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The Only Way to Avoid Wasting Many Billions More: Take Over the Banks

By Joseph Stiglitz, The Nation. Posted March 7, 2009.


American banks have polluted the economy; it's a matter of equity and efficiency that they now be forced to clean it up.

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The news that even Alan Greenspan and Senator Chris Dodd suggest that bank nationalization may be necessary shows how desperate the situation has become. It has been obvious for some time that a government takeover of our banking system -- perhaps along the lines of what Norway and Sweden did in the '90s -- is the only solution. It should be done, and done quickly, before even more bailout money is wasted.

The problem with America's banks is not just one of liquidity. Years of reckless behavior, including bad lending and gambling with derivatives, have left them, in effect, bankrupt. If our government were playing by the rules -- which require shutting down banks with inadequate capital -- many, if not most, banks would go out of business. But because faulty accounting practices don't force banks to mark down all their assets to current market prices, they may nominally meet capital requirements -- at least for a while.

No one knows for sure how big the hole is; some estimates put the number at $2 trillion or $3 trillion, or more. So the question is, Who is going to bear the losses? Wall Street would like nothing better than a steady drip of taxpayer money. But the experience in other countries suggests that when financial markets run the show, the costs can be enormous. Countries like Argentina, Chile and Indonesia spent 40 percent or more of their GDP to bail out their banks. For the United States, the worry is that the $700 billion appropriated for the bank bailout may turn out to be just a small down payment.

The cost to the government is especially important, given the legacy of debt from the Bush administration, which saw the national debt soar from $5.7 trillion to more than $10 trillion. Unless care is taken, government spending on the bailout will crowd out other vital government programs, from Social Security to future investments in technology.

There is a basic principle in environmental economics called "the polluter pays": polluters must pay for the cost of cleaning up their pollution. American banks have polluted the global economy with toxic waste; it is a matter of equity and efficiency that they must be forced, now or later, to pay the price of cleaning it up. As long as the banking sector feels that it will be bailed out of disasters -- even ones it created -- we will continue to have a moral hazard. Only by making sure that the sector pays the costs of its actions will efficiency be restored.

The full costs of those mistakes include not just the $700 billion bailout but the almost $3 trillion shortfall between the economy's potential output and its actual output resulting from the crisis. Since we are not forcing banks to pay these full costs imposed on society, we should hear no complaints from them about paying for the much smaller direct costs of the bailout.

The politicians responsible for the bailout keep saying, "We had no choice. We had a gun pointed at our heads. Without the bailout, things would have been even worse." This may or may not be true, but in any case the argument misses a critical distinction between saving the banks and saving the bankers and shareholders. We could have saved the banks but let the bankers and shareholders go. The more we leave in the pockets of the shareholders and the bankers, the more that has to come out of the taxpayers' pockets.

Principles and Goals

There are a few basic principles that should guide our bank bailout. The plan needs to be transparent, cost the taxpayer as little as possible and focus on getting the banks to start lending again to sectors that create jobs. It goes without saying that any solution should make it less likely, not more likely, that we will have problems in the future.

By these standards, the TARP bailout has so far been a dismal failure. Unbelievably expensive, it has failed to rekindle lending. Former Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson gave the banks a big handout; what taxpayers got in return was worth less than two-thirds of what we gave the big banks -- and the value of what we got has dropped precipitously since.

Since TARP facilitated the consolidation of banks, the problem of "too big to fail" has become worse, and therefore the excessive risk-taking that it engenders has grown worse. The banks carried on paying out dividends and bonuses and didn't even pretend to resume lending. "Make more loans?" John Hope III, chair of Whitney National Bank in New Orleans, said to a room full of Wall Street analysts in November. The taxpayers put out $350 billion and didn't even get the right to find out what the money was being spent on, let alone have a say in what the banks did with it.

TARP's failure comes as no surprise: incentives matter. Bankers won't restart lending unless they have a reason to do so or are forced. Receiving billions of dollars in bonus pay for racking up record losses is a peculiar "incentive" structure. Bankers have been accused of unbounded greed using hard-earned taxpayer dollars for bonuses and dividends, but economists more calmly observe: they were simply responding rationally to the incentives and constraints they faced.

Even if the banks had not poured out the money in bonuses as we were pouring it in, they might not have restarted lending; they might have just hoarded it. Recapitalization enables them to lend. But there is a difference between the ability to lend and the willingness to lend. With the economy plunging into deep recession, the risks of lending are enormous. TARP did nothing to require or create incentives for new lending, focusing instead on cleaning up past mistakes. We need to be forward-looking, reducing the risk of new lending. Just think of what new lending $700 billion could have financed. Leveraged on a modest ten-to-one basis, it could have supported $7 trillion of new lending -- more than enough to meet business's requirements.

Flawed Attempts to Restart Lending

Policy-makers have been flailing around, trying to figure out how to get lending restarted. It is not hard to do -- if the government bears all or most of the risk. The Federal Reserve is, in effect, making major loans to America's corporate giants, giving them a big advantage over traditional job creators, America's small- and medium-size enterprises. We have no idea if the Fed is doing a good job of assessing risk and whether interest rates commensurate with the risks are being charged. Given the Fed's recent record, there is no reason for confidence. But there is a consensus that whatever the Fed is doing, it is not enough.

The Obama administration has floated a number of ideas, from buying the bad assets and putting them into a "bad bank," leaving it to the government to dispose of them; to providing insurance to the banks; to assisting private investors (like hedge funds) to buy the bad assets, presumably by lending to investors on favorable terms. Because of the lack of details, the market greeted the Obama administration's announcement of its so-called plan with dismay. As this article goes to press, we can only guess that the administration's plan will be an amalgam of several of these ideas. The devil is in the details, and without the details we can't be sure how things will turn out.

An early idea floated by Paulson was for the government to buy the bad assets from the banks. Naturally, Wall Street was delighted with this idea. Who wouldn't want to offload their junk to the government at inflated prices? The banks could get rid of some of these bad assets now, but not at prices they would like. Then there are other assets that the private sector wouldn't touch with a ten-foot pole. Some of them are liabilities that can explode, eating up government funds like Pac-Man. On September 15 AIG said it was short $20 billion. The next day, its losses had grown to some $85 billion. A little later, when no one was looking, there was a further dole, bringing the total to $150 billion. Then on March 1, the government agreed to another $30 billion in taxpayer money for AIG -- the fourth intervention in less than six months.

Paulson's original proposal was thoroughly discredited, as the difficulties of pricing and buying thousands of assets became apparent. More recently a variant of this proposal, which involves government buying garbage in bulk, was broached. But the major difficulty with determining prices of toxic assets, whether singly or in bulk, remains: pay too much and the government will suffer huge losses; pay too little and the hole in the banks' balance sheets will still seem enormous, requiring another bailout to recapitalize the banks.

Most variants of the "cash for trash" proposal are based on putting the bad assets into a bad bank (advocates of the plan prefer the gentler term "aggregator bank"). But the banks holding only good assets would likely be short of cash, even after taxpayers had vastly overpaid for the trash. The hope is that the banks would then find private funds to further the recapitalization, though one suspects that the sovereign wealth funds, to whom many turned a little while ago, would be less interested, having been so badly burned before.

I believe that the bad bank, without nationalization, is a bad idea. We should reject any plan that involves "cash for trash." It is another example of the voodoo economics that has marked the financial sector -- the kind of alchemy that allowed the banks to slice and dice F-rated subprime mortgages into supposedly A-rated securities. Somehow, it is believed that moving the bad assets around into an aggregator bank will create value. But I suspect that Wall Street is enthusiastic about the plan not because bankers believe that government has a comparative advantage in garbage disposal but because they hope for a nontransparent bonanza from the Treasury in the form of high prices for their junk.

If the government takes over banks that don't meet the minimum capital requirements, placing them in federal conservatorship, then these pricing problems are no longer important. Under this scenario, pricing is just an accounting entry between two pockets of the government. Whether the government finds it useful to gather all the bad assets into a bad bank is a matter of management: Norway chose not to; Sweden chose to. But Sweden wasn't foolish enough to try to buy bad assets from private banks, as many in America are advocating. It was only under government ownership of the entire bank that the bad bank was created. Norway's experience was perhaps somewhat better, but the circumstances were different. Given the complexity and scale of the mess Wall Street has gotten us into, I suspect we will want to gather the problems together, net out the derivative positions (something that will be much easier to do under conservatorship and a significant achievement in its own right, with major benefits in risk reduction) and eventually restructure and dispose of the assets.

More recently, another idea has been put forward: the government would insure bank losses. By removing the risk of loss, the value of these toxic assets automatically increases, improving the banks' balance sheets. Bankers love this idea. The government can give them a big insurance policy at a small premium. Politicians love this idea too: there is at least a chance they will be out of Washington before the bills come due.

But that's precisely the problem with this approach: we won't know for years what it would do to the government's balance sheet. Six months ago, what the banks told us about their losses going forward was totally off the mark. AIG had to revise its losses by tens of billions of dollars within days. Real estate prices might fall only another 5 percent, or they could fall another 25 percent. With the insurance proposal, neither the government nor the banks have to admit the size of the hole in the banks' balance sheets. It's another example of those nontransparent transactions that got Wall Street into trouble.

Even worse, the insurance proposal exacerbates incentive distortions -- it moves us from a zero-sum world into a negative-sum world, where increased taxpayer losses are greater than Wall Street's gains. The insurance proposal may even inhibit banks from restructuring mortgages, worsening the problem that gave rise to the crisis in the first place. If they restructure the mortgage, they have to book a loss. If they keep the mortgage and things get worse (the likely scenario), the taxpayer picks up most of the downside risk; but if things get better and prices improve, the banks keep the gains.

Still worse are proposals to try to enlist the private sector to buy the trash. Right now, the prices the private sector is willing to pay are so low that the banks aren't interested -- it would make apparent the size of the hole in banks' balance sheets. But if the government insures private-sector investors -- and even makes loans at favorable terms -- they'll be willing to pay a higher price. With enough insurance and favorable enough loan terms, presto! We can make our banks solvent.

But there is a sleight-of-hand here: go back to the zero-sum principle. The private sector is not going to provide money for nothing. It expects a return for providing capital and bearing risk. But its cost of capital is far higher than that of government. The losses are real, and the private sector won't bear them without full compensation. This means that the amount the government is likely to have to pay in the end is all the greater.

This proposal, like so many others emanating from the banking community, is based partially on the hope that if banks make things sufficiently complex and nontransparent, no one will notice the gift to the banking sector until it is too late. It appears as if they are at last getting the high market prices that they hoped they would get all along. But it would be a misnomer to call these market prices, since the government has taken away the downside risk. This proposal has, of course, the further advantage of drumming up support from the hedge funders, who so far have not received any of the TARP bonanza.

There is an underlying problem facing all these proposals: the hole in the banks' balance sheets is bigger than the $700 billion Congress has approved -- and much of what has been spent so far has been wasted. So the financial wizards are turning to tried and true gimmicks -- the same ones that got us into the mess. One strategy is to hide the costs in nontransparent accounting (easier under the insurance proposal). The other combines this trickery with the magic of leveraging and pretends that leveraging carries no risk. The government sets up a "special investment vehicle" using, say, $100 billion of TARP as the "equity." It then borrows another $900 billion from the Fed -- which in rapid succession has been tripling and quadrupling its balance sheet. Of course, in doing so the Fed is risking taxpayers' money -- but without having to ask permission of Congress. At best, this is a deliberate circumvention of democratic processes.

Is There an Alternative?

Firms often get into trouble -- accumulating more debt than they can repay. There is a time-honored way of resolving the problem, called "financial reorganization," or bankruptcy. Bankruptcy scares many people, but it shouldn't. All that happens is that the financial claims on the firm get restructured. When the firm is in very bad trouble, the shareholders get wiped out, and the bondholders become the new shareholders. When things are less serious, some of the debt is converted into equity. In any case, without the burden of monthly debt payments, the firm can return to profitability. America is lucky in having a particularly effective way of giving firms a fresh start -- Chapter 11 of our bankruptcy code, which has been used repeatedly, for example, by the airlines. Airplanes keep flying; jobs and assets are preserved. Under new management, and without the burden of debt, the airline can go on making a contribution to our society.

Banks differ in only one respect. The failure of a bank results in particular hardship to depositors and can lead to broader problems in the economy. These are among the reasons that the government has provided deposit insurance. But this means that when banks fail, the government comes in to pick up the pieces -- and this is different from when the local pizza parlor fails. Worse still, long experience has taught us that when banks are at risk of failure, their managers engage in behaviors that risk losing even more taxpayer money. They may, for instance, undertake big bets: if they win, they keep the proceeds; if they lose, so what? -- they would have died anyway. That's why we have laws that say when a bank's capital is low, it should be shut down. We don't wait for the till to be empty. Because the government is on the hook for so much money, it has to take an active role in managing the restructuring; even in the case of airline bankruptcy, courts typically appoint someone to oversee the restructuring to make sure that the claimants' interests are served.

Usually, the process is done smoothly. The government finds a healthy bank to take over the failed bank. To get the healthy bank to do this, it often has to "fill in the hole," making up for the difference between the value of what the bank owes depositors and the value of the bank's assets. It's no different from an ordinary takeover or merger, except the government facilitates the process. Typically, in the process, shareholders get wiped out, and often the government and/or private investors may put in additional money.

Occasionally, the government can't find a healthy bank to take over the failed bank. Then it has to take over the failed bank itself. Usually, it restructures the bank, shutting down many of the branches and lending departments with particularly bad track records. Then it sells the bank. We can call this "temporary nationalization" if we want. But whatever we call it, it's no big deal. Not surprisingly, the banks are trying to scare us into believing that it would be the end of the world as we know it. Of course, it can be done badly (Lehman Brothers, for example). But there are far more examples of it being done well.

The current situation is only slightly different. There are few healthy banks to take over the very many unhealthy banks, and the banks are in such a mess -- and the economy is in such a downturn -- that we don't really know how much money would be needed. We don't know if claims by depositors are greater than the value of assets, and if so, by how much. The banks may claim, If we hold the assets long enough, and if the real estate market recovers, and if our recession isn't too deep or long, then we can meet all our obligations. We are "solvent." We just can't get the cash we need.

Those are big ifs. That's why governments typically make judgments based on market values. Right now, the suspicion is that the banks don't meet their capital requirements with current market values, let alone the market values in the future, as real estate prices continue to fall and the downturn gets worse. (If banks don't have enough capital, we would give them short notice: either come up with additional capital, or you can't continue to operate as you are. We either find someone to take you over, or we run you, restructure and sell.)

The banks obviously don't want the government to play by the rules. They want to delay the day of reckoning. They want what is called forbearance. They say, Allow us a little slack now, because we are fundamentally sound. Of course they would say that. Of course banks claim that market prices underestimate true values. We learned the hard way in the S&L crisis, however, that delay is very costly. We are on track to learn that lesson again.

The Obama administration seems to be proposing a way out of this muddle: we will "stress test." We will see how well you fare. If you pass the test, we will help you get out of your temporary difficulties. Stress testing involves using mathematical models to see what happens under various scenarios. The banks were supposed to have been stress testing themselves on an on-going basis. Their models said everything was fine and dandy.

We know those models failed. What we don't know is whether the models the administration will use will be any better. Will they use the old, failed models? We have been told that it will take time to do the stress test, and while we wait, will we pour more money into failing institutions, with good money chasing bad, ever widening our national debt. We know, too, that the worst-case scenarios that will be used in the stress test are nowhere near the worst-case scenarios that some economists are depicting -- implying that even banks that pass the stress test may need more funding down the line.

Gradually America is realizing that we must do something -- now. We already have a framework for dealing with banks whose capital is inadequate. We should use it, and quickly, with perhaps some modifications to take care of the unusual nature of today's problems. There are several ways we can proceed. One innovative proposal (variants of which have been floated by Willem Buiter at the London School of Economics and by George Soros) entails the creation of a Good Bank. Rather than dump the bad assets on the government, we would strip out the good assets -- those that can be easily priced. If the value of claims by depositors and other claims that we decide need to be protected is less than the value of the assets, then the government would write a check to the Old Bank (we could call it the Bad Bank). If the reverse is true, then the government would have a senior claim on the Old Bank. In normal times, it would be easy to recapitalize the Good Bank privately. These are not normal times, so the government might have to run the bank for a while.

Meanwhile, the Old Bank would be left with the task of disposing of its toxic assets as best it can. Because the Old Bank's capital is inadequate, it couldn't take deposits, unless it found enough capital privately to recapitalize itself. How much shareholders and bondholders got would depend on how well management did in disposing of these assets -- and how well they did in ensuring that management didn't overpay itself.

The Good Bank proposal has the advantage of avoiding the N-word: nationalization. Some believe a more polite term, "conservatorship" as it was called in the case of Fannie Mae, may be more palatable. It should be clear, though, that whatever it is called, the Good Bank proposal entails little more than playing by longstanding rules, a variant of standard practices to deal with firms whose liabilities exceed their assets.

Those who say the government cannot be trusted to allocate capital efficiently sound unconvincing these days. After all, it's not as though the private sector did a very good job. No peacetime government has wasted resources on the scale of America's private financial system. Wall Street's incentives structures were designed to encourage shortsighted and excessively risky behavior. The bankers were supposed to understand risk, but they did not understand the most elementary principles of information asymmetry, risk correlation and fat-tailed distributions. Most of them, while they may have been ethically challenged, were really guided in their behavior by the perverse incentives they championed. The result was that they did not even serve their shareholders well; from 2004 to 2008, net profits of many of the major banks were negative.

There is every reason to believe that a temporarily nationalized bank will behave much better -- even if most of the employees are still the same -- simply because we will have changed the perverse incentives. Besides, a government-run bank might spend some time and money teaching its employees about risk management, good lending practices, social responsibility and ethics. The experience elsewhere, including in the Scandinavian countries, shows that the whole process can be done well -- and when the economy is eventually restored to prosperity, the profitable banks can be returned to the private sector. What is required is not rocket science. Banks simply need to get back to what they were supposed to do: lending money, on a prudent basis, to businesses and households, based not just on collateral but on a good assessment of the use to which borrowers will put the money and their ability to repay it.

Meanwhile, there needs to be an orderly plan for disposing of the old bad assets. There is no magic in moving them around from one owner to another. In some countries, government agencies (often hiring private subcontractors) have done a good job of selling off the assets. Other countries (including some hit in the East Asia crisis a decade ago) have had an unfortunate experience, bringing in investment banks and hedge funds to dispose of their assets. These institutions simply held them for the short time it took the economy to recover and made a huge capital gain at the expense of the country's taxpayers. To add insult to injury, some even took advantage of tax havens to avoid paying taxes on those huge profits. These experiences suggest caution in turning to hedge funds and other investment firms.

Every downturn comes to an end. Eventually we will be able to sell the restructured banks at a good price -- though, one hopes, not one based on the irrational exuberant expectation of another financial bubble. The notion that we will make a profit from the bailouts -- which the financial sector tried to convince us were "investments" -- seems to have dropped from public discourse. But at least we can use the proceeds of the eventual sale of the restructured banks to pay down the huge deficit that this financial debacle will have brought onto our nation.


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See more stories tagged with: banks, chris dodd, nationalization, geithner, restructuring

Joseph E. Stiglitz is University Professor at Columbia University. He received the Nobel Prize in Economics in 2001 for research on the economics of information. Most recently, he is the co-author, with Linda Bilmes, of The Three Trillion Dollar War: The True Costs of the Iraq Conflict.

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Damn Right ! ... It's Past Time to Nationalize Wall Street Banks !
Posted by: mmckinl on Mar 7, 2009 12:27 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Let the owners of these toxic assets get rid of them themselves! Why should tax payers be hit up for "investment" decisions they never would have profited from.

Stiglitz brings up another problem, malfeasance and fraud. Banks are in trouble know they are in trouble so why not make bigger bets because it is tax payer money anyway ...

Here are some sobering articles from Naked Capitalism ...

Bank Rescue Programs: Setting the Stage for More Looting?

Quelle Surprise! Who Gained From AIG Rescues? Goldman (and Deutsche) Tops the List (and Willer Buiter is REALLY Angry!)

Guess what folks ... we are still getting screwed, it hasn't stopped and it won't stop until we throw the bums out of these banks. It's Time, Past Time, To Nationalize Insolvent Banks

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» Thanks Posted by: TimS
Dumb Azz American Government!
Posted by: nobuko on Mar 7, 2009 3:21 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
With the Stock Prices being as low as it is, what sense does it make for our dumb azz government, to WASTE OUR MONEY, bailing out the Financial Institutions for MORE than what they are worth! This STUPIDITY DRIVES ME ABSOLUTELY CRAZY!

They don't want to SCARE the Stockholders, well, the stockholders are already scared, heck, they have LOST a good portion of their investments, and they are worried that the Federal Government will take over; give me a break, they are PRAYING the Government will take over to keep what little they have left, if not, they will certainly loose it all!

What's even worse, the spin misters, are trying to spin this devastation, as if its President Obama's fault, relating it to his "tone & words," give me a freaking break, President Obama did not assist Maddof, AIG, Lemand Bros, or any of those Cockroaches, to lie and steal from the Investors who place their TRUST in them! Yet, they are trying to make him responsible for the market TANKING, when its the DECEIT, and the Under the Table dealings, SPECULATIONS, that's still SURFACING, whose causing MORE damge to Wall Street, and the Confidence of the Stock Holders, NOT PRES. OBAMA! AIG, NEEDING ANOTHER 30 BILLION, AND THAT'S PRES. OBAMA'S FAULT?????

All I can do is PRAY that the American People and the World have learned their lesson, after Hoover taught us over 50 years ago! What is with this BLIND-SIGHTEDNESS, when this happen some time ago, that Americans REFUSES to pay attention to HISTORY? I JUST DON'T GET IT!

One thing I am assured of, if criminal charges are not brought against these Cockroaches, Restitutions made, and jail time served, you can be ASSURED, that this era will be upon us, better yet, our grandchildren once again, if these bastards get away with this Grand Thief of America, and the World!

This confirms, since Roosevelt and his Justice Dept. did not do anything to bring Hoover and his Cronies to justice, its WHY we are RELIVING History, all over again!

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More NAKED FASCIST PROPAGANDA
Posted by: Mister_PsyOps on Mar 7, 2009 3:45 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What this red herring story doesn't mention is that "capitalism" is dead as a coffin nail. The entire banking system is a fraud where the "too big to fail" money center banks looting the system ($9.5 TRILLIONS so far) are the same banks that own the private Ponzi trap "Federal Reserve" Corp (not federal, no reserves).

Extortion banking along with a Washington-MSM circus is the old bloody fox in the American henhouse. In fact, America is now just an expendable leftover for the ruling class that has produced this latest catastrophe that is no way "disaster capitalism" but disaster Fascism.

In other words, the system is already a monopoly Fascist sting where a parasite farce insures the most greedy, venal corporate criminals on the planet are guaranteed to be the richest and most powerful. Under that reality "nationalization" is just Orwellian code for more concentration of power under organized corporate crime tyranny.

This is so obvious and so naked, only the brainwashed gullible could be fooled.

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» Bit extreme, eh yellow? Posted by: edgar1
» RE: Bit extreme, eh yellow? Posted by: yellow
» RE: Bit extreme, eh yellow? Posted by: Man_vs_Kleptocracy
» GasTurd TROLL BUSTED (Again) Posted by: PointMan
Caesar77
Posted by: Caesar77 on Mar 7, 2009 4:45 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Joe McCarthy was going after the wrong people in the 1950's. He should have been going after the Capitalists in this country. They sure as hell have brought us to our collective knees.
Going after the Commies was a great diversionary tactic, we took out eyes of the ball, and where fooled big time.
Maybe he was working for the banks.

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» Joe M had it partly right. Posted by: edgar1
sgtmajor
Posted by: seazen on Mar 7, 2009 4:56 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Probably the biggest issue facing us today is the difficulty of even locating intelligent and articulate examination of the extraodrdinary conditions we are now in. Instead, we are bombarded with assertions, complaints, accusations, lies, distortions, etc. offered to simply satisfy petty egos, cable ratings, or ideological competitions. I'd love to hear Rush Limbaugh, or Boehner, or Hannity discuss the finer points of this article.

In the meantime, for those who believe that there is true merit to Stiglitz' thesis, the question is how one gets from here to there. I happen to think that Obama pretty much gets the magnitude of the shift that has to occur and that our existing banking/finance structure is broken. He further understands that the group has enormous power and support within very influential media outlets.

With a dumbed-down populace, a venal Republican Party to deal with, and an historic change to make, how does one proceed to actually establish an alternative? This is a particularly vexing problem when what comes next probably has no precedent or effective label. This is why any major government intervention is automatically called "socialism." It's tough to move forward fighting that knee-jerk reaction.

This all makes a frontal attack extremely risky and likely to cause exactly the wrong response. It appears that a "guerilla" strategy is the only one to take. This would consist of a persistent series of smaller attacks, sometimes in unsuspected places with a willingness to take some injuries along the way. Sustained efforts to engage the "villagers" and patient tactics that gradually demoralize the enemy might work.

This is not to say that nationalizing the banks is not the best of a set of lousy alternatives. Perhaps some of these tentative early steps are softening the populace and the enemy for a more dramatic act later.

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» RE: sgtmajor Posted by: donal1944
Bill Perdue
Posted by: donal1944 on Mar 7, 2009 5:39 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It's an excellent idea to nationalize the FIRE sector, including banks. but it has to be done without compensation except for working people.

The rich should not be compensated at all.

Nationalized enterprises, and all corporate entities that require public funding to stay alive should be nationalized with the condition, established by by Constitutional Amendment, that they can never be re-privatized.

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Don't click on that link (IDENTITY THEFT!)
Posted by: GuitarBill on Mar 7, 2009 7:50 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This scumbag is not trying to protect your privacy; he's trying to steal your identity.

If you click on his "Privacy Center" hyperlink, the server the link points to will install a keylogger on your computer, which is used to steal your credit card number, SSN, etc.

Please, report the comment to Alternet's staff.

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Dig Up Ben Franklin
Posted by: edgar1 on Mar 7, 2009 12:55 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Darn that Fifth Amendment to the Constitution. You should join my drive to replace the current constitution. The fifth and fourteenth amendments have to go, along with the first and eighth amendments. These matters should be handled by states or regions that would replace the states in a new constitution or constitutions that would be the basic organic laws for several new nations based on ethnicity that would replace the dying USA.

How many black people want to live with whites? Damn few. Same with hispanics. Let em have their own nations. But dont ask for 'civil rights' in the Eurpoean sector of the nation unless you swear loyalty to a new set of European based principles of citizenship, language and behavior.

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» RE: Dig Up Ben Franklin Posted by: wrinklemomma
Nationalize
Posted by: thouzel on Mar 7, 2009 6:13 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Stabilize. Privatize -- after selling off all those toxic "assets".
Get rid of incompetent existing executives. In a perfect world they would have to return those bonuses.
Too many Wall Street wolves guarding the banking chickens.

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RE: Bank nationalization.
Posted by: walter_map on Mar 7, 2009 7:23 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Bank liquidation won't accomplish the result the World Trade Federation and the Bank of International Settlements want:

"The real truth of the matter is, as you and I know, that a financial element in the larger centers has owned the government of the U.S. ever since the days of Andrew Jackson."

Franklin D. Roosevelt, letter to Edward House (1933)

"...the powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent private meetings and conferences. The apex of the system was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basle, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world’s central banks which were themselves private corporations."

Carroll Quigley, Tragedy and Hope: A History of the World in Our Time (1966)


I've provided a link to the text of the book. It explains the origins of present situation and says most of the things I have to say on these matters, except for this:

You should recognize that Obama's "solutions" to problems always involve a payout to a big financial supporter. Obama's "economic team" will continue to pretend to be filling the bottomless pit until there’s nothing left to throw in. The idea is to trade all the financiers' fake assets, invented out of investment leverage like credit default swaps, for actual productive assets. They still have several trillion to go.

The last fifty years of middle-class prosperity (in the US and Europe, at least) has been an aberration of history, because all other human history has been characterized by a relatively small, wealthy ruling class dominating the rest of the population, virtually powerless and mostly poor. Roosevelt was probably most responsible for this aberration in the US.

Having lost much of their domination in the 1930's and 1940's, the wealthy and powerful have since then militated to reclaim their domination and are well on-course to succeed. Siphoning off money through the military-industrial complex and related industries has been one method, but now they're using financial ruses which are much more efficient. The Logic of Empire clearly prescribes crushing debt as the usual tool to impoverish and control subject peoples, and so this aberration has finally been corrected by inducing the middle class in the developed countries to trade their prosperity for debts they can never repay.

The only hope is that Obama will take on the banks, as Roosevelt did. Roosevelt had bottled up the genie of corporate greed, which neoconservative deregulation has let out, and which Obama must somehow get back in. Obama will have to be encouraged to let Geithner and Bernanke go and to pursue a proper strategy.

Capitalism as presently constituted is clearly unsustainable. The financial overlords of the world surely know this and are grabbing while the grabbing is good. Nationalizing the banks is only the first step, because capitalism must be reconstituted into something more equitable and sustainable, just to have a chance of even mitigating the upcoming global misery.

Otherwise, kings and queens will retake their places, under other titles, and the world will revert to the historical model, according to the nature of civilization. It's sure to get ugly, and then weird ugly, and then weird ugly will come to seem normal in time, as it has been in most of history.

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» RE: Bank nationalization. Posted by: pdxjoe
» RE: Bank nationalization. Posted by: inanaturallight
TOO MUCH MONEY NOT ENOUGH QUESTIONS
Posted by: VZEQICVA on Mar 7, 2009 7:36 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Vast sums of money was handed to these faiing institutions but that was only part of the the solution. Any company accepting a dime from he government should have been required to fire its top six people. Many left, eventually but there was no message and there should have been. "You screwed up, you're fired, call security". It's not a time to save face or protect reputations. New people in the door usually see the problem immediately and are able to put a stop to it. Why would anyone believe that we could clean house and preserve all the executives' reputations and bonuses? These people were protected by the Bush Administration for 8 years. We're trying to run a government, not a country club. There's no way to clean up after 8 years of courruption and deceit without embarassing alot of people. There's much to be said for hanging people out to dry. It's good for the social physche. People paying their dues. It's good enough for the rest of us. Thanks, ANNA

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This country should stop starting wars all over God's green earth.
Posted by: symcokid on Mar 7, 2009 7:51 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
That's the only sane thing we can do to start with, but that won't ever happen so I say, "Nationalize the F------ banks". My wife and I are getting our money out and told our kids to do likewise. It's all going tit's up anyway.

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take over
Posted by: hurricane hugo on Mar 7, 2009 9:23 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
and issue stock to each and every US taxpayer.

#@!

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Taking over the...........
Posted by: ava1984 on Mar 7, 2009 11:36 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
banks, I still have a problem with the term 'toxic assets.' How can anything poison be an asset?, single payer health care; two things Obama and the Dems are loathe to do!
Why? The congress, the Senate in particular, has been resting in the deep pockets of the financial arm of our government, and let's not kid ourselves, similarly the heath scare 'sic' industries have paid good money to keep us in the clutches of these vampires.
While, it is nice to have a president who can speak in complete sentences; paragraphs even. We still must remember to read between the lines on every issue.

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» RE: Taking over the........... Posted by: VZEQICVA
Economic recovery plan
Posted by: under1630 on Mar 7, 2009 12:10 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
1) Nationalize all financial institutions
2) Forgive all unsecured consumer debt acquired prior to Jan. 20th, 2009
3) Write down all home mortgages to 80% of current market value and issue new loans at 5%
Current U.S. CC debt is ~ 3 trillion
Current U.S. mortgage debt is ~ 13 trillion (~ 1/3 own homes outright)
Doing this would generate ~ 200 billion/mo into U.S. economy.
4) Raise the tax on Capital Gains to 50%
A Capital Gain is a profit you make by selling something for more than what you bought it at. In other words, you're doing nothing to improve the economy. Most all Capital Gains are simply someone moving money and speculating. Why should they pay half what the working stiff pays?
This would raise ~ 60 billion/yr in revenues.
5) Repeal the Bush tax cuts. This would raise ~ 60 billion/yr in revenues.
6) Remove the cap on Social Security taxes.
This would have a twofold effect. One it would raise generate a tremendous amount of money into SS Trust Fund and two, it would make corporate America think twice about Executive pay, as they would have to pay an additional 15% taxes on those burgeoning salaries.
This would raise ~ 100 billion/yr in revenues.
7) Here's the biggie! Institute a 1/2% tax on all trades in all markets. Last year the NASDAQ traded ~ 26 trillion. NYSE ~ 17 trillion. These 2 however are small potatoes compared to the amount traded in the Derivatives markets. Last year there was 560 trillion traded! At 1/2% tax on these trades it would add 130 billion from the NASDAQ, 85 billion from the NYSE and 2.8 trillion from the derivatives.
All told these actions would add 3.15 trillion/yr to the U.S. Treasury, and boost the economy by about 200 billion/mo

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England Just Nationalized Loyd's. This is the 2nd one so far. These bailouts bring me to tears
Posted by: RR#1 on Mar 7, 2009 12:23 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
how could Obama be so stupid, the social good that could have been done with that TARP money and he said not one penny for shareholders or CEO's. Well, how is that playing out?
RR

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Report released Thursday argues that inequality is the most significant factor affecting health
Posted by: RR#1 on Mar 7, 2009 12:36 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
around the world.
ANDRÉ PICARD
From Thursday's Globe and Mail

August 28, 2008 at 5:20 AM EDT

Social justice - or lack thereof - has a greater impact on the health of the world's population than medical treatment, according to a landmark study that concludes that inequities are killing people on a "grand scale."

The report by a blue-ribbon international panel, being released Thursday in Geneva, says essentially that there is little point in trying to prevent and treat illness without tackling the underlying root causes such as poverty, poor housing, inadequate education and lack of human rights.

And the panel, chaired by Sir Michael Marmot, a professor at University College in London, calls on the World Health Organization and member countries like Canada to make the issue a global priority and close the health gap between rich and poor within a generation.

"Social injustice is killing people on a grand scale," the introduction reads.

"In countries at all levels of income, health and illness follow a social gradient: the lower the socioeconomic position, the worse the health. It does not have to be this way and it is not right that it should be like this."

To underscore the gaps, a number of stark statistics are featured, including the fact that a girl born today in the African country of Lesotho can expect to live 42 fewer years than one born in Japan.

The 256-page report, entitled Closing the Gap in a Generation: Health Equity through Action on the Social Determinants of Health, also challenges current economic dogma, stating that global trade and an aversion to public spending on social programs is not improving the lot of most people in the world, but making things worse.

"Economic growth is without question important, particularly for poor countries, as it gives the opportunity to provide resources to invest in improvement of the lives of their population. But growth by itself, without appropriate social policies to ensure reasonable fairness in the way its benefits are distributed, brings little benefit to health equity," the report says.

The 19 commissioners, who spent almost three years on the endeavour, call for a broad range of social measures to be instituted in rich and poor countries alike to "improve daily living conditions," including affordable housing, labour policies such as a decent minimum wage, social support like welfare, taxation measures that redistribute wealth, and universal access to basic health care.

Ronald Labonté, the Canada Research Chair in Globalization/Health Equity and a professor in the faculty of medicine at the University of Ottawa, said, "There is nothing terribly magical about these approaches, but the commission provides compelling evidence that they work."

He said the report should now shift the debate from what needs to be done to why countries are not acting.

"A failure to act now is a moral failure," Prof. Labonté said.

In fact, the report states that a business-as-usual approach will increase unfairness and unhealthiness because currently health disparities are actually increasing.

Monique Bégin, a professor in the school of management at the University of Ottawa, said that it would be a mistake to assume this issue is of interest to developing countries only.

Health inequities, she said, exist even in wealthy countries like Canada, where the abandonment of social programs is also affecting the health of citizens.

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» Conslusion Posted by: RR#1
good idea but..
Posted by: edgar1 on Mar 7, 2009 12:45 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I still don't quite get what will happen to the toxic assets-the stupid mortgage securities and paper junk the banks bought instead of lending to thriving businesses or people with innovative ideas. Yes, screw the shareholders and executives.

But these liabilities still exist don't they, even if Prez O is the defacto CEO of Citibank? Does someone out there have the expertise to explain? After all, even the author wants to eventually sell these banks back to private investors when "happy times are here again".

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» RE: good idea but.. Posted by: VZEQICVA
Look out Kid, it's somthing ya did!
Posted by: RR#1 on Mar 7, 2009 1:00 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Let these banks fail!
Isn't that how the free market works.
That is how it works for the poor disabled disenfranchised.
Look at the personal wealth of these ceo’s and stockholders.
For workers for 40 years it’s tighten your belt,
cut back,
work longer for less,
get two jobs,
and your wife as well,
Lose weight,
quit smoking,
get an education and pay the rest of your life,
go to treatment,
be prepared to have at least 7 career's in your lifetime,
Sell trinkets on the internet,
Get rich quick,
flip this house,
they are wealth creators (labour creates wealth not fancy bookkeeping)
What's good for G.M is good for the country,
Brown-outs,
black outs,
Kenny Lay,
executive privilege,
just say no,
WMD''s,
The terrorists, Terrorists, TERRIFIST!
Patriot Act,
3 strikes your out,
heads I win tails you lose,
What ever happened to the e-car?
Marijuana is bad,
Fruit Loops are good,
look out kid it's somethin you did, God know what but your doin it agin,
the free market is the best we can hope for,
we are all equal under the law,
the US government doesn't torture, it's private security firms can,
workers get laid off stocks go up,
we have the best health care system in the world,
socialism doesn't work,
the consumer wants,
The middle class,
We can't afford universal health care,
we can't afford universal education,
we can't afford affordable housing,
9/11,
blow-back,
be patriotic,
SPEND!
The West is the Best!
Keep on Rockin in the Free World!
Would you like Fries with that Coke?
Supersize Me,
WE WANT SHOCK N AWE!

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» Fascism rocks!!!!!!!!! Posted by: rafaeltoral
Nationalize the banks and more pie in the sky...
Posted by: chance garden on Mar 7, 2009 2:33 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Yea right, nationalize the banks?!? Who do you think would run the "new nationalization?" The same machiavellians that run the show today. This idea is as bankrupt as the banks themselves. Why should we trust the same bogus "leaders" to "fix" what THEY created to begin with????

...You need to have your head examined, if you believe that nationalization will "un-corrupt" this tradegy...

...Congress MUST investigate all the parties and counterparties to this crime and expose the scam...otherwise there will be NO restoration of confidence in captialism or our leaders...Time to smell the coffee Congress, perform YOUR SWORN DUTY to protect the american people OR RESIGN from office NOW!

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Stiglitz Should Replace Geithner as Secretary of the Treasury
Posted by: jimswanson on Mar 7, 2009 3:20 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
James A. Swanson, Los Altos, CA
“The Bush League of Nations” [for FREE download of entire $25.95 book]

I’m a longtime fan of Nobel Prize winner Stiglitz who would like to see him immediately replace Timothy Geithner as Treasury Secretary. A Team Stiglitz could then replace Team Goldman Sachs.

This article by Stiglitz should be required reading by both the Obama White House and Congress.

I suspect there are tens of millions of Americans like me who know that nationalization is not a four-letter word.

There’s a parallel between America’s military and America’s financial system. Both are too important to be entrusted to private mercenaries.

Have we learned nothing from the last three decades, especially the last eight years?

Reaganomics. Voodoo Economics. Deregulate. Deregulate. Deregulate. Take the money and run.

Are we nuts?

James A. Swanson, Los Altos, CA
"The Bush League of Nations"
www.bushleagueofnations.com [for FREE download of entire $25.95 book]

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» Land of the gutless Posted by: edgar1
Greenspan remarks
Posted by: reg373 on Mar 7, 2009 5:01 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
things are serious when;

For 2 decades the clarion of self-regulating financial markets, held in check by shareholders with faulty information as it turns out, now says we'll need not only new government oversight, but indeed outright government ownership... -- found a cool site; Balkingpoints.com -- incredible satellite camera view of earth

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Time for the Obama Celebration To End
Posted by: bessie on Mar 7, 2009 11:35 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As wonderful as it has been to watch the election of our new President, it's time for his administration to settle on a clear message about our financial crisis. So far, his message is confusing. I no longer care about anything to do with the trivial - I want to see some leadership that clearly defines the plan in terms of dealing with the banks and other groups like AIG. The lack of information is very disturbing. And then, President Obama asks us not to stuff our mattresses with cash. What kind of statement is this? Did FDR ever say anything like this? I think it's probably time for Obama to pick up the FDR playbook and to forget the Lincoln "Team of Rivals". Different times require different innovative approaches. Almost seems like President Obama just wants to have fun & celebrate his victory. Meanwhile, another 600,000 have lost their jobs, credit is still frozen, and Wall Street is tanking. I want a President on the job 24/7 defining his message and demanding results. No more time for Camp David or Brad Pitt until the message is crafted and defined. It's no longer about an election - it's about us.

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» Not the Point Posted by: edgar1
What about us?
Posted by: Gaubladt on Mar 8, 2009 7:27 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We are at a crossroads at this moment in time, in this nation.
One faction, lead by the treasure secretary, wants us taxpayers to pump cash into the existing economic structure to revitalize it and make it run again. This path, if carried to it's ultimate conclusion could cost us 10 trillion dollars, maby less. Even with all those trillions spent, it may not work. Who really knows? Is there any way to really know?
Another faction wants to wipe the slate clean. They want to leave all the creditors on the hook to dry. That means that all the people who held onto these stocks to the end, and kept their trust in US financial institutions will loose their entire investments: Pension funds, IRA Funds, as well as wealthy foreigners who trusted us to stand by institutions like Citi and BofA will loose any chance they might of had to recoup the losses they incurred in the last year.
It is a hard choice. We need a debate between the 2 factions to let them argue their positions before each other and before the entire world.

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The Global Collapse: a Non-orthodox View
Posted by: RR#1 on Mar 8, 2009 12:04 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
February 22, 2009

By Walden Bello


This is the longer version of an essay by the author released by the British Broadcasting Corporation (BBC) on 6 February 2009.



Week after week, we see the global economy contracting at a pace worse than predicted by the gloomiest analysts. We are now, it is clear, in no ordinary recession but are headed for a global depression that could last for many years.



The Fundamental Crisis: Overaccumulation



Orthodox economics has long ceased to be of any help in understanding the crisis. Non-orthodox economics, on the other hand, provides extraordinarily powerful insights into the causes and dynamics of the current crisis. From the progressive perspective, what we are seeing is the intensification of one of the central crises or "contradictions" of global capitalism: the crisis of overproduction, also known as overaccumulation or overcapacity. This is the tendency for capitalism to build up, in the context of heightened inter-capitalist competition, tremendous productive capacity that outruns the population's capacity to consume owing to income inequalities that limit popular purchasing power. The result is an erosion of profitability, leading to an economic downspin.



To understand the current collapse, we must go back in time to the so-called Golden Age of Contemporary Capitalism, the period from 1945 to 1975. This was a period of rapid growth both in the center economies and in the underdeveloped economies -- one that was partly triggered by the massive reconstruction of Europe and East Asia after the devastation of the Second World War, and partly by the new socioeconomic arrangements and instruments based on a historic class compromise between Capital and Labor that were institutionalized under the new Keynesian state.



But this period of high growth came to an end in the mid-1970s, when the center economies were seized by stagflation, meaning the coexistence of low growth with high inflation, which was not supposed to happen under neoclassical economics.



Stagflation, however, was but a symptom of a deeper cause: the reconstruction of Germany and Japan and the rapid growth of industrializing economies like Brazil, Taiwan, and South Korea added tremendous new productive capacity and increased global competition, while income inequality within countries and between countries limited the growth of purchasing power and demand, thus eroding profitability. This was aggravated by the massive oil price rises of the seventies.



The most painful expression of the crisis of overproduction was global recession of the early 1980s, which was the most serious to overtake the international economy since the Great Depression, that is, before the current crisis.



Capitalism tried three escape routes from the conundrum of overproduction: neoliberal restructuring, globalization, and financialization



Escape Route # 1: Neoliberal Restructuring



Neoliberal restructuring took the form of Reaganism and Thatcherism in the North and Structural Adjustment in the South. The aim was to invigorate capital accumulation, and this was to be done by 1) removing state constraints on the growth, use, and flow of capital and wealth; and 2) redistributing income from the poor and middle classes to the rich on the theory that the rich would then be motivated to invest and reignite economic growth.

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Sharkie
Posted by: Sharkie on Mar 8, 2009 1:19 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Here is the only way to stop this at once, it's called "Bank Run". Let's see how much more tax payer dollars are wasted after deposits are yanked, hopefully all on the same day. People do have a tool left to use and that is remove their deposits, now!

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No Law to Nationalize "To Big to Fail 'Banks'"
Posted by: undead on Mar 8, 2009 8:02 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Citigroup, AIG, Goldman are not banks in the definition of the FDIC. These are huge investment conglomerates.

This is why the fed's are pumping money into them. To hope they don't go under taking the world with them.

And the fed's don't have the management talent to run these "banks."

You suckers voted for the clowns in congress who, BTW, are receiving huge campaign contributions from these very "banks."

These congressman knew or should have known that the "to big to fail banks" could not be taken over with the lack of laws. They should have made laws to regulate and take over those types of banks or broken them up under Sherman anti trust laws.

Congress did nothing, except continue to take the money and run (for office that is.).

Opensecrets.org has all the info. http://www.opensecrets.org/

Mr. Obama (37 million dollars)and his chief of staff, Ramh Emmanuel (1.5 million dollars) are some of the biggest recipients of money from the biggest bail out candidates. Nancy Pelosi, Speaker of the House, and Senator Dodd, Banking Committee chair (six million dollars), too are huge recipients of money, too.

Get it, the game is rigged and you fell for it again.

And you think Mr. Nader is a fool and clown. Well, look in the mirror fools.

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Nationalization is the Way.
Posted by: eyeonit on Mar 9, 2009 7:40 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Dr. Steiglitz has a good idea and that is to nationalize the zombie bank's good assets, and let the bank deal with their bad assets, by looking for investors to buy them for what they are worth. I don't like the idea of the taxpayer buying these bad toxic assets above their worth through Geithners terrible private-public plan, and have the government guarantee 90% of the loan if sold to a hedge fund or sovereign wealth fund.

http://eye-on-washington.blogspot.com

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Wake up, humanity! You have robbed yourselves!
Posted by: nigelbest on Mar 9, 2009 5:31 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
You're softpedalling on these superrich because you think they are somehow good and great. All they do is sell for more than they pay. They think they are great, and you have bought into their high opinion of themselves. They have sold you the idea that they are great.

What is their virtue? They work about as hard as you do. That is all. They don't create jobs. Demand creates jobs. Where would they be if people didn't buy?

Are they rare geniuses? No one has measured their talents. Everyone has assumed that they are great and rare because they raked a lot of money, and that they deserve a lot of money because they are great and rare - a circular argument (false).

In any case, no one should in justice be paid for natural gifts, any more than anyone should have to pay people for having received birthday gifts. Nature has done the work of providing the natural gifts, not the person. And most people are underpaid paying unlimited amounts for the hypothetical natural gifts of others.

Because of these pays for no work by them, we have super-extreme pay injustice, super-extreme power injustice, undemocracy, warmongering, cannonfoddering, tyranny, social chaos, market chaos, violence, danger, nuclear winter coming, consuming all.

It's just purely a con job, a snow job, a suck. See it. They don't work any harder than you do. Justice is equal pay for equal WORK. There aren't enough hours in the day for anyone to work more than about 50% longer hours than the average. And yet we have pay up to 100,000 times the average. And consequently pay down to 10,000th of average. And consequently horrific violence, miserable society.

They haven't earned it, you have. The money isn't theirs, it's yours. Only work creates substantial wealth (goods and services). They have just raked it, by charging more than their costs.

By allowing unlimited fortunes, you have put most power in the hands of a few, and they use it to rake more money. They warmonger for money (with public money) and cannonfodder you. They are wealthpower giants walking on everyone. They are not necessary. In fact, it is necessary that they not be. Violence (war and crime) is proportional to pay injustice, and violence has grown to 60 times PDC (planet death capability).

Pay justice is the root of happy society. Pay injustice is the root of unhappy insane self-destructive society. Limit fortunes to $10 million (the most a person can earn by own work) and you will enter a golden age of happy society, with both the overpaid and the underpaid far far far happier.

We have super-extreme pay injustice, so we can be super-extremely happier. If one person has the property of 100, he is extremely unhappy too, with 100 enemies. Pay injustice is good for no one. Pay justice is good for everyone.

You have ruined the world, society, happiness and the future by allowing unlimited fortunes for limited work. Change!

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I was just thinking.....
Posted by: TimS on Mar 12, 2009 6:50 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The voting, concerned population of this country that contacted congress while the first hint of viral bailout fever was still germinating in the house,before the election,and said "don't do it" by a percentage of one hundred to one against this lousy idea,has been swindled.All Americans have been swindled. I've watched hearings on C-span where Helicopter Ben refused the house finance committee's request for an accounting of where the money was going and what was being done with it. He wouldn't say, and they didn't make him. That was last week. Who the hell does this country belong to? Bernanke's buddies or them and the other three hundred million of us? Congress is disgraced. They should have taken a tally of PEOPLE who were going to lose their worlds and sent THEM the money, if for nothing else, for letting things go this far. I would be happy to help citizens, screw the banks. They gave the "banks" one and a half trillion tax dollars after we told them not to. What are they going to do next, sneak their banker buddies out of the country? They'll probably need to use the Navy for that.

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