COMMENTS: 97
No More Band-Aid Solutions to the Financial Crisis: We Need to Build an Economy that Works
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Editor's Note: The following is an excerpt from Agenda for a New Economy: From Phantom Wealth to Real Wealth by David Korten, published by Berrett-Koehler Publishers, 2009.
Our economic system has failed in every dimension: financial, environmental, and social. And the current financial collapse provides an incontestable demonstration that it has failed even on its own terms. Spending trillions of dollars in an effort to restore this system to its previous condition is a reckless waste of time and resources and may be the greatest misuse of federal government credit in history. The more intelligent course is to acknowledge the failure and to set about redesigning our economic system from the bottom up to align with the realities and opportunities of the twenty-first century.
The Bush administration's strategy focused on bailing out the Wall Street institutions that bore primary responsibility for creating the crisis; its hope was that if the government picked up enough of those institutions' losses and toxic assets, they might decide to open the tap and get credit flowing again. The Obama administration has come into office with a strong focus on economic stimulus, and particularly on green jobs -- by far a more thoughtful and appropriate approach.
The real need, however, goes far beyond pumping new money into the economy to alleviate the consequences of the credit squeeze. We need to rebuild the system from the bottom up.
The recent credit meltdown has resulted in bailout commitments estimated in November 2008 to be $7.4 trillion, roughly half of the total U.S. gross domestic product (GDP). Congressional passage the previous month of a $700 billion bailout package to be administered by the Treasury Department sparked a vigorous national debate that focused attention on the devastating consequences of Wall Street deregulation. Other, even larger government commitments, including $4.5 trillion from the Federal Reserve, largely escaped notice. Large as the bailouts were, the failure of the credit system is only one manifestation of a failed economy that is wildly out of balance with, and devastating to, both humans and the natural environment.
Wages are falling in the face of volatile food and energy prices. Consumer debt and housing foreclosures are setting historic records. The middle class is shrinking. The unconscionable and growing worldwide gap between rich and poor, with its related alienation, is eroding the social fabric to the point of fueling terrorism, genocide, and other violent criminal activity.
At the same time, excessive consumption is pushing Earth's ecosystems into collapse. Climate change and the related increase in droughts, floods, and wildfires are now recognized as serious threats. Scientists are in almost universal agreement that human activity bears substantial responsibility. We face severe water shortages, the erosion of topsoil, the loss of species, and the end of the fossil fuel subsidy. In each instance, a failed economic system that takes no account of the social and environmental costs of monetary profits bears major responsibility.
We face a monumental economic challenge that goes far beyond anything being discussed in the U.S. Congress or the corporate press. The hardships imposed by temporarily frozen credit markets pale in comparison to what lies ahead.
Even the significant funds that the Obama administration is committed to spending on economic stimulus will do nothing to address the deeper structural causes of our threefold financial, social, and environmental crisis. On the positive side, the financial crisis has put to rest the myths that our economic institutions are sound and that markets work best when deregulated. This creates an opportune moment to open a national conversation about what we can and must do to create an economic system that can work for all people for all time.
Treat the System, Not the Symptom
As a student in business school, I learned a basic rule of effective problem solving that has shaped much of my professional life. Our professors constantly admonished us to "look at the big picture." Treat the visible problem -- a defective product or an underperforming employee -- as the symptom of a deeper system failure. "Look upstream to find the root cause. Find the systemic cause and fix the system so the problem will not recur." That is one of the most important things I learned in more than twenty-six years of formal education.
Many years after I left academia, an observation by a wise Canadian friend and colleague, Tim Brodhead, reminded me of this lesson when he explained why most efforts fail to end poverty. "They stop at treating the symptoms of poverty, such as hunger and poor health, with food programs and clinics, without ever asking the obvious question: Why do a few people enjoy effortless abundance while billions of others who work far harder experience extreme deprivation?" He summed it up with this simple statement: "If you act to correct a problem without a theory about its cause, you inevitably treat only the symptoms." It is the same lesson my business professors were drumming into my brain many years earlier.
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Comments are closed-
Posted by: Jay Randal on Feb 17, 2009 12:25 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: Democratic Socialism might be the wave of the future?! REPLY
Posted by: Jay Randal
» RE: Democratic Socialism might be the wave of the future?! REPLY
Posted by: Rolomax
» RE: Democratic Socialism might be the wave of the future?!
Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Democratic Socialism might be the wave of the future?!
Posted by: DaBear
» RE: Democratic Socialism might be the wave of the future?!
Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Democratic Socialism might be the wave of the future?!
Posted by: Rolomax
» RE: Democratic Socialism might be the wave of the future?!
Posted by: Rolomax
» Hope He Doesn't Defend It ! ! !
Posted by: mtnprivy
» Or, Obama might not defend Wall ST. because... he gets it!
Posted by: greentime
Comments are closed-
Posted by: mmckinl on Feb 17, 2009 12:56 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
~ Nationalization of all banks ... to get liquidity and trust back into the banking system.
~ Nationalization of the Fed ... Why should we borrow our own money? We need a Public Central Bank that creates our currency and credit for the benefit of the public who underwrite its value and shoulder the risk.
~ HR 676 Medicare for All ... Saves millions of jobs, helps the under and uninsured, helps business, helps the states and can start to be implemented within a month or two and finished within 18 months.
~ Higher taxes on the well to do, the closing of loopholes and all income counted as ordinary income ... A Carbon Tax, A Tobin Tax .... The budget deficit must be contained.
~ A shorter workweek ... Why should we have a 40 hour workweek? Efficiency has been going up for decades, yet real wages and benefits are flat and falling. The new economy won't have tens of millions of jobs in retail anymore, we have to spread the work. How about a 32 hour workweek? We went from 48 to a 40 hour work week six days to five and it worked just fine.
~ Bankruptcy "CramDowns" for consumers to get them back on the right track. Acorn and other social agencies could prepackage BKs for bankruptcy judges. And then credit has to get much tighter.
~ Cut the Defense Budget by 50% ... we spend more than almost all other countries combined! Military spending is dead end spending.
Politically possible? ... Not right now ... but when the Dow hits 6000 anything goes ...
and ...
If we don't start demanding these reforms they will never even get considered ... We need big answers to big problems.
[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: Veros
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: richholland
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: gazooks
» Human Resources.
Posted by: edgar1
» RE: Human Resources.
Posted by: bornxeyed
» Are you demanding AGAINST them?
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» How does that even make sense? And do you happen to know what Nader's middle name is?
Posted by: Beck
» Jennifer makes more sense than you'll ever come close to making. Give it a rest.
Posted by: maxpayne
» Thanks max. "Beck the Obamabot" is just another "Joe the Plumber".
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» RE: ...ARE you demanding them? Yes, I am!
Posted by: mmckinl
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: maxpayne
» And by the way, we borrow from China to spend recklessly for wars and military.
Posted by: maxpayne
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: maxpayne
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: bornxeyed
» Thank you ! Also, love your physics posts you nailed those neolibs with. :)
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» RE: Thank you ! Also, love your physics posts you nailed those neolibs with. :)
Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Thank you ! Also, love your physics posts you nailed those neolibs with. :)
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» RE: Thank you ! Also, love your physics posts you nailed those neolibs with. :)
Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: bornxeyed
» "massive spending program"
Posted by: truthlover
» RE: "massive spending program"
Posted by: EncinoM
» Defense spending is what SUPERCRIPPLED the economy in the 1980s and this decade !
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» RE: Defense spending is what SUPERCRIPPLED the economy in the 1980s and this decade !
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Defense spending is what SUPERCRIPPLED the economy in the 1980s and this decade !
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» RE: "massive spending program"
Posted by: bornxeyed
» I'm Changing My Name To Fannie Mae
Posted by: bornxeyed
» Get ready for more unproductive military spending. Read this article and weep !!
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» RE: Get ready for more unproductive military spending. Read this article and weep !!
Posted by: EncinoM
» The more Obama shows his rightwing self, the more Nader or likewise will gain on Barry.
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» RE: The more Obama shows his rightwing self, the more Nader or likewise will gain on Barry.
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: The more Obama shows his rightwing self, the more Nader or likewise will gain on Barry.
Posted by: maxpayne
» RE: Get ready for more unproductive military spending. They know very little about Nader.
Posted by: Beck
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: riondluz
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Green Party Platform
Posted by: oregoncharles
» Love the Green Party too and I'm not giving up on helping them out in MO.
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
Comments are closed-
Posted by: richholland on Feb 17, 2009 1:11 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
why so many american people, in their hearts friendly and nice. think it is normal that some individuals have billions and others live on foodstamps???
And try to export this crazy system all over the world.
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» RE: think out of the box
Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Religious freaks
Posted by: solrev
» Yeah, but then Jesus wasn't religious (he wasn't a freak, either)
Posted by: truthlover
» RE: eligious freaks
Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: eligious freaks
Posted by: riondluz
» RE: think out of the box
Posted by: Beck
» RE: think out of the box
Posted by: bornxeyed
» Like Nixon, Reagan, Clinton, and both Bushes, Obama's borrowing from China to
Posted by: maxpayne
» RE: Like Nixon, Reagan, Clinton, and both Bushes, Obama's borrowing from China to
Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Like Nixon, Reagan, Clinton, and both Bushes, Obama's borrowing from China to
Posted by: maxpayne
Comments are closed-
Posted by: lastmarx1 on Feb 17, 2009 1:38 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: Perry Logan on Feb 17, 2009 3:33 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Another major dimension of capitalism's failure is its toxic effect on freedom and democracy.
Far from promoting human rights and democracy, capitalism seems to destroy it wherever it goes. The marriage between Friedmanism and the most atrocious dictatoraship is well-known, outside of Wingnutania.
America went whole-hog for capitalism--and our democracy is on full life support. (Mark Crispin Miller estimates the Republicans reduced Obama's victory by half. We have traitors amongst us.)
Meanwhile, tiny, impoverished Cuba--under embargo for decades--has a far better health care system than us. So much for communism not working!
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» RE: Toxic effect
Posted by: bornxeyed
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Posted by: SteveBreeze on Feb 17, 2009 3:36 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: kafka, f on Feb 17, 2009 4:01 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As one small example for all you dopes who somehow think the system is not and has not always been rigged by liars and thieves, Citi’s 10q as of 9/31/08 shows capital of about $126 billion yet its market cap as of today is $19 Billion (though it is likely insolvent). Forget about FAS 157 there are a million ways around it, the more difficult scam to discern is the use of SIVs to offload bad assets from Citi’s balance sheet so it does not have to recognize the losses. To Citi’s credit it does disclose in footnote 15 of its 10q potential exposure of about $130 Billion for part of their SPEs. Of course such amount is in excess of its stated book capital and almost 7 times larger than its current market cap and likely massively understated.
I know no one saw this coming; you can’t know the unknown; and all KPMG did was follow the accounting rules. Then how come a dope like me could figure it out? Further, that is what the tax partners thought before Tim Flynn, Joe Loonan and Swen Holmes tried to get them put in prison. In fact, many beginning as early as 2005 saw this problem coming like Dr. Roubini and used simple math to explain why. If KPMG is so expert at anything, why didn’t KPMG see this coming and warn all the decimated Citi investors. Personally, I am glad KPMG continued to produce the self evident fraudulent financials because me and my kind made a fortune off all the idiots who think any integrity exists within the fraudulent accounting statements or companies (such statements are reflective of).
In fact, Dr. Roubini is suggesting formally nationalizing all the banks (which most of are already 100% owned on a fair market value basis) because the system is insolvent. It may be time to short these fraudulent companies yet again if he is right, any thoughts?
15. SECURITIZATIONS AND VARIABLE INTEREST ENTITIES
The following tables summarize the Company's significant involvement in VIEs in millions of dollars:
As of September 30, 2008
(continued)
Maximum exposure to loss in
significant unconsolidated VIEs
(continued) As of December 31, 2007(1)
Total maximum exposure Consolidated
VIE assets Significant
unconsolidated
VIE assets(2) Maximum exposure to loss in
significant unconsolidated
VIE assets(3)
356,326 $ 152,248
Total stockholders' equity 126,062 126,962 (1
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Posted by: outlook on Feb 17, 2009 4:10 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: edgar1 on Feb 17, 2009 5:23 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
the climate however is not on the verge of collapse. no study claims this, including the biased IPCC climate change prediction report of 2008.
Real economic growth means use of carbon. There is no other realistic way to keep unemployment down and production up. We will need a defensive military to protect us from the Asians who will be angry at us for keeping their goods out, which we must. Asians and Latinos, except for highly skilled scientists, must be excluded, to provide jobs for Americans.
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» RE: Jobs that create real value
Posted by: Evelyn
» RE: Jobs that create real value
Posted by: bornxeyed
» For once I agree
Posted by: truthlover
» RE: For once I agree
Posted by: bornxeyed
Comments are closed-
Posted by: cmaukonen on Feb 17, 2009 6:55 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"Well I’ve signed about a thousand petitions,
And my golf score is six under par.
And I keep myself up on the issues
By listening to N.P.R.,
And you know that I’m changing the world
With these stickers all over my car!
So love me, love me, love me, I’m a liberal!"
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» RE: Another solution to the economic mess...
Posted by: pawheel
» RE: Another solution to the economic mess...
Posted by: bornxeyed
Comments are closed-
Posted by: freelyb on Feb 17, 2009 7:03 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» So why should we give Obama our taxpayer money if we're to be doing all his shit?
Posted by: maxpayne
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Posted by: greenferret on Feb 17, 2009 7:24 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
-Medicare for all
-progressive taxation
-carbon tax
-Tobin tax
-shorter workweek
-drastic cuts in military spending
-public campaign financing
If you look at the Greens' response to the financial meltdown, they were calling for nationalization of the banks and the fed, and renegotiation of adjustable-rate mortgages to allow people to keep their homes.
You want social democracy? What are you waiting for? http://gp.org/
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Posted by: Craig Collier on Feb 17, 2009 7:28 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We can't put enough money or resources into the old model to change the process and thereby the end result. We need to create a new model using existing resources, organizations and opportunities while we are moving through the largest economic challenge in our history.
Co-op: "an autonomous association of persons united voluntarily to meet common economic, social, and cultural needs and aspirations through a jointly-owned and democratically-controlled enterprise".
Bioregion: "an area constituting a natural ecological community with characteristic flora, fauna and environmental conditions and bounded by natural rather than arificial borders".
Economic regions: WORKING PAPER NO.03-23 AN ALTERNATIVE DEFINITION OF ECONOMIC REGIONS IN THE U.S. BASED ON SIMILARITIES IN STATE BUSINESS CYCLES - Theodore M. Crone
Co-op capitalism based on bio-economic regionalism: not yet totally created but possibly a workable format in which to organize and finance the building of sustainable value.
We've been working on creating an equitable distribution system since we moved into town 10,000 years ago. We just took a little detour and mistook creating money for value. Maybe if we refocus on value (infrastructure, cultural, social), we can use incentives within a different operating system to redirect without tearing the whole thing down.
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Posted by: sawdust on Feb 17, 2009 7:37 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» Was twice enough?
Posted by: bornxeyed
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Zimbly on Feb 17, 2009 8:05 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If Obama is really serious about curing the ills of America, then the Federal Reserve...which is a privately owned company, needs to be shut down and the power to create the money put back into the hands of the Government......then the whole equation is changed and there won't be this nefarious entity creating "balloon money" out of thin air and having people to pay them back with "real assets"
Stop the crime, shut down the Federal Reserve, Nationalize the Banks.......end of sentence.
Sounds easy right........ I can assure you if Obama does that..it will be Dealy Plaza for him....and he knows that
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Posted by: outlook on Feb 17, 2009 8:42 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Maybe, just maybe, they will all wake-up when the s--t hits the proverbial fan; and it might then be too late.
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Posted by: pfm on Feb 17, 2009 10:17 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The American economy in February 2009, is like viewing a cult movie … Chain Saw Massacre … the difference we really don’t know how our economy plays out…? While Chain Saw Massacre is make believe, what we see with our own eyes, hear with our own ears, feel with our own sense is real, when we turn the knob it does not go away, but remains.
That we have been educated to find our individual value in the “stuff” we have, not being able to shop every day, purchasing “stuff” which quickly we throw away, we feel unfulfilled, alone, afraid.
Our economy can quickly be not only restored but lead create much greater fulfillment for all but first we must wake up from the dream state our current education has put us in. Demand and accept nothing less than full disclosure from all in any office of government, from President, Congress, State, County and local too. Begin by closing down the IRS and bogus Federal Reserve, yea, I know, that’s asking a lot. I invite you to look behind the curtain and see who for all these years has manipulated our economy not for our benefit but solely for theirs. It is but a handful of greedy, selfish, immoral men and women seeing themselves different from you and me. Well, guess what, they’re not.
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Posted by: jlowelld on Feb 17, 2009 11:27 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-66172489666918336
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Posted by: Givvemhell on Feb 17, 2009 11:46 AM
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Posted by: oregoncharles on Feb 17, 2009 12:24 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We've all heard the line about doing the same old thing and expecting different results. That's more human than insane, but it certainly places us in a straitjacket.
Why would anyone expect anything truly new from a politician whose whole record says he's a "radical centrist," or a party that is utterly beholden to big-business money?
We've come to the end of our rope and we're dangling over a cliff, folks. Time to try something new; time for politics that might actually let us rethink our economy, instead throwing untold trillions at the same old banksters.
www.gp.org
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» You need to come up with someone more credible than Cynthia McKinney...
Posted by: mjabele
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Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield on Feb 17, 2009 1:30 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
READ IT AND WEEP !!
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» Sigh, looks like Obama really is hell bent on making Afghanistan America's next "Vietnam"
Posted by: maxpayne
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Posted by: Sojourner on Feb 17, 2009 2:02 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If you don't have a specific proposal (the prez says he is willing to listen to those, by the way) get out of the way.
The US Congress has just floated a big parachute because the sky IS falling. No, it will not be enough, because we are caught between the rock and the hard place.
My specific proposal is to reign in off-shore capitalism, establish a corporate tax rate that history showed was fair, and regulate the living h3ll out of the economy. Yes, rationing stamps if that is what it takes. Greed will always prevail over regulation, and that will not change.
Do not blow this moment! We have enough going for us to make it to a more just society. Of course government must dance with the princes of finance. How else do we put them to work for us?
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Posted by: yesman on Feb 17, 2009 10:31 PM
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This is the perfect opportunity to change direction, to begin to rebuild a truly humane society. Will we rise to this challenge? Seems doubtful.
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Posted by: Stew on Feb 20, 2009 2:26 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This question/observation makes it quite clear that the whole game - rules, rule-breakers, Keynsians, Freidmanites, wealth re-distribution, consumerism, etc. is ALL WRONG.
Can a world economy grow from local, resource/value-based systems? hmmmm...
-stew
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Posted by: Jay Randal on Feb 17, 2009 12:25 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]
» RE: Democratic Socialism might be the wave of the future?! REPLY
Posted by: Jay Randal
» RE: Democratic Socialism might be the wave of the future?! REPLY
Posted by: Rolomax
» RE: Democratic Socialism might be the wave of the future?!
Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Democratic Socialism might be the wave of the future?!
Posted by: DaBear
» RE: Democratic Socialism might be the wave of the future?!
Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Democratic Socialism might be the wave of the future?!
Posted by: Rolomax
» RE: Democratic Socialism might be the wave of the future?!
Posted by: Rolomax
» Hope He Doesn't Defend It ! ! !
Posted by: mtnprivy
» Or, Obama might not defend Wall ST. because... he gets it!
Posted by: greentime
Comments are closed-
Posted by: mmckinl on Feb 17, 2009 12:56 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
~ Nationalization of all banks ... to get liquidity and trust back into the banking system.
~ Nationalization of the Fed ... Why should we borrow our own money? We need a Public Central Bank that creates our currency and credit for the benefit of the public who underwrite its value and shoulder the risk.
~ HR 676 Medicare for All ... Saves millions of jobs, helps the under and uninsured, helps business, helps the states and can start to be implemented within a month or two and finished within 18 months.
~ Higher taxes on the well to do, the closing of loopholes and all income counted as ordinary income ... A Carbon Tax, A Tobin Tax .... The budget deficit must be contained.
~ A shorter workweek ... Why should we have a 40 hour workweek? Efficiency has been going up for decades, yet real wages and benefits are flat and falling. The new economy won't have tens of millions of jobs in retail anymore, we have to spread the work. How about a 32 hour workweek? We went from 48 to a 40 hour work week six days to five and it worked just fine.
~ Bankruptcy "CramDowns" for consumers to get them back on the right track. Acorn and other social agencies could prepackage BKs for bankruptcy judges. And then credit has to get much tighter.
~ Cut the Defense Budget by 50% ... we spend more than almost all other countries combined! Military spending is dead end spending.
Politically possible? ... Not right now ... but when the Dow hits 6000 anything goes ...
and ...
If we don't start demanding these reforms they will never even get considered ... We need big answers to big problems.
[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: Veros
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: richholland
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: gazooks
» Human Resources.
Posted by: edgar1
» RE: Human Resources.
Posted by: bornxeyed
» Are you demanding AGAINST them?
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» How does that even make sense? And do you happen to know what Nader's middle name is?
Posted by: Beck
» Jennifer makes more sense than you'll ever come close to making. Give it a rest.
Posted by: maxpayne
» Thanks max. "Beck the Obamabot" is just another "Joe the Plumber".
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» RE: ...ARE you demanding them? Yes, I am!
Posted by: mmckinl
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: maxpayne
» And by the way, we borrow from China to spend recklessly for wars and military.
Posted by: maxpayne
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: maxpayne
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: bornxeyed
» Thank you ! Also, love your physics posts you nailed those neolibs with. :)
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» RE: Thank you ! Also, love your physics posts you nailed those neolibs with. :)
Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Thank you ! Also, love your physics posts you nailed those neolibs with. :)
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» RE: Thank you ! Also, love your physics posts you nailed those neolibs with. :)
Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: bornxeyed
» "massive spending program"
Posted by: truthlover
» RE: "massive spending program"
Posted by: EncinoM
» Defense spending is what SUPERCRIPPLED the economy in the 1980s and this decade !
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» RE: Defense spending is what SUPERCRIPPLED the economy in the 1980s and this decade !
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Defense spending is what SUPERCRIPPLED the economy in the 1980s and this decade !
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» RE: "massive spending program"
Posted by: bornxeyed
» I'm Changing My Name To Fannie Mae
Posted by: bornxeyed
» Get ready for more unproductive military spending. Read this article and weep !!
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» RE: Get ready for more unproductive military spending. Read this article and weep !!
Posted by: EncinoM
» The more Obama shows his rightwing self, the more Nader or likewise will gain on Barry.
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» RE: The more Obama shows his rightwing self, the more Nader or likewise will gain on Barry.
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: The more Obama shows his rightwing self, the more Nader or likewise will gain on Barry.
Posted by: maxpayne
» RE: Get ready for more unproductive military spending. They know very little about Nader.
Posted by: Beck
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: riondluz
» RE: Here are Seven Policies for a Start ...
Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Green Party Platform
Posted by: oregoncharles
» Love the Green Party too and I'm not giving up on helping them out in MO.
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
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Posted by: richholland on Feb 17, 2009 1:11 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
why so many american people, in their hearts friendly and nice. think it is normal that some individuals have billions and others live on foodstamps???
And try to export this crazy system all over the world.
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» RE: think out of the box
Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Religious freaks
Posted by: solrev
» Yeah, but then Jesus wasn't religious (he wasn't a freak, either)
Posted by: truthlover
» RE: eligious freaks
Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: eligious freaks
Posted by: riondluz
» RE: think out of the box
Posted by: Beck
» RE: think out of the box
Posted by: bornxeyed
» Like Nixon, Reagan, Clinton, and both Bushes, Obama's borrowing from China to
Posted by: maxpayne
» RE: Like Nixon, Reagan, Clinton, and both Bushes, Obama's borrowing from China to
Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Like Nixon, Reagan, Clinton, and both Bushes, Obama's borrowing from China to
Posted by: maxpayne
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Posted by: lastmarx1 on Feb 17, 2009 1:38 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: Perry Logan on Feb 17, 2009 3:33 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Another major dimension of capitalism's failure is its toxic effect on freedom and democracy.
Far from promoting human rights and democracy, capitalism seems to destroy it wherever it goes. The marriage between Friedmanism and the most atrocious dictatoraship is well-known, outside of Wingnutania.
America went whole-hog for capitalism--and our democracy is on full life support. (Mark Crispin Miller estimates the Republicans reduced Obama's victory by half. We have traitors amongst us.)
Meanwhile, tiny, impoverished Cuba--under embargo for decades--has a far better health care system than us. So much for communism not working!
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» RE: Toxic effect
Posted by: bornxeyed
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Posted by: SteveBreeze on Feb 17, 2009 3:36 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: kafka, f on Feb 17, 2009 4:01 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As one small example for all you dopes who somehow think the system is not and has not always been rigged by liars and thieves, Citi’s 10q as of 9/31/08 shows capital of about $126 billion yet its market cap as of today is $19 Billion (though it is likely insolvent). Forget about FAS 157 there are a million ways around it, the more difficult scam to discern is the use of SIVs to offload bad assets from Citi’s balance sheet so it does not have to recognize the losses. To Citi’s credit it does disclose in footnote 15 of its 10q potential exposure of about $130 Billion for part of their SPEs. Of course such amount is in excess of its stated book capital and almost 7 times larger than its current market cap and likely massively understated.
I know no one saw this coming; you can’t know the unknown; and all KPMG did was follow the accounting rules. Then how come a dope like me could figure it out? Further, that is what the tax partners thought before Tim Flynn, Joe Loonan and Swen Holmes tried to get them put in prison. In fact, many beginning as early as 2005 saw this problem coming like Dr. Roubini and used simple math to explain why. If KPMG is so expert at anything, why didn’t KPMG see this coming and warn all the decimated Citi investors. Personally, I am glad KPMG continued to produce the self evident fraudulent financials because me and my kind made a fortune off all the idiots who think any integrity exists within the fraudulent accounting statements or companies (such statements are reflective of).
In fact, Dr. Roubini is suggesting formally nationalizing all the banks (which most of are already 100% owned on a fair market value basis) because the system is insolvent. It may be time to short these fraudulent companies yet again if he is right, any thoughts?
15. SECURITIZATIONS AND VARIABLE INTEREST ENTITIES
The following tables summarize the Company's significant involvement in VIEs in millions of dollars:
As of September 30, 2008
(continued)
Maximum exposure to loss in
significant unconsolidated VIEs
(continued) As of December 31, 2007(1)
Total maximum exposure Consolidated
VIE assets Significant
unconsolidated
VIE assets(2) Maximum exposure to loss in
significant unconsolidated
VIE assets(3)
356,326 $ 152,248
Total stockholders' equity 126,062 126,962 (1
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Posted by: outlook on Feb 17, 2009 4:10 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: edgar1 on Feb 17, 2009 5:23 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
the climate however is not on the verge of collapse. no study claims this, including the biased IPCC climate change prediction report of 2008.
Real economic growth means use of carbon. There is no other realistic way to keep unemployment down and production up. We will need a defensive military to protect us from the Asians who will be angry at us for keeping their goods out, which we must. Asians and Latinos, except for highly skilled scientists, must be excluded, to provide jobs for Americans.
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» RE: Jobs that create real value
Posted by: Evelyn
» RE: Jobs that create real value
Posted by: bornxeyed
» For once I agree
Posted by: truthlover
» RE: For once I agree
Posted by: bornxeyed
Comments are closed-
Posted by: cmaukonen on Feb 17, 2009 6:55 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"Well I’ve signed about a thousand petitions,
And my golf score is six under par.
And I keep myself up on the issues
By listening to N.P.R.,
And you know that I’m changing the world
With these stickers all over my car!
So love me, love me, love me, I’m a liberal!"
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» RE: Another solution to the economic mess...
Posted by: pawheel
» RE: Another solution to the economic mess...
Posted by: bornxeyed
Comments are closed-
Posted by: freelyb on Feb 17, 2009 7:03 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» So why should we give Obama our taxpayer money if we're to be doing all his shit?
Posted by: maxpayne
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Posted by: greenferret on Feb 17, 2009 7:24 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
-Medicare for all
-progressive taxation
-carbon tax
-Tobin tax
-shorter workweek
-drastic cuts in military spending
-public campaign financing
If you look at the Greens' response to the financial meltdown, they were calling for nationalization of the banks and the fed, and renegotiation of adjustable-rate mortgages to allow people to keep their homes.
You want social democracy? What are you waiting for? http://gp.org/
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Posted by: Craig Collier on Feb 17, 2009 7:28 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We can't put enough money or resources into the old model to change the process and thereby the end result. We need to create a new model using existing resources, organizations and opportunities while we are moving through the largest economic challenge in our history.
Co-op: "an autonomous association of persons united voluntarily to meet common economic, social, and cultural needs and aspirations through a jointly-owned and democratically-controlled enterprise".
Bioregion: "an area constituting a natural ecological community with characteristic flora, fauna and environmental conditions and bounded by natural rather than arificial borders".
Economic regions: WORKING PAPER NO.03-23 AN ALTERNATIVE DEFINITION OF ECONOMIC REGIONS IN THE U.S. BASED ON SIMILARITIES IN STATE BUSINESS CYCLES - Theodore M. Crone
Co-op capitalism based on bio-economic regionalism: not yet totally created but possibly a workable format in which to organize and finance the building of sustainable value.
We've been working on creating an equitable distribution system since we moved into town 10,000 years ago. We just took a little detour and mistook creating money for value. Maybe if we refocus on value (infrastructure, cultural, social), we can use incentives within a different operating system to redirect without tearing the whole thing down.
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Posted by: sawdust on Feb 17, 2009 7:37 AM
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» Was twice enough?
Posted by: bornxeyed
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Posted by: Zimbly on Feb 17, 2009 8:05 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If Obama is really serious about curing the ills of America, then the Federal Reserve...which is a privately owned company, needs to be shut down and the power to create the money put back into the hands of the Government......then the whole equation is changed and there won't be this nefarious entity creating "balloon money" out of thin air and having people to pay them back with "real assets"
Stop the crime, shut down the Federal Reserve, Nationalize the Banks.......end of sentence.
Sounds easy right........ I can assure you if Obama does that..it will be Dealy Plaza for him....and he knows that
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Posted by: outlook on Feb 17, 2009 8:42 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Maybe, just maybe, they will all wake-up when the s--t hits the proverbial fan; and it might then be too late.
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Posted by: pfm on Feb 17, 2009 10:17 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The American economy in February 2009, is like viewing a cult movie … Chain Saw Massacre … the difference we really don’t know how our economy plays out…? While Chain Saw Massacre is make believe, what we see with our own eyes, hear with our own ears, feel with our own sense is real, when we turn the knob it does not go away, but remains.
That we have been educated to find our individual value in the “stuff” we have, not being able to shop every day, purchasing “stuff” which quickly we throw away, we feel unfulfilled, alone, afraid.
Our economy can quickly be not only restored but lead create much greater fulfillment for all but first we must wake up from the dream state our current education has put us in. Demand and accept nothing less than full disclosure from all in any office of government, from President, Congress, State, County and local too. Begin by closing down the IRS and bogus Federal Reserve, yea, I know, that’s asking a lot. I invite you to look behind the curtain and see who for all these years has manipulated our economy not for our benefit but solely for theirs. It is but a handful of greedy, selfish, immoral men and women seeing themselves different from you and me. Well, guess what, they’re not.
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Posted by: jlowelld on Feb 17, 2009 11:27 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-66172489666918336
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Posted by: Givvemhell on Feb 17, 2009 11:46 AM
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Posted by: oregoncharles on Feb 17, 2009 12:24 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We've all heard the line about doing the same old thing and expecting different results. That's more human than insane, but it certainly places us in a straitjacket.
Why would anyone expect anything truly new from a politician whose whole record says he's a "radical centrist," or a party that is utterly beholden to big-business money?
We've come to the end of our rope and we're dangling over a cliff, folks. Time to try something new; time for politics that might actually let us rethink our economy, instead throwing untold trillions at the same old banksters.
www.gp.org
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» You need to come up with someone more credible than Cynthia McKinney...
Posted by: mjabele
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Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield on Feb 17, 2009 1:30 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
READ IT AND WEEP !!
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» Sigh, looks like Obama really is hell bent on making Afghanistan America's next "Vietnam"
Posted by: maxpayne
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Posted by: Sojourner on Feb 17, 2009 2:02 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If you don't have a specific proposal (the prez says he is willing to listen to those, by the way) get out of the way.
The US Congress has just floated a big parachute because the sky IS falling. No, it will not be enough, because we are caught between the rock and the hard place.
My specific proposal is to reign in off-shore capitalism, establish a corporate tax rate that history showed was fair, and regulate the living h3ll out of the economy. Yes, rationing stamps if that is what it takes. Greed will always prevail over regulation, and that will not change.
Do not blow this moment! We have enough going for us to make it to a more just society. Of course government must dance with the princes of finance. How else do we put them to work for us?
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Posted by: yesman on Feb 17, 2009 10:31 PM
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This is the perfect opportunity to change direction, to begin to rebuild a truly humane society. Will we rise to this challenge? Seems doubtful.
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Posted by: Stew on Feb 20, 2009 2:26 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This question/observation makes it quite clear that the whole game - rules, rule-breakers, Keynsians, Freidmanites, wealth re-distribution, consumerism, etc. is ALL WRONG.
Can a world economy grow from local, resource/value-based systems? hmmmm...
-stew
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Erick Erickson Is the New CNN Go-to Bigot, Misogynist and Homophobe
Religious Right and Tea Party Nation Turn to Michele Bachmann in Desperate Attempt to Defeat Health-Care Bill
Honoring Granny D: Crusader for Democracy




