COMMENTS: 207
A 'Ho' By Any Other Color: The History and Economics of Black Female Sexual Exploitation
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In regard to gender, there have been two, pronounced, conflicting and unjust narratives concerning female sexuality in America. Although all women who were viewed or accused as loose or promiscuous faced the ire and consternation of a (predominantly white) male-dominated society, there has always been this duplicitous racial application of the penalties incurred for committing perceived "moral" crimes against society. Historically, White women, as a category, have been portrayed as examples of self-respect, self-control, and modesty -- even sexual purity -- but Black women were often (and still are) portrayed as innately promiscuous, even predatory. I would like to focus on the various ways White female sexual promiscuity has been viewed, recognized and oft-times celebrated in today's media and in popular culture.
In her publication, "Female Chauvinist Pigs," New York magazine writer Ariel Levy argues that the recent trend for soft-porn styling in everything from music videos to popular TV is reducing female sexuality to its basest levels. In short: "A tawdry, tarty, cartoon-like version of female sexuality has become so ubiquitous, it no longer seems particular."
Kathleen Parker in her article, "Girls Gone Ridiculous," further elaborates this point: "... the message to girls the past 20 years or so has been that they can be and do anything they please. Being a stripper or a porn star is just another option among many. In some feminist circles, porn is seen as the ultimate feminist expression -- women exercising autonomy over their bodies, profiting from men's desire, rather than merely being objectified by it. Self-exploitation has become the raised middle finger of women's sexual freedom." And that "raised middle-finger" in popular culture, rap videos aside, has largely been a white one.
Society, by and large, has deracialized white female sexual explicitness while at the same time strongly accentuating what is perceived as Black female promiscuity and immodesty. That message has been communicated to us time and time again on the pages of Maxim, FHM, Playboy, Penthouse and Sports Illustrated -- and this list goes on. Although these mags have, in the past 10 years, featured more women of color, they are still (overwhelmingly) a celebration of white female sexual explicitness.

The ultra-celebrity accorded to white female sexual explicitness burst on the scene in the person of Marilyn Monroe. Can anyone argue that Monroe was more recognized for her acting talents than for her "natural assets?" Yet, she is regarded as a legend. The celebrity that has been granted to white women such as Anna Nicole Smith, Pamela Anderson, Carmen Elecktra, Paris Hilton and a whole host of others, is also given based upon sexual assets and not upon talent. This theme is consistent in today's raunch-infested society, but the raunchiness, once again, is deracialized when the practitioners are white. WWE women's wrestling has increased in popularity in the past few years with its predominantly white roster of sex-kittens and their highly sexualized plots and subplots. Even current and former white porn stars such as Ginger Lynn, Traci Lords and Jenna Jameson are made the topics of E! Hollywood True Stories exposes, thus giving them a place of prominence and legitimacy and without ever linking their promiscuity to her whiteness. While, in contrast, one would be hard-pressed to name as many Black women (or any other women of color) -- absent of talent -- who enjoy the same level of celebrity and success.
Even in, seemingly light-hearted (at least that is the impression that we've been given), popular movies we see this phenomenon played out. Risky Business, the film that introduced Tom Cruise to mainstream America, was about a young man (with the help of a spunky prostitute fleeing her pimp, played by Rebecca De Mornay) who opened up a brothel in his parent's home while they were away on vacation. Pretty Woman, the film that made Julia Roberts a megastar, essentially is a remake of the children's classic Cinderella, except this time Cinderella is a hooker. The Woody Allen (that alone gives it legitimacy) film The Mighty Aphrodite stars Mira Sorvino in the "acceptable" prostitute role (for which she won an Oscar). In the recent film, The Girl Next Door (featuring another rising star, Elisha Cuthbert) the movie centers on the relationship between an accomplished high school senior and his 19 year-old porn star (Cuthbert) neighbor. In the descriptions of the main characters in these films (the women) words such as, free-spirited, spunky, playful, spontaneous were used. I tried imagining these same films with Black main characters and I could not envision the same light-hearted response by the American public-at-large. There has yet to be a critically-acclaimed or commercially successful film, where a central character was a Black prostitute. So even when the "textbook" requirements of what constitutes being promiscuous is met, her whiteness saves the day. Even at her most licentious, she is made to appear innocent, wholesome and strangely virginal.
These movies were huge box office successes, and if one subscribes to the theory that the lyrics contained in some hip-hop songs desensitizes individuals to misogyny and normalizes sexism, then that same ethos would have to applied to the films that have essentially "deified" and normalized white female explicitness and promiscuity. So when the same messages that are being demonized in hip-hop are also found in these popular films and white-dominated music genres (but couched in the safety and familiarity of whiteness), what society is essentially telling us is that it is better PR that hip-hop needs, not a lessening of sexist themes in their music and videos.
So it has to be understood that racism is at the heart of this current debate regarding misogyny and sexism. America continues to prove (day in and day out) that it has absolutely no problem with sexual promiscuity. So what is their problem with hip-hop? It is the sheer "Blackness" of it. Historically (as well as now), there has been a fear of Black (especially Black male) sexuality. This irrational and racist fear was repeatedly used in the countless lynchings of Black men in the history of this nation (which often included castration as well). Black equals dangerous; Black equals savage; Black equals barbaric; Black equals forbidden, infected and inferior. Therefore hip-hop, like Blackness, is something that society should be, must be, protected from. It is from this context that ALL things Black have been realized and it is from this context that white female sexual explicitness has been sanitized.
The History of the "Sexploitation" of the Black Woman

The degrading images of Black women were cemented in American culture centuries previous to the first rapper uttering their first words into a microphone. The English colonists accepted the Elizabethan image of "the lusty Moor," (Moor being Elizabethan for Black) and used this and similar stereotypes to justify enslaving Blacks. In part, this was accomplished by arguing that Blacks were subhumans: intellectually inferior, culturally stunted, morally underdeveloped, and with a bestial sexuality. The hypersexualized stereotype of Black women was used during slavery as a rationalization for sexual relations between White men and Black women, especially sexual unions involving masters and slaves. The Black woman was depicted as a woman with an insatiable appetite for sex. She was not satisfied with Black men. It was claimed that the female slave desired sexual relations with White men; therefore, White men did not have to rape Black women. James Redpath, who was of all things an abolitionist, wrote that slave women were "gratified by the criminal advances of Saxons." This view is contradicted by Frederick Douglass, the abolitionist and former slave, who claimed that the "slave woman is at the mercy of the fathers, sons or brothers of her master." Douglass's account is consistent with the accounts of other former slaves. In Narrative of the Life and Adventures of Henry Bibb, An American Slave, Bibb tells of how his master forced a young slave to be his son's concubine; later, Bibb and his wife were sold to a Kentucky trader who forced Bibb's wife into prostitution.
Slave women were property; therefore, legally they could not be raped. Often slavers would offer gifts or promises of reduced labor if the slave women would consent to sexual relations. Nevertheless, as John D'Emilio and Estelle B. Freedman state in Intimate Matters: A Sexual History of Sexuality In America, "the rape of a female slave was probably the most common form of interracial sex" during that time.
The idea that Black women were naturally and unavoidably sexually immoral was reinforced by several features of the slavery institution. Slaves, whether on the auction block or offered privately for sale, were often stripped naked and physically examined. In premise, this was done to ensure that they were healthy, able to reproduce, and, equally important, to look for whipping scars -- the presence of which implied that the slave was rebellious. In practice, the stripping and touching of slaves had a sexually exploitative, sometimes sadistic function. Nakedness, especially among women in the 18th and 19th centuries, implied lack of civility, morality, and sexual restraint even when the nakedness was forced. Slaves, of both sexes and all ages, often wore few clothes or clothes so ragged that their legs, thighs, and chests were exposed. Conversely, Whites, especially women, wore clothing over most of their bodies. The contrast between the clothing reinforced the belief that White women were civilized, modest, and sexually pure, whereas Black women were crude, immodest, and sexually deviant.
Black slave women were also frequently pregnant. The institution of slavery depended on Black women to supply future slaves. By every method imaginable, slave women were "encouraged" to reproduce. Deborah Gray White, in Ar'n't I a Woman?, speaks of major periodicals carrying articles detailing optimal conditions under which bonded women were known to reproduce, and the merits of a particular "breeder" were often the topic of parlor or dinner table conversations. Gray White goes on to say "the fact that something so personal and private became a matter of public discussion prompted one ex-slave to declare that 'women wasn't nothing but cattle.' Once reproduction became a topic of public conversation, so did the slave woman's sexual activities."
The portrayal of Black women as sexually promiscuous began in slavery, extended through the Jim Crow period, and continues today. Although the Mammy distortion was the dominant popular cultural image of Black women from slavery to the 1950s, the depiction of Black women as sexually licentious was common in American material culture. There was practically no item that was considered out-of-bounds in depicting the Black woman as immodest and lacking in sexual restraint as ordinary articles such as ashtrays, postcards, sheet music, fishing lures, drinking glasses, featured scantily-clad Black women. For example, a metal nutcracker, from the 1930's, depicts a topless Black woman. The nut is placed under her skirt, in her crotch, and crushed. Were sexually explicit items such as these made in the image of white women? Yes. However, they were never mainstreamed like the objects that caricatured Black women. The seamy novelty objects depicting white women were sold on the down-low, the QT and always hush-hush. An analysis of these racist items also reveals that Black female children were sexually objectified. Black girls, with the faces of pre-teenagers, were drawn with adult sized buttocks, which were exposed. They were naked, scantily clad, or hiding seductively behind towels, blankets, trees, or other objects.
As we enter the late 60's and early 70's the vestiges of the old Mammy and Picaninny caricatures were replaced with the supersexualized female (as well as male) protagonists and heroines -- often in the form of prostitutes or women using sex as a means to the greater end of achieving a vendetta. These films are now referred to as "blaxploitation" movies. These movies were supposedly steeped in the Black experience. However, many were produced and directed by Whites. Author and film historian Daniel J. Leab in his narrative, Sambo to Superspade: The Black Experience in Motion Pictures, wrote: "Whites packaged, financed, and sold these films, and they received the bulk of the big money." The world depicted in blaxploitation movies included corrupt police and politicians, pimps, drug dealers, violent criminals, prostitutes, and whores. In the main, these movies were low-budget, formulaic interpretations of Black life by White producers, directors, and distributors. Black actors and actresses, many unable to find work in mainstream movies, found work in blaxploitation movies. Black patrons supported these movies because they showed Blacks fighting the "White establishment," resisting the "pigs" (police), in control of their fate and sexual beings.
There are compelling parallels between this period and where we find ourselves today in regard to sexist hip-hop. Parallels such as the erroneous perceptions that certain images were and are indeed steeped in the true Black experience: who controlled and controls the production and distribution of the "black" product; the preeminence of distorted sexual roles; and who disproportionately benefits, financially, from this destructive typecasting. It is a painful reality that the lack of real opportunities can sometimes tempt us to be co-facilitators in our own cultural demise, as we engage in endeavors that aid in the buttressing and reinforcement of pernicious and racist stereotypes.
One of our strengths as Black people (contrary to popular opinion) is our ability to engage in deep and insightful self-critique -- and in that spirit we must take responsibility for our role in this. Toni Morrison, in addressing the dynamics of racial and gender internalized oppression in her novel The Bluest Eye, stated that it was "as though some mysterious all-knowing master had said, 'You are ugly people.' ... [a]nd they (Black folk) took the ugliness in their hands, threw it as a mantle over them, and went about the world with it. And we as Black people (male & female), have now taken ownership, or taken it in our hands as it were, this deplorable legacy and have worn this disgraceful and destructive garment proudly; and we have indeed gone about the world with it. We in the Black community who have consumed, purchased and repeated the words and images; we, Black male and female exploiters of Black sexuality, who have participated in this dishonor are like the Laodecians who were rebuked by Christ because they were convinced that they were rich and increased with goods and had need of nothing without understanding; without realizing that they were blind, wretched, miserable and naked. And like Esau, we have gave up our God-given birthright that entitled us to something better, for a mess of pottage; for husks that satiate us for only a little while; with nothing to show for the bitter and foolish trade but pain, regret and longing."
Seeing that her womb supplied the steady flow of slaves that facilitated the accumulation of wealth for plantation owners and the various industries in this country (rice, cotton, tobacco and sugar to name a few), America was built, in large part, on the sexual exploitation of the Black woman. With the coffers of the major corporations that own the record labels and the music video networks, bursting from the profits of this new millennium's minstrel show, it is a malicious irony of epic and tragic proportions that we have now come full circle.
What The Market Will Bear
It is a multibillion-dollar industry, accounting for one of every five records sold in America. Eighty percent of buyers are white. The music that now generates over $10 billion per year (according to Forbes magazine) was initially ignored by corporate America. Now corporations use the phrases, the images, and the sounds of hip-hop to sell everything from McDonald's dollar menus to Cadillacs.
Although the faces of hip-hop are predominantly Black and the Black community birthed the music, who are the real power-players at Universal Music and Viacom that are pushing the green or red button on what gets produced and promoted in hip-hop? Dr. Jared Ball in his composition, "Hip-Hop, Mass Media & 21st Century Colonization," states: "Given the societal need and function of mass media and popular culture, all that is popular is fraudulent. Popularity is in almost every case an intentionally constructed fabrication of what it claims to represent. Too few who comment on the lamentable condition of today's popular hip-hop seem to grasp this, the political nature of the nation's media system, nor the political function that system serves. Hip-hop is often taken out of the existing context of political struggle, repression, or the primacy of a domestic/neo-colonialism in the service of which mass media play a (the?) leading role. Media, often incorrectly defined by their technologies, are the primary conduits of ideology or worldview and must be seen as such. Therefore, their highly consolidated ownership and content management structure (corporate interlocking boards of directors, advertisers, stockholders, etc.) cannot be understood absent their ability to disseminate a consciousness they themselves sanction and mass produce. Nowhere is this more clearly demonstrable than in hip-hop."
Entertainment has always been a sponsor/market-driven entity. This is important to remember as a multitude begins to mourn Don Imus as the latest "sacrifice" on the altar of the god called political correctness, their outrage is suspect at best and hypocritical at worst. To say that a campaign of this sort has never been lodged against a rap artist deemed guilty of derogatory attitudes towards Black women is not supported by history or the facts. In 2002 Pepsi-Cola pulled a national, 30-second commercial featuring multiplatinum rapper Ludacris from the air after Fox News Channel's host Bill O'Reilly called for a boycott of the company. O'Reilly characterized Pepsi as "immoral" for using the rapper, whom he described as a rap thug. O'Reilly, on his program, read several of the rapper's lyrics, which he said emphasized a lifestyle that included getting intoxicated, selling drugs, fighting people, and degrading women -- by the way, in all my research, not once did I discover that Ludacris was ever sued for sexual harassment or charged with sexual misconduct. The same cannot be said of Mr. O'Reilly and yet he still holds a position as a moral authority with millions of Americans.
Pepsi-Cola released a statement explaining its decision to pull the ad, "We have a responsibility to listen to our consumers and customers, and we've heard from a number of people that were uncomfortable with our association with this artist. We've decided to discontinue our ad campaign with this artist and we're sorry that we've offended anyone."
Let's fast-forward two years to 2004 when Whoopi Goldberg's sexual puns on President Bush's name at a John Kerry fundraiser got her fired as spokeswoman for Slim-Fast weight-loss products. The West Palm Beach, Fla.-based maker of diet aids pulled the ad campaign featuring Goldberg stating that it regretted that Goldberg's remarks "offended some of their consumers." Contrast the rapidity of Pepsi and Slim Fast in dispatching Ludacris and Whoopi, with the decades-long, accommodating, look-the-other-way attitude of sponsors and networks when it comes to individuals such as Imus.
Armstrong Williams on the MSNBC news program Hardball (4/11/07), said that Don Imus should not be fired and "the marketplace should make that decision." And alas, the marketplace did make that decision when the sponsors pulled out en masse. If that is the criterion that we are to use, then what do we do when hip-hop's/rap's vast popularity is determined by that same marketplace -- and as was stated previously, that purchasing marketplace is 80% white and the company executives making the final decision as to what gets made and what gets played are predominantly white.
If corporations want to push anti-woman and sexist music this year, millions of dollars will be pumped into the budget of whatever rapper is ignorant enough to write the lyrics. Sure the artists can choose to make something different. They just won't have the backing that others do who agree to play the game. So, by all means hold hip-hop (and ALL artists of ALL genres) who are guilty of producing the misogynistic and sexist messages in their lyrics and videos morally and politically accountable. However, although they may be guilty of providing the supply, it is the American culture that created the demand.
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Posted by: ekipnrut on May 19, 2007 2:01 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Ahhhhhh..But of course..here comes the White feminist Cavalry
together with 'Fawning Festus' racist white boy (deputized) posse (Remember 'Gunsmoke'??)... Hard ridin' 'Johnette Wayne'...
making da' ghetto safe for trut', justice, and the LGBT 'darkie'
way!!!!! 'Liberals'..'progressives'.....ALL hypocritical vermin...
slither on down..the Price is ALWAYS right.......for co-opted
apologists for racist nonsense or sell out (to corporate America) MFs....... :O)
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» wtf?
Posted by: Ellie1
» RE: wtf? Clarification results if you...
Posted by: ekipnrut
» is the author wanting more Black women in Porn?!??
Posted by: albrechtkrausse
» RE: is the author wanting more Black women in Porn?!??
Posted by: jroth420
» RE: There are plenty of white men who like brown sugar...
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: is the author wanting more Black women in Porn?!??
Posted by: mizani
» RE: is the author wanting more Black women in Porn?!?? Ummmm mizani.....
Posted by: ekipnrut
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Posted by: JCrowe on May 19, 2007 2:47 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Not in any of the feminist circles I know about. When sex work is a real choice, when women don't go into it because they have very few economic options, then and only then will the question of whether it's "empowering" or not become askable.
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» RE: Say what?!
Posted by: frosty86
» RE: Say what?!
Posted by: goldmarx
» RE: Say what?!
Posted by: frosty86
» RE: Say what?!
Posted by: adventuregrrl
» RE: Say what?!
Posted by: frosty86
» interesting Dworkin quote
Posted by: off-the-radar 2
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Posted by: kepstein7777 on May 19, 2007 5:26 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Part of that is the myth of sugar and spice. We like to pretend that we don't like women of any color who are sassy, sexy, aggressive, full of attitude, and got big butts. And we don't like the fact that we do like them, so we blame rap culture, Janet Jackson, etc. and their historical equivalents.
The article is a bit too conspiracy, but brings up some interesting things about our culture.
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» RE: It's a Puritan thing......... Correction
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: Blame it all on whitey...
Posted by: jimidee
» Black Woman ROAR Now!!! She with hair Like Lambs Wool
Posted by: Ast77
» RE: Blame it all on whitey...refer to Black Woman ROAR NOW!!!
Posted by: Ast77
» RE: Blame it all on whitey...
Posted by: mizani
» RE: It's a Puritan thing
Posted by: frosty86
» RE: It's a Puritan thing
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: It's a Puritan thing
Posted by: mizani
» RE: It's a Puritan thing
Posted by: talkville
» American Idol is culture
Posted by: vangogh69
» Pray Tell....
Posted by: Ast77
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Posted by: rjgwood on May 19, 2007 6:45 AM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It is so typical a reaction from many in white America: Take no responsibility for past transgressions. Paint the messenger and the victims as exploitive for bringing up the subject, and then move on, refusing "to discuss the past."
The author is not making a "conspiracy theory" argument by pointing out the FACT that 80% of hip-hop purchasers are white and that the recording/distribution industry, indeed the entire media industry, is controlled by white men. Who then is culpable for media exploitation of black sexuality in hip-hop, the author ponders, black artists who have VERY little control in the industry, or those who own the means of production/distribution, the industry, and those who push the demand, the buyers?
Further, by giving us an historical context which firmly entrenches the fact of white control and manipulation of the image of black sexuality, from the pernicious discussions of slave "breeders" to blackploitation films to hip-hop, the sad fact is that white's have continually PROFITED from the exploitation of black sexuality.
So, for someone like Imus to fraudulently claim that no on cares about hip-hop's exploitation of black female sexuality (which the author debunks with the Ludicrious example), and for America's right to then get "up in arms" about the racial double-standard they feel is given blacks to exploit black sexuality, without acknowledging that it is precisely WHITE America through CEOs of record companies to buyers of hip-hop music that are really the ones, once again, who are exploiting black sexuality is PERVERSE and disingenuousness (Imus & right wing power brokers know who controls the media) disguised as a rational reason to not fire Imus.
The author and the Imus incident brilliantly illustrate the entrenchment of white power in our society, especially the power to avoid responsibility. If one even mentions reparations for the damage inflicted by the slave trade and the ensuing years of state sponsored misery following emancipation, one is painted a cuckoo, and that discussion is never on the table. Yet it is obviously that racism is entrenched and rampant in our society and that white domination of every institution, public and private, remains and will remain because of the culpability of people who refuse to coldly examine the facts and make it right, and yes, make reparations.
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» RE: As soon as I read this article
Posted by: JoshuaLudd
» Culpability
Posted by: Ast77
» RE: As soon as I read this article
Posted by: kelt65
» RE: As soon as I read this article
Posted by: lessbread
» RE: Of course not...
Posted by: ekipnrut
» Gasp.. you mean not everyone on the internet is a white middle class male american age 25-30???? nm
Posted by: JoshuaLudd
» RE: Blame it all on whitey...cont.
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: Blame it all on whitey...cont.
Posted by: Tacticsb
» RE: Blame it all on whitey...cont.
Posted by: jimidee
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Posted by: VZEQICVA on May 19, 2007 6:55 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» Agreed, And Comparing Slavery To Black Exploitation
Posted by: hole11
» RE: Agreed, And Comparing Slavery To Black Exploitation
Posted by: mizani
» ...Just as expected.....
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: TRASH-TRASH-TRASH
Posted by: Ast77
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Posted by: liberalibrarian on May 19, 2007 6:56 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: for every rule its exception
Posted by: Progressive Citizen
» RE: For every conspiracy there is an exception...
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: for every rule its exception
Posted by: off-the-radar 2
» RE: for every rule its exception
Posted by: mizani
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Posted by: H_H on May 19, 2007 7:16 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
But that can't be acknowledged.
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» RE: Don Imus' "apology"...
Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Don Imus' "apology"...
Posted by: H_H
» So Catholic priests have been......
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: So Catholic priests have been......
Posted by: H_H
» RE: So (SOME) Catholic priests have been......
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: So (SOME) Catholic priests have been......
Posted by: H_H
» RE: So (SOME) Catholic priests have been......
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: Don Imus' "apology"...
Posted by: lessbread
» RE: Don Imus' "apology"...
Posted by: H_H
» RE: Don Imus' "apology"...
Posted by: lessbread
» RE: Don Imus' "apology"...
Posted by: H_H
» RE: Don Imus' "apology"...
Posted by: lessbread
» RE: Don Imus' "apology"...
Posted by: H_H
» RE: Don Imus' "apology"...
Posted by: lessbread
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Posted by: NoPCZone on May 19, 2007 7:23 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There is also a difference between a woman being sexually expressive and aggressive because she wants to and someone who is forced to by economics. A woman can be highly sexual without being a whore, yet most people seem to either confuse one for the other or choose not to for whatever reason. Like abortion, it is a woman's choice as to how she carries herself and approaches relationships. It's nobody else's business. A man- any man- lecturing women or any woman about how they should dress, work, interact with men, date or who they should sleep with is as ludicrous as the old stereotypes.
I enjoy and am attracted to women who are sexually confident and aggressive, which is very different from being easy or a whore. A person comfortable in their own skin who dresses, conducts themselves and interacts with people on their own terms is refreshing. Women should not feel forced to act in such a way, but those who do not choose to shouldn't have to play a demure wallflower.
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» Is today's reality that different?
Posted by: vangogh69
» RE: Is today's reality that different?
Posted by: NoPCZone
» RE: Is today's reality that different?
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: Is today's reality that different?
Posted by: anonymous black writer
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Posted by: talkville on May 19, 2007 7:48 AM
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There's a better world to build - much better.
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Posted by: Sojourner on May 19, 2007 7:49 AM
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But I cannot understand then the dynamics of the protectiveness of men of color by women of color. Is it that white men have so many privileges that they don't need or deserve protection?
Or is it that generalizations at the level of race don't make any sense, except for the commercialization of pop culture? And is pop culture anything more than an empty gesture?
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» RE: One more wrinkle? Well........
Posted by: ekipnrut
» Well........well?
Posted by: Sojourner
» RE: Well........well?
Posted by: jimidee
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Posted by: frosty86 on May 19, 2007 8:06 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Softcore porn has moved into the mainstream and we can see this all over the mass media. Most of the pornography that men consume on the internet and in their homes is hardcore pornography which sexualizes violence against women and reduces women to the status of "things to be fucked." Pornography in the has grown to be a $12 billion a year industry which makes it larger than the mainstream movie industry (Hollywood is $8 billion).
Everywhere women are told by the media and corporate PR strategies, that the way to liberation is through a commodified sexuality. Not only is this an outright lie, but it trivializes the idea of liberation. All too often the idea that women should be sexually expressive and open has meant that women should learn to enjoy being treated and portrayed as sex objects and women should start having casual sex. This is not the way to end sexism and patriarchal exploitation of women's bodies. I agree that women's sexuality has been repressed and shamed, but I think there is way to change this without making women into sex objects and commodifying sexuality in general.
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» RE: patriarchal sexuality
Posted by: bob t
» RE: Why does it have to be one or the other?
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: Why does it have to be one or the other?
Posted by: frosty86
» RE: Why does it have to be one or the other?
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: Why does it have to be one or the other?
Posted by: frosty86
» RE: Why does it have to be one or the other?
Posted by: frosty86
» RE: things tobe f$#"&ed?
Posted by: justinmango
» RE: things tobe f$#"&ed?
Posted by: frosty86
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Posted by: Don Garb on May 19, 2007 8:09 AM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
However, the black woman's stronger sexuality is not a product of systemic racism and it is not a myth. Black men have larger penises on average than men of other races. Why is that? Because black women have been more promiscuous than other women, for about the last half million years or so. Before you feminists out there start throwing fits and tantrums at me, do your homework. Every honest book on sexuality and evolution out there will tell you that as the females are more active, the males are built bigger. Works the same for gorillas and chimpanzees too. A female gorilla would rather die than be unfaithful to her alpha male, who consequently has a small penis size compared to the size of the rest of his body. A female chimpanzee on the other hand, will accept offers from just about anybody.
In my experience black women are not insatiable or slutty in any way that could be described as "dirty." They are just more pragmatic and practical. When legitimate escort agencies recruit new workers, the largest share of applicants are black women. They're not bad, they're just sensible. Imagine what white women would be like if they hadn't been messed up by the last few hundred years of Victorian, Christian and Republican sexual repression. They would be the same way that black women are now. If you shift your perspective, black women do not have a history of being immoral, rather white women have a history of being uptight.
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» RE: The author is right on
Posted by: mobile68
» RE: The author is right on
Posted by: Don Garb
» Careful....Donnie wishes to ply his filth on muddied waters....
Posted by: ekipnrut
» Muddied waters indeed . . .
Posted by: MAD
» RE: Muddied waters indeed . . .Well......
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: Muddied waters indeed . . .Well......
Posted by: MAD
» NO...
Posted by: elfinito
» Aw'right.. How 'bout I hook your ass up with a blind date with Bokito....
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: Aw'right.. How 'bout I hook your ass up with a blind date with Bokito....
Posted by: elfinito
» RE: Aw'right.. How 'bout I hook your ass up with a blind date with Bokito....Well.......
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: The author of this post......
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: The author is right on
Posted by: Bobsays
» RE: Oh no you Di'unt!!!!
Posted by: jimidee
» What about testosterone levels?
Posted by: moflard
» Am I a racist yet?
Posted by: Don Garb
Comments are closed-
Posted by: wleming on May 19, 2007 9:33 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
of all colors.....
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Posted by: TheTruthSeeker on May 19, 2007 10:39 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
A whore is a whore – black, brown, white, yellow and purple.
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» RE: A Whore is a Whore
Posted by: frosty86
» How about "a prostitute is a prostitute"? Feel better now, frosty86?
Posted by: TheTruthSeeker
» RE: How about "a prostitute is a prostitute"? Feel better now, frosty86?
Posted by: frosty86
» WHO'S A HO ???
Posted by: gellero
» RE: WHO'S A HO ???
Posted by: frosty86
» Sounds to me like you've see a LOT of porn, frosty86. Or you were a star perhaps?
Posted by: TheTruthSeeker
» anti-porn activists are familiar with the contents of porn, TheTruthSeeker
Posted by: frosty86
» I visited Wheelock.edu. So it's okay to call men "pimps" and "johns" but not prostitutes "whores"?
Posted by: TheTruthSeeker
» RE: I visited Wheelock.edu. So it's okay to call men "pimps" and "johns" but not prostitutes "whores"?
Posted by: frosty86
» Oh Come now, Frosty......
Posted by: gellero
» RE: Oh Come now, Frosty......
Posted by: frosty86
» RE: WHO'S A HO ???
Posted by: mizani
» RE: A Whore is a Whore- male OR female
Posted by: jimidee
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Bobsays on May 19, 2007 2:06 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The solution to these impressions is to change your behaviour and how you live. Such an example will over time change public perceptions. There is no better evidence that this is the case than the impression people have about asian women (hardworking, loyal, ambitious, family oriented). So it's not a white women conspiracy. In fact I have never heard a white woman spend any time talking about how she was going to run down black women. If they ever broach the issue, it is usually sweetly naive hopes for a better world. Those are the facts.
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» RE: Sorry, but impressions are always based on victim blaming
Posted by: lessbread
» Ge..I'm confused Bobbie....are these white women real sluts or do they just make themselves
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: Sorry, but impressions are always based on fact
Posted by: JoshuaLudd
» Wrong Impression
Posted by: gellero
» God, I love these posts!!!
Posted by: vangogh69
» Are you a Social Scientist?
Posted by: Ast77
Comments are closed-
Posted by: emmanuel_goldstein_fights_fake_lefties on May 19, 2007 6:23 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
So keep pushing that feminist propaganda! Keep pushing the woman-must-work-and-must-be-integrated-into-the-workplace PROPAGANDA!
Won't someone please think of the rich???
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» RE: VERY WOMAN MUST BE IN THE WORKFORCE!!
Posted by: richholland
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Posted by: Forgiven on May 19, 2007 7:21 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
That being said, the first point that troubled me was the writers initial argument concerning the way the media deals with white women’s sexuality versus black women. The writer states that celebrity has been accorded to white women based on sexuality and not talent and then goes on to complain that the same has not been given to black women, but later he discusses how black women’s sexuality was mainstreamed in the form of novelty items. You can’t have it both ways.
The next point that troubled me was the writer’s underlying justification of the hip-hop culture based on the fact that similar things are being done in the white community. While this may or may not be true, it is precisely this type of reasoning that keeps the black community ignorant and on the current road to destruction. So, it is ok for hip-hop artist to demean black women and denigrate black culture because of racism? Even for a race consultant doctor that is a reach. Whatever happened to personal responsibility? Sure there are more liquor stores that banks and yes there are drugs rampant in my neighborhood, so does that allow me a free pass to become an alcoholic and drug addict?
Though we have more Black people with money than ever before, we are worst off as a people than we have ever been in our history. Why has achievement as a people eluded us even though we have more material wealth? There is a disconnection between those that have achieved material success and the average Black person on the street.
While we spend tremendous amounts of time and energy annihilating the outsiders who dare to use the same words we use to describe ourselves and yet we do nothing against those in our community that dispense the vile vermin that poisons our minds and the minds of our children. Where are the protest marches outside of Sean Combs studio or any number of other hip-hop artists that poison the air waves with violence, sexism, and the worst attributes of our communities? We have no trouble picketing CBS over Don Imus, yet where is the outrage for those who we really should fear? Who should we be more afraid of a few washed up media personalities that most of our children have never heard of or those who invade our homes and our air waves with all manner of mental pollution?
There will be those who speak about artistic expression and the “language of the street”, but those arguments hold no weight. There is more going on in our communities than the “thug life” these so called Black artists are portraying. When has our community been about nothing, but drug dealing, dope smoking, and killing other Black men? These so called Black men are more responsible for other young Black men being killed than any racist white men. The Klan no longer have anything to do, we are finishing the job ourselves. These men who profit from the misery of their brothers and sisters are worse than any racist. At least with an outsider you can see it coming, but these people they are doing from the inside what no outsider could do. It is a known fact that what you listen to is what you become. This isn’t about some musical expression; this is about the intentional internal genocide for the sake of fortune and fame. Is everyone in the Black community selling drugs, smoking dope, and killing? When did this become our only story? This is not my story. Is it yours?
/thedisputedtruth.blogspot.com/”> The Disputed Truth
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» RE: The ho that racism created?
Posted by: DrRhymes
» RE: The ho that racism created?
Posted by: Forgiven
» RE: The ho that racism created?
Posted by: DrRhymes
» RE: The ho that racism created?
Posted by: Forgiven
» RE: The ho that racism created?
Posted by: DrRhymes
» RE: The ho that racism created?
Posted by: Forgiven
» RE: The ho that racism created?
Posted by: mobile68
» RE: The ho that racism created?
Posted by: DrRhymes
» I myself have (infrequently) quoted Scripture.....
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: I myself have (infrequently) quoted Scripture.....
Posted by: mobile68
» Legacies of Slavery: Neither Forgotten nor Forgiven..............
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: The ho that racism created?
Posted by: grangersmith
» RE: How long can you keep blaming whitey for everything...
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: How long can you keep blaming whitey for everything...
Posted by: DrRhymes
» RE: How long can you keep blaming whitey for everything...
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: How long can you keep blaming whitey for everything...
Posted by: DrRhymes
» actually jimidee..the problems started not a mere twenty years ago....
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: actually jimidee..the problems started not a mere twenty years ago....
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: How long can you keep blaming whitey for everything...
Posted by: Kym525
» RE: How long can you keep blaming whitey for everything...
Posted by: mizani
» OK...OK...(Shrill sound of Whistle)..EVERYBODY out the F'n pool..Yeah..that means you two..
Posted by: ekipnrut
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Kelly on May 19, 2007 9:46 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I would like to add, however, that the depiction of white women's sexuality as appealing and pleasantly subversive has a long-standing presence in European literature and did not arise as a flip-side or doppelganger to the sexuality of women of color. Examples from Ancient/Medieval literature include Aristophanes' plays, La Vielle, the Wife of Bath, May and Alisoun from the Canterbury Tales, Brynhild, etc. etc. etc. There is also a long counter-history of sex-hating, anti-woman sentiment in this same European literature.
As for animalistic exploitation of women, 1980's heavy metal music was just as exploitative as modern rap, frequently showing women caged and/or painted with tiger stripes--check out Sam Kinison's "Wild Thing" with Jessica Hahn rolling around on the floor: my guess is that a certain segment of men like to see women degraded, no matter the color of either party, and that it is easier to degrade those with less money or power.
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» RE: Some context
Posted by: DrRhymes
» I'll check it out
Posted by: Kelly
» RE: I'll check it out..and while you're at it..........
Posted by: ekipnrut
» Fawning
Posted by: Kelly
» Hold up............
Posted by: ekipnrut
» Monster's Ball is PORN; Halle Berry is a Whore that represents Slave Pussy
Posted by: Shalimarali
» RE: Monster's Ball is PORN; Halle Berry is a Whore that represents Slave Pussy..YOU GOT THAT RIGHT!!
Posted by: ekipnrut
» An important distinction.......
Posted by: ekipnrut
Comments are closed-
Posted by: bob t on May 20, 2007 1:19 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
When the aforementioned groups decide to raise women to first class status much if not most abortion and pornography will end. But of course a sharp drop in porn would hurt Rupert Murdochs business, the biggest telecarrier of porn in the U.S. And O'Reilly and Hannity work for him, amaaazing.
Are right wingers just stupid or what, stupid would be the right word. But then mayhap they prefer to bash and stomp all over women rather than use some intelligence.
If they would stop being so obsessed with sex and male domination of women and allow that God gave women equal status as human beings, but they seem to conviently forget that as they cherry pick Gods works and the teachings of Jesus Christ.
So much for right wingers.
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Posted by: grangersmith on May 20, 2007 3:26 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: I got the point....Did you? :O)
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: I got the point....Did you? :O)
Posted by: mobile68
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Posted by: vangogh69 on May 20, 2007 1:42 PM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It's quite easy to blame the victims and also, very old. If black women are whores/ho's then why try to better them? Likewise, if black men are oversexed brutes then why not lock them up/kill them? Whites have long projected their fantasies on black flesh (for example, black men are the anxious rapists when its white men who historically have been the rapists of black women; black men are theives when, WHEW, the US as a nation was founded on white theft, for example) as a way of asserting their own superiority. Not all white, of course, but enough. Personally, I found Imus' comment(s) much less offensive than say Ann Coulter's about "nuking the ragheads" which is both racist and imperialist --- yet she's still on the air. We have a long way to go towards equality yet we must begin by calling a spade a spade, even if its dirty.
2 cents.
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» RE: Clearly, we're not as enlightened as we may think?
Posted by: mobile68
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Posted by: Progressive Citizen on May 20, 2007 7:36 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
for every rule its exception
...for every book its reader. I have found that there are several black female authors who write extremely popular pop fiction, aimed toward black women, (the authors often go by one name or initial) that are The most raunchy, explicit, and blatantly exploitive of all the books in that genre. These books go way beyond chic lit or the general romance genre. I'm curious. What is the explanation for that?
On May 19, 2007, I posted the following reply at 9:57 PM. I am posting both liberalibrarian's question and my response as food for thought, to make an effort to combat disinformation about women of all races:
This is potentially an example of veiled racism and sexism in the publishing industry as well as in literary marketing. The world of literature is run predominantly by white males who interact with few women of any color as equals, least of all black women, and go by stereotypes in their own minds.
This is not to say that the writers they publish are necessarily bad, just that they are more likely to publish and promote books that conform to their stereotype of "true" black female culture (considered more earthy and frank) or "true" white female culture (regarded as more demure), regardless of whether either is realistic.
The books to which poster liberalibrarian refers are basically women's erotica, and there are female erotica writers of all races.
The difference is that black women's erotica tends to be aggressively marketed (i.e. books by Zane end up in the African-American literature section of a bookstore) while white women's erotica tends to be placed in relatively inconspicuous sections of the bookstore.
The literature industry is seeking out a niche market of black women who enjoy explicit sexuality--while they are sometimes finding their niche, they are likely pissing off numerous other black women who, regardless of their own views on explicit sexuality, feel like they are stereotyping black female readers by showcasing these books (which sometimes have relatively explicit book art) in the African-American literature section of the bookstore. The literature industry tends to either not to market to potential white female audiences who enjoy explicit sex, or to portray it in the context of harlequin-style romances.
The decisionmakers in the literary world operate under racially distorted views of women's sexuality that do not conform to the experiences and desires of individual women, and that perpetuate simplified, distorted stereotypes of both black and white female sexuality.
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Posted by: libkid on May 20, 2007 9:37 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: mobile68 on May 20, 2007 10:44 PM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
A snippet from an article seen on Yahoo news:
Poll: American satisfaction at new low
By ALAN FRAM and TREVOR TOMPSON, Associated Press Writers Sun May 20, 7:28 AM ET
WASHINGTON - It's gloomy out there. Men and women, whites and minorities — all are feeling a war-weary pessimism about the country seldom shared by so many people.
It shows how white people think that they’re different from women an “minorities”. This proves my point of what I try to explain to my friends, who put whites on a pedestal, that they are a whole another species of beings. I thought anyone who is paying taxes and legally reside and work in this country is an American citizen. Why do white people have to continually subcategorize other human beings?
Which brings me to the point of responsibility. How can an individual take personal responsibility for one’s self if not given the tools and to be taught how to use those tools properly?
Dr. Rhymes: If we have been given a scriptural mandate to take up the cause of the poor and oppressed, how do we fulfill that without addressing nations, corporations and governments? The prophets of old spoke more to the sins of nations and governments more than they did individuals.
I said in an earlier post:
-Why was the system of race classification put into practice?
-Who are the benefactors of a system based on race classification and so-called racial superiority?
-Why haven't effective solutions been formulated to educate the origins of alleged racial superiority, and to eradicate this tainted notion?
You have to address the gov’t and corporations, because they control policy. We still only have one black senator out of 100 and never a person of color or a female in the president or vice president seat. This country finally got it’s 1st female speaker of the house in 2007. Why is that such a big deal? Like only white men can sit around and live like a pig on the farm? Because none of them aren’t doing anything when you look it. Excuse me for digressing.
Look at the jews, they are still getting paid for what happened to them on European soil, have the largest lobbying group-AIPAC, and even have a federal holocaust department financed with your tax dollars, yet they are using the holocaust as a crutch so much that there are laws around the world jailing people for even questioning it. Do the Native Americans have a federal branch addressing what this gov’t has done to them on their own soil?
Examples of white privilege like g. bush to get into Harvard because of who his family is, even though he barely passed, is OK for them, but in order for us brownies to get into Harvard or where-ever-else-university, they won’t take in the ones that can truly hold their own, they instead will search for and take a dumbed down version of us to fill a quota which they created, which in turn satisfies whitey’s screwed up ego by saying, ‘see they only got in because they’re black, Hispanic, etc.’ Same scenario when applying for a job or a loan.
Whites have and control the tools which they are going to give to their own first and foremost because it’s their way of maintaining control over those who differ from themselves.
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» RE: Forgiven, you and Dr. Rhymes bring up some excellent points.
Posted by: DrRhymes
» RE: Forgiven, you and Dr. Rhymes bring up some excellent points.
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: Forgiven, you and Dr. Rhymes bring up some excellent points.
Posted by: mobile68
» RE: Forgiven, you and Dr. Rhymes bring up some excellent points.
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: Forgiven, you and Dr. Rhymes bring up some excellent points.
Posted by: mobile68
» RE: Forgiven, you and Dr. Rhymes bring up some excellent points. Mobile........
Posted by: ekipnrut
Comments are closed-
Posted by: mobile68 on May 20, 2007 10:49 PM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Well what about the people who are getting thru life decently, yet stand by and aren’t challenging the gov’t about the war, hurricane Katrina, etc.? It’s because they feel that it ain’t affecting them directly so they justify their silence by saying "I’m just going to toe the line so I won’t lose what little I do have." This is true of both blacks and whites.
I’ve noticed in talking to different groups of people, people do sound hopeless, but so many of them are so quick to say, 'oh just pray about it', instead of taking action and responsibility for themselves, let alone for others.
Why don’t you see people protesting about the war on college campuses like in the 70’s?
Why don’t you see people leaving their cars at home to protest high gas prices like the Montgomery bus boycott of the 50’s?
Americans, black and white, are stressing themselves out over material things, are star struck, and have just given their power over to the gov’t and the churches, both who are leading them down to a road called nowhere. So what happened is an affliction of social laziness compounded with it’s-not-my-problem-itis.
We the people in this country are the worst examples in the world of democracy gone wrong. No wonder people around the world don’t respect us, because we don’t respect ourselves.
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Posted by: ekipnrut on May 21, 2007 6:59 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: jimidee on May 21, 2007 9:29 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The term "ho" is a BLACK variation on the word whore...and is seldom used in the "white community" except by young hip-hoppers trying to act black for whatever reason. It certainly has never been a part of the lexicon of Imus's generation...that part is laughable! Imus and Bernard were doing an obvious parody of bro's rappin' in the hood...as seen in Spike Lee's "School Daze". They were in character when they did it. It was a performance, stupid!
Should all actors be held personally accountable for the scoundrels that they play? Should all lawyers be personally associated with the scum that they represent? This crap has become ridiculous.
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» RE: The article is based upon a false premise...
Posted by: DrRhymes
» RE: The article is based upon a false premise...
Posted by: jimidee
» ..upon a false premise...Yeah right!...as if your dumb racist ass knows WTF a 'false premise' is...
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: ..upon a false premise...Yeah right!...as if your dumb racist ass knows WTF a 'false premise' is...
Posted by: jimidee
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Pace on May 21, 2007 11:05 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: luffy28 on May 21, 2007 11:55 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: SOME Minorities are stupid.......(SOMETIMES).. However......
Posted by: ekipnrut
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Kym525 on May 23, 2007 2:40 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
But I digress...a little.
Though I agree with most of the author's assertions, which still doesn't explain the growing misogyny of some black men, black women are not just viewed as hypersexual. There's also the "church girl/frigid" stereotype which some black men use to justify dating women (especially white women) of other races. We're also considered "strong" and that word now carries a stigma rather than the badge of honor that it used to. Black women are expected to put up with a LOT of b.s.--not just from the larger society, but from those in our community who should know better. Music companies may sell misogynistic rap, but it is the rappers themselves who care more about "the benjamins" rather than the damage they cause to black women.
And yes, while it's true that white women enjoy a certain sexual freedom that isn't tainted by the stigma of race, the truth is that few of them actually OWN their images or their sexuality. For every business-savvy Jenna Jameson, there are hundreds of young porn starlets who have signed their rights to their bodies away. Madonna seems to be the few white women who owned both her image and her sexuality.
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» RE: Hmm...Does Anyone Remember Monster's Ball...
Posted by: DrRhymes
» RE: Hmm...Does Anyone Remember Monster's Ball...
Posted by: Kym525
» RE: Hmm...Does Anyone Remember Monster's Ball...
Posted by: DrRhymes
» RE: Hmm...Does Anyone Remember Monster's Ball...
Posted by: Kym525
» RE: Hmm...Does Anyone Remember...as a matter of fact ...some of us made that call ...
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: Hmm...Does Anyone Remember...as a matter of fact ...some of us made that call ...
Posted by: Kym525
» RE: Yeah..Right!!!
Posted by: ekipnrut
» On second thought..........
Posted by: ekipnrut
» You Actually Have THOUGHTS???
Posted by: Kym525
» RE: You Actually Have THOUGHTS???
Posted by: Kelly
» RE: You Actually Have THOUGHTS??? Ohhhhh....
Posted by: ekipnrut
» res ipsa voce stultorum loquitor
Posted by: Kelly
» Nomina et numerus stultorum semper lavatio domus parietibus haerent......
Posted by: ekipnrut
» vox stultorum=imdb, vox stultum=fill in the blank
Posted by: Kelly
» Assignment Part l
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: Assignment Part ll
Posted by: ekipnrut
Comments are closed-
Posted by: anonymous black writer on May 26, 2007 9:58 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: anonymous black writer on May 26, 2007 9:58 AM
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Posted by: Kelly on May 28, 2007 12:02 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
And how does calling her a "bi-racial slut" and "slave pussy" not make you a misogynist because Sophia Loren protrayed a rape victim in a movie? I'm lost.
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» RE: Read the assignments again...or not... But...
Posted by: ekipnrut
» i repeat
Posted by: Kelly
» RE: i repeat...Yeah.......I know.....THAT'S the problem
Posted by: ekipnrut
Comments are closed-
Posted by: jimidee on May 30, 2007 7:56 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"While white women's sexuality is celebrated in movies and magazines, Black women acting out the same behavior are relegated to the ranks of whoredom."
The negative way the black community responded (hell, is STILL responding) to Halle Berry's performance where she PRETENDED to do the nasty with Billy Bob Thorton, THEY are the ones relegating black women to whoredom, not whitey. There was no backlash from white America against Ms. Berry...none! Instead they gave her the highest honor an actess can achieve.
There are some members of black America that should reconsider its racists and separatists attitudes. Dr. Rhymes should consider that his premise is true because of blacks treatment of other blacks, not something whites are doing.
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Posted by: dlf on Jun 7, 2007 5:51 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
On the other hand I can recall an incident during the Super Bowl that had many Whites up in arms, Janet Jackson's breast. The FCC was all over it. Did anyone notice the FCC ruled that FOX was not in violation of any codes when Paris and Nicole uttered the words F**k and S**t. Anyone who is deluded enough to think that there aren't double standards when it comes to Black and White sexuality and vulgarity is simply not paying attention.
And the reason so many Blacks were offended not only by Halle, but also Denzel's win that year, was because of the roles they had to play to get Oscars. Denzel couldn't be rewarded for Malcolm X or Steven Biko he had to play a rogue cop. Halle won because of her sexuality not her acting there wasn't that much meat on that part. Personally I would have preferred she had won for her portrayal of a crack addict in Jungle Fever. It was a supporting role, but it required her to look bad and act well.
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Posted by: ekipnrut on May 19, 2007 2:01 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Ahhhhhh..But of course..here comes the White feminist Cavalry
together with 'Fawning Festus' racist white boy (deputized) posse (Remember 'Gunsmoke'??)... Hard ridin' 'Johnette Wayne'...
making da' ghetto safe for trut', justice, and the LGBT 'darkie'
way!!!!! 'Liberals'..'progressives'.....ALL hypocritical vermin...
slither on down..the Price is ALWAYS right.......for co-opted
apologists for racist nonsense or sell out (to corporate America) MFs....... :O)
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» wtf?
Posted by: Ellie1
» RE: wtf? Clarification results if you...
Posted by: ekipnrut
» is the author wanting more Black women in Porn?!??
Posted by: albrechtkrausse
» RE: is the author wanting more Black women in Porn?!??
Posted by: jroth420
» RE: There are plenty of white men who like brown sugar...
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: is the author wanting more Black women in Porn?!??
Posted by: mizani
» RE: is the author wanting more Black women in Porn?!?? Ummmm mizani.....
Posted by: ekipnrut
Comments are closed-
Posted by: JCrowe on May 19, 2007 2:47 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Not in any of the feminist circles I know about. When sex work is a real choice, when women don't go into it because they have very few economic options, then and only then will the question of whether it's "empowering" or not become askable.
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» RE: Say what?!
Posted by: frosty86
» RE: Say what?!
Posted by: goldmarx
» RE: Say what?!
Posted by: frosty86
» RE: Say what?!
Posted by: adventuregrrl
» RE: Say what?!
Posted by: frosty86
» interesting Dworkin quote
Posted by: off-the-radar 2
Comments are closed-
Posted by: kepstein7777 on May 19, 2007 5:26 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Part of that is the myth of sugar and spice. We like to pretend that we don't like women of any color who are sassy, sexy, aggressive, full of attitude, and got big butts. And we don't like the fact that we do like them, so we blame rap culture, Janet Jackson, etc. and their historical equivalents.
The article is a bit too conspiracy, but brings up some interesting things about our culture.
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» RE: It's a Puritan thing......... Correction
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: Blame it all on whitey...
Posted by: jimidee
» Black Woman ROAR Now!!! She with hair Like Lambs Wool
Posted by: Ast77
» RE: Blame it all on whitey...refer to Black Woman ROAR NOW!!!
Posted by: Ast77
» RE: Blame it all on whitey...
Posted by: mizani
» RE: It's a Puritan thing
Posted by: frosty86
» RE: It's a Puritan thing
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: It's a Puritan thing
Posted by: mizani
» RE: It's a Puritan thing
Posted by: talkville
» American Idol is culture
Posted by: vangogh69
» Pray Tell....
Posted by: Ast77
Comments are closed-
Posted by: rjgwood on May 19, 2007 6:45 AM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It is so typical a reaction from many in white America: Take no responsibility for past transgressions. Paint the messenger and the victims as exploitive for bringing up the subject, and then move on, refusing "to discuss the past."
The author is not making a "conspiracy theory" argument by pointing out the FACT that 80% of hip-hop purchasers are white and that the recording/distribution industry, indeed the entire media industry, is controlled by white men. Who then is culpable for media exploitation of black sexuality in hip-hop, the author ponders, black artists who have VERY little control in the industry, or those who own the means of production/distribution, the industry, and those who push the demand, the buyers?
Further, by giving us an historical context which firmly entrenches the fact of white control and manipulation of the image of black sexuality, from the pernicious discussions of slave "breeders" to blackploitation films to hip-hop, the sad fact is that white's have continually PROFITED from the exploitation of black sexuality.
So, for someone like Imus to fraudulently claim that no on cares about hip-hop's exploitation of black female sexuality (which the author debunks with the Ludicrious example), and for America's right to then get "up in arms" about the racial double-standard they feel is given blacks to exploit black sexuality, without acknowledging that it is precisely WHITE America through CEOs of record companies to buyers of hip-hop music that are really the ones, once again, who are exploiting black sexuality is PERVERSE and disingenuousness (Imus & right wing power brokers know who controls the media) disguised as a rational reason to not fire Imus.
The author and the Imus incident brilliantly illustrate the entrenchment of white power in our society, especially the power to avoid responsibility. If one even mentions reparations for the damage inflicted by the slave trade and the ensuing years of state sponsored misery following emancipation, one is painted a cuckoo, and that discussion is never on the table. Yet it is obviously that racism is entrenched and rampant in our society and that white domination of every institution, public and private, remains and will remain because of the culpability of people who refuse to coldly examine the facts and make it right, and yes, make reparations.
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» RE: As soon as I read this article
Posted by: JoshuaLudd
» Culpability
Posted by: Ast77
» RE: As soon as I read this article
Posted by: kelt65
» RE: As soon as I read this article
Posted by: lessbread
» RE: Of course not...
Posted by: ekipnrut
» Gasp.. you mean not everyone on the internet is a white middle class male american age 25-30???? nm
Posted by: JoshuaLudd
» RE: Blame it all on whitey...cont.
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: Blame it all on whitey...cont.
Posted by: Tacticsb
» RE: Blame it all on whitey...cont.
Posted by: jimidee
Comments are closed-
Posted by: VZEQICVA on May 19, 2007 6:55 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» Agreed, And Comparing Slavery To Black Exploitation
Posted by: hole11
» RE: Agreed, And Comparing Slavery To Black Exploitation
Posted by: mizani
» ...Just as expected.....
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: TRASH-TRASH-TRASH
Posted by: Ast77
Comments are closed-
Posted by: liberalibrarian on May 19, 2007 6:56 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: for every rule its exception
Posted by: Progressive Citizen
» RE: For every conspiracy there is an exception...
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: for every rule its exception
Posted by: off-the-radar 2
» RE: for every rule its exception
Posted by: mizani
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Posted by: H_H on May 19, 2007 7:16 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
But that can't be acknowledged.
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» RE: Don Imus' "apology"...
Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Don Imus' "apology"...
Posted by: H_H
» So Catholic priests have been......
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: So Catholic priests have been......
Posted by: H_H
» RE: So (SOME) Catholic priests have been......
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: So (SOME) Catholic priests have been......
Posted by: H_H
» RE: So (SOME) Catholic priests have been......
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: Don Imus' "apology"...
Posted by: lessbread
» RE: Don Imus' "apology"...
Posted by: H_H
» RE: Don Imus' "apology"...
Posted by: lessbread
» RE: Don Imus' "apology"...
Posted by: H_H
» RE: Don Imus' "apology"...
Posted by: lessbread
» RE: Don Imus' "apology"...
Posted by: H_H
» RE: Don Imus' "apology"...
Posted by: lessbread
Comments are closed-
Posted by: NoPCZone on May 19, 2007 7:23 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There is also a difference between a woman being sexually expressive and aggressive because she wants to and someone who is forced to by economics. A woman can be highly sexual without being a whore, yet most people seem to either confuse one for the other or choose not to for whatever reason. Like abortion, it is a woman's choice as to how she carries herself and approaches relationships. It's nobody else's business. A man- any man- lecturing women or any woman about how they should dress, work, interact with men, date or who they should sleep with is as ludicrous as the old stereotypes.
I enjoy and am attracted to women who are sexually confident and aggressive, which is very different from being easy or a whore. A person comfortable in their own skin who dresses, conducts themselves and interacts with people on their own terms is refreshing. Women should not feel forced to act in such a way, but those who do not choose to shouldn't have to play a demure wallflower.
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» Is today's reality that different?
Posted by: vangogh69
» RE: Is today's reality that different?
Posted by: NoPCZone
» RE: Is today's reality that different?
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: Is today's reality that different?
Posted by: anonymous black writer
Comments are closed-
Posted by: talkville on May 19, 2007 7:48 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There's a better world to build - much better.
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Posted by: Sojourner on May 19, 2007 7:49 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
But I cannot understand then the dynamics of the protectiveness of men of color by women of color. Is it that white men have so many privileges that they don't need or deserve protection?
Or is it that generalizations at the level of race don't make any sense, except for the commercialization of pop culture? And is pop culture anything more than an empty gesture?
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» RE: One more wrinkle? Well........
Posted by: ekipnrut
» Well........well?
Posted by: Sojourner
» RE: Well........well?
Posted by: jimidee
Comments are closed-
Posted by: frosty86 on May 19, 2007 8:06 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Softcore porn has moved into the mainstream and we can see this all over the mass media. Most of the pornography that men consume on the internet and in their homes is hardcore pornography which sexualizes violence against women and reduces women to the status of "things to be fucked." Pornography in the has grown to be a $12 billion a year industry which makes it larger than the mainstream movie industry (Hollywood is $8 billion).
Everywhere women are told by the media and corporate PR strategies, that the way to liberation is through a commodified sexuality. Not only is this an outright lie, but it trivializes the idea of liberation. All too often the idea that women should be sexually expressive and open has meant that women should learn to enjoy being treated and portrayed as sex objects and women should start having casual sex. This is not the way to end sexism and patriarchal exploitation of women's bodies. I agree that women's sexuality has been repressed and shamed, but I think there is way to change this without making women into sex objects and commodifying sexuality in general.
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» RE: patriarchal sexuality
Posted by: bob t
» RE: Why does it have to be one or the other?
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: Why does it have to be one or the other?
Posted by: frosty86
» RE: Why does it have to be one or the other?
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: Why does it have to be one or the other?
Posted by: frosty86
» RE: Why does it have to be one or the other?
Posted by: frosty86
» RE: things tobe f$#"&ed?
Posted by: justinmango
» RE: things tobe f$#"&ed?
Posted by: frosty86
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Don Garb on May 19, 2007 8:09 AM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
However, the black woman's stronger sexuality is not a product of systemic racism and it is not a myth. Black men have larger penises on average than men of other races. Why is that? Because black women have been more promiscuous than other women, for about the last half million years or so. Before you feminists out there start throwing fits and tantrums at me, do your homework. Every honest book on sexuality and evolution out there will tell you that as the females are more active, the males are built bigger. Works the same for gorillas and chimpanzees too. A female gorilla would rather die than be unfaithful to her alpha male, who consequently has a small penis size compared to the size of the rest of his body. A female chimpanzee on the other hand, will accept offers from just about anybody.
In my experience black women are not insatiable or slutty in any way that could be described as "dirty." They are just more pragmatic and practical. When legitimate escort agencies recruit new workers, the largest share of applicants are black women. They're not bad, they're just sensible. Imagine what white women would be like if they hadn't been messed up by the last few hundred years of Victorian, Christian and Republican sexual repression. They would be the same way that black women are now. If you shift your perspective, black women do not have a history of being immoral, rather white women have a history of being uptight.
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» RE: The author is right on
Posted by: mobile68
» RE: The author is right on
Posted by: Don Garb
» Careful....Donnie wishes to ply his filth on muddied waters....
Posted by: ekipnrut
» Muddied waters indeed . . .
Posted by: MAD
» RE: Muddied waters indeed . . .Well......
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: Muddied waters indeed . . .Well......
Posted by: MAD
» NO...
Posted by: elfinito
» Aw'right.. How 'bout I hook your ass up with a blind date with Bokito....
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: Aw'right.. How 'bout I hook your ass up with a blind date with Bokito....
Posted by: elfinito
» RE: Aw'right.. How 'bout I hook your ass up with a blind date with Bokito....Well.......
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: The author of this post......
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: The author is right on
Posted by: Bobsays
» RE: Oh no you Di'unt!!!!
Posted by: jimidee
» What about testosterone levels?
Posted by: moflard
» Am I a racist yet?
Posted by: Don Garb
Comments are closed-
Posted by: wleming on May 19, 2007 9:33 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
of all colors.....
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Posted by: TheTruthSeeker on May 19, 2007 10:39 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
A whore is a whore – black, brown, white, yellow and purple.
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» RE: A Whore is a Whore
Posted by: frosty86
» How about "a prostitute is a prostitute"? Feel better now, frosty86?
Posted by: TheTruthSeeker
» RE: How about "a prostitute is a prostitute"? Feel better now, frosty86?
Posted by: frosty86
» WHO'S A HO ???
Posted by: gellero
» RE: WHO'S A HO ???
Posted by: frosty86
» Sounds to me like you've see a LOT of porn, frosty86. Or you were a star perhaps?
Posted by: TheTruthSeeker
» anti-porn activists are familiar with the contents of porn, TheTruthSeeker
Posted by: frosty86
» I visited Wheelock.edu. So it's okay to call men "pimps" and "johns" but not prostitutes "whores"?
Posted by: TheTruthSeeker
» RE: I visited Wheelock.edu. So it's okay to call men "pimps" and "johns" but not prostitutes "whores"?
Posted by: frosty86
» Oh Come now, Frosty......
Posted by: gellero
» RE: Oh Come now, Frosty......
Posted by: frosty86
» RE: WHO'S A HO ???
Posted by: mizani
» RE: A Whore is a Whore- male OR female
Posted by: jimidee
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Bobsays on May 19, 2007 2:06 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The solution to these impressions is to change your behaviour and how you live. Such an example will over time change public perceptions. There is no better evidence that this is the case than the impression people have about asian women (hardworking, loyal, ambitious, family oriented). So it's not a white women conspiracy. In fact I have never heard a white woman spend any time talking about how she was going to run down black women. If they ever broach the issue, it is usually sweetly naive hopes for a better world. Those are the facts.
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» RE: Sorry, but impressions are always based on victim blaming
Posted by: lessbread
» Ge..I'm confused Bobbie....are these white women real sluts or do they just make themselves
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: Sorry, but impressions are always based on fact
Posted by: JoshuaLudd
» Wrong Impression
Posted by: gellero
» God, I love these posts!!!
Posted by: vangogh69
» Are you a Social Scientist?
Posted by: Ast77
Comments are closed-
Posted by: emmanuel_goldstein_fights_fake_lefties on May 19, 2007 6:23 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
So keep pushing that feminist propaganda! Keep pushing the woman-must-work-and-must-be-integrated-into-the-workplace PROPAGANDA!
Won't someone please think of the rich???
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» RE: VERY WOMAN MUST BE IN THE WORKFORCE!!
Posted by: richholland
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Forgiven on May 19, 2007 7:21 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
That being said, the first point that troubled me was the writers initial argument concerning the way the media deals with white women’s sexuality versus black women. The writer states that celebrity has been accorded to white women based on sexuality and not talent and then goes on to complain that the same has not been given to black women, but later he discusses how black women’s sexuality was mainstreamed in the form of novelty items. You can’t have it both ways.
The next point that troubled me was the writer’s underlying justification of the hip-hop culture based on the fact that similar things are being done in the white community. While this may or may not be true, it is precisely this type of reasoning that keeps the black community ignorant and on the current road to destruction. So, it is ok for hip-hop artist to demean black women and denigrate black culture because of racism? Even for a race consultant doctor that is a reach. Whatever happened to personal responsibility? Sure there are more liquor stores that banks and yes there are drugs rampant in my neighborhood, so does that allow me a free pass to become an alcoholic and drug addict?
Though we have more Black people with money than ever before, we are worst off as a people than we have ever been in our history. Why has achievement as a people eluded us even though we have more material wealth? There is a disconnection between those that have achieved material success and the average Black person on the street.
While we spend tremendous amounts of time and energy annihilating the outsiders who dare to use the same words we use to describe ourselves and yet we do nothing against those in our community that dispense the vile vermin that poisons our minds and the minds of our children. Where are the protest marches outside of Sean Combs studio or any number of other hip-hop artists that poison the air waves with violence, sexism, and the worst attributes of our communities? We have no trouble picketing CBS over Don Imus, yet where is the outrage for those who we really should fear? Who should we be more afraid of a few washed up media personalities that most of our children have never heard of or those who invade our homes and our air waves with all manner of mental pollution?
There will be those who speak about artistic expression and the “language of the street”, but those arguments hold no weight. There is more going on in our communities than the “thug life” these so called Black artists are portraying. When has our community been about nothing, but drug dealing, dope smoking, and killing other Black men? These so called Black men are more responsible for other young Black men being killed than any racist white men. The Klan no longer have anything to do, we are finishing the job ourselves. These men who profit from the misery of their brothers and sisters are worse than any racist. At least with an outsider you can see it coming, but these people they are doing from the inside what no outsider could do. It is a known fact that what you listen to is what you become. This isn’t about some musical expression; this is about the intentional internal genocide for the sake of fortune and fame. Is everyone in the Black community selling drugs, smoking dope, and killing? When did this become our only story? This is not my story. Is it yours?
/thedisputedtruth.blogspot.com/”> The Disputed Truth
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» RE: The ho that racism created?
Posted by: DrRhymes
» RE: The ho that racism created?
Posted by: Forgiven
» RE: The ho that racism created?
Posted by: DrRhymes
» RE: The ho that racism created?
Posted by: Forgiven
» RE: The ho that racism created?
Posted by: DrRhymes
» RE: The ho that racism created?
Posted by: Forgiven
» RE: The ho that racism created?
Posted by: mobile68
» RE: The ho that racism created?
Posted by: DrRhymes
» I myself have (infrequently) quoted Scripture.....
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: I myself have (infrequently) quoted Scripture.....
Posted by: mobile68
» Legacies of Slavery: Neither Forgotten nor Forgiven..............
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: The ho that racism created?
Posted by: grangersmith
» RE: How long can you keep blaming whitey for everything...
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: How long can you keep blaming whitey for everything...
Posted by: DrRhymes
» RE: How long can you keep blaming whitey for everything...
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: How long can you keep blaming whitey for everything...
Posted by: DrRhymes
» actually jimidee..the problems started not a mere twenty years ago....
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: actually jimidee..the problems started not a mere twenty years ago....
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: How long can you keep blaming whitey for everything...
Posted by: Kym525
» RE: How long can you keep blaming whitey for everything...
Posted by: mizani
» OK...OK...(Shrill sound of Whistle)..EVERYBODY out the F'n pool..Yeah..that means you two..
Posted by: ekipnrut
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Kelly on May 19, 2007 9:46 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I would like to add, however, that the depiction of white women's sexuality as appealing and pleasantly subversive has a long-standing presence in European literature and did not arise as a flip-side or doppelganger to the sexuality of women of color. Examples from Ancient/Medieval literature include Aristophanes' plays, La Vielle, the Wife of Bath, May and Alisoun from the Canterbury Tales, Brynhild, etc. etc. etc. There is also a long counter-history of sex-hating, anti-woman sentiment in this same European literature.
As for animalistic exploitation of women, 1980's heavy metal music was just as exploitative as modern rap, frequently showing women caged and/or painted with tiger stripes--check out Sam Kinison's "Wild Thing" with Jessica Hahn rolling around on the floor: my guess is that a certain segment of men like to see women degraded, no matter the color of either party, and that it is easier to degrade those with less money or power.
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» RE: Some context
Posted by: DrRhymes
» I'll check it out
Posted by: Kelly
» RE: I'll check it out..and while you're at it..........
Posted by: ekipnrut
» Fawning
Posted by: Kelly
» Hold up............
Posted by: ekipnrut
» Monster's Ball is PORN; Halle Berry is a Whore that represents Slave Pussy
Posted by: Shalimarali
» RE: Monster's Ball is PORN; Halle Berry is a Whore that represents Slave Pussy..YOU GOT THAT RIGHT!!
Posted by: ekipnrut
» An important distinction.......
Posted by: ekipnrut
Comments are closed-
Posted by: bob t on May 20, 2007 1:19 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
When the aforementioned groups decide to raise women to first class status much if not most abortion and pornography will end. But of course a sharp drop in porn would hurt Rupert Murdochs business, the biggest telecarrier of porn in the U.S. And O'Reilly and Hannity work for him, amaaazing.
Are right wingers just stupid or what, stupid would be the right word. But then mayhap they prefer to bash and stomp all over women rather than use some intelligence.
If they would stop being so obsessed with sex and male domination of women and allow that God gave women equal status as human beings, but they seem to conviently forget that as they cherry pick Gods works and the teachings of Jesus Christ.
So much for right wingers.
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Posted by: grangersmith on May 20, 2007 3:26 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: I got the point....Did you? :O)
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: I got the point....Did you? :O)
Posted by: mobile68
Comments are closed-
Posted by: vangogh69 on May 20, 2007 1:42 PM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It's quite easy to blame the victims and also, very old. If black women are whores/ho's then why try to better them? Likewise, if black men are oversexed brutes then why not lock them up/kill them? Whites have long projected their fantasies on black flesh (for example, black men are the anxious rapists when its white men who historically have been the rapists of black women; black men are theives when, WHEW, the US as a nation was founded on white theft, for example) as a way of asserting their own superiority. Not all white, of course, but enough. Personally, I found Imus' comment(s) much less offensive than say Ann Coulter's about "nuking the ragheads" which is both racist and imperialist --- yet she's still on the air. We have a long way to go towards equality yet we must begin by calling a spade a spade, even if its dirty.
2 cents.
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» RE: Clearly, we're not as enlightened as we may think?
Posted by: mobile68
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Progressive Citizen on May 20, 2007 7:36 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
for every rule its exception
...for every book its reader. I have found that there are several black female authors who write extremely popular pop fiction, aimed toward black women, (the authors often go by one name or initial) that are The most raunchy, explicit, and blatantly exploitive of all the books in that genre. These books go way beyond chic lit or the general romance genre. I'm curious. What is the explanation for that?
On May 19, 2007, I posted the following reply at 9:57 PM. I am posting both liberalibrarian's question and my response as food for thought, to make an effort to combat disinformation about women of all races:
This is potentially an example of veiled racism and sexism in the publishing industry as well as in literary marketing. The world of literature is run predominantly by white males who interact with few women of any color as equals, least of all black women, and go by stereotypes in their own minds.
This is not to say that the writers they publish are necessarily bad, just that they are more likely to publish and promote books that conform to their stereotype of "true" black female culture (considered more earthy and frank) or "true" white female culture (regarded as more demure), regardless of whether either is realistic.
The books to which poster liberalibrarian refers are basically women's erotica, and there are female erotica writers of all races.
The difference is that black women's erotica tends to be aggressively marketed (i.e. books by Zane end up in the African-American literature section of a bookstore) while white women's erotica tends to be placed in relatively inconspicuous sections of the bookstore.
The literature industry is seeking out a niche market of black women who enjoy explicit sexuality--while they are sometimes finding their niche, they are likely pissing off numerous other black women who, regardless of their own views on explicit sexuality, feel like they are stereotyping black female readers by showcasing these books (which sometimes have relatively explicit book art) in the African-American literature section of the bookstore. The literature industry tends to either not to market to potential white female audiences who enjoy explicit sex, or to portray it in the context of harlequin-style romances.
The decisionmakers in the literary world operate under racially distorted views of women's sexuality that do not conform to the experiences and desires of individual women, and that perpetuate simplified, distorted stereotypes of both black and white female sexuality.
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Posted by: libkid on May 20, 2007 9:37 PM
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Posted by: mobile68 on May 20, 2007 10:44 PM
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A snippet from an article seen on Yahoo news:
Poll: American satisfaction at new low
By ALAN FRAM and TREVOR TOMPSON, Associated Press Writers Sun May 20, 7:28 AM ET
WASHINGTON - It's gloomy out there. Men and women, whites and minorities — all are feeling a war-weary pessimism about the country seldom shared by so many people.
It shows how white people think that they’re different from women an “minorities”. This proves my point of what I try to explain to my friends, who put whites on a pedestal, that they are a whole another species of beings. I thought anyone who is paying taxes and legally reside and work in this country is an American citizen. Why do white people have to continually subcategorize other human beings?
Which brings me to the point of responsibility. How can an individual take personal responsibility for one’s self if not given the tools and to be taught how to use those tools properly?
Dr. Rhymes: If we have been given a scriptural mandate to take up the cause of the poor and oppressed, how do we fulfill that without addressing nations, corporations and governments? The prophets of old spoke more to the sins of nations and governments more than they did individuals.
I said in an earlier post:
-Why was the system of race classification put into practice?
-Who are the benefactors of a system based on race classification and so-called racial superiority?
-Why haven't effective solutions been formulated to educate the origins of alleged racial superiority, and to eradicate this tainted notion?
You have to address the gov’t and corporations, because they control policy. We still only have one black senator out of 100 and never a person of color or a female in the president or vice president seat. This country finally got it’s 1st female speaker of the house in 2007. Why is that such a big deal? Like only white men can sit around and live like a pig on the farm? Because none of them aren’t doing anything when you look it. Excuse me for digressing.
Look at the jews, they are still getting paid for what happened to them on European soil, have the largest lobbying group-AIPAC, and even have a federal holocaust department financed with your tax dollars, yet they are using the holocaust as a crutch so much that there are laws around the world jailing people for even questioning it. Do the Native Americans have a federal branch addressing what this gov’t has done to them on their own soil?
Examples of white privilege like g. bush to get into Harvard because of who his family is, even though he barely passed, is OK for them, but in order for us brownies to get into Harvard or where-ever-else-university, they won’t take in the ones that can truly hold their own, they instead will search for and take a dumbed down version of us to fill a quota which they created, which in turn satisfies whitey’s screwed up ego by saying, ‘see they only got in because they’re black, Hispanic, etc.’ Same scenario when applying for a job or a loan.
Whites have and control the tools which they are going to give to their own first and foremost because it’s their way of maintaining control over those who differ from themselves.
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» RE: Forgiven, you and Dr. Rhymes bring up some excellent points.
Posted by: DrRhymes
» RE: Forgiven, you and Dr. Rhymes bring up some excellent points.
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: Forgiven, you and Dr. Rhymes bring up some excellent points.
Posted by: mobile68
» RE: Forgiven, you and Dr. Rhymes bring up some excellent points.
Posted by: jimidee
» RE: Forgiven, you and Dr. Rhymes bring up some excellent points.
Posted by: mobile68
» RE: Forgiven, you and Dr. Rhymes bring up some excellent points. Mobile........
Posted by: ekipnrut
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Posted by: mobile68 on May 20, 2007 10:49 PM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Well what about the people who are getting thru life decently, yet stand by and aren’t challenging the gov’t about the war, hurricane Katrina, etc.? It’s because they feel that it ain’t affecting them directly so they justify their silence by saying "I’m just going to toe the line so I won’t lose what little I do have." This is true of both blacks and whites.
I’ve noticed in talking to different groups of people, people do sound hopeless, but so many of them are so quick to say, 'oh just pray about it', instead of taking action and responsibility for themselves, let alone for others.
Why don’t you see people protesting about the war on college campuses like in the 70’s?
Why don’t you see people leaving their cars at home to protest high gas prices like the Montgomery bus boycott of the 50’s?
Americans, black and white, are stressing themselves out over material things, are star struck, and have just given their power over to the gov’t and the churches, both who are leading them down to a road called nowhere. So what happened is an affliction of social laziness compounded with it’s-not-my-problem-itis.
We the people in this country are the worst examples in the world of democracy gone wrong. No wonder people around the world don’t respect us, because we don’t respect ourselves.
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Posted by: ekipnrut on May 21, 2007 6:59 AM
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Posted by: jimidee on May 21, 2007 9:29 AM
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The term "ho" is a BLACK variation on the word whore...and is seldom used in the "white community" except by young hip-hoppers trying to act black for whatever reason. It certainly has never been a part of the lexicon of Imus's generation...that part is laughable! Imus and Bernard were doing an obvious parody of bro's rappin' in the hood...as seen in Spike Lee's "School Daze". They were in character when they did it. It was a performance, stupid!
Should all actors be held personally accountable for the scoundrels that they play? Should all lawyers be personally associated with the scum that they represent? This crap has become ridiculous.
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» RE: The article is based upon a false premise...
Posted by: DrRhymes
» RE: The article is based upon a false premise...
Posted by: jimidee
» ..upon a false premise...Yeah right!...as if your dumb racist ass knows WTF a 'false premise' is...
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: ..upon a false premise...Yeah right!...as if your dumb racist ass knows WTF a 'false premise' is...
Posted by: jimidee
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Posted by: Pace on May 21, 2007 11:05 AM
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Posted by: luffy28 on May 21, 2007 11:55 AM
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» RE: SOME Minorities are stupid.......(SOMETIMES).. However......
Posted by: ekipnrut
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Posted by: Kym525 on May 23, 2007 2:40 PM
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But I digress...a little.
Though I agree with most of the author's assertions, which still doesn't explain the growing misogyny of some black men, black women are not just viewed as hypersexual. There's also the "church girl/frigid" stereotype which some black men use to justify dating women (especially white women) of other races. We're also considered "strong" and that word now carries a stigma rather than the badge of honor that it used to. Black women are expected to put up with a LOT of b.s.--not just from the larger society, but from those in our community who should know better. Music companies may sell misogynistic rap, but it is the rappers themselves who care more about "the benjamins" rather than the damage they cause to black women.
And yes, while it's true that white women enjoy a certain sexual freedom that isn't tainted by the stigma of race, the truth is that few of them actually OWN their images or their sexuality. For every business-savvy Jenna Jameson, there are hundreds of young porn starlets who have signed their rights to their bodies away. Madonna seems to be the few white women who owned both her image and her sexuality.
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» RE: Hmm...Does Anyone Remember Monster's Ball...
Posted by: DrRhymes
» RE: Hmm...Does Anyone Remember Monster's Ball...
Posted by: Kym525
» RE: Hmm...Does Anyone Remember Monster's Ball...
Posted by: DrRhymes
» RE: Hmm...Does Anyone Remember Monster's Ball...
Posted by: Kym525
» RE: Hmm...Does Anyone Remember...as a matter of fact ...some of us made that call ...
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: Hmm...Does Anyone Remember...as a matter of fact ...some of us made that call ...
Posted by: Kym525
» RE: Yeah..Right!!!
Posted by: ekipnrut
» On second thought..........
Posted by: ekipnrut
» You Actually Have THOUGHTS???
Posted by: Kym525
» RE: You Actually Have THOUGHTS???
Posted by: Kelly
» RE: You Actually Have THOUGHTS??? Ohhhhh....
Posted by: ekipnrut
» res ipsa voce stultorum loquitor
Posted by: Kelly
» Nomina et numerus stultorum semper lavatio domus parietibus haerent......
Posted by: ekipnrut
» vox stultorum=imdb, vox stultum=fill in the blank
Posted by: Kelly
» Assignment Part l
Posted by: ekipnrut
» RE: Assignment Part ll
Posted by: ekipnrut
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Posted by: anonymous black writer on May 26, 2007 9:58 AM
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Posted by: anonymous black writer on May 26, 2007 9:58 AM
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Posted by: Kelly on May 28, 2007 12:02 PM
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And how does calling her a "bi-racial slut" and "slave pussy" not make you a misogynist because Sophia Loren protrayed a rape victim in a movie? I'm lost.
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» RE: Read the assignments again...or not... But...
Posted by: ekipnrut
» i repeat
Posted by: Kelly
» RE: i repeat...Yeah.......I know.....THAT'S the problem
Posted by: ekipnrut
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Posted by: jimidee on May 30, 2007 7:56 PM
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"While white women's sexuality is celebrated in movies and magazines, Black women acting out the same behavior are relegated to the ranks of whoredom."
The negative way the black community responded (hell, is STILL responding) to Halle Berry's performance where she PRETENDED to do the nasty with Billy Bob Thorton, THEY are the ones relegating black women to whoredom, not whitey. There was no backlash from white America against Ms. Berry...none! Instead they gave her the highest honor an actess can achieve.
There are some members of black America that should reconsider its racists and separatists attitudes. Dr. Rhymes should consider that his premise is true because of blacks treatment of other blacks, not something whites are doing.
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Posted by: dlf on Jun 7, 2007 5:51 PM
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On the other hand I can recall an incident during the Super Bowl that had many Whites up in arms, Janet Jackson's breast. The FCC was all over it. Did anyone notice the FCC ruled that FOX was not in violation of any codes when Paris and Nicole uttered the words F**k and S**t. Anyone who is deluded enough to think that there aren't double standards when it comes to Black and White sexuality and vulgarity is simply not paying attention.
And the reason so many Blacks were offended not only by Halle, but also Denzel's win that year, was because of the roles they had to play to get Oscars. Denzel couldn't be rewarded for Malcolm X or Steven Biko he had to play a rogue cop. Halle won because of her sexuality not her acting there wasn't that much meat on that part. Personally I would have preferred she had won for her portrayal of a crack addict in Jungle Fever. It was a supporting role, but it required her to look bad and act well.
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