COMMENTS: 494
Is a Presidential Coup Under Way?
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"My faith in the Constitution is whole; it is complete; it is total," she declared in her thundering voice. "And I am not going to sit here and be an idle spectator to the diminution, the subversion, the destruction, of the Constitution."Where are the likes of Barbara Jordan in today's Congress? While the BushCheney regime continues to establish a supreme, arrogant, autocratic presidency in flagrant violation of the Constitution, members of Congress largely sit there as idle spectators -- or worse, as abettors of Bush's usurpation of their own congressional authority.
Why it matters
Separation of powers. Rule of law. Checks and balances. These may seem to us moderns to be little more than a set of dry, legal precepts that we had to memorize in high-school history class but need not concern us now. After all, the founders (bless their wigged heads!) established these principles for us back in 17-something-or-other, so we don't really have to worry about them in 2007. Think again. These are not merely arcane phrases of constitutional law, but the very keystones of our democracy, essential to sustaining our ideal of being a self-governing people, free of tyrants who would govern us on their own whim. The founders knew about tyranny. The monarch of the time, King George III, routinely denied colonists basic liberties, spied on them and entered their homes at will, seized their property, jailed anyone he wanted without charges, rounded up and killed dissidents, and generally ruled with an iron fist. He was both the law and above the law, operating on the twin doctrines of "the divine rule of kings" and "the king can do no wrong."
(Alert: Ready or not, the following is a high-school refresher course on American government. There will be a test.) At the front of the founders' minds was the necessity of breaking up the authority of their new government in order to avoid re-creating the autocracy they had just defeated. The genius of their structure was that legislating, administering, and judging were to be done by three separate but coequal branches, each with powers to check the other two, and none able to aggregate all three functions into its own hands (a result that James Madison called the very definition of tyranny). Just as important, to deter government by whim, all members of the three branches were to be subject to the laws of the land (starting with the Constitution and Bill of Rights), with no one above the law. As Thomas Paine said, "The law is king."
These were not legal niceties but core restraints designed to protect citizens from power grabs by ambitious autocrats. Such restrictions also make our country stronger by vetting policies through three entities rather than one. This balanced authority helps avoid many serious policy mistakes (or at least offers a chance to correct them later), and it is intended to prevent the one mistake that's fatal to democracy -- allowing one branch to seize the power to rule unilaterally.
Of course, sound schemes are oft screwed up by unsound leaders, and we've had some horrible hiccups over the years. John Adams went astray early in our democratic experiment by claiming the unilateral authority to imprison his political enemies; Abe Lincoln took it upon himself to suspend habeas corpus during the Civil War; Woodrow Wilson launched his notorious Palmer Raids; FDR rounded up and imprisoned Japanese-Americans; J. Edgar Hoover and the infamous COINTEL program spied on and arrested thousands in the Vietnam War years; and Ronnie Reagan ran his own illegal, secret war out of the White House basement.
In all these cases of executive excess and abuse, however, outrage flowed from the public, courts stood up to the White House, congressional investigations ensued, and the American system regained its balance relatively quickly. As Jefferson put it when he succeeded Adams and repealed the Alien and Sedition Acts, "Should we wander [from the essential principles of our government] in moments of error or alarm, let us hasten to retrace our steps and regain the road which alone leads to peace, liberty, and safety."
This time is different
Now, however, come two arrogant autocrats like we've never seen in the White House. George W and his snarling enabler, Dick Cheney, are making a power grab so unprecedented, so audacious, so broad and deep, so secretive, so stupefying, and so un-American that it has not yet been comprehended by the media, Congress, or the public. The dictionary defines "coup" not just as an armed takeover in some Third World country, but as "a sudden and decisive action in politics, especially one affecting a change of government illegally or by force."
Constantly waving the bloody flag of 9/11 and swaggering around in commander-in-chief garb, the BushCheney duo are usurping authority from Congress, the courts, and the people, while also asserting arbitrary power that does not belong to the presidency. Their coup is changing our form of government, rewriting the genius of the founders by imposing a supreme executive that functions in secret and insists that it is above the law, unaccountable either to congressional oversight or to judicial review.
As Al Gore pointed out in a powerful speech he gave last year (read it here), the BushCheney push for imperial power is much more dangerous and far-reaching than other presidential excesses for a couple of big reasons. First, the Bushites make no pretension that they want these powers only temporarily, instead contending that a super-powerful presidency is necessary to cope with a terrorist threat that they say will last "for the rest of our lives." Second, they are not merely pushing executive supremacy as a response to an outside threat, but as an ideological, right-wing theory of what they allege the Constitution actually meant to say.
Called the "unitary executive theory," this perverse, antidemocratic construct begs us to believe that the president has inherent executive powers that cannot be reviewed, questioned, or altered by the other branches. Bush himself has asserted that his executive power "must be unilateral and unchecked." Must? Extremist theorists aside, this effectively establishes an executive with arbitrary power over us. It creates the anti-America.
The list of Bushite excesses is long...and growing:
- Their sweeping, secret program of warrantless spying on Americans -- in direct violation of a long-standing federal law intended to forestall such flagrant intrusions into people's privacy.
- The usurpation of legislative authority by attaching "signing statements" to laws passed by Congress, openly asserting Bush's intention to disobey or simply ignore the laws. He has used this artifice to challenge over 1,150laws, even though the Constitution and the founders never conceived of such a dodge (signing statements were concocted by Ed Meese, Reagan's attorney general, and were pushed at that time by a young Reaganite lawyer who is now ensconced for life on the Supreme Court, Sam Alito).
- Suspension of habeas corpus for anyone whom Bush deems to be an "enemy combatant"-allowing innocent people to be detained indefinitely in prison without charges or civil trial, subjected to abuse and even torture, and denied access to judicial review of their incarceration (thus usurping the power of the courts). The routine and illegal assertion of "executive privilege" to stonewall Congress's legitimate efforts to perform its constitutional obligation of executive oversight and to prevent the questioning of top officials engaged in outright violations of American law.
- The assertion of a "state secrets" doctrine to prevent citizens and judges from pursuing legitimate lawsuits on the spurious grounds that even to have the executive's actions brought before the court would endanger national security and infringe on executive authority.
- An ever-expanding grab bag of autocratic actions, including using "national security letters" to sidestep the courts and spy on American political groups and individuals with no connection at all to terrorism; censoring executive-branch employees and government information for political purposes and using federal officials and tax dollars to push the regime's political agenda; and, of course, outright lying to Congress and the public, including lying for the most despicable purpose of all -- putting our troops, our public treasury, and our nation's good name into a war based on nothing but hubris, oil, and ideological fantasies (including Bush's latest blatant lie that "progress" in Iraq warrants the killing and maiming of additional thousands of American troops -- none of whom comes from his family).
Democratic capitulation
What we have is a lawless presidency. But our problem is not Bush. He is who he is -- a bonehead. He won't change, and why should he? He's getting away with his power grab! So he has no reason to step back, and every reason to keep pushing and to keep trying to institutionalize his coup.
Rather, our problem is those weaselly, wimpy, feckless members of Congress who have failed to confront the runaway executive, who have sat silent or (astonishingly) cheered and assisted as their own constitutional powers have been taken and their once-proud, coequal branch has been made subservient to the executive.
In the first six years of BushCheney, the Republican Congress operated as no more than a rubber stamp for the accretion of presidential power, shamelessly surrendering its own autonomy in a burst of mindless partisan zeal. Too many Democrats just went along, either buying the lies or being cowed by the unrelenting politics of fear and intimidation whipped up by Bush and Cheney. (The Bushites are still using these bullying tactics, as when they demanded this past summer that Congress legalize their illegal domestic spy program and CIA chief Mike McConnell warned publicly that "Americans are going to die" if Democrats failed to pass it.)
Which brings us to the new Congress run by Democrats. Where are they? Yes, I know they have only slim majorities and that the GOP uses veto threats, filibusters, and demagogic lies to fight them -- but, come on, suck it up! At least stop voting for "the diminution, the subversion, the destruction, of the Constitution." For example, the party now in charge did indeed cave in to Bush's summer demand that it legalize his warrantless spying on Americans (a Lowdowner sent an email to me saying he hopes Bush gets caught smoking pot, because then the Democrats will immediately legalize it).
The founders would be stunned that Congress has failed to assert itself. They saw checks and balances not as an option but as an obligation, a fundamental responsibility that goes to the very heart of each lawmaker's oath faithfully to support and defend the Constitution.
It's important to note that Congress is not a weak institution. It has powerful muscles to flex, including control of the purse, which Congress used in 1973 to tell Nixon, "No, we will not provide money for you to extend the Vietnam War into Laos and Cambodia." Nixon had to back off. Legislators also have clear constitutional mandates to oversee, probe, and expose presidential actions (remember the extensive Fulbright hearings in the '60s and the Church investigations of the '70s, for example). Members of Congress have wide-ranging subpoena power, as well as something called "inherent contempt" power to make their own charges against outlaw executive officials and to hold their own trials. And, of course, they have impeachment power -- which the founders saw not only as a way to remove an outlaw president (or veep or cabinet officer), but also as a means to compel a recidivist constitutional violator to come before the bar of Congress and to be held accountable. The process itself, even if it does not lead to conviction in the Senate, is educational and chastening, putting the executive branch back in its place.
None of this is about making a partisan attack on BushCheney. It's really not about them at all. Rather, Congress must find its backbone because our democracy cannot function without a vigilant legislative branch. Outlaw presidents must finally leave office, but their precedents live beyond them if left unchecked. As historian Arthur Schlesinger wrote of the power-grabbing Nixon administration, "If the Nixon White House escaped the legal consequences of its illegal behavior, why would future presidents not suppose themselves entitled to do [the same]?"
Bang pots and pans
Sam Adams, the organizer of the Boston Tea Party, knew that it is the citizenry itself that ultimately has to do the heavy lifting of democracy building. "If ever a time should come when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats of government," he declared, "our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin."
That's us. And now is that time.
What can we do? We can do what millions have been doing-only more of it, more insistently, more loudly, more creatively. Our friend Molly Ivins, just before she died this year, urged us to start "banging pots and pans" to make the bastards hear us. Raise a ruckus through street demonstrations, peace actions, visits (and/or confrontations) with lawmakers, political campaigns, alliances with military families, religious ceremonies, coalitions with constitutional conservatives, outreach to young people, and grassroots media action, including blogs, email blasts, call-in radio, letters to editors, op-eds, bumperstickers, and whatever you've got. Make a mighty noise.
Don't forget our friends in office. Such Democrats as John Conyers, Henry Waxman, Barbara Lee, Lynn Woolsey, Russ Feingold, Pat Leahy, and Dennis Kucinich are all over Bush and Cheney with investigations, subpoenas, censure motions, impeachment bills, and exposes -- not only on the war, but most emphatically on constitutional abuses. Thank them, find out what you can do to help them, demand that your own Congress critter join them.
And here's a creative idea from Garret Keizer. I have no idea who he is, but he wrote a punchy piece in the October issue of Harper's Magazine (read it here) that I like and that Lowdowners might want to embrace. He's calling for a general strike. Not by unions, but by us-you and me. As a symbolically appropriate day, he suggests the first Tuesday of November, the traditional date for our elections -- this year, Nov. 6. He dubs it "The Feast of the Hanging Chads."
A general strike means that We The People, as many of us as possible, would disobey the inept, corrupt, undemocratic (add your own adjective here) system by withholding our presence at for least one day. Don't go to work. Stay home. Better yet, take some political action. Also, don't go to the mall, the supermarket, or the bank; don't use your credit card or make any commercial transaction. This would be the ultimate affront to the corporate president who so pathetically told us after 9/11 that our highest patriotic response to the attack was to "go shopping." So don't fly, use your cell phone (hard, I know), watch TV, or otherwise participate. Sometimes, silence is the loudest sound of all. As Keizer says, "As long as we're willing to go on with our business, Bush and Cheney will feel free to go on with their coup."
On one level, the strike is against the war, against Bush thumbing his nose at the American majority that has already emphatically said -- OUT! -- and against the Democratic leadership that can't seem to muster the will to rein in the Bush administration. On another level, however, this is a strike for the Constitution, a strike against the betrayal of the rule of law and our democratic ideals. It's a strike for the America we thought this was. It's an affirmation that the people are the only "larger force" that can stop the BushCheney coup and make America whole again.
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Comments are closed-
Posted by: NoPCZone on Oct 23, 2007 12:39 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If BushCo claims Executive Privilege invoke inherent contempt and lock him and whomever gets in the way up. When the NeoCons see that Congress has had enough the rest will fall in line as all will see 'The Decider' for the lame duck that he really is.
To my fellow AlterNet readers:
If you see one of our Senators or Representatives out on the campaign trail, don't ask them about Iraq or anything other than what are they going to do with the power ALREADY in their hands to stop this cabal from going one inch farther. If they will not do their job as Senators or Representatives, what makes you think they will do any better as President? They are unworthy of your vote.
It's time to turn up the heat on those who claim to be Democrats.
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» RE: Time To Step Up
Posted by: farmertx
» RE: Time To Step Up, or be Stepped ON!
Posted by: gazooks
» RE: Request impeachment or promise to vote against him or her next possible election.
Posted by: Christie
» Bullies do NOT fold ...
Posted by: BenCaxton12
» Keep saying the words "IMPEACH CHENEY AND BUSH" when ever the candidates come to....
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» RE: Time To Step Up
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» Turn up the heat?
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» RE: Turn up the heat?
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» RE: Turn up the heat?
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» RE: Time To Step Up
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» The Coup Has Already Occured! 9/11 Was an Inside Job
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» RE: The Coup Has Already Occured! 9/11 Was an Inside Job
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» RE: The Coup Has Already Occured! 9/11 Was an Inside Job
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Posted by: mcthorogood on Oct 23, 2007 12:55 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am a U.S. Citizen!
All 2008 presidential candidates are members of the prestigious cabal called the Council on Foreign Relations (CFR), except a few. "We the People of the United States of America", are headed towards a one world government, if the members of the CFR have their way. The old NAFTA treaty, the CAFTA treaty, and the recently implemented Security and Prosperity Partnership of North America (SPP) are stepping stones towards a "New World Order"(NWO).
What is the CFR agenda and who will it benefit the most? The hidden agenda of the CFR is to further diminish U.S. sovereignty, in order to foster free trade, which will benefit the owners of large multi-national corporations. The late Mr. Arthur M. Schlesinger wrote in the August 1995 edition of Foreign Affairs, "In defense of the world order ... U.S. soldiers would have to kill and die".
Today the European Union (EU) consists of 27 states, except Switzerland. On March 4, 2001 the Swiss voted on March 4, 2001 with a 77.3% majority to remain Swiss citizens, and not join the EU. The new EU Constitution has only been fully ratified by 16 of the 27 states.
I stand together with the proud Swiss, and prefer to remain a citizen of my own country, rather than a citizen of a supranational union. I like our present form of government established by the U.S. Constitution, and our liberties guaranteed by the Bill of Rights.
Ms. Daneen G. Peterson, Ph.D., gave a speech in Salt Lake City, UT, on September 9, 2006 entitled "America is a Constitutional Republic . . . NOT a Democracy". The contempt of the U.S. Constitution shown by our current president is evidenced by the part of her speech cited in the next paragraph.
..."In fact, the Constitution is far more than 'outmoded,' according to President Bush who rebuffed GOP leader's request to soft pedal some parts of the 'Patriot Act' by saying: "I don't give a goddamn . . . I'm the President and the Commander-in-Chief. Do it my way." Then, responding to an aide who stated: "There is a valid case that the provisions in this law undermine the Constitution." Bush screamed back: "Stop throwing the constitution in my face . . . It's just a goddamned piece of paper!""...
In case you may be wondering, which presidential candidates are not members of the CFR, one answer is on the sign in front of my house, please look at it when you pass by. Additional information about the North American Union can be found at Dr. Peterson's website StopTheNorthAmericanUnion.com. Other information on the NWO can be found at YouTube.com.
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» Thanks for the comment
Posted by: vox persona
» RE: Thanks for the comment
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» RE: That "goddamned piece of paper" comment is not irrelevant
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» RE: That "goddamned piece of paper" comment is not irrelevant
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» RE: That "goddamned piece of paper" comment is not irrelevant
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» RE: That "goddamned piece of paper" comment is not irrelevant
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» RE: That "goddamned piece of paper" comment is not irrelevant
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» RE: That "goddamned piece of paper" comment is not irrelevant
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» RE: Thanks for the comment
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» There are only two who are not CFR and that is Kucinch and Paul.
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» RE: There are only two who are not CFR and that is Kucinch and Paul.
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» That was cryptic and uninformative.
Posted by: Pepper
» RE: Thanks for the comment
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» You can't put the brakes on the future
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» Hightower needs to expand his perspective to include this
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» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
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» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» Wow, your one sick puppy.......
Posted by: Pepper
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: slashpot
Comments are closed-
Posted by: vox persona on Oct 23, 2007 1:05 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: Let's hope it's not too late
Posted by: VZEQICVA
» RE: Let's hope it's not too late
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: Let's hope it's not too late
Posted by: footman
» RE: Let's hope it's not too late
Posted by: catroina
» RE: Let's hope it's not too late
Posted by: footman
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Tom Degan on Oct 23, 2007 1:52 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Yes, folks, your constitution is in mortal peril. Then again, the fact that you're sitting there at your computer, reading AlterNet and not some right wing screed/blog tells me that you are probably more than aware of this nasty little fact. Are we all just preaching to the choir, so to speak? No, it's much more than that. We inspire each other to get motivated and do something about it. The revolution probably won't be televised. But of this you may be absolutely certain: It will be on your computer.
Seventy five years ago next March 4, Franklin D. Roosevelt set this country on a new course. Until a feeble-minded piece of shit named Ronald Reagan began to dismantle it twenty-seven years ago, the New Deal worked beautifully for America. Prior to FDR, there was no middle class in this country. There was just the very rich, the professional class, and all the rest. All the rest lived in grinding poverty.
If you want a good look into what it was like in this country for the average worker pre New Deal, by all means, pick up the book called, "The Jungle" by Upton Sinclair. When Mr. Sinclair died on November 25, 1968, his book was all-but-forgotten. I think it is telling that recent years have shown it to be gaining popularity again.
Tom Degan
Goshen, NY
"The Rant" by Tom Degan
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» Do I detect a note of discomfit?
Posted by: vox persona
» Thank you, Vox!
Posted by: Tom Degan
» RE: Thank you, Jim Hightower!
Posted by: aislinnluv
» The Return to the Jungle
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» Uh, no.
Posted by: Coleman
» RE: Uh, no. And thanks
Posted by: LeeAnnG
» RE: Uh, no.
Posted by: LMNOP
» Classic Right Wing Blame the Victim....
Posted by: CatDad
» Patriotism, like God and taxes, is for the "little people".
Posted by: LMNOP
» RE: The Return to the Jungle
Posted by: rainingwolf
» RE: Thank you, Jim Hightower!
Posted by: LeeAnnG
» Pre New Deal, "All the rest lived in grinding poverty?" Not true
Posted by: chief of okeefe
» RE: You got me, chief!
Posted by: Tom Degan
» RE: Thank you, Jim Hightower!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: Thank you, Jim Hightower!
Posted by: catroina
Comments are closed-
Posted by: xbj on Oct 23, 2007 3:07 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
That's why the gutless wonders do little, and the ones who have done anything at all to oppose him have balls of steel. Give credit where credit is due.
Once you know and can finally accept the facts about 9-11, everything makes horrific sense.
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» what sense?
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» RE: what sense?
Posted by: MyLeftFoot
» RE: Congress does nothing because they know BushCheneyCo pulled 9-11 and they're deathly afraid...
Posted by: WitchyNy
» RE: Congress does nothing because they know BushCheneyCo pulled 9-11 and they're deathly afraid...
Posted by: helenwheels
Comments are closed-
Posted by: kgs1947 on Oct 23, 2007 3:19 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: The Time is Still the Present
Posted by: groyne
» RE: The Time is Still the Present
Posted by: mcthorogood
Comments are closed-
Posted by: pacto on Oct 23, 2007 3:20 AM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: It`s to late, No it's NOT
Posted by: MyLeftFoot
» RE: It`s to late
Posted by: VZEQICVA
» RE: It`s to late
Posted by: pacto
» RE: YES, IT IS TOO LATE
Posted by: pammers
» RE: YES, IT IS TOO LATE
Posted by: makeadifference
» RE: YES, IT IS TOO LATE
Posted by: helenwheels
Comments are closed-
Posted by: DrGeneNelson on Oct 23, 2007 3:44 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
S. 2205 would burden the U.S. taxpayer to the tune of trillions of dollars, since it is the first step of a permanent, rolling amnesty. Unlike the so-called CIR that Senate leadership attempted to pass earlier in 2007, this bill has NO enforcement provisions.
Sen. Reid is attempting to sneak this one through via Rule 14, with a cloture vote set for Wednesday, Oct. 24. Call your Senators at (202) 224-2121 now to protest. You may also use the free citizen activism tools at http://NumbersUSA.com and http://www.FAIRUS.org
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» RE: Dr. Gene Nelson
Posted by: Shey
» DREAM Act
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» RE: Dr. Gene Nelson
Posted by: mcthorogood
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Suzon on Oct 23, 2007 4:10 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Get a more optimistic perspective than TPTB would like you to have. "We are all doomed" is a cop-out. Even with all the state terrorism directed against the people of Iraq (this has a very long history), there are Iraqis still around. Another 9/11 type of attack (of whatever origin) on American soil is not likely to wipe out everyone.
In my view, the complete surveillance and control of the population is not an achieveable goal. (What is achievable is the security industry making money by selling imperfect technology.) Have any of you ever chaired a meeting? People are too contrary to go along with any single notion, however often they are described as sheeple.
Remember that the Vietnamese routed the military might of the US of A with tunnels and bamboo sticks.
I'm not saying that bad things are unlikely or impossible, but that they are damned difficult.
Bang those pots and pans!
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» RE: first make yourself fearless and then enjoy having meaningful (if unpaid) work
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» RE: first make yourself fearless and then enjoy having meaningful (if unpaid) work
Posted by: channing
» RE: first make yourself fearless and then enjoy having meaningful (if unpaid) work
Posted by: VZEQICVA
» Of course we're not doomed
Posted by: dogman44
» Thanks for the optimism
Posted by: LeeAnnG
» RE: Pot & Pan banger speaks...
Posted by: makeadifference
» RE: Pot & Pan banger speaks...
Posted by: footman
Comments are closed-
Posted by: packofwolves on Oct 23, 2007 4:39 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: The time is now
Posted by: dennidus1680
» RE: The time is now
Posted by: VZEQICVA
Comments are closed-
Posted by: shangrilalad on Oct 23, 2007 5:09 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If Bush’s criminal regime were disappearing thousands of Americans into secret detention camps, would anyone tell us? Do you think our fascist owned Monopoly Media would warn us? Maybe not, but that’s crazy talk, right? They couldn’t keep something as horrific as that secret, could they? It’s not as if an iron curtain of secrecy has a descended on America, right?
But the thing is, dictators have used terrorism against their own people in the past and continue to do so today. It couldn’t happen in America no matter how much power Cheney & Bush have illegally seized, with no resistance from our Democratic leadership. It’s not as if our elected representatives are so terrified of Bush’s Fascist Regime that they’d sacrifice troublemakers to save themselves, but what if they don’t know what’s going on?
Bush controls all three branches of government, our armed forces, CIA, FBI, NSA, police and his private mercenary armies, but if you or I disappeared tomorrow, someone would notice and investigate. Right?
.
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» RE: Bush’s Fascist Regime
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» calm down lol
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» RE: calm down lol
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: Bush’s Fascist Regime... It's Do Or Die
Posted by: channing
» Its already happening
Posted by: Tombo
Comments are closed-
Posted by: hefalumpe on Oct 23, 2007 5:52 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
HE IS A DEM PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE. HE GETS NO COVERAGE BY THE MEDIA, BECAUSE HE WOULD WIN IF HE DID GET HEARD BY ENOUGH PEOPLE AND TREATED LIKE A SERIOUS CANDIDATE (WHICH HE CERTAINLY IS).
HE'S BEEN IN CONGRESS OVER 10 YEARS .... HIS RECORD SPEAKS OF GREAT PERSONAL COURAGE AND RESPECT FOR THE CONSTITUTION AND THE PEOPLE OF THIS COUNTRY.
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» RE: carla janson
Posted by: dennidus1680
» RE: carla janson
Posted by: josephq
» I'd rather vote for what I want
Posted by: LeeAnnG
» Same thing with Ron Paul...
Posted by: Cooltruth
» RE: carla janson
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: carla janson
Posted by: slashpot
» RE: carla janson Follow the money and the billionaires and Party leaders want Facsism
Posted by: SJ
Comments are closed-
Posted by: MyLeftFoot on Oct 23, 2007 6:18 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» "...like-minded people who don't actually DO anything"
Posted by: Beagle17
Comments are closed-
Posted by: johns333 on Oct 23, 2007 6:22 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Bush is after terrorists not political opponents. I have never seen such a collection of whackos as I have on this site.
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» well, at least alternet starts with an "a" so you didn't have to trouble yourself to find us
Posted by: Beck
» RE: well, at least alternet starts with an "a" so you didn't have to trouble yourself to find us
Posted by: VZEQICVA
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: Axiom69
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: LMNOP
» And once again you pove the point...
Posted by: worldwide65
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: andrushka
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: MyLeftFoot
» Yo, ditto head
Posted by: LMNOP
» You keep saying it -- please do it
Posted by: BTDT
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» one nut answers your questions
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» RE: where do these nuts like johns333 come from?
Posted by: channing
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: hurricane hugo
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: AMERICAN VETERAN
» We are scared because if you oppose Bush you are a "terrorist"
Posted by: chief of okeefe
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: skydog
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: SatanicJamboree
Comments are closed-
Posted by: LMNOP on Oct 23, 2007 6:32 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
First, let's recognize that we're well beyond that. There comes a time in the evolution of a republic into a dictatorship when the democratic processes that define a republic are no longer efficacious, processes such as voting, campaigning, letter-writing, protesting, referenda generation and the like. Obviously, none of things had any power in Hitler's Germany or Marcos' Philippines. When that time comes, the republic is gone and cannot be revived if it cannot be recovered by force.
There hasn't been an "if we - then they" threat to democracy since before the 2006 election. Clearly, democracy was already dead in America by then. We had had three consecutive tainted elections already in 2000, 2002, and 2004, all with losers assuming office. Then, in 2006, the voters sent Congress and the president a mandate to begin ending their war. They laughed. Congress took impeachment off of the table and approved Bush's war budget without benchmarks, goals or timelines. Bush escalated the war.
Another poster noted, "We've been out on the streets, tasered, put in the jails, blacklisted by Homeland Security, given federal prison sentences for non-violent protest, and organized until we're exhausted, but nothing changes"
I believe that it's too late for activism. "So, let us not talk falsely now - the hour is getting late."
Next, let's recognize that the American people are just as morally defective as their (our) government.
America is a cruel country populated by a jaded, self-indulgent, consumptive and self-centered people. So, Americans are well represented by a cruel, arrogant, ignorant, inarticulate, sociopathic imitation of a cowboy. These are not the qualities of Bush that America objects to, and they were out there for all to see certainly by 2004, when Bush garnered close to half of the votes legitimately.
What America objects to is that Bush isn't kicking Iraq's ass hard enough. If Blackwater could squelch the resistance in Iraq and get the oil flowing, even if it used genocide to do so, Bush would be a popular president. Torture is not an issue for Americans. Nor the loss of their rights. Americans don't mind Bush snubbing the UN, the French or Kyoto.
Katrina is no problem for Americans to absorb. They may tsk-tsk a little, but they don't really care. Lying America into the Iraqi quagmire, or outing an undercover CIA operative? Both were well known in 2004 - and apparently weren’t deal breakers for the good American people in Bush’s bid to keep the White House. No problema. Despite the extremely long laundry list of Bush's failures and deficiencies, the only reason America has given up on him is the same reason Steinbrenner turned on Joe Torre: he’s not kicking enough ass.
So, the whole kit and caboodle is damaged goods. The Republicans, the Democrats and the people, for whom the politicians are merely a reflection, an epitome, are all ready for history's trash pile.
I believe that this race is run, and it's time to begin recognizing that this problem is out of the hands of the people now, and that they were never up to it in the first place. America was anxious to go where Bush took them, and apparently fully approved. It's only progressives that have objected - mostly to each other on sites like this.
As I’ve indicated many times before, it’s time to give up on America and the American people. They’re really not worth fighting for. For krissake, they don’t even object to fraudulent wars and torture.
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» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: Scott
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: Ivann
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: Skunkatthepicnic
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: astudent
» Let's face reality, however terrible it is
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now.....
Posted by: Captainmagic
» My response is a line from another song:
Posted by: hurricane hugo
» So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: CatDad
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: makeadifference
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: FedererFan
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: odom79
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: LMNOP
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now....Marines
Posted by: Captainmagic
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now (understanding americans)
Posted by: Sum Won
» Sorry, I'll stick by the people...
Posted by: worldwide65
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now A bit uninformed, but would it make any differance
Posted by: SJ
Comments are closed-
Posted by: rocketman on Oct 23, 2007 6:38 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We should all remember that the first question asked after 9-11 is how come we didnt know about these plans. How did this happen. To Bush's credit he addressed this problem (he may have screwed up most other things but this he is getting right.
The the policies that this administration and congress have instituted are those that fit the times and circumstances and are no different than what was done in other wars..including the civil war.
Dont let the emense dislike for Bush blind us in what makes sense and what doesn't.
Our focus should be on what could be another war with Iran. Should that happen our homefront will be in deep shit and the current "trampling" on the constitution will seem like ants walking compared to the buffalo we can expect!
Hopefull congress has the balls (which they don't) to stall any actions until a new President takes office!
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» This he is getting right?
Posted by: Windwhistler
» Your last sentence is interesting.
Posted by: Coleman
» RE: Your last sentence is interesting.
Posted by: rocketman
» RE: My, what an Appeasing Neo-Nose you have there rocketman
Posted by: channing
» RE: My, what an Appeasing Neo-Nose you have there rocketman
Posted by: rocketman
» Venezuela IS democratic.
Posted by: pig
» RE: What makes sense!
Posted by: brunowe
» RE: What makes sense???
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: What makes sense!
Posted by: WILLYBILLO7
» RE: What makes sense!
Posted by: skydog
» RE: What makes sense!
Posted by: mcthorogood
Comments are closed-
Posted by: US Citizen on Oct 23, 2007 6:57 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
But there was the very inconvenient fact that the United States was a democracy and the President was supposed to change after eight years. For a while, the oil interests considered keeping their prime team, George W. Bush and Dick Cheney, in office past 2008. They may have decided that this would cause too much outrage, so their next plan was to subvert the 2008 elections via the Justice Department and Alfredo Gonzales. This also provoked outrage. Now I think these interests are somewhat resigned to the fact that George W. Bush cannot continue to be President, so the next best thing is to do whatever it takes to make sure the next President, Republican or Democrat, follows the Bush family oil agenda. Thus now even the major Democratic candidates are toeing the Bush family line on keeping troops in Iraq and speaking out vociferously against Iran. The major requirement to be President in 2008 is to follow the Bush family agenda.
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» RE: Bush Family Business Interests
Posted by: GANDALF84
» Yes. Peak oil is a myth.
Posted by: pig
» RE: Bush Family Business Interests
Posted by: Skyelav
» RE: Bush Family Business Interests
Posted by: channing
» RE: Bush Family Business Interests
Posted by: mcthorogood
Comments are closed-
Posted by: williameon on Oct 23, 2007 7:04 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Even before the Shrub said, wait till the votes are counted.
He still lost even after all of their trickery. But, nobody knows it! The Faux Media or The Cor‘pirate’ BULL HORN is too busy spewing BU__! SH__!, to tell you the truth. Disinformation and propaganda is all you get. Everybody knows it.
You think any of these Media Prostitutes are going to say a word? They’ve sold out. They’re on the payroll. The are pawns in the game and willing participants in the deception.The Shrub resents you. He was born into nobility and you’re just a clog in the machine. What we have now is a Demockery. A sham. A Puppet Show for paupers.
Steal everything for their friends! Empty the Treasury. Devalue your savings. Ruin The Dollar. Things are really looking up from Bushes paper cup.
That Silver Spoon has really worked wonders for him and his treacherous family.
Shills for Billionaires. They’ll do all the dirty work for a pittance of the haul.
The Corpirates have taken over. They are in complete control. They own all the Media. They own the Arms companies. You even dunk their donuts. They're ordering the Militia to commit suicide in a phony War. Sacrifice more of your sons and daughters for Dead Eye Dick. Who controls the Dark Army?
The Dark Army stands in violation to the constitution.
Oh, I forgot! The Constitution is just a piece of paper.
Bush’s toilet paper.
Better be good or they will send the dark army aganist you, again. Just like they do everyday to other poor countries. They have privatized your government. They own it. The Nazi’s won the War. The Corpirates who perpetuated the Nazi rise, won here. All those Fairy Tales about WWII are meaningless. They are selling World War III. We live in a Fascist Stupid State. Where the politicians are traitors.
Where the Secret Police. NSA, FBI, CIA, Torture and Spy on us! Why! Because they are afraid of you. You're the enemy within. The Sleeping Giant must be bound and tied.
Lied to and denied or he might awaken someday and Kick these Bass-Turds ass. Who's ass? The Alien Aristocracy.
The Shrub, Dead Eye Dick and the rest of his Corpirate Traitors.
Who rape and pillage the world in the name of Democracy and freedom.
Greedy Hypocrites and Liars who worship the golden calf.
Too bad nobody can put two and two together anymore and stop them.
They are too busy watching The FAUX MEDIA, working three jobs and drowning in debt.
The Shrub’s idea of the New Ameri-con Dream.
Three jobs and in Debt!
The Slaves have all been co-opted: Brain washed, Poisoned, Imprisoned, Militarized, Drugged, Tortured, Sick, Spied on, Afraid, Overworked and Underpaid. How wonderful for Bush & Con. Sell them more delusion and poison. The weight of the whole Corpirate system is riding on your shoulders. While our Militia is overseas robbing oil, who is going to protect us here?
From Dead Eye Dick the Virtual Vigilant?
They have weapons you haven’t even dreamed of to use in
Another War. Don’t worry! They will provide the weapons and the army. The only thing you must provide is the BLOOD to lubricate the wheels of their War Machine.
Mindless Robo-Trons bully and victimize people so they can,
Sell you another even bigger pile of sh__. Robots control us now. Look at them. They show no emotion. They have no positive human qualities. What are they? Alien Politicians
Talking Endless! BU__! SH__! The system is corrupted.
Shut it down. REBOOT!
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» RE: It’s too late.
Posted by: makeadifference
Comments are closed-
Posted by: stevor on Oct 23, 2007 7:23 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: The Dodd that is stepping up is Chris, Senator from CT.
Posted by: groyne
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Beagle17 on Oct 23, 2007 7:20 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
They obviously got Hillary on board. In case no one has noticed, the two most genuinely popular candidates in the party nomination races, Kucinich and Paul, are constantly sidelined by the corporate controlled media.
Let him who has eyes see. It's so bloody obvious that the whole political scene these days is a gigantic sham, the only wonder is how those still in denial manage to look at themselves in the mirror.
War is the biggest segment of the economy. Oil is second. It has been this way for years. No one has the guts to challenge this SOP.
A general strike might be a good way to begin, but good luck trying to make that happen. I have posted that suggestion several times on comment threads at various sites, and each time it was met with absolutely no response from anyone.
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» RE: You got it, Pontiac. another course of action
Posted by: MyLeftFoot
» A more effective course of action -
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: You got it, Pontiac.
Posted by: PJAW
» RE: You got it, Pontiac.
Posted by: jbur816
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Trixie on Oct 23, 2007 7:57 AM
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» RE: not entirely true, Trixie
Posted by: channing
» RE: Trixie
Posted by: mcthorogood
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Posted by: LIBBIEBETH on Oct 23, 2007 8:01 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» THINK CLEARLY
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
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Posted by: maxpayne on Oct 23, 2007 8:22 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Now, could SF wake up and RECALL that fucking HAG and give Cindy Sheehan a chance to lead ?!?!?
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» Pelosi is an actor, like most of Congress, but it's
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: Pelosi is an actor, like most of Congress, but it's
Posted by: weatherking
» RE: Pelosi is an actor, like most of Congress, but it's
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: Recall Pelosi, I've been saying she was wrong before she was voted in!
Posted by: common intelligence
» People are waking up and there is hope. I have a bumper sticker on my car with....
Posted by: Pepper
» RE: People are waking up and there is hope. I have a bumper sticker on my car with....
Posted by: jbur816
» Yes, it would...... and every single person that went by and saw it gave me a thumbs up.
Posted by: Pepper
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Col. Jackleg on Oct 23, 2007 8:37 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: We need more than Hightower!
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» Palace coup?
Posted by: Col. Jackleg
» RE: We need more than Hightower!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» Progression
Posted by: Col. Jackleg
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Posted by: Constitutionalist75 on Oct 23, 2007 9:22 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» You maybe right, but we have to give this one more chance for the system to work.
Posted by: Pepper
» RE: You maybe right, but we have to give this one more chance for the system to work???
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» What????
Posted by: pig
» Actually, Paul was asked and he said, while they disagree on some things, they are......
Posted by: Pepper
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Posted by: channing on Oct 23, 2007 12:02 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Only anti-CFR candidate Ron Paul
Kucinich is there too, and moreover why I propose that these two abandon their soldout parties and run a one term clean-up of the beltway, foreign policy, clean elections and campaign finance... Right and Left have everything at stake, these two can join us.
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Posted by: skydog on Oct 24, 2007 11:52 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Oh, yeah, Ron Paul! Jumpin' jiminy, he's jes' like Jeezus Keeerhist hisself!!! He's the ANSWER!! Whoooooooeeee!!! Only Ronny understands the magnitude of the problem! That's why a flat tax is so important -- we need to complete the transfer of the burden of paying for this crony war profiteering to the middle and lower class that Reagan started.
You gotta be smokin' some really good rope over there, my friend. You'd and the rest of the Ron Paul campaign staff would be better served trying to convince people on FreeRepublic.com.
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Posted by: mcthorogood on Oct 24, 2007 3:47 PM
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Posted by: Suzon on Oct 23, 2007 9:28 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I didn't like being fingerprinted and being forced to swear a loyalty oath in the 1950s, anymore than I like the idea of having to report to another city to have my irises scanned. But we got through the McCarthy era and we have to get through the Bush era.
When Harold Wilson was prime minister TPTB considered a military coup but decided against it. Can't you see the cracks in the administration? Guess what? Your worst dreams--like your best hopes--would be pretty hard to realize.
I think that the Nancy Pelosi-Hilary Clinton pact suggested by a commenter upthread is very promising. Neither one of them can afford to be seen to have sold out the American people for personal reasons. Out them and get rid of the roadblock to impeachment.
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» RE: how is the "it's too late" talk different from "reds under the beds" panic?
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» politicians need more than corporate bucks, they need something that passes for respect
Posted by: Suzon
» RE: politicians need more than corporate bucks, they need something that passes for respect
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: how is the "it's too late" talk different from "reds under the beds" panic?
Posted by: scoutkai
Comments are closed-
Posted by: madmac10 on Oct 23, 2007 9:41 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What a bag of crybabies! All this handwringing and pillowbiting ain't gonna stop the wheels of history from grinding our bones to flour! But when has that stopped us before?
Americans must be the most gloomy people in history--they make the Swedes look postively comic! How come only GWB gets to guffaw any more? Look--some day soon, the blood will run in our gutters, and we will not have the time or energy to join the paddy farmer and dirt-scratcher in joyful gratitude for this life.
Quit feeling bad. We are not to blame for what is happening to the world--forces greater than us are at play here (and I believe more than anything else, those forces are testing our ability to laugh, love & dance in their face. If you cannot laugh at the devil, then you are damned!) I mean, some of us are lucky enough to have a larger role to play in history's sweep, and by all means, play your part the best you can. But only a lunatic would weep to sleep for not being one of the Beckhams or Bonos. Are we a nation of lunatics? I thought not.
Here's what is going to happen: the pendulum will swing wider and wider, the stakes will rise and rise, and reactions will become stronger and stronger. This scenario WILL play out with a big bang that will make the Reign of Terror look like the Night of the Long Knives. I pray that you and your children will not suffer more than those who deserve it, but in the meantime, make like the Weimars and treat yourself to a good stiff drink. And for God's sake, cheer up!
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» RE: Cheer Up???
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» Even the Buddhists believe in Hell
Posted by: snideelf
» RE: ven the Buddhists believe in Hell
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: ven the Buddhists believe in Hell
Posted by: thekidde
» Re: "Drink Good Booze"
Posted by: makeadifference
» RE: e: "Drink Good Booze"
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: Cheer Up!
Posted by: thought-crime
Comments are closed-
Posted by: common intelligence on Oct 23, 2007 11:09 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Recall her and others. They are not acting on the behalf of their constituents.
Even Diane Feinstein is wrong, She refuses to Impeach get her out of there. For all the good things she's done. This solely out weighs it.
Arianna Huffington, had the chance to confront Pelosi on her resent interview on The subject of Impeach or Stop the War . Arianna said she believed it would take too much.... energy away from ending the war.
But these three women, it just so happens to be, they just don't get it.
End BUSH means End the war. Impeach the SOB. Or do what ever needs to be done to stop these pirates that have taken over the country.
Bush / Cheney are the domestic enemies of the United States of America.
Now is the time for all good men and women to come to the aid of their country.... to protect it from this domestic enemy. Where is our military when we need them ?
They've been shanghaied!
Why can't the nation rally to make it happen. What have we got to loose?
The people that work for the Corporate media and all Corporate powers are the scared ones stopping it from happening because they are so scared of loosing their jobs, their livelihoods. THeir 401k's their retirement, thier American Dream.
Mean while the nation and whole world is going to bury itself under the guise of an illusionary sense of ( temporary) well being. Their selfish ways will lead to their childerns burden
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» RE: CALL Pelosi ! Impeach The BUSH /Cheney Cons
Posted by: makeadifference
» RE: CALL Pelosi ! Impeach The BUSH /Cheney Cons
Posted by: mcthorogood
Comments are closed-
Posted by: odom79 on Oct 23, 2007 11:17 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» They are calling for some sort-of general strike...
Posted by: snideelf
» RE: They are calling for some sort-of general strike...
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: so what do we do
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: so what do we do
Posted by: makeadifference
» RE: so what do we do
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: so what do we do
Posted by: thought-crime
Comments are closed-
Posted by: snideelf on Oct 23, 2007 11:42 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron." (July 1920)
-from Dark Ages America written by Morris Berman
chapter 8
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» Amen
Posted by: Philip Newton
» RE: H.L. Mencken
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: H.L. Mencken
Posted by: LeeAnnG
» RE: H.L. Mencken
Posted by: worldwide65
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Posted by: Philip Newton on Oct 23, 2007 12:56 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: IT'S ONE PARTY, STUPID!
Posted by: mcthorogood
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Posted by: thekidde on Oct 23, 2007 1:42 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: Suzon on Oct 23, 2007 1:46 PM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Gird your loins,all you egalitarian girls and guys. The real battle is psychological.
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Posted by: kogwonton on Oct 23, 2007 2:29 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Great article. Too bad this kind of talk is coming so late.
I think we strike at least once a week till election day. and for a week straight ON election day. What the hell... we should step it up till these bastards are hung from flagpoles (after a impeachment, a stint at guantanimo, and when that's repealed, a fair trial).
PEACE
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» RE: HEAR HEAR!!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: HEAR HEAR!!
Posted by: maktan1
Comments are closed-
Posted by: WitchyNy on Oct 23, 2007 3:05 PM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Find a way to make a low income living-out of the system as much as possible- and live on it. Sell anything expensive you don't need.
Grow a garden-eat what you grow. Join an worker owned- food co-op for the rest. Don't eat at resturants. (Except for worker owned radical cafe's and such)
Develop alternative energy for your home. Solar, woodstoves what ever will work when the grid is shut off. Store lots of food, candles, matches and more. Put your money into food and tools instead of the banks.
Don't buy a new car. Drive an old one and get a horse or mule if you live outside the cities.
Don't buy new clothes- Buy things at second hand stores and garage sales.
Organize your area. Trade skills. Organize communities that have their own community wells, gardens, windmills and so on.
NOW have a General Strike.
Some people say we should start bombing dams. Two for the price of one. One for the Revolution, One for the fish and sediment. Not me, mind you- but some people.
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» RE: WHAT TO DO-GO ON STRIKE AGAINST THE SYSTEM
Posted by: odom79
» RE: WHAT TO DO-GO ON STRIKE AGAINST THE SYSTEM
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: WHAT TO DO-GO ON STRIKE AGAINST THE SYSTEM
Posted by: mcthorogood
Comments are closed-
Posted by: mjm3iii on Oct 23, 2007 3:25 PM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I have never heard or read of anyone voicing these thoughts. Why is that? Could it be that many Americans fear retribution from the bushies? I remember back in the bushs first term and America's first sentence under the bush. Many Americans were treating the bush as the second coming of Jesus Christ, God told me to attack Iraq. Remember that sad part of American history? I will never forget it!
A man in Oregon was at a bar and said something detrimental about the bush and was thrown into jail! Nobody talked about it much and I was here in nowheresville Juneau Alaska in awe that such a travesty like this flagrant abuse of power could happen in America...today!
Have Americans lost their balls???
I suffered a major brain injury on 9/12/1990 when the world was first experiencing the internet highway. The beginning of the information age. Back in the good ol' days of Bill Clinton.
Oww, got some on here the anti-Clintonites bushies that I know patrol these message boards waiting to spout out their anti-liberal views. Anyone that won't agree to their lies is a liberal to those Neanderthals.
Because of my brain injury like most of us had to re-learn everything. Walk, talk, speak, think, everything you can think of that has to do with the human condition. The really hard one to accept was that people lied! People lied? People don't always tell the truth??? Why??? Why would people lie?
One of my sayings now is that IF your not as good as your world you ain't worth s_it! Bush is not as good as his word is an understatement. My statement applies especially to the filth that is bush!
Bush, the president of America??? Welcome to my nightmare!!!
Now that bush has brought WW3 out of the bag it makes me wonder IF one of my hypothesis's may be correct.
Where would the best place be for the Anti-Christ to be before it makes it's final struggle against God's creation? How about the most powerful country on earth...America! Bush the anti-Christ??? Naw...he's too much of an idiot!
Maybe but at one time he enjoyed the popularity that the anti-Christ is supposed to attract according to the new testament.
In revelations it says that many will claim to be Christian but few are. It also says that being complacent is the true sin.
Complacency is everywhere. Look at all the homeless in America. The RICHEST nation in the world and we have a large population of homeless people! Complacency the true sin!
It is time for the ordinary people of America to stand up and say enough throw those Neanderthal bums out of America's house!
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» RE: 2nd American Revolution!
Posted by: odom79
» RE: 2nd American Revolution!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: 2nd American Revolution!
Posted by: mcthorogood
Comments are closed-
Posted by: johndoraemi on Oct 23, 2007 4:46 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
They had accepted corporate corrupt rule, a legalized bribery system where their interests were not near the top of the list. That was evident with the export of millions of our jobs to lower paying third world countries. Those in charge were not representing us, or our interests, not for a very long time.
The false flag / allowed to happen 9/11 attack was the final solution to fat stupid Americans who own too much wealth for the masters' liking. It was the seminal event of a new act in the class struggle -- in addition to its foreign policy / resource grab objectives.
Bush was installed (unlawfully) to bankrupt the nation, thereby leading to desperation, militarism, and expanded government control of our lives (techno-fascism).
The endless war paradigm ("war on terror") which is accepted by every sector of the elites, becomes the smoke screen to accomplish a whole lot of other nasty business.
With an oligarchy in control of the media, and very little true opposition allowed to speak to the masses at all, they feel quite comfortable pushing the envelope with more outrageous assaults on our liberties, our econimic interests, our children, our very minds. We are drowning in half truth propaganda, and the people are routinely offered a Coke v. Pepsi choice to rule over them -- as if it really mattered.
Much cognitive dissonance out there, paralysing the masses, preventing them from agreeing on a solidarity plan.
+
"If you had, you'd know you can always hire half the poor to kill the other half."
--Boss Tweed (Gangs of NY)
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» RE: The long descent into fascism.
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: The long descent into fascism.
Posted by: helenwheels
Comments are closed-
Posted by: thekatman on Oct 23, 2007 5:48 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
look at what NY wants to do.... give illegal immigrants a driver's licnese..... NOT!
Bank of America is giving our credit cards to illegal immigrants..... STUPID move.
Congress is considering providing college grants and loans to illegal immigrants.... WHAT??????
Our own citizens can't get college loans, with the high cost of a college education these dyas, and Congress wnats to give away our hard earned money to illegal immigrants? Damn, we're screwed.....
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» RE: Young people 18 - 45... Stop complaining and do something
Posted by: helenwheels
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Posted by: eagleeye on Oct 23, 2007 6:29 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» so true and yet
Posted by: Missing Piece
» RE: mick3
Posted by: mcthorogood
» In the making?
Posted by: QuestionAuthority
» RE: In the making?
Posted by: helenwheels
» Not for long..... Bush and Cheney have them in their sites.
Posted by: Pepper
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Missing Piece on Oct 23, 2007 7:33 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Republicans are trying to lose elections, because they know the house of cards is about to fall. How do they know? because most of them are oil men and women who have watched oil production stagnate and decline.
Forget about the government saving us, it is too weak now and will become even weaker. Get ready for a depression that has no end. Learn how to raise livestock, grow food and store food. Oil has peaked and we have no alternatives to this energy dense gift from the dinosaurs. Even wind is a net energy loser.
Hey, it could be worse, we could be wasting our remaining resources fighting wars for a resource that will soon be gone anyway.......oh wait
Good Luck, Build and earth home and go off grid
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Posted by: common intelligence on Oct 23, 2007 7:56 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
These are the republicans, people that will be forced to realize and scream to the top of their smoke filled lungs when the great insurance companies in the sky claim bank ruptcy.
Just watch as the kaos is unleashed. Like when they all realize ,"hey where was the National Guard?"
Like when these former fat cats see how long Homeland Security takes to get the check in the mail!
Winter is coming on folks. The real "Fire Storm" is yet to come. Listen when Schwartsnagger get's pissed.
The coup de tat is going to be the people taking over or being run over by the governement. Man, this is a great time for Bush to initiate marshall law.
Where will the San Diego Charges play ball? People are going to need that stadium to make home?
Oh, Where is the Fed-eral Gov. going to get the money to give "low interest loans" to people. Oh, out of thin air.
Oh, this could get the housing market back in high gear.
Man, I can hear the dollar signs ringing in my ears now.
There's money to be made here.
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» RE: The SOCAL Fires will make SudoRepubs realize How Screwed up this country is
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: The SOCAL Fires will make SudoRepubs realize How Screwed up this country is
Posted by: helenwheels
» Well, thats good, most revolutions were started by the landed gentry/elite/middle class.
Posted by: Pepper
Comments are closed-
Posted by: DaBear on Oct 23, 2007 8:37 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The shitstorm is coming...
(I always wanted to do that.)
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» He bought that for the water... he and Rev Moon if you can believe it.
Posted by: Pepper
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Canaan on Oct 24, 2007 12:23 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I'm wary when people quote noble high-minded speeches in defense of our Constitution, whether from Barbara Jordan or the powdered wig set. I quote the machiavellian Federalist Papers. "If men were angels, they wouldn't need a government, and if they were governed by angels, they wouldn't need a constitution." We are not and never will be governed by angels.
The Founders weren't angels, either. The Constitution--checks, balances and all--is the blueprint for a permanent superpower--an empire that will rise and never fall. The plan was to maximize American power through a 'more perfect union' -- Texas oil, midwestern farmland and New York ports together under one central government that doesn't screw it all up equals World Superpower. The Bill of Rights is in there so minorities and the underclass don't blow their stack and revolt. If anyone else had pulled off what the Founders did -- say, a United States of Africa -- they'd be running the world instead of us.
That's a cynical but not entirely dark view -- the Founders believed some degree of morality in government--The Bill of Rights--was necessary to keep the state from destroying itself -- to abort what Aristotle called the 'cyclical decay of the state'. It's the only reason Bush 41 didn't open fire Tianemen-style on the L.A. rioters. Madison told him he'd ultimately bring down the U.S. behaving that way.
So Bush is tampering with the blueprints of the American superpower. He's playing out Bin Laden's vision to bring down America: Destroy their Constitution, and thereby destroy their nation.
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Posted by: compu on Oct 24, 2007 12:35 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
forties.3 yrs ago Limbaugh was daily guest,Bush picture
was in the living room,then one the boys in Iraq was killed
and the other's leg was blown.He is going throgh the drill at
the vets,the Betheda syndrome.
The guy had small company lawnmoving,he was injured
last july.I have noticed envelopes sitting there unopened
for days and days,letters from the mortgage companies
they just look each other,one senses the crisis.
I just wonder,how many people that blindly follow this bunch
is in similar predicament?
You guestsed,there is not more Limbaugh,and the other.
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» RE: Maybe our friend johns333 will find this a mirror....
Posted by: mcthorogood
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Brueckner on Oct 24, 2007 1:53 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Bush has followed on with CAFTA, and the Security and Prosperity Partnership of North America. (note that it is not called a treaty).
Bush and his congress of R's and D's advanced the police state at home. Converting the Justice Department to his personal legal service that rubber stamped his outright acts of tyranny and rebellion against the Constution.
Bush and his congress of R's and D's initiated Eisenhower warned this country about the military industrial complex. R's and D's in Congress approved Bush's act of aggression against Iraq. Most notable when the people got fed up last November with Bush's 30 year war and his annointed powers as world cop by the R and D political system, they were stampeeded from the R side to the D side of the politcal system and voted majority power to the D side expecting change. The D side showed complicity and collusion with the ongoing Globalization conspiracy, the economic conquest of the world. Corporatism reigns and americans reclassified as the workforce are now government by business and economic principles. Economic Development is funded by the assets resources and tax money of the lower class to insure the success and profitablity of the Corporations.
Weath transfers from the lower class to the super rich and corporations.
Globalization is a conspiracy of the R and D political system to subjigate all people with the market economy.
Corporations hold the monopoly on jobs, thereby controlling wages, everything we buy comes from corporations who control the prices. People are on an econoic treadmill. This is not a free society, this is slavery!
When corporations run into economic problems they solution them by layoffs, firings and pay and/or pension and benefit cuts, throwing all of those people into their own personal economic depression.
When you only make enough money to sustain your family this is peonage, indentured servitude, tenant farmers, serfs and you dont need bars on the windows or chains on your ankles when you are ruled to business and economic principles.
It is time for all Americans to destroyed the R and D political system that has laid this conspiracy upons us.
Voter imposed term limits are the method
Never vote for an R or a D or anyone that has ever been an R or a D.
Vote only for those statemen and statewoman that will look you in the eye and swear to return this nation to the principles of the Constitution. (You may need to write the names in on the ballots to avoid manipulation of the vote through electronic voting that R's and D's forced upon us with HAVA)
We have degenerated to what we are by allowing R and D politicians to nest in the seats of government and play musical chairs with government seats.
Our nation has degenerated to nothing more that a mob of political hacks who have assumed autocratic powers. Help save this nation and yourself apply you personal voter imposed term limits.
On term and theyre all out!
What have you got to lose?
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» RE: Globalization, the conspiracy of the R and D political system
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: Globalization, the conspiracy of the R and D political system
Posted by: mcthorogood
Comments are closed-
Posted by: yeske24 on Oct 24, 2007 6:18 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I will do my part in voting for the best Democratic candidate but in my heart, I believe it will be for naught.
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» RE: Protect our ballots? Protect our lives!
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: Protect our ballots? Protect our lives!
Posted by: mcthorogood
Comments are closed-
Posted by: tooldoc60 on Oct 24, 2007 10:28 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: where do we start? where do i sign up?
Posted by: mcthorogood
Comments are closed-
Posted by: elotrolado on Oct 24, 2007 11:06 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Apathy is the #1 enemy of change. Often, we are our own worst enemy.
Think of people who have been in much more severe situations. Holocaust survivor Victor Frankl went on to write "The Search for Meaning". In it he says "between stimulus and response is a space. In that space lies our power and freedom to choose our response. In our response lies our growth and freedom."
I choose life, democracy, and freedom. How about you?
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» RE: Fight Back, Don't Give Up
Posted by: skydog
» RE: Fight Back, Don't Give Up
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: Fight Back, Don't Give Up
Posted by: mcthorogood
Comments are closed-
Posted by: wawa on Oct 24, 2007 2:17 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The TOTAL 2005-2006 Election Cycle Congressional recipients of Arab American PAC Funds to Congress TOTALED:
$80,500.-Washington Report on Middle East Affairs, July 2007 edition
On October 21, 2007 I once again FAXED President Bush and my Fl. Senators after sending an email seeking justice:
An open independent investigation of the Israeli attack on the USS LIBERTY on June 8, 1967-
And an END to the 40 years of Occupation of Palestine.
I was pissed after I received an email reply from Senator Nelson -who received $89,861 Pro-Israeli PAC funds from 2005-2006;
For he admitted USA's "symbiotic relationship with Israel"
President George Washington warned in his Farewell Address of September 17, 1796:
"The nation which indulges toward another…is in some degree a slave…a passionate attachment of one nation for another produces a variety of evils."
Congress lack the balls/thatchers and Common Sense to do the right thing because they are all about the $$$
American democracy is based on the self evident truth that all people are created equal; all are endowed by their creator with certain inalienable rights…[and] that, to secure these rights, governments are instituted…and derive their powers from the consent of the governed; and, whenever any form of government becomes unjust and destructive of these ends, it is the right of the people [to rise up and] alter or abolish it.- "The Declaration of Independence"
"Soon after I had published the pamphlet "Common Sense" [on Feb. 14, 1776] in America, I saw the exceeding probability that a revolution in the system of government would be followed by a revolution in the system of religion... The world is my country, all mankind are my brethren, and to do good is my religion."-Tom Paine
ON WITH THE REVOLUTION!
Eileen Fleming, Reporter and Editor
Http://www.wearewideawake.org/
Author "Keep Hope Alive" and "Memoirs of a Nice Irish American 'Girl's' Life in Occupied Territory"
Producer "30 Minutes With Vanunu."
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» RE: Congress is Under Israeli Occupation
Posted by: mcthorogood
» "Balls" is not a synonym for "courage"
Posted by: LeeAnnG
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Knobby on Oct 24, 2007 2:28 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Thomas J Kaminski
?
?
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» RE: American Republic Defense League Covenant
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: American Republic Defense League Covenant
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: American Republic Defense League Covenant
Posted by: Knobby
» Don't give up, it only took 5% of the population to fight to create this nation. Thats all....
Posted by: Pepper
» RE: Don't give up, it only took 5% of the population to fight to create this nation. Thats all....
Posted by: Knobby
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Blueprelude on Oct 24, 2007 4:28 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
More effective would be to have people read it aloud in turns all day and night near the Capitol. Nothing more needs to be said. Just keep reading it aloud like Buddhist monks would receit mantras or Christians prayers.
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» RE: I Have A Better Idea, Mr. Hightower!
Posted by: mcthorogood
Comments are closed-
Posted by: PROFPETE on Oct 24, 2007 4:44 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
as well as at Bagnolosprophetics.Blogspot.com
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Comments are closed-
Posted by: newdarkagez on Oct 25, 2007 5:58 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Here is what I suggest if we actually make it to the next election...
RE-ELECT NO ONE IN WASHINGTON!
this would truely get their attention. imagine how confused they would be. our vote is the only power we have over these despicable characters. vote against every one!
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Posted by: Trish on Oct 25, 2007 9:16 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: jende on Oct 26, 2007 1:04 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» You are absolutely right, 100%.
Posted by: Pepper
Comments are closed-
Posted by: waltcherry on Oct 26, 2007 2:07 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
An "incident" will happen, possibly related to Iran, and the American people will "need the protection of martial law." Since so much of the military is 6,000 miles away -- the enforcement of martial law will have to be done by Blackwater.
George W. is a genious. He set all this up while he kept us distracted. Maybe we didn't notice because he kept us laughing at how "dumb" he was. Yeah -- like a fox!
So, who would you have voted for in 2008?
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» RE: The Coming Coup
Posted by: helenwheels
» Here is where they will make a mistake in your scenario..... Americans will shoot foreign mercenarie
Posted by: Pepper
Comments are closed-
Posted by: corazon on Oct 27, 2007 12:33 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Anybody that trusts the government to watch out for them are fools. Whether its your retirement, medicare, national security, etc.
The Government is run by people just like you and me which means they are subject to all the other weaknesses that all of us are. Fraud, thievery, egoism, corruption, not giving a shit in general.
Thats why the founders divided the government into 3 parts and gave the powers not EXPRESSLY given to the government to the STATES. So we would not have this crap going on now with a runaway executive and an ass crazy President that wants to start WW3.
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Posted by: helenwheels on Oct 27, 2007 12:49 PM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Of course, to make sure the second choice doesn't happen, there are new weapons to make sure we don't congregate. Anyone else see this story yesterday?
http://tinyurl.com/2p7uy8
This is partly why the bush regime says and does whatever the hell it wants. Remember a couple of months back, when bush AND cheney both said they were above the law? No one did a damn thing then, either.
They know we can't fight back. Between this "pain ray" written about at the above link, and what will become bush's new Praetorian Guard (or Hitler's SS), Blackwater, we are in real trouble, folks. This is what our apathy has bought us. Now we're paying the price for a few cushy decades. We let ourselves be drugged and duped by our gluttony.
In the end, though, it's our gov't that's screwed us over and I truly now believe they were behind 9-11. Watch www.zeitgeistmovie.com and be prepared to have your mind blown.
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» RE: Call me crazy, but....
Posted by: DrColes
» RE: Call me crazy, but....
Posted by: helenwheels
» You are Crazy DrColes
Posted by: vox persona
» RE: Call me crazy, but....
Posted by: Rochelle_Weber
Comments are closed-
Posted by: DrColes on Oct 27, 2007 1:41 PM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: Constitutionalist75 on Oct 28, 2007 9:59 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: Rochelle_Weber on Oct 28, 2007 10:34 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I fear that future is here. I fear that King George the Bush will find a way to prevent the 2008 elections from taking place and will refuse to relinquish the power he now wields. He's already done quite a good job of ignoring, if not completely trashing the Constitution.
By the way--I've signed enough petitions, written enough blogs and attended enough demonstrations, that I think I am not totally paranoid when I say Hi, NSA! Hope you guys are having a nice day. The next phone call I make will be to my grandkids. Don't you just love how grown-up Presley sounds now?
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» RE: ock Bound Comes True
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
Comments are closed-
Posted by: DBargad on Oct 29, 2007 2:40 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: seasoul on Oct 29, 2007 12:16 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"Let me simplify this and not just to be rhetorical: A coup has occurred. I woke up the other day realizing, coming out of sleep, that a coup has occurred. It’s not just a question that a coup lies ahead with the next 9/11. That’s the next coup, that completes the first"
SOURCE:
By Daniel Ellsberg
September 26, 2007 (Text of a speech delivered September 20, 2007 at an American University symposium -- posted at consortiumnews.com)
Editor’s Note: Daniel Ellsberg, the former Defense Department analyst who leaked the secret Pentagon Papers history of the Vietnam War, offered insights into the looming war with Iran and the loss of liberty in the United States at an American University symposium on Sept. 20.
Below is an edited transcript of Ellsberg’s remarkable speech:
"I think nothing has higher priority than averting an attack on Iran, which I think will be accompanied by a further change in our way of governing here that in effect will convert us into what I would call a police state.
If there’s another 9/11 under this regime … it means that they switch on full extent all the apparatus of a police state that has been patiently constructed, largely secretly at first but eventually leaked out and known and accepted by the Democratic people in Congress, by the Republicans and so forth.
Will there be anything left for NSA to increase its surveillance of us? … They may be to the limit of their technical capability now, or they may not. But if they’re not now they will be after another 9/11.
And I would say after the Iranian retaliation to an American attack on Iran, you will then see an increased attack on Iran – an escalation – which will be also accompanied by a total suppression of dissent in this country, including detention camps.
It’s a little hard for me to distinguish the two contingencies; they could come together. Another 9/11 or an Iranian attack in which Iran’s reaction against Israel, against our shipping, against our troops in Iraq above all, possibly in this country, will justify the full panoply of measures that have been prepared now, legitimized, and to some extent written into law. …
This is an unusual gang, even for Republicans. [But] I think that the successors to this regime are not likely to roll back the assault on the Constitution. They will take advantage of it, they will exploit it.
Will Hillary Clinton as president decide to turn off NSA after the last five years of illegal surveillance? Will she deprive her administration her ability to protect United States citizens from possible terrorism by blinding herself and deafening herself to all that NSA can provide? I don’t think so.
Unless this somehow, by a change in our political climate, of a radical change, unless this gets rolled back in the next year or two before a new administration comes in – and there’s no move to do this at this point – unless that happens I don’t see it happening under the next administration, whether Republican or Democratic.
The Next Coup
Let me simplify this and not just to be rhetorical: A coup has occurred. I woke up the other day realizing, coming out of sleep, that a coup has occurred. It’s not just a question that a coup lies ahead with the next 9/11. That’s the next coup, that completes the first."
Read the rest at consortiumnews.com - and good luck to everyone....
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» RE: Daniel Ellsberg: "A Coup Has Occurred"
Posted by: turkeybut
Comments are closed-
Posted by: etisoppa on Oct 30, 2007 4:34 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
And where are the freedom-loving, peace-loving, human life-respecting good guys ( & gals ) in all of this?
They are busy writing posts to AlterNet (482 posts + the article) and being double-scanned at the same time. Once ( or more) by NSA as they scan the email of electronic transmission, and again by ( DARPA? COINTEL? CIA?) they as scan our brains..
Isn’t there something profoundly wrong with this picture folks?
Openly assault the mind assault directed energy technologies that these governments are using in support of their tyranny.
Click http://360.yahoo.com/etisoppa
then click “View blog" then click on square where the picture is to be and the Mind Assault System photo will appear. Then read and the entry
"The Physics behind The MC System" at the same blog.
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» RE: The Axis of Tyranny vs. "The Axis of Evil"
Posted by: Dianka
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Dianka on Nov 1, 2007 6:12 PM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Comments are closed-
Posted by: NoPCZone on Oct 23, 2007 12:39 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If BushCo claims Executive Privilege invoke inherent contempt and lock him and whomever gets in the way up. When the NeoCons see that Congress has had enough the rest will fall in line as all will see 'The Decider' for the lame duck that he really is.
To my fellow AlterNet readers:
If you see one of our Senators or Representatives out on the campaign trail, don't ask them about Iraq or anything other than what are they going to do with the power ALREADY in their hands to stop this cabal from going one inch farther. If they will not do their job as Senators or Representatives, what makes you think they will do any better as President? They are unworthy of your vote.
It's time to turn up the heat on those who claim to be Democrats.
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» RE: Time To Step Up
Posted by: farmertx
» RE: Time To Step Up, or be Stepped ON!
Posted by: gazooks
» RE: Request impeachment or promise to vote against him or her next possible election.
Posted by: Christie
» Bullies do NOT fold ...
Posted by: BenCaxton12
» Keep saying the words "IMPEACH CHENEY AND BUSH" when ever the candidates come to....
Posted by: Pepper
» RE: Time To Step Up
Posted by: VZEQICVA
» Turn up the heat?
Posted by: hurricane hugo
» RE: Turn up the heat?
Posted by: Intellect
» RE: Turn up the heat?
Posted by: Urgelt
» RE: Time To Step Up
Posted by: mountainmama
» The Coup Has Already Occured! 9/11 Was an Inside Job
Posted by: Zeitgeist
» RE: The Coup Has Already Occured! 9/11 Was an Inside Job
Posted by: footman
» RE: The Coup Has Already Occured! 9/11 Was an Inside Job
Posted by: scoutkai
» RE: Time To Step Up
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: Time To Step Up
Posted by: johnwoolman
» RE: Time To Step Up
Posted by: footman
» RE: Time To Step Up
Posted by: scheherezade
Comments are closed-
Posted by: mcthorogood on Oct 23, 2007 12:55 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am a U.S. Citizen!
All 2008 presidential candidates are members of the prestigious cabal called the Council on Foreign Relations (CFR), except a few. "We the People of the United States of America", are headed towards a one world government, if the members of the CFR have their way. The old NAFTA treaty, the CAFTA treaty, and the recently implemented Security and Prosperity Partnership of North America (SPP) are stepping stones towards a "New World Order"(NWO).
What is the CFR agenda and who will it benefit the most? The hidden agenda of the CFR is to further diminish U.S. sovereignty, in order to foster free trade, which will benefit the owners of large multi-national corporations. The late Mr. Arthur M. Schlesinger wrote in the August 1995 edition of Foreign Affairs, "In defense of the world order ... U.S. soldiers would have to kill and die".
Today the European Union (EU) consists of 27 states, except Switzerland. On March 4, 2001 the Swiss voted on March 4, 2001 with a 77.3% majority to remain Swiss citizens, and not join the EU. The new EU Constitution has only been fully ratified by 16 of the 27 states.
I stand together with the proud Swiss, and prefer to remain a citizen of my own country, rather than a citizen of a supranational union. I like our present form of government established by the U.S. Constitution, and our liberties guaranteed by the Bill of Rights.
Ms. Daneen G. Peterson, Ph.D., gave a speech in Salt Lake City, UT, on September 9, 2006 entitled "America is a Constitutional Republic . . . NOT a Democracy". The contempt of the U.S. Constitution shown by our current president is evidenced by the part of her speech cited in the next paragraph.
..."In fact, the Constitution is far more than 'outmoded,' according to President Bush who rebuffed GOP leader's request to soft pedal some parts of the 'Patriot Act' by saying: "I don't give a goddamn . . . I'm the President and the Commander-in-Chief. Do it my way." Then, responding to an aide who stated: "There is a valid case that the provisions in this law undermine the Constitution." Bush screamed back: "Stop throwing the constitution in my face . . . It's just a goddamned piece of paper!""...
In case you may be wondering, which presidential candidates are not members of the CFR, one answer is on the sign in front of my house, please look at it when you pass by. Additional information about the North American Union can be found at Dr. Peterson's website StopTheNorthAmericanUnion.com. Other information on the NWO can be found at YouTube.com.
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» Thanks for the comment
Posted by: vox persona
» RE: Thanks for the comment
Posted by: pb120669
» RE: That "goddamned piece of paper" comment is not irrelevant
Posted by: channing
» RE: That "goddamned piece of paper" comment is not irrelevant
Posted by: Lauren
» RE: That "goddamned piece of paper" comment is not irrelevant
Posted by: channing
» RE: That "goddamned piece of paper" comment is not irrelevant
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: That "goddamned piece of paper" comment is not irrelevant
Posted by: pb120669
» RE: That "goddamned piece of paper" comment is not irrelevant
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: Thanks for the comment
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: Thanks for the comment
Posted by: maktan1
» RE: Thanks for the comment
Posted by: mcthorogood
» There are only two who are not CFR and that is Kucinch and Paul.
Posted by: Pepper
» RE: There are only two who are not CFR and that is Kucinch and Paul.
Posted by: mcthorogood
» That was cryptic and uninformative.
Posted by: Pepper
» RE: Thanks for the comment
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: Thanks for the comment
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: Thanks for the comment
Posted by: mcthorogood
» You can't put the brakes on the future
Posted by: snideelf
» RE: You can't put the brakes on the future
Posted by: mcthorogood
» Hightower needs to expand his perspective to include this
Posted by: ZoraP
» RE: Hightower needs to expand his perspective to include this
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: Hightower needs to expand his perspective to include this
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: Hightower needs to expand his perspective to include this
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: Pat H.
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
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» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
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» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» Wow, your one sick puppy.......
Posted by: Pepper
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: I am a U.S. Citizen!
Posted by: slashpot
Comments are closed-
Posted by: vox persona on Oct 23, 2007 1:05 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: Let's hope it's not too late
Posted by: VZEQICVA
» RE: Let's hope it's not too late
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: Let's hope it's not too late
Posted by: footman
» RE: Let's hope it's not too late
Posted by: catroina
» RE: Let's hope it's not too late
Posted by: footman
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Tom Degan on Oct 23, 2007 1:52 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Yes, folks, your constitution is in mortal peril. Then again, the fact that you're sitting there at your computer, reading AlterNet and not some right wing screed/blog tells me that you are probably more than aware of this nasty little fact. Are we all just preaching to the choir, so to speak? No, it's much more than that. We inspire each other to get motivated and do something about it. The revolution probably won't be televised. But of this you may be absolutely certain: It will be on your computer.
Seventy five years ago next March 4, Franklin D. Roosevelt set this country on a new course. Until a feeble-minded piece of shit named Ronald Reagan began to dismantle it twenty-seven years ago, the New Deal worked beautifully for America. Prior to FDR, there was no middle class in this country. There was just the very rich, the professional class, and all the rest. All the rest lived in grinding poverty.
If you want a good look into what it was like in this country for the average worker pre New Deal, by all means, pick up the book called, "The Jungle" by Upton Sinclair. When Mr. Sinclair died on November 25, 1968, his book was all-but-forgotten. I think it is telling that recent years have shown it to be gaining popularity again.
Tom Degan
Goshen, NY
"The Rant" by Tom Degan
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» Do I detect a note of discomfit?
Posted by: vox persona
» Thank you, Vox!
Posted by: Tom Degan
» RE: Thank you, Jim Hightower!
Posted by: aislinnluv
» The Return to the Jungle
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» Uh, no.
Posted by: Coleman
» RE: Uh, no. And thanks
Posted by: LeeAnnG
» RE: Uh, no.
Posted by: LMNOP
» Classic Right Wing Blame the Victim....
Posted by: CatDad
» Patriotism, like God and taxes, is for the "little people".
Posted by: LMNOP
» RE: The Return to the Jungle
Posted by: rainingwolf
» RE: Thank you, Jim Hightower!
Posted by: LeeAnnG
» Pre New Deal, "All the rest lived in grinding poverty?" Not true
Posted by: chief of okeefe
» RE: You got me, chief!
Posted by: Tom Degan
» RE: Thank you, Jim Hightower!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: Thank you, Jim Hightower!
Posted by: catroina
Comments are closed-
Posted by: xbj on Oct 23, 2007 3:07 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
That's why the gutless wonders do little, and the ones who have done anything at all to oppose him have balls of steel. Give credit where credit is due.
Once you know and can finally accept the facts about 9-11, everything makes horrific sense.
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» what sense?
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» RE: what sense?
Posted by: MyLeftFoot
» RE: Congress does nothing because they know BushCheneyCo pulled 9-11 and they're deathly afraid...
Posted by: WitchyNy
» RE: Congress does nothing because they know BushCheneyCo pulled 9-11 and they're deathly afraid...
Posted by: helenwheels
Comments are closed-
Posted by: kgs1947 on Oct 23, 2007 3:19 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: The Time is Still the Present
Posted by: groyne
» RE: The Time is Still the Present
Posted by: mcthorogood
Comments are closed-
Posted by: pacto on Oct 23, 2007 3:20 AM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: It`s to late, No it's NOT
Posted by: MyLeftFoot
» RE: It`s to late
Posted by: VZEQICVA
» RE: It`s to late
Posted by: pacto
» RE: YES, IT IS TOO LATE
Posted by: pammers
» RE: YES, IT IS TOO LATE
Posted by: makeadifference
» RE: YES, IT IS TOO LATE
Posted by: helenwheels
Comments are closed-
Posted by: DrGeneNelson on Oct 23, 2007 3:44 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
S. 2205 would burden the U.S. taxpayer to the tune of trillions of dollars, since it is the first step of a permanent, rolling amnesty. Unlike the so-called CIR that Senate leadership attempted to pass earlier in 2007, this bill has NO enforcement provisions.
Sen. Reid is attempting to sneak this one through via Rule 14, with a cloture vote set for Wednesday, Oct. 24. Call your Senators at (202) 224-2121 now to protest. You may also use the free citizen activism tools at http://NumbersUSA.com and http://www.FAIRUS.org
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» RE: Dr. Gene Nelson
Posted by: Shey
» DREAM Act
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» RE: Dr. Gene Nelson
Posted by: mcthorogood
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Suzon on Oct 23, 2007 4:10 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Get a more optimistic perspective than TPTB would like you to have. "We are all doomed" is a cop-out. Even with all the state terrorism directed against the people of Iraq (this has a very long history), there are Iraqis still around. Another 9/11 type of attack (of whatever origin) on American soil is not likely to wipe out everyone.
In my view, the complete surveillance and control of the population is not an achieveable goal. (What is achievable is the security industry making money by selling imperfect technology.) Have any of you ever chaired a meeting? People are too contrary to go along with any single notion, however often they are described as sheeple.
Remember that the Vietnamese routed the military might of the US of A with tunnels and bamboo sticks.
I'm not saying that bad things are unlikely or impossible, but that they are damned difficult.
Bang those pots and pans!
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» RE: first make yourself fearless and then enjoy having meaningful (if unpaid) work
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» RE: first make yourself fearless and then enjoy having meaningful (if unpaid) work
Posted by: channing
» RE: first make yourself fearless and then enjoy having meaningful (if unpaid) work
Posted by: VZEQICVA
» Of course we're not doomed
Posted by: dogman44
» Thanks for the optimism
Posted by: LeeAnnG
» RE: Pot & Pan banger speaks...
Posted by: makeadifference
» RE: Pot & Pan banger speaks...
Posted by: footman
Comments are closed-
Posted by: packofwolves on Oct 23, 2007 4:39 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: The time is now
Posted by: dennidus1680
» RE: The time is now
Posted by: VZEQICVA
Comments are closed-
Posted by: shangrilalad on Oct 23, 2007 5:09 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If Bush’s criminal regime were disappearing thousands of Americans into secret detention camps, would anyone tell us? Do you think our fascist owned Monopoly Media would warn us? Maybe not, but that’s crazy talk, right? They couldn’t keep something as horrific as that secret, could they? It’s not as if an iron curtain of secrecy has a descended on America, right?
But the thing is, dictators have used terrorism against their own people in the past and continue to do so today. It couldn’t happen in America no matter how much power Cheney & Bush have illegally seized, with no resistance from our Democratic leadership. It’s not as if our elected representatives are so terrified of Bush’s Fascist Regime that they’d sacrifice troublemakers to save themselves, but what if they don’t know what’s going on?
Bush controls all three branches of government, our armed forces, CIA, FBI, NSA, police and his private mercenary armies, but if you or I disappeared tomorrow, someone would notice and investigate. Right?
.
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» RE: Bush’s Fascist Regime
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» calm down lol
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» RE: calm down lol
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: Bush’s Fascist Regime... It's Do Or Die
Posted by: channing
» Its already happening
Posted by: Tombo
Comments are closed-
Posted by: hefalumpe on Oct 23, 2007 5:52 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
HE IS A DEM PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE. HE GETS NO COVERAGE BY THE MEDIA, BECAUSE HE WOULD WIN IF HE DID GET HEARD BY ENOUGH PEOPLE AND TREATED LIKE A SERIOUS CANDIDATE (WHICH HE CERTAINLY IS).
HE'S BEEN IN CONGRESS OVER 10 YEARS .... HIS RECORD SPEAKS OF GREAT PERSONAL COURAGE AND RESPECT FOR THE CONSTITUTION AND THE PEOPLE OF THIS COUNTRY.
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» RE: carla janson
Posted by: dennidus1680
» RE: carla janson
Posted by: josephq
» I'd rather vote for what I want
Posted by: LeeAnnG
» Same thing with Ron Paul...
Posted by: Cooltruth
» RE: carla janson
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: carla janson
Posted by: slashpot
» RE: carla janson Follow the money and the billionaires and Party leaders want Facsism
Posted by: SJ
Comments are closed-
Posted by: MyLeftFoot on Oct 23, 2007 6:18 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» "...like-minded people who don't actually DO anything"
Posted by: Beagle17
Comments are closed-
Posted by: johns333 on Oct 23, 2007 6:22 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Bush is after terrorists not political opponents. I have never seen such a collection of whackos as I have on this site.
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» well, at least alternet starts with an "a" so you didn't have to trouble yourself to find us
Posted by: Beck
» RE: well, at least alternet starts with an "a" so you didn't have to trouble yourself to find us
Posted by: VZEQICVA
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: Axiom69
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: LMNOP
» And once again you pove the point...
Posted by: worldwide65
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: andrushka
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: MyLeftFoot
» Yo, ditto head
Posted by: LMNOP
» You keep saying it -- please do it
Posted by: BTDT
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» one nut answers your questions
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» RE: where do these nuts like johns333 come from?
Posted by: channing
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: hurricane hugo
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: AMERICAN VETERAN
» We are scared because if you oppose Bush you are a "terrorist"
Posted by: chief of okeefe
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: skydog
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: where do these nuts come from
Posted by: SatanicJamboree
Comments are closed-
Posted by: LMNOP on Oct 23, 2007 6:32 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
First, let's recognize that we're well beyond that. There comes a time in the evolution of a republic into a dictatorship when the democratic processes that define a republic are no longer efficacious, processes such as voting, campaigning, letter-writing, protesting, referenda generation and the like. Obviously, none of things had any power in Hitler's Germany or Marcos' Philippines. When that time comes, the republic is gone and cannot be revived if it cannot be recovered by force.
There hasn't been an "if we - then they" threat to democracy since before the 2006 election. Clearly, democracy was already dead in America by then. We had had three consecutive tainted elections already in 2000, 2002, and 2004, all with losers assuming office. Then, in 2006, the voters sent Congress and the president a mandate to begin ending their war. They laughed. Congress took impeachment off of the table and approved Bush's war budget without benchmarks, goals or timelines. Bush escalated the war.
Another poster noted, "We've been out on the streets, tasered, put in the jails, blacklisted by Homeland Security, given federal prison sentences for non-violent protest, and organized until we're exhausted, but nothing changes"
I believe that it's too late for activism. "So, let us not talk falsely now - the hour is getting late."
Next, let's recognize that the American people are just as morally defective as their (our) government.
America is a cruel country populated by a jaded, self-indulgent, consumptive and self-centered people. So, Americans are well represented by a cruel, arrogant, ignorant, inarticulate, sociopathic imitation of a cowboy. These are not the qualities of Bush that America objects to, and they were out there for all to see certainly by 2004, when Bush garnered close to half of the votes legitimately.
What America objects to is that Bush isn't kicking Iraq's ass hard enough. If Blackwater could squelch the resistance in Iraq and get the oil flowing, even if it used genocide to do so, Bush would be a popular president. Torture is not an issue for Americans. Nor the loss of their rights. Americans don't mind Bush snubbing the UN, the French or Kyoto.
Katrina is no problem for Americans to absorb. They may tsk-tsk a little, but they don't really care. Lying America into the Iraqi quagmire, or outing an undercover CIA operative? Both were well known in 2004 - and apparently weren’t deal breakers for the good American people in Bush’s bid to keep the White House. No problema. Despite the extremely long laundry list of Bush's failures and deficiencies, the only reason America has given up on him is the same reason Steinbrenner turned on Joe Torre: he’s not kicking enough ass.
So, the whole kit and caboodle is damaged goods. The Republicans, the Democrats and the people, for whom the politicians are merely a reflection, an epitome, are all ready for history's trash pile.
I believe that this race is run, and it's time to begin recognizing that this problem is out of the hands of the people now, and that they were never up to it in the first place. America was anxious to go where Bush took them, and apparently fully approved. It's only progressives that have objected - mostly to each other on sites like this.
As I’ve indicated many times before, it’s time to give up on America and the American people. They’re really not worth fighting for. For krissake, they don’t even object to fraudulent wars and torture.
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» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: Scott
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: Ivann
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: Skunkatthepicnic
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: astudent
» Let's face reality, however terrible it is
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now.....
Posted by: Captainmagic
» My response is a line from another song:
Posted by: hurricane hugo
» So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: CatDad
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: makeadifference
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: FedererFan
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: odom79
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: LMNOP
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now....Marines
Posted by: Captainmagic
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now
Posted by: mcthorogood
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now (understanding americans)
Posted by: Sum Won
» Sorry, I'll stick by the people...
Posted by: worldwide65
» RE: So, let us not talk falsely now A bit uninformed, but would it make any differance
Posted by: SJ
Comments are closed-
Posted by: rocketman on Oct 23, 2007 6:38 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We should all remember that the first question asked after 9-11 is how come we didnt know about these plans. How did this happen. To Bush's credit he addressed this problem (he may have screwed up most other things but this he is getting right.
The the policies that this administration and congress have instituted are those that fit the times and circumstances and are no different than what was done in other wars..including the civil war.
Dont let the emense dislike for Bush blind us in what makes sense and what doesn't.
Our focus should be on what could be another war with Iran. Should that happen our homefront will be in deep shit and the current "trampling" on the constitution will seem like ants walking compared to the buffalo we can expect!
Hopefull congress has the balls (which they don't) to stall any actions until a new President takes office!
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» This he is getting right?
Posted by: Windwhistler
» Your last sentence is interesting.
Posted by: Coleman
» RE: Your last sentence is interesting.
Posted by: rocketman
» RE: My, what an Appeasing Neo-Nose you have there rocketman
Posted by: channing
» RE: My, what an Appeasing Neo-Nose you have there rocketman
Posted by: rocketman
» Venezuela IS democratic.
Posted by: pig
» RE: What makes sense!
Posted by: brunowe
» RE: What makes sense???
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: What makes sense!
Posted by: WILLYBILLO7
» RE: What makes sense!
Posted by: skydog
» RE: What makes sense!
Posted by: mcthorogood
Comments are closed-
Posted by: US Citizen on Oct 23, 2007 6:57 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
But there was the very inconvenient fact that the United States was a democracy and the President was supposed to change after eight years. For a while, the oil interests considered keeping their prime team, George W. Bush and Dick Cheney, in office past 2008. They may have decided that this would cause too much outrage, so their next plan was to subvert the 2008 elections via the Justice Department and Alfredo Gonzales. This also provoked outrage. Now I think these interests are somewhat resigned to the fact that George W. Bush cannot continue to be President, so the next best thing is to do whatever it takes to make sure the next President, Republican or Democrat, follows the Bush family oil agenda. Thus now even the major Democratic candidates are toeing the Bush family line on keeping troops in Iraq and speaking out vociferously against Iran. The major requirement to be President in 2008 is to follow the Bush family agenda.
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» RE: Bush Family Business Interests
Posted by: GANDALF84
» Yes. Peak oil is a myth.
Posted by: pig
» RE: Bush Family Business Interests
Posted by: Skyelav
» RE: Bush Family Business Interests
Posted by: channing
» RE: Bush Family Business Interests
Posted by: mcthorogood
Comments are closed-
Posted by: williameon on Oct 23, 2007 7:04 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Even before the Shrub said, wait till the votes are counted.
He still lost even after all of their trickery. But, nobody knows it! The Faux Media or The Cor‘pirate’ BULL HORN is too busy spewing BU__! SH__!, to tell you the truth. Disinformation and propaganda is all you get. Everybody knows it.
You think any of these Media Prostitutes are going to say a word? They’ve sold out. They’re on the payroll. The are pawns in the game and willing participants in the deception.The Shrub resents you. He was born into nobility and you’re just a clog in the machine. What we have now is a Demockery. A sham. A Puppet Show for paupers.
Steal everything for their friends! Empty the Treasury. Devalue your savings. Ruin The Dollar. Things are really looking up from Bushes paper cup.
That Silver Spoon has really worked wonders for him and his treacherous family.
Shills for Billionaires. They’ll do all the dirty work for a pittance of the haul.
The Corpirates have taken over. They are in complete control. They own all the Media. They own the Arms companies. You even dunk their donuts. They're ordering the Militia to commit suicide in a phony War. Sacrifice more of your sons and daughters for Dead Eye Dick. Who controls the Dark Army?
The Dark Army stands in violation to the constitution.
Oh, I forgot! The Constitution is just a piece of paper.
Bush’s toilet paper.
Better be good or they will send the dark army aganist you, again. Just like they do everyday to other poor countries. They have privatized your government. They own it. The Nazi’s won the War. The Corpirates who perpetuated the Nazi rise, won here. All those Fairy Tales about WWII are meaningless. They are selling World War III. We live in a Fascist Stupid State. Where the politicians are traitors.
Where the Secret Police. NSA, FBI, CIA, Torture and Spy on us! Why! Because they are afraid of you. You're the enemy within. The Sleeping Giant must be bound and tied.
Lied to and denied or he might awaken someday and Kick these Bass-Turds ass. Who's ass? The Alien Aristocracy.
The Shrub, Dead Eye Dick and the rest of his Corpirate Traitors.
Who rape and pillage the world in the name of Democracy and freedom.
Greedy Hypocrites and Liars who worship the golden calf.
Too bad nobody can put two and two together anymore and stop them.
They are too busy watching The FAUX MEDIA, working three jobs and drowning in debt.
The Shrub’s idea of the New Ameri-con Dream.
Three jobs and in Debt!
The Slaves have all been co-opted: Brain washed, Poisoned, Imprisoned, Militarized, Drugged, Tortured, Sick, Spied on, Afraid, Overworked and Underpaid. How wonderful for Bush & Con. Sell them more delusion and poison. The weight of the whole Corpirate system is riding on your shoulders. While our Militia is overseas robbing oil, who is going to protect us here?
From Dead Eye Dick the Virtual Vigilant?
They have weapons you haven’t even dreamed of to use in
Another War. Don’t worry! They will provide the weapons and the army. The only thing you must provide is the BLOOD to lubricate the wheels of their War Machine.
Mindless Robo-Trons bully and victimize people so they can,
Sell you another even bigger pile of sh__. Robots control us now. Look at them. They show no emotion. They have no positive human qualities. What are they? Alien Politicians
Talking Endless! BU__! SH__! The system is corrupted.
Shut it down. REBOOT!
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» RE: It’s too late.
Posted by: makeadifference
Comments are closed-
Posted by: stevor on Oct 23, 2007 7:23 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: The Dodd that is stepping up is Chris, Senator from CT.
Posted by: groyne
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Posted by: Beagle17 on Oct 23, 2007 7:20 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
They obviously got Hillary on board. In case no one has noticed, the two most genuinely popular candidates in the party nomination races, Kucinich and Paul, are constantly sidelined by the corporate controlled media.
Let him who has eyes see. It's so bloody obvious that the whole political scene these days is a gigantic sham, the only wonder is how those still in denial manage to look at themselves in the mirror.
War is the biggest segment of the economy. Oil is second. It has been this way for years. No one has the guts to challenge this SOP.
A general strike might be a good way to begin, but good luck trying to make that happen. I have posted that suggestion several times on comment threads at various sites, and each time it was met with absolutely no response from anyone.
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» RE: You got it, Pontiac. another course of action
Posted by: MyLeftFoot
» A more effective course of action -
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: You got it, Pontiac.
Posted by: PJAW
» RE: You got it, Pontiac.
Posted by: jbur816
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Posted by: Trixie on Oct 23, 2007 7:57 AM
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» RE: not entirely true, Trixie
Posted by: channing
» RE: Trixie
Posted by: mcthorogood
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Posted by: LIBBIEBETH on Oct 23, 2007 8:01 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» THINK CLEARLY
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
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Posted by: maxpayne on Oct 23, 2007 8:22 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Now, could SF wake up and RECALL that fucking HAG and give Cindy Sheehan a chance to lead ?!?!?
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» Pelosi is an actor, like most of Congress, but it's
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: Pelosi is an actor, like most of Congress, but it's
Posted by: weatherking
» RE: Pelosi is an actor, like most of Congress, but it's
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: Recall Pelosi, I've been saying she was wrong before she was voted in!
Posted by: common intelligence
» People are waking up and there is hope. I have a bumper sticker on my car with....
Posted by: Pepper
» RE: People are waking up and there is hope. I have a bumper sticker on my car with....
Posted by: jbur816
» Yes, it would...... and every single person that went by and saw it gave me a thumbs up.
Posted by: Pepper
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Posted by: Col. Jackleg on Oct 23, 2007 8:37 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: We need more than Hightower!
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» Palace coup?
Posted by: Col. Jackleg
» RE: We need more than Hightower!
Posted by: mcthorogood
» Progression
Posted by: Col. Jackleg
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Posted by: Constitutionalist75 on Oct 23, 2007 9:22 AM
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» You maybe right, but we have to give this one more chance for the system to work.
Posted by: Pepper
» RE: You maybe right, but we have to give this one more chance for the system to work???
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» What????
Posted by: pig
» Actually, Paul was asked and he said, while they disagree on some things, they are......
Posted by: Pepper
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Posted by: channing on Oct 23, 2007 12:02 PM
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Only anti-CFR candidate Ron Paul
Kucinich is there too, and moreover why I propose that these two abandon their soldout parties and run a one term clean-up of the beltway, foreign policy, clean elections and campaign finance... Right and Left have everything at stake, these two can join us.
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Posted by: skydog on Oct 24, 2007 11:52 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Oh, yeah, Ron Paul! Jumpin' jiminy, he's jes' like Jeezus Keeerhist hisself!!! He's the ANSWER!! Whoooooooeeee!!! Only Ronny understands the magnitude of the problem! That's why a flat tax is so important -- we need to complete the transfer of the burden of paying for this crony war profiteering to the middle and lower class that Reagan started.
You gotta be smokin' some really good rope over there, my friend. You'd and the rest of the Ron Paul campaign staff would be better served trying to convince people on FreeRepublic.com.
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Posted by: mcthorogood on Oct 24, 2007 3:47 PM
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Posted by: Suzon on Oct 23, 2007 9:28 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I didn't like being fingerprinted and being forced to swear a loyalty oath in the 1950s, anymore than I like the idea of having to report to another city to have my irises scanned. But we got through the McCarthy era and we have to get through the Bush era.
When Harold Wilson was prime minister TPTB considered a military coup but decided against it. Can't you see the cracks in the administration? Guess what? Your worst dreams--like your best hopes--would be pretty hard to realize.
I think that the Nancy Pelosi-Hilary Clinton pact suggested by a commenter upthread is very promising. Neither one of them can afford to be seen to have sold out the American people for personal reasons. Out them and get rid of the roadblock to impeachment.
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» RE: how is the "it's too late" talk different from "reds under the beds" panic?
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» politicians need more than corporate bucks, they need something that passes for respect
Posted by: Suzon
» RE: politicians need more than corporate bucks, they need something that passes for respect
Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: how is the "it's too late" talk different from "reds under the beds" panic?
Posted by: scoutkai
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Posted by: madmac10 on Oct 23, 2007 9:41 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What a bag of crybabies! All this handwringing and pillowbiting ain't gonna stop the wheels of history from grinding our bones to flour! But when has that stopped us before?
Americans must be the most gloomy people in history--they make the Swedes look postively comic! How come only GWB gets to guffaw any more? Look--some day soon, the blood will run in our gutters, and we will not have the time or energy to join the paddy farmer and dirt-scratcher in joyful gratitude for this life.
Quit feeling bad. We are not to blame for what is happening to the world--forces greater than us are at play here (and I believe more than anything else, those forces are testing our ability to laugh, love & dance in their face. If you cannot laugh at the devil, then you are damned!) I mean, some of us are lucky enough to have a larger role to play in history's sweep, and by all means, play your part the best you can. But only a lunatic would weep to sleep for not being one of the Beckhams or Bonos. Are we a nation of lunatics? I thought not.
Here's what is going to happen: the pendulum will swing wider and wider, the stakes will rise and rise, and reactions will become stronger and stronger. This scenario WILL play out with a big bang that will make the Reign of Terror look like the Night of the Long Knives. I pray that you and your children will not suffer more than those who deserve it, but in the meantime, make like the Weimars and treat yourself to a good stiff drink. And for God's sake, cheer up!
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