COMMENTS: 89
The End of Democracy in Ohio?
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House Bill 3 has already passed the Ohio House of Representatives and is about to be approved by the Republican-dominated Senate, probably before the holiday recess. Republicans dominate the Ohio legislature thanks to a heavily gerrymandered crazy quilt of rigged districts, and to a moribund Ohio Democratic party. The GOP-drafted HB3 is designed to all but obliterate any possible future Democratic revival. Opposition from the Ohio Democratic Party, where it exists at all, is diffuse and ineffectual.
HB3's most publicized provision will require positive identification before casting a vote. But it also opens voter registration activists to partisan prosecution, exempts electronic voting machines from public scrutiny, quintuples the cost of citizen-requested statewide recounts and makes it illegal to challenge a presidential vote count or, indeed, any federal election result in Ohio. When added to the recently passed HB1, which allows campaign financing to be dominated by the wealthy and by corporations, and along with a Rovian wish list of GOP attacks on the ballot box, democracy in Ohio could be all but over.
The GOP is ramming similar bills through state legislatures around the U.S., starting with Georgia and Indiana. The ID requirements in particular have provoked widespread opposition from newspapers such as the New York Times. The Times, among others, argues that the ID requirements and the costs associated with them, constitute an unconstitutional discriminatory poll tax.
But despite significant court challenges, the Republicans are forcing changes in long-standing election laws that have allowed citizens to vote based on their signature alone. Across the U.S., GOP Jim Crow laws will eliminate millions of Democratic voters from the registration rolls. In swing states like Ohio, such ballots are almost certain to be crucial.
The proposed Ohio law will demand a valid photo ID or a utility bill, a bank statement, a paycheck or a government document with a current address. Thousands of Ohio citizens who are elderly, homeless, unemployed or who do not drive will be effectively disenfranchised. Many citizens, for example, rent apartments where the utilities are paid by landlords. In such cases, the number of people living in utilities-included apartment rentals could actually determine an election.
During the 2004 presidential election, Ohio's Republican Secretary of State, J. Kenneth Blackwell, also issued statewide threats against ex-felons and people whose names resembled those of ex-felons. Thousands of such threats were delivered to registered voters who were never convicted of anything, or who were eligible to vote after being released from prison. In 2004 a "Mighty Texas Strike Force" came to Columbus with a specific mandate to threaten ex-felons with arrest if they dared to vote.
It is legal for ex-felons in Ohio to vote, even if they are in half-way houses or on parole. But HB3's identification requirement, combined with the confusion Blackwell has introduced into the process, will intimidate such Ohioans from voting in 2006 and beyond.
HB3 will also reduce voter rolls by ordering county boards of elections to send cards to registered voters every two years. If a card comes back as undelivered, the voter must rely on a provisional ballot. But tens of thousands of provisional ballots were arbitrarily discarded in 2004, and some 16,000 are known to remain uncounted to this day.
HB3 also imposes severe restrictions on voter registration drives. It allows the state attorney-general and local prosecutors wide powers to prosecute vaguely defined charges of fraud against those working to sign up voters. The restrictions are clearly meant to chill the kind of Democratic registration drives that brought hundreds of thousands of new voters to the polls in 2004 (even though many were turned away in Democratic wards due to a lack of voting machines).
Those electronic machines will also be exempted from recounts by random sampling, even in close, disputed elections like those of 2000 and 2004.
In 2004, scores of Ohio voters reported, under oath, that they had pressed John Kerry's name on touchscreen machines, only to see George W. Bush's name light up. A board of elections technician in Mahoning County (Youngstown) has admitted that at least 18 machines there suffered such problems. Sworn testimony in Columbus indicates that votes for Kerry faded off the screen on touchscreen machines there. Other charges of mis-programming, re-programming, recalibrating, mishandling and manipulation of electronic voting software, hardware and memory cards have since arisen throughout Ohio 2004.
For the 2005 election, some 41 additional Ohio counties (of 88) were switched to Diebold touchscreen machines. Despite polls showing overwhelming voter approval, two electoral reform issues went down improbable defeat. Issue Two, meant to make voting easier, and Issue Three, on campaign finance reform, were shown by highly reliable Columbus Dispatch polls to be passing handily.
The Dispatch was within 0.5% on Issue One, a bond issue, and has rarely been significantly wrong in its many decades of Ohio polling. Even opponents of Issues Two and Three conceded that they were highly likely to pass.
On the Sunday before the Tuesday 2005 election, the Dispatch predicted Issue Two would pass by a vote of 59% to 33%, with about 8% undecided. But Tuesday's official vote count showed Issue Two failing with just 36.5% in favor and 63.5% opposed. For that to have happened, the Dispatch had to have been wrong on Issue Two's support by more than 20 points. Nearly half those who said they would support Issue Two would have had to vote against it, along with all the undecideds.
The numbers on Issue Three are equally startling. The Dispatch showed it winning with 61%, to just 25% opposed and some 14% undecided. Instead just 33% of the votes were counted in its favor, with 67% opposed, an almost inconceivable weekend turnaround.
No other numbers were comparable on November 8, 2005, or elsewhere in the recent history of Dispatch polling. The startling outcome has thus raised even more suspicion and doubt about the use of electronic voting and tabulating machines in Ohio, which account for virtually 100% of the state's vote count.
The federal General Accountability Office (GAO) has recently issued a major report confirming that tampering with and manipulating such machines can be easily done by a very small number of people. Charges are widespread that this is precisely what gave George W. Bush Ohio's electoral votes, and thus the presidency, in 2004, not to mention the suspicious referenda outcomes in 2005.
HB3 will make it virtually impossible for any challenge to be mounted involving any votes cast or counted on electronic machines or tabulators -- meaning virtually every vote cast in Ohio.
Indeed, HB3 will raise the cost of mounting a recount from $10 per precinct to $50 per precinct. In 2004, Secretary of State Blackwell forced citizen groups to raise private funds for a recount, which he proceeded to sabotage. The process, which became a futile electronic charade, cost donors committed to democracy more than $100,000. Three partial, meaningless faux recounts resulted. To date more than 100,000 votes cast in Ohio remain uncounted, including some 93,000 easily-read machine-rejected ballots. .
During the 2004 election process Blackwell, manipulated the number of precincts in Ohio, and issued inaccurate information about their location and boundaries, making a meaningful precise number hard to come by. But with more than 10,000 precincts still in existence, HB3 would make funding an attempt at another recount in 2006 or 2008 cost more than $500,000.
Such an effort might also result in official retaliation. In 2004, Blackwell and Ohio Attorney-General Jim Petro -- both of whom are now Republican candidates for governor -- tried to impose stiff financial sanctions against attorneys who filed a legal challenge to the seating of the Ohio electors who gave George W. Bush the presidency. The Ohio Supreme Court disallowed the sanctions after the challenge was withdrawn. But HB3 would make such a federal election challenge illegal altogether.
With the electoral process in Ohio all but disemboweled, those hoping for a change of party in upcoming state and national elections are probably kidding themselves.
The 2004 election in the Buckeye state was riddled with deception, fraud, intimidation, manipulation and outright theft, all of which were essential to the triumph of George W. Bush. In 2005, four electoral reform ballot initiatives were allegedly defeated despite huge poll margins showing the almost certain passage of two of them. The most credible explanation for their defeat lies in electronic manipulation of voting machines, tabulators and memory cards which the GAO confirms have no credible security safeguards.
With campaign finance, voter registration, electronic voting, public recounts, district gerrymandering and overall electoral administration now firmly in the pocket of the GOP, and with Democratic opposition that is virtually non-existent on the issue of vote fraud and election manipulation, there is little reason to believe the Republican grip on Ohio will be loosened at any point in the near future.
In traditional terms, the scandal-ridden Ohio GOP would appear to be more vulnerable than ever. Governor Robert Taft has become the only Ohio governor to be convicted of a crime while in office. With an astonishing 7% approval rating, he has been compared to Homer Simpson by the state's leading Republican newspaper. Republican US Senator Mike DeWine appears highly vulnerable. The GOP has never won the White House without winning the Buckeye State.
But HB3 will solidify the GOP's iron grip on the electronic voting process and all that surrounds it. Unless they break that grip, Democrats who believe they can carry any part of Ohio in 2006 or 2008 are kidding themselves.
When it comes to 2008, can you say "Jeb Bush"?
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Posted by: ShaSpirit on Dec 12, 2005 12:57 AM
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» RE: I wish this article was not so clear cut and well written
Posted by: douglashoyt
» RE: yes, smashing diebolt would feel so great any where in usa
Posted by: ShaSpirit
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Posted by: zmesberg on Dec 12, 2005 2:32 AM
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In states where the cards are not available free of charge to those who can not pay I would challenge that laws such as the proposed one are unfair because no one should be denied the vote for lack of money. Realistically though, at least 99% of Americans can afford to lay $5.00-$15.00 dollars on the line every few years. Even at federal minimum wage that is a maximum of only three hours of work. Thus, even though the law is perhaps unfair it is not a real barrier to nearly anyone who wants to vote.
What I'm trying to point out is that this article has some really important things to say but by exaggerating one of its claims it loses some of it's credibility. The Bush administration and the Republican Party are often criticized for lying or stretching the truth, and rightfully so. By the same token, counter-arguments against deceitful Republican legislation need to be carefully thought out and truthfully presented. If what is being said is true, the truth alone will speak for itself.
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» RE: A lessening of credibility because of exaggeration
Posted by: bgroat
» RE: exactly the arguments justifying Jim Crow
Posted by: citizenjoe
» RE: A lessening of credibility because of exaggeration
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» RE: A lessening of credibility because of exaggeration
Posted by: astockton
» RE: A lessening of credibility because of exaggeration
Posted by: gigospam
» RE: A lessening of credibility because of exaggeration
Posted by: gar
» RE: A lessening of credibility because of exaggeration
Posted by: Gma1
» RE: A lessening of credibility because of exaggeration
Posted by: Basenjis
» RE: A lessening of credibility because of exaggeration
Posted by: A. James
» RE: contact MoveOn.org
Posted by: ShaSpirit
» RE: The GOP is Scared of Minorities!!
Posted by: fullavit@hotmail.com
» RE: The GOP is Scared of Minorities!!
Posted by: billfaster
» Well Put!
Posted by: citizenjoe
» Fullavit: well put!
Posted by: citizenjoe
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Posted by: WhatNow? on Dec 12, 2005 3:53 AM
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Posted by: citizenjoe on Dec 12, 2005 4:58 AM
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» hm
Posted by: benjamincanfly
» When you 'own' the courts, you own the Constitution.
Posted by: Sojourner
» RE: One-Party model: Mexico's PRI
Posted by: ScottP
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Posted by: maxpayne on Dec 12, 2005 5:16 AM
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» RE: It ain't just happening in OH and FL
Posted by: crusty
» RE: It ain't just happening in OH and FL
Posted by: maxpayne
» RE: It ain't just happening in OH and FL
Posted by: redcat
» RE: Georgia and Nebraska are also lost
Posted by: ScottP
» RE: Georgia and Nebraska are also lost
Posted by: Lets all eat cake
» RE: Georgia and Nebraska are also lost
Posted by: maxpayne
» RE: Georgia and Nebraska are also lost
Posted by: maxpayne
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Posted by: maxpayne on Dec 12, 2005 5:22 AM
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Posted by: bookwoman on Dec 12, 2005 6:54 AM
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» RE: What good is that?
Posted by: harpy
» RE: The genes and the blood stream thins out
Posted by: Gma1
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Posted by: Lincoln fan on Dec 12, 2005 7:02 AM
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Posted by: gonzoskismet on Dec 12, 2005 7:37 AM
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Posted by: jeffrey7 on Dec 12, 2005 7:43 AM
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Are you sick of being taxed to pay back insurance companies for having to make good on their claims from 9/11? That's what they're doing. Are you sick of compound intrest rates that only make the rich richer and keep you form
getting out of debt faster? Are you sick of being one of the 80 million that will never get out of low income? Or one of the many who make $50,000+/yr,have a child,live in a big city,
and can't get the ends to meet,not because you're a bad with
money but because the cost of living goes up faster that your wages? Are you tired of being made sick just by breathing the Air that industry gets to poison us with by Govt assistance? Are you sick of hearing about your friends and nieghbors hang 'Gold Stars' for the dead children in uniform for the Corpie War for Oil? Are you ready to change this outdated system of oppression? I am.
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» RE: Join the P.O.T. Party !!!!
Posted by: gonzoskismet
» RE: Join the P.O.T. Party !!!!
Posted by: BuckFush
» RE: Join the P.O.T. Party !!!!
Posted by: Lets all eat cake
» RE: Join the P.O.T. Party !!!! We're Ready
Posted by: jeffrey7
» RE: Join the P.O.T. Party !!!! We're Ready
Posted by: fullavit@hotmail.com
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Posted by: Farragher on Dec 12, 2005 8:07 AM
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» Are you saying this is fascism?
Posted by: citizenjoe
» RE: Are you saying this is fascism?
Posted by: t.harris
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Posted by: liberalibrarian on Dec 12, 2005 9:10 AM
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» RE: two party system
Posted by: A. James
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Posted by: AlanSmithee on Dec 12, 2005 10:14 AM
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Vote Green, vote libertarian, vote anything but Republicrat. It's far too late to rely on a pair of utterly corrupt all-but-identical parties.
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» RE: Thank yourself for this mess
Posted by: harpy
» Before you throw stones, make sure your not in a glass house.
Posted by: RevRick
» RE: Thank yourself for this mess
Posted by: AlanSmithee
» RE: Vote dem - vote for fraud
Posted by: Basenjis
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Posted by: harpy on Dec 12, 2005 11:06 AM
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» RE: ID cards not that easy to aquire
Posted by: Basenjis
» RE: ID cards not that easy to aquire
Posted by: gar
» RE: ID cards not that easy to aquire
Posted by: Jackson
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Posted by: fullavit@hotmail.com on Dec 12, 2005 11:14 AM
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Why did not one senator stand up in 2000??! Why did the mainstream press just gloss over the case?! I don't think enough people (Make that Sheople) give a rat's ass! I don't think enough people can see over their Starbucks large latte and over their daily slice of the corporate press!
Is it a crime to give a fuck! (Yea, I said fuck! Ban me!! AGAIN!!)
Are we so jaded by the corporate dream that we can't see that they are stealing the country while we sit in our Calgon bubble baths and send our kids to McDonald's for another of those burgers with a half-life of 3000 years! Have we become so lazy that we can't pull ourselves away from Fox News long enough to log on to Alternet and get the REAL story!!
We need a new Democratic party! I'm sick of this shit!!! How can you call yourselve a viable alternative to the neocons when all you do is sit on your ass and count your money while they hijack the whole country!!! Where is a Martin Luther King!! Where is a Medgar Evers!! An Abby Hoffman! A Hunter S. Thompson! A Malcom X! Where are the people who can grow a set of balls on that donkey!!
I'm ready to die for this country!! I took one step forward on a cloudy day in Atlanta Georgia and swore too defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies foriegn and domestic! I never recended that vow!
The GOP has turned into a bloated festering boil on the ass of the world!!! There's only one way to deal with it and that is to bust it open and clean it out! If Dean or Hillary can't get the job done then find someone that can!! There's got to be somebody in that party that has a set of balls!
In closing, let me say this! I WILL NOT stand idely by while the Repugs steal another election! They can bust me, beat me, lock me up for ever! FUCK 'EM! I may be the only one out there BUT I WILL BE THERE!!!!! Alternet can ban me of this site again! It don't matter! If speaking my mind and standing up for the rights of all Americans gets me banned, then maybee I'm on the wrong site anyway!
Check out" http://cyclone696.blogspot.com." Cyclone's got the balls to spell it ALL out for you!
Stoney13
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» RE: AND THIS IS FREEDOM??!!!!!!!
Posted by: gar
» RE: AND THIS IS FREEDOM??!!!!!!! Thanks!
Posted by: fullavit@hotmail.com
» RE: AND THIS IS FREEDOM??!!!!!!!
Posted by: rockpicker
» RE: AND THIS IS FREEDOM??!!!!!!! It would be my honor!
Posted by: fullavit@hotmail.com
» RIGHT ON!!!! MAN!!!!!!!
Posted by: WhatNow?
» RE: IGHT ON!!!! MAN!!!!!!! Thanks!! I will!!!
Posted by: fullavit@hotmail.com
» RE: AND THIS IS FREEDOM??!!!!!!!
Posted by: JoanB
» Alright people!! Read the post above! This sister has her shit together!!!
Posted by: fullavit@hotmail.com
» RE: AND THIS IS FREEDOM??!!!!!!!
Posted by: drdanj
» This is not freedom
Posted by: tkwilson
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Posted by: zmesberg on Dec 12, 2005 12:53 PM
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Posted by: drmiller on Dec 12, 2005 1:30 PM
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In California we have had to present a valid ID before voting for many years. While some parts of the described law sound very harsh, this does not it seems to me.
Granted, in California we have the similar but politically opposite effect in that Republicans are nearly unelectable to statewide offices. Govenor Schwartzenneger will be, I think, a one term exception.
Other parts might not pass Constitutional muster, like making recounts of Federal elections illegal?
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» RE: Over reaction...
Posted by: venus924
» RE: Over reaction...
Posted by: Gma1
» RE: Over reaction...
Posted by: Gma1
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Posted by: tanstaafl28 on Dec 12, 2005 3:42 PM
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Posted by: gltirebiter on Dec 12, 2005 3:57 PM
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is every eligible voter allowed to vote and, more importantly, is the vote accurately recorded and counted?
i believe that we are losing the bedrock of democracy, an accurate count of valid votes and, thereby, the voice of the people.
what is it going to take until the citizens of this country realize that fraud and corruption are silencing their voices? or, even more sinister, do they tacitly approve of this chicanery??
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Posted by: JSquercia on Dec 12, 2005 4:44 PM
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Black Box Voting pointed out that there are more stringent requirements for Elelectronic Slot Machines in Vegas than theere are for Elecrtonic Voting Machines . There is no such thing as Proprietary Code for slot machines . The code MUST be made available to the Gaming Commission and yet here we have our votes counted by programs whosee code in not available for review . This is an absolute disgrace .
Canada votes entirely on paper and we should too . the problem si still who counts the votes . to see the incompetance and corruption of the Taft Adminstration should be reason enough to vote the Republicans out of office .
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» RE: xit Polls
Posted by: crusty
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Posted by: WhatNow? on Dec 12, 2005 5:15 PM
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If anybody knows where I found Kroeger's essay on the internet please let me know the address. I have looked for that essay for months but can not remember where I found it.
Thanks.
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Posted by: john henry on Dec 12, 2005 5:17 PM
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Posted by: apratt6436 on Dec 13, 2005 12:11 AM
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God bless
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Posted by: drdanj on Dec 13, 2005 7:59 AM
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As good as this analysis is, it reduces its conclusions to squabbles between the two parties in power. Rather than going all the way, and pointing out that the people involved are traitors to the Constitution, to human rights, to social justice, to the United States, the authors cower in their corner, afraid to confront the deep truth and wind up this discussion with the non-problem that Democrats won't get Ohio.
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Posted by: kenhymes on Dec 13, 2005 10:17 AM
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However: progressives have for many decades put way too much faith in the efficacy of the representative system to change society, and neglected the building of local alternative structures, such as co-ops, worker-owned businesses, legal advocacy groups.
Society doesn't change much through national elections. In fact, despite the GOP's stranglehold on Washington, they have made negative progress in changing the thinking of Americans on long-standing policy issues.
Americans still largely favor national health insurance, gay rights, women's right to an abortion, and largely oppose unchecked corporate power, unnecessary wars, and exclusionary and discriminatory practices by government and companies.
Progressives need to tap into this where they live, not wait for a party structure to emerge that suits their policy goals. Ain;t gonna happen, and wouldn't work if it did.
Peace
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Posted by: stlaura on Dec 13, 2005 2:24 PM
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» RE: UN election observers?
Posted by: billfaster
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Posted by: idgit on Dec 14, 2005 6:03 PM
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Mmm...I know...how's this for subtle and realistic? Game the system to sum the votes as 65 against/35 for, the inverse of "respected" polls which showed them 35 against/ 65 for mere days before the voting.
Yeah. Right.
But, wait! Maybe that's what they want us to think, so we won't investigate it!
Yeah. Right.
Please, if you are going to invent new conspiracy theories, at least make them plausible.
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Posted by: tumal on Dec 14, 2005 8:13 PM
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Posted by: tbostic on Dec 15, 2005 9:15 AM
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» RE: T
Posted by: Puhleeze
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Posted by: TheStranger on Dec 18, 2005 9:34 PM
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Posted by: ShaSpirit on Dec 12, 2005 12:57 AM
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» RE: I wish this article was not so clear cut and well written
Posted by: douglashoyt
» RE: yes, smashing diebolt would feel so great any where in usa
Posted by: ShaSpirit
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Posted by: zmesberg on Dec 12, 2005 2:32 AM
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In states where the cards are not available free of charge to those who can not pay I would challenge that laws such as the proposed one are unfair because no one should be denied the vote for lack of money. Realistically though, at least 99% of Americans can afford to lay $5.00-$15.00 dollars on the line every few years. Even at federal minimum wage that is a maximum of only three hours of work. Thus, even though the law is perhaps unfair it is not a real barrier to nearly anyone who wants to vote.
What I'm trying to point out is that this article has some really important things to say but by exaggerating one of its claims it loses some of it's credibility. The Bush administration and the Republican Party are often criticized for lying or stretching the truth, and rightfully so. By the same token, counter-arguments against deceitful Republican legislation need to be carefully thought out and truthfully presented. If what is being said is true, the truth alone will speak for itself.
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» RE: A lessening of credibility because of exaggeration
Posted by: bgroat
» RE: exactly the arguments justifying Jim Crow
Posted by: citizenjoe
» RE: A lessening of credibility because of exaggeration
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» RE: A lessening of credibility because of exaggeration
Posted by: astockton
» RE: A lessening of credibility because of exaggeration
Posted by: gigospam
» RE: A lessening of credibility because of exaggeration
Posted by: gar
» RE: A lessening of credibility because of exaggeration
Posted by: Gma1
» RE: A lessening of credibility because of exaggeration
Posted by: Basenjis
» RE: A lessening of credibility because of exaggeration
Posted by: A. James
» RE: contact MoveOn.org
Posted by: ShaSpirit
» RE: The GOP is Scared of Minorities!!
Posted by: fullavit@hotmail.com
» RE: The GOP is Scared of Minorities!!
Posted by: billfaster
» Well Put!
Posted by: citizenjoe
» Fullavit: well put!
Posted by: citizenjoe
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Posted by: WhatNow? on Dec 12, 2005 3:53 AM
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Posted by: citizenjoe on Dec 12, 2005 4:58 AM
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» hm
Posted by: benjamincanfly
» When you 'own' the courts, you own the Constitution.
Posted by: Sojourner
» RE: One-Party model: Mexico's PRI
Posted by: ScottP
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Posted by: maxpayne on Dec 12, 2005 5:16 AM
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» RE: It ain't just happening in OH and FL
Posted by: crusty
» RE: It ain't just happening in OH and FL
Posted by: maxpayne
» RE: It ain't just happening in OH and FL
Posted by: redcat
» RE: Georgia and Nebraska are also lost
Posted by: ScottP
» RE: Georgia and Nebraska are also lost
Posted by: Lets all eat cake
» RE: Georgia and Nebraska are also lost
Posted by: maxpayne
» RE: Georgia and Nebraska are also lost
Posted by: maxpayne
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Posted by: maxpayne on Dec 12, 2005 5:22 AM
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Posted by: bookwoman on Dec 12, 2005 6:54 AM
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» RE: What good is that?
Posted by: harpy
» RE: The genes and the blood stream thins out
Posted by: Gma1
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Posted by: Lincoln fan on Dec 12, 2005 7:02 AM
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Posted by: gonzoskismet on Dec 12, 2005 7:37 AM
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Posted by: jeffrey7 on Dec 12, 2005 7:43 AM
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Are you sick of being taxed to pay back insurance companies for having to make good on their claims from 9/11? That's what they're doing. Are you sick of compound intrest rates that only make the rich richer and keep you form
getting out of debt faster? Are you sick of being one of the 80 million that will never get out of low income? Or one of the many who make $50,000+/yr,have a child,live in a big city,
and can't get the ends to meet,not because you're a bad with
money but because the cost of living goes up faster that your wages? Are you tired of being made sick just by breathing the Air that industry gets to poison us with by Govt assistance? Are you sick of hearing about your friends and nieghbors hang 'Gold Stars' for the dead children in uniform for the Corpie War for Oil? Are you ready to change this outdated system of oppression? I am.
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» RE: Join the P.O.T. Party !!!!
Posted by: gonzoskismet
» RE: Join the P.O.T. Party !!!!
Posted by: BuckFush
» RE: Join the P.O.T. Party !!!!
Posted by: Lets all eat cake
» RE: Join the P.O.T. Party !!!! We're Ready
Posted by: jeffrey7
» RE: Join the P.O.T. Party !!!! We're Ready
Posted by: fullavit@hotmail.com
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Posted by: Farragher on Dec 12, 2005 8:07 AM
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» Are you saying this is fascism?
Posted by: citizenjoe
» RE: Are you saying this is fascism?
Posted by: t.harris
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Posted by: liberalibrarian on Dec 12, 2005 9:10 AM
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» RE: two party system
Posted by: A. James
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Posted by: AlanSmithee on Dec 12, 2005 10:14 AM
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Vote Green, vote libertarian, vote anything but Republicrat. It's far too late to rely on a pair of utterly corrupt all-but-identical parties.
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» RE: Thank yourself for this mess
Posted by: harpy
» Before you throw stones, make sure your not in a glass house.
Posted by: RevRick
» RE: Thank yourself for this mess
Posted by: AlanSmithee
» RE: Vote dem - vote for fraud
Posted by: Basenjis
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Posted by: harpy on Dec 12, 2005 11:06 AM
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» RE: ID cards not that easy to aquire
Posted by: Basenjis
» RE: ID cards not that easy to aquire
Posted by: gar
» RE: ID cards not that easy to aquire
Posted by: Jackson
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Posted by: fullavit@hotmail.com on Dec 12, 2005 11:14 AM
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Why did not one senator stand up in 2000??! Why did the mainstream press just gloss over the case?! I don't think enough people (Make that Sheople) give a rat's ass! I don't think enough people can see over their Starbucks large latte and over their daily slice of the corporate press!
Is it a crime to give a fuck! (Yea, I said fuck! Ban me!! AGAIN!!)
Are we so jaded by the corporate dream that we can't see that they are stealing the country while we sit in our Calgon bubble baths and send our kids to McDonald's for another of those burgers with a half-life of 3000 years! Have we become so lazy that we can't pull ourselves away from Fox News long enough to log on to Alternet and get the REAL story!!
We need a new Democratic party! I'm sick of this shit!!! How can you call yourselve a viable alternative to the neocons when all you do is sit on your ass and count your money while they hijack the whole country!!! Where is a Martin Luther King!! Where is a Medgar Evers!! An Abby Hoffman! A Hunter S. Thompson! A Malcom X! Where are the people who can grow a set of balls on that donkey!!
I'm ready to die for this country!! I took one step forward on a cloudy day in Atlanta Georgia and swore too defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies foriegn and domestic! I never recended that vow!
The GOP has turned into a bloated festering boil on the ass of the world!!! There's only one way to deal with it and that is to bust it open and clean it out! If Dean or Hillary can't get the job done then find someone that can!! There's got to be somebody in that party that has a set of balls!
In closing, let me say this! I WILL NOT stand idely by while the Repugs steal another election! They can bust me, beat me, lock me up for ever! FUCK 'EM! I may be the only one out there BUT I WILL BE THERE!!!!! Alternet can ban me of this site again! It don't matter! If speaking my mind and standing up for the rights of all Americans gets me banned, then maybee I'm on the wrong site anyway!
Check out" http://cyclone696.blogspot.com." Cyclone's got the balls to spell it ALL out for you!
Stoney13
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» RE: AND THIS IS FREEDOM??!!!!!!!
Posted by: gar
» RE: AND THIS IS FREEDOM??!!!!!!! Thanks!
Posted by: fullavit@hotmail.com
» RE: AND THIS IS FREEDOM??!!!!!!!
Posted by: rockpicker
» RE: AND THIS IS FREEDOM??!!!!!!! It would be my honor!
Posted by: fullavit@hotmail.com
» RIGHT ON!!!! MAN!!!!!!!
Posted by: WhatNow?
» RE: IGHT ON!!!! MAN!!!!!!! Thanks!! I will!!!
Posted by: fullavit@hotmail.com
» RE: AND THIS IS FREEDOM??!!!!!!!
Posted by: JoanB
» Alright people!! Read the post above! This sister has her shit together!!!
Posted by: fullavit@hotmail.com
» RE: AND THIS IS FREEDOM??!!!!!!!
Posted by: drdanj
» This is not freedom
Posted by: tkwilson
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Posted by: zmesberg on Dec 12, 2005 12:53 PM
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Posted by: drmiller on Dec 12, 2005 1:30 PM
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In California we have had to present a valid ID before voting for many years. While some parts of the described law sound very harsh, this does not it seems to me.
Granted, in California we have the similar but politically opposite effect in that Republicans are nearly unelectable to statewide offices. Govenor Schwartzenneger will be, I think, a one term exception.
Other parts might not pass Constitutional muster, like making recounts of Federal elections illegal?
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» RE: Over reaction...
Posted by: venus924
» RE: Over reaction...
Posted by: Gma1
» RE: Over reaction...
Posted by: Gma1
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Posted by: tanstaafl28 on Dec 12, 2005 3:42 PM
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Posted by: gltirebiter on Dec 12, 2005 3:57 PM
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is every eligible voter allowed to vote and, more importantly, is the vote accurately recorded and counted?
i believe that we are losing the bedrock of democracy, an accurate count of valid votes and, thereby, the voice of the people.
what is it going to take until the citizens of this country realize that fraud and corruption are silencing their voices? or, even more sinister, do they tacitly approve of this chicanery??
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Posted by: JSquercia on Dec 12, 2005 4:44 PM
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Black Box Voting pointed out that there are more stringent requirements for Elelectronic Slot Machines in Vegas than theere are for Elecrtonic Voting Machines . There is no such thing as Proprietary Code for slot machines . The code MUST be made available to the Gaming Commission and yet here we have our votes counted by programs whosee code in not available for review . This is an absolute disgrace .
Canada votes entirely on paper and we should too . the problem si still who counts the votes . to see the incompetance and corruption of the Taft Adminstration should be reason enough to vote the Republicans out of office .
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» RE: xit Polls
Posted by: crusty
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Posted by: WhatNow? on Dec 12, 2005 5:15 PM
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If anybody knows where I found Kroeger's essay on the internet please let me know the address. I have looked for that essay for months but can not remember where I found it.
Thanks.
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Posted by: john henry on Dec 12, 2005 5:17 PM
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Posted by: apratt6436 on Dec 13, 2005 12:11 AM
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God bless
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Posted by: drdanj on Dec 13, 2005 7:59 AM
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As good as this analysis is, it reduces its conclusions to squabbles between the two parties in power. Rather than going all the way, and pointing out that the people involved are traitors to the Constitution, to human rights, to social justice, to the United States, the authors cower in their corner, afraid to confront the deep truth and wind up this discussion with the non-problem that Democrats won't get Ohio.
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Posted by: kenhymes on Dec 13, 2005 10:17 AM
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However: progressives have for many decades put way too much faith in the efficacy of the representative system to change society, and neglected the building of local alternative structures, such as co-ops, worker-owned businesses, legal advocacy groups.
Society doesn't change much through national elections. In fact, despite the GOP's stranglehold on Washington, they have made negative progress in changing the thinking of Americans on long-standing policy issues.
Americans still largely favor national health insurance, gay rights, women's right to an abortion, and largely oppose unchecked corporate power, unnecessary wars, and exclusionary and discriminatory practices by government and companies.
Progressives need to tap into this where they live, not wait for a party structure to emerge that suits their policy goals. Ain;t gonna happen, and wouldn't work if it did.
Peace
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Posted by: stlaura on Dec 13, 2005 2:24 PM
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» RE: UN election observers?
Posted by: billfaster
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Posted by: idgit on Dec 14, 2005 6:03 PM
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Mmm...I know...how's this for subtle and realistic? Game the system to sum the votes as 65 against/35 for, the inverse of "respected" polls which showed them 35 against/ 65 for mere days before the voting.
Yeah. Right.
But, wait! Maybe that's what they want us to think, so we won't investigate it!
Yeah. Right.
Please, if you are going to invent new conspiracy theories, at least make them plausible.
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Posted by: tumal on Dec 14, 2005 8:13 PM
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Posted by: tbostic on Dec 15, 2005 9:15 AM
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» RE: T
Posted by: Puhleeze
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Posted by: TheStranger on Dec 18, 2005 9:34 PM
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