COMMENTS: 429
Enough of 'Barbituate' Left Cynicism, Obama Is a Victory over White Supremacy
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My political entry into the left (and by this I mean the real left, beyond the Democratic Party) came a little more than twenty years ago in New Orleans, when, as a college student I became involved in the fight against U.S. intervention in Central America. In particular, the groups of which I was a part sought to end military aid to the death squad governments in El Salvador and Guatemala, and to block support for the contra thugs our nation was arming in Nicaragua, who by that time had already killed about 30,000 civilians in their war with the nominally socialist Sandinista government.
It was the first place where I came into contact with folks who defined themselves as radicals (I had grown up in Nashville, after all, where at that time, even finding "out" liberals was sometimes a challenge), and where I got to experience all the fascinating permutations of Marxism that the left had to offer. In addition to unaffiliated socialists (which I considered myself to be at the time), there were Trotskyites, old-line Leninists, Maoists, and even some bizarre Stalinists in the bunch. Excluding from consideration those among this number who turned out to be FBI spies, there were still plenty of real and interesting ideologues who had valuable insights to offer, even for those of us who didn't swallow their particular party line.
But despite being interesting, these folks also managed, at least for me, to demonstrate one of the key problems with the left in the U.S. Namely, for the sake of ideological purity few within the professional left expressed any joy about life, or any emotion whatsoever that wasn't rooted in negativity. They were like the political equivalent of quaaludes: guaranteed to bring you down from whatever partly optimistic place you might find yourself from time to time.
This was never so evident as the day I hopped into a car with one of the Stalinoids (a member of something called the Albanian Liberation League, which viewed the brutal regime of Enver Hoxha as a worker's paradise), and headed downtown for a rally to protest Contra aid. Once in the car, I asked about the music playing from his stereo. What was it? I wanted to know. He quickly explained that it was Albanian folk music, and the only music he listened to. I made some joke about how strange it was to be living in one of the greatest musical towns on Earth and yet to restrict oneself to a single genre of music (especially that favored by Albanian sheepherders), to which my revolutionary friend responded with a grunt and a scowl. Of course, because Comrade Stalin never much liked jazz.
The humorlessness of the far left -- to which I remain connected ideologically if not organizationally -- has always struck me as one of its greatest weaknesses. People like to laugh, they like to smile, they like to be joyful, and an awful lot of hardened leftists seem almost utterly incapable of doing any of these things. It's as if they have all taken a pledge that there should be no laughter until the revolution, or some such shit. No positivity, no hope, no happiness so long as people are still poor and exploited and being murdered by cops, and victimized by United States militarism, or performing as wage slaves for global capital, or eating meat, or driving cars. And they wonder why the left is so weak?
Now, in the wake of Barack Obama's victory these barbiturate leftists are back in full effect, lecturing the rest of us about how naive we are for having any confidence whatsoever in him, or for voting at all, since "the Democrats and Republicans are all the same," and he supports FISA and the war with Afghanistan, and all kinds of other messed up policies just like many on the right. Those of us who find any significance in the election of a man of color in a nation founded on white supremacy are fools who "drank the kool-aid," unlike they, whose clear-headed radical consciousness leads them to recognize the superior morality of Ralph Nader, or the pure "scientific wisdom of chairman Bob Avakian," or the intellectual profundity of their favorite graffiti bomb: "If voting changed anything it would be illegal." Yeah, and if body piercings and anarchy tats changed anything, they would be too, and then what would some folks do to be "different?" (Note: there is nothing wrong with either type of adornment, but getting either or both doesn't make you a revolutionary, any more than voting, that's all I'm saying).
These are people who think being agitators is about pissing people off more than reaching out to them. So they pull out their "Buck Fush" signs at their repetitively irrelevant antiwar demonstrations, or their posters with W sporting a Hitler mustache, because that tends to work so well at convincing folks to oppose the slaughter in Iraq. But effectiveness isn't what matters to them. What matters to them is raging against the machine for the sake of rage itself. Their message is simple: everything sucks, the earth is doomed, all cops are brutal, all soldiers are baby-killers, all people who work for corporations are evil, blah, blah, blah, right on down the line. It's as if much of the left has become co-dependent with despondency, addicted to its own isolation, and enamored of its moral purity and unwillingness to work with mere liberals. In the name of ideological asceticism, they spurn the hard work of movement building and inspiring others to join the struggle, snicker at those foolish enough to not understand or appreciate their superior philosophical constructs, and then act shocked when their movements and groups accomplish exactly nothing. But honestly, who wants to join a movement filled with people who look down on you as a sucker?
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Posted by: -matti on Nov 26, 2008 1:22 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I find many things in the incipient Obama Administration that I approve of. And I find several tendencies in the incipient Obama Administration that I disapprove of.
After several months of being told "Silence, this is the best you can get!" I'm a little wary of being told "Silence you're spoiling the fun!".
There's still a hellava lot of work to be done kids. Those that are skeptical should be convinced by EXAMPLE not rhetoric.
-matti.
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» RE: Woo hoo Obama! Am I now allowed to speak?
Posted by: EKSwitaj
» I agree. It seems aimed more at surppressing expression than...
Posted by: -matti
» RE: I agree. It seems aimed more at surppressing expression than...
Posted by: Marina in Paris
» How any American can be a cynic with regard to this election...
Posted by: Bliss Doubt
» RE: How any American can be a cynic with regard to this election...
Posted by: bluepilgrim
» Oh, dear, the blind faith religious right has spoken.
Posted by: Prophit
» Boy, that was my first reaction..... didn't this also happen....
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: Boy, that was my first reaction..... didn't this also happen....
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: Boy, that was my first reaction.....[Poor Prophit,
Posted by: Squarehead
» RE: Boy, that was my first reaction.....[Poor Prophit,
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: Woo hoo Obama! Am I now allowed to speak?
Posted by: Shey
» Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: -matti
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Squarehead
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Aimleft
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Lauren
» LOL!!! Thanks for the warning, Lauren.
Posted by: Aimleft
» RE: LOL!!! Thanks for the warning, Lauren.
Posted by: Longdream
» Oh, so now anyone who is clear headed about what Obama will or won't do
Posted by: Bliss Doubt
» RE: how can ANYONE (including Obama) predict what Omama will or won't do?
Posted by: Longdream
» No lie, this reminds me of the Bush supporters after he began...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: No lie, this reminds me of the Bush supporters after he began...
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: Oh, so now anyone who is clear headed about what Obama will or won't do
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: I love you, Lauren.
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Longdream
» Truth does that to ya. It hurts.
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: Woo hoo Obama! Am I now allowed to speak?
Posted by: 2thepoint
» Sorry, but it was Daily Kos and Moveon.org "types"
Posted by: Aimleft
» RE: Sorry, but it was Daily Kos and Moveon.org "types"
Posted by: 2thepoint
» RE: Woo hoo Obama! Am I now allowed to speak?
Posted by: Longdream
» FOLLOW YOUR OWN RULES, please. . . .
Posted by: Beck
» Federal Reserve Rally
Posted by: Von
» I call it Mainstreamnet
Posted by: Bliss Doubt
» RE: I call it Mainstreamnet
Posted by: Quannah
» You've always been allowed to speak - let's see YOUR example
Posted by: leighsure
» RE: Woo hoo Obama! Am I now allowed to speak?
Posted by: Longdream
» Wise's Straw Man...
Posted by: jooljetkmae
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Posted by: sibadd on Nov 26, 2008 1:31 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
No-one can donate the labour of democracy to one leader. Obama's there because so many *did* labour, because 1000s didn't play the non-politics of 'everything sucks'. This man says the problems you (and we, in Europe) face are enormous. He tells it like it is but intelligently, not conjuring monsters. You are so right. He spreads hope and its possibilities - and not just in the USA. Look after this man for us, Americans. The name of that street where I met those old yanks in the camper van is 'Odos Dimokratias'.
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» RE: Simon Baddeley
Posted by: Shey
» RE: Oh such high talk from a Briton. Britain, most destruction force in human history!
Posted by: Spot
» RE: Oh such high talk from a Briton. Britain, most destruction force in human history!
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: Oh such high talk from a Briton. Britain, most destruction force in human history!
Posted by: javajoe
» RE: Oh such high talk from a Briton. Britain, most destruction force in human history!
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: Simon Baddeley
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: Simon Baddeley
Posted by: turtleposer
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Suzon on Nov 26, 2008 1:58 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It's up to us to support moves which are progressive. In fact, we should make it clear that what we want is constitutional fundamentalism!
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» I, as a Nader Supporter, spit out your bait.
Posted by: -matti
» No, independents have voted Democrat while no one was looking
Posted by: Beck
» RE: No, independents have voted Democrat while no one was looking
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: No, independents have voted Democrat while no one was looking
Posted by: Longdream
» please note that I referred to "some" not "all" Nader supporters
Posted by: Suzon
» RE: why did this make me think of Nader and some of his supporters? because it described them.
Posted by: Beck
Comments are closed-
Posted by: flowerguerrilla on Nov 26, 2008 2:03 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I love seeing a black man walking up to a place of power. That is a beautiful dream come true. But to celebrate 'victory' without doing...something!...is civil dereliction.
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» RE: We HOPE Obama will CHANGE his cabinet!
Posted by: douglashoyt
» RE: We HOPE Obama will CHANGE his cabinet!
Posted by: RedWalt67
» RE: We HOPE Obama will CHANGE his cabinet!
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: We HOPE Obama will CHANGE his cabinet!
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: We HOPE Obama will CHANGE his cabinet!
Posted by: Spot
» It's the author of the article who brought out the black president meme
Posted by: Bliss Doubt
» RE: We HOPE Obama will CHANGE his cabinet!
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: We HOPE Obama will CHANGE his cabinet!
Posted by: Spot
» RE: We HOPE Obama will CHANGE his cabinet!
Posted by: Longdream
Comments are closed-
Posted by: RHad on Nov 26, 2008 2:15 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Blank pages.
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» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis?
Posted by: Shey
» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis?
Posted by: writer7
» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis?
Posted by: babs
» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis?
Posted by: writer7
» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis? Yeah, funny that this followed so many "everything sucks"
Posted by: Beck
» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis? Exactly...
Posted by: Allstar Cookie
» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis? Exactly...
Posted by: Spot
» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis?--EXACTLY!!
Posted by: slugsucker
» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis?
Posted by: YogiBear
» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis?
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis?
Posted by: Raptor
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Posted by: Ashoka911 on Nov 26, 2008 2:19 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
http://change.gov/
This is our chance. Back seat quarterbacks? PLEASE....Get in there an DO something. Yes there will be people we dont agree with (Democracy is messy)
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» RE: This is a good article. Great article. And Democracy and life and politics are all messy
Posted by: Beck
» RE: This is a good article
Posted by: RedWalt67
» RE: This is a good article
Posted by: leTerrassier
» yes, we have to stop complaining and put the pressure on
Posted by: Suzon
» he doesnt have to balance anything.
Posted by: rafaeltoral
» RE: he doesnt have to balance anything.
Posted by: Lauren
» RE: he doesnt have to balance anything.
Posted by: leTerrassier
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Iraan Ozono on Nov 26, 2008 2:24 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Yay!
Now - What kind of president is he going to be?
It's not looking not so good, progressive-change-wise.
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» RE: YayBoo! It is looking good, if you can look and see
Posted by: Beck
» RE: YayBoo!
Posted by: babs
» Reality vs. "meth"
Posted by: Iraan Ozono
» RE: YayBoo!
Posted by: Raptor
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Posted by: gunboat diplomat on Nov 26, 2008 2:27 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: In a word: NAFTA.
Posted by: Shey
» If the public doesn't pressure Obama, the corporate lobbyists will be all he hears
Posted by: gunboat diplomat
» RE: If the public doesn't pressure Obama, the corporate lobbyists will be all he hears
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: If the public doesn't pressure Obama, the corporate lobbyists will be all he hears
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: If the public doesn't pressure Obama, the corporate lobbyists will be all he hears
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: If the public doesn't pressure Obama, the corporate lobbyists will be all he hears
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: If the public doesn't pressure Obama, the corporate lobbyists will be all he hears
Posted by: Quannah
» The world as seen through UChicago economic glasses: NAFTA leads to wealth creation
Posted by: gunboat diplomat
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Posted by: writerman on Nov 26, 2008 2:28 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Now, instead of mobilizing millions for real change, Obama is doing the opposite. His supporters are being de-mobilized, calmed down, told to return to their homes and leave the streets to those who own them. That's what his appoinments signify. The return of the Democratic Party's establishment to power, after the party's grass roots and the electorate regected them and voted for hope and change. Didn't happen.
The king is dead, long live the king.
What does that phrase really mean? It means that the king may change. They come and they go, but the role/office/position remains the same, the system continues, stability remains, there is continuity of purpose. This isn't cynicism. It's a fact. A realistic assessment of how the political machine functions.
The campaign ritual is full of ritualised fighting, almost like professional wrestling. The passionate rhetoric almost never gains traction in the real world once the election is over. The promisses are rarely kept. This is harsh, but true.
The most one can hope for in relation to Obama is that he's as "good" a president as Bill Clinton was, is that asking for too little or too much? After all he's surrounded by Clinton's people, even though the Democratic Party's activists and supporters regected them in favour of Obama, seems a bit strange to me though.
Let's just hope for change in one crucial area; that Obama doesn't escalate in Afghanistan and send an even bigger army to a lost war; and more importantly, that he doesn't start a new war with Iran. If he manages to avoid these bear traps, he'll be doing well and should be supported.
Not really asking much, am I? And then there was the little detail of stopping the economy sliding into a second Great Depression.
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» RE: The Man or the Movement?
Posted by: Shey
» RE: The Man or the Movement?
Posted by: writerman
» RE: The Man or the Movement?
Posted by: douglashoyt
» Full of it
Posted by: Aimleft
» RE: Full of it
Posted by: Spot
» RE: The Man or the Movement?
Posted by: Longdream
» Yeah, and they can continue with their bitching
Posted by: Aimleft
» As "good" as Clinton? Asking too little!
Posted by: leighsure
Comments are closed-
Posted by: eridani on Nov 26, 2008 2:42 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: Given that I spent most of my severance pay time--
Posted by: Shey
» RE: Lots of Silly Me's
Posted by: americansheep
» RE: Lots of Silly Me's
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: Given that I spent most of my severance pay time--
Posted by: annavan1
» If you take the trouble to gripe in a way that matters
Posted by: Beck
» Dingbat lady strikes again !
Posted by: maxpayne
» Max, as a fan, please . . .
Posted by: Scientz
» Beck's no dingbat
Posted by: westomoon
» RE: Beck's no dingbat
Posted by: maxpayne
» RE: Beck's no dingbat
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: Beck's no dingbat
Posted by: westomoon
» RE: Beck's no dingbat
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: Beck's no dingbat
Posted by: westomoon
» RE: Beck's no dingbat
Posted by: Quannah
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Posted by: Shey on Nov 26, 2008 2:52 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"...the political equivalent of Quaaludes". That's priceless, and so true.
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» RE: Thank you AlterNet
Posted by: bluepilgrim
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Posted by: Marina in Paris on Nov 26, 2008 3:53 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
For me the key sentence in this piece is "At some point, the left will have to relinquish its love affair with marginalization."
As long as (we) the (fuzzy) left remain intent on being marginal for reasons of purity, those who have been in command of things with the support of majorities and of defaulting marginals, we are cooked.
No one gets to be president (and therefore in a position of significant power) anywhere by being a pure ideologue. So if we insist on purity and cop out, "they" will be defining who lives and who dies in "their" world (no matter that they are destroying the livelihood of human beings).
It's high time for us to take the chance and jump into what might become majority thinking, i.e., which itself can only survive if it preserves its biodiversity.
If intention counts (and quantum physics says it does), then Obama's consensus-building intention (until proven otherwise) is a good bet in that direction.
Thank you for this contribution, well put.
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» RE: If we want to survive as a human species, the only way...
Posted by: Beck
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Posted by: bluepilgrim on Nov 26, 2008 3:54 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Those who object to what Obama has done so far are to be compared to Stalinists (or 'Stalinoids' -- what that's supposed to mean). "Barbituate lefties"? Hmmm... I guess we can expect to see a new ad hominem attacks now that the Limbaughs are receeding a bit. And who is this "we on the left" -- did I miss something -- that I had to join a union or get a membership card or something? Oh -- maybe it's that I forgot to sign up in Obama's army. Funny -- somehow it feels like *I'm* being marginalized for not waving the Obama banner (and by proxie the Clinton banner -- nothing new there, either -- just more progressive bashing: it's a recurring nuisance, like fleas in the Summer and raccoons in the Autumn).
Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad and reveling in loyality; it's made by forming coalitions over specific principles, goals and policies -- and so far Obama is falling short. Not unexpected, of course, but people had better understand what the situation is: we have a bit more political space to work in, not a 'fearless leader' we should follow.
We've taken a step back from the abyss, and there is much more to do, and it will take a lot of time and work to do it. Understanding that is not cynicism or anger, and it's not being a Stalinist (or a Marxist) on barbituates.
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» RE: What's the deal?
Posted by: Marina in Paris
» RE: What's the deal?
Posted by: bluepilgrim
» RE: What's the deal?
Posted by: msegedy
» joining the Obama fan club is "more dangerous than anything"?
Posted by: Suzon
» RE: What's the deal?
Posted by: Beck
» Thanks for a reasoned perspective
Posted by: annavan1
Comments are closed-
Posted by: jnelson4765 on Nov 26, 2008 4:14 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I was considered persona non grata for becoming a shop steward. After all, the unions are just another way to keep the workers contained, or some s**t like that.
Didn't see a single one of them in the huge effort many radicals, progressives, liberals, centrists, libertarians, fiscal conservatives, and people of no ideology in particular made to turn Virginia Democratic. Of course, that would have soiled their precious ideals. So, they can point to the failures of the Obama administration with glee, secure that they never soiled their hands with it.
Of course, they'll claim credit for any achievements. Or complain that it didn't go far enough. Because compromise is a dirty word.
It's good to see someone else who has noticed these same trends and is just as sick of the BS of it all.
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» RE: Thank you for writing this
Posted by: babs
» Another "hear, hear"
Posted by: westomoon
» RE: Thank YOU for writing this!
Posted by: Longdream
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Red Emma on Nov 26, 2008 4:54 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
GOOD NEWS: people did NOT shut up about JOHN BRENNAN (an Obama advisor on inteliigence & national security) part of Bush -Cheny "ontelligence" who SUPPORTS TRRTURE & RENDITION. It was announced this morning that Brennan WILL NOT take any positon in Obama Administration--due to outcry about his positions.
Is there a middle path" between just being a (silenced) Obama cheerleader & being seen as the "barbituate Leftist" Wise describes?
Of course, it's a blow against white supremacy that Obama was elected--but, it's also reasonable to ask: Will Obama DO anything for actual people of color--like address the DISPARITIES in EVERY aspect of life from income to health care access to being disproportionatley incarcerated?"
The anti-war movement was vdry significant in getting Obama nominated and then.,elected? Is it too much to ask that he actualy END US OCCUPATION OF IRAQ?(& NOT just re-deploy those soldiers elsewhere)?
No one expects a leftist revolutiona from Obama, but, it would be nice if SOME of his actions matched his campaign rhetoric.
Brennan's exit proves thAT WE MUST RAISE OUR VOICES WITH DEMANDS--not just cheer wildly for Obama as a beautiful symbol. It's NOT "being negative" tomake demands on Obama.
It's the reason FDR pushed the New Deal--people made their voices heard.
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» RE: OBAMA'S TORTURE ADVOCATE OUT
Posted by: Pissed Off Woman
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Posted by: timwise on Nov 26, 2008 5:09 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» But you wrote this:
Posted by: kegbot1
» Explain Your Logic
Posted by: pdxjoe
» And we're not all unhappy, miserable people
Posted by: WhuThe?!?
» RE: And we're not all unhappy, miserable people
Posted by: leighsure
» Yeah, AlterNet sensationalizes their headlines . . .
Posted by: Scientz
» Misspells 'em, too
Posted by: westomoon
» RE: Yeah, AlterNet sensationalizes their headlines . . .
Posted by: fanny666
» But still a GREAT article!
Posted by: zooeyhall
» Alternet has a very bad record when it comes to distorting titles.
Posted by: gunboat diplomat
» Compassion is a more constructive force than anger, even if it doesn't sell copy.
Posted by: stellabloo
» RE: Compassion is a more constructive force than anger, even if it doesn't sell copy.
Posted by: maxpayne
» Max, you know the only good corporation is a dead one!
Posted by: stellabloo
» RE: This was NOT my chosen title for this piece
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: This was NOT my chosen title for this piece
Posted by: BobJ
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Purple Girl on Nov 26, 2008 5:17 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I have never thought Obama a far left 'Liberal', but certainly farther 'left' then any other 'Top Tier' choice ( Both Hillary & Edwards are DLC....The Blue arm of the Corporationist Party)
Have I been 'thrilled' by some of his Choice for Cabinet memebers ...NO, esp the possiblity of Hillary as Sec of State- She terrifies me as much as Cheney!
But what Obama has done is Proven to these Political Assholes that the People can become a Force to be reckoned with.We have proven that 'Religion' is not the only thing which can invoke participation in our democratic process...So can Hope..Fueled with a good dose of Anger and Outrage regarding How Things SHOULD be.
Having been conned by the Clintons twice, I am a little leary of 'blind faith' when it comes to Obama & his future admin...But I still retain the Hope I won't get 'Fooled Again'.
Frankly I am sick of People trying to convert every one to Christianity as much as I am sick of people trying to convert Humanity to Veganism. Both are Unattainable because they are innately Impossible. People find Inner strength in various ways so getting Us all to agree on Philososphy is ridiculous. Same For the PETA folks, some of Us like meat,dairy,eggs and to make this quest even more ill fated is the fact We are Designed as a species to be Omnivores- both plant & animal. Our forward eyes, opposable thumbs, larger brain and planning abilities and msot notably our digestive systems (we have no cecum,Kiddo's).
what I fear is that the far left will feel they must keep up their never ending descent to prove they're 'intellectual' superiority to the same extent the Relgious 'right' proclaimed their self anointment as 'Spiritually' superiors.
What is 'Fringe' ..that which hangs off either side of the adult negotiation table cloth, but never actually protects the table. ya know the part of the table cloth that gets caught when sit down and pulls the rest of the cloth and the contents on the table off in a disasterous clatter.Ya Know the part of the Table cloth that gets in the way and can cause havoc to an other wise beautiful 'Thanksgiving' Table.
the Far Left should be thankful....We bet McCain and his Puppet masters. Now lets sit down and figure how to enjoy the bountiful feast of possiblities we have before US.
If You are not part of the Solution,Than You are part of the Problem.
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» RE: Constructive Criticism is good, Self Righteousness is not
Posted by: Moodotv
» RE: Constructive Criticism is good, Self Righteousness is not
Posted by: babs
» No thanks, I'll remain vegetarian...
Posted by: WhuThe?!?
» RE: Constructive Criticism is good, Self Righteousness is not
Posted by: Bliss Doubt
» I've had the same experience...
Posted by: WhuThe?!?
» RE: Constructive Criticism is good, Self Righteousness is not
Posted by: Longdream
» What was that?
Posted by: annavan1
Comments are closed-
Posted by: uncleeddie on Nov 26, 2008 5:24 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» Your commentary deserves a 6!
Posted by: WhuThe?!?
» Amen, brother
Posted by: annavan1
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Posted by: Sherry M. on Nov 26, 2008 5:27 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: Nightstallion on Nov 26, 2008 5:27 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» Um, dude? We're already at war with Afghanistan . . .
Posted by: Scientz
» RE: Um, dude? We're already at war with Afghanistan . . .
Posted by: Nightstallion
» Then you're an idiot.
Posted by: Scientz
» RE: Um, dude? We're already at war with Afghanistan . . .
Posted by: Nightstallion
» RE: Um, dude? We're already at war with Afghanistan . . .
Posted by: Nightstallion
» RE: Yeah, we get it.
Posted by: Longdream
Comments are closed-
Posted by: mrsanfran on Nov 26, 2008 5:40 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We are going to keep a close eye on Obama and make sure we scream to the high heavens when he mirrors the Bush-neocon agenda. His picks
are fine from a competency standpoint. The only question is whether he will demand they
dance to the tune of a new progressive agenda,
or whether they will fall into the same old patterns which helped get us here.
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Posted by: douglashoyt on Nov 26, 2008 5:58 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Many of us saw that Mr. Obama was running as a progressive for change, but his record screamed that he is a DLC conservative Clintonista. Now that his appointments are confirming our pre election knowledge, we are telling you that you have been snookered.
We use strong language, because you are so very hard headed that normal rational discourse does not seem to get through your thick sculls.
Self reflection is something you are not accustomed too; because the truth hurts.
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» RE: You Can't Stand the Truth.
Posted by: Beck
» Dingbat lady PERSECUTES third parties yet again !
Posted by: maxpayne
» RE: Dingbat lady PERSECUTES [Time for a little wise-up, max.
Posted by: Squarehead
» Truth is Obama is not McCain
Posted by: gar1948
» You Can't Stand to let go of anger
Posted by: leighsure
» RE: You Can't Stand the Truth.
Posted by: Longdream
» Room Temperature IQ
Posted by: leighsure
» RE: Room Temperature IQ
Posted by: Longdream
» We need a rating for "LOL"
Posted by: westomoon
» RE: We need a rating for "LOL"
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: We need a rating for "LOL"
Posted by: westomoon
» RE: You Can't Stand the Truth.
Posted by: Squarehead
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Bob Horn on Nov 26, 2008 5:57 AM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: On one hand and on the other
Posted by: douglashoyt
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Posted by: using on Nov 26, 2008 6:01 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
i do agree....
the question is: what to do about it? We believed that there was hope in audiacity...if we could see it and believe it ... we could make it happen.
It is true...it is hard to reach the silly me's.....even after they feel it -- it is hard for them to see....how can we..who are not silly me's ..but do not have the power....who infact have a great sense of humor..about life...and want to help create a better world......
There are so many more of us...then of them......HOW CAN WE......FIND A PLAN TO INFLUENCE THE GOVERNMENT IN PROTECT OUR BEST INTERESTS?
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Posted by: douglashoyt on Nov 26, 2008 6:09 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Tangentially, elections are about social issues which may affect only small subgroups within a society.
Being bi-racial is not one issue which is that very important to most in this society, compared to the big issues facing us all, today.
Remember, polls suggested that people were voting on the economy not, racism in this election.
The world is not all about you.
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Posted by: Nightstallion on Nov 26, 2008 6:13 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: I note that as long as we all go along with the RAH RAH shit we get high rating marks.
Posted by: Nightstallion
» RE: I note that as long as we all go along with the RAH RAH shit we get high rating marks.
Posted by: Quannah
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Posted by: Nightstallion on Nov 26, 2008 6:31 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: Adastra on Nov 26, 2008 6:31 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I have a bit of a problem with much of this discussion. There seems to be a lot of concern over what Barak Obama will do or won't do once he's in office. This view ignores the one truly important lesson we should take from his campaign. Our concern should now be over what we, the people, will do or won't do once the next President is sworn in. It isn't finally up to any President, any administration, any Congress to protect our rights and get the nation back on track. It's up to us and if the effort fails, we can only blame ourselves. Hey, folks, let's avoid setting up Obama, in advance, as a scapegoat for anything that might or can go wrong. It's our collective responsibility to see that things go right.
And we shouldn't be afraid to dance now and then.
With love under will,
Bob, Adastra,
The Wizzard of Jacksonville
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» RE: As a line from my favorite movie goes. . .
Posted by: using
» RE: As a line from my favorite movie goes. . .
Posted by: leighsure
» RE: As a line from my favorite movie goes. . .
Posted by: Longdream
Comments are closed-
Posted by: peakoiler on Nov 26, 2008 6:34 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: marcosmeconi on Nov 26, 2008 6:43 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
most of the criticisms placed on obama on this site and from the left in general are based on facts and genuine concerns: that underneath a cosmetic surface of "change" there is just more market-based neoliberalism. his early cabinet choices strongly support this concern.
what am i to do? just look the other way?
i'm going back to my pablo neruda LP's now lighting incense and drinking mate...
HASTA LA VICTORIA SIEMPRE!
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» RE: dude don't mess with the avakian....
Posted by: Spot
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Posted by: ernieervin on Nov 26, 2008 6:44 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Is Obama against US imperialism? No. Would he use the US military to kill poor people for US power. Yes.
Is Obama against financial capitalist elites raiding the US treasury, leading to declining standards of living for most Americans. No, he supportsit.
Will Obama allow the US to be structurally adjusted like a third world country so the elite can prosper as the mass sits in food lines? Yes.
Geithner, strangled East Asia. Volcker, strangled the US people with double digit interest rates. Summers, brought a violent mafia to power in Russia...
America, we are screwed, and Obama is in on it.
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» RE: This was painful to read and of course
Posted by: collins101
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Posted by: MsFeasance on Nov 26, 2008 6:46 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Wouldn't "toxic" have worked just as well?
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» RE: Nice headline.
Posted by: Longdream
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Beck on Nov 26, 2008 6:56 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I didn't realize this about third party supporters until a few months ago. Like the scenario described in the article, someone loving an obscure band until that band makes it big, I think the biggest letdown in the world would be a third party candidate winning. I think it would bring desolation to many who supported that person, and they'd find someone else marginal very quickly.
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» well said, Beck, another high five...
Posted by: Suzon
» This opera sounds so familiar!
Posted by: Bliss Doubt
» Congratulations Beck
Posted by: Bliss Doubt
» RE: "obscurity is the true measure of integrity"
Posted by: Longdream
Comments are closed-
Posted by: using on Nov 26, 2008 6:48 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Maybe the people Obama took into his cabinet can change. After all, Bobby Kennedy was for the war...until he realized his error. And William F. Buckley Jr supported smoking until he testified that "We should be tried like the Nazi war criminals"
However, the Obama switch from words to action:
1. transparency to oversight...to business as usual
2. giving money to the banks without investigating needs and plans and making iron clad regulatioins...and open information so the we, the people, could atleast try to protect ourselves...True, Bush is still president. However, before Obama's election there was clear condemnation for the Bush decisions that caused the downward spiriling of our economy. After the election...silence.....as the money rolls out. And our Bankers stand before our senators and say: "ofcuase we will give ourselves bonuses...after all we are not using the Taxpayers money...we are using the bank's money."
STill no word....no action...from the Obama group. THese are clear signs..to come down from the high and get serious about what change means...are they not?
ENjoying ones young children is truely a joyous experience that puts happy face on life -- as long as one does not have to face the fear that they will not have food to eat or a homeless shelter to spend the night.
I worked to rid the horizon of the Bush/chenney clan...and elect Obama.....I am wondering..is it possible that Obama is not so much a victory over prejudice as a clean cut, intelligent, Harvard crdentialed, face clocking the closed doors in which our history is decided, as William F Buckley Jr was the face of young conservatives?
Example of a face: the open Martha Steward trial played out before our very eyes, while the ENron trial took place in the back rooms with the doors shut. Oh and did you notice, Martha Stewart is now bigger than ever. What could be funnier?? too bad the jokes on us.
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Posted by: douglashoyt on Nov 26, 2008 7:34 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
You have no understanding, like many on this site, of the significance of this election.
The significance is that it is the same old game with different puppet masters.
If you would like to "think outside the box" go here and read Mr. Chompsky on Democracy Now.
http://www.democracynow.org
/2008/11/24/noam_chomsky_what_next_the_elections
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» RE: If you want a new perspective on politics...
Posted by: Elixabeth
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Posted by: maxpayne on Nov 26, 2008 7:34 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: Well? He beat Mccain by about 9 million.
Posted by: beijaflor
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Posted by: peacelf on Nov 26, 2008 7:39 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: Progressivism is HOPE
Posted by: Quannah
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Posted by: mwildfire on Nov 26, 2008 7:44 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I haven't personally known many commies, but I find the characterization apt: you see them handing out their shrill literature at every peace march, and setting up book stalls at events--I noticed at the World Social Forum in Brazil in 2002 that they were always the first to arrive in the morning and the last to leave. A grim and joyless bunch--like any fundamentalists, NOT like any leftists. There were billboards there urging the people (in Portuguese, of course) Use Your Mouth to Fight Fundamentalism. They were talking primarily about market fundamentalism--neoliberalism. I wondered if they realized that there is another kind of financial fundamentalism--communism. Any time you get people determined to protect and advance the Ten True Things, you have fundamentalism and such people have a lot in common regardless of which religion or economic philosophy they're pushing. But these attitudes hardly characterize the entire Left.
These are desperate times, with enormous multiple crises facing the world. We have dithered so long on dealing with climate change (thank you President Harken and VP Halliburton) that now if we are to preserve a planet for our grandchildren fit to love on, we must make extreme, drastic changes immediately. Oil is peaking right about now, adding urgency to the need to transition off fossil fuels. Then there's the financial turmoil resulting from putting bank robbers in charge. Is it even possible for any president to cope with such problems simultaneously?
A leader capable of pulling that off would have to be extremely intelligent, have excellent judgment, be sufficiently articulate to persuade the American people of the necessity of the drastic changes we must begin making, and have the capacity to unite this divided country. Obama shows all of these qualities--which is why it's so frustrating seeing him blowing it with appointments that indicate we will have only cosmetic changes (although he's doing better in the realm of Energy/Environment than either the economy or foreign affairs). I seriously suspect that the Powers That Be have implanted him, his wife and his kids with little chips they can key at any time should he balk at his orders...although I must admit there were signs long ago that he's anything but a progressive.
Still, the movement he ignited, the naive (yes I said it and I'll say it again if I feel like it) young people may become a force to be reckoned with, people who will demand the change he promised. But this will only happen if we don't allow the likes of this author to persuade us we ought to shut up.
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» Amen!
Posted by: WhuThe?!?
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Posted by: wellaware lec on Nov 26, 2008 7:50 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
For those few that I haven't yet lost in the reading of this, I recommend you read Lynn McTaggart's book THE INTENTION EXPERIMENT and THE FIELD. And if you want to join the work she is helping to facilitate for factual global change in positive directions, go to the Global Coherence Initiative or type in Lynn McTaggart Intention Experiment and it will get you on the right track. About 15,000 of us recently did an 8 day experiment with our focus on northern Sri Lanka and after painstaking analysis, we apparently made a very significant difference in the intensity of violence there.
POLITICAL steering of group mind is, along with other steerings like religion, using this field constantly, but never talks about it for what it is, and group mind showed factual, measurable power through Obama's campaign and ensuing election. There was factual evidence of global group mind right after 9-11 also---demonstrated through Dean Radin/Roger Nelson's work from Princeton University. Evidence of some huge global group mind focus began hours prior to 9-11 series of happenings...I have yet to see this covered even within the groups trying for as much factual truth as possible about the 9-11 travesties...I find that interesting...
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» RE: COMPLETELY MISSING, WORTH STRONG CONSIDERATION...
Posted by: beijaflor
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Posted by: MobileSucks on Nov 26, 2008 7:58 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: another article telling you to shut-up, from a liberal
Posted by: babs
» RE: another article telling you to shut-up, from a liberal
Posted by: Quannah
» Ohh that is soo clever and funny! Heeeeheee
Posted by: MobileSucks
» RE: Ohh that is soo clever and funny! Heeeeheee
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: Ohh that is soo clever and funny! Heeeeheee
Posted by: MobileSucks
» RE: Ohh that is soo clever and funny! Heeeeheee
Posted by: Quannah
Comments are closed-
Posted by: gunboat diplomat on Nov 26, 2008 8:00 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Every single one of his economic appointments is a dedicated corporate neoliberal.
Under the neoliberal system, international corporations make the decisions and governments implement them. It's a fundamentally antidemocratic agenda that only benefits entrenched corporate interests, who have no real interest in environmental protections, social justice, fair labor laws, or anything like that - they just want to maximize profits, period.
So far, all indications are that Obama fits the mold - just another Carter, in other words. If he keeps this up, his administration will be a total failure. It's easy to view the economic picks as a repudiation of the entire campaign, isn't it?
"Change we can believe in!"
"Yes, that DOES mean Larry Summers!"
Just say it with confidence and authority, right?
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» RE: Obama is a corporate neoliberal, by all appearances.
Posted by: Spot
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Posted by: ABetterFuture on Nov 26, 2008 8:13 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Obama was a better candidate, among the two that we effectively get to pick from, because we allow the two machines exclude all other choices first and foremost.
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Posted by: 876 on Nov 26, 2008 8:16 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: Coleman on Nov 26, 2008 8:36 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Second, everyone's going to go home and go back to work because that's the only path available to them. There was zero, literally zero, effort to organize the people who worked on the campaign - who supported the campaign with their sweat and dollars - into a real expression of democratic will, a real political power beyond the stage play of electoral politics. Aside from a minuscule number of positions in the government, there's nothing left for the liberal to do. Whose fault is that? Some phantom, marginalized, militant American Left? Some snarky commenters on internet message boards? No, it's the normal run of capitalist liberal democracy.
Finally, if you take equality and freedom as your axioms, as the very principles of your worldview, you reject the world as it is and its absolute injustice. Leftists have, correctly, located the source of that injustice in our managed two-party system of capitalist liberal democracy. If you have an argument to refute that I'd love to hear it.
Why must I refrain from the harshest of criticism? Haven't the Democrats had a majority in congress for two years? Haven't they had the power of the purse? Hasn't President Bush been unpopular for that time? Haven't we seen an escalation of war and a policies of complete disdain for ordinary working people while speculative capitalists are given every concession?
Why must I even wait until Obama gets into office? He's proposing his government's ideas and it's our right to criticize them. When he starts implementing them I'll criticize his government's implementation. In the meantime I'm trying to survive the recession.
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» Everyone needs to read this great comment by Coleman
Posted by: chlamor
» Your Criticism or Your Vote!
Posted by: pdxjoe
» My Criticism AND my Vote.
Posted by: Coleman
» Check out Democracy for America
Posted by: westomoon
» Thank you for the suggestion!
Posted by: Coleman
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Posted by: rafaeltoral on Nov 26, 2008 8:38 AM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
You are so easily fooled and manipulated. You chose between two of the same. One a crusty old war vet puppet, the other a half black articulate puppet.
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» RE: you people are Negative!
Posted by: beijaflor
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Posted by: chlamor on Nov 26, 2008 8:40 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Galeano (and Tim Wise?) doesn't seem to recall that Afro-Americans can be mass murderers too. Condi is a killer and Barack's big booster Colin Powell once obligated the United National Security Council to cover up a reproduction of Picasso's "Gernika" before he could lie that contaminated body in the eye about Saddam's make-believe WMDs and jumpstart a war that has now taken a million Iraqi lives. So far. The bloodletting has hardly abated.
We are in garbage time. The adulatory garbage being spewed about the virtues of Barrack Obama are a toxic trick on the peoples of the earth.
One glaring recent example: 100,000 marched from sea to shining sea in the U.S. last weekend (Nov. 16th) in support of same sex marriage and no one had the moxie to even mention that Barack Obama does not support same sex marriage.
False Messiahs are made to be unmasked. Anyone who aspires to be the maximum capo of the world's most homicidal on-going criminal conspiracy is just that, a criminal. Barack Obama is a war criminal-in-waiting masquerading as a peace candidate on the pretext that he will move the Yanqui troops two wars to the east to massacre civilians who did not vote for him. I am not fooled.
LINK
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» RE: False messiahs are made to be unmasked-Touched a sore nerve?
Posted by: slugsucker
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Posted by: BlueBerry PickN on Nov 26, 2008 8:50 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I'm so tired of people who seek the f*cking 'Great Leader' to do all their work for them...
"everything IS FINE NOW"
you'd better hope that man is all he's cracked up to be.
Just remember, he has to placate the military, the financial powerbrokers & the SIXTEEN INTELLIGENCE SERVICES...
those who don't? find themselves looking at the Kennedys as a Cautionary Tale.
wake up. if the PEOPLE don't establish themselves as a power, then why would anybody CARE about meeting the Human Rights movement if MONEY & POWER are the only ones at the Table?
you gave up ALMOST EVERYTHING because:
"we can't ask for what we want because HILARY might get in!"
"we can't ask for what we want because a Republican might get in..."
well, you got what you asked for... PRECIOUS LITTLE.
Nice job interview process, folks. 'The Apprentice' is more demanding than liberals. BUT THEN, MONEY & POWER KNOW HOW TO GET WHAT THEY WANT, right?
enjoy Afghanistan...
you might want to ask yourself... "did we get what we wanted? or what we were told was 'enough'... Obama didn't have Kucinich's platforms, now is he?
For a nation that likes strutting around telling the Rest of the World, 'how its gonna be, because 'we're Number One!',' you sure don't have two clues to rub together...
Spread Love, not corporate dependence...
BlueBerry Pick'n
can be found @
ThisCanadian
~~~
"... tolerance of intolerance is cowardice..." ~ Ayaan Hirsi Ali.
"We, two, form a Multitude" ~ Ovid.
"Violence can only be concealed by a Lie, & the Lie can only be maintained by Violence." ... "Any man, who has once proclaimed Violence as his Method, is inevitably forced to take the Lie as his Principle" – Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn
Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities." - Voltaire
~~~
"Silent Freedom is Freedom Silenced"
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» RE: about as LIBERAL as Eisenhower...
Posted by: babs
» RE: about as LIBERAL as Eisenhower...
Posted by: animalleaderisgreat
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Posted by: happytklz on Nov 26, 2008 8:53 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The left, or part of it, understood this in the 70's, and many cooperative businesses and effective advocacy groups were born out of the hard work and commitment of this diverse group of people. A group which, by the way, ranged from secular academics to Jews with a social justice bent to denominational Christians who take the Gospel seriously.
We need to stop arguing so freaking much over who is perfectly right and look around where we are, for allies and for people who need help. Change comes, sometimes almost unnoticed, when people have a choice. A choice for a little more control, a little more freedom, a little more voice, a little more joy.
Look where you are... Washington is not the center of the universe.
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» right on...
Posted by: Suzon
» RE: long long road
Posted by: Spot
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Posted by: lproyect on Nov 26, 2008 8:57 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: Scruffy on Nov 26, 2008 9:01 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: slugsucker on Nov 26, 2008 9:32 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This part really hits the nail on the head. Stop taking yourselves so freaking seriously already! You know, the far-right feels it's on a mission from God and cannot rationally defend its viewpoints without invoking religious "Manifest Destiny." The far-left invokes the sacred anti-religion of Karl Marx in the same manner. They both lack the "humor" aspect of the ridiculous nature of man in his relationship with other men.
"The humorlessness of the far left -- to which I remain connected ideologically if not organizationally -- has always struck me as one of its greatest weaknesses. People like to laugh, they like to smile, they like to be joyful, and an awful lot of hardened leftists seem almost utterly incapable of doing any of these things. It's as if they have all taken a pledge that there should be no laughter until the revolution, or some such shit. No positivity, no hope, no happiness so long as people are still poor and exploited and being murdered by cops, and victimized by United States militarism, or performing as wage slaves for global capital, or eating meat, or driving cars. And they wonder why the left is so weak?"
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» The Palmer Raids
Posted by: chlamor
» RE: The Palmer Raids--Fascistic? or Party cleansing?
Posted by: slugsucker
» Aren't we bitter?
Posted by: WhuThe?!?
» RE: Aren't we bitter?--Thanks for proving Tim Wise right
Posted by: slugsucker
» Calling yourself "slugsucker" is an insult to hard working, intelligent slugs.
Posted by: GuitarBill
» Far left and far right are angry because centrists are indifferent to America's real problems
Posted by: Pissed Off Woman
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Posted by: jeffrey7 on Nov 26, 2008 9:34 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Yes there are millions of activists,myself included, and public spirited vlounteers looking towards the positive. It's Big O's recent Cabinet choices that have given more than a few us 'Old School Activist's' pause.
We see the 'Republicanizing' of an alledged 'Democratic' President-Elect. We've seen the 'bait and switch' before,so there are also millions of us that are watching very closely what Big O is doing. So far I've seen little in the way of difference,but then again he's not actually 'in office' yet.
I do hold out great hope for all of us to come together and straighten out the ills of the governance and there's a lot of ills to heal. It's up to the Elder Activists and Volunteers to help focus our younger brothers and sisters to be vigilant on making sure the
promises are kept. I've lived through 10 Presodents and not a one of them and the only 'promise' they kept was to send the young off to die somewhere other than at home of old age.
Yes,there are millions of us that are watching. We're willing to act too. We're looking to make sure the 'we' that needs to bring change to DC is really We the People and not a samll circle of 'friends' of Big O.
Yes we've taken a major step,as far as breaking the 'color' shield. It should have been done long ago. But that's not how things get done here. You have to cajole and wrangle your way collecting 'friends' that may or may not actually 'have your back'. So Young Mr. Obama truly needs the protection of all the people because he has fallen into a nest of vipers.
The message from Main St is 'We're sick of Killing of all kinds.' and " Don't bailout the greedy. That's what got them into trouble in the first place.', 'We want total healthcare for all citizens because the lax emission's laws have been slowly killing all of us for generations and most of the ailments we are forced to endure are from man-made pollutants'
and 'If you're going to stimulate my economy then you'd better think a hell of a lot more than $300 bucks!'
We want a governance that thinks about the needs of the People first.not second to industry or finance or the military. We want a governance that will 'Honor the veterans and Troops' by moving hard in the direction of Peace. A Peace that wasn't won by force of arms. We want a governance that would rather have a total disarmament global ideal than the advanceing of global fear through high tech
missle defense shields. We want a governance that is open and Honest, as much it would kill most of the DC'ers to be Honest but that's the best waty to save Democracy and exactly what's needed.
Yes there's millons of us watching. We don't think 'everything sucks' but we do believe the best governance is run by the People. It's the folks that want to convince you that the lefties really believe that,that you've got to look out for.
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» RE: YOU get a Big, Fat
Posted by: beijaflor
Comments are closed-
Posted by: gunboat diplomat on Nov 26, 2008 9:48 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This is hilarious. Bush gave that token pick to Mineta, the transportation secretary. Obama gives it to Gates, the guy in charge of keeping troops in Iraq. The only reason to keep troops in Iraq is to secure the oil deals - the troops are what fuels the insurgency. Just long enough to get a U.S.-friendly version of Saddam back in power - same old thing.
"Change we can believe in!"
I wonder if Obama will be so pleased about the wonderful internet, now that all his campaign promises are a matter of record...
Barack Obama, Feb 5 2008 CHANGE We Can Believe
"They want somebody who is talking straight to them about the choices that are ahead." - Barak Obama, Feb 5 2008
We want out of Iraq, get it? We want an end to trade deals that ship U.S. jobs overseas to slave labor states like China, right? We want an end to the two-faced Democratic hypocrisy exemplified by the Democratic Leadership Council and the Progressive Policy Institute, in which Democrats quietly serve the same corporate agenda that Republicans do, while keeping public discussion focused on things like racism and sexism and "culture wars".
So, that's public opinion - and yet he decides to keep on Bush's Secretary of Defense - the guy responsible for the entire civilian side of the U.S. military decision-making apparatus? Maybe we're all supposed to be grateful he didn't bring Rumsfeld back...
Transparent enough, I guess. I don't see any clean energy or anti-war program here. For that, we'd need Dennis Kucinich and Ron Paul. On energy and environmental issues, all we hear from the Obama team is a curious silence...
Did you know that Warren Buffet, one of Obama's major advisors, is up to his neck in coal and tar sand oil deals? Railroads make a lot of money shipping coal from mines to power plants, and Buffet is a major holder. He also is involved in multiple aspects of tar sand oil development, both at the producing end in Canada and the refining end in the Midwest. Obama is a great admirer of Warren Buffet, who is American's leading robber baron.
Second, one of Obama's major lifetime backers is the biggest electric utility corporation in the U.S., Exelon. Their business plan is heavily reliant on coal-fired power, as well as on nuclear expansion - but solar and wind? Not interested. Here's some background:
"Democrat Barack Obama has come under fire for his ties to Exelon Corp, the largest operator of nuclear reactors in the United States and one of his most generous financial backers. When Exelon failed to disclose radioactive leaks at one of its nuclear plants, Obama tried to push through a bill in the Senate last year that required such plants to notify state and local authorities of such cases, the New York Times reported last week. According to the Times, the final proposal was a watered-down version of the original legislation that "played into the hands of the nuclear power industry." Obama has collected at least $222,000 from Exelon employees for his presidential campaign, making the company his eighth largest contributor last year.
Big Coal and Big Nuclear - that's Obama. A little different from Big International Oil (i.e. the Houston-Saudi-London axis, see Craig Unger on House of Bush, House of Saud). He's less likely to start wars, and he'll give token support to weak domestic programs, rather than gutting them.
This is a disaster in the making - a complete repudiation of all campaign promises.
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» Obama, Axelrod, Exelon and nuclear reactor leaks & decomissioning costs
Posted by: gunboat diplomat
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Posted by: jareilly on Nov 26, 2008 10:00 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The thing Wise doesn't get is that there is a huge difference in numbers, strategy and ideology between the sectarians and the rest of unaffiliated Left. They are cultists with fairly pronounced psychological problems; the rest of us have a radical critique that is subject to regular reflection and refinement. I know. I was a member of a very small and as it turns out, very unimportant revolutionary group in the mid-70s. After too much blather about "Uncle Joe" Stalin I bailed out, but I have held fast to my views, which are probably in line with Noam Chomsky and other systemic critics of empire. This means that while I allowed myself to crow a bit after election day, I have not taken leave of my senses. I view Obama, his hawkish statements, his free-market fundamentalism and pro-bailout position, his re-activation of the Clinton regime, in this context. It all comes down to this:
The purpose of elections in America is to perpetuate the seamless continuity of elite rule.
If anything comes of Obama's victory it won't be because of Obama, it will be in spite of him. It'll be because of the rising expectations of his millions of supporters, whose rosey view of all things Obama is about to get hammered by the reality of the actual Obama regime.
If all that makes me a walking "barbiturate, so be it. I am profoundly relieved that Mad Dog and Miss Perky were not elected and at the same time profoundly disturbed that so many of my neighbors voted for them. Meanwhile Mr. Wise, Obama just used a significant chunk of political capital pushing through a $700 billion bailout, which your daughters will have to pay for.
In WWII, the press sometimes called General George Patton "old Blood and Guts". His soldiers said, "our blood, his guts". They died by the truckload for his greater glory. To paraphrase those poor bastards, about Obama, "our hope, his change".
Pardon my skepticism and stay tuned in. We'll see soon what it all means.
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» Brilliant
Posted by: pdxjoe
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Posted by: jwc1480 on Nov 26, 2008 10:46 AM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
And if we all pitch in, we may still turn this place into another North Korean or African wonderland.
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» RE: Mr. Appreciates What He Has
Posted by: Spot
» RE: Mr. Appreciates What He Has
Posted by: jwc1480
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Posted by: dbuskirk1 on Nov 26, 2008 11:02 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
But me, I'm one of The Poor, and I have the W-2s to prove it. Obama talks a lot about helping the middle class but he rarely mentions The Poor. People are selling Hope, we've got Hope, we wouldn't have made it this far without Hope. What we need are a decent jobs. And Barack can't even say our name.
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» Not true
Posted by: westomoon
» RE: Not true
Posted by: dbuskirk1
» Oh, please
Posted by: westomoon
» I've noticed that too...
Posted by: WhuThe?!?
» RE: The Poor
Posted by: Elixabeth
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Bliss Doubt on Nov 26, 2008 11:06 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I'm hopeful. I, too, was gratified to see an African American make that acceptance speech on the night of November 4, and I cried tears of joy, but that does not change the direction Obama is already taking in preparation for his office, with regard to war, with regard to corporate welfare, with regard to offshore drilling, with regard to many things.
I repeat, I'm hopeful, and I don't spend much time criticizing Obama in my native habitat. Mainly, all day long, wedged between bible thumpers and wingnuts, I listen to people griping about a marxist socialist communist being elected, and there is no convincing them how similar Obama's views are to McCain's. I live in Texas. I have to be hopeful.
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Posted by: mrtshw on Nov 26, 2008 11:15 AM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Your rant is labeled as an indictment of far leftist cynics but seems to be equally applicable to right wing harpies. Harpies appear to be harpies whenever they meet one another in the ethers of extremism where left joins right in a death grip on unreason. Thus, Barry Goldwater's mantra that extremism in the cause of virtue is no vice is horribly wrong-headed. In fact, my 65-year-old perspective convinces me that extremism in the cause of vice is more likely the virtuous choice.
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» I think 'slugsucker' up above demonstrates
Posted by: WhuThe?!?
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Posted by: pamphyila on Nov 26, 2008 11:15 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: Down with Leftist Cynicism
Posted by: slugsucker
» There is legitimate uncertainty about what it is Obama wants to get done.
Posted by: gunboat diplomat
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Posted by: bluepilgrim on Nov 26, 2008 12:02 PM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
http://www.truthout.org/112608A
Learning to Lead
Wednesday 26 November 2008
by: Dahr Jamail, t r u t h o u t | Perspective
[...]
We in the United States have grown acclimatized to a system that first dehumanizes us and then inevitably feeds on our dehumanization, sucking away at our resources, our rights, and our resistance while we scamper frantically around in the pursuit of life, liberty, and happiness.
[...]
Making Real the Symbol
But this is not the time to despair, or merely hope.
"The cure for despair is not hope. It's discovering what we want to do about something we care about." - Margaret Wheatley
To underscore the essence of this moment in history, I refer once again to my partner's email from Africa, "We must not forget the tremendous responsibility we have now, to see that Obama maintains his promise of change ... we must not relinquish this moment nor this victory into his hands entirely. As he learns to lead us, so must we learn to lead him."
As for this 'humor' thing, etc., that's just a red herring and more personal smear as we get from the right wing.
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Posted by: common intelligence on Nov 26, 2008 12:05 PM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Without it as a priority as deems necessary in light of the high crimes of the Bush Administration, any CHANGE we see will be camoflaged in CHAINS on US.
All the Obama and all congressional committees have already done all the investigations.
They all know the war crimes.
100's of thousands of innocent people have died because of a plethora of known reasons.
Livelihoods ruined, destroyed, nations literally in ruins., complete industries bombed to smithereens, 100's of thousands crippled for life. Families completely shattered. Agony, pain, despair. Millions homeless & destitute unfathomable hunger and starvation, whole biological environments uninhabitable and wildlife decimated.
radioactive weapons of mass destruction unleashed upon generations to come.
All this by George W. BUSH
Now what do you all not understand?
They all know how the Constitution has been trashed.
They all know actions implemented under BUSH the "Decider's" watch (or should we say "not watching" have compromised national security. That being the economic stability of the country has purposely neglected in order to maintain and push forth middle east empire building. That alone point to ill qualification to even be in a "management position. Any Corporation in the world would have fired the bastard long ago for destroying the country.
But even as Michael Moore warned the whole nation years ago people refuse to recognize the critics that fore told of the how Bush's policies were bound to lead to these consequences.
Until 911 is opened and reinvestigated, and even brought people accountable whom were negligent on their watch. There can never be any trust in this government again.
NO other President in the history of this nation has ever been allowed to get away with so much.
In comparison to Nixon and not even Clinton, Bush is unparalleled in Impeachable offenses.
But senators and congressmen in collusion with the NeoCon machine and corporate financiers guard their machine at ALL costs.
For them to be dethroned and have a national distrust of the economic system and leadership exposed as corrupt wold destroy their power base. POWER over the flow of all activity on planet earth is theirs. They will blow the world up before they give it up.
The only thing that can turn it around is the people being fully marching in unison, including our boys in uniform to weed out the system. People have the power. But the media and movie industry uses every propaganda blitz at their disposal to keep the sheeple mesmerized and divided. Because people hold on to idealistic and romantic notions that the word United States reflects this continents social continuity, they accept being exploited and accept the "Chains" (not Change) like good "Christian martyrs" belief there is redemption by suffering.
BULL SHIT.
SO Americans are subdued and fully beat each other up, accept the corruption and spin and redefinition of political wordsmithing as they
whine only left wanting more.
There can only be reconciliation and a heart warming trust and true faith in leadership when they are made accountable. Any sense of safety and security people can have in this country is nil until the perpetrators of the actions that have transpired during Bush's office are brought to justice.
IT ALL IS IN THE HANDS OF THE PEOPLE TO REESTABLISH JUSTICE.
Does the french revolution remind you of ideas? That was a time when people had had enough.
You should all Hail the Pirates of Somalia, the only people alive that have any guts (and are pretty smart too!
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» RE: Without Accountability The Power elete Remain in power.
Posted by: mrtshw
» Wow.
Posted by: Scientz
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Posted by: DaBear on Nov 26, 2008 12:31 PM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I couldn't disagree more with Wise's perceptions because of those little nagging things called FACTS. It is absolutely IRRESPONSIBLE to suggest to critics that they are "barbituates" merely because the critic and do so based on facts.
FACT: Obama promised numerous times to take progressive positions on the economy and for the benefit of working people not the uber classes.
FACT: He's selected economic advisors who were the very ARCHITECTS of the economic disaster we have now.
Sorry, Tim, that you can't seem to notice the facts for your own urge to experience happy-happy joy-joy. You're irresponsible to suggest critics of Obama based on FACTS should remain mute.
We will not and you will have to deal with us, whether you want to or not.
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» You are right, it is Tim Wise himself that appears to be doped up here on Speed
Posted by: logansafi
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Posted by: westomoon on Nov 26, 2008 12:51 PM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The comments to this piece are predictably hilarious. Of course the carpers and quibblers are responding to the suggestion that carping and quibbling are not forward motion with... LOL! a sh*tstorm of carping and quibbling! What's life about, after all? If we don't complain about the pea under the mattress, how will anyone know we're a princess?
People, look at yourselves! You have been slamming doors shut on the basis of the tiniest omens since the morning of Nov. 5! We are still two months away from any official action the guy can take, and you've already written him off! All the lessons of his campaign -- a collection of dubious characters and erstwhile prima donnas that functioned as the tightest ship ever seen in politics and took its guidance exclusively from Obama -- were erased the moment he won, and you all have been looking for loose threads, no matter how minuscule, ever since!
I'm a survivor of DC, and Obama's picks are starting to form a very different pattern for me than for the Purist Brigade. His first hire is a junkyard dog who knows him well. All his subsequent Cabinet decisions, to my eye, need to be viewed in the context of a President with a chessplayer's brain, a clear notion of the direction we need to be moving in, a tremendous capacity for detail and multitasking, and an enforcer to make it happen.
Some of the areas already selected for are labyrinths designed to repel outsiders -- Defense and Wall Street in particular. You can't send a Dennis Kucinich (whom I admire) into those jungles and expect him to make smart moves right away, you have to co-opt someone who already speaks the language and put them on a very short leash, with a shock collar named Emmanuel. (Hillary Clinton is the exception, but I suspect her appointment is designed to rein in both the Senator and her husband -- who has been running wild in the international sphere.)
But no, every pick should be Jesus or the Buddha, and Obama should himself be better than Jahweh ever was. I guess there's no harm in this form of paralysis -- we got Obama nominated despite it, and elected too. The carpers will never give him credit for the good he will do, just like the far right won't, but they'll be happy to live in the better country he'll help create. . . (grinning) Well, maybe "happy" is too strong a word...
Wise's main point -- that change comes from us, and that we've just had a success experience which has reminded us that we are not simply consumers of government, but makers of it -- seems to have been missed by many of the commenters here.
That's fine. While you all argue over how many angels can -- or should -- dance on the head of a pin, the rest of us will be shoveling the garbage out of the streets. You'll never thank us for the clean streets -- but the point of this article was, who cares? The streets will still be cleaner, and lots of us imperfect types will be proud of our part in making it happen.
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» I agree 100%
Posted by: Scientz
» Still chuckling
Posted by: westomoon
» RE: LOVED this piece!
Posted by: bluepilgrim
» RE: LOVED this piece!
Posted by: Scientz
» RE: LOVED this piece!
Posted by: bluepilgrim
» "My army"? "My squad"? Oh, the temptation!
Posted by: westomoon
» RE: LOVED this piece!
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: LOVED this piece!
Posted by: westomoon
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Smiff on Nov 26, 2008 12:56 PM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
History will determine the extent to which Obama's election is symbolic. But regardless of that ultimate judgement, his election is at the very least, a candle in the darkness that descended when Bush-Cheney-Rumsfeld turned the lights out.
In the meantime, let's keep the faith. Let's continue to know that there IS a way to global equality and opportunity. Let's continue to do, each in our way, whatever we can to help move humanity towards that goal.
Real, permanent change may be generations away. Individually, we may be little more than witnesses at a window as the parade passes by.
In the meantime, let's not diminish anyone's contribution by criticising each other for the size or style of the candles we carry.
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Posted by: femmyv on Nov 26, 2008 1:48 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: logansafi on Nov 26, 2008 2:03 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I call folk like Tim Wise 'Peace'crats, simply because they are not actually for PEACE so much as they are for voting DP. We in the Movement have a big problem now, and that is keeping people like Tim from braking us yet even more from mobilizing people like they don't, and never much will. The glue of the Democratic Party keeps them tied to the ground, so don't look for folk like Tim to help mobilize folk against their racism of continuing to support US occupation of Iraq, Somalia, and Afghanistan.
I like Tim, having met him once, and he works in a difficult state. However, making folk think that the Northern DP elite is different much from the Southern RP elite is mistaken nonsense. You can do better than this rant against us to the Left of the DP voting crowd you call realists, Tim. Can't you?
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» RE: I guess we know who Wise voted for... lol...
Posted by: logansafi
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Posted by: steveconn on Nov 26, 2008 2:24 PM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: orftc on Nov 26, 2008 2:32 PM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I very much appreciated Wise's essay, "Good, and Now Back to Work: Overcoming Cynicism and Overconfidence in the Age of Obama." This one, I'm not sure I get. Going after Stalinists for their lack of joy? It seems like a straw man used to attack people rightly critiquing Obama's actions since elected.
Obama's candidacy was an important step forward for this country because millions of Americans came together to make it work. Whether Obama's presidency will be important will likewise depend upon millions of Americans coming together to make real demands upon him and upon Congress.
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» Oh we're 'Stalinists' now are we?
Posted by: logansafi
» RE: Oh we're 'Stalinists' now are we?
Posted by: orftc
» RE: Oh we're 'Stalinists' now are we?
Posted by: logansafi
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Posted by: Dr T on Nov 26, 2008 3:24 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We travel on this life journey from ordeal to ordeal. We must pursue happiness. It balances the crap.
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Posted by: nfamous on Nov 26, 2008 3:30 PM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: Positive Realism is not Negativity
Posted by: macdon1
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Posted by: Dr T on Nov 26, 2008 3:24 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We travel on this life journey from ordeal to ordeal. We must pursue happiness. It balances the crap.
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» The author was referring to New Orleans, not Nashville
Posted by: left-leaning-libertarian
» Huh?
Posted by: leighsure
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Posted by: Dr T on Nov 26, 2008 4:30 PM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Mel Brooks
All matter is really energy condensed to a slow vibration. We are all one consciousness experiencing itself subjectively. There is no such thing as death. Life is only a dream and we are the imagination of ourselves. It's just a ride folks so lighten up"
Bill Hicks
;)
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» RE: Mel Brooks & Bill Hicks
Posted by: Quannah
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Posted by: avatar_singh on Nov 26, 2008 5:39 PM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
no -they awere english abstrds who were racists and very pirates in essence and were the scum of the earth-their arival in america is celebrated by the americans most of who have no ebnglish or british ancestry-in fact moere than 60% of americans are not of anglosaxon descent but in name of whote e=versues balck and other crap the aenglish derived scum bags have maninted their illgotten power in america so much that amerc=ica celebreates this crap thankgivintg more than the 4th of july.
so called white supremacists are nothing but engliahs scum bags and their agents-they donto like germans irish, frewnch or scandinavions either-who are more white than these english derived scum bags.
===================
How britain got hold on america after american independence-- --- This all started soon after Napoleonic war when in 1816 to 1817 The english again attacked america in her southern flanks and the day was saved only because of some French navy mercenaries and French speaking population of Louisiana and such states along with non-english origin americans. But the english invaders infiltrated among that population of the south of USA which today calls itself bible belt (whose god has always been english royalty and who worship only stolen money).By 1850 to 1860 England attacked erstwhile friend (in Napoleonic war) Russia in Crimea along with erstwhile foe (now controlled by unpopular english stooge) France.-how the same pattern is so predictable in case of this intrusive, cancerous exploitative race called english and anglo saxons. At that very time England was actively supporting the slave exploitation, in fact all the big plantation owners were english derived and they owned loyalty not to flag of United states of america but to England. -in other words they were agents of foreign country who wanted to keep south america occupy as foreign power again. The civil war in america was not only supported with money and arms by england but rather england was the instigator of american civil war in order to keep whole of america enslaved and if not possible at least those parts (South) where it could call upon filial loyalty. It was truly a war of race-not against whites and blacks but against anglo saxons versus blacks, Irish, other European peoples .The same would be repeated in future. The confederacy was a traitor to america-a british agents; but ironically that same confederacy flag today is being propagandised by their descendents as symbol of american independence and patriotism. Having lost the proxy war england resorted to the one thing it specialises-terrorism and misinformation. Abraham Lincoln was murdered by the person very sympathetic to british cause. (against Napoleon england had sent several terrorist squads-that is why Napoleon had to declare Himself an Emperor to maintain the clear line of succession to protect glorious French Revolution). It is very interesting that most of the american presidents assassinated were those whom England did not want being elected. By the end of civil war ,instead of disinfranchasising the british supporters (of southern states) and taking away their land or at least redistributing evenly the stolen land, the american govt. was persuaded by britain to spare them and let those southern traitors keep all the stolen land so that drug (tobacco) and cotton would be of assured supply to england. Of course by that time because of fall of Napoleon (brought about not by military might but by conspiracy to embroil the Europeans among each other( conspiracy hatched in London-that was the only english contribution to napoleons' fall-forget waterloo where Austrians and Prussians had contributed most militarily):consequently
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» RE: not really. otherwise america would have celebrated indpedence day more than thankgiving day.
Posted by: avatar_singh
» RE: not really. otherwise america would have celebrated independence day more than thankgiving day.
Posted by: avatar_singh
» You want to be taken seriously?
Posted by: leighsure
» RE: You want to be taken seriously?-no, not by you idiot.
Posted by: avatar_singh
» RE: You want to be taken seriously?
Posted by: Longdream
» RE:british bastards race msut e eiminated to free the world
Posted by: avatar_singh
» RE: why england needs to be eliminated for the sake of the world.before any real peace comes.
Posted by: avatar_singh
Comments are closed-
Posted by: mindtrvlr on Nov 26, 2008 6:00 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
PS..I usually vote Republican. Never again. Have a nice Thanksgiving and pray for everyone
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» RE: PLEASE SHUT UP ALL THE COMMENTATORS AND GIVE THE MAN A CHANCE
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: PLEASE SHUT UP ALL THE COMMENTATORS AND GIVE THE MAN A CHANCE
Posted by: mindtrvlr
» Your title was perfect
Posted by: westomoon
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Posted by: cdmagda on Nov 26, 2008 6:54 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: gnaw_bone on Nov 26, 2008 7:22 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» Your comment is awesome
Posted by: slugsucker
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Posted by: left-leaning-libertarian on Nov 26, 2008 8:30 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Isn't it interesting how the dourly, deadly serious extreme ends of the political spectrum seem to look and sound alike?
Living as I do in an extremely rural and overwhelmingly conservative area, I've learned that idelogy must often be tempered with pragmatism if anything is to be achieved for the good. A well-developed, self-efacing sense of humor and a thick skin are also essential to survival in such a political climate. But it IS possible to bring people along if you know how to frame your arguments!
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» Refreshing
Posted by: slugsucker
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Direct Democracy on Nov 26, 2008 8:46 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
VOCA, Now !!
FREE AMERICA
REVOLUTIONARY (DIRECT) DEMOCRACY
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» ???WHAT??? - RE: Bush Lite
Posted by: ds1st
» So where've you been for the past ten years?
Posted by: westomoon
Comments are closed-
Posted by: chantlaca on Nov 26, 2008 10:01 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Message to the Americas
Continental Confederation of the Eagle and the Condor
"Ese sol ya se acabó, este nuevo ya empezó."
Now the call for change comes at the threshold of a new administration in Washington that is historic for not being defined by the dehumanizing memes of caste and the historical trajectory of Manifest Destiny of the European American colonization on North America. The scars still bleed.
Now is the time for the realization of Integrity, integrating justice and dignity along with all of our fellow "Americans" of this continent Abya Yala a new hemispheric policy of Self Determination and Reciprocity with Respect for the Rights of the Nations of the Indigenous Peoples at a continental level, transcribed in the principles of the United Nations Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples which was adopted by the UN General Assembly on September 13th, 2007.
The time has come to not only change but TRANSFORM our collective continental society of the Americas, breaking the chains of centuries of European-American racism and colonization, expropriation and exploitation by finally and for the first time arriving and discovering the ancient hearth of our global humanity here in the New World: a world under assault since the beginnings of World War One: October the 12th, 1492.
This war, the war against the Nations of Indigenous Peoples of Abya Yala, must also be brought to an end. Can this be the dream of the Americas, as it is the Destiny of Humanity?
Self Respect, Self Sacrifice, and Self Determination: Abya Yala.
NAHUACALLI
Embassy of the Indigenous Peoples
PO Box 24009 Phoenix, AZ 85074
Contact: Tupac Enrique Acosta, Yaotachcauh
Tel: (602) 254-5230 Email: chantlaca@tonatierra.org
www.tonatierra.org
http://www.un.org/esa/socdev/unpfii/en/declaration.html
***********
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Posted by: BobJ on Nov 26, 2008 10:44 PM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Yes, it’s great that there’s an African American as president, but we didn’t vote for a figure head, we voted for a leader who should be expected to match his campaign rhetoric with his actions.
So stop trying to quash dissent, Tim. Dissent is what got torture-advocate John Brennan off Obama’s team, and there is a lot more to be done. Our nation’s problems are complicated and are going to require COMMUNICATION to resolve. Get used to it.
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» Obama is a Dove!
Posted by: ds1st
Comments are closed-
Posted by: realmuzik on Nov 27, 2008 2:09 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I know of almost no families of any of the 9-11-01 victims that are against the war with Afghanistan, and some of these people are even more rabid, anti-war "peacenick" hippies than I am.
The 9-11-01 victims' families want the ultimate in justice, and that is the prosecution (and yes, elmination) of the Seriously Dangerous and Evil Taliban. They will have no closure until the mission is accomplished.
Not convinced? Didn't you hear that members of the Taliban threw acid at girls walking to school the other day?? What did you think happened in Mumbai yesterday, and even that scare in the NYC subway system?? They are sobering reminders that the TALIBAN IS ALIVE, WELL AND READY TO ELIMINATE THE NON-MUSLIM SECTORS OF THE HUMAN RACE. WE CANNOT BE BLIND TO THIS!!)
Blaming Obama for starting that war is cheap pettiness, indicative of the sad sate of the troubling "sore winner/loser" mentality of this country. You cannot have it every way you want!
Some peace activists need to learn some important life lessons on grief. Have some EMPATHY for the 9-11-01 victims' families (including Pat Tillman's family, who will eternally seek TRUE JUSTICE FOR THE UNLAWFUL, BUSH-ADMINISTRATION-TAINTED FRIENDLY FIRE MURDER OF HIM), who must live with their grief for the rest of their lives. The grieving process is ETERNAL.
NEVER, EVER FORGET.
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» RE: Oh, please .[There are several areas of life where emotion, pride are inappropriate;
Posted by: Squarehead
» RE: then why youy american bastards were creating and supporting taliban agasint liberal afgan govt
Posted by: avatar_singh
» RE: then why youy american bastards were creating and supporting taliban agasint liberal afgan govt
Posted by: puf_almighty
» no itis better to kill bastrd american and british troops rather than bring democracy to USa or afga
Posted by: avatar_singh
» RE:never dare you bastrds shed crocodile tear for Indians-you are the ones who supported islamic ter
Posted by: avatar_singh
» what would have happend if the american and brit bastards had really succeded in iraq and afganistan
Posted by: avatar_singh
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Squarehead on Nov 27, 2008 3:24 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Just stop to think! There is a slaughter of millions! I blame the administration! Yes, and the new one as well!
When are we going to see this change that we all desire?
Yours, a European turkey (Name and address kept secret. They are out to get me!
Gobble, gobble
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» RE: Yours, a European turkey (Name and address kept secret. They are out to get me!
Posted by: ranchero42
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Posted by: BobS on Nov 27, 2008 6:53 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Obama is a moderate cautious Democrat. I am not. But the movement that brought him to power is like nothing I have seen in decades.
If you can't celebrate the moment when the walls of white supremacy crumbled a little more and people across the nation demanded a genuine break from the past, than you should get out of the radical left business and go do something else.
Obama himself made it very clear that night in Grant Park. The Change is us. We have to wrest our nation away from a decrepit ruling class that is not only grossly overpaid, but is grossly incompetent.
We have to make this nation into a place where a U.S. president can preside over the Change we need.
While we're out doing that, Barack Obama has a broken and battered government to run and an economy that is teetering on the abyss.
Does that mean we shouldn't criticize his appointments and dissect his policies? Hell no. He's a grown man. He can take it. If we are smart about about it, he may even take some of our complaints seriously, especially if we have a movement to back them up.
As Saul Alinsky pointed out long ago,"Power goes to two poles: to those who've got money and those who've got people."
The time to hit the ground running is now, just like the abolitionists of Lincoln's time, the labor militants of Roosevelt's time and the civil rights activists of Kennedy's time.
Bob Simpson
The BobboSphere
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» RE: Obama has his job. We have ours.
Posted by: Squarehead
» RE: Obama has his job. We have ours.
Posted by: Quannah
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Posted by: PaulinSF on Nov 27, 2008 10:59 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Do you really like to laugh?
The novel on which it was based, "Aunt Julia and the Scriptwriter," by Mario Vargas Llosa, is great too. But it's set in South America, not New Orleans. And it's entirely devoid of Albanians.
The people who wrote the script for "Tune In Tomorrow" took a lot of liberties with the story, and they wound up creating a comedy classic. Marvelous performances by Peter Falk and Barbara Hershey. Five stars.
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Posted by: ds1st on Nov 27, 2008 11:28 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This is a poorly written article. It has outdated ideas based on SOCIALISM, COMUNISIM, MARCISM, FACISIM, and RACISM. These concepts never last or ever work … ever …
The above social templates breed ineffective trailing societies that are racist and eventually fail. Look at Cuba, pre WWII Germany, and the USSR as examples. These societies have either failed, killed-off by stronger working societies or are let to fail of their own devices.
They are in collapse or have collapsed; their people suffered the lack of freedom and goods and services that capitalistic democracies or republics offer in their countries.
It is so obvious, lets see; Cuba actually invented the Internet and the USSR developed grocery chain stores, malls, and Rock-n-Roll.
Racists and Race-Baters, both the black version and the white version are living in a
largely by-gone era, especially the R/RBs here in America. SOCIALISM, COMUNISIM, MARCISM, FACISIM, and RACISM breeds stupidity in leaders and people.
I travel to Asia (Korea, Twain, and China) and Europe (Germany, Italy, and France) on business. In Asia I see a very limited number of women in the Asian business office. In Europe (more-so 10 years ago) I see a limited number of people of color in the business office.
I feel sorry for this hatred filled, out-dated, and single minded author.
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» RE: Generally Uninteresting, Inaccurate, [t is true that 'actually existing Socialism'
Posted by: Squarehead
» Wow, nice post, Squarehead!
Posted by: westomoon
» RE: Wow, nice post, Squarehead!
Posted by: Squarehead
» RE: Squarehead! Bravo!
Posted by: Quannah
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Elixabeth on Nov 27, 2008 1:36 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Obama did a lot to address some of the more legitimate criticisms of the left by people who are socially moderate. He did a lot to fight the grief industry that focuses more on symptoms of inequality rather then on sound economic policy to fix those problems, a problem as many of the advocates for the poor are not economists. This culling of some of the weaker cultural warriors is healthy for liberals, it leads the rest of the movement more legitimate and stronger, if people don't view them as defending weak arguments from social sanctions. The key to democracy is the center- if we are not able to talk out our policy objectives we won't be able to write good laws.
I would like to note however the difference between an active center and a passive center, if politics isn't discussed by normal people it is easily subverted by those who would use political theory against the nation and people's interest. Lazy democracies become fascist countries quickly because someone has got to ensure that politician's keep their office, and if people won't do it businesses will.
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» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Elixabeth
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Squarehead
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Elixabeth
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Squarehead
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Elixabeth
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Elixabeth
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Squarehead
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Elixabeth
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Elixabeth
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Elixabeth
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Squarehead
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Elixabeth
» RE: The country had already changed, [The economic facts of like of supply and demand.
Posted by: Squarehead
» RE: The country had already changed, [The economic facts of like of supply and demand.
Posted by: Elixabeth
» RE: The country had already changed, [The economic facts of like of supply and demand.
Posted by: Elixabeth
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Squarehead
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Elixabeth
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Squarehead
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Elixabeth
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Elixabeth
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Elixabeth
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Elixabeth
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Elixabeth
» RE: The country had already changed, Obama just let everyone else in on a thinly disguised secret.
Posted by: Elixabeth
» Position filled.
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: Position filled.
Posted by: Squarehead
» RE: I've got a lot of respect for you, Squarehead--
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: I've got a lot of respect [I thought that that was so much of the academic method?
Posted by: Squarehead
» RE: I've got a lot of respect [I forgot to include:
Posted by: Squarehead
» RE: You I understand perfectly.
Posted by: Longdream
Comments are closed-
Posted by: cori on Nov 27, 2008 5:43 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: LETS GIVE THE GUY A CHANCE
Posted by: Quannah
Comments are closed-
Posted by: jdhatl on Nov 28, 2008 1:29 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: parkslopester on Nov 28, 2008 3:27 PM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Cynical leftists tend to be very fact-based creatures. It seems to me that if one really were genuinely intent on reducing apathy-inducing cynicism, a better approach than a lengthy ad hominem, would be to provide reasons why we should all be cheerful and hopeful in the midst of the ghouls parade that is Obama's cabinet so far.
Perhaps you should present an actual program, Tim. We have been hearing a lot of loose talk about this movement from below that is supposed to save Obama from all the riff-raff he has set about surrounding himself with. But how is this all supposed to play out., exactly, especially when folks like Wise keep enforcing this waiting period on 'negativity' to which Obama is entitled for no reason but his race?
But, of course, Wise is not interested in improving things. Like the guilt-inducing hectoring of his anti-racism blather, what comes across more than anything is preening self-regard in relation to so many flawed others. By the way Tim, I doubt if anyone familiar with your career considers you fun, humorous or particularly effective. And when I think of what I don't like about the official left, I think of people like you.
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» RE: Lead by example [where do you get that really good acid, in that pen?
Posted by: Squarehead
» RE: Lead by example
Posted by: puf_almighty
» RE: Lead by example
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: Lead by example
Posted by: parkslopester
» RE: Lead by example
Posted by: Squarehead
» RE: Lead by example
Posted by: parkslopester
» RE: Lead by example
Posted by: Squarehead
» RE: Lead by example
Posted by: parkslopester
» RE: Lead by example
Posted by: Squarehead
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Posted by: nightmarenotover on Nov 30, 2008 4:42 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I disagree with that statement, because what America needed to repair the damage from President Bush-Cheney was (1) impeachments and (2) a president who would take a bold turn to the left.
You don't get anything for free in Washington D.C.
There is always a trade-off.
If you want to add a few cents to the federal minimum wage, you also get a tax cut on capital gains or and end to the Estate Tax.
You don't get a black president this early unless you are willing to let go of the dream of someone strong enough to counteract Cheney and Bush.
If you take the safe road and make deals with President Bush-Cheney about getting out of Iraq, you stay until 2012.
No black man could reach the White House this soon without being a Republican or a Republican-lite.
It is a great victory for Barack Obama, but it is a setback for the country.
It's a great victory for equality, exactly like it would have been if Powell had decided to run in the 90s.
When the pendulum swings back after Obama, it will swing further right than it ever has, because Obama will define the New Left (just to the right of Reagan).
Pelosi put impeachment off the table and swore to work with Bush to end the bloody Iraq Occupation. The Democrats presented us with a fascinating multi-ring circus with our choice of the first woman or first black.
The Republicans countered with the first ex-POW and assorted clowns.
Forgotten during this diversionary Reality Show was the fact that the crimes of President Bush-Cheney requires IMPEACHMENT, not waiting years until the next election.
You can't heal a wound without painfully scrubbing it clean first.
Because we took the timid road, there are infected sores that our country will carry for the rest of its life.
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» RE: EDIT Pelosi's Victory
Posted by: nightmarenotover
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Posted by: nikkidr on Dec 1, 2008 7:02 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: ayala on Dec 1, 2008 10:33 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: tony12000 on Dec 2, 2008 8:08 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I was not around to "enjoy" all of the drug abuse that you and your friends engaged in during the 60s. Perhaps if you expanded your own base of colleagues, you would find that a lot of young progressives are underwhelmed by Obama. Many of us are black as well.
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» PS
Posted by: tony12000
» RE: I am a young, non-drug using black man....
Posted by: Squarehead
Comments are closed-
Posted by: turtleposer on Dec 3, 2008 7:09 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Would left wingers be happier if McCain, who is still to the right of Obama won? Would it have given them a sense a smug superiority that yes, they lost, but they voted for the pure candidate, Ralph Nader? How exactly has voting for Ralph Nader changed the world? How? Oh, wait, I'm sure Ralph Nader still isn't the "left-wingiest." How has saying "Fuck Bush" or deciding to move to Canada changed anything? How has behaving like people 30 years ago-so retro-changed anything?
Sure, the hard left may feel the injustice of the oppressed Palestinians, Rwandans, Bosnians, etc, but all it's acquaired pain will not match what those people actually endure. Being ideologically pure doesn't change anything - it polarizes people. Left wingers ruin every chance to win people over by shouting obscenities and behaving like impudent brats.
If people already felt the way left-wingers did, they'd be left-wingers. As it stands, left wingers have plenty of people to be angry at, but little of themselves to be proud of.
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Posted by: -matti on Nov 26, 2008 1:22 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I find many things in the incipient Obama Administration that I approve of. And I find several tendencies in the incipient Obama Administration that I disapprove of.
After several months of being told "Silence, this is the best you can get!" I'm a little wary of being told "Silence you're spoiling the fun!".
There's still a hellava lot of work to be done kids. Those that are skeptical should be convinced by EXAMPLE not rhetoric.
-matti.
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» RE: Woo hoo Obama! Am I now allowed to speak?
Posted by: EKSwitaj
» I agree. It seems aimed more at surppressing expression than...
Posted by: -matti
» RE: I agree. It seems aimed more at surppressing expression than...
Posted by: Marina in Paris
» How any American can be a cynic with regard to this election...
Posted by: Bliss Doubt
» RE: How any American can be a cynic with regard to this election...
Posted by: bluepilgrim
» Oh, dear, the blind faith religious right has spoken.
Posted by: Prophit
» Boy, that was my first reaction..... didn't this also happen....
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: Boy, that was my first reaction..... didn't this also happen....
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: Boy, that was my first reaction.....[Poor Prophit,
Posted by: Squarehead
» RE: Boy, that was my first reaction.....[Poor Prophit,
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: Woo hoo Obama! Am I now allowed to speak?
Posted by: Shey
» Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: -matti
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Squarehead
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Aimleft
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Lauren
» LOL!!! Thanks for the warning, Lauren.
Posted by: Aimleft
» RE: LOL!!! Thanks for the warning, Lauren.
Posted by: Longdream
» Oh, so now anyone who is clear headed about what Obama will or won't do
Posted by: Bliss Doubt
» RE: how can ANYONE (including Obama) predict what Omama will or won't do?
Posted by: Longdream
» No lie, this reminds me of the Bush supporters after he began...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: No lie, this reminds me of the Bush supporters after he began...
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: Oh, so now anyone who is clear headed about what Obama will or won't do
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: I love you, Lauren.
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: Maybe it is a matter of experience prejudicing comprehension...
Posted by: Longdream
» Truth does that to ya. It hurts.
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: Woo hoo Obama! Am I now allowed to speak?
Posted by: 2thepoint
» Sorry, but it was Daily Kos and Moveon.org "types"
Posted by: Aimleft
» RE: Sorry, but it was Daily Kos and Moveon.org "types"
Posted by: 2thepoint
» RE: Woo hoo Obama! Am I now allowed to speak?
Posted by: Longdream
» FOLLOW YOUR OWN RULES, please. . . .
Posted by: Beck
» Federal Reserve Rally
Posted by: Von
» I call it Mainstreamnet
Posted by: Bliss Doubt
» RE: I call it Mainstreamnet
Posted by: Quannah
» You've always been allowed to speak - let's see YOUR example
Posted by: leighsure
» RE: Woo hoo Obama! Am I now allowed to speak?
Posted by: Longdream
» Wise's Straw Man...
Posted by: jooljetkmae
Comments are closed-
Posted by: sibadd on Nov 26, 2008 1:31 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
No-one can donate the labour of democracy to one leader. Obama's there because so many *did* labour, because 1000s didn't play the non-politics of 'everything sucks'. This man says the problems you (and we, in Europe) face are enormous. He tells it like it is but intelligently, not conjuring monsters. You are so right. He spreads hope and its possibilities - and not just in the USA. Look after this man for us, Americans. The name of that street where I met those old yanks in the camper van is 'Odos Dimokratias'.
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» RE: Simon Baddeley
Posted by: Shey
» RE: Oh such high talk from a Briton. Britain, most destruction force in human history!
Posted by: Spot
» RE: Oh such high talk from a Briton. Britain, most destruction force in human history!
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: Oh such high talk from a Briton. Britain, most destruction force in human history!
Posted by: javajoe
» RE: Oh such high talk from a Briton. Britain, most destruction force in human history!
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: Simon Baddeley
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: Simon Baddeley
Posted by: turtleposer
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Suzon on Nov 26, 2008 1:58 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It's up to us to support moves which are progressive. In fact, we should make it clear that what we want is constitutional fundamentalism!
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» I, as a Nader Supporter, spit out your bait.
Posted by: -matti
» No, independents have voted Democrat while no one was looking
Posted by: Beck
» RE: No, independents have voted Democrat while no one was looking
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: No, independents have voted Democrat while no one was looking
Posted by: Longdream
» please note that I referred to "some" not "all" Nader supporters
Posted by: Suzon
» RE: why did this make me think of Nader and some of his supporters? because it described them.
Posted by: Beck
Comments are closed-
Posted by: flowerguerrilla on Nov 26, 2008 2:03 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I love seeing a black man walking up to a place of power. That is a beautiful dream come true. But to celebrate 'victory' without doing...something!...is civil dereliction.
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» RE: We HOPE Obama will CHANGE his cabinet!
Posted by: douglashoyt
» RE: We HOPE Obama will CHANGE his cabinet!
Posted by: RedWalt67
» RE: We HOPE Obama will CHANGE his cabinet!
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: We HOPE Obama will CHANGE his cabinet!
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: We HOPE Obama will CHANGE his cabinet!
Posted by: Spot
» It's the author of the article who brought out the black president meme
Posted by: Bliss Doubt
» RE: We HOPE Obama will CHANGE his cabinet!
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: We HOPE Obama will CHANGE his cabinet!
Posted by: Spot
» RE: We HOPE Obama will CHANGE his cabinet!
Posted by: Longdream
Comments are closed-
Posted by: RHad on Nov 26, 2008 2:15 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Blank pages.
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» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis?
Posted by: Shey
» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis?
Posted by: writer7
» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis?
Posted by: babs
» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis?
Posted by: writer7
» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis? Yeah, funny that this followed so many "everything sucks"
Posted by: Beck
» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis? Exactly...
Posted by: Allstar Cookie
» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis? Exactly...
Posted by: Spot
» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis?--EXACTLY!!
Posted by: slugsucker
» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis?
Posted by: YogiBear
» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis?
Posted by: Longdream
» RE: No more "everything sucks" analysis?
Posted by: Raptor
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Ashoka911 on Nov 26, 2008 2:19 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
http://change.gov/
This is our chance. Back seat quarterbacks? PLEASE....Get in there an DO something. Yes there will be people we dont agree with (Democracy is messy)
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» RE: This is a good article. Great article. And Democracy and life and politics are all messy
Posted by: Beck
» RE: This is a good article
Posted by: RedWalt67
» RE: This is a good article
Posted by: leTerrassier
» yes, we have to stop complaining and put the pressure on
Posted by: Suzon
» he doesnt have to balance anything.
Posted by: rafaeltoral
» RE: he doesnt have to balance anything.
Posted by: Lauren
» RE: he doesnt have to balance anything.
Posted by: leTerrassier
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Iraan Ozono on Nov 26, 2008 2:24 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Yay!
Now - What kind of president is he going to be?
It's not looking not so good, progressive-change-wise.
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