extent of the damage. That's just the kind of hands on guys he is. Hell, he could have gotten a better feel just by putting on the Weather Channel and circling in front of the TV on his trike.

Gas $3.60 a gallon. You: OMG! Chimp: Yee Haw!!

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» drill Alaska Posted by: Olympiada
Katrina
Posted by: Tom Degan on Sep 1, 2005 4:10 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This is worse than anyhting I could have imagined. Say a rosary for the people of the Gulf coast.

Bad as it is, though, it's a politcal gold strike for George W. Bush. It has taken evryone's mind (temporarily, at least) off of Karl Rove, Iraq, the Downing Street memo, the economy, the national debt, John Roberts, his own stupidity, etc. Looking at the television pictures of the looters, I couldn't help thinking that Dubya now an insurgency to deal with - Cajun syle.

Count on it: As he did with September 11th, he'll use this disaster as an excuse to do something really stupid. Pray.

Tom Degan
Goshen, NY

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» RE: Katrina Posted by: dj0114
» RE: Katrina Posted by: Pepper
» No thank you to prayer Posted by: LMNOP
» RE: Katrina Posted by: rotorooter
» RE: Katrina Posted by: rinthy
» RE: Katrina Posted by: Tom Degan
Oh please!
Posted by: dj0114 on Sep 1, 2005 4:12 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If God truly punished those for doing bad immoral stuff:

-Georgie would have been voted out of office in a landslide
-Pat Robertson would have been committed to a mental institution long ago
-The hurricane would have wiped out any rich person who benefitted from Georgie's outrageous tax cuts and NOT the overwhelming average to poor citizen in New Orleans.

How do the doomsayers explain that!? Mostly poor and middle class people were affected by this. All the doomsayers need to get real!

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» RE: Oh please! Posted by: Pepper
» RE: Oh please! Posted by: moogyboy
» Me? Posted by: Olympiada
» Christians and Creepystians Posted by: Olympiada
» dignity Posted by: Olympiada
» RE: COOL IT WITH THE CHRISTIANITY Posted by: nharrison1
» RE: COOL IT WITH THE CHRISTIANITY Posted by: nharrison1
» RE: COOL IT WITH THE CHRISTIANITY Posted by: nharrison1
» RE: COOL IT WITH THE CHRISTIANITY Posted by: nharrison1
» Thanks again Posted by: Olympiada
» RE: Thanks again Posted by: nharrison1
» Contact Posted by: Olympiada
» RE: Contact Posted by: nharrison1
» Think again Posted by: LMNOP
» RE: Think again Posted by: nharrison1
» Thanks for the response Posted by: Olympiada
» That was directed to me? Posted by: Olympiada
» Do you know me? Posted by: Olympiada
» RE Hi Olympiada !! Posted by: borrego
» RE: Oh please! Posted by: nharrison1
» Oh pah-leeese is right! Posted by: LMNOP
» thanks for your strong faith Posted by: Olympiada
The world is what you make of it?
Posted by: owlbear1 on Sep 1, 2005 5:24 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Whatever the Bush Zealots appear to be trying to make is SCARY!!

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Two out of three ain't bad
Posted by: JesseBC on Sep 1, 2005 5:26 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Comparing the established link between global warming to fundamentalist Christian apocalypse rhetoric and New Age Gaia rhetoric is really a load of horseshit.

It only feeds into the problem to conflate environmental science with religious paranoia. Granted, we aren't entirely sure of the extent to which global warming influenced the rise in hurricanes like Katrina, but the tools of determining this don't even belong in the same article with Tim LeHaye psychosis. It serves only to lower the reality of global warming to the level of religious myth.

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» RE: Two out of three ain't bad Posted by: moogyboy
» AGREE 10000% Posted by: Michiganman
more of the same
Posted by: utatke on Sep 1, 2005 6:08 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I don't understand how people can blame a spiritual being for something that is tangible and destructive. Not to say that I don't acknowledge a higher power, but I think that blaming God for a natural disaster is, as my father used to say, "stretching rhe covers" a bit!
Given all of the weather related natural disasters which have occurred in recent months, perhaps we should be looking for a scientific explaination instead of a theological one. I think that would make more sense.
I would be curious to know how many of these "doomsdayers" who are floating this notion that it's all God's fault, and we are on the verge of armegedon, actually pray to God everyday and thank him for all of the great things we have.

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» blaming God - not a good idea Posted by: Olympiada
» Smell the evil.... Posted by: Michiganman
» evil Posted by: Olympiada
» Exploration is good Posted by: Michiganman
» Peace offering accepted Posted by: Olympiada
» Belief.net Posted by: Olympiada
» You tripped the alarm Posted by: Michiganman
» Ooops not you...... Posted by: Michiganman
» Protection, a good thing Posted by: Olympiada
» Agree Posted by: Michiganman
» friendship is good Posted by: Olympiada
» RE: God is not male! Posted by: fleurdelamer
agitator church and state
Posted by: eileenflmng on Sep 1, 2005 6:09 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Punitive Father God [believed in by fundamentalist's] who would afflict millions of innocents by 'sending a tsunami or hurricane' as a judgement is a false idol who thinking Christians reject.

God is love, compassion, mercy and patient. She/He will be the judge of every individual heart in His/Her own time and while we walk upon this earth we are to care, nurture and tend Creation and we do need to take seriously the cumilative effects of global warming.

We should be in awe and wonder at the power of nature and humbled by our inability to change the wind and control Mother Nature.

Combine global warming, large concentrations of population and instant and excessive media coverage fed to a citizenship who worship a Punitive Father God and it is inevitable that the doomsayers will be heard.

There is another view: natural disasters could humble us and encourage us to become fully human and compassionate and supportive towards all who suffer, instill within us a reverence for Mother Earth and gratitude that we didn't get slammed this time around!

www.wearewideawake.org

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» test Posted by: Olympiada
» long strange trip Posted by: Olympiada
WAIT A MINUTE.... WAS THERE A NUCLEAR WAR....AND I MISSED IT?
Posted by: Velos on Sep 1, 2005 6:22 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Did this country suffer a pre-emptive nuclear strike?

Did a meteor hit the continent of North America?

Did a Tsumani strike the nation?

Then explain to me, in twenty-five words or less; with a straight face;....and no help from the jury.....

Why the hell are almost three-quarters of a million people suffering in South Louisiana (no aid, no water, no food, rampant lawlessless, uncollected bodies strewn on the streets....) in the greatest, richest, most powerful country on the planet.

The First Idiot comes on TV and tells us "Don't Worry, Be Happy....We're (your Federal government) gonna spare no resource or expense to do everything to make it better..."

Cities as close as Shreveport are utterly unscathed, yet they CAN'T COLLECT THE BODIES, OR STOP THE 'URBAN TERRORISTS' (LOOTERS)???

Fuck Iraq, and their Goddam 'Freedom'.....DO SOMETHING HERE! IDIOT!!

Well, the 'silver lining' in all this is that this tragedy may be the ringing of the 'death knell' for the Country-Club Republicans and their Frat-House Jerk Off...Pray.

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Hierodule
Posted by: Hierodule on Sep 1, 2005 6:40 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Copy of letter to Pres. Bush:
What? You want me to donate?

Gee, I dunno. Sending money to the Red Cross to help a red state is a real problem for me. Would the "Christians" down there take money from a card-carrying Liberal from hoity-toity Connecticut? What if they knew I were Gay; would they take my money then? Anyway, I thought I heard some preacher somewhere saying that Hurricane Katrina was God's wrathful punishment against the Bible Belt for turning away from evolution, for their homophobia, for their anti-environmentalism, for opposing universal health-care, for supporting the Invasion of Iraq, for interpreting the Bible literally, for a history of racism, and, especially, for the Catholic diocese down there in New Orleans throwing another Christian church (UFMCC) out of a building they own because of theological disagreements. Maybe it was Jerry Falwell or "ole squint-eye" Pat Robertson. Didn't Falwell blame 9/11 on us? And didn't Robertson agree with him? Will they take my money now? I really need to know.

Since Bush, Cheney, et. al. are making billions from gasoline prices and war profiteering, I'd like to know how much they are contributing first, before I donate. Is anybody asking these questions? Is anybody asking the president of "Personal Responsibility" why he insists that the globe is not warming even though the gulf waters are hotter than ever and are directly linked to Katrina's force? How much are these fat cats donating?

Hey, what about the tax cuts for the rich? Shouldn't the rich be the ones to kick in? I haven't heard about a covey of rich white folks getting it together, giving up their tax cuts, to provide millions in aid to Hurricane Katrina victims. Maybe they're all down in the superdome with Falwell, Dobson and Robertson - hot, smelly, filthy, crowded superdome - handing out food to the poor??? Guess not. Say, why can't the Corporations that have bought what used to be a Democracy for and by the people globalize the relief effort? Are the holders of outsourced jobs donating?

Maybe after Bush privatizes my Social Security I'll feel more disposed to act like a good Christian and send money. Oh, if I'm not by chance a Christian at all, would my money be accepted? It's a real quandary.

Frank Chisholm
East Lyme, CT 06333

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» RE: Hierodule Posted by: cyclone
» RE: Hierodule Posted by: dai766
» RE: Hierodule Posted by: holojojo
Saint John of Shanghai
Posted by: Olympiada on Sep 1, 2005 7:17 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I have to admit, I was feeling a sense of doom. Last night as I lay in my daughter's room and listened to the wind in the tree out side, I thought "this same wind slammed into New Orleans at 145mph". Incomprehensible. Why do we deserve to live and they do not?
It definitely made me count my blessings. What a time. I remember when the spaceship Challenger crashed. That was the first big news event of my childhood. For my father, it was the asassination of Kennedy. Pardon my spelling. My daughter is too young to comprehend, she does not know.
Yet, thankfully, I belong to a religion that has intercessory saints, for hurricanes even! And discovered a beloved saint, Saint John of Shanghai and San Francisco is an intercessory saint for hurricanes. So I now longer have to feel this 'doom'. I will not speculate on Israel and New Orleans. That seems dangerous to me. I more see it as "Bush, get out of Iraq now and pay attention to home!" but that is just my view point.
I am happy this article mentioned 'the still small voice'. Seems rational to me.

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» RE: Saint John of Shanghai Posted by: Barbara
"Our Egos Will Be Our Undoing"
Posted by: monkeywrench on Sep 1, 2005 9:06 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It is interesting in times like this that we humans fall back on superstition; especially superstition that puts our own importance at center: "it must be God's big punishment for our big sins," or "it is the world striking back for our greed and big mistakes." Well. . .the fact is, we're not so big. Oh, yes, we, with our vast numbers and our "too-clever-for-our-own-good" machinations can make things here on Earth very unpleasant for ourselves and other living things – in the geologic short-term. But, after we're gone, the Earth will repair itself, some other life-form (hopefully wiser) will ascend, and our puny attempts to transform the planet to our immature wants will be forgotten. Keep in mind that the dinosaurs, the most successful large life-form in history, ruled the Earth for 250 MILLION years – and they're gone. We've only been here for less than 4 million years – only about 20 thousand as organized societies – and already we've fouled our nest.

No, our foolishness may have exacerbated the conditions that caused Hurricane Katrina, but in terms of the planet, that storm was just a small eddy in the flow of atmosphere. It only seemed so large to us, because we are actually so small.

I hope that someday we all (I include myself) can take more of a Zen perspective on our place in life, and put our egos where they will do less harm.

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» Zen perspective Posted by: Olympiada
why
Posted by: mark on Sep 1, 2005 9:10 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
why does alternet have to instantly focus on how they can use the hurricane to bash the president and the general right wing. that can wait a few days. why not print a few articles about relief efforts, how the individual can help out and such. Obviously this is a left wing website, but I never thought it was that bad.

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» RE: why Posted by: Charaud
» RE: why Posted by: djcrow22
» RE: why Posted by: Basenjis
» RE: why Posted by: djcrow22
Rev. Alexander Harper
Posted by: zan123 on Sep 1, 2005 9:32 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
In spite of screeches to the contrary, orthodox Christianity — Protestant or Catholic) does not HAVE TO blame on, or attribute to, God "natural" disasters like the great Tsunami and now the Katrina devastation.

We Christians attribute the EXISTENCE (and PURPOSE) of all things to God, but not the details of what happens, whether formation of galaxies or evolving creatures (yes, Darwin) and events on our planet earth.

God says, "Here's a green but uncertain and dangerous world. See what you can make of it. I'll inspire prophets and saints (and scientists) with vision to help you." With the Hebrews and esp. in Jesus, "I'll enter into covenant and share your risks personally."

Then we struggle with barbaric and saintly impulses in all of us; we organize for mutual aid and sometimes for unfair advantage.

Sometimes what seems "natural diaster" is made more disastrous by human guil — as is being discovered just now with federal funds diverted from flooding projects in the Delta by the President to wealthy tax cuts (NYT yesterday). and an obscene, unnecessary war in Iraq, violating 1600 years of
canons and limitations of "justified war."

God never promised us a rose garden in this life. Yet God did give us vision, intelligence and strength to create a more decent and humane world now (thru politics) and the hope of forgiven sin and a blessed life to come for those who prize a life of faith, hope and love (thru the Church).

Rev. Alexander Harper, retired UCC minister, Norwalk, CT. Comments? zharper@optonline.net

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» screeches - LOL Posted by: Olympiada
» RE: ev. Alexander Harper Posted by: pomes
» RE: ev. Alexander Harper Posted by: BuckFush
» RE: ev. Alexander Harper Posted by: nharrison1
» RE: ev. Alexander Harper Posted by: Basenjis
A Modest Proposal for Disaster Relief
Posted by: RobS on Sep 1, 2005 9:39 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Since New Orleans' economy has been based on the tourism and convention industries (for the past 30 years, at least)...

And, since so many of the special events that draw tourists to New Orleans are "Sin"-based events (such as Mardi Gras, "Girls Gone Wild," and "Southern Decadence") that our "Christian" fundamentalist friends find objectionable...

And given that, in all likelihood, these events will not be able to take place in New Orleans for at least the next 12 months, I propose that:

1. Those who were planning to attend the above-mentioned and similar "sinful" events hold fund-raising events and parties in the spirit of Girls Gone Wild, Southern Decadence, etc.
2. We (meaning all thoughtful progressives) should come up with a snappy collective name for these fundraisers, and pre-empt the Freepers (Fundamentalist Republicans) and conservatives. My suggestion - "GulfAid."
3. Building further on the whole "branding" thing that the conservatives seem to be so good at, we could name these fund raisers "In Exile," in honor of a well-known gay bar in the French Quarter, "Lafitte's In Exile."
4. Therefore, starting this weekend, we should hold fundraisers such as "Southern Decadence In Exile - for GulfAid" (Labor Day weekend is the weekend when Southern Decadence traditionally takes place) and "Girls Gone Wild - for GulfAid."

IMHO (and in all seriousness), if all the people who love New Orleans and attend these events contributed even 1/10th of what they would have spent down there towards these fundraisers, we could raise a considerable amount of money for "GulfAid," and do much to relieve the pain and suffering currently experienced by the residents of that entire area. Hopefully, our generosity will shame the corporate fat cats into giving up some of their ill-gotten gains towards this cause.

Furthermore, events like this would help keep the Dionysian, life-affirming spirit of New Orleans alive, help disseminate this spirit to the more unenlightened regions of this country, and would be the best possible challenge to those who would quash all displays of sexuality and free expression.

Interested in seeing what the rest of you think of this proposal. If you like my ideas, feel free to take them and run, with my blessing. Hope to see you at a fundraiser!

Rob Saqueton
Chicago, IL

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It's not the Apocolypse
Posted by: BuckFush on Sep 1, 2005 9:58 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Times like these are all too convienent for the bible thumpers to cast their apocolyptic lines. Ironically, Katrina hit the bible belt hardest. Is it because of the all the sinners in the south? No. Is it because God hates gays? Certainly He/She/It does not. Is it because Is it because of all the oil refineries? No, although the ensuing oil crisis should be enought to wake up the lawmakers in Washington. Maybe, just maybe it has something to do with the fact that the Big Easy lies below sea level. Maybe, just maybe it has something to do with the forces of nature that are independent of both dogma and humanity.

To say that the world is coming to an end is rediculuous. It was here for millions of years before man walked the earth, and it will certainly be here for millions of years after the last human takes one last breath. To suggest that humanity has the power to completely destroy the earth is all too arrogant. We might make it uninhabitable for ourselves, but that is a far cry from utter and complete destruction as the bully pulpit would have us believe.

As for the environmentalists, their doomsday picture is just as rediculous. Disasters like this one [along with the tsunami et al...] are part of the natural forces that shape and reshape the earth. Whether or not they are induced by the very real threat of global warming remains to be seen.

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Disclaimer
Posted by: Olympiada on Sep 1, 2005 10:03 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I gotta say, I in no way shape or form represent my religion. I am sharing how I got rid of the feeling of doom I had when reading the news off the wire last night. So please, take what I say with a rock of salt, not a grain, a rock.

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Katrina was Not God's Wrath for Gaza AND Israel Should be a Theme Park
Posted by: barrys new conversations on Sep 1, 2005 10:49 AM   
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The removing of Jews from Gaza was demanded by Israel's shrinking population.
The UN in 1947 didn't have eminent domain over the partition of Palestine when it counted the rigged vote set up by Bernard Baruch with the blessing of Truman.
Israel would fit biblical reality and be more appropriately sized as a theme park without nuclear weapons.
Zionists should stop spreading a revised history of their place in history.

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Storm warning
Posted by: hotlipsin61 on Sep 1, 2005 10:52 AM   
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The hurricane is another storm the United States is facing. This one, hoever, was created by nature; the other ones we created ourselves, like Iraq, the yawning deficit, Social Security woes, rising oil prices, et al. We have stormy weather all around us.
Who could fathom the Gulf Coast resembling Bangladesh, as New Orleans lies underwater? Residents have nowhere to go, as Vietnam's boat people did decades ago.
Lastly, this will cost the country billions to repair the damage down in those states affacted by the storm. Will it come out of the Pentagon's budget?

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A quick answer...
Posted by: nanobubble on Sep 1, 2005 10:59 AM   
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"no"

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What???? No spin (untruths) from the White House?
Posted by: LuhitYoung on Sep 1, 2005 11:29 AM   
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I am really wondering why White House has not claimed that Katrina was really a terrorist attack. Given that no truth has EVER come from the lips of the White Houst press office since January 2000, this must be an improvement!

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Hell yes it's punshiment
Posted by: SteveO on Sep 1, 2005 12:25 PM   
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It's punishment for likes of Zell Miller, Trent Lot, and the fact that all the states that were hit hard went to Bush in 2000 and 2004.

Praise the Lord!

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» Please tell me this is sarcasm Posted by: nickptar
» sarcasm...I hope Posted by: Michiganman
» RE: Hell yes it's punshiment Posted by: spyderbaby
It looks like they are setting us up again for ...
Posted by: zoro123 on Sep 1, 2005 12:47 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
a new manufactured event like 9/11 or maybe another premptive strike to really scare the pants off us all to give up more of our human rights, and make the rich richer, and the WORLD's PEOPLE... not just the people of the US.... MUCH POORER. I am 51, and a US RN... I am sickened to death that the first half of my life, I saw... or I was conditioned to see the world as a progressive, healing world on it's way to better things. The last half has been a slow, almost imperceptible shift to the other direction, to the point that I feel a fear that my very existance s threatened. This has been engineered. That fear will probably grow, because that is the agenda. Say it out loud with me... " God, please save us from this NWO"

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» Just dumb luck Posted by: Michiganman
Jesus say's, JEEZ
Posted by: Michiganman on Sep 1, 2005 4:49 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Is the scary story over yet? What a crock of dung.

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» What scary story? Posted by: Olympiada
» The one we are commenting on, ? Posted by: Michiganman
» Totally ridiculous, agreed. Posted by: Olympiada
» I agree, too Posted by: decembrist
Cause & Effect = Sh*t's Just Gonna Get More Vivid
Posted by: decembrist on Sep 1, 2005 6:39 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Let me say that everyone I know who wishes to keep this planet a hospitable and beautiful place (fit for humans and all life) doesn't believe that we are being punished for our sins, by the earth or by god. What we are experiencing is the catastrophe of our own unchecked greed and self-centeredness, whether this particular hurricane is worse because of global warming or not.

Cause and effect - driving your auto everywhere yields CO2 yields global warming, or building a city below sea level yields flooding and chaos from broken levees - is completely different than sinning and punishment. It also implies more responsibility - because cause and effect contains no forgiveness or "get out of jail free" cards.

Even with explicit evidence of global warming we today are still willing to live with the effect because what the effect really means hasn't sunken past the "I'm happy my Lexus has so many drink holders!" layer in our minds.

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Katrina and God
Posted by: thehousedog on Sep 1, 2005 8:32 PM   
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The other day, i burnt my oatmeal and it spoke to me. It was the voice of an invisible omniscient diety. It said to me, through the charcoal and the oats, that a tree would fall in the woods, or a forest, near my house, and that the birds that used to live there would come to the roof of my house and soil it. While I couldn't tell for sure about the tree falling, I did check my roof and sure enough, I saw bird droppings on it. Now, I'm going to start my own religion called the cult of burnt oatmeal worshippers.

what's the moral of this hokey story? that religion tries to explain that which we don't understand. in the case of some of us, we understand a whole lot less than others and thus, ask for more religion. the rest of us may have a bit more focus on the reality of now, without the hokey, unbelievable and certainly unreal explanations.

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» HA HA HA HA HA Posted by: Michiganman
?
Posted by: Ace-Del-Boy on Sep 2, 2005 1:15 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
whats a spiritual enviromentalist?

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» Spiritual environmentalist Posted by: Olympiada
God’s wrath - I don't thin so - but you reap what you sew
Posted by: IanA on Sep 2, 2005 12:38 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
In my little Portuguese village the people are angry at Mr. Bush. They are angry about Iraq, angry about lies, and now angry about seeing a mother and baby stranded without security, shelter, sanitation or water and food, four days after a massive storm which was forecast and for which plans should have been made, if not forethought of prevention taken.

It seems evacuation orders were given and otherwise little else was done to help those who for economic or other reasons could not or would not leave the city of New Orleans. In a city where 1 in 4 lives by degrees below the poverty line. Even the shelter at the Super Dome was provided only to those who qualified. They had to bring 2 days of food.

It seems that looting, rape, murder and snipers are rampant with the breakdown of law and order which has ensued filling the vacuum left by the lack of authority. Local authorities and police failed totally to provide direction and assistance to their community. It should not come as any surprise that disrespect for life and property and use of violence is as prevalent in the criminal elements of New Orleans as it is in the Bush administration.

Whether its the war in Iraq, the continued occupation, Bolton’s appointment and revision of the UN position statement for the summit this month, there is a fundamental moral void in the US administration’s view of humanity. This is so clear in the handling of this disaster. Mr. Bush cannot see humans as such. He does not accept that that they have basic rights and deserve respect no matter whether they are American or foreign, rich or poor, black or white, Muslim, Christian or Jew.

To the civilized, money and power, oil and resources, come after people in any world order.

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Belief net
Posted by: Olympiada on Sep 2, 2005 5:51 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I guess I have to add my own comment on belief net. It is not hard core enough for me, what ever that means. I like this forum better.

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A libertarian comments: What a waste of time!
Posted by: wdzeller on Sep 3, 2005 8:36 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
So what else is new? Another hurricane blows the literal hell out of a part of America that no person in their right mind would live in, unless you are a sixth generation native-born cracker or some inhabitant of another failed, crime-infested Government public housing project.

The fact is that ever since 1776 America has had to deal with a whole host of natural and man-made disasters, such as the New Madrid Earthquakes(there was an earthquake on average 4 times an hour, every day, over a 6 month period, including one 10,000 times more powerful than San Francisco, 1906), the Louisville Cholera Epidemic (about 5,000 died after the Ohio flooded), or try this one, Abraham Lincoln's Dirty Little War( they counted a minimum of 250,000 dead, during which time EVERY SINGLE constitutional right was suspended over the whole of his worthless administration). The main difference is, when comparing then to now, that in the past people accepted such bad things as a part of life and went on living best as they could. They were not slavish dependents of a failing imperial society, such as what we see in the U.S. today.

Nearly every problem we see in today's society is a result of a gross and expanded and intrusive government that was made possible by the introduction of fiat money and the ensuring host of regulations that infest us today. However, do not fear. In the entire history of corrupt financial systems where the currency is based upon government debt (the first such system was engineered in China around 1250 A.D.), and where borrowers are charged interest on money that doesn't exist, no such fiat system had lasted more than 41 years. Our own such system just turned 34 years old this August. Compared to 1930, when we had about $10 of debt for every $1 of gold, we now have around $1375 of debt for every $1 of cash. Within several years we will be facing similar problems that will dwarf what Imperial Rome faced around A.D. 410.

If you are shocked by the savage, animal-like behaviors of the underclass of New Orleans of recent days, then just wait a few years when we are treated with the ultimate financial collapse of the Dollar-based Federal system. You ain't seen nothing yet!

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If God sent Katrina to LA and MS
Posted by: pbr90king on Sep 5, 2005 9:44 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If God sent the hurricane to those states, it surely must have been from his displeasure at how his humans suffer from the disregard that has been shown in the delay in getting services to the disaster zones. If it wasn't clear before, it certainly is now.

For a region that promotes only its mardi gras and its casinos, that it would be so hard hit may just be a lesson in the logistics of how God values humanity, not a celebration of how man values humanity. Regional arrogance, having been the earmarks of the area for some time by the rest of nation, is difficult to ignore in the face of such devastation, and for those who are inclined to be especially religious and believe in a jealous God, his wrath cannot be misunderstood in this storm that brought this flood, much as the flood forecast for Noah. God's Ark was the answer for Noah's time. What is the answer for current time if mankind is dealing with a retributive God?

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Yes, HE did........
Posted by: Scott on Sep 5, 2005 8:39 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
HE did it to bring a proud and haughty people to their knees! THIS is the first of many storms being brought forth by their votes to elect a man who will be and is GOD'S arm of wrath!!

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