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I Married an Illegal Immigrant: A First-Hand Account of How Screwed Up This Country's Rules for Foreigners Are

By Joshua Holland, AlterNet. Posted March 30, 2009.


The one argument in the immigration debate with absolutely no merit is that the system is fine.

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Immigration is an issue that always spurs heated debates. There are some decent arguments floating around, some kooky ones and one that reveals that the person making it is utterly clueless about the issue. That argument, in a nutshell, is that the system's fine.

Sure, there are around 11 million people in this country illegally; sure, many toil away in horrific conditions without any legal protections; yes, we detain suspected illegal immigrants (children included) -- meaning some number of legal immigrants and citizens as well -- in obscene conditions that human rights groups say violate international norms and, yes, those citizens who employ undocumented workers do so with something very close to impunity.

But the system's not broken, according to these folks. That's just a liberal talking point bandied about by those with a perverse desire to actually fix it. (This is closely related to the even more ridiculous assertion that the government doesn't do much to enforce the immigration laws. It does -- much more than enough, in fact, given the nature of the offense in question.)

Now, there is a significant group of people who would never, ever suggest that our immigration system is anything less than dysfunctional. That group consists of anyone who has ever had any opportunity to interact with it in any way whatsoever.

Although I am a U.S. citizen -- belonging to a fourth-generation immigrant family -- I count myself among that group. What I learned through the experience is that the difference between a "legal" and "illegal" immigrant often comes down to whether one can afford a decent, well-connected lawyer.

Here's my tale:

When I was very young, I fell in love with a woman. She had the misfortune of being born in another country, but we didn't let that stand in our way, and eventually we married. (And, for the record, it was by no means a sham marriage -- we had lived together for three years before tying the knot.)

We had lived in Germany for a while -- where my application for permanent residency was processed with typical Teutonic efficiency. Then we moved to New York and ran into the U.S. immigration system, a black hole of an agency staffed by incompetent, gray-faced bureaucrats whose performances would have shamed the DMV.

Their sole joy in life seemed to come from making applicants' lives miserable, but we soldiered on, traipsing down to lower Manhattan to file endless pieces of paper and attend about four interviews.

Eventually, my (now ex-) wife was granted a temporary permit to work while her application was being processed. She was, officially, a "legal" immigrant, one of the ones that Lou Dobbs supposedly loves.

Then we made a huge error, at least as it relates to the immigration system: We moved to Florida (I know, how rude of us?).

We paid a fee to have our file transferred and were assured that the application process would continue smoothly in the sure hands of the Miami field office (this was back when CIS was INS, and not part of Homeland Security).

Only the file never arrived. It was transferred, but to Maine. And then somewhere else (I forget where -- I think it landed somewhere in the Pacific Northwest).

Months passed. we were repeatedly told that the file was being tracked and would appear in the Sunshine State any day now. The authorities renewed my sweetie's 'temporary' authorization, and she remained, thankfully, "legal."

Until the day cruise.

If you've ever been to Florida, you've probably seen a lot of ads for these tacky junkets. They jam a bunch of pasty, brightly clothed tourists into a ship -- most of which are packed with E. coli bacteria -- and for 50 bucks they stuff them with cheap booze and fattening foods, toodle around the Atlantic for 10 hours, relieve them of a few more bucks in the casino and then back to port. We got one of these cruises as a gift.

Now, we'd been told that while the application was pending, my wife couldn't leave the country. And we weren't sure whether a day cruise constituted leaving the country or not. So we brought all our paperwork to an INS agent in the cruise terminal and asked him point-blank whether we could take the trip.

Not a problem, he assured us, as long as we didn't disembark in another country, it wouldn't be considered an overseas trip. We thanked him, got on board, and proceeded to get as sick as the other 1,000 or so suckers who took that day's cruise.


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Joshua Holland is an editor and senior writer at AlterNet.

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View:
"nation of immigrants" Lies
Posted by: Honky the Nihilist... on Mar 30, 2009 12:18 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Perhaps the US was once a "Nation of Immigrants" but that is no longer the case.

I am a Native American born of native parents who were born of native parents. When my great grandparents immigrated here in the early part of the last century, they didn't scurry across the border in the middle of the night but came here legally.

Aside from the author's situation and maybe people adopting children from abroad, immigration is a tool for the corporate elites to undercut the middle class. H1B visa holders prevent computer scientist and engineers from receiving the compensation they would otherwise receive. Illegals are likewise used to union bust and destroy blue collar wages.

America is not the world's welfare program.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» "...I am a Native American" Posted by: Honky the Nihilist...
» "Native American"? Posted by: GuitarBill
» RE: "Native American"? Posted by: AMERICAN VETERAN
» Yeah, tell me about it, GI Joe Posted by: GuitarBill
» RE: Celtic, Anglo, Saxon, Teutonic, and Mandarin Posted by: Honky the Nihilist...
» RE: "...I am a Native American" Posted by: john mont
» Native American? Posted by: Obijuan
» RE: Native American? Posted by: babs
» Are You Into Visigoths Too? Posted by: johnwinthrop
» Mongrels? Posted by: Honky the Nihilist...
» Agreed Posted by: freelyb
» RE: Agreed Posted by: babs
» Oh Franklin, You Turn Me On! Posted by: johnwinthrop
» Honky the Onanist an immigrant? Posted by: GuitarBill
My problem was with Social Security.
Posted by: Sojourner on Mar 30, 2009 1:04 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Nothing got done until I wrote my Congressman who got the head of the local office to telephone me.

All the appropriate forms were filed but when I personally went in to find out where I stood, none of the paperwork could be located.

It seems FICA staff at the frontlines spend so much time as inquistors, they get in the habit of thinking it is their money they are handling. Kafka didn't know the half of it.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» Social Security fun Posted by: BlueTigress
» Great story Posted by: Sojourner
The system is a disaster
Posted by: janvdb on Mar 30, 2009 1:24 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I also navigated a spouse through the legalization process, which took 5 years instead of the expected 6 months.

And, yes, you must hire a lawyer.

MOST Mexicans wait 10 to 20 years, so 5 was a mere walk in the park.

The system is deliberately structured to create an exploitable class of no-rights workers to undercut low-end American wages. The "illegals" have been openly tolerated for decades, yet denied reasonable access to rightful status.

The state and employers are deliberately collaborating to create a large class (about 5% of American workers, it is estimated) who are afraid to quit, afraid to sue, afraid to ask for decent conditions.

I myself met individuals who were deliberately hired for jobs requiring exposure to harmful chemicals; then when they became ill, they were simply sent back to Mexico do die. No coverage, no compensation, no legal rights, no lawsuit -- no problem!

The system is shameful.

Jan VanDenBerg

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Big Lie
Posted by: johnwinthrop on Mar 30, 2009 1:29 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Immigrant supporters claim opponents of illegal immigrants think system is fine. This is a lie.System fell down years ago. Nonenforcement led to twenty million parasites sucking blood of US working class. Liberals scuttle E Verify system to make sure employers hire Americans, not illegal immigrants. Not example of system working fine. Our system, if enforced by President who swore to up hold law, could work better.

What's needed is reversal of dreadful and arbitrary Plyer v Doe 5-4 decision by Brennan(ultra-activist judge) in 1982 letting illegals educate their kids in US as matter of right ("inchoate" right according to Brennan in typical Warren Court style genius reasoning).

Imprison employers who hire illegals

Turn all arrested illegal felons over to ICE and or appropriate security agencies.

Keep illegals out of hospital emergency rooms and out of any state welfare or health care for poor/working class program.

Currrent system already grants defacto amnesty. It sucks.

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» RE: Big Lie Posted by: 113121
» RE: Big Lie Posted by: Lilykins
» RE: Big Lie Posted by: johnwinthrop
» RE: Big Lie Posted by: colinmeister
» Free Health Care a Big Lie Posted by: johnwinthrop
» Got a Passport, stud? Posted by: johnwinthrop
» "Class"? Posted by: GuitarBill
» Keepin It Flexible Posted by: johnwinthrop
broken indeed
Posted by: RuthS on Mar 30, 2009 1:33 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
A friend of mine is a Swiss woman who married an American. After his death, she decided to emigrate to the US to be nearer her sons, who are both US military officers. It is hard to imagine a less problematic immigrant, yet--after repetitions of the lost paperwork scenario you suffered through as well--she was asked, most hostilely, why she had waited so long to come to the US. Her sons finally realized that they would have to have to pull strings if they were ever going to get their mother a green card. The straightforward "here is the widow of an US citizen, a woman of fine character and adequate means who wishes to be nearer her sons as they serve their country" approach went nowhere.

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» RE: broken indeed Posted by: nadine sellers
» RE: broken indeed Posted by: jallegro
» RE: broken indeed Posted by: sonny0412
Now I'm not as confused.
Posted by: countingdaisies on Mar 30, 2009 2:03 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Your unrelenting support of immigrants, legal or illegal, is finally out of the closet. We were led to believe your articles were unbiased, but now know otherwise.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» I had the opposite reaction Posted by: Gabba_Gabba_Hey
» Love Me Love Me I'm A Liberal Posted by: johnwinthrop
» Hey, babs . . . Posted by: countingdaisies
When It Suits Them
Posted by: Jacksonian on Mar 30, 2009 2:56 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It's always been apparent to me that there is a huge amount of hypocrisy when it comes to immigration issues, especially among conservatives. Repubs are the first to whine about illegals as they shore up their redneck constituency-- and the first to ask for relaxation of enforcement when it comes to their sweatshop factories and corporate farms. Thus this author is completely correct in asserting that the truly "pro-illegals" are the ones wearing the other hat.

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» Not provable Posted by: johnwinthrop
Inefficiency and rip offs.
Posted by: colinmeister on Mar 30, 2009 4:23 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am a Legal Resident of the United States. I did this by the fairly usual way of coming here with an H1 visa and applying for a "Green" card. Everything went well, and I received my card, which was good for 10 years.

I applied for a renewal on the first date I could - 6 months before my card ran out, paid the exhorbitant fees, had the "Biometrics" (Fingerprint and photograph) done, and waited.

My replacement card never arrived, despite being told by the DHS that all I had to do was wait a little longer. I finally filled out the form for a replacement, stating that I had not received my card. I was then told that they had sent my card - without any proof - and that I would have to apply and pay again, giving the reason that I had "Lost my card".

A nice little earner for the government if they do this to lots of legal residents.

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This comment has been removed from the site due to non-compliance with AlterNet's community policies.
» UR Spam Posted by: logansafi
» Have you reported him? Posted by: BlueTigress
» Yes. Posted by: GuitarBill
» RE: Yes. Posted by: Wendiego
» Global Regular Expression Parser. Posted by: GuitarBill
» Sed. The Unix Stream Editor. Posted by: GuitarBill
hardworking 'civil servants' & contractors
Posted by: BlueBerry PickN on Mar 30, 2009 7:39 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
are ALL FIRED UP to DEFEND THE AMERICAN WAY!

& drilling down to nail every single 'deviant' of the system...

SO A SMARMY IMMIGRATION 'LAWYER' & his 'Friend' can have plenty of opportunity to CUT A PROFIT off the misery of Others...

& so the COPS have something to do... & an opportunity to *squeeze* immigrants & their associated friends... to 'do the Right Thing in the New Country'...

Its the "AMERICAN WAY"... washing hands & scratching backs...
is so much different from any other nationality's corruption, because it comes with a BIG ASS FLAG ON IT to assure the dedicated approval & fierce efforts of its loyal minions.

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The only immigrants that should have a free reign -----
Posted by: symcokid on Mar 30, 2009 8:36 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
in this "Land of the Free" should be the Mexicans. Mostly they come back here to live on land that is rightfully their's anyway, like Texas, Arizona, Colorado, New Mexico and California.

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» International Law by Prof Symokid Posted by: johnwinthrop
JH didn't follow the rules
Posted by: laoma on Mar 30, 2009 8:39 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I have gone through this process twice with little or no problems. Once with a woman from the Middle East, the second from China. The first was generally quicker because it was in the 1980s. THe most recent just in the last couple of years. If you dot your 'i' and cross your 't', the process will be painless, though possibly lengthy. If you want this process to run without problems, you HAVE to believe and follow what is written, e.g. don't leave the country until you get the GC, etc. Why complicate matters by moving? These are government workers who could care less. Why jeopardize the process? Why listen to an INS agent picking his nose in the Florida sun, when the documents clearly state, DON'T LEAVE THE COUNTRY. Any exposure to government officials and processes like the IRS, TSA, etc., should have completely prepared anyone to simply follow along to get what you want. Really, it isn't that difficult.

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What I still can't wrap my mind around,
Posted by: popsicle67 on Mar 30, 2009 8:56 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
All of us have immigrant forebears if you go back enough generations. The only thing that's being protected is an imaginary line on a map and I think it's time to abolish them.

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Had you followed the rules you wouldn't be whining.
Posted by: PortTabacco on Mar 30, 2009 9:27 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
So you married an illegal alien?

Wasn't that your first mistake?

You married someone that broke the law.
People marry spouses in prison. So what?

That move doesn't create a great life for the free spouse does it?

Don't blame our Immigration laws for your mistake.

All countries have immigration laws.

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No sympathy here
Posted by: Juven on Mar 30, 2009 9:45 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I married a Mexican woman and we waited in Mexico until her visa and my step kid's visas were ready for us in order to enter the country legally-- It cost me 1000s of dollars and we waited over a year and half, but we did it the LEGAL way--- it is not fair that an illegal can come up here and get any sort of citizenship when there are people who actually wait and pay and follow the laws.

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» RE: No sympathy here Posted by: PortTabacco
Sorry, this comment has been removed from the system.
Shyster
Posted by: Archie1954 on Mar 30, 2009 10:33 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Excuse me but you should be thanking your lawyer for doing his job instead of calling him a shyster. Talk about backhanding your benefactor. If you have a problem it's with the immigration department not your lawyer.

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» Shyster Posted by: leafsong1
congratulations
Posted by: aquariansun on Mar 30, 2009 11:02 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
congrats that you were able to get your wife in legally at all. our situation was a little more complicated (yes, even after marriage, 5 years, and 3 lawyers). so rather than live clandestinely in a society that would never officially accept my husband, we decided to move to his home town in mexico. that was over 2 years ago. at first i had a really hard time adjusting down here, i had to make a major interruption in my career, suffered from culture shock, had to build a new network (besides a house), be far from friends & family, and b/c of all this we question having children...but since my husband did it for so many years i figured i could do it too. so i'm trying to look at it with a silver lining. i am a much stronger and compassionate person now than before i got together with my husband...and if there's anything positive to be said about this tragic, xenophobic situation, i guess my own personal growth and that of our loved ones has got to be it. we don't even have a chance of going back together to the states legally for the next 7.5 yrs. and at that point it'll be a one-time shot direct application to the attorney general's office. so it's a real life changing event, a lifestyle overhaul you might say. i don't regret staying with my husband for a second. yeah, i know there's some chicks out there who pick their husbands like produce, and a lot of people who've managed to de-personalize their entire view of the crisis, but being more principled in terms of love, i decided that my ideals were more important than some temporary discomfort. i am glad i followed my heart (and that my husband did too). hope to share our story in more detail one of these days. good luck to all of those folks who are still struggling for recognition and rights as we type.

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» RE: congratulations Posted by: nadine sellers
Immigration and Economics
Posted by: carrotwax on Mar 30, 2009 11:26 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I'm a new American as of November.

The world changed from the economics of the 70s. Every wealthy nation, because of the deregulation and change of focus, had to be more protectionist. The poor nations were getting poorer, and it was generally known that more desperate people meant more attempts to emigrate.

In the 60s, my father decided to go to Canada. He just got out of the Peace Corps, and went to the Canadian embassy. At that meeting, they got him a job in Vancouver as a journalist via telephone. When he entered Canada by bus he was given a permanent resident slip on a piece of paper.

Now the immigration in Canada is very hard too, with years of waiting and the authorities doing their best to make things hard.

The problem is that if we go back to the way things were, then the world economy would create too many immigrants to cope. If we want to fix immigration, the only long term solution is to make the world in general a more equitable place.

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Fix Mexico
Posted by: freelyb on Mar 30, 2009 11:50 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
How hard would it be to do what is necessary to make Mexico habitable for it's citizens? Politically and economically, I honestly don't know what this would entail. But I do know that the US cannot afford the greater population growth and utilization of resources that our current immigration policy dictates. I am against immigration of any sort. We have to be self-preserving.

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» Repeal NAFTA and Posted by: Bliss Doubt
Illegal immigration unfair to legals? Try other way around.
Posted by: moyshekapoyre on Mar 30, 2009 11:53 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I'm sick of hearing people who have had the luck to get legal paperwork spewing their hate at people who haven't had the luck to get such paperwork.

Here's how I see it: Working (& disabled) people, anywhere in the world, have the right to the same standard of living, period. Those who go through the bourgeois sham process of being stamped legal are the same as scabs, receiving benefits at the expense of the rest of the world's workers.

Perhaps one day soon I'll fit into the category of scab as well. If I do, it will be because I prefer, at some practical level, comfort over international solidarity. But I will never be proud of being a scab. I will always do whatever I can to support my brothers and sisters who said "Fuck the system, we are humans too."

Down with national borders, and down with capitalism!

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» To johnwinthrop et al. Posted by: allUneedislove
» Please, don't feel horrified Posted by: outsideagitator
A legal imigrant married to a legal imigrant
Posted by: Gor on Mar 30, 2009 12:25 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Unlike the author who is married to a legal immigrant. I am a legal immigrant who is married to a legal immigrant. I concur with him that as someone who has encountered this system for the last 13 years of living in the US legally; the system (immigration) is broken to almost beyond repair. My initial encounters during my undergraduate/graduate were generally non-lethal because they involved routine paper work of renewing my F1 (student) visa as well as occasional work and practical training permits which took between 3-6 months to process.

I vividly recall what the Korean American immigration lawyer we hired told us way back in 2002: that the immigration system, just like the rest of society, is not color blind. An Anglo-Saxon immigration applicant is mostly treated with respect and thus fast-tracked than say that of an African American who is getting married to a Tanzanian. We started the process of applying for permanent residency through H1 visa way back in 2002 and to date, we have not been granted residency despite the fact that we have paid all the fees due, delivered all the paperwork that is required and remained in status. We have spent close to 20k in legal fees. Since our country of origin is Kenya, we do not understand why we have had to wait this long because Kenya H1 visa applicants are generally fewer and never exceed their residency quota compared to say India or China for that matter.

In the meantime we have witnessed those who got tired or did not trust the system to treat them fairly and decided to get “married” to an American to hasten the process. Even though the author thinks that he was unfairly treated by INS, it is nothing compared to immigrants who are not married to Americans but have decided to stick to the legal path. I almost want to scream whenever I hear politicians (republicans mostly) say that those so called illegal immigrants should apply legally and go to the end of the queue – a queue that has never moved for us since 2003. It was only this year that I received travel permit after all these years. The permanent residency application is waiting on a stand-still queue.

On the positive side the state of limbo that my family has lived through for a long time has made us to be frugal and save substantially. For instance we decided that we would not make any major purchases like a house until our stay is assured. This recession has found us in a strong financial standing and we are in a position of buying a house and paying it off in less than five years should our residency be granted.
The US immigration system is designed to frustrate and keep out those who are likely to contribute the most to the society and let in those who are likely to depend most on tax payers’ dollars. As time goes, we have begun to question the merit and wisdom of wanting to stay here at all costs. We feel that with our savings and qualifications maybe we can stay in places that appreciate our contributions

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Our story, and some tips
Posted by: peteymon on Mar 30, 2009 12:57 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am in a similar situation as the author of this piece. I married an illegal alien (overstayed visa) and here are some things that I learned and may help others.

Don’t try this on your own. Get a lawyer – one that is well versed in immigration and also criminal law in case you or your spouse get any tickets that a good lawyer could plead down. To quote Burroughs, “It pays to pay the boys off”. Set aside about ten grand in legal fees.

Get and read a book published by Nolo called “Fiance and Marriage Visas” so you will have a clue what your lawyer is talking about. Once you read that book you won’t make mistakes like leaving the country or believing what immigration officers say.

We had two interviews for our I130. The fist was a fraud interview. They were trying to prove our marriage was fraudulent by interviewing us separately. I didn’t have a problem with that except that they wouldn’t look at the evidence that we had brought to prove we were legit. After that interview we didn’t hear anything for a few years. (My wife had a Master Hearing Date that kept on getting postponed into the future so she was temporarily legal.) We had to sue DHS with what is called a Mandamus to try to get our second interview and get us out of legal limbo. That was another $2500 in legal fees, but worth it because immigration granted us the interview to avoid going to court. That interview was not a fraud interview. The officer accepted our evidence and asked for a few other relevant documents that we didn’t bring: my wife’s divorce certificate with her ex-husband, and her new passport which was being processed at the Chinese embassy (In hindsight, it was a mistake to file for a new passport because they took the old, expired one). Thankfully, we were able to get those documents by the allotted deadline. We passed that interview and got the I130 approved.

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Thanks for sharing
Posted by: wanealy on Mar 30, 2009 2:25 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As someone who has had painful experience with this system, I can vouch that this story is practically a "feel good" story in comparison to the horrors so many immigrants who are trying to go through the legal system face. As awful and frustrating as Mr Holland's experience is, he is actually one of the lucky ones.

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you break the law, what do you expect?
Posted by: zooeyhall on Mar 30, 2009 5:09 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There are plenty of generous and LAWFUL ways to enter this country.

If you climb a fence in the middle of the night, don't expect any sympathy however.

If you come here legally and took your place in the line, I will be the first to welcome you.

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» saludos! Posted by: Juven
Some thoughts from experience (pt. 1)
Posted by: Nozka on Mar 30, 2009 5:10 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This article brings up some good points, but I think it really oversimplifies the whole situation and does not put this issue into a proper perspective. Like a lot of ranting that goes on on Alternet, this article really misses the big picture.
I have also gone through the immigration process with a formerly illegal (overstay visa) spouse and know the system first-hand. Without the aid of any lawyers (but using NOLO as others have suggested) my wife went from illegal alien to US citizen in just over four years. Yes, I have speculated that our being white and well educated helped to make the process easier, but this is just pure speculation and nothing more. In fact, our application was processed according to the timetables which are posted by the DHS (INS). Yes, we did go through some hassles, and our case wasn't without challenges - we had to get sponsored for example because I was a student at the time of our marriage - but I do believe that there are many like us who get though this successfully, even without paying the f-ing lawyers.
Yet, instead of merely chalking it up to my ethnicity and crying "foul," I think there are certain other factors which contributed to our success. First, we live in a district that is relatively small and, as others have noted, we did not move (out of the district) at least, during the processing period. If you look on the immigration website you can see very clearly how long the average processing times are for various forms and documents and how this can very from district to district. The author was from New York and moved to Florida, probably the two areas with the highest number of applicants. These places always have longer processing times.
Second, We did everything by the book. Although this wasn't easy, and I know it must be a nightmare for non-native speakers of English, the author, like myself, is a native speaker of English with a good command of the language. From my experience and perspective the system does work because I have seen it work.
So the question then is, did we get lucky, or did the author get unlucky? I think it's probably both. We really need to remember that we are dealing with a HUGE bureaucracy here, and it is the nature of bureaucracies to be complex, ineffective, and cumbersome. Go back and read your Kafka. Yes, of course when you get lost or stuck in the system you're going to experience the proverbial nightmare, and this is no real solace to anyone who has or currently is navigating the corridors; however, no one as yet has really found a way around this. The "little" district where my wife was sworn in as a new citizen holds the ceremony for 900 people a month, and the citizenship application is only one of many, many forms.

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Some thoughts from experience (pt. 2)
Posted by: Nozka on Mar 30, 2009 5:11 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Now think about it another way: should this process really be easy? Should you just waltz in with your marriage certificate and pick up a new passport? I don't know anyone who is more vociferous about immigration rights than myself, but I still think the answer to this question in "no!" The system is designed to be hard in order to discourage the scammers and the freeloaders. Does this fully work? Again, I know unequivocally that it doesn't all the time, but it is also true that marriage - sham or otherwise - is the quickest and easiest path to citizenship. The system, at least in theory, is put in place to protect us.
Finally, the author points out, as if it were really a big surprise, that once he got some lawyers involved, the cogs of the machine suddenly started to move. So what? Is that not the case in every single area of government in every country on earth? Why does he seem to suggest that this is such a revelation? It is nothing of the sort.
Is this system flawed? Of course. Does it grind people into a pulp and spit them into the ether? Absolutely. Could we reform it? You bet. But its not the worst system in the world, not the worst bureaucracy. Try living in a place where you need permission to travel from one area to the next, or a visa just to leave the country. I have. This system is a playdate at Chuck E Cheese compared to some places.
I guess what I'm bothered by here is the lack of balance in this kind article, which is why I appreciate the opportunity for a rebuttal. What is really wrong is the fact that we need such a system for immigration in the first place. I have always understood intuitively that, as long as we have an imbalance of wealth and opportunity in the world, there will be emigration and immigration. This is the root of the "problem" that no one ever addresses. Fixing the bureaucratic nightmare of the INS is useless; we need to provide opportunity for others so that there is no need for large-scale immigration in the first place.

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I'm real tired of this........
Posted by: gellero1 on Mar 30, 2009 5:45 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
How about the unemployed who need jobs taken by illegals??

What about urban congestion, energy, tax resources.

The Boo Hoo Lobby is out of touch with the working man.

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» RE: I'm real tired of this........ Posted by: Bliss Doubt
Josh is a liar
Posted by: rickiey on Mar 30, 2009 8:20 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
He's claiming he can find someone who thinks the immigration system is working, and I'm calling bullshit.

I can't find anyone on the right or the left that thinks that any part of our immigration system works correctly.

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» RE: Josh is a liar Posted by: Joshua Holland
Little Green Men
Posted by: Nicks on Mar 30, 2009 9:13 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Hi Everyone,

I really dont appreciated being called an "Alien" though, even now as a US resident. I was born in Australia, not Mars. I am a Human being, not Martian. I wish this word to reference foreigners was not used as it is quite degrading. In Australia, the word foreigner is used. Alien is reserved for the little green men that abduct you in the night and stick probes in your anus.

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» Are You Alienated, James Dean? Posted by: johnwinthrop
» RE: Little Green Men nonsense Posted by: Old Skeptic
advice for Bin Laden
Posted by: richholland on Mar 31, 2009 9:01 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
step 1 no more beard, a big mustache
step 2 learn Spanish

enter USA as an illegal immigrant.

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» RU scared of the boogey man? Posted by: logansafi
The descendants of European squatters now obsessed with the rule of law
Posted by: 876 on Mar 31, 2009 11:45 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I love how a nation of the descendants of genocidal European squatters who imposed themselves here by some of the most atrocious and criminal means in human history are now crazed and utterly obsessed with legality. Why shouldn’t Mexicans attempt to use whatever means necessary to reclaim their own territories? These Europeans should thank god every day that the Mexicans will not attempt to do so by the same means that were employed against them. All over the globe European people have imposed themselves on other people’s homelands; you can barely find a corner of the world that is free of their presence. Not even simply imposed themselves as laborers or in service of any sort but in the most offensive ways making slaves and paupers of the natives yet they continue to gripe and whine endlessly about immigrants in the slums of Europe or on the stolen homelands of these so called Americans. As if they should have free reign to make an utter parasitic nuisance of themselves anywhere and everywhere all while regarding others as some encroachment on their precious rights. This is on top of the vicious economic and military slavery and atrocities they inflict on the rest of humanity, profiting from the blood of people all over the world like parasites, living off the very “third world” inhabitants they ridicule and despise. I hope to god I live to see the day Mexicans rule this land and teach you sons and daughters of slave mongers a thing or two about nuisances.

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» Well said! Posted by: logansafi
» RE: Well said! Posted by: Juven
» pfft! Posted by: Juven
i also married an illegal alien (from south africa)
Posted by: veggiegrrrl on Mar 31, 2009 11:48 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
i also married an illegal alien in 1997 who overstayed his tourist visa and was working as a dot-com web geek engineer under the table for $40k per year salary. the day after we got married, he got his temporary green card, work permit, social security card. they raised his salary to 80k. the green card/work permit to permanent resident to citizen process was much longer than our lawyer expected. years longer. he's a citizen now. he's from south africa, a native english speaker, educated. but it still took 7 years for him to become a citizen.

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One Thing That Seems To Be Clear
Posted by: desidid on Mar 31, 2009 1:09 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The husband in the above story wasn't about to rock the boat and support a union movement that included native workers, as it would have been counterproductive to his situation before his marriage. He had no incentive and in fact he had more incentive to undercut the native worker's salary than to attempt to ask for it himself. However he managed to stay long enough to find a partner and reap the benefits of citizenship by doubling his salary. And these stories will continue to remind many of us that native workers and illegals may have similar goals. However, why shouldn't there be some punishment for those who hire and work outside the system? Native workers are going to the One Stop for work while employers and illegal immigrants are going to day labor sites (a practice that appears discriminatory in that it serves one community). How many languages are spoken at day labor sites? Do they serve Asian, African, European, or Arabic illegal immigrants? When these federal projects start let's see how many of the jobs are filled by sub-contractors who hire illegal immigrants rather than the hundreds of thousands of natives who are scrambling for jobs. I see my friends who are hard-working struggling to make it day to day. I see those who have union jobs fearful that the next job cuts will be their's. But worst of all I see my co-workers being reminded in every meeting that we are fortunate just to be employed. That translates into do what you're told and be happy to do it. How is that any different from being here illegally?

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Nation of immigrants? Not any more
Posted by: Old Skeptic on Mar 31, 2009 2:56 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The USA is not a nation of immigrants. All of us are the descendants of immigrants, even the "native" Americans, who are the descendants of the first wave of immigrants who crossed the then-existent land bridge from Asia into the Americas. Their descendants meandered down from there to the very tip of South America and beyond, but they didn't "evolve" here; they came here as immigrants.

Originally there were no nations, other than whatever territory a particular tribe might control. The nations that now exist all have laws governing immigration. If you want strict laws against illegal immigration, check out Mexico's! An illegal alien in Mexico can get up to 2 years in prison just for violating their border. So the idea that there exists a group of people with a de facto right to cross our border if they wish is totally bogus! Just the self-serving excuses of people who don't respect the laws and national sovereignty of other nations.

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» Nation of legalistic clowns Posted by: logansafi
Asinine...
Posted by: doctorsquared on Mar 31, 2009 8:34 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
At least, one would think that a federal agency that transcends and supervenes state boundaries could keep track of a file and not send it on to the wrong state...

But seriously...the immigration system should be streamlined at the very least for people we need in the US, like engineers, scientists, primary care physicians (you know, the kinds of jobs that we used to be the best or at least top notch at, but which now Americans choose less often because they are hard or don't pay as well as financial skullduggery).

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» RE: Asinine...maybe Posted by: Old Skeptic
» Not so much the IT sector Posted by: doctorsquared
Don't assume anything
Posted by: dezoars on Apr 1, 2009 3:57 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Yes, our immigration bureaucracy is a mess and needs streamlining, but as with any complex legal process you should have hired an immigration lawyer, who would have told you two things:

1) It's not enough to ask a single immigration official about a particular issue. The more you ask, the more different answers you may get. The more answers, the more complicated the problem, and the more likely it is that you are in a gray area that's going to spell trouble down the line, and

2) Don't do anything to jeopardize your immigration status unless you have it in writing that it's going to be OK.

As an immigrant who became a citizen in 2005, I quickly realized that this labyrinthine, Kafkaesque system was not to be tested. I never jay-walked, paid late on a fine or taxes, or joined any organization that might be considered politically iffy (since these were the Bush years). Did you wife really need to take that trip into international waters?

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A RETIRED AMERICAN CITIZEN
Posted by: foxxx on Apr 1, 2009 7:55 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
WHEN YOU AS AN AMERICAN MARRY SOMEONE OUTSIDE OF THE COUNTRY THAT IS'NT AMERICAN. ONCE YOUR MARRIED YOU BOTH SHOULD BE ALLOWED AS A AMERICAN FAMILY, WITHOUT ANY HASSLE FROM IMMIGRATION WHAT-EVER STOPS AT THE MARRIAGE LICENSE. FROM THAT POINT FORWARD THAT SHOULD'NT COUNT, SINCE YOUR FULL BLOODED AMERICAN, UNLESS YOUR TRYING TO BRING OTHERS TO OUR COUNTRY. HAVE A NICE DAY. MIKE

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Get a grip man!!!!!!!
Posted by: knight on Apr 1, 2009 10:05 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
So what is the writers point? that because of his ordeal we should stop enforcing all our inmigration laws? each case is different,and I imagine that no idustrial nation has the millions of people waning to come to it,one way or the other,but I must also point out that no nation is as forgiving as we are,when it comes to illegal inmigration,try that in Mexico,Canada or some parts of Europe,nah,we here leave them pretty much alone,that s how we have 13 mil and counting of illegal people,we let them work,have babies,impregnate our thrashy and ghetto women,and when they commit a crime we keep them comfortably in jail,so fix the system? system ain t broke,but if you are broke,system ain t gonna work for you,I wish it was less,but I imagine every nation on earth has a fee to become a legal resident,so follow the law,and work make the system work for you.

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why?
Posted by: sonny0412 on Apr 2, 2009 7:51 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
why do we have to look at mexicans as bad or squatters in this country....look at the europeans...the only native person to this country are the american indians..
we have given the mexican the bad press or negative comments why?these are good hard working people,they have families ,they are a nation of people who strive for the american dream..meeting the basic needs..car ,home and food..nothing more...this country bought california from the mexican people and now we are trying really hard to keep them out..why? if we are trying to do it right then,we need to not allow ,,,the black,or white or any race thats not native here..
and so far the american indian and the mexican are the only true natives here in america.

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Video about "the great irony of the immigration debate"
Posted by: WillC on Apr 6, 2009 11:15 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Thanks Joshua for this great article!

This satirical video I created with some friends tries to get at this irony: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-30BZtpvaTY

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