Orion Magazine / By Derrick Jensen
comments_imageCOMMENTS: 289

Taking Shorter Showers Doesn't Cut It: Why Personal Change Does Not Equal Political Change

Are we taking the easy route? Dumpster diving wouldn't have stopped Hitler, and composting wouldn't have ended slavery.
July 13, 2009  |  
 
 
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This article was first published in the July/August 2009 issue of Orion Magazine.

Would any sane person think dumpster diving would have stopped Hitler, or that composting would have ended slavery or brought about the eight-hour workday, or that chopping wood and carrying water would have gotten people out of Tsarist prisons, or that dancing naked around a fire would have helped put in place the Voting Rights Act of 1957 or the Civil Rights Act of 1964? Then why now, with all the world at stake, do so many people retreat into these entirely personal “solutions”?

Part of the problem is that we’ve been victims of a campaign of systematic misdirection. Consumer culture and the capitalist mindset have taught us to substitute acts of personal consumption (or enlightenment) for organized political resistance. An Inconvenient Truth helped raise consciousness about global warming. But did you notice that all of the solutions presented had to do with personal consumption—changing light bulbs, inflating tires, driving half as much—and had nothing to do with shifting power away from corporations, or stopping the growth economy that is destroying the planet? Even if every person in the United States did everything the movie suggested, U.S. carbon emissions would fall by only 22 percent. Scientific consensus is that emissions must be reduced by at least 75 percent worldwide.

Or let’s talk water. We so often hear that the world is running out of water. People are dying from lack of water. Rivers are dewatered from lack of water. Because of this we need to take shorter showers. See the disconnect? Because I take showers, I’m responsible for drawing down aquifers? Well, no. More than 90 percent of the water used by humans is used by agriculture and industry. The remaining 10 percent is split between municipalities and actual living breathing individual humans. Collectively, municipal golf courses use as much water as municipal human beings. People (both human people and fish people) aren’t dying because the world is running out of water. They’re dying because the water is being stolen.

Or let’s talk energy. Kirkpatrick Sale summarized it well: “For the past 15 years the story has been the same every year: individual consumption—residential, by private car, and so on—is never more than about a quarter of all consumption; the vast majority is commercial, industrial, corporate, by agribusiness and government [he forgot military]. So, even if we all took up cycling and wood stoves it would have a negligible impact on energy use, global warming and atmospheric pollution.”

Or let’s talk waste. In 2005, per-capita municipal waste production (basically everything that’s put out at the curb) in the U.S. was about 1,660 pounds. Let’s say you’re a die-hard simple-living activist, and you reduce this to zero. You recycle everything. You bring cloth bags shopping. You fix your toaster. Your toes poke out of old tennis shoes. You’re not done yet, though. Since municipal waste includes not just residential waste, but also waste from government offices and businesses, you march to those offices, waste reduction pamphlets in hand, and convince them to cut down on their waste enough to eliminate your share of it. Uh, I’ve got some bad news. Municipal waste accounts for only 3 percent of total waste production in the United States.

I want to be clear. I’m not saying we shouldn’t live simply. I live reasonably simply myself, but I don’t pretend that not buying much (or not driving much, or not having kids) is a powerful political act, or that it’s deeply revolutionary. It’s not. Personal change doesn’t equal social change.

So how, then, and especially with all the world at stake, have we come to accept these utterly insufficient responses? I think part of it is that we’re in a double bind. A double bind is where you’re given multiple options, but no matter what option you choose, you lose, and withdrawal is not an option. At this point, it should be pretty easy to recognize that every action involving the industrial economy is destructive (and we shouldn’t pretend that solar photovoltaics, for example, exempt us from this: they still require mining and transportation infrastructures at every point in the production processes; the same can be said for every other so-called green technology). So if we choose option one—if we avidly participate in the industrial economy—we may in the short term think we win because we may accumulate wealth, the marker of “success” in this culture. But we lose, because in doing so we give up our empathy, our animal humanity. And we really lose because industrial civilization is killing the planet, which means everyone loses. If we choose the “alternative” option of living more simply, thus causing less harm, but still not stopping the industrial economy from killing the planet, we may in the short term think we win because we get to feel pure, and we didn’t even have to give up all of our empathy (just enough to justify not stopping the horrors), but once again we really lose because industrial civilization is still killing the planet, which means everyone still loses. The third option, acting decisively to stop the industrial economy, is very scary for a number of reasons, including but not restricted to the fact that we’d lose some of the luxuries (like electricity) to which we’ve grown accustomed, and the fact that those in power might try to kill us if we seriously impede their ability to exploit the world—none of which alters the fact that it’s a better option than a dead planet. Any option is a better option than a dead planet.


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Derrick Jensen is an activist and the author of many books, most recently What We Leave Behind and Songs of the Dead.
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Are you unemployed?
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Spot on Jul 13, 2009 12:11 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Stop looking for a job and start organizing! Knock on every door on your block, the next block, and the block beyond that. Find your unemployed and underemployed neighbors. Politics isn't something that only happens in November, it is what happens whenever we meet to solve our collective problems.

If you live in a city, you must seize control of government or you will be cut out of the supply chain when collapse hits.

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» But seriously folks! Posted by: frankly1
» RE: But seriously folks! Posted by: xmvince
» RE: But seriously folks! Posted by: TNT666
» RE: But seriously folks! Posted by: pomes
» RE: Are you unemployed? Posted by: jwc1480
» RE: Are you unemployed? Posted by: Spot

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One of the Most Important Articles Alterent Has Ever Posted
[Report this comment]
Posted by: mmckinl on Jul 13, 2009 12:26 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Why?

This article cuts through the bull and shows us the entire landscape of the fight for the environment and the progressive agenda in general ...

This article gives us the real figures on pollution and the minute impact of trying to take these issues on as individuals instead of banding together to confront the bad actors that perpetrate the pollution and problems in the first place.

The tactics that the PTB use are laid bare. That the individual is targeted as both the problem and the solution when in fact we are chasing our own tails while the polluters and profiteers merrily go on about their business.

get involved and get involved now ...

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» RE: get involved and get involved now Posted by: tommy_slothrop

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No worries, Honkey...
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Nebris on Jul 13, 2009 1:28 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
...Nature will just as happily slaughter the 'brown theists' when Her Bill comes due. =)

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funny that you should mention Rome--check out the declining Italian birthrate
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Suzon on Jul 13, 2009 1:33 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The birth rate is below replacement level. (And by the way, who exactly is pro-abortion?)

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Up to 12?
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Beck on Jul 13, 2009 6:52 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
.

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RE: I think I’ll just fiddle as Rome burns.
[Report this comment]
Posted by: TNT666 on Jul 13, 2009 4:11 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Well that means we just have to work harder on convincing our «sisters of another color» to quit religion and contracept too. I hope the «brothers of another color» will do the same.

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Not that I'm disagreeing entirely...
[Report this comment]
Posted by: jparsons on Jul 13, 2009 1:10 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
...but surely much of that industrial use is in making
stuff for individuals to buy (or not buy)?

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» RE: good point Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» RE: Pulp Mills Posted by: PeterW
» RE: Pulp Mills Posted by: TNT666
» Move to New Zealand? Posted by: jparsons
» RE: Move to New Zealand? Posted by: photon's feather
» True... Posted by: jparsons
» RE: True... Posted by: photon's feather
» Sorry... In case I wan't clear: Posted by: photon's feather
» Yes, I have thanked him since. Posted by: jparsons
» RE: True... Posted by: evolve
» Exactly Posted by: tommy_slothrop
» RE: xactly Posted by: TNT666

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Two Simple Steps
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Nebris on Jul 13, 2009 1:24 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
One: Remove ALL Heavy Industry from the surface of the planet.

Two: Reduce the total number of humans on the surface of the planet by 90%.

Note I said simple, not easy.

And for those who will scream about #Two, be aware that the elimination of 'the industrial economy' the author calls for would create such an outcome anyway.

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» You first, baby.. Posted by: Nebris
» Thank You... Posted by: Nebris
» Not that hard, people... Posted by: Rusty Shackleford

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the roots of crime in the western world go back nearly a thousand years
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Suzon on Jul 13, 2009 1:23 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
when William the Conquerer granted a royal charter to an association of powerful men in the City of London. The Corporation of the City of London would have been entitled to enter people's houses, destroy their goods and run them out of town.

Today privileged associations of powerful men (banks and other corporations) simply take our money and houses through "legal' means.

Off topic? Not at all. The wasteful and destructive rat race is based on the rich needing to dominate and exhaust us lest we get our act together and give them their comeuppance.

We have been fooled into thinking we need jobs. People don't need jobs, they need food, water and shelter.

If we stopped extracting oil and minerals and stopped manufacturing unnecessary goods, our lives would be happier and the earth could begin to recover from the aggressive behavior of the frightened rich.

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» If, if, if.... Posted by: batmagoo
» RE: If, if, if.... Posted by: wbblack
» RE: If, if, if.... Posted by: TNT666
» RE: If, if, if.... Posted by: johnthetreehugger
» RE: If, if, if.... Posted by: TNT666
» yup... Posted by: batmagoo
» RE: WRONG Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» RE: WRONG Posted by: HoboHomo
» Right on Sister Posted by: wbblack
» Wrong again Lauren... Posted by: brunowe
» RE: WRONG Posted by: photon's feather
» RE: WRONG Posted by: melloe2

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Overpopulation is the root and should be addressed at some point...
[Report this comment]
Posted by: batmagoo on Jul 13, 2009 1:44 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Great article, sure - but regrettably, like every other commentary on environmental collapse in modern media, it looks at "comfortable" targets near the bottom of the elephant in the room, but fails to discuss the overhanging root of this environmental crisis: No political or industrial paradigm shift is going to stop the impending catastrophe any more than dumpster diving was ever going to stop Hitler ( or sorting through our plastic bottles, or holding-in our farts for that matter )...if we are "going to get serious, people," we need to tackle the inconvenient truth of which even inconvenient truth hunters dare not speak: Human Overpopulation!
The greatest societal taboo...
No offense to Derrick Jensen, who is probably a happy father of two, it is worth noting that in a Judeo-Christian culture brainwashed with notions of a God-given Earthly Paradise, joy-for-all, beauty-of-childbirth myths, and so on, it is hard to get folks to grasp that human multiplication is little more than a cancer.
Speaking-out about ways to fix the world by side-stepping the issue of population growth and ( yes! ) "Population-growth control," is a canard - the spreading of false hope.
One of the dirtiest words on our language is the branding of "neo-malthusian."
It is our fundamental attitudes which must be re-examined.
If we are to do anything -- anything at all -- we need to get topical.
Anything else is mental masturbation, indeed.
Masturbation? wait!
There's a solution.

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» Ah yep Posted by: Sympa
» What you're missing. Posted by: heid

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Or Stupidest Article Ever Written?
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Lloydmillerus on Jul 13, 2009 3:22 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Did it never occur to the Left that the basic tenent of "Environmentalism" is that the "people" are the problem? Is it just a co-incidence that the richest people in the world got together in the Club of Rome and launched the environmentalist movement based on scare tactics to reduce the standard of living of the masses?

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» Wrong again Lauren Posted by: brunowe
» RE: Or Stupidest Article Ever Written? Posted by: johnthetreehugger

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Thanks for posting this, Alternet
[Report this comment]
Posted by: vision on Jul 13, 2009 3:58 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Derrick Jensen is probably the most important thinker of our time, and if a whole bunch of us don't head his message soon, there's going to be very little life left for our grandchildren.

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» RE: Thanks for posting this, Alternet Posted by: Sister_Lauren

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Jensen makes a great case.
[Report this comment]
Posted by: JenniferBedingfield on Jul 13, 2009 4:20 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We are so accustomed to linear equations. As a result, we sometimes fail to realize that there is a place for everyone, and thus a number of solutions and approaches at the proverbial table.

It is important that some persons act as wayshowers/role models to forms of living that go more gently on this amazing earth. It is important that citizens/consumers recognize that every time they buy a big mac, they contribute to the "meat market." Unless we're talking pasture raised and local grown meat which is obviously more expensive, the issue of sustainability will be more difficult to ignore. I happen to think that eating more meat also contributes to more macho-egotistical personality traits and the over-all ridiculously inflated US emphasis on Mars, war, aggression, in general.

Jensen makes an important case, critical really, that the individual can only do so much via lifestyle alterations. A lot of would-be activists dilute their passion by diverting the call to change ONLY to their own neck of the woods. To me this is similar to the New Age movement that co-opted much political activism in general by diverting persons to the task of "self work," the quintessential inside job. I often argue that it must be both! The individual owns an obligation to evolve at his or her own rate, but so, too, must citizens contribute to the overall evolution of the society they share. It is not an either/or proposition.

One hidden factor of the "Mars rules" bankrupt ethos that is so prevalent in our land of the hardly brave is the focus on SELF. We see it in consumerism, that TV commercials market to the "single digit consumer," to increase sales/market shares. It is also seen in the "YOYO" economic priorities, in the conservative belief that everyone is responsible for himself; and in its most raw form, as competition, the sporting arena, and its acme, the killing fields a/k/a "theaters" of war.

As scarcity begins persons will by necessity find themselves forced to learn how to work better together. Community will emerge from the ashes. Truly we are coming into a phase where we either learn to care for one another, or may otherwise perish. An armed nation with lots of persons angry, hungry and/or homeless (added to those who cannot get humane treatment for medical needs) can be a land more dangerous than any scene drawn from an apocalyptic film.

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» You don't know Obama much do you? Posted by: Wayne Etheridge

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Retired Citizen
[Report this comment]
Posted by: dogman12 on Jul 13, 2009 4:22 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This article brought something to light that's been at the back of my mind for some time, and couldn't quite bring into focus. Conditioning of a sort, perhaps. Complacency more likely, I'm ashamed to say! I'm one of those that recycles, and composts and signs petitions to fight injustice. An all-around tree-hugger, I suppose you could say. Needless to say, it's quite a shock to realize that, as things stand now in the world, it's all been rather pointless. I'm at the age where, as they say, there are less days ahead than behind me. Perhaps that's a good thing, now. God help the kids that will really suffer for our stupidity!

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» RE: etired Citizen Posted by: kilgore4356

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Consumer Power
[Report this comment]
Posted by: CTC123 on Jul 13, 2009 4:39 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Consider the Connection to:
Environmental Communication
IN'PUT=READ-SEE-LISTEN
OUT'PUT=WRITE-SPEAK
=CONSUMER ACTION
Please Search:
CTC123GREEN
The more you know,
The more connections you make.
Great article, Derric Jensen

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Shorter showers?
[Report this comment]
Posted by: PJAW on Jul 13, 2009 4:46 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I tried that for awhile, but I got tired of bending over to rinse my hair.

George Carlin was onto something when he hypothesized that the earth spawned humans as a life form because it needed plastic for its next evolutionary phase. Which clearly implies that we are not the culmination of the evolutionary process but only a step along the way, which may or may not be a comforting thought.

I find it more than a little ironic, that if evolution is real ("scientists disagree" - sure they do) the ones who seem to be denying its validity are also the ones accelerating its progression. As in having more babies and using more resources (driving the chemical changes the planet is undergoing as a result of our presence).

The human ego knows no boundaries, (as in we're "God's" greatest achievement or "we're destroying the planet"). We're not destroying the planet, but we certainly may be changing it in ways that make it uninhabitable for our kind. Or at least unsupportive of the number of us that has accumulated.

The next hundred years should prove interesting, I wish I could live long enough to experience them. Ever shower outside while drinking a cold beer? Delightful.

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» RE: isn't mutation fun? Posted by: PJAW
» Missing Link? Posted by: Hiroak

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Since World Power Is In The Hands Of A Handful...
[Report this comment]
Posted by: ZPaul on Jul 13, 2009 4:58 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If we're going to talk about personal change, the first ones who should be setting the example, environmentally and otherwise, are that handful.

And, of course, they are not doing so. That's for "the masses"; the elite, the super-wealthy, who seem to want us to believe that they have a "higher calling", are the "exceptions to the rule" (or so they think)

This is typical in so many areas. The rich want to hold the poor accountable for the things that they bear most of the guilt for , many times over, not simply through how they live their personal lives, but how they maintain their personal power and privilege through their exploitation of the poor throughout the world.

In general, the attitude of the rich, especially the super-rich, with regard to ecology is absolutely hypocritical and disgusting. They are never going to change willingly, you can count on that. The most they will do is window dressing, and give a lot of publicity to that window dressing.

Until the power is in the hands of the people, how can we say democracy exists anywhere?

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Time for Green collective action
[Report this comment]
Posted by: greenferret on Jul 13, 2009 5:20 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Individual lifestyle changes won't make our civilization sustainable. Neither will articles on the internet, if all we do is read them and post our comments in the hope that our wisdom will slowly but surely change the world.

We need collective political action. Green Parties around the world have known this since the 1970s. Get active with the Greens and help lead our civilization from the failed model of corporatist consumerism to a more sustainable, just, and meaningful society.

Green Party of the United States

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Big Government
[Report this comment]
Posted by: snowhound on Jul 13, 2009 5:53 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It's funny how people think they can change things by politically changing the way our government operates. Does any so called progressive on this site ever think that maybe the reason we have this problem in the first place is because our government has grown too large and powerful and it is the reason we consume too much and pollute to much? If the federal government did not remove the gold standard and stuck with sound money, maybe we wouldn't have been able to print so much money and spend so much on worthless stuff. If the government didn't subsidize agriculture maybe we wouldn't have genetically engineered corn sweeteners in every food item in the supermarket. If the government would follow the Constitution, maybe we wouldn't be in endless wars while trying to maintain a world empire. If government followed the Constitution, maybe we wouldn't have a Federal Reserve system that artificially lowered interests rates which enabled people to borrow too much and buy way to much junk! As I see it government has enabled the big corporations to gain control and push out small business through regulations, trade agreements, and taxes. If government didn't subsidize health care maybe big Pharma wouldn't have so much power over our health system. Maybe the answer is Freedom! Freedom without government coercion and corporate control.

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» RE: Big Government Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» RE: Big Government Posted by: snowhound
» RE: Big Government Posted by: johnthetreehugger
» RE: Big Government Posted by: snowhound
» RE: Big Government Posted by: TNT666

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Yep.
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Stell on Jul 13, 2009 5:58 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As usual, Jensen is right.

People may not like it, but he's right.

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Divide and Conquer
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Cybershaman on Jul 13, 2009 6:03 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It's a tactic I've been seeing for several decades. A good example is how the issue of industrial pollution was turned on it's head. I suspect if we could trace where the money came from for the anti-smoking campaign it would lead back to the major industrial polluters. By keeping us busy being outraged by our neighbors second hand smoke we have lost focus on that area of town where huge smokestacks belch out tons of toxic particles every day.

I predict that any 'carbon tax' legislation passed will actually translate into an individual price for exhaling carbon dioxide when it all comes down. THAT seems to be the pattern.

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» RE: Divide and Conquer Posted by: richholland

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Good points
[Report this comment]
Posted by: aazippo2 on Jul 13, 2009 6:16 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Wow, excellent points indeed.

RT
Ultimate Anonymity

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» Piracy when it counts. Posted by: GuitarBill

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We pay these people to enslave us.
[Report this comment]
Posted by: rafaeltoral on Jul 13, 2009 6:21 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We pay the government and corporations to be our slave handlers. If you want to quit being a slave quit giving them money.

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oh well......
[Report this comment]
Posted by: grmartin on Jul 13, 2009 6:38 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As things get worse, pro-active efforts at sustainability reform will probably be overwhelmed in a tide of destruction, starvation and migration as the ecosystem goes on auto-correct, ie collaspes. And if we do get reduced by 90%, the survivors will have done so by the most capicious means, not through any good will or voluntary self- denial, and will be more vicious than ever. By now I think one thing is clear, humans as a species are not capable of living within their means on this planet. Too bad, so sad! Bring me back that old time religion!

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» RE: oh well...... Posted by: HoboHomo

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No, taking the easy route is saying, "Do whatever you want, just like you were always told"
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Beck on Jul 13, 2009 6:44 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Dumpster diving and HITLER? Come on. When someone has to toss Hitler into an argument, watch out. And anyway, the dumpster diving version of opposition against Hitler was valid and important. Would you NOT have hidden in a Dutch attic just because that action to help individual Jews didn't flat-out stop Hitler?

Too many articles now with either/or thinking, or with "you should do this, because I do, and I'd like to keep convincing myself that I don't have to do anything else, YOU do" or both. No, personal change does not EQUAL political change. Driving less doesn't EQUAL flying less, and shorter showers don't equal less coal plants. Straw men, nothing but straw men, while the planet fries, melts, and floods. All blather designed to hide the essential personal question, "What else do I have to do?" and the essential political question: (ditto). Many articles on alternet are followed by comments about how our lifestyle is not sustainable. Now we seem to get one, popular enough to be repeated here after being on other websites, that soothes us with contrary information. And it's all words, while scientists write more articles on rising sea levels and 385 ppm of carbon in the atmosphere. And methane burps. And hydrogen sulfide.

Shorter showers AND better political action are what's needed. Who was it that said you can't solve a problem by using the same thinking that caused it? Was it Einstein? Well, even the title of this article is problem thinking. And it's typically American: " there must be some way I can take showers thoughtlessly, because any thinking I'm forced to do about my lifestyle and its consequences means I've been cheated. Doesn't matter if I'm being cheated out of something not worth having. I'm supposed to get (I've heard this as an American many times a day, every day of my life, so it's obviously true) everything that pops into my head that equals convenience and/or pleasure. I've heard that convenience and pleasure are not only better than anything else, anything else is garbage."

Or it's that other typical American thinking: "So what? Other things are worse."

Isn't 25% of the carbon in the atmosphere right now from Americans and our lifestyles? Don't tell me it doesn't matter, or that our lifestyle changes don't cause bigger changes. WalMart now stocks organics and BST-free milk; in fact, I think ALL their milk is now hormone free. They didn't do that out of their great benevolence and concern. They did it because they were losing money to places that already sold such things.

Don't fall for hogwash. Don't wait for "leadership" or for corporations to do the right thing while you're showering for 20 minutes. And don't bleat "Obahahahahahama" unless you're, oh, never mind. Some of you bleat Obama if the subject is football.

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» A little too far to the right, no? Posted by: JenniferBedingfield

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You need to shave your head, be labotomized and get some tattoos to comment here.
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Posted by: grindermonkey on Jul 13, 2009 6:53 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The industrial food supply and the pharmaceutical industry has replaced natural selection. Busch Lite is another big contributor.

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» is that what you're like? Posted by: ismac76

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So what's the next step beyond accolades?
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Posted by: ismac76 on Jul 13, 2009 7:01 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I too appreciate Derrick's lucid decimation of the green capitalist ruse. In many ways I have understood what he speaks for far longer than I have read or listened to his words.
The missing element is the Commons.
Those who have found themselves in this age of crisis...out of work, fed up with school, debt addled, fed up with your labor being used to destroy our world so some rich fucks who think we just don't get it can enjoy the priviledge of decidering from their yachts, planes and multiple homes....
CONVERGE
we need to claim land, and space to self sustain. Start looking everywhere for sympathetic minds and appropriate unused space. Break through the privacy bubble of the individuals here and there to see exactly how many people share this frustration. Why should TV be the only accepted form of platonic social intercourse, or petitions, or religion? Build relationships, get the idea out there so it is as ubiquitous as the ideas of pointless social action have been up until now. people have been waiting for something real for a long time. last but not least...remember pacifism is only an option if you can choose to act decisively otherwise. let's not be pacifists by default, but pacifists by choice. Be ready, this winter, next spring so we can plant seeds under no flag other than our that of own community of self determination. A fire is burning hot and bright in the hearts of many thousands, let's build a bonfire. If you want to get anything, DEMAND EVERYTHING!!!

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Our political system is also a "double bind"
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Posted by: wcscheurer on Jul 13, 2009 7:04 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Without necessarily agreeing with much of the author's worldview, I want to point out that political action in this country also puts us in a "double bind" predicament.

"I think part of it is that we’re in a double bind. A double bind is where you’re given multiple options, but no matter what option you choose, you lose, and withdrawal is not an option."

That pretty much describes the two-party duopoly that limits our political action today -- which makes me want to go out back and meditate on my compost bin ...

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The whole system needs to change.
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Posted by: r3s0n4t0r on Jul 13, 2009 7:46 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It's the fundamental structure of the capatalist fracional reserve monetary system which is largely to blame for the environmental degredation of our planet. The whole system is based on exponential growth of resources being sold to consumers and wasted. It is completely dependant on the perpetual growth and therefore cannot afford to be sustainable. The whole system relies on cyclical consumumption of the Earth's resources for profit not matter what environmental cost. Corruption and waste are built into the system, scarcity of resources means greater profit.
That's why people like Al Gore and the so called government are not going to change anything for they will do everything in there upmost to keep the system in place along with banking interests and corporations. It's insulting that they're even trying to influence the population into changing their way of living when it's them at the top who are largely to blame for this mess.
Ignorance is the only reason this system is still going. People would be revolting in the streets if they really knew how the system worked.
'Money As Debt' is a very good video when it comes to understanding how flawed this fractional reserve system really is. I encourage everyone to look it up on google video.
Money is completely irrelevant as we now how sufficient technology to provide a surplus of resources to everyone on the planet. Don't believe this crap your told that the planet is overpopulated and resources are running out. Is it not in their greatest interest for people to believe this is true? People are not starving in Africa becasue of scarcity of resources, it's largely due to greed. This whole depopulation agenda we're hearing deeply disturbs me.
Yes our world is in a bad state, but it's obvious that it's our society which needs change before we can even begin to focus our attention on the planet. The Venus Project offers a good alternative to out present system. By all means look it up.

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Language Worker
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Posted by: WordLab on Jul 13, 2009 8:14 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Ethical matters are not “personal.” With six billion people and headed for nine, there are no (longer) private acts. It is simply wrong and dissimulating to assert that that it is a tenet of “freedom” and “liberty” and “democracy” that “ethics” and “morals” are private and concern only us. This is precisely, resoundingly false. Behaviors and consequences are ethical choices and moral matters simply, and only, because they matter. To us. To our collective well-being. To our survival. To a recognizable enduring ecosystem.

Derrick Jensen has an astonishing and unflinching courage and conviction. I think he may be the most courageously self-examining author I have read.

There is nothing that we do –that you or I do- that does not engage us. Everything we do –collectively- broadcasts our clumsy, burdensome and irreversible degradation and waste of resources and spread of contaminants. Our institutions and our very "civilization" have become profoundly, unspeakably destructive. We can choose to be civic actors and do harm to a greater or lesser degree. Behaviors are ethical and moral, only insofar as they are not unethical, not immoral.

Read an essay about this at

http://www.takebackourlanguage.com/blog/
2008/09/07/there-are-no-private-acts/#202

There is no dishonor in honesty, and there is no immorality in acknowledging the harm we do. Derrick Jensen has demonstrated this with a public, and unequalled, integrity and dignity. I think I would not have the courage to hold these convictions if I had not read him.

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gimmie shelter
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Posted by: gimmie shelter on Jul 13, 2009 8:19 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Some may conclude that outsourcing in a way is good for us in the United States, after all China and so on are polluting their part of the world and not ours. Well think again. Pollution has no politics or recognizes no boundaries and eventually spreads to all parts of our planet given enough time. These corporations could be dismantled by a concerted effort to not buy their products or stocks. If this is done to a number of key polluters the rest will get the message. Of course if the other corporations do not get the message we can do the same to them. As for dams there should be no dams. Let the water flow once again to bring nutrients to the places that have been starved for far to long.

If any area could not survive without emptying the rivers or streams then let it go back to what it was before the dams. Instead of dams for producing electricity use solar and wind.

We need to stop or even reverse what corporations have done and are doing. They are in control of the bus we are all riding on and that bus is about to go over a cliff. There will be no do over. If any of us survive it will the corporations who owned the buses and not we whom were forced to ride on them.

Do you really think that the rich have not constructed ways to survive what we all see is coming. They are prepared but it is we who are not....yet.

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» RE: gimmie shelter Posted by: TNT666

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End result
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Posted by: willymack on Jul 13, 2009 8:26 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We're experincing the end result of cannibalistic capitalism. How do you like it?
The merchant royalty would just LOVE it if we were all narcissistic, compulsive consumers of stuff, mindless and heedless of any bad consequence of our actions or non-actions.
The problem with humans everywhere is they don't want to THINK. That's how and why psychotic parasites are able to make us all jump through their hoops.
Not wanting to think blinds us to the malevolent nature of the various predators only too willing to steal, by ANY means, the lion's share of everything worth having; hell, we practically WORSHIP them.
If this one tendency doesn't change, the inevitable collapse will occur. Mother Nature will NOT be cheated, and she can be a BITCH.

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Maybe I should sell my bicycle and buy an Excursion
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Posted by: thedevil666 on Jul 13, 2009 9:02 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I think I will stop using condoms, too. Sarcasm aside, though I agree with the point that many of the problems are systemic, but that does not absolve each and every one of us from our own personal responsibility. If we could reduce driving by 50% in this country through collective acts of personal thrift we wouldn't need to clear cut forests and create tailing ponds so we can access the oil sands of Alberta.

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Straw man
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Posted by: Mousey on Jul 13, 2009 9:07 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"Would any sane person think dumpster diving would have stopped Hitler, or that composting would have ended slavery or brought about the eight-hour workday, or that chopping wood and carrying water would have gotten people out of Tsarist prisons, or that dancing naked around a fire would have helped put in place the Voting Rights Act of 1957 or the Civil Rights Act of 1964?"

Apples and oranges. While I agree we need cohesive political might, please do not denigrate the critical need for individuals to make different choices. Only when we change our ways of living and thinking will we truly be able to influence others.

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» RE: Straw man Posted by: sunnywater
» RE: Straw man Posted by: obliu222
» RE: Straw man Posted by: Alternativepowerguy

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Deck chairs on the Titanic?
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Posted by: westomoon on Jul 13, 2009 9:23 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
In a strange way, I find it sort of comforting that it may already be too late to tip the balance back to where the Earth can sustain the huge number of people already on it, or the rapacious approach to life that has bloomed under patriarchal monotheism.

Planetary degradation is outstripping all the scientific models, and we still can't even bring ourselves to take the tiny steps that might have helped if we'd done them 40 years ago, but are definitely too little, too late now. Collectively, we don't seem capable of saving ourselves or our planet.

But the remnant of humanity that will be left (speaking optimistically) after we've crashed the planet won't have the luxury of being as stupid and self-destructive as we've been. That's the happiest ending I can see to our current self-created mess, and it's comforting, in a strange, detached way.

This was a spectacular article. As improving tech has made it easy, I've done all the green things -- with full knowledge that it's just to reduce the enormous shame I feel at being a part of the species that has caused the sixth mass extinction and is still destroying the planet that gave us life.

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Just a few days ago...
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Posted by: wildbill on Jul 13, 2009 9:27 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
...AlterNet published an article in which James Lovelock said it's too late, we're already toast, all of these efforts are akin to rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic, so why even bother writing anything more about what we should and shouldn't do? The best advice for handling the coming environmental/economic/political/societal collapse is: 1) stand or sit with legs apart, 2) bend over as far as you can with head between legs, 3) use hands to pull head farther back between legs, 4) kiss your ass goodbye.

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» gimmie shelter Posted by: gimmie shelter

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I concur
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Posted by: maddy on Jul 13, 2009 10:28 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I agree with the above article that this essay is really important.

I've taught for nearly 10 years and I gotta say that one of the most horrifying classes I ever had was at an institution that prides itself on being a radical training ground--no grades, no departments, no majors--the students design their own programs and do their own independent research. At least in theory.

In the process, we would all delude ourselves that we were somehow activists who were changing the world. (I think I may vomit if I ever have to again hear the expressions "speak truth to power" or "I need to examine my own privilege.")

Anyway, this particular class was on economic globalization.

And the best writer in the class insisted that, and I quote, "The only power we have is as consumers."

And the rest in the class agreed with him. They believed that their "freedom" was linked to the "freedom" of the marketplace and they could only see themselves as individual consumers. Worse, and truly horrifying, they thought that they were EMPOWERED as a result. As long as they could condemn racism, and sexism, and homophobia, and US foreign policy in the sanctity of these classrooms, they were somehow "radicals," but they couldn't see that they too were "sold" an identity by the college itself. Hence, the students either didn't know or didn't care about how the college busted an attempt by hourly workers on campus to unionize, nor did they understand or care that the bulk of faculty were hired as adjuncts or visiting profs so that they could be paid less and easily let go to save money.

I told them that it was probably the most upsetting thing I had ever heard in a classroom. What about cizitenship, or communities, or the commons? They clearly didn't know the history of struggle that is the United States--the abilitionist movement, the labor movement, the suffragist movement, the civil rights movement, the gay liberation movement, etc. These movements weren't based on how people "felt" or what they bought or didn't buy--they were direct confronations with institutions of power--some violent, most militant, and all collective and unapologetic.

So, yes, this article is very important.

On another note, I'm also glad that the author recognized that the "I'm a political hero cuz I'm not having a baby" is similar in its prioritizing of self-delusion over actual social change.

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» oops... Posted by: maddy
» Hipsters Posted by: Nebris
» RE: I concur Posted by: TNT666

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So, Ted Kaczynski was right all along?
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Posted by: HoboHomo on Jul 13, 2009 10:29 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Well?

Industrial Society and Its Future (the Unabomber Manifesto).

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» Eerie, isn't it? Posted by: Urstrly

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More of the same
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Posted by: sirios on Jul 13, 2009 10:40 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This article is just more of the same, more clever, but more of the same. He is asking us to use polarity as a means of correcting the imbalance in relativity. It is the us and them game once again. If the us side asserts it self a great deal more, then the them side will surrender and join the ranks of "us" . The author describes "them" as menacing and "us' as weak do gooders, and then gives us a David and Goliath pep talk, a good pep talk but a pep talk. Assignment of blame no matter how clever and palatable it is to Alternet intellectuals, is still just intellectual inspiration about the imbalance that greed and corruption produce. how exactly does removing power from one side and placing it in the hands of the opposite exact a solution. Can the us group handle power more compassionately because they have so long been without ? maybe at first, but remember, power corrupts. If the reassignment of power was so effective, it would have worked centuries ago. The correction of opposites feeds into the continued existence of opposing forces and becomes an obstacle to unity. The reason we have this dilemma is because of the entrenched belief that life is limited to individualized personality.
Solution ? introduce the thems and us to our common essence, awareness awake to it self. This is NOT a missing knowledge but what knowledge resides in. It is the container of knowledge which is unified in nature by virtue of the fact that it does not require an observer and an object of observation. it remains in a constant state of self referral while simultaneously allowing objects of polarity to exist inside of it. The result of this realization is that the individual now sees itself and the environment as irrevocably connected. The them and us and the environment are no longer at odds with each other. The problem of convincing "them" and of maintaing the new us is accomplished without fear based legislation to keep the greedy rebels in line.

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Big task
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Posted by: Jaffe on Jul 13, 2009 10:46 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Astute article.

But it's a big challenge. I mentioned in an earlier post that official culture actually approved of the so-called political correctness struggles of the 80s and 90s because it balkanized progressives, pitting faction against faction for what amounted to a very small slice of the financial pie.

The situation is worse now because of several factors, including global capitalist propaganda (or media warfare), where people's legitimate grievances are marginalized, rendered invisible, or simple lied about.

Meanwhile. the imposed obsession with technology has young would-be progressives murdering baddies in video games, even as what is left of "real time" pulses around them.

Perhaps the final disappointment is the ethical cowardice of those who should know better. I see it everyday among my intelligent, enfeebled university colleagues.

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We need to stop
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Posted by: wormfarmer on Jul 13, 2009 10:52 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
screwing around with the media created distractions, the socio-political distractions, take control of our futures, (and the futures of succeeding generations), and treat the planet with the respect and responsibility it deserves. This goes for ALL contributors to the problem. I wish I could present another solution, but the dismantling of the current system through dissent, refusal to support the present political industrial economic systems, open revolt, to achieve a responsible society that pays attention to the needs of the planet, populace, and succeeding generations, (thats not going to stop), is a drastic solution, but it will have an effect.
This is OUR ONLY HOME! Lets concentrate on saving it.

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I Hate My Job Anyway!!!
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Posted by: Klaus on Jul 13, 2009 11:06 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Check out this website linked text and read "Radical Simplicity" by Jim Merkel. Also another interesting read is "Radical Simplicity" by Dan Price linked text. I am very much considering these options because as the title says I HATE MY JOB. I have always hated my jobs! JOBS SUCK!!! P.S. If you are wondering what I do for a living, I am an Electrical Engineer.

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our grandparents in the 1930's were TOUGHER then us!
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Posted by: frantic1971 on Jul 13, 2009 11:40 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I keep thinking back to the 1930s--the labor movement, for example. People got out and picketed and protested and tried to organize unions often at risk of their lives. And these were just ordinary Joes--our grandparents and great-grandparents. What courage it must have taken for these people to face-down the likes of U.S. Steel and Ford. Witness the infamous "Memorial Day Massacre" when 10 people were killed.

My dad was a farmer in Nebraska. He and other farmers got together and forcibly stopped farm foreclosures. He always told a story to us kids about how once at a "foreclosure action", a Nebraska State Trooper pointed a shotgun at him and screamed "stand back you sonofabitch, or I'll fill you full of lead!".

Is it just me, or do people today in general just seem to be ball-less in the face of this oppression? Are folks today afraid that protesting or picketing might "affect their credit rating"? Is it something in the water or food that has effectively emasculated the People's fighting spirit?

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Personal change DOES produce political action and social change
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Posted by: MotherLodeBeth on Jul 13, 2009 12:28 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Personal change DOES produce political action and social change. Here in the Sierras with less garbage being produced we have less land fill. When on neighbor installed off the grid solar other neighbors did as well. This meant fewer power lines in our rural area. Buying less meant that Home Depot wont be building a store in the historical area of Jackson CA. And not only are people into small homes like in decades past, but instead of conventional materialistic burials, we are doing green burials.

And a family with two children who shop at thrift stores, are better than a family with no children who rush out to buy the newest iPod and other high tech goodie. Or the person who has no children but flies off to various world destinations, or has a walk in closet the size of a studio apartment. which clothes made in China, and other child labor places. Think of Sex in the City. Or the 'green' homes that are HUGE and have designer kitchens where little homemade simple food is ever created. Another reason I joined the Small House Society.

Look at all the 'environmental' minded publications that have page after page of stuff they insist someone who lives simple must have. Green living has become a buy buy buy business. Not about use it up, wear it out, find a need or do without. Or waste not want not.

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You go first....
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Posted by: lightwing1 on Jul 13, 2009 12:31 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I find it ironic that the author points out that the logical conclusion of simple living is suicide and argues against this approach being meaningful but promotes the idea of suicide by attacking the powers that be. Alot of the people who stood up to Nazi Germany were sent to death camps as were many who challenged the powers that be in Tsarist Russia.

So, the only answer is to risk death to stop the industrial machine, eh? All of you collectivists out there - which ones of you are willing to lay down your life first to advance this cause? Which ones of you are willing to sacrifice your individual lives (since you argue that the quest for individualism is the root of all evil)?

I thought so. Seems like an extreme approach to me. The author presumes that the industrial machine can not be changed without death and destruction and yet I read every day about individuals and groups who are working hard as I write this - not at politics - but at experimenting with alternative energy solutions, waste stream reduction solutions, and resource management solutions that can change the substance of the modern industrial paradigm.

I concede that there are political battles that are being and can be won as well - but without bloodshed or sacrifice of life this author is advocating. What about the Industrial Hemp movement? It is gaining ground. Oregon just passed SB 676 which legalizes production and possession of industrial hemp. Now that's political action that works - but done on a local level - without bloodshed or loss of life - and applied to a constructive, useful paradigm that will benefit the whole ultimately. Soon most states will legalize this incredibly beneficial plant.

I am not saying that political pressure doesn't have it's place, but I would argue that while top-down strategies are notoriously seductive in that they get things done quickly and serve the impatient, that they can be oppressive as well. And, the author ignores the fact that changing hearts and minds on an individual level ultimately does change paradigms. There is an upward force that exists from bottom-up change that is just as relevant (and proven to be more effective and longer-lasting) than top-down strategies.

I know, I know. I just don't get it from your point of view. However, you can't deflate the powers that be by directly attacking them. They are too strong. They have too many resources. Taking the wind out of their sails works much better. So, how does one do this? By changing the substance of the forms that exist and potentially the forms themselves - in essence by outwitting them and coming up with a better way. That means getting busy using the marketplace to bring new ideas to the table - build new models. Come up with new ways of utilizing resources, recapturing the valuable elements from our waste streams, new manufacturing paradigms, energy paradigms, transportation paradigms, etc. Get busy designing and creating the new world you want to bring in. Stop waiting for the federal government to be the final solution to everything - the federal government will not solve this crisis. Stop waiting for others to jump on the bandwagon. Roll up your sleeves and do it yourself.

If a collective body of individuals committed themselves to creating alternatives, the world would change alot faster. Beating people over the head with a stick never solved anything long term. Be the leadership you desire to see in the world - lead the way with ideas, innovation, example.

I challenge you to - instead of whining about overpopulation - come up with models that provide the best standard of living for all utilizing the limited resources we have. It is possible to change the world without having to die for the privilege.

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» RE: You go first.... Posted by: sirios
» RE: We are not cooked yet... Posted by: lightwing1
» RE: You go first.... Posted by: cplot
» RE: Have it your way... Posted by: lightwing1
» RE: You go first.... Posted by: TNT666

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taming sublimanailly induced behaviorial matrixes
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Posted by: wolvedrive on Jul 13, 2009 12:53 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
won't actually appease the enemies of freedom or satisfy superficial visions of day dreams ,,,sorry gotta go,drive ya latter

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dumb first paragraph puts off reader....
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Posted by: bifurctationpoint on Jul 13, 2009 2:48 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This article may be brilliant as brilliant can be. But, unfortunately, after this shockingly illogical lead-in, I'm going to have to force myself to finish the rest of it later, when I've had time to recuperate!

Composting wouldn't end slavery, but perhaps individuals freeing slaves would. Etc. I would think that the author could do better than this sort of preposterous "straw-man" argument.

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» RE: I think you have trouble with analogies Posted by: bifurctationpoint
» RE: I think you have trouble with analogies Posted by: bifurctationpoint

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There is a niche for everyone!
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Posted by: raincascadia on Jul 13, 2009 2:53 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Social transformation requires vast ecosystems of people doing all sorts of things to change culture and institutions. There is a niche for everyone. Some of us are working on models of sustainable living which will replace the current insanity. There is no corporate or government solution that will allow individuals to keep living the way they do. Personally, the only way I would be willing to work with corporations and governments is by blowing things up, so I need to do something else that is positive if I don't want to end up dead or in jail. For those who enjoy knocking on doors, working within the institutions, organizing demonstrations, or engaging in direct action, go for it! I'm curious to know what the author does besides writing.

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Pls. free US from Israel
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Posted by: weathered on Jul 13, 2009 4:32 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
its not a relationship at all, its extortion and its made America very sick.

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Gluttony Is No Sin.
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Posted by: melpol on Jul 13, 2009 4:44 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Picking the planet clean is what Mother Nature designed us to do. Nothing can stop this process. Taking only one shower per week or eating less will slow down the extinction of life on the planet. But the final outcome will be death to all. The wisest thing that each person can do is practice as much gluttony as possible. It is sinful to deny yourself that pleasure.

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Good article but a fundamentally flawed argument -Part 1
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Posted by: humanrevolution on Jul 13, 2009 7:28 PM   
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Mr. Jenson definitely made a good stab at it. I agree with the fundamental premise that people must not only do good, but must fight evil at the same time in order to change the system, but where I believe Mr. Jenson totally gets it wrong is in taking it out of the hands of individuals. This I believe in a way is the problem with the modern progressive movement and though we may not want to hear it is very similar to those fundamentalist right wing Christians that we blame for just about everything. The idea is that we are all good and they (corporate media, politicians, corporations, etc. etc. etc.) are all part of some evil machine. Those fundamentalist Christians do this too. But good and evil are in fact inseparable aspects of life that are within and without and what assigns good or evil to any given external manifestation is people. Most anything in the human world can be a force for good or for evil; it all depends on the person(s) using it. The second aspect of this argument that reminds me of those darn fundamentalists is the idea of salvation. The most extreme of progressives believe some divine moment like the second coming will happen and lift us from this evil. I hope you aren't waiting for that because you are going to be waiting just as long as the fundamentalists are for Jesus. Change happens piece by piece, person by person, one step at a time and when a critical mass, so to speak, of people subscribe to a particular idea then a larger shift occurs. But here is my point. You cannot force your ideas on others... this is the method of lesser men. Instead you must live true to your beliefs, prove the validity of your way of life, encourage others around you, and they will naturally adopt it over time. This may seem simple but it is powerful. When you say, "The second problem—and this is another big one—is that it incorrectly assigns blame to the individual (and most especially to individuals who are particularly powerless) instead of to those who actually wield power in this system and to the system itself... We, as individuals, are not creating the crises, and we can’t solve them." ...then you miss the entire point. Systems are made of people. The solutions to the problems of humanity lie within human beings and in fact it is those everyday "particularly powerless" people who have changed much of what has needed changing in the past few centuries. Individuals must change before anything else will. Otherwise you will spend your life fighting an apparition. We have already tried social, economic, cultural, and political revolutions. We need a human revolution. The human revolution of just a single individual can change the destiny of all mankind. Let me provide some evidence for my point. Gandhi. Not a particularly powerful individual as a young man; in fact he was quite shy and timid. But from one man's determination and the support of many others afterwards he wrested power away from the greatest imperialists of the preceding few centuries without ever even holding political office, taking up an armed rebellion, being the head of a major company etc. One person has extreme power. I get your point that turning off the water while I am brushing my teeth won't save the worlds water supply, but I fundamentally disagree that the most profound change I can make... that of changing myself from within and inspiring others to do the same can't make a difference. In fact, I believe it is the only thing that will. You can spend all of your life trying to take down a company or a political system and you might succeed, but it will just be replaced by another one that is most likely more greedy than the one before it. Another alternative is to spend your life transforming yourself and the individuals who may one day populate those systems so that when you or they do get to the top, then collectively they can make a better decision.

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» RE: i think the problem comes in... Posted by: humanrevolution

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Good article but a fundamentally flawed argument -Part 2
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Posted by: humanrevolution on Jul 13, 2009 7:28 PM   
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Let me put it another way. Would you rather have a company staffed by greedy individuals who were raised selfishly believing in money as their salvation or would you take a company filled with people who do believe in personal conservation and restraint. Don't you think if an organization is filled with enough of the second kind of people then it would naturally come to transform itself to reflect more of those ideas? Now I am not saying that it will be easy to wrest this greed, anger, and stupidity out of our lives and those of others, but as long as we are just trimming back the shoots of the weeds without pulling up the roots, we will get nowhere. We will also get nowhere by standing on some moral high ground like many others we disagree with and pointing the finger at someone or something else. There is an old Buddhist proverb that says when you point one finger at someone else in blame then 3 fingers are pointing back at you. Start with yourself, then move to those around you and you will see change. If you own or work in a company then work to make that company a model of change and an example for others. If you are a politician then don’t be greedy, don’t give into cooperate demands etc. If you work in the media, report the truth. I don’t care if you sweep the floor at Denny’s you can make a difference. Get to work on yourself and YOUR environment and you can change anything, find a way to apathetically blame some far off system and you will accomplish no more than anyone else. Not fighting evil is the same as doing evil.

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Cosmic Annihilation
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Posted by: je5752 on Jul 13, 2009 7:47 PM   
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There's just one giant, gaping hole in all of this fluffy, feel-good environmentalism and the arguments for a return to a primitive, agrarian society: our species will cease to exist in a few billion years as will all life in the solar system whether we like it or not.

The Sun will go red giant in 5 billion years, consuming Earth. Andromeda will collide with the Milky Way in 3 billion years, possibly resulting in catastrophic devastation from asteroid/comet or high energy particle storms. And then there's the outside possibility that a megadose of gamma radiation will sweep over the planet from a quasar, or an asteroid/comet from our own galaxy will collide with us at some point in the near (next few million year) future.

From this perspective we don't really have a choice if we want to survive as a species - we simply must have technological development so that we can leave this planet and even this galaxy. We are guaranteed to die if we don't develop technology - we start out with nothing to lose. Some how we'll have to find a way to make technological development sustainable, as it's the only way forward. All other paths lead to certain death.

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» RE: Cosmic Annihilation Posted by: gimmie shelter

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Composting WOULD reduce slavery, and dumpster diving might stop a Hitler
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Posted by: cascadia on Jul 13, 2009 9:35 PM   
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If we composted and dumpster dived more, we wouldn't need outsourced slaves in Haiti, China, Pakistan, etc. making cheap stuff for us--You know, slavery still exists, it's just that now, we figured out a system where we don't have to pay for our slaves' room and board. And we don't have to see them at all. So clever!

A lot of Hitler's elan was his promise to provide material prosperity to the Germans. So if the Germans in control, and their American and British helpers and propagandists,had been content with a world without autobahns and Volkswagens and sophisticated killing machines that could be sold for lots of money, well,the world would be a very different place.

I like Derrick Jensen's provocative style, but have to agree with the poster above who warned about anyone summoning Hitler in their first sentence...

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Oh God yes
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Posted by: james108 on Jul 13, 2009 10:37 PM   
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So many people had the same democratic ideals and mantras in Hitlers day, and only paying attention and being impartial about injustice helped a little.
All the animal friendly, anti smoking, anti right wing ideals did nothing but strengthen it, as long as they were willing to look the other way.

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Well meaning but flawed...
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Posted by: whogrant on Jul 14, 2009 12:34 AM   
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With 207 comments I'll hope you'll forgive me if this point has already been made so here goes.

This article is well meaning, I mean I agree with it in spirit but basically it is flawed - if everyone stops consuming excessively and limits themselves to the simplest of consumption then that 90% (or whatever the figure is the author gives) of industrial and commercial output will go away because it exists only to service our basic economic wants, needs and desires. So it is a fallacy to say that we consumers changing our behavior will have an insignificant impact on the damage being caused by the corporate world.

The only flaw in my counter-argument that I can see is where the market for providing a basic need (that we cannot do without) is run by a monopoly, or there is only one affordable provider that the majority of consumers can afford (think WalMart). In which case we have no choice but to "eat it". This is why anti-trust laws and diversity is king. We simply cannot let our market place be taken over by a tiny few providers that dictate the terms.

The only thing required to make this all work is transparency so that consumers know what they are buying into when they buy a product on the shelf. If you're pro-American, pro-local or whatever why would you shop at Wal-Mart where 80% of everything is shipped in from China??? Well if you knew where everything came from you could still shop there but only buy the stuff made in America, believe me, these big corps will take note! All you have to do is shop with your values first and price second and you can change the world.

There are companies out there, e.g. GoodGuide that are campaigning for transparency at the checkout - just give the consumers the info they need and let them make the decisions. This is, admittedly, the opposite of traditional marketing where companies try to influence you to ignore your basic needs and use your greed, indulgence and other emotions to influence your purchace. But so long as consumers on the whole give a s**t about the world and the future maybe there is a chance.

At the very least consumers deserve an equal footing in this "free market" because if they don't then the free market will be forever slanted against us and lets face it in this case "us" is humanity so that is not going to be a good outcome. Just remember that all the standard measures of progress that the government uses will value money spent on bad things like war, pollution clean up and treating the sick (instead of preventing sickness) just like any other dollar spent on "good" things like preventing war, pollution and sickness.

That's just sad and I'm afraid to say WRONG and speaks volumes about what is wrong with the world today.

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EarthFirst! fist on headline page
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Posted by: TNT666 on Jul 14, 2009 1:19 AM   
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What a sight of beauty, how I miss the original EarthFirst! crowd, before it got taken over the poetry and PC crowd and the originals got shoved aside.

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The point is well-taken, but...
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Posted by: MadameSwanky on Jul 14, 2009 6:22 AM   
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I think this article outlines something really important. By cleverly spinning the Green Movement into something you can BUY, industry has managed to take a movement and make it into another iteration of consumption.

That said, I do think there is some value in personal symbolism. I know that, for instance, I am a vegetarian, and when I explain all the reasons that I am a vegetarian, I do touch on why the meat industry is so horrible for the environment, etc. Those who are completely unfamiliar with the issues might be compelled to look it up just by asking me questions about my choices. It's not going to change the world, but it is valuable.

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» And you? Posted by: Jason Jordan

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Doesn't matter whether you're personally using a sledge hammer, toothpick, beer bottle, we're all .
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Posted by: Beck on Jul 14, 2009 7:11 AM   
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. . .pounding the same hole in the same boat. When you're helping pound a hole in the boat we're all in, it's foolish, not to mention narcissistic, to, instead of stopping pounding, argue that since the person or corporation beside you is using a jackhammer, you shouldn't stop chipping away with your Bic pen. After all, you've been told many times each day your entire life how pleasurable it is to knock holes in the boat.

Yesterday I read this in the Utne reader:

"It could be argued that our entire culture suffers from a narcissistic personality disorder, as evidenced by our distant and entitiled relationship to the more-than-human world." Maybe the greatest indication of this entitlement and distance is using the argument that since others use bigger tools, we shouldn't have to stop whatever we're doing with our little ones. Underneath that argument is the same tired consumerism: I LIKE longer showers! I know I'm not only supposed to get and do what I like, I would actually be dumb to not get it. Especially when someone else is getting and doing EVEN MORE!

A great question from the article, by Larry Robinson, from the new book Ecotherapy:

"What human qualities does a healthy ecosystem require?" It should be obvious which ones don't sustain the ecosystem: the ones that never have. And by now we have to include scapegoating and straw men. We're all knocking the same hole in the same boat. Who knows which tool from which hand will puncture through first? Just because there's a maul slamming away beside you doesn't mean that your bare hand won't make the final plunge. And only people who WANT badly to keep hammering away argue about shorter showers.

The article also stated that in ancient Greece, the word "idiot" meant a private person not engaged in the life of the community. It's time to stop arguing for the right to have a daily life that does not take the community into account. The reason: that's the exact thinking that got us here to begin with, the thinking that CEOs take into board meetings and make decisions with.

Won't this be awful? No more rationalizing. No more specious arguments. No more waiting for someone else. No more straw men. Just each doing whatever it takes.

Actually, no, it's not awful. If a shorter shower makes your life worse, you're not living a real life anyway. I dare you, start giving up this kind of stuff and see how little you miss it. Start doing active things, and see how pleasant they are. I'm about to do a load of laundry. I'm going to put a 5-gallon bucket under the exhaust hose and use the water to water my garden. If I'm quick enough, I'll get almost 20 gallons, all I need. It'll be exercise, gardening, money saving, and an excuse not to do anything else, all at once.

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gimmie shelter
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Posted by: gimmie shelter on Jul 15, 2009 9:35 AM   
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One of the biggest secrets any government holds is that the masses have the power at any moment to change what so few have put in place. There is no country in the world where their military or police forces are greater in number than it's citizens. The feeling of helplessness is exactly what those in power and big business created to keep us in line. Never believe that the majority in any country do not have a say in what that country does or does not do. It all is just a matter of timing and education.
Modern society has been weakened by the isolation of the individuals and of nuclear families, but they are not down and out. The powers that be profit from breaking down families to the smallest units possible while also destroying our sense of community.

We need to get back to basics and away from consumerism which only leaves us unfulfilled.
Never let anyone tell you that "we the people", are powerless.

It only takes one spark to create a fire. And when is the public going to demand that criminals in government be tried and go to jail the same way we would if we do not follow the law. There are some in or out of government who have and are literally getting away with murder. Everyone needs to chip away at those in Washington to get rid of those worthless politicians working for themselves or for the corporations. The time has never been better than now.

Our people are feeling the pain caused by men and not by cycles in the market. America was robbed and we are paying the thieves a bonus. Only in America.

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THAT PERSONAL PRIVATE ETHICS EQUALS SOCIAL ETHICS IS A MYTH, A LIE TOLD
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Posted by: Raymond Emerson on Jul 15, 2009 3:17 PM   
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by republicans. It is told as a cover to the fact that they are socially unethical. Private ethics does not automatically create a social ethic.

The right shoot themselves in the foot when they prove privately unethical. I has an unintended side effect. They are instantly seen as socially unethical.

It is entirely possible to have really high social ethics and have the private ethics of an alleycat. All of the Kennedys tomcatted around. Their social ethics have been right on. Even FDR had a mistress. He may go down as ataining the highest social ethics quotient ever achieved by an American president. Bill Clinton left office with a 70% approval rating. That wasn't because of his private ethics. The citizenry had a deeper understanding.

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We are the problem but we can be the solution
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Posted by: verityguiton on Jul 15, 2009 6:16 PM   
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Attacks on people (any people) from the left to the right, from developed to developing nations doesn't help solve the issue of Global Warming and Climate Change.

Global warming is a natural process and happens when various chemicals (not just CO2) rise to the atmosphere. Ultimately this process keeps us warm and enables the growth of plants, animals and people. However, due to the increase in these chemicals, the earth has warmed to a dangerous level causing the earths climate to change as well as future environmental conditions.

The industrial revoluition has contributed a lot to this and thus people (like you and me) are the cause for our earths current state.

But there is one thing that seems to be over looked. We didn't know...

Well at least up until the 1960's (or earlier) when chemical threats to the environment were also effecting people and therefore it was necessary they be minimised or stopped. DDT is a good example of this.

From there on, industry has increased substantially as well as population growth causing further climatic alterations. However it was too early to be sure if polution would cause long term damage.

So we carried on and a splash of consumerism exploded from the capatalist regime where and more money was to be put into the economy to increase power, miltary weapons and security.

True, but there are other things to consider such as history, progression and shifts in religion and science, race, social networks/status and war. These are also extreamly important to consider in the development of our current lives and thus global warming and climate change.

The above factors happened throughout history predating christ and the evolutionary theory and to say that global warming can be fixed in one clean swoop is not only impossile, it's unrealistic.

We have very little power in this world. Freedom to be sure in the west, however to create conflict in the larger or littlest sense doesn't help minimise polution and environmental degredation which is causing our rivers and land to dry up.

It may seem like we are only making a small contribution in the great scheme of things were water restriction and simple living are concerned but should we just do nothing? The government isn't doing anything, so why should we, right?

We may not have the power to change the world tomorrow, but we have ultimate power of the way we live in our homes today. 20% is a quarter of the total intake of water in homes within the country. That's a lot considering the many other factors that need to be considered when determing the cause and solution of climate change. And it's a great contribution on our part if we can give that back through small acts such as taking shorter showers.

There's hope in continuing with a simple life, especially when we are on the topic of capitalism. If the government and industry see no market in non sustainable living, then they won't bother investing in a way of life that brings them no profit.

This is why we must keep going and not fight with eachother. It may take some time, but we can change the world by pushing through and doing it the right way, not the violent way.

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Oh the irony
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Posted by: Arbie on Jul 16, 2009 5:05 AM   
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In the last week we've been told we've got to cut back our CO2 emmisions by x% by y year or we'll all die due to global warming. In the same month the G8 have agreed to these cut backs (ok there's some debate as to what the exact figures are). Here in the UK we have the governement peddling green jobs and a green future.

Then what does NASA do? Launch a spaceship - how much CO2 was released there? Even if I don't go carbon neutral I will never as emmit as much CO2 as they did. And it will never impact the ozone as quickly.

I think it proves the author's point.

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Don't agree with this at all
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Posted by: setrimacoky on Jul 16, 2009 12:30 PM   
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Remember when the Clintons required us to use less water in our toilet flushes? Now I have to flush twice. That did not work so well. People please open your minds to discussion about the environment. The science behind this is not sound and reflects agenda rather than truth. Yours is not the alternative voice anymore - yours is the main-stream voice. I would encourage you to subjegate your local government to your environmental beliefs rather than the fed. There are too many alternative individual opinions, beliefs, cultures, etc in this great country for a one size fits all mentality. That is why our republic is so great - you can have your alternative lifestyle locally while others in another part of the country can enjoy a very different life style (San Francisco vs Salt Lake City). If you keep pushing on the FED, and create a one size fits all Federal Gov't, where are the alternatives? Where are the differences that make us the best country on earth. Take out a coin, read the inscription - E Pluribus Unum..."Out of many, One". Beautiful stuff my friends.

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The obvious question is...
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Posted by: lcdcobb on Jul 16, 2009 3:01 PM   
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Why not do both?? Why not make personal choices that are sustainable, AND get politically active? An argument that suggests lifestyle changes are irrelevant and unrelated to sea changes is flimsy at best.

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Industrial civilization is killing the planet
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Posted by: CleanWaterWarrior on Jul 17, 2009 12:02 PM   
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Derrick- If we adopt your mantra, "Industrial civilization is killing the planet," we might have a chance.
I'm fighting for clean water in my community. The fight is against industrial civilization.

Bill MacKibbon said that changing the way we do business and live on this planet will be as hard as getting rid of slavery.

Slavery impacted every social, cultural, political religious and business institution in the US. Slavery has been outlawed for 150 years -- and we are still living in its shadow. Ask any person of color you know.

Re-aligning our industrial civilization is the task of this generation -- and the next seven generations.

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tiffany
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Posted by: ekoljos on Jul 18, 2009 10:34 AM   
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Cellphones might have defeated Hitler, and eating fish could help stop global warming.
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Posted by: SardineLady on Jul 18, 2009 6:21 PM   
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Pay attention to one of Jensen’s key points: misdirection. Once we know how a magician did his trick, we marvel that we fell for the trick.

Not that I can tell you how we were persuaded to do all the stupid things that got us here, but obviously our overlord Magicians (AKA “Puppeteers,” “Powers That Be”) exploit human beings’ tendency to be emotional and impulsive.

But now our inventions are balancing the power relationship. The PC non-consumers amongst us might have missed Clay Shirky’s idea, namely, "How cell phones, Twitter, Facebook can make history" (http://blog.ted.com/2009/06/qa_with_clay_sh.php)

Pictures are worth a thousand words. If we’d had Twitter in the 1930s, maybe the WWI victors could have seen how foolish it was to expect immense reparations from the loser.

With cell phone cameras, would Hitler have maintained his heroic public persona?

Wouldn’t news have gotten out about IBM and Ford’s profitable commerce with the Reich have been exposed? If all wars are resource wars pretending to be other things, then grassroots comprehension might have reduced the war fever that swept nations.

Could economic ostracism, like that used against South Africa’s apartheid regime, have worked on Hitler's Germany?

Meanwhile, no real, pervasive change can happen until we fix two invisible national deficiencies: omega-3s and vitamin D.

Huh? If you have noticed that American voters are more impulsive and gullible than ever, consider that we are also more deficient in DHA and EPA (the omega-3s from fish, chickens that eat bugs, and grass fed beef). Our big brains are supposed to contain a high percentage of these essential fatty acids. The frontal cortex, where empathy, long range planning, and the ability to see the consequences of our actions occurs, especially needs omega-3s.

Our national vitamin D deficiency fits in with our greatly reduced fish consumption (don’t worry, we could have sustainable fisheries if we stopped feeding the bulk of what’s caught to pigs etc.), and adds to our fuzzy thinking.

Read about it at GoodSchoolFood.org.

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A Vision - Slaves Anonymous
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Posted by: A. Servant on Jul 20, 2009 1:41 AM   
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Our strength does not lie in our large numbers, but in our diversity of imaginative actions.

Don't wait for a "perfect" solution to be "given" to you before you begin. Take what's here, modify it to make it yours, and begin creating emancipation in your local communities.

Slaves Anonymous: A vision for us

Regardless of how kindly we treat others in the global society of slaves, our caring and love will be moot unless we can help create the conditions necessary for emancipation in our local communities. You can create this in your community; and I, in mine.

You have a connection with transcendence that will lead your creativity and passion to find effective responses to individual and shared predicaments. You can help a neighbor to learn to discern and connect with his or her potency, so that your autonomy and diversity will be your strength.

Suggested Steps of Slaves Anonymous

Step 3: Made a decision to turn our will and our lives away from the care of the slave masters.

Step 7: Began transforming our local communities.

Step 11: Sought through imaginative activities to improve our connection to our passion and power.

This work is licensed under the Creative Commons Attribution-Share Alike 3.0 License.

This means that you can use this material in any way including modification if you provide attribution and allow others to use this material in the same manner.

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barnule
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Posted by: barnule on Jul 22, 2009 5:42 AM   
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Not so simple, Derrick. The personal and the political are intertwined. The "evil" corporations are destroying the planet in their eagerness to serve our wants as consumers. So let's not pretend we're not complicit, or that things wouldn't change if we stopped consuming as though there were no tomorrow. Eventually we'll be compelled to stop anyway, one way or another, simply because Nature's limits are being reached, and though she can be kind to those who respect her laws, those laws are not flexible.

Anyway, why is it either or? Cut down your consumption AND act politically. You'll have a better life.

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Insufficient analysis
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Posted by: cdlepthien on Jul 25, 2009 9:21 AM   
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characterizes this article. While individual action surely needs to be accompanied by collective and political action, our economy is driven by consumers and their choices make a huge difference. Yes it's frustrating that the corporations continually obfuscate the issues, but counter-information and continual pressure on the government are the way you counter that. The issues are complicated and there are thousands of them.

The author of the article says that electricity is a luxury. So - you want the entire population of New York trying to wash their clothes in the Hudson River? It's not a question of getting rid of technology - if we did we would destroy the biosphere in a matter of months.

"Or let’s talk energy. Kirkpatrick Sale summarized it well: “For the past 15 years the story has been the same every year: individual consumption—residential, by private car, and so on—is never more than about a quarter of all consumption; the vast majority is commercial, industrial, corporate, by agribusiness and government [he forgot military]." All of that commercial, industrial, corporate and agribusiness energy results in items that are consumed. If everyone stopped consuming the items the production of them would stop. period. And most of us wouldn't have jobs.

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Alternet Comments:

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Are you unemployed?
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Spot on Jul 13, 2009 12:11 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Stop looking for a job and start organizing! Knock on every door on your block, the next block, and the block beyond that. Find your unemployed and underemployed neighbors. Politics isn't something that only happens in November, it is what happens whenever we meet to solve our collective problems.

If you live in a city, you must seize control of government or you will be cut out of the supply chain when collapse hits.

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» But seriously folks! Posted by: frankly1
» RE: But seriously folks! Posted by: xmvince
» RE: But seriously folks! Posted by: TNT666
» RE: But seriously folks! Posted by: pomes
» RE: Are you unemployed? Posted by: jwc1480
» RE: Are you unemployed? Posted by: Spot

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One of the Most Important Articles Alterent Has Ever Posted
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Posted by: mmckinl on Jul 13, 2009 12:26 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Why?

This article cuts through the bull and shows us the entire landscape of the fight for the environment and the progressive agenda in general ...

This article gives us the real figures on pollution and the minute impact of trying to take these issues on as individuals instead of banding together to confront the bad actors that perpetrate the pollution and problems in the first place.

The tactics that the PTB use are laid bare. That the individual is targeted as both the problem and the solution when in fact we are chasing our own tails while the polluters and profiteers merrily go on about their business.

get involved and get involved now ...

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» RE: get involved and get involved now Posted by: tommy_slothrop

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No worries, Honkey...
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Posted by: Nebris on Jul 13, 2009 1:28 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
...Nature will just as happily slaughter the 'brown theists' when Her Bill comes due. =)

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funny that you should mention Rome--check out the declining Italian birthrate
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Posted by: Suzon on Jul 13, 2009 1:33 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The birth rate is below replacement level. (And by the way, who exactly is pro-abortion?)

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Up to 12?
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Posted by: Beck on Jul 13, 2009 6:52 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
.

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RE: I think I’ll just fiddle as Rome burns.
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Posted by: TNT666 on Jul 13, 2009 4:11 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Well that means we just have to work harder on convincing our «sisters of another color» to quit religion and contracept too. I hope the «brothers of another color» will do the same.

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Not that I'm disagreeing entirely...
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Posted by: jparsons on Jul 13, 2009 1:10 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
...but surely much of that industrial use is in making
stuff for individuals to buy (or not buy)?

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» RE: good point Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» RE: Pulp Mills Posted by: PeterW
» RE: Pulp Mills Posted by: TNT666
» Move to New Zealand? Posted by: jparsons
» RE: Move to New Zealand? Posted by: photon's feather
» True... Posted by: jparsons
» RE: True... Posted by: photon's feather
» Sorry... In case I wan't clear: Posted by: photon's feather
» Yes, I have thanked him since. Posted by: jparsons
» RE: True... Posted by: evolve
» Exactly Posted by: tommy_slothrop
» RE: xactly Posted by: TNT666

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Two Simple Steps
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Posted by: Nebris on Jul 13, 2009 1:24 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
One: Remove ALL Heavy Industry from the surface of the planet.

Two: Reduce the total number of humans on the surface of the planet by 90%.

Note I said simple, not easy.

And for those who will scream about #Two, be aware that the elimination of 'the industrial economy' the author calls for would create such an outcome anyway.

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» You first, baby.. Posted by: Nebris
» Thank You... Posted by: Nebris
» Not that hard, people... Posted by: Rusty Shackleford

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the roots of crime in the western world go back nearly a thousand years
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Posted by: Suzon on Jul 13, 2009 1:23 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
when William the Conquerer granted a royal charter to an association of powerful men in the City of London. The Corporation of the City of London would have been entitled to enter people's houses, destroy their goods and run them out of town.

Today privileged associations of powerful men (banks and other corporations) simply take our money and houses through "legal' means.

Off topic? Not at all. The wasteful and destructive rat race is based on the rich needing to dominate and exhaust us lest we get our act together and give them their comeuppance.

We have been fooled into thinking we need jobs. People don't need jobs, they need food, water and shelter.

If we stopped extracting oil and minerals and stopped manufacturing unnecessary goods, our lives would be happier and the earth could begin to recover from the aggressive behavior of the frightened rich.

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» If, if, if.... Posted by: batmagoo
» RE: If, if, if.... Posted by: wbblack
» RE: If, if, if.... Posted by: TNT666
» RE: If, if, if.... Posted by: johnthetreehugger
» RE: If, if, if.... Posted by: TNT666
» yup... Posted by: batmagoo
» RE: WRONG Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» RE: WRONG Posted by: HoboHomo
» Right on Sister Posted by: wbblack
» Wrong again Lauren... Posted by: brunowe
» RE: WRONG Posted by: photon's feather
» RE: WRONG Posted by: melloe2

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Overpopulation is the root and should be addressed at some point...
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Posted by: batmagoo on Jul 13, 2009 1:44 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Great article, sure - but regrettably, like every other commentary on environmental collapse in modern media, it looks at "comfortable" targets near the bottom of the elephant in the room, but fails to discuss the overhanging root of this environmental crisis: No political or industrial paradigm shift is going to stop the impending catastrophe any more than dumpster diving was ever going to stop Hitler ( or sorting through our plastic bottles, or holding-in our farts for that matter )...if we are "going to get serious, people," we need to tackle the inconvenient truth of which even inconvenient truth hunters dare not speak: Human Overpopulation!
The greatest societal taboo...
No offense to Derrick Jensen, who is probably a happy father of two, it is worth noting that in a Judeo-Christian culture brainwashed with notions of a God-given Earthly Paradise, joy-for-all, beauty-of-childbirth myths, and so on, it is hard to get folks to grasp that human multiplication is little more than a cancer.
Speaking-out about ways to fix the world by side-stepping the issue of population growth and ( yes! ) "Population-growth control," is a canard - the spreading of false hope.
One of the dirtiest words on our language is the branding of "neo-malthusian."
It is our fundamental attitudes which must be re-examined.
If we are to do anything -- anything at all -- we need to get topical.
Anything else is mental masturbation, indeed.
Masturbation? wait!
There's a solution.

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» Ah yep Posted by: Sympa
» What you're missing. Posted by: heid

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Or Stupidest Article Ever Written?
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Posted by: Lloydmillerus on Jul 13, 2009 3:22 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Did it never occur to the Left that the basic tenent of "Environmentalism" is that the "people" are the problem? Is it just a co-incidence that the richest people in the world got together in the Club of Rome and launched the environmentalist movement based on scare tactics to reduce the standard of living of the masses?

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» Wrong again Lauren Posted by: brunowe
» RE: Or Stupidest Article Ever Written? Posted by: johnthetreehugger

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Thanks for posting this, Alternet
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Posted by: vision on Jul 13, 2009 3:58 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Derrick Jensen is probably the most important thinker of our time, and if a whole bunch of us don't head his message soon, there's going to be very little life left for our grandchildren.

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» RE: Thanks for posting this, Alternet Posted by: Sister_Lauren

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Jensen makes a great case.
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Posted by: JenniferBedingfield on Jul 13, 2009 4:20 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We are so accustomed to linear equations. As a result, we sometimes fail to realize that there is a place for everyone, and thus a number of solutions and approaches at the proverbial table.

It is important that some persons act as wayshowers/role models to forms of living that go more gently on this amazing earth. It is important that citizens/consumers recognize that every time they buy a big mac, they contribute to the "meat market." Unless we're talking pasture raised and local grown meat which is obviously more expensive, the issue of sustainability will be more difficult to ignore. I happen to think that eating more meat also contributes to more macho-egotistical personality traits and the over-all ridiculously inflated US emphasis on Mars, war, aggression, in general.

Jensen makes an important case, critical really, that the individual can only do so much via lifestyle alterations. A lot of would-be activists dilute their passion by diverting the call to change ONLY to their own neck of the woods. To me this is similar to the New Age movement that co-opted much political activism in general by diverting persons to the task of "self work," the quintessential inside job. I often argue that it must be both! The individual owns an obligation to evolve at his or her own rate, but so, too, must citizens contribute to the overall evolution of the society they share. It is not an either/or proposition.

One hidden factor of the "Mars rules" bankrupt ethos that is so prevalent in our land of the hardly brave is the focus on SELF. We see it in consumerism, that TV commercials market to the "single digit consumer," to increase sales/market shares. It is also seen in the "YOYO" economic priorities, in the conservative belief that everyone is responsible for himself; and in its most raw form, as competition, the sporting arena, and its acme, the killing fields a/k/a "theaters" of war.

As scarcity begins persons will by necessity find themselves forced to learn how to work better together. Community will emerge from the ashes. Truly we are coming into a phase where we either learn to care for one another, or may otherwise perish. An armed nation with lots of persons angry, hungry and/or homeless (added to those who cannot get humane treatment for medical needs) can be a land more dangerous than any scene drawn from an apocalyptic film.

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» You don't know Obama much do you? Posted by: Wayne Etheridge

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Retired Citizen
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Posted by: dogman12 on Jul 13, 2009 4:22 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This article brought something to light that's been at the back of my mind for some time, and couldn't quite bring into focus. Conditioning of a sort, perhaps. Complacency more likely, I'm ashamed to say! I'm one of those that recycles, and composts and signs petitions to fight injustice. An all-around tree-hugger, I suppose you could say. Needless to say, it's quite a shock to realize that, as things stand now in the world, it's all been rather pointless. I'm at the age where, as they say, there are less days ahead than behind me. Perhaps that's a good thing, now. God help the kids that will really suffer for our stupidity!

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» RE: etired Citizen Posted by: kilgore4356

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Consumer Power
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Posted by: CTC123 on Jul 13, 2009 4:39 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Consider the Connection to:
Environmental Communication
IN'PUT=READ-SEE-LISTEN
OUT'PUT=WRITE-SPEAK
=CONSUMER ACTION
Please Search:
CTC123GREEN
The more you know,
The more connections you make.
Great article, Derric Jensen

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Shorter showers?
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Posted by: PJAW on Jul 13, 2009 4:46 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I tried that for awhile, but I got tired of bending over to rinse my hair.

George Carlin was onto something when he hypothesized that the earth spawned humans as a life form because it needed plastic for its next evolutionary phase. Which clearly implies that we are not the culmination of the evolutionary process but only a step along the way, which may or may not be a comforting thought.

I find it more than a little ironic, that if evolution is real ("scientists disagree" - sure they do) the ones who seem to be denying its validity are also the ones accelerating its progression. As in having more babies and using more resources (driving the chemical changes the planet is undergoing as a result of our presence).

The human ego knows no boundaries, (as in we're "God's" greatest achievement or "we're destroying the planet"). We're not destroying the planet, but we certainly may be changing it in ways that make it uninhabitable for our kind. Or at least unsupportive of the number of us that has accumulated.

The next hundred years should prove interesting, I wish I could live long enough to experience them. Ever shower outside while drinking a cold beer? Delightful.

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» RE: isn't mutation fun? Posted by: PJAW
» Missing Link? Posted by: Hiroak

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Since World Power Is In The Hands Of A Handful...
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Posted by: ZPaul on Jul 13, 2009 4:58 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If we're going to talk about personal change, the first ones who should be setting the example, environmentally and otherwise, are that handful.

And, of course, they are not doing so. That's for "the masses"; the elite, the super-wealthy, who seem to want us to believe that they have a "higher calling", are the "exceptions to the rule" (or so they think)

This is typical in so many areas. The rich want to hold the poor accountable for the things that they bear most of the guilt for , many times over, not simply through how they live their personal lives, but how they maintain their personal power and privilege through their exploitation of the poor throughout the world.

In general, the attitude of the rich, especially the super-rich, with regard to ecology is absolutely hypocritical and disgusting. They are never going to change willingly, you can count on that. The most they will do is window dressing, and give a lot of publicity to that window dressing.

Until the power is in the hands of the people, how can we say democracy exists anywhere?

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Time for Green collective action
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Posted by: greenferret on Jul 13, 2009 5:20 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Individual lifestyle changes won't make our civilization sustainable. Neither will articles on the internet, if all we do is read them and post our comments in the hope that our wisdom will slowly but surely change the world.

We need collective political action. Green Parties around the world have known this since the 1970s. Get active with the Greens and help lead our civilization from the failed model of corporatist consumerism to a more sustainable, just, and meaningful society.

Green Party of the United States

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Big Government
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Posted by: snowhound on Jul 13, 2009 5:53 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It's funny how people think they can change things by politically changing the way our government operates. Does any so called progressive on this site ever think that maybe the reason we have this problem in the first place is because our government has grown too large and powerful and it is the reason we consume too much and pollute to much? If the federal government did not remove the gold standard and stuck with sound money, maybe we wouldn't have been able to print so much money and spend so much on worthless stuff. If the government didn't subsidize agriculture maybe we wouldn't have genetically engineered corn sweeteners in every food item in the supermarket. If the government would follow the Constitution, maybe we wouldn't be in endless wars while trying to maintain a world empire. If government followed the Constitution, maybe we wouldn't have a Federal Reserve system that artificially lowered interests rates which enabled people to borrow too much and buy way to much junk! As I see it government has enabled the big corporations to gain control and push out small business through regulations, trade agreements, and taxes. If government didn't subsidize health care maybe big Pharma wouldn't have so much power over our health system. Maybe the answer is Freedom! Freedom without government coercion and corporate control.

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» RE: Big Government Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» RE: Big Government Posted by: snowhound
» RE: Big Government Posted by: johnthetreehugger
» RE: Big Government Posted by: snowhound
» RE: Big Government Posted by: TNT666

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Yep.
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Stell on Jul 13, 2009 5:58 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As usual, Jensen is right.

People may not like it, but he's right.

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Divide and Conquer
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Posted by: Cybershaman on Jul 13, 2009 6:03 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It's a tactic I've been seeing for several decades. A good example is how the issue of industrial pollution was turned on it's head. I suspect if we could trace where the money came from for the anti-smoking campaign it would lead back to the major industrial polluters. By keeping us busy being outraged by our neighbors second hand smoke we have lost focus on that area of town where huge smokestacks belch out tons of toxic particles every day.

I predict that any 'carbon tax' legislation passed will actually translate into an individual price for exhaling carbon dioxide when it all comes down. THAT seems to be the pattern.

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» RE: Divide and Conquer Posted by: richholland

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Good points
[Report this comment]
Posted by: aazippo2 on Jul 13, 2009 6:16 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Wow, excellent points indeed.

RT
Ultimate Anonymity

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» Piracy when it counts. Posted by: GuitarBill

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We pay these people to enslave us.
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Posted by: rafaeltoral on Jul 13, 2009 6:21 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We pay the government and corporations to be our slave handlers. If you want to quit being a slave quit giving them money.

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oh well......
[Report this comment]
Posted by: grmartin on Jul 13, 2009 6:38 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As things get worse, pro-active efforts at sustainability reform will probably be overwhelmed in a tide of destruction, starvation and migration as the ecosystem goes on auto-correct, ie collaspes. And if we do get reduced by 90%, the survivors will have done so by the most capicious means, not through any good will or voluntary self- denial, and will be more vicious than ever. By now I think one thing is clear, humans as a species are not capable of living within their means on this planet. Too bad, so sad! Bring me back that old time religion!

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» RE: oh well...... Posted by: HoboHomo

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No, taking the easy route is saying, "Do whatever you want, just like you were always told"
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Beck on Jul 13, 2009 6:44 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Dumpster diving and HITLER? Come on. When someone has to toss Hitler into an argument, watch out. And anyway, the dumpster diving version of opposition against Hitler was valid and important. Would you NOT have hidden in a Dutch attic just because that action to help individual Jews didn't flat-out stop Hitler?

Too many articles now with either/or thinking, or with "you should do this, because I do, and I'd like to keep convincing myself that I don't have to do anything else, YOU do" or both. No, personal change does not EQUAL political change. Driving less doesn't EQUAL flying less, and shorter showers don't equal less coal plants. Straw men, nothing but straw men, while the planet fries, melts, and floods. All blather designed to hide the essential personal question, "What else do I have to do?" and the essential political question: (ditto). Many articles on alternet are followed by comments about how our lifestyle is not sustainable. Now we seem to get one, popular enough to be repeated here after being on other websites, that soothes us with contrary information. And it's all words, while scientists write more articles on rising sea levels and 385 ppm of carbon in the atmosphere. And methane burps. And hydrogen sulfide.

Shorter showers AND better political action are what's needed. Who was it that said you can't solve a problem by using the same thinking that caused it? Was it Einstein? Well, even the title of this article is problem thinking. And it's typically American: " there must be some way I can take showers thoughtlessly, because any thinking I'm forced to do about my lifestyle and its consequences means I've been cheated. Doesn't matter if I'm being cheated out of something not worth having. I'm supposed to get (I've heard this as an American many times a day, every day of my life, so it's obviously true) everything that pops into my head that equals convenience and/or pleasure. I've heard that convenience and pleasure are not only better than anything else, anything else is garbage."

Or it's that other typical American thinking: "So what? Other things are worse."

Isn't 25% of the carbon in the atmosphere right now from Americans and our lifestyles? Don't tell me it doesn't matter, or that our lifestyle changes don't cause bigger changes. WalMart now stocks organics and BST-free milk; in fact, I think ALL their milk is now hormone free. They didn't do that out of their great benevolence and concern. They did it because they were losing money to places that already sold such things.

Don't fall for hogwash. Don't wait for "leadership" or for corporations to do the right thing while you're showering for 20 minutes. And don't bleat "Obahahahahahama" unless you're, oh, never mind. Some of you bleat Obama if the subject is football.

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» A little too far to the right, no? Posted by: JenniferBedingfield

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You need to shave your head, be labotomized and get some tattoos to comment here.
[Report this comment]
Posted by: grindermonkey on Jul 13, 2009 6:53 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The industrial food supply and the pharmaceutical industry has replaced natural selection. Busch Lite is another big contributor.

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» is that what you're like? Posted by: ismac76

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So what's the next step beyond accolades?
[Report this comment]
Posted by: ismac76 on Jul 13, 2009 7:01 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I too appreciate Derrick's lucid decimation of the green capitalist ruse. In many ways I have understood what he speaks for far longer than I have read or listened to his words.
The missing element is the Commons.
Those who have found themselves in this age of crisis...out of work, fed up with school, debt addled, fed up with your labor being used to destroy our world so some rich fucks who think we just don't get it can enjoy the priviledge of decidering from their yachts, planes and multiple homes....
CONVERGE
we need to claim land, and space to self sustain. Start looking everywhere for sympathetic minds and appropriate unused space. Break through the privacy bubble of the individuals here and there to see exactly how many people share this frustration. Why should TV be the only accepted form of platonic social intercourse, or petitions, or religion? Build relationships, get the idea out there so it is as ubiquitous as the ideas of pointless social action have been up until now. people have been waiting for something real for a long time. last but not least...remember pacifism is only an option if you can choose to act decisively otherwise. let's not be pacifists by default, but pacifists by choice. Be ready, this winter, next spring so we can plant seeds under no flag other than our that of own community of self determination. A fire is burning hot and bright in the hearts of many thousands, let's build a bonfire. If you want to get anything, DEMAND EVERYTHING!!!

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Our political system is also a "double bind"
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Posted by: wcscheurer on Jul 13, 2009 7:04 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Without necessarily agreeing with much of the author's worldview, I want to point out that political action in this country also puts us in a "double bind" predicament.

"I think part of it is that we’re in a double bind. A double bind is where you’re given multiple options, but no matter what option you choose, you lose, and withdrawal is not an option."

That pretty much describes the two-party duopoly that limits our political action today -- which makes me want to go out back and meditate on my compost bin ...

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The whole system needs to change.
[Report this comment]
Posted by: r3s0n4t0r on Jul 13, 2009 7:46 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It's the fundamental structure of the capatalist fracional reserve monetary system which is largely to blame for the environmental degredation of our planet. The whole system is based on exponential growth of resources being sold to consumers and wasted. It is completely dependant on the perpetual growth and therefore cannot afford to be sustainable. The whole system relies on cyclical consumumption of the Earth's resources for profit not matter what environmental cost. Corruption and waste are built into the system, scarcity of resources means greater profit.
That's why people like Al Gore and the so called government are not going to change anything for they will do everything in there upmost to keep the system in place along with banking interests and corporations. It's insulting that they're even trying to influence the population into changing their way of living when it's them at the top who are largely to blame for this mess.
Ignorance is the only reason this system is still going. People would be revolting in the streets if they really knew how the system worked.
'Money As Debt' is a very good video when it comes to understanding how flawed this fractional reserve system really is. I encourage everyone to look it up on google video.
Money is completely irrelevant as we now how sufficient technology to provide a surplus of resources to everyone on the planet. Don't believe this crap your told that the planet is overpopulated and resources are running out. Is it not in their greatest interest for people to believe this is true? People are not starving in Africa becasue of scarcity of resources, it's largely due to greed. This whole depopulation agenda we're hearing deeply disturbs me.
Yes our world is in a bad state, but it's obvious that it's our society which needs change before we can even begin to focus our attention on the planet. The Venus Project offers a good alternative to out present system. By all means look it up.

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Language Worker
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Posted by: WordLab on Jul 13, 2009 8:14 AM   
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Ethical matters are not “personal.” With six billion people and headed for nine, there are no (longer) private acts. It is simply wrong and dissimulating to assert that that it is a tenet of “freedom” and “liberty” and “democracy” that “ethics” and “morals” are private and concern only us. This is precisely, resoundingly false. Behaviors and consequences are ethical choices and moral matters simply, and only, because they matter. To us. To our collective well-being. To our survival. To a recognizable enduring ecosystem.

Derrick Jensen has an astonishing and unflinching courage and conviction. I think he may be the most courageously self-examining author I have read.

There is nothing that we do –that you or I do- that does not engage us. Everything we do –collectively- broadcasts our clumsy, burdensome and irreversible degradation and waste of resources and spread of contaminants. Our institutions and our very "civilization" have become profoundly, unspeakably destructive. We can choose to be civic actors and do harm to a greater or lesser degree. Behaviors are ethical and moral, only insofar as they are not unethical, not immoral.

Read an essay about this at

http://www.takebackourlanguage.com/blog/
2008/09/07/there-are-no-private-acts/#202

There is no dishonor in honesty, and there is no immorality in acknowledging the harm we do. Derrick Jensen has demonstrated this with a public, and unequalled, integrity and dignity. I think I would not have the courage to hold these convictions if I had not read him.

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gimmie shelter
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Posted by: gimmie shelter on Jul 13, 2009 8:19 AM   
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Some may conclude that outsourcing in a way is good for us in the United States, after all China and so on are polluting their part of the world and not ours. Well think again. Pollution has no politics or recognizes no boundaries and eventually spreads to all parts of our planet given enough time. These corporations could be dismantled by a concerted effort to not buy their products or stocks. If this is done to a number of key polluters the rest will get the message. Of course if the other corporations do not get the message we can do the same to them. As for dams there should be no dams. Let the water flow once again to bring nutrients to the places that have been starved for far to long.

If any area could not survive without emptying the rivers or streams then let it go back to what it was before the dams. Instead of dams for producing electricity use solar and wind.

We need to stop or even reverse what corporations have done and are doing. They are in control of the bus we are all riding on and that bus is about to go over a cliff. There will be no do over. If any of us survive it will the corporations who owned the buses and not we whom were forced to ride on them.

Do you really think that the rich have not constructed ways to survive what we all see is coming. They are prepared but it is we who are not....yet.

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» RE: gimmie shelter Posted by: TNT666

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End result
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Posted by: willymack on Jul 13, 2009 8:26 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We're experincing the end result of cannibalistic capitalism. How do you like it?
The merchant royalty would just LOVE it if we were all narcissistic, compulsive consumers of stuff, mindless and heedless of any bad consequence of our actions or non-actions.
The problem with humans everywhere is they don't want to THINK. That's how and why psychotic parasites are able to make us all jump through their hoops.
Not wanting to think blinds us to the malevolent nature of the various predators only too willing to steal, by ANY means, the lion's share of everything worth having; hell, we practically WORSHIP them.
If this one tendency doesn't change, the inevitable collapse will occur. Mother Nature will NOT be cheated, and she can be a BITCH.

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Maybe I should sell my bicycle and buy an Excursion
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Posted by: thedevil666 on Jul 13, 2009 9:02 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I think I will stop using condoms, too. Sarcasm aside, though I agree with the point that many of the problems are systemic, but that does not absolve each and every one of us from our own personal responsibility. If we could reduce driving by 50% in this country through collective acts of personal thrift we wouldn't need to clear cut forests and create tailing ponds so we can access the oil sands of Alberta.

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Straw man
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Posted by: Mousey on Jul 13, 2009 9:07 AM   
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"Would any sane person think dumpster diving would have stopped Hitler, or that composting would have ended slavery or brought about the eight-hour workday, or that chopping wood and carrying water would have gotten people out of Tsarist prisons, or that dancing naked around a fire would have helped put in place the Voting Rights Act of 1957 or the Civil Rights Act of 1964?"

Apples and oranges. While I agree we need cohesive political might, please do not denigrate the critical need for individuals to make different choices. Only when we change our ways of living and thinking will we truly be able to influence others.

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» RE: Straw man Posted by: sunnywater
» RE: Straw man Posted by: obliu222
» RE: Straw man Posted by: Alternativepowerguy

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Deck chairs on the Titanic?
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Posted by: westomoon on Jul 13, 2009 9:23 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
In a strange way, I find it sort of comforting that it may already be too late to tip the balance back to where the Earth can sustain the huge number of people already on it, or the rapacious approach to life that has bloomed under patriarchal monotheism.

Planetary degradation is outstripping all the scientific models, and we still can't even bring ourselves to take the tiny steps that might have helped if we'd done them 40 years ago, but are definitely too little, too late now. Collectively, we don't seem capable of saving ourselves or our planet.

But the remnant of humanity that will be left (speaking optimistically) after we've crashed the planet won't have the luxury of being as stupid and self-destructive as we've been. That's the happiest ending I can see to our current self-created mess, and it's comforting, in a strange, detached way.

This was a spectacular article. As improving tech has made it easy, I've done all the green things -- with full knowledge that it's just to reduce the enormous shame I feel at being a part of the species that has caused the sixth mass extinction and is still destroying the planet that gave us life.

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Just a few days ago...
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Posted by: wildbill on Jul 13, 2009 9:27 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
...AlterNet published an article in which James Lovelock said it's too late, we're already toast, all of these efforts are akin to rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic, so why even bother writing anything more about what we should and shouldn't do? The best advice for handling the coming environmental/economic/political/societal collapse is: 1) stand or sit with legs apart, 2) bend over as far as you can with head between legs, 3) use hands to pull head farther back between legs, 4) kiss your ass goodbye.

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» gimmie shelter Posted by: gimmie shelter

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I concur
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Posted by: maddy on Jul 13, 2009 10:28 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I agree with the above article that this essay is really important.

I've taught for nearly 10 years and I gotta say that one of the most horrifying classes I ever had was at an institution that prides itself on being a radical training ground--no grades, no departments, no majors--the students design their own programs and do their own independent research. At least in theory.

In the process, we would all delude ourselves that we were somehow activists who were changing the world. (I think I may vomit if I ever have to again hear the expressions "speak truth to power" or "I need to examine my own privilege.")

Anyway, this particular class was on economic globalization.

And the best writer in the class insisted that, and I quote, "The only power we have is as consumers."

And the rest in the class agreed with him. They believed that their "freedom" was linked to the "freedom" of the marketplace and they could only see themselves as individual consumers. Worse, and truly horrifying, they thought that they were EMPOWERED as a result. As long as they could condemn racism, and sexism, and homophobia, and US foreign policy in the sanctity of these classrooms, they were somehow "radicals," but they couldn't see that they too were "sold" an identity by the college itself. Hence, the students either didn't know or didn't care about how the college busted an attempt by hourly workers on campus to unionize, nor did they understand or care that the bulk of faculty were hired as adjuncts or visiting profs so that they could be paid less and easily let go to save money.

I told them that it was probably the most upsetting thing I had ever heard in a classroom. What about cizitenship, or communities, or the commons? They clearly didn't know the history of struggle that is the United States--the abilitionist movement, the labor movement, the suffragist movement, the civil rights movement, the gay liberation movement, etc. These movements weren't based on how people "felt" or what they bought or didn't buy--they were direct confronations with institutions of power--some violent, most militant, and all collective and unapologetic.

So, yes, this article is very important.

On another note, I'm also glad that the author recognized that the "I'm a political hero cuz I'm not having a baby" is similar in its prioritizing of self-delusion over actual social change.

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» oops... Posted by: maddy
» Hipsters Posted by: Nebris
» RE: I concur Posted by: TNT666

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So, Ted Kaczynski was right all along?
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Posted by: HoboHomo on Jul 13, 2009 10:29 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Well?

Industrial Society and Its Future (the Unabomber Manifesto).

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» Eerie, isn't it? Posted by: Urstrly

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More of the same
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Posted by: sirios on Jul 13, 2009 10:40 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This article is just more of the same, more clever, but more of the same. He is asking us to use polarity as a means of correcting the imbalance in relativity. It is the us and them game once again. If the us side asserts it self a great deal more, then the them side will surrender and join the ranks of "us" . The author describes "them" as menacing and "us' as weak do gooders, and then gives us a David and Goliath pep talk, a good pep talk but a pep talk. Assignment of blame no matter how clever and palatable it is to Alternet intellectuals, is still just intellectual inspiration about the imbalance that greed and corruption produce. how exactly does removing power from one side and placing it in the hands of the opposite exact a solution. Can the us group handle power more compassionately because they have so long been without ? maybe at first, but remember, power corrupts. If the reassignment of power was so effective, it would have worked centuries ago. The correction of opposites feeds into the continued existence of opposing forces and becomes an obstacle to unity. The reason we have this dilemma is because of the entrenched belief that life is limited to individualized personality.
Solution ? introduce the thems and us to our common essence, awareness awake to it self. This is NOT a missing knowledge but what knowledge resides in. It is the container of knowledge which is unified in nature by virtue of the fact that it does not require an observer and an object of observation. it remains in a constant state of self referral while simultaneously allowing objects of polarity to exist inside of it. The result of this realization is that the individual now sees itself and the environment as irrevocably connected. The them and us and the environment are no longer at odds with each other. The problem of convincing "them" and of maintaing the new us is accomplished without fear based legislation to keep the greedy rebels in line.

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Big task
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Posted by: Jaffe on Jul 13, 2009 10:46 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Astute article.

But it's a big challenge. I mentioned in an earlier post that official culture actually approved of the so-called political correctness struggles of the 80s and 90s because it balkanized progressives, pitting faction against faction for what amounted to a very small slice of the financial pie.

The situation is worse now because of several factors, including global capitalist propaganda (or media warfare), where people's legitimate grievances are marginalized, rendered invisible, or simple lied about.

Meanwhile. the imposed obsession with technology has young would-be progressives murdering baddies in video games, even as what is left of "real time" pulses around them.

Perhaps the final disappointment is the ethical cowardice of those who should know better. I see it everyday among my intelligent, enfeebled university colleagues.

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We need to stop
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Posted by: wormfarmer on Jul 13, 2009 10:52 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
screwing around with the media created distractions, the socio-political distractions, take control of our futures, (and the futures of succeeding generations), and treat the planet with the respect and responsibility it deserves. This goes for ALL contributors to the problem. I wish I could present another solution, but the dismantling of the current system through dissent, refusal to support the present political industrial economic systems, open revolt, to achieve a responsible society that pays attention to the needs of the planet, populace, and succeeding generations, (thats not going to stop), is a drastic solution, but it will have an effect.
This is OUR ONLY HOME! Lets concentrate on saving it.

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I Hate My Job Anyway!!!
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Posted by: Klaus on Jul 13, 2009 11:06 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Check out this website linked text and read "Radical Simplicity" by Jim Merkel. Also another interesting read is "Radical Simplicity" by Dan Price linked text. I am very much considering these options because as the title says I HATE MY JOB. I have always hated my jobs! JOBS SUCK!!! P.S. If you are wondering what I do for a living, I am an Electrical Engineer.

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our grandparents in the 1930's were TOUGHER then us!
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Posted by: frantic1971 on Jul 13, 2009 11:40 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I keep thinking back to the 1930s--the labor movement, for example. People got out and picketed and protested and tried to organize unions often at risk of their lives. And these were just ordinary Joes--our grandparents and great-grandparents. What courage it must have taken for these people to face-down the likes of U.S. Steel and Ford. Witness the infamous "Memorial Day Massacre" when 10 people were killed.

My dad was a farmer in Nebraska. He and other farmers got together and forcibly stopped farm foreclosures. He always told a story to us kids about how once at a "foreclosure action", a Nebraska State Trooper pointed a shotgun at him and screamed "stand back you sonofabitch, or I'll fill you full of lead!".

Is it just me, or do people today in general just seem to be ball-less in the face of this oppression? Are folks today afraid that protesting or picketing might "affect their credit rating"? Is it something in the water or food that has effectively emasculated the People's fighting spirit?

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Personal change DOES produce political action and social change
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Posted by: MotherLodeBeth on Jul 13, 2009 12:28 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Personal change DOES produce political action and social change. Here in the Sierras with less garbage being produced we have less land fill. When on neighbor installed off the grid solar other neighbors did as well. This meant fewer power lines in our rural area. Buying less meant that Home Depot wont be building a store in the historical area of Jackson CA. And not only are people into small homes like in decades past, but instead of conventional materialistic burials, we are doing green burials.

And a family with two children who shop at thrift stores, are better than a family with no children who rush out to buy the newest iPod and other high tech goodie. Or the person who has no children but flies off to various world destinations, or has a walk in closet the size of a studio apartment. which clothes made in China, and other child labor places. Think of Sex in the City. Or the 'green' homes that are HUGE and have designer kitchens where little homemade simple food is ever created. Another reason I joined the Small House Society.

Look at all the 'environmental' minded publications that have page after page of stuff they insist someone who lives simple must have. Green living has become a buy buy buy business. Not about use it up, wear it out, find a need or do without. Or waste not want not.

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You go first....
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Posted by: lightwing1 on Jul 13, 2009 12:31 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I find it ironic that the author points out that the logical conclusion of simple living is suicide and argues against this approach being meaningful but promotes the idea of suicide by attacking the powers that be. Alot of the people who stood up to Nazi Germany were sent to death camps as were many who challenged the powers that be in Tsarist Russia.

So, the only answer is to risk death to stop the industrial machine, eh? All of you collectivists out there - which ones of you are willing to lay down your life first to advance this cause? Which ones of you are willing to sacrifice your individual lives (since you argue that the quest for individualism is the root of all evil)?

I thought so. Seems like an extreme approach to me. The author presumes that the industrial machine can not be changed without death and destruction and yet I read every day about individuals and groups who are working hard as I write this - not at politics - but at experimenting with alternative energy solutions, waste stream reduction solutions, and resource management solutions that can change the substance of the modern industrial paradigm.

I concede that there are political battles that are being and can be won as well - but without bloodshed or sacrifice of life this author is advocating. What about the Industrial Hemp movement? It is gaining ground. Oregon just passed SB 676 which legalizes production and possession of industrial hemp. Now that's political action that works - but done on a local level - without bloodshed or loss of life - and applied to a constructive, useful paradigm that will benefit the whole ultimately. Soon most states will legalize this incredibly beneficial plant.

I am not saying that political pressure doesn't have it's place, but I would argue that while top-down strategies are notoriously seductive in that they get things done quickly and serve the impatient, that they can be oppressive as well. And, the author ignores the fact that changing hearts and minds on an individual level ultimately does change paradigms. There is an upward force that exists from bottom-up change that is just as relevant (and proven to be more effective and longer-lasting) than top-down strategies.

I know, I know. I just don't get it from your point of view. However, you can't deflate the powers that be by directly attacking them. They are too strong. They have too many resources. Taking the wind out of their sails works much better. So, how does one do this? By changing the substance of the forms that exist and potentially the forms themselves - in essence by outwitting them and coming up with a better way. That means getting busy using the marketplace to bring new ideas to the table - build new models. Come up with new ways of utilizing resources, recapturing the valuable elements from our waste streams, new manufacturing paradigms, energy paradigms, transportation paradigms, etc. Get busy designing and creating the new world you want to bring in. Stop waiting for the federal government to be the final solution to everything - the federal government will not solve this crisis. Stop waiting for others to jump on the bandwagon. Roll up your sleeves and do it yourself.

If a collective body of individuals committed themselves to creating alternatives, the world would change alot faster. Beating people over the head with a stick never solved anything long term. Be the leadership you desire to see in the world - lead the way with ideas, innovation, example.

I challenge you to - instead of whining about overpopulation - come up with models that provide the best standard of living for all utilizing the limited resources we have. It is possible to change the world without having to die for the privilege.

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» RE: You go first.... Posted by: sirios
» RE: We are not cooked yet... Posted by: lightwing1
» RE: You go first.... Posted by: cplot
» RE: Have it your way... Posted by: lightwing1
» RE: You go first.... Posted by: TNT666

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taming sublimanailly induced behaviorial matrixes
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Posted by: wolvedrive on Jul 13, 2009 12:53 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
won't actually appease the enemies of freedom or satisfy superficial visions of day dreams ,,,sorry gotta go,drive ya latter

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dumb first paragraph puts off reader....
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Posted by: bifurctationpoint on Jul 13, 2009 2:48 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This article may be brilliant as brilliant can be. But, unfortunately, after this shockingly illogical lead-in, I'm going to have to force myself to finish the rest of it later, when I've had time to recuperate!

Composting wouldn't end slavery, but perhaps individuals freeing slaves would. Etc. I would think that the author could do better than this sort of preposterous "straw-man" argument.

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» RE: I think you have trouble with analogies Posted by: bifurctationpoint
» RE: I think you have trouble with analogies Posted by: bifurctationpoint

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There is a niche for everyone!
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Posted by: raincascadia on Jul 13, 2009 2:53 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Social transformation requires vast ecosystems of people doing all sorts of things to change culture and institutions. There is a niche for everyone. Some of us are working on models of sustainable living which will replace the current insanity. There is no corporate or government solution that will allow individuals to keep living the way they do. Personally, the only way I would be willing to work with corporations and governments is by blowing things up, so I need to do something else that is positive if I don't want to end up dead or in jail. For those who enjoy knocking on doors, working within the institutions, organizing demonstrations, or engaging in direct action, go for it! I'm curious to know what the author does besides writing.

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Pls. free US from Israel
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Posted by: weathered on Jul 13, 2009 4:32 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
its not a relationship at all, its extortion and its made America very sick.

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Gluttony Is No Sin.
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Posted by: melpol on Jul 13, 2009 4:44 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Picking the planet clean is what Mother Nature designed us to do. Nothing can stop this process. Taking only one shower per week or eating less will slow down the extinction of life on the planet. But the final outcome will be death to all. The wisest thing that each person can do is practice as much gluttony as possible. It is sinful to deny yourself that pleasure.

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Good article but a fundamentally flawed argument -Part 1
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Posted by: humanrevolution on Jul 13, 2009 7:28 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Mr. Jenson definitely made a good stab at it. I agree with the fundamental premise that people must not only do good, but must fight evil at the same time in order to change the system, but where I believe Mr. Jenson totally gets it wrong is in taking it out of the hands of individuals. This I believe in a way is the problem with the modern progressive movement and though we may not want to hear it is very similar to those fundamentalist right wing Christians that we blame for just about everything. The idea is that we are all good and they (corporate media, politicians, corporations, etc. etc. etc.) are all part of some evil machine. Those fundamentalist Christians do this too. But good and evil are in fact inseparable aspects of life that are within and without and what assigns good or evil to any given external manifestation is people. Most anything in the human world can be a force for good or for evil; it all depends on the person(s) using it. The second aspect of this argument that reminds me of those darn fundamentalists is the idea of salvation. The most extreme of progressives believe some divine moment like the second coming will happen and lift us from this evil. I hope you aren't waiting for that because you are going to be waiting just as long as the fundamentalists are for Jesus. Change happens piece by piece, person by person, one step at a time and when a critical mass, so to speak, of people subscribe to a particular idea then a larger shift occurs. But here is my point. You cannot force your ideas on others... this is the method of lesser men. Instead you must live true to your beliefs, prove the validity of your way of life, encourage others around you, and they will naturally adopt it over time. This may seem simple but it is powerful. When you say, "The second problem—and this is another big one—is that it incorrectly assigns blame to the individual (and most especially to individuals who are particularly powerless) instead of to those who actually wield power in this system and to the system itself... We, as individuals, are not creating the crises, and we can’t solve them." ...then you miss the entire point. Systems are made of people. The solutions to the problems of humanity lie within human beings and in fact it is those everyday "particularly powerless" people who have changed much of what has needed changing in the past few centuries. Individuals must change before anything else will. Otherwise you will spend your life fighting an apparition. We have already tried social, economic, cultural, and political revolutions. We need a human revolution. The human revolution of just a single individual can change the destiny of all mankind. Let me provide some evidence for my point. Gandhi. Not a particularly powerful individual as a young man; in fact he was quite shy and timid. But from one man's determination and the support of many others afterwards he wrested power away from the greatest imperialists of the preceding few centuries without ever even holding political office, taking up an armed rebellion, being the head of a major company etc. One person has extreme power. I get your point that turning off the water while I am brushing my teeth won't save the worlds water supply, but I fundamentally disagree that the most profound change I can make... that of changing myself from within and inspiring others to do the same can't make a difference. In fact, I believe it is the only thing that will. You can spend all of your life trying to take down a company or a political system and you might succeed, but it will just be replaced by another one that is most likely more greedy than the one before it. Another alternative is to spend your life transforming yourself and the individuals who may one day populate those systems so that when you or they do get to the top, then collectively they can make a better decision.

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» RE: i think the problem comes in... Posted by: humanrevolution

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Good article but a fundamentally flawed argument -Part 2
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Posted by: humanrevolution on Jul 13, 2009 7:28 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Let me put it another way. Would you rather have a company staffed by greedy individuals who were raised selfishly believing in money as their salvation or would you take a company filled with people who do believe in personal conservation and restraint. Don't you think if an organization is filled with enough of the second kind of people then it would naturally come to transform itself to reflect more of those ideas? Now I am not saying that it will be easy to wrest this greed, anger, and stupidity out of our lives and those of others, but as long as we are just trimming back the shoots of the weeds without pulling up the roots, we will get nowhere. We will also get nowhere by standing on some moral high ground like many others we disagree with and pointing the finger at someone or something else. There is an old Buddhist proverb that says when you point one finger at someone else in blame then 3 fingers are pointing back at you. Start with yourself, then move to those around you and you will see change. If you own or work in a company then work to make that company a model of change and an example for others. If you are a politician then don’t be greedy, don’t give into cooperate demands etc. If you work in the media, report the truth. I don’t care if you sweep the floor at Denny’s you can make a difference. Get to work on yourself and YOUR environment and you can change anything, find a way to apathetically blame some far off system and you will accomplish no more than anyone else. Not fighting evil is the same as doing evil.

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Cosmic Annihilation
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Posted by: je5752 on Jul 13, 2009 7:47 PM   
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There's just one giant, gaping hole in all of this fluffy, feel-good environmentalism and the arguments for a return to a primitive, agrarian society: our species will cease to exist in a few billion years as will all life in the solar system whether we like it or not.

The Sun will go red giant in 5 billion years, consuming Earth. Andromeda will collide with the Milky Way in 3 billion years, possibly resulting in catastrophic devastation from asteroid/comet or high energy particle storms. And then there's the outside possibility that a megadose of gamma radiation will sweep over the planet from a quasar, or an asteroid/comet from our own galaxy will collide with us at some point in the near (next few million year) future.

From this perspective we don't really have a choice if we want to survive as a species - we simply must have technological development so that we can leave this planet and even this galaxy. We are guaranteed to die if we don't develop technology - we start out with nothing to lose. Some how we'll have to find a way to make technological development sustainable, as it's the only way forward. All other paths lead to certain death.

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» RE: Cosmic Annihilation Posted by: gimmie shelter

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Composting WOULD reduce slavery, and dumpster diving might stop a Hitler
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Posted by: cascadia on Jul 13, 2009 9:35 PM   
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If we composted and dumpster dived more, we wouldn't need outsourced slaves in Haiti, China, Pakistan, etc. making cheap stuff for us--You know, slavery still exists, it's just that now, we figured out a system where we don't have to pay for our slaves' room and board. And we don't have to see them at all. So clever!

A lot of Hitler's elan was his promise to provide material prosperity to the Germans. So if the Germans in control, and their American and British helpers and propagandists,had been content with a world without autobahns and Volkswagens and sophisticated killing machines that could be sold for lots of money, well,the world would be a very different place.

I like Derrick Jensen's provocative style, but have to agree with the poster above who warned about anyone summoning Hitler in their first sentence...

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Oh God yes
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Posted by: james108 on Jul 13, 2009 10:37 PM   
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So many people had the same democratic ideals and mantras in Hitlers day, and only paying attention and being impartial about injustice helped a little.
All the animal friendly, anti smoking, anti right wing ideals did nothing but strengthen it, as long as they were willing to look the other way.

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Well meaning but flawed...
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Posted by: whogrant on Jul 14, 2009 12:34 AM   
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With 207 comments I'll hope you'll forgive me if this point has already been made so here goes.

This article is well meaning, I mean I agree with it in spirit but basically it is flawed - if everyone stops consuming excessively and limits themselves to the simplest of consumption then that 90% (or whatever the figure is the author gives) of industrial and commercial output will go away because it exists only to service our basic economic wants, needs and desires. So it is a fallacy to say that we consumers changing our behavior will have an insignificant impact on the damage being caused by the corporate world.

The only flaw in my counter-argument that I can see is where the market for providing a basic need (that we cannot do without) is run by a monopoly, or there is only one affordable provider that the majority of consumers can afford (think WalMart). In which case we have no choice but to "eat it". This is why anti-trust laws and diversity is king. We simply cannot let our market place be taken over by a tiny few providers that dictate the terms.

The only thing required to make this all work is transparency so that consumers know what they are buying into when they buy a product on the shelf. If you're pro-American, pro-local or whatever why would you shop at Wal-Mart where 80% of everything is shipped in from China??? Well if you knew where everything came from you could still shop there but only buy the stuff made in America, believe me, these big corps will take note! All you have to do is shop with your values first and price second and you can change the world.

There are companies out there, e.g. GoodGuide that are campaigning for transparency at the checkout - just give the consumers the info they need and let them make the decisions. This is, admittedly, the opposite of traditional marketing where companies try to influence you to ignore your basic needs and use your greed, indulgence and other emotions to influence your purchace. But so long as consumers on the whole give a s**t about the world and the future maybe there is a chance.

At the very least consumers deserve an equal footing in this "free market" because if they don't then the free market will be forever slanted against us and lets face it in this case "us" is humanity so that is not going to be a good outcome. Just remember that all the standard measures of progress that the government uses will value money spent on bad things like war, pollution clean up and treating the sick (instead of preventing sickness) just like any other dollar spent on "good" things like preventing war, pollution and sickness.

That's just sad and I'm afraid to say WRONG and speaks volumes about what is wrong with the world today.

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EarthFirst! fist on headline page
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Posted by: TNT666 on Jul 14, 2009 1:19 AM   
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What a sight of beauty, how I miss the original EarthFirst! crowd, before it got taken over the poetry and PC crowd and the originals got shoved aside.

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The point is well-taken, but...
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Posted by: MadameSwanky on Jul 14, 2009 6:22 AM   
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I think this article outlines something really important. By cleverly spinning the Green Movement into something you can BUY, industry has managed to take a movement and make it into another iteration of consumption.

That said, I do think there is some value in personal symbolism. I know that, for instance, I am a vegetarian, and when I explain all the reasons that I am a vegetarian, I do touch on why the meat industry is so horrible for the environment, etc. Those who are completely unfamiliar with the issues might be compelled to look it up just by asking me questions about my choices. It's not going to change the world, but it is valuable.

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» And you? Posted by: Jason Jordan

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Doesn't matter whether you're personally using a sledge hammer, toothpick, beer bottle, we're all .
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Posted by: Beck on Jul 14, 2009 7:11 AM   
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. . .pounding the same hole in the same boat. When you're helping pound a hole in the boat we're all in, it's foolish, not to mention narcissistic, to, instead of stopping pounding, argue that since the person or corporation beside you is using a jackhammer, you shouldn't stop chipping away with your Bic pen. After all, you've been told many times each day your entire life how pleasurable it is to knock holes in the boat.

Yesterday I read this in the Utne reader:

"It could be argued that our entire culture suffers from a narcissistic personality disorder, as evidenced by our distant and entitiled relationship to the more-than-human world." Maybe the greatest indication of this entitlement and distance is using the argument that since others use bigger tools, we shouldn't have to stop whatever we're doing with our little ones. Underneath that argument is the same tired consumerism: I LIKE longer showers! I know I'm not only supposed to get and do what I like, I would actually be dumb to not get it. Especially when someone else is getting and doing EVEN MORE!

A great question from the article, by Larry Robinson, from the new book Ecotherapy:

"What human qualities does a healthy ecosystem require?" It should be obvious which ones don't sustain the ecosystem: the ones that never have. And by now we have to include scapegoating and straw men. We're all knocking the same hole in the same boat. Who knows which tool from which hand will puncture through first? Just because there's a maul slamming away beside you doesn't mean that your bare hand won't make the final plunge. And only people who WANT badly to keep hammering away argue about shorter showers.

The article also stated that in ancient Greece, the word "idiot" meant a private person not engaged in the life of the community. It's time to stop arguing for the right to have a daily life that does not take the community into account. The reason: that's the exact thinking that got us here to begin with, the thinking that CEOs take into board meetings and make decisions with.

Won't this be awful? No more rationalizing. No more specious arguments. No more waiting for someone else. No more straw men. Just each doing whatever it takes.

Actually, no, it's not awful. If a shorter shower makes your life worse, you're not living a real life anyway. I dare you, start giving up this kind of stuff and see how little you miss it. Start doing active things, and see how pleasant they are. I'm about to do a load of laundry. I'm going to put a 5-gallon bucket under the exhaust hose and use the water to water my garden. If I'm quick enough, I'll get almost 20 gallons, all I need. It'll be exercise, gardening, money saving, and an excuse not to do anything else, all at once.

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gimmie shelter
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Posted by: gimmie shelter on Jul 15, 2009 9:35 AM   
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One of the biggest secrets any government holds is that the masses have the power at any moment to change what so few have put in place. There is no country in the world where their military or police forces are greater in number than it's citizens. The feeling of helplessness is exactly what those in power and big business created to keep us in line. Never believe that the majority in any country do not have a say in what that country does or does not do. It all is just a matter of timing and education.
Modern society has been weakened by the isolation of the individuals and of nuclear families, but they are not down and out. The powers that be profit from breaking down families to the smallest units possible while also destroying our sense of community.

We need to get back to basics and away from consumerism which only leaves us unfulfilled.
Never let anyone tell you that "we the people", are powerless.

It only takes one spark to create a fire. And when is the public going to demand that criminals in government be tried and go to jail the same way we would if we do not follow the law. There are some in or out of government who have and are literally getting away with murder. Everyone needs to chip away at those in Washington to get rid of those worthless politicians working for themselves or for the corporations. The time has never been better than now.

Our people are feeling the pain caused by men and not by cycles in the market. America was robbed and we are paying the thieves a bonus. Only in America.

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THAT PERSONAL PRIVATE ETHICS EQUALS SOCIAL ETHICS IS A MYTH, A LIE TOLD
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Posted by: Raymond Emerson on Jul 15, 2009 3:17 PM   
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by republicans. It is told as a cover to the fact that they are socially unethical. Private ethics does not automatically create a social ethic.

The right shoot themselves in the foot when they prove privately unethical. I has an unintended side effect. They are instantly seen as socially unethical.

It is entirely possible to have really high social ethics and have the private ethics of an alleycat. All of the Kennedys tomcatted around. Their social ethics have been right on. Even FDR had a mistress. He may go down as ataining the highest social ethics quotient ever achieved by an American president. Bill Clinton left office with a 70% approval rating. That wasn't because of his private ethics. The citizenry had a deeper understanding.

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We are the problem but we can be the solution
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Posted by: verityguiton on Jul 15, 2009 6:16 PM   
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Attacks on people (any people) from the left to the right, from developed to developing nations doesn't help solve the issue of Global Warming and Climate Change.

Global warming is a natural process and happens when various chemicals (not just CO2) rise to the atmosphere. Ultimately this process keeps us warm and enables the growth of plants, animals and people. However, due to the increase in these chemicals, the earth has warmed to a dangerous level causing the earths climate to change as well as future environmental conditions.

The industrial revoluition has contributed a lot to this and thus people (like you and me) are the cause for our earths current state.

But there is one thing that seems to be over looked. We didn't know...

Well at least up until the 1960's (or earlier) when chemical threats to the environment were also effecting people and therefore it was necessary they be minimised or stopped. DDT is a good example of this.

From there on, industry has increased substantially as well as population growth causing further climatic alterations. However it was too early to be sure if polution would cause long term damage.

So we carried on and a splash of consumerism exploded from the capatalist regime where and more money was to be put into the economy to increase power, miltary weapons and security.

True, but there are other things to consider such as history, progression and shifts in religion and science, race, social networks/status and war. These are also extreamly important to consider in the development of our current lives and thus global warming and climate change.

The above factors happened throughout history predating christ and the evolutionary theory and to say that global warming can be fixed in one clean swoop is not only impossile, it's unrealistic.

We have very little power in this world. Freedom to be sure in the west, however to create conflict in the larger or littlest sense doesn't help minimise polution and environmental degredation which is causing our rivers and land to dry up.

It may seem like we are only making a small contribution in the great scheme of things were water restriction and simple living are concerned but should we just do nothing? The government isn't doing anything, so why should we, right?

We may not have the power to change the world tomorrow, but we have ultimate power of the way we live in our homes today. 20% is a quarter of the total intake of water in homes within the country. That's a lot considering the many other factors that need to be considered when determing the cause and solution of climate change. And it's a great contribution on our part if we can give that back through small acts such as taking shorter showers.

There's hope in continuing with a simple life, especially when we are on the topic of capitalism. If the government and industry see no market in non sustainable living, then they won't bother investing in a way of life that brings them no profit.

This is why we must keep going and not fight with eachother. It may take some time, but we can change the world by pushing through and doing it the right way, not the violent way.

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Oh the irony
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Posted by: Arbie on Jul 16, 2009 5:05 AM   
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In the last week we've been told we've got to cut back our CO2 emmisions by x% by y year or we'll all die due to global warming. In the same month the G8 have agreed to these cut backs (ok there's some debate as to what the exact figures are). Here in the UK we have the governement peddling green jobs and a green future.

Then what does NASA do? Launch a spaceship - how much CO2 was released there? Even if I don't go carbon neutral I will never as emmit as much CO2 as they did. And it will never impact the ozone as quickly.

I think it proves the author's point.

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Don't agree with this at all
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Posted by: setrimacoky on Jul 16, 2009 12:30 PM   
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Remember when the Clintons required us to use less water in our toilet flushes? Now I have to flush twice. That did not work so well. People please open your minds to discussion about the environment. The science behind this is not sound and reflects agenda rather than truth. Yours is not the alternative voice anymore - yours is the main-stream voice. I would encourage you to subjegate your local government to your environmental beliefs rather than the fed. There are too many alternative individual opinions, beliefs, cultures, etc in this great country for a one size fits all mentality. That is why our republic is so great - you can have your alternative lifestyle locally while others in another part of the country can enjoy a very different life style (San Francisco vs Salt Lake City). If you keep pushing on the FED, and create a one size fits all Federal Gov't, where are the alternatives? Where are the differences that make us the best country on earth. Take out a coin, read the inscription - E Pluribus Unum..."Out of many, One". Beautiful stuff my friends.

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The obvious question is...
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Posted by: lcdcobb on Jul 16, 2009 3:01 PM   
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Why not do both?? Why not make personal choices that are sustainable, AND get politically active? An argument that suggests lifestyle changes are irrelevant and unrelated to sea changes is flimsy at best.

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Industrial civilization is killing the planet
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Posted by: CleanWaterWarrior on Jul 17, 2009 12:02 PM   
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Derrick- If we adopt your mantra, "Industrial civilization is killing the planet," we might have a chance.
I'm fighting for clean water in my community. The fight is against industrial civilization.

Bill MacKibbon said that changing the way we do business and live on this planet will be as hard as getting rid of slavery.

Slavery impacted every social, cultural, political religious and business institution in the US. Slavery has been outlawed for 150 years -- and we are still living in its shadow. Ask any person of color you know.

Re-aligning our industrial civilization is the task of this generation -- and the next seven generations.

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tiffany
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Posted by: ekoljos on Jul 18, 2009 10:34 AM   
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Cellphones might have defeated Hitler, and eating fish could help stop global warming.
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Posted by: SardineLady on Jul 18, 2009 6:21 PM   
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Pay attention to one of Jensen’s key points: misdirection. Once we know how a magician did his trick, we marvel that we fell for the trick.

Not that I can tell you how we were persuaded to do all the stupid things that got us here, but obviously our overlord Magicians (AKA “Puppeteers,” “Powers That Be”) exploit human beings’ tendency to be emotional and impulsive.

But now our inventions are balancing the power relationship. The PC non-consumers amongst us might have missed Clay Shirky’s idea, namely, "How cell phones, Twitter, Facebook can make history" (http://blog.ted.com/2009/06/qa_with_clay_sh.php)

Pictures are worth a thousand words. If we’d had Twitter in the 1930s, maybe the WWI victors could have seen how foolish it was to expect immense reparations from the loser.

With cell phone cameras, would Hitler have maintained his heroic public persona?

Wouldn’t news have gotten out about IBM and Ford’s profitable commerce with the Reich have been exposed? If all wars are resource wars pretending to be other things, then grassroots comprehension might have reduced the war fever that swept nations.

Could economic ostracism, like that used against South Africa’s apartheid regime, have worked on Hitler's Germany?

Meanwhile, no real, pervasive change can happen until we fix two invisible national deficiencies: omega-3s and vitamin D.

Huh? If you have noticed that American voters are more impulsive and gullible than ever, consider that we are also more deficient in DHA and EPA (the omega-3s from fish, chickens that eat bugs, and grass fed beef). Our big brains are supposed to contain a high percentage of these essential fatty acids. The frontal cortex, where empathy, long range planning, and the ability to see the consequences of our actions occurs, especially needs omega-3s.

Our national vitamin D deficiency fits in with our greatly reduced fish consumption (don’t worry, we could have sustainable fisheries if we stopped feeding the bulk of what’s caught to pigs etc.), and adds to our fuzzy thinking.

Read about it at GoodSchoolFood.org.

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A Vision - Slaves Anonymous
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Posted by: A. Servant on