COMMENTS: 98
Keeping Tabs on the Peaceniks
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On March 8, 2006, FBI Supervisory Senior Resident Agent G. Charles Rasner, delivered a guest lecture before professor Ronald Sievert's U.S. Law and National Security class of approximately 100 students. Accompanying his lecture was an "unclassified" PowerPoint presentation titled "Counter-Terrorism Efforts in Texas."
According to UT law student Elizabeth Wagoner's account of Rasner's lecture on Austin Indymedia:
"On a list of approximately ten groups, Food Not Bombs was listed seventh. Indymedia was listed tenth, with a reference specifically to IndyConference 2005. The Communist Party of Texas also made the list. Rasner explained that these groups could have links to terrorist activity. He noted that peaceful-sounding group names could cover more violent extremist tactics."
Wagoner has made a Freedom of Information Act request for Rasner's PowerPoint presentation.
Food Not Bombs (disclosure: the author used to participate in an Austin FNB group) is a moniker for volunteer-run groups that distribute unused vegetarian food from grocery stores and restaurants for free to the general population. Its name stems from a belief that excessive military spending could be redirected to provide food for the hungry. Indymedia is a decentralized grassroots online media outlet, which provides an alternative to the mainstream media coverage.
A self-described libertarian law student who also attended the class wrote on his blog that this list "got many in class riled up."
Rene Salinas, a spokesperson for the FBI San Antonio field office, said that the FBI "doesn't put people on the Terror Watch List for grins." He said that a group has to act or participate in a group connected with terrorism. He declined to say whether any of the groups Rasner mentioned have connections to terrorism or how terrorism is defined. He did say that the Terror Watch List helps keep different law enforcement agencies informed about suspect characters. Salinas described a scenario where the list could help a police officer who pulled over an individual on the list for a traffic violation identify a person that "we might just want to question."
Since 9/11, government surveillance of domestic organizations has increased, raising questions that legitimate political activity and civil liberties are being violated under a sweeping and unjustifiably broad definition of terrorism. Legislative and administrative changes, notably the Patriot Act, have given law enforcement agencies, including the FBI, broadened power to investigate and monitor individuals and organizations. In response to concerns from a bipartisan group of legislators, minor changes were made to the Patriot Act when Congress reauthorized it last month.
At the UT-Austin campus alone, there has been other evidence of government surveillance of political organizations. A 2003 FOIA request by UT Watch uncovered that the University of Texas-Austin participates in the Austin Joint Terrorism Task Force, made up of an FBI liason, and members of the University of Texas Police Department and Austin Police Department. In 2004, FBI agents questioned a UT student after he made a state open records request to UT for information about tunnels underneath the UT campus. The agents asked the student questions such as "Have you ever thought of joining any student activist organizations, like UT Watch?" (Disclosure: The author has been involved with UT Watch.)
Such surveillance has occurred at other campuses as well. For example, the ACLU obtained a FBI report entitled "Domestic Terrorism Symposium" (PDF), which mentions Direct Action, an anti-war group at Michigan State University, and BAMN (By Any Means Necessary), a national group with a chapter at Michigan State that defends affirmative action.
Also this Month, the ACLU released documents showing that Pennsylvania law enforcement was surveilling an anti-war group because of its political activities. Through a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request, the ACLU of Pennsylvania obtained documents revealing that the FBI was monitoring gatherings at the Thomas Merton Center for Peace and Justice in Pittsburgh. According to the FBI's own description (PDF), the Thomas Merton Center "is a left-wing organization advocating, among many political causes, pacificism." However, the center is more of a gathering place and resource center "for over 30 different projects," according to the center's website.
Post-9/11 government spying operations are reminiscent of those uncovered by 1970s congressional investigations such as the FBI's COINTELPRO program and the NSA's Shamrock and Minaret programs. Congress found that civil liberties and legitimate political activity were suppressed by the government and sought to place these programs under a modicum of oversight to reign in excesses.
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Posted by: debbieaustin on Mar 27, 2006 12:45 AM
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» RE: Creeeps
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» RE: Creeeps
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» RE: Creeeps
Posted by: fifthworld
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Posted by: thinkverybig on Mar 27, 2006 2:44 AM
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With so many other important issues we could be addressing, we choose to invade two other countries, spend over 350 billion in tax payers money, and be responsible for over 2500 U.S. Soldiers lives not counting those who are injured emotionally and physically. And also the tens of thousands of Iraqis and Afghans we have killed and scarred for life. Where are our priorities or is it all about the money.... not the people. It's time for a CHANGE and the sooner the better folks... It's time for a REVOLUTION.
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» RE: It's Time for a REVOLUTION
Posted by: Lincoln fan
» RE: It's Time for a REVOLUTION
Posted by: redskin69
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Posted by: Nez46 on Mar 27, 2006 4:00 AM
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» RE: Until The Media Is Wrested From Corporate Control....
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» RE: Want your cake and eat it, too
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» RE: Want your cake and eat it, too
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Posted by: rsaxto on Mar 27, 2006 4:49 AM
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Posted by: sgtmartin1 on Mar 27, 2006 5:04 AM
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Dubya has perverted both our constitution and, ironically, the basic tenets of the political party he purports to represent. I'm amazed more Republicans have not spoken up. It's almost made this good Democrat a fan of Bob Barr!
But the intrusions are not limited to DOJ, be careful what you search for:
Oodles of Googles
...But know that the Chinese government isn’t the only bureaucracy with designs on using Google to further its agenda. Last summer, Uncle Sam’s crazy nephew, the Department of Justice, served Google with a subpoena demanding billions of search requests and Web site addresses as part of Dubya’s effort to protect children from porn...Freedom in America isn’t eroding. It’s undergoing a wholesale excavation. Perhaps we should all start madly Googling the term “constitution” in hopes that the search records are subpoenaed by the feds and they will be forced to investigate it...
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» RE: It just deepens my disgust, but it doesn't surprise...
Posted by: WhatNow?
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Posted by: nbrown on Mar 27, 2006 5:06 AM
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Have a look at my Iraq War Timeline. Think back to previous events and statements in the war. What do you see?
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» RE: Aggressive war for an aggressive government
Posted by: symcokid
» Yes...
Posted by: Ivan_K
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Posted by: roland89 on Mar 27, 2006 5:13 AM
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I believe the way forward is something as simple as being yourself, don't bow to any stereotypes and get back in touch with nature, maybe my way of thinking will get me tagged as a terrorist, but I'm tired of being frightened to speak out, as I watch our beautiful planet and everything contained with in being destroyed. We have all bought into this problem by separating ourselves from nature, then separating ourselves from each other, Black vs White, Female vs Male, Gay vs Straight, Rich vs Poor, Young vs Old, Left vs Right, these are the tactics of polarization and their not benefiting anyone, even the greedy will be shocked when extreme environmental shifts start talking place.
The revolution will not be televised as it's a battle in ourselves to reclaim our humanity.
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» I couldn't agree with you more!
Posted by: Ivan_K
» RE: I couldn't agree with you more!
Posted by: heliosweb
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Posted by: Uncle Tupelo on Mar 27, 2006 5:22 AM
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Posted by: vkobaya on Mar 27, 2006 6:29 AM
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» RE: Does FBI Monitor Right Wing
Posted by: AlienSlave
» RE: Does FBI Monitor Right Wing
Posted by: cottontail
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Posted by: mozillafs on Mar 27, 2006 7:08 AM
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» RE: Lincoln Initiative? Feh
Posted by: Lincoln fan
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Posted by: jrmart66 on Mar 27, 2006 7:44 AM
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I fully expect that someday when i hop to the airport to visit my grandchildren in Maryland that some 12 dollar an hour "security" guard will inform me that --so sorry, you no fly!!!!
and what could i do about it? ZIP ZIPPO NADA NUTTIN.
My son happens to be on a no fly list. He happens to have a name shared by at least a hundred thousand Americans. Perhaps, just perhaps, ONE of them MIGHT be a legitimate threat. Nevertheless, allthough he has now made over 50 flights, each time going through the extra security encumbant on no flyers, the government has yet to --1: explain why he is on the list; and 2: why they can't clear him once and give him some form of number or code that will allow him NORMAL access to the airways.
(he can't for instance book online!!!)
This Gestapo administration is using fear and "security" to impose restrictions on ---who?---AMERICANS. LOYAL PATRIOTIC AMERICANS. OF WHICH I HAPPEN TO BE ONE.
Germany slid into the depths of hell with just such a beginning when NO ONE stood up and resisted.
IT is encumbant on the Main Line Media to act as a watchdog. I don't see that happening.
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» RE: what about no-fly?
Posted by: ocho
» RE: what about no-fly?
Posted by: cornellm
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Posted by: codingguy on Mar 27, 2006 8:03 AM
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If that makes some of you angry, i suggest you spend a few hours combing through the "articles" on an indymedia site. Mind you, i'm not suggesting there arent perfectly legitimate anti-war and anti-govt articles posted -- there are lots of those -- but in my opinion, it would be irresponsible for a govt. to ignore the site.
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» RE: "Those who give up liberty for security, deserve neither" T. Jefferson
Posted by: codingguy
» This is what the first revolutionary war was about.
Posted by: brad
» RE: This is what the first revolutionary war was about.
Posted by: codingguy
» RE: This is what the first revolutionary war was about.
Posted by: brad
» RE: This is what the first revolutionary war was about.
Posted by: codingguy
» RE: "Those who give up liberty for security, deserve neither" T. Jefferson
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» RE: Contrary view
Posted by: nickbk
» RE: Contrary view
Posted by: Asses of Evil
» RE: Contrary view
Posted by: rj123
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Posted by: Boomerang on Mar 27, 2006 9:57 AM
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Oh yeah, because there wasn't any threat that if they splintered they would turn into the Weather Underground and go on a ten-year urban terrorism campaign.
Oh wait... they did.
Silly FBI, keeping tabs on groups full of extremists.
There's absolutely no reason we should be concerned about someone asking for steam tunnel blueprints to a university, and nevermind that group called Direct Action, their name can't possibly be taken from the French terrorist group with the same name.
Please, this is why Republicans get to rip into liberals for being weak on national security, because ridiculous bullshit articles like this confirm their suspicions.
Oh noes, if I go to a protest, I might be put on an FBI watch list! You know what, if you're going to be active in political activities that make the government nervous, you should EXPECT to be on a watch list. In the perfect world you can pretend that you're being snow-white innocent and doing nothing but exercising your liberties, but governments get very, very nervous about groups on the far side of any spectrum.
If you think groups like Food Not Bombs and the Texas Communist Party are staffed by mainstream, everyday Americans, you're living in a fantasty world. Hell yes, the government is going to keep their eyes on you, you whacko. Why do you think PETA is on the terrorism watch list? They're not a little weird, they just love animals! Nevermind the possible links to the ALF and ELF.
Grow up, Alternet gets worse and worse every day.
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» RE: This article is ridiculous
Posted by: bmrunner
» It is you who are ridiculous
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» RE: This article is ridiculous
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» RE: This article is ridiculous
Posted by: Asses of Evil
» more intelligence from Asses of Evil
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» RE: more intelligence from Asses of Evil
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» RE: This article is ridiculous
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» RE: This article is ridiculous
Posted by: ChicanoThinker
» RE: This article is ridiculous
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» RE: This article is ridiculous
Posted by: Roverton
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Posted by: chasaturn on Mar 27, 2006 10:07 AM
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Posted by: outragedinIN on Mar 27, 2006 10:21 AM
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» RE: Get your FBI file
Posted by: outsidea
» I don't trust them
Posted by: axolotl_helix
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Posted by: shinyfish on Mar 27, 2006 12:21 PM
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We are the govenment and the government is us. Our fathers/brothers/sisters/mothers/uncles/aunts/neighbors may be in the FBI/Military or earn a living in the Military Industrial Complex (which is the U.S.).
If you want things to change, you must change yourself. Stop playing the game. We complain about big oil profits as we get into our cars to go off to a peace rally. Doesn't make sense. I recently lived in an Intentional Community for a couple of years. 75% of the house's weekly recycling bin consisted of magazines, newsletters and fund raising paraphanalia from Environmental/Peace Organizations.
Sounds schizophenic doesn't it.
What is that old saying about violence…
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» RE: We are all terrorists
Posted by: ConnecttheDots
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Posted by: Ellie1 on Mar 27, 2006 1:15 PM
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» That's OK. Just send me a photo...
Posted by: chasaturn
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Posted by: eileenflmng on Mar 27, 2006 9:25 PM
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I have just returned from my third 16 Days in Israel Palestine
+
Checked my link to read where my readers
have this month come from
to discover
That since WAWA's birth 8 months ago
BIG BROTHER:
US MILITARY and US Government
have dropped in over
1,500 times
Hi Big Brother!
"Many journalists come here to the American Colony, they all want to cover my story, but the EDITORS say no."
-Mordechai Vanunu @ the American Colony March 26, 2006 to WAWA Reporter + EDITOR
more of that conversation to follow later on WAWA
but now i must go,
i have laundry to do.
WAWA:
http://www.wearewideawake.org/
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Posted by: wli on Mar 27, 2006 11:57 PM
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The right wing has been planning to do this since 1948, when the right wing proposed incinerating "Communists" in death camps as an alternative to mere McCarthyism. The New Deal Democrats stopped it and their remnants stood in its way until the Republicans took over. Now that Republicans are in charge of all three branches of government, they're going to kill us all ("us" being the lefties). They're having the FBI and others spy on us and build up a hitlist millions long. Then when the martial law or counterterrorism or death squad or whatever trap snaps shut, off we go into the gas chambers and ovens.
Generally this sort of thing is written off as some bizarre right-wing(!) paranoid fantasy. This is not tremendously difficult to do, because the right-wing websites/etc. are generally completely wrong about the details and go on endlessly about garbage dumps they think are the death camps or whatever. I've seen no trace of physical evidence of all this, though I wouldn't be surprised if the RW'ers had smoked out one or two actual death camps from their mostly bogus list of 600 or so, but there is copious documentary evidence, starting with the Congressional record in 1948. From there not much happened until 1975 when Ron Ridenhour (of My Lai fame) smoked out Garden Plot (the death camp plan that spun off REX 84 as an exercise) and Lantern Spike (a sort of REX 84 precursor exercise and/or troop movement that was connected to the MLK assassination in some unclear way beyond the military patrols and surveillance around MLK). Then, of course, comes REX 84 itself, exposed in 1987, which was just a Garden Plot -related exercise. The right wing tends to go on endlessly about REX 84 as if it were the overarching plan in and of itself or as if it had significance beyond being some subsidiary exercise for Garden Plot.
Another problem with the right-wing version of events is that they claim the targets are Christians or "patriots" or some such nonsense. This is, of course, preposterous, because the documentary evidence very explicitly names its targets:
1. "Communists"
2. hippies
3. protesters
4. blacks
I'm sure there are special ovens or some such reserved for atheists and other religious "heretics" in like fashion.
There are a number who say, of course, that control over the US populace could never be effectively exerted by such means. Whatever they're smoking, they've not reviewed death squad campaigns the US has fomented around the world. Political profiling and mass killing actually does work, and has rather consistently done so except in the face of massive militarily organized resistance with extensive foreign sponsorship. Whatever reason things are "going wrong" in Iraq has little to do with ability, and by and large can only be the subject of speculation regarding ulterior motives for maintaining an occupying force there.
Garden Plot, by the way, was activated on 9/11 as Operation Noble Eagle, and remains active to this day, with no known plans to halt it.
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» RE: Halliburton's death camps for Democrats
Posted by: codingguy
» RE: Halliburton's death camps for Democrats
Posted by: wli
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Posted by: Ellen Remore on Mar 28, 2006 12:05 PM
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Posted by: ggeddis on Mar 28, 2006 2:11 PM
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Posted by: KPelley on Apr 2, 2006 12:04 PM
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Posted by: Jan Frel on Apr 5, 2006 11:42 PM
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Posted by: ConnecttheDots on Apr 6, 2006 4:43 PM
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O Henry in Hell.
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Posted by: debbieaustin on Mar 27, 2006 12:45 AM
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» RE: Creeeps
Posted by: nickbk
» RE: Creeeps
Posted by: alterhead
» RE: Creeeps
Posted by: fifthworld
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Posted by: thinkverybig on Mar 27, 2006 2:44 AM
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With so many other important issues we could be addressing, we choose to invade two other countries, spend over 350 billion in tax payers money, and be responsible for over 2500 U.S. Soldiers lives not counting those who are injured emotionally and physically. And also the tens of thousands of Iraqis and Afghans we have killed and scarred for life. Where are our priorities or is it all about the money.... not the people. It's time for a CHANGE and the sooner the better folks... It's time for a REVOLUTION.
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» RE: It's Time for a REVOLUTION
Posted by: Lincoln fan
» RE: It's Time for a REVOLUTION
Posted by: redskin69
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Posted by: Nez46 on Mar 27, 2006 4:00 AM
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» RE: Until The Media Is Wrested From Corporate Control....
Posted by: AlienSlave
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Posted by: cornellm on Mar 27, 2006 4:19 AM
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» RE: Want your cake and eat it, too
Posted by: Nez46
» RE: Want your cake and eat it, too
Posted by: Reinform.org
» RE: Want your cake and eat it, too
Posted by: debbieaustin
» RE: Want your cake and eat it, too
Posted by: cornellm
» RE: Want your cake and eat it, too
Posted by: jrmart66
» RE: Want your cake and eat it, too
Posted by: redskin69
» RE: Want your cake and eat it, too
Posted by: janiepoe
» RE: To Cornellm
Posted by: mendomama
» RE: Want your cake and eat it, too
Posted by: civil rights 1
» RE: Want your cake and eat it, too
Posted by: nickbk
» RE: Want your cake and eat it, too
Posted by: saywhat
» RE: Want your cake and eat it, too
Posted by: nickbk
» the middle road
Posted by: cornellm
» RE: Want your cake and eat it, too
Posted by: jredd
» RE: Want your cake and eat it, too
Posted by: Asses of Evil
» RE: Want your cake and eat it, too
Posted by: cornellm
» RE: Want your cake and eat it, too
Posted by: rj123
» RE: Want your cake and eat it, too
Posted by: Asses of Evil
» RE: Want your cake and eat it, too
Posted by: keith@foodnotbombs.net
» brave ones like you
Posted by: cornellm
» RE: Want your cake and eat it, too
Posted by: Roverton
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Posted by: rsaxto on Mar 27, 2006 4:49 AM
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Posted by: sgtmartin1 on Mar 27, 2006 5:04 AM
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Dubya has perverted both our constitution and, ironically, the basic tenets of the political party he purports to represent. I'm amazed more Republicans have not spoken up. It's almost made this good Democrat a fan of Bob Barr!
But the intrusions are not limited to DOJ, be careful what you search for:
Oodles of Googles
...But know that the Chinese government isn’t the only bureaucracy with designs on using Google to further its agenda. Last summer, Uncle Sam’s crazy nephew, the Department of Justice, served Google with a subpoena demanding billions of search requests and Web site addresses as part of Dubya’s effort to protect children from porn...Freedom in America isn’t eroding. It’s undergoing a wholesale excavation. Perhaps we should all start madly Googling the term “constitution” in hopes that the search records are subpoenaed by the feds and they will be forced to investigate it...
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» RE: It just deepens my disgust, but it doesn't surprise...
Posted by: WhatNow?
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Posted by: nbrown on Mar 27, 2006 5:06 AM
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Have a look at my Iraq War Timeline. Think back to previous events and statements in the war. What do you see?
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» RE: Aggressive war for an aggressive government
Posted by: symcokid
» Yes...
Posted by: Ivan_K
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Posted by: roland89 on Mar 27, 2006 5:13 AM
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I believe the way forward is something as simple as being yourself, don't bow to any stereotypes and get back in touch with nature, maybe my way of thinking will get me tagged as a terrorist, but I'm tired of being frightened to speak out, as I watch our beautiful planet and everything contained with in being destroyed. We have all bought into this problem by separating ourselves from nature, then separating ourselves from each other, Black vs White, Female vs Male, Gay vs Straight, Rich vs Poor, Young vs Old, Left vs Right, these are the tactics of polarization and their not benefiting anyone, even the greedy will be shocked when extreme environmental shifts start talking place.
The revolution will not be televised as it's a battle in ourselves to reclaim our humanity.
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» I couldn't agree with you more!
Posted by: Ivan_K
» RE: I couldn't agree with you more!
Posted by: heliosweb
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Posted by: Uncle Tupelo on Mar 27, 2006 5:22 AM
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Posted by: vkobaya on Mar 27, 2006 6:29 AM
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» RE: Does FBI Monitor Right Wing
Posted by: AlienSlave
» RE: Does FBI Monitor Right Wing
Posted by: cottontail
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Posted by: mozillafs on Mar 27, 2006 7:08 AM
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» RE: Lincoln Initiative? Feh
Posted by: Lincoln fan
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Posted by: jrmart66 on Mar 27, 2006 7:44 AM
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I fully expect that someday when i hop to the airport to visit my grandchildren in Maryland that some 12 dollar an hour "security" guard will inform me that --so sorry, you no fly!!!!
and what could i do about it? ZIP ZIPPO NADA NUTTIN.
My son happens to be on a no fly list. He happens to have a name shared by at least a hundred thousand Americans. Perhaps, just perhaps, ONE of them MIGHT be a legitimate threat. Nevertheless, allthough he has now made over 50 flights, each time going through the extra security encumbant on no flyers, the government has yet to --1: explain why he is on the list; and 2: why they can't clear him once and give him some form of number or code that will allow him NORMAL access to the airways.
(he can't for instance book online!!!)
This Gestapo administration is using fear and "security" to impose restrictions on ---who?---AMERICANS. LOYAL PATRIOTIC AMERICANS. OF WHICH I HAPPEN TO BE ONE.
Germany slid into the depths of hell with just such a beginning when NO ONE stood up and resisted.
IT is encumbant on the Main Line Media to act as a watchdog. I don't see that happening.
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» RE: what about no-fly?
Posted by: ocho
» RE: what about no-fly?
Posted by: cornellm
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Posted by: codingguy on Mar 27, 2006 8:03 AM
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If that makes some of you angry, i suggest you spend a few hours combing through the "articles" on an indymedia site. Mind you, i'm not suggesting there arent perfectly legitimate anti-war and anti-govt articles posted -- there are lots of those -- but in my opinion, it would be irresponsible for a govt. to ignore the site.
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» RE: "Those who give up liberty for security, deserve neither" T. Jefferson
Posted by: codingguy
» This is what the first revolutionary war was about.
Posted by: brad
» RE: This is what the first revolutionary war was about.
Posted by: codingguy
» RE: This is what the first revolutionary war was about.
Posted by: brad
» RE: This is what the first revolutionary war was about.
Posted by: codingguy
» RE: "Those who give up liberty for security, deserve neither" T. Jefferson
Posted by: Bronx Girl
» RE: Contrary view
Posted by: nickbk
» RE: Contrary view
Posted by: Asses of Evil
» RE: Contrary view
Posted by: rj123
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Posted by: Boomerang on Mar 27, 2006 9:57 AM
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Oh yeah, because there wasn't any threat that if they splintered they would turn into the Weather Underground and go on a ten-year urban terrorism campaign.
Oh wait... they did.
Silly FBI, keeping tabs on groups full of extremists.
There's absolutely no reason we should be concerned about someone asking for steam tunnel blueprints to a university, and nevermind that group called Direct Action, their name can't possibly be taken from the French terrorist group with the same name.
Please, this is why Republicans get to rip into liberals for being weak on national security, because ridiculous bullshit articles like this confirm their suspicions.
Oh noes, if I go to a protest, I might be put on an FBI watch list! You know what, if you're going to be active in political activities that make the government nervous, you should EXPECT to be on a watch list. In the perfect world you can pretend that you're being snow-white innocent and doing nothing but exercising your liberties, but governments get very, very nervous about groups on the far side of any spectrum.
If you think groups like Food Not Bombs and the Texas Communist Party are staffed by mainstream, everyday Americans, you're living in a fantasty world. Hell yes, the government is going to keep their eyes on you, you whacko. Why do you think PETA is on the terrorism watch list? They're not a little weird, they just love animals! Nevermind the possible links to the ALF and ELF.
Grow up, Alternet gets worse and worse every day.
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» RE: This article is ridiculous
Posted by: bmrunner
» It is you who are ridiculous
Posted by: brad
» RE: This article is ridiculous
Posted by: Jim McCulloch
» RE: This article is ridiculous
Posted by: Asses of Evil
» more intelligence from Asses of Evil
Posted by: cornellm
» RE: more intelligence from Asses of Evil
Posted by: Asses of Evil
» RE: This article is ridiculous
Posted by: rj123
» RE: This article is ridiculous
Posted by: ChicanoThinker
» RE: This article is ridiculous
Posted by: Jan Frel
» RE: This article is ridiculous
Posted by: Roverton
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Posted by: chasaturn on Mar 27, 2006 10:07 AM
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Posted by: outragedinIN on Mar 27, 2006 10:21 AM
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» RE: Get your FBI file
Posted by: outsidea
» I don't trust them
Posted by: axolotl_helix
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Posted by: shinyfish on Mar 27, 2006 12:21 PM
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We are the govenment and the government is us. Our fathers/brothers/sisters/mothers/uncles/aunts/neighbors may be in the FBI/Military or earn a living in the Military Industrial Complex (which is the U.S.).
If you want things to change, you must change yourself. Stop playing the game. We complain about big oil profits as we get into our cars to go off to a peace rally. Doesn't make sense. I recently lived in an Intentional Community for a couple of years. 75% of the house's weekly recycling bin consisted of magazines, newsletters and fund raising paraphanalia from Environmental/Peace Organizations.
Sounds schizophenic doesn't it.
What is that old saying about violence…
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» RE: We are all terrorists
Posted by: ConnecttheDots
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Posted by: Ellie1 on Mar 27, 2006 1:15 PM
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» That's OK. Just send me a photo...
Posted by: chasaturn
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Posted by: eileenflmng on Mar 27, 2006 9:25 PM
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I have just returned from my third 16 Days in Israel Palestine
+
Checked my link to read where my readers
have this month come from
to discover
That since WAWA's birth 8 months ago
BIG BROTHER:
US MILITARY and US Government
have dropped in over
1,500 times
Hi Big Brother!
"Many journalists come here to the American Colony, they all want to cover my story, but the EDITORS say no."
-Mordechai Vanunu @ the American Colony March 26, 2006 to WAWA Reporter + EDITOR
more of that conversation to follow later on WAWA
but now i must go,
i have laundry to do.
WAWA:
http://www.wearewideawake.org/
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Posted by: wli on Mar 27, 2006 11:57 PM
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The right wing has been planning to do this since 1948, when the right wing proposed incinerating "Communists" in death camps as an alternative to mere McCarthyism. The New Deal Democrats stopped it and their remnants stood in its way until the Republicans took over. Now that Republicans are in charge of all three branches of government, they're going to kill us all ("us" being the lefties). They're having the FBI and others spy on us and build up a hitlist millions long. Then when the martial law or counterterrorism or death squad or whatever trap snaps shut, off we go into the gas chambers and ovens.
Generally this sort of thing is written off as some bizarre right-wing(!) paranoid fantasy. This is not tremendously difficult to do, because the right-wing websites/etc. are generally completely wrong about the details and go on endlessly about garbage dumps they think are the death camps or whatever. I've seen no trace of physical evidence of all this, though I wouldn't be surprised if the RW'ers had smoked out one or two actual death camps from their mostly bogus list of 600 or so, but there is copious documentary evidence, starting with the Congressional record in 1948. From there not much happened until 1975 when Ron Ridenhour (of My Lai fame) smoked out Garden Plot (the death camp plan that spun off REX 84 as an exercise) and Lantern Spike (a sort of REX 84 precursor exercise and/or troop movement that was connected to the MLK assassination in some unclear way beyond the military patrols and surveillance around MLK). Then, of course, comes REX 84 itself, exposed in 1987, which was just a Garden Plot -related exercise. The right wing tends to go on endlessly about REX 84 as if it were the overarching plan in and of itself or as if it had significance beyond being some subsidiary exercise for Garden Plot.
Another problem with the right-wing version of events is that they claim the targets are Christians or "patriots" or some such nonsense. This is, of course, preposterous, because the documentary evidence very explicitly names its targets:
1. "Communists"
2. hippies
3. protesters
4. blacks
I'm sure there are special ovens or some such reserved for atheists and other religious "heretics" in like fashion.
There are a number who say, of course, that control over the US populace could never be effectively exerted by such means. Whatever they're smoking, they've not reviewed death squad campaigns the US has fomented around the world. Political profiling and mass killing actually does work, and has rather consistently done so except in the face of massive militarily organized resistance with extensive foreign sponsorship. Whatever reason things are "going wrong" in Iraq has little to do with ability, and by and large can only be the subject of speculation regarding ulterior motives for maintaining an occupying force there.
Garden Plot, by the way, was activated on 9/11 as Operation Noble Eagle, and remains active to this day, with no known plans to halt it.
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» RE: Halliburton's death camps for Democrats
Posted by: codingguy
» RE: Halliburton's death camps for Democrats
Posted by: wli
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Posted by: Ellen Remore on Mar 28, 2006 12:05 PM
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Posted by: ggeddis on Mar 28, 2006 2:11 PM
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Posted by: KPelley on Apr 2, 2006 12:04 PM
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Posted by: Jan Frel on Apr 5, 2006 11:42 PM
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Posted by: ConnecttheDots on Apr 6, 2006 4:43 PM
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Posted by: Roverton on Apr 7, 2006 10:27 AM
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O Henry in Hell.
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Posted by: kwaynek on Dec 2, 2006 1:01 PM
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