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The Samaritan's Dilemma: Should Government Help Your Neighbor?

By Courtney E. Martin, AlterNet. Posted October 24, 2008.


In a democracy, people depend on one another to make rules that benefit everyone. Author Deborah Stone discusses how the GOP destroyed that reality.

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As folks watch the economy crumble, shake their heads in unison, worry about retirement in this uncertain time and about our national security in this increasingly globalized world, and sit around in doctors' waiting rooms swapping health care horror stories, it's hard not to admit that Americans are in this together.

A new book by Deborah Stone, a Dartmouth professor and founding editor of the American Prospect, comes at just the right moment -- when we're all becoming painfully aware of how interconnected our fate is as citizens of this country. In The Samaritan's Dilemma: Should Government Help Your Neighbor? she takes the reader on a journey through America's political and ethical history over the past 80 or so years, showing us the ways in which our altruistic instincts have been slowly eroded by a strategic smear campaign on the part of conservative GOP leaders.

Stone makes a cogent, inspiring argument that we must realign our deepest knowing -- that helping our neighbors is the right thing to do -- with our public policy. AlterNet picked her brain about social policy, the state of the economy and, of course, the upcoming election.

Courtney E. Martin: In your book, you make an argument for a renewed "politics of generosity" and a return to democracy's initial essence: "mutual dependency." Can you explain what you mean?

Deborah Stone: Democracy at its simplest means government by the people. To me, that means people collaborate on making rules to guide their individual behavior for the common good. It means people work together to solve common problems, especially the problems that are too big for any one person to lick. In a democracy, we're "mutually dependent" because we depend on each other to come up with good ideas and to cooperate on putting them into practice. We're also dependent on the scientific and cultural knowledge and the social institutions built by the people before us and around us.

Once we acknowledge our mutual dependence, our politics has to start from that place, too. We have to design policies for citizens who care about each other and for each other, and who feel gratitude, loyalty and sometimes devotion. A politics of generosity means we think of ourselves as helping others and contributing to the common good. We're willing to make sacrifices and compromises in order to benefit a larger purpose.

CEM: You argue that conservative leaders -- especially Reagan -- have convinced American voters that interdependence is weak and shameful and that rugged individualism is realistic. You also show the ways in which joyful interdependence plays out around us constantly in our personal lives. Why, given our everyday experiences of altruism, did we take to the notion that it was weak writ large?

DS: Partly, I think, the conservative notion of freedom (not having to do anything you don't choose to do) taps into the painful truth of human development. Each of us grows from a helpless, dependent and powerless creature to a reasonably competent and independent adult with a high degree of autonomy. From our teen years on, we savor that freedom from adult control, even as we watch our elders sometimes become frail and revert to childlike dependence. Perhaps that's why it's easy for leaders to evoke terror and shame in us by speaking of dependence.

Partly, too, our culture celebrates individual achievement. Even team sports hype their MVP awards. From the time we're born, when our parents get our Apgar scores of infant health, we are constantly subjected to measures of our individual merits -- athletic abilities, intellectual abilities, job performance and financial accumulations. Schools emphasize individual accomplishment, and teachers punish collaboration as "cheating." When parents, schools, employers and others reward people for individual achievement, this way of thinking pushes interdependence into the background of everyone's consciousness. We begin to believe that individuals can do it all on their own if they try hard enough, and we lose sight of all the ways people get help all the time.

CEM: What are your thoughts on the developing field of social entrepreneurship -- which is largely based on the idea that creating markets, not giving charity, is the best way to change the world? Is it just the "Help is Harmful philosophy" dressed up in progressive ideas, or is it truly transformative?

DS: I'm a little skeptical, as one should be about any buzzword. Roughly, social entrepreneurship means doing something socially useful through business. Now, entrepreneurship has always meant providing services and products that people want -- and are willing to pay for. That last phrase is the hitch. All entrepreneurs, even the most highly profitable and exploitative such as drug and oil companies, can claim they're providing something socially useful. It seems to me that adding the honorific "social" to an entrepreneur's title ought to mean that the business is willing to provide things people need but can't afford -- it's willing to limit its profits and possibly run in the red, as many nonprofits do (or would without substantial donations).

For many proponents, I fear, social entrepreneurship rests on a belief that being in business is the only truly productive and virtuous activity. I heard Mohammad Yunus speak last year -- the founder of the Grameen Bank, famous for its microloans to help women get started in small businesses. As an illustration of his philosophy, Yunus talked about a beggar who asked him for money. Yunus said he asked the man if he would be willing to go door to door in a middle-class neighborhood selling candy and small toys for the children if Yunus provided him with some items to get started. He set the man up and voila! He had turned a beggar into a businessman. I ask myself: How is it socially useful for a man to sell candy and trinkets that people don't need, and why is pedaling consumer junk any more virtuous than begging? Where's the value-added?

CEM: Fascinating. I notice that when you wrote about the need for family-friendly policies in the workplace, you largely de-gendered the conversation. Do you think that the contemporary Mother's Movement -- led by groups like MomsRising -- is furthering a "politics of generosity," or do you worry that they are continuing the stereotype that it is largely only women and mothers who care about these issues?

DS: I've gotten some flak for not saying that women do most of the family caregiving and not calling for men to do more. By de-gendering, I hope to convey several messages. First, caring for and about others is profoundly human. Yes, women do way more of the hands-on caregiving and have been penalized for it in so many ways. Mona Harrington's Care and Equality is a must-read on this topic. But men do a lot, too -- 40 percent of the 44 million caregivers to adults (people over 18, not children) are men, and working men often suffer for their devotion to caregiving as well.

Second, we need to transform work-family policy across the board so that everyone can express their emotional attachments as actual caregiving. When paid family leave becomes more available and normal for men as well as women, more men will be free to take advantage of it. Meanwhile, women will hopefully face less discrimination in the workplace.

CEM: Makes sense. Generation Y was raised with two very contradictory messages: "Be wary of helping; it's complicated," and "Go out and save the world!" Can you talk about what you see as the long-term effects of this kind of confusing politicization for young people, especially from your perspective as a teacher?

DS: That's a fascinating contradiction. It strikes me as much like the contradictory political messages fed to Generation X: "It's your privilege and duty to participate in politics," but hey, "Government is the problem, not the solution." Along with many other college professors, I've certainly noticed that students who want to do some social good are tending more toward community service and teaching rather than politics and organizing.

I'm just speculating here, but as you put the two messages for Generation Y, I wonder whether they push you to "save the world" in macho, coercive, adventurist ways -- slaying evil-doers rather than helping the vulnerable. Or to put it another way, ridding the world once and for all of something bad with little thought to constructing something new and good. This would seem to be a good description of how the Bush administration sees its mission in Iraq and the War on Terror. In any case, the perfect is the enemy of the good. If you think you have to "save the world" to do something worthwhile, you probably won't bother to do small things -- say, tutor a child or start a community health clinic -- because you've been led to believe that small differences don't matter.

CEM: On that note, studies confirm that young people volunteer more than any other American demographic. Some worry that this is a direct result of the increasingly competitive college admissions process and not an authentic impulse. What are the risks of young people getting involved in community service to boost their resumes?

DS: Not to worry. I don't care how or why young people come to community service and volunteer work, because those are transformative experiences. Helping others changes how people see the world. They come to feel the common humanity of people who are vastly different in superficial yet socially loaded ways (race, class, nationality, age, religion, gender, sexual orientation). They come to understand poverty and powerlessness as the result of social arrangements rather than personal failures. And generally, people who have done community service in their youth are more inclined to believe that the solutions to these problems must occur at the policy level.

So no matter what motivates people to volunteer at first -- pad my resume, required for my high school graduation, my friends are doing it -- more often than not, the work shows them the rewards of altruism and teaches them some basic citizenship virtues that are so essential for a healthy democracy. In fact, I'm all in favor of community service requirements for youth.

CEM: You write, "We know that people's ideas and attitudes about politics take shape at times in the life course when they are particularly impressionable." How do you think the current economic crisis might be reshaping Americans' ideas and attitudes about politics?

DS: There's a lot of interesting research that demonstrates how social and political upheavals can shape the attitudes of an entire cohort or generation. Famously in the U.S., the Great Depression and World War II are said to have shaped the political attitudes of "The Greatest Generation," such that they believed in a strong government that guarantees the social, economic and military security of the citizens. The conservative government-bashing tide ushered in by Ronald Reagan -- government is the problem, dismantle it, privatize its functions -- undermined those attitudes and led directly to the current financial meltdown. Then, the crisis scared the pants off even those die-hard anti-regulatory, anti-government conservatives like Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson, Sen. John McCain and George W. Bush.

Ironically, conservatives had convinced a lot of their constituents to "keep government off our backs," as Sarah Palin put it in the VP debate, so when the time came that we suddenly needed government at our backs, a lot of people were still running from the wrong enemy. The angry calls for tough government oversight, punishing and dismantling Wall Street giants, and helping the victims of foreclosure represent a sea change in public attitudes toward government.

CEM: You write so eloquently about the differences between government programs that disempower citizens by making them feel buried in bureaucracy and those that humanize them by giving them a sense of control. When you look at the proposed policies of the two presidential tickets, which one do you see embodying the latter approach to social programs?

To be honest, neither candidate's platform gives enough detail to tell us how they will administer government programs. But everything about Obama's background and principles suggests he feels more empathy with the disadvantaged and disempowered. And many of his programs are geared to giving people more control over their lives and strengthening their ability to take care of their families: the "make work pay" tax credit, health insurance, paid sick days, expanded reach of Family and Medical Leave Act, fatherhood support programs, more government support for education at all levels. Above all, Obama and the Democratic Party are staunch supporters of civil rights and voting rights -- nothing could be more important for empowerment.

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Perfect Girls, Starving Daughters: How the Quest for Perfection Is Harming Young Women. You can read more about her work at www.courtneyemartin.com.

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Interdependence
Posted by: kepstein7777 on Oct 24, 2008 2:57 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Unless you live on an island somewhere, you are interdependent, and subject to exploitation, among other things. Denying this is one of the key, fundamental flaws in right-wing ideology. Unfortunately, lots of lefties argue this from a hippy-dippy, lovey-dovey perspective rather than pointing out the cold, practical reality that there is no such thing as independence.

Lots more good stuff here on "help is harmful", de-gendering, saving the world by bombing it...Wish I had more time to comment this morning, but I have to go to work and see if my job is still there.

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you can always ask conservatives if they are willing to make their own shoes
Posted by: Suzon on Oct 24, 2008 4:20 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Excellent article!

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McCain's DIRTY LITTLE SECRET in Arizona
Posted by: X-POLYGAMIST WIFE on Oct 24, 2008 5:00 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Stop John McCain on election day and my people's sorrows will melt away.

http://www.bankingonheaven.com

BANKING ON HEAVEN . COM

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Government Cant Be Trusted!
Posted by: Godfather89 on Oct 24, 2008 5:08 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Government cannot be trusted! Our government is so inefficient and cannot possibly have the foresight to make any long-term goals. Hell, look at social security oh sure it worked for awhile back than but apparently government did not have the foresight to see it collapse some 50-75 years down the road.

I and my local community and even my state have a better chance at helping someone (nextdoor neighbor) than some federal bureaucrat hundreds of miles away in Washington. But we are disempowered and it is our job to stand up and say to Government, NO MORE!

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» RE: Government Cant Be Trusted! Posted by: QuestionAuthority
» Well said, QuestionAuthority Posted by: socialpsych
» Well said, both of you! Posted by: Coleman
» RE: Government Cant Be Trusted! Posted by: JSquercia
Pardon? Encouaging-- nay --SUBSIDIZING(!!!)... (further) stupidity? At taxpayer's expense?
Posted by: ABetterFuture on Oct 24, 2008 5:14 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
No thanks. While I sympathize with those who've made stupid decisions--both home "owners", bankers, financial "gurus", and etc., and I don't see the reason why the rest of the 93% of us should be on the hook for their folly. You know, I've made some stupid decisions with money during my life, but it never struck me to go rob my neighbor to get "mines paybacks".

P.T. Barnum said that a fool and his money are soon parted, but here you have the federal government intervening on behalf of the fools. Our government--of the fools, by the fools, and for furthering of the general foolishness, it would seem, and sadly.

And why? Because of bunch of crazy *** talking heads and tinpot boggers have convinced YOU that the world will end unless you give up your tax dollars, and your children's and grandchildrens's economic soundness, in order to (largely*) make a news item.

Yes, there are some issues with the guarantee of funds. And there are some issues with solvency in funds in with people have invested. These are separate issues, not to be confused with whether WE THE TAXPAYERS AT LARGE need to be in the business of bailing out individuals, banks, and financial institutions that decided a 60-year ARM paid by people with no income and no assets was a really good deal.

Do we, as a democratic republic, really need to be in the business of fostering stupidity? Do you give a tin sh_t where the money you send your Congresscritter is going?

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» RE: A littered future Posted by: zeofredo
Not right
Posted by: RedFoxOne on Oct 24, 2008 6:18 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I think its absurd we throw away $10 BILLION a month in Iraq, I think its absurd we had out $700 BILLION to that fat cats of Wall Street, I think Main Street America should the the focus! Government has lost complete and total touch with its Sheeple!

Jiff
Privacy Center

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American society today--a vision of hell
Posted by: zooeyhall on Oct 24, 2008 6:43 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The great Romanian theologian Richard Wurmbrand once described his vision of what Hell was like. He saw a group of people seated around a table where a sumptuous banquet was laid out. He asked one of the condemned souls what his punishment was, and was told "we are a starving, but none of us can lift the food from the plate to our own mouth". "But why don't you just feed each other?" he asked the person. The reply was: "What!!! Feed HIM?? I'd rather go on starving!"

Pretty-much the prevailing attitude in this country today.

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» Don't just watch! Posted by: Last Chance
Cooperation
Posted by: LeeAnnG on Oct 24, 2008 7:22 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
For quite a few years, I taught a beginner's level computer science class at the local community college. Because I am a programmer in my regular job, I was aware that, on the job, cooperation is essential. I decided to allow my students to collaborate on all aspects of their work including tests. And rather than make them memorize facts, I allowed them to use their books during tests.

My guidelines for cooperation included class attendance and completion of assignments. For example, if a student missed more than 2 classes between tests and also did not make an effort to get notes or see me for the missed information, he or she was not permitted to work with others during a test.

Instead of multiple choice type questions, I gave essay questions that involved problem solving. And people who didn't pay attention, take notes, and do assignments couldn't pass the tests even when allowed to use their books and talk to others. But the majority of my students worked hard, were enthusiastic, and loved the format.

And the results were amazing. Many, many of my students came to me after the end of the semester to tell me that they had learned more in my class than any other. More than one said they dropped the subsequent computer class because they already knew the material or that they breezed through for the same reason. A few told me they were required to use computers at work and had stopped being scared of them after taking my class. One student even went on to become a computer repair technician - inspired, as he told me, from my class. He now also teaches classes in computer repair.

The point of all this is that cooperation and collaboration are often much more beneficial than the "you're on your own" attitude of the regressives and so-called conservatives.

We are dependent upon each other, and we can share information and resources with each other so we all can grow and flourish. There seems to be a philosophy of extreme competition in certain areas of our culture, that it's somehow "good" to be "the best" at the expense of others. Maybe that works for some things, but it seems to me that improving lives of as many people as possible, like elevating the education of all my students, is a much greater benefit to any culture. Even the USA.

At least that's my experience - and not just in my classroom.

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» RE: Cooperation Posted by: lbrlw13
» RE: Cooperation Posted by: LeeAnnG
Spreading the wealth...
Posted by: Karina on Oct 24, 2008 8:02 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
... is perfectly reasonable in a society where the MOST frivolous, trivial professions like movie stars and sports players rake in millions while school teachers, nurses and cops live paycheck to paycheck.

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Great points made here.
Posted by: Coleman on Oct 24, 2008 8:06 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
My favorite part of the interview is this notion: whether it's better to turn a begger into an "independent" entrepreneur selling poisonous, landfill-bound baubles to the consumer class. This is capitalism's only solution to abject poverty. Even as the first world exports it's junk back to the third from whence it came (how did that starving African get a Houston Rockets '95 Championship t-shirt?), we're told that the way to a better world is to make more junk and put everyone to work (either through direct foreign investment or "empowerment" via micro-loans) doing things that are objectively useless.

Think about it. The US farms a huge surplus with a mere 3% of the population doing the farming. The other essential functions are accomplished by a similar percentage. The rest of us - if we're lucky enough to be in the consumer class - toil in a dull useless misery at jobs that need not exist, but that must exist to propel capitalism out of it's periodic crises of accumulation. Again and again and again. Forever?

Thought experiment:
If the nations of the world decided to build a giant spaceship to colonize another solar system - a journey that would take generations - how would they assign tasks? They'd pick doctors, engineers, teachers, agricultural specialists, and scientists. They'd organize the spaceship's government to ensure that none of these professionals used the spaceship's precious resources on (respectively) botox, useless consumer gadgets, nationalist propganda, unsustainable agriculture, or any sort of weapons research. And there wouldn't be a single Starbuck's, McDonald's, Macy's, or Pay Day Loan office sucking electricity off the grid and keeping people idle. If one of the spaceship's citizens stood up and tried to argue that he ought to be free to build twenty Starbuck's for a profit, in the name of efficiency no less, he'd be shouted down as the insane, dangerous person he is.

That the earth is just such a spaceship is a universal truth that is dawning on us all. How can you remain faithful to this truth? Ordinary people can spread the truth far and wide. We can also seek state power and re-make the Law and the economy in the service of (not mere "recognition of") this truth. But whatever you do, don't open a highly profitable franchise, please.

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HOW MANY PEOPLE SHOULD DIE IN THE GUTTER BEFORE WE GET IT
Posted by: cori on Oct 24, 2008 8:29 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We are one nation. Anyone of us could go under. We are not a bunch of tribal villages. We pay trillions to the military but we would let our neighbor starve or die in the gutter, live in their car and oppose our tax dollars go to help them!!! We gave trillions in tax dollars to kill tne's of thousands of men, women and children in Iraq. Wake up! Who are we? What is important?
McCains says Obama wants to spread the wealth. You bet when 99% of the people in this nation have all the wealth! We don't bat an eye lash when they give billions OF OUR TAX DOLLARS to the drug and insurance companies but god forbid you should help a homeless family! Our nation if it is to be a civilized nation must take all under it's wing and not let the Corporations and the miltiarty industrial comples suck up all of our tax dollars while millions of Americans go hungry.

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Reagan
Posted by: JSquercia on Oct 24, 2008 9:31 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It all started with that famous Reagan quote that " the most frighting words are I'm from the Government and I'm here to help you "
The strange thing is that at one time Reagan was a liberal Democrat and Head of a union . I heard a commercial he made for Truman in 1948
and was absolutely stunned . What changed him I have no idea but his policies are 30 years old and we have seen the results . No regulation , free trade , and tax cuts that tilt toward the wealthy have left us with the largest inqualityof income among Western Nations , worse health care than our allies and at twice the cost . AND OH yes the BIGGEST Financial Crisis since the DEPRESSION .
We must turn the page on his failed phliosphy of Trickle down tax cuts and increasing our National Debt ( it is ten fold what it was when Reagan entered office )

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A Day in the Life....
Posted by: ohb0b on Oct 24, 2008 9:29 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
August 29th, 2004 9:38 pm
Day in the Life of Joe Middle-Class Republican

by John Gray

Joe gets up at 6:00am to prepare his morning coffee. He fills his pot full of good clean drinking water because some liberal fought for minimum water quality standards. He takes his daily medication with his first swallow of coffee. His medications are safe to take because some liberal fought to insure their safety and work as advertised.

All but $10.00 of his medications are paid for by his employers medical plan because some liberal union workers fought their employers for paid medical insurance, now Joe gets it too. He prepares his morning breakfast, bacon and eggs this day. Joe’s bacon is safe to eat because some liberal fought for laws to regulate the meat packing industry.

Joe takes his morning shower reaching for his shampoo; His bottle is properly labeled with every ingredient and the amount of its contents because some liberal fought for his right to know what he was putting on his body and how much it contained. Joe dresses, walks outside and takes a deep breath. The air he breathes is clean because some tree hugging liberal fought for laws to stop industries from polluting our air. He walks to the subway station for his government subsidized ride to work; it saves him considerable money in parking and transportation fees. You see, some liberal fought for affordable public transportation, which gives everyone the opportunity to be a contributor.

Joe begins his work day; he has a good job with excellent pay, medicals benefits, retirement, paid holidays and vacation because some liberal union members fought and died for these working standards. Joe’s employer pays these standards because Joe’s employer doesn’t want his employees to call the union. If Joe is hurt on the job or becomes unemployed he’ll get a worker compensation or unemployment check because some liberal didn’t think he should lose his home because of his temporary misfortune.

Its noon time, Joe needs to make a Bank Deposit so he can pay some bills. Joe’s deposit is federally insured by the FSLIC because some liberal wanted to protect Joe’s money from unscrupulous bankers who ruined the banking system before the depression.

Joe has to pay his Fannie Mae underwritten Mortgage and his below market federal student loan because some stupid liberal decided that Joe and the government would be better off if he was educated and earned more money over his life-time.

Joe is home from work, he plans to visit his father this evening at his farm home in the country. He gets in his car for the drive to dads; his car is among the safest in the world because some liberal fought for car safety standards. He arrives at his boyhood home. He was the third generation to live in the house financed by Farmers Home Administration because bankers didn’t want to make rural loans. The house didn’t have electric until some big government liberal stuck his nose where it didn’t belong and demanded rural electrification. (Those rural Republican’s would still be sitting in the dark)

He is happy to see his dad who is now retired. His dad lives on Social Security and his union pension because some liberal made sure he could take care of himself so Joe wouldn’t have to. After his visit with dad he gets back in his car for the ride home.

He turns on a radio talk show, the host’s keeps saying that liberals are bad and conservatives are good. (He doesn’t tell Joe that his beloved Republicans have fought against every protection and benefit Joe enjoys throughout his day) Joe agrees, “We don’t need those big government liberals ruining our lives; after all, I’m a self made man who believes everyone should take care of themselves, just like I have”.

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» Awesome Posted by: LeeAnnG
WHAT KIND OF NATION ARE WE?
Posted by: cori on Oct 24, 2008 9:33 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We are one nation. Anyone of us could go under at any time. Your spouse might get sick or you might lose your job. We are not a bunch of tribal villages. We pay trillions OF OUR TAX DOLLARS to the military but we would let our neighbor starve or die in the gutter, live in their car and still oppose our tax dollars going to help those in need!!! We gave trillions in tax dollars to kill ten's of thousands of men, women and children in Iraq. Wake up! Who are we? What is important? McCain says Obama wants to spread the wealth. You bet when 99% of the people in this nation have all the wealth! We don't bat an eye lash when they give billions OF OUR TAX DOLLARS to the drug and insurance companies but god forbid you should help a homeless family! Our nation, if it is to be a civilized nation, must take all under it's wing and not let the Corporations and the miltiarty industrial complex suck up all of our tax dollars while millions of Americans go hungry.

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ONLY ONE PER CENT OF THE PEOPLE IN THE NATION OWN 99PER CENT OF THE WEALTH
Posted by: cori on Oct 24, 2008 9:59 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
cORRECTION
HOW MANY AMERICAN’S SHOULD DIE IN THE GUTTER IN THE USA BEFORE WE GET IT?

We are one nation. Anyone of us could go under at any time. Your spouse might get sick or you might lose your job. We are not a bunch of tribal villages. We pay trillions OF OUR TAX DOLLARS to the military but we would let our neighbor starve or die in the gutter, live in their car and still oppose our tax dollars going to help those in need!!! We gave trillions in tax dollars to kill ten's of thousands of men, women and children in Iraq. Wake up! Who are we? What is important? McCain says Obama wants to spread the wealth. You bet when 1% of the people in this nation own 99 per cent of the wealth. We don't bat an eye lash when they give billions OF OUR TAX DOLLARS to the drug and insurance companies but god forbid you should help a homeless family! Our nation, if it is to be a civilized nation, must take all under its wing and not let the Corporations and the military industrial complex suck up all of our tax dollars while millions of Americans go hungry.

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I'm sorry but the elites are thriving because Main Street is EXPLOITING itself.
Posted by: maxpayne on Oct 24, 2008 10:04 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It's great that there are Sumaritans who are there to help. However, notice that "Thanksgiving Day" is a BIG JOKE and you ask why? Because the word GRATITUDE is a DIRTY WORD. Just ask "Joe The Plumber". The ungrateful bastard would rather he and the rest of us be stuck in Iraq for another 100 years and have Wall $treet continue its path towards corporate serfdom. When you have too many god damn motherfucking self-righteous motherfuckers within the working class fighting against those of us in the working class trying to stand up to the criminals on Wall $treet and the corrupt elites in Washington, then of course Main Street will remain the LOSER while Wall $treet, Big Religion, Big Military, and the corrupt pols laugh their asses to the bank until their ribs fall apart and have unlimited field days watching Main Street implode !!

Sorry if I sound like a mad man ranting but it doesn't matter who the hell wins the White House. We the people need to unite and quit sucking up to the propaganda that "only spending drives the 'economy'".

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» Ignorance Posted by: LeeAnnG
Interdependance
Posted by: Archie1954 on Oct 24, 2008 10:40 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We all live within a society, whether American, British, German etc. How those societies arrange themselves depends on the culture, social insitutions, ideology etc. of the society itself. American society has prospered unbelievably from its goal oriented, entrepreneurial bent. However American society unlike the others mentioned has not uniformly participated in the creation of all that wealth. Unlike most other first world countries Americans have arranged for a huge percentage of that wealth to find its way into the hands of a very few exceedingly wealthy people. the economy is only so large and when the majority of the wealth gravitates to a wealthy few it leaves very little else for the rest of society. This is not good for the society as a whole, for the poorer segments of it and even for the very wealthy. Why? Because it creates conflict which manifests itself at the beginning in a low key way with increased crime but could graduate to street battles and revolution. Why do you think the Latin countries had so much trouble with their revolutions and military tyrants? It was because of unfair distribution of the economic benefits. the US has for the most part escaped this trouble but the last 8 years of out and out theft of the profits of the American economy by Republican pirates of industry has brought the potential for such problems much closer than before. It would behoove the political elite to open up their eyes and the economic pocketbook to everyone not just themselves and their friends.

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My view point
Posted by: Axiom69 on Oct 24, 2008 11:39 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I have no problem whatsoever helping my neighbor. As a matter of fact I do help whenever asked. I have a fellow vet living with me right now who would be homeless otherwise. It is the Christian thing to do. Christ did say something to the effect that if your neighbor asks for your coat you should give it to him. What I do have a problem with is when my neighbor asks for my coat two IRS agents grab me, strip me of my coat and hand it to my neighbor.

If you are forced to help your neighbor it isn't charity, it's taxation. Charity begins at home not in Washington DC.

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» RE: My view point Posted by: fork
» RE: My view point Posted by: PaulD
» RE: My view point Posted by: Axiom69
he Government Does Not Have the Right
Posted by: websmith on Oct 24, 2008 11:45 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
People have the right to be good Samaritans. The government does not have the right to take our money and give it to someone else.

http://ewebsmith.com/Finance/notlistening.html

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My damned neighbors
Posted by: bettyn on Oct 24, 2008 11:55 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
don't need any help! They're the ones getting that $700 billion bailout (and they ain't sharing it with the peons, that's for sure. They're just buying bigger boats and another Mercedes!)

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Sorry to have to burst your little bubble
Posted by: MartianBachelor on Oct 24, 2008 1:08 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
> Above all, Obama and the Democratic Party are staunch supporters of civil
> rights and voting rights -- nothing could be more important for empowerment.

What a total load of first class BS!!

In 2004 the Undemocrats tried to take away my civil right to vote for the candidate of my choice by attempting to sue Ralph Nader off the ballot in practically every state in the nation, including mine. (He's the one largely responsible for the auto safety laws and other Good Things mentioned in a post above...) The Undemocrats couldn't stand any sort of that kind of "empowerment" going on.

They're nothing but a bunch of autocratic bullies with lawyers in $2,000 suits from my observations in the courtroom, when the rubber actually hits the road.

Fortunately, our state supreme court here in Colorado protected my civil rights against their dirty tricks. The ACLU was nowhere in sight, since their allegiance now is evidently to the Undemocrats rather than to civil rights.

So you'll have to go sell your silly unicorns and rainbows and other campaign drivel somewhere else. I will never vote for an Undemocrat again in my life. They've proven by their actions they're more a direct threat to my civil rights than their worst fevered nightmares involving Bush, Cheney, Rove, and Ashcroft.

I've seen nothing in the interim to cause me to even consider changing my mind, not even something to the effect that they were wrong and regretted doing what they did. For them it was just politics as usual -- try and crush the little guy in any way possible if he's in your way, because all the Undemocrats care about is money and power.

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OleManRiver
Posted by: OleManRiver on Oct 25, 2008 6:55 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Extremely complex article. The narrative transcends the recent writings by a variety of economists, as some of the above responses to it demonstrate.

I have an old friend from high school who is a scholar in Communitarianism, which of course ducks the label, Communism, because were he a Professor of Communism instead of Communitarianism he could not hold a job in American Academia.

The American people have been blindsided by a Dogma that some of us knew, instinctively, was an impossible path to the future. Financialism and Monetization of all things and processes is a Chimera. The head of a hawk attached to the body of an elephant a hundred times bigger than the head. Huge eyes, but no trunk and thus no sense of smell. After all, who needs a sense of smell 60,000 feet in the sky flying continent to continent to seal yet another sleazy deal in hopes that your "client" will not see through the bullshit contract forms.

The source of wealth is work. This fact goes not merely to Social Forms. It goes to Physics, and Chemistry. Humans can perform Work. We can change Physical Forms. We do ART for crying out loud. Seven billion highly educated brains with the embodiment of Ghandhi could do what? Perhaps Save the Planet?

Come Together. Act Now. Vote.

-30-

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cheating
Posted by: kennethkinkade on Oct 26, 2008 11:45 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I must take exception to a comment in the article:teachers punish collaboration as "cheating." I and many other teachers encourage and teach collaboration to our students, this is not cheating. What IS punished as cheating is in representing someone elses work as your own. Big difference.

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