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Racism Is the Prime Cause for Debunked Obama Birth Certificate Conspiracy Theory

The "birther" conspiracy has been utterly debunked, yet more GOP establishment figures have embraced the transparently racist cause.
July 28, 2009  |  
 
 
 
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By now, everyone has heard of the "birthers," that rabid crop of self-appointed patriots who insist that Barack Hussein Obama is not a legitimate president because he is not really an American citizen.

What was once a nasty little rumor in the early days of the presidential race has since evolved into a full-blown conspiracy theory whose proponents, though "viewed as irrelevant by the White House, and as embarrassing by much of the Republican Party," in the words of Politico's Ben Smith, nonetheless enjoy increasingly high-profile political support, and media coverage "9/11 truthers" could only dream of.

The birthers' conspiracy theory -- which holds that Obama was born in Kenya, despite all evidence to the contrary -- has long been debunked. The Obama camp released a copy of his birth certificate as early as June 2008, although that only seemed to fan the flames.

Yet, last week the "birthers" became big news again, after a video emerged showing Rep. Mike Castle, R-Del., confronted at a town hall meeting by a woman who angrily accused him of being complicit in the coverup of Obama's true origins. Castle, who is commonly labeled a "moderate Republican" -- and whose subsequent remark would earn him the label "RINO American Traitor" in some corners of the Internet -- seemed genuinely perplexed.

"Well I don't know what comment that invites," he said, to a chorus of boos. "If you're referring to the president, then he is a citizen of the United States."

The video of Castle's unfortunate run-in with the birthers hit YouTube and went viral. MSNBC put the clip on heavy rotation; "Hardball" host Chris Matthews devoted multiple segments to the topic; On CNN and on his radio show, sneering nativist Lou Dobbs fanned the flames with such remarks as, "What is the deal here? I'm starting to think we have … a document issue," and on Larry King, Dick Cheney's increasingly vocal daughter, Liz, shared her highly unempirical view that "one of the reasons you see people so concerned about this" is that "people are uncomfortable with having for the first time ever … a president who seems so reluctant to defend the nation overseas."

By midweek, Jon Stewart had lampooned the birthers and their media allies on Comedy Central's Daily Show, a move that, given his recent distinction as the new "most trusted man in news," might have spelled the death of the birthers.

Of course, it hasn't.

This week alone, Sen. Jim Inhofe, R-Okla., was quoted as saying they may "have a point," while the fourth-highest-ranking member of the House, Rep. Cathy McMorris Rodgers, R-Wash., said she'd "like to see the documents."

Meanwhile, an attempt by Hawaii Democrat Rep. Neil Abercrombie to pass a resolution to commemorate his state's 50th anniversary (while also proclaiming the state as President Obama’s birthplace) was temporarily blocked by Minnesota Republican Michele Bachmann on Monday, only to pass a few hours later.

By now it seems everyone has put in their two cents (and then some) about the birthers. But while most media coverage has treated them as incurable wackjobs pushing a conspiracy theory to be classified alongside the moon landing "hoax" (40 years old last week!) and the (considerably larger) group of Americans who believe 9/11 was an inside job, the "truth" of Obama's birth seems to fall into a slightly different category.

Like all conspiracy theories, it springs from the fertile soil of collective denial. Unlike all conspiracy theories, it thrives on a deep-rooted, racist belief: that a black man with a foreign name could never have won the presidency in the United States through anything other than trickery, deception or fraud.

"If Barack Obama was an Irish American or a Polish American or a German American, there would be no discussion anywhere in this country about his citizenship," radio host E. Steven Collins told Chris Matthews on Thursday, in response to his fellow guest, deranged right-winger and Nixon Watergate operative, G. Gordon Liddy, whose own attempt to defend the birthers should mark a low point, even for his career. "This is because many people in this nation cannot still accept the fact that a brilliant African American is the commander-in-chief."

Tim Wise, author of Between Barack and a Hard Place: Racism and White Denial in the Age of Obama, puts this in perspective: "When [Arnold] Schwarzenegger became governor, there were people who were saying, 'Hey we should amend the Constitution to allow people who are naturalized citizens to maybe run for president.'

"Although that didn't go anywhere -- and my guess is that the 'birthers' who are doing this crap with Obama probably wouldn't have been real keen on that idea -- notice that there was no groundswell of anger and opposition."

It's the Racism, Stupid!

Perhaps it is too obvious to say that the birthers' insistence on Obama's illegitimacy is based on racism. Even so, why isn't this collective racism at the heart of the "debate"?

"That's one of the problems with this so-called postracial era that we're in," says Wise. "White folks in particular -- and some folks of color -- are very quick to avoid that angle at all costs, lest they be accused of somehow being the ones who are somehow racist in some way or who are thinking in racial terms."

After all, Americans have seen what happens when people of color dare to suggest that the country is anything but perfect: they are ruthlessly attacked.

Take the rage over Michelle Obama's remark during the presidential campaign that "for the first time in my adult lifetime, I am really proud of my country," which was treated as unpatriotic hate speech. Or the controversy prompted by Eric Holder's remark that we are a "nation of cowards" when it comes to race.

Or, more recently, the ugly backlash against Obama's (considerably mild) remark that a judge should have a capacity for "empathy" and an understanding of "people's hopes and struggles."

"Usually that's a code word for an activist judge," Sen. Orrin Hatch, R-Utah, told George Stephanopoulos on ABC's This Week, a line that became a rallying cry against Supreme Court nominee Sonia Sotomayor. ("I will not vote for, and no senator should vote for, an individual nominated by any president who believes it is acceptable for a judge to allow their personal background, gender, prejudices or sympathies to sway their decision in favor of or against parties before the court," GOP Alabama Sen. Jeff Sessions proclaimed at the confirmation hearing.)

In the end, the obsessive harping over Sotomayor's "wise Latina" remark and right-wing accusations that she is a "reverse racist" because of her ruling in Ricci v. DeStefano (otherwise known as the Connecticut firefighters case) hijacked her confirmation hearing.

In fact, no sooner was the latest "birther" story gaining ground last week than we saw this same phenomenon on full display with a new controversy: The arrest of Harvard Professor Henry Louis Gates Jr.

In an unguarded moment, Obama dared to say what might have seemed pretty obvious to even the most superficially race-conscious: the Cambridge police, "acted stupidly" by handcuffing Gates in his own home, particularly given the "long history in this country of African Americans and Latinos being stopped by law enforcement disproportionately."

Obama's comment became national news; the networks seized on it, the blogosphere went wild, and by Friday afternoon, Obama had backtracked, issued a qualified apology, and invited the arresting officer, Sgt. Jim Crowley, to the White House for a beer.

"There's a bizarre tendency, every time a person of color criticizes white folks -- or just white racism -- to say 'that's racism,' " says Wise. "So, by that logic, the Rev. Jeremiah Wright is a racist, Barack Obama is a racist, Sonia Sotomayor is a racist. … Meanwhile, people like Pat Buchanan, who say Sonia Sotomayor is unqualified or that white people built the country and are basically entitled to 100 percent of everything -- they're not racist."

The attacks on Sotomayor, the hysteria over Obama's criticism of the Cambridge police, and the persistent rumors about Obama's origins seem symptomatic of something larger, something Wise believes is "the culmination of centuries of ingrained privilege and hegemonic control."

Even it you are not yourself in a position of power, "… if you've gotten used to seeing people who look like you in almost every position of authority," he says, "to then have to wake up every day and see a man of color basically running the country … is psychologically debilitating to white folks who all their lives weren't necessarily bigots or racists in any overt sense, but had simply gotten complacent with the way things were. They had internalized these notions of entitlement and superiority."

Given how deep such notions of entitlement and superiority can run, it’s hard to know to what degree the birthers are fully conscious of the racist impulses behind their crazy allegations -- or whether they are in such denial that they actually believe their own bullshit.

White Hegemony Challenged

To explain the devastating effect of Obama's presidency on those ordinary Americans who were quite happy with their white privilege, thank you, Wise quotes W.E.B. DuBois's concept of "the psychological wage of whiteness."

"A lot of white folks don't have much. They're struggling, they're hurting, but they've been able to content themselves with the idea that at least they're not black," Wise says. "So they get this psychological wage from their whiteness. The problem is, that's a wage which is diminishing in value. If you say to yourself, 'Well I may not have much, but at least I'm not black,' and then you look around and say, 'Shit, black is the new president!' -- now the value of your psychological wage is reduced in real dollar terms. Now you've got nothing."

In Wise's view: "The people who latch on to the birther stuff (working-class and struggling middle-class whites) aren't any more racist than elite white folks, but their way of expressing it is so much more raw and visceral, because: a) they may not have the filter that you get when you're elite (you sort of know when to check yourself), but also because they're the ones who feel the most threat."

Of course, white elites have their own fears over the erosion of white hegemony -- and not just televised bigots like Buchanan. For a real measure of the panic over their own supremacy, a prime example is the growing number of elected officials who are pandering to -- and emboldening -- the birthers, not just by paying them lip service, but actually introducing legislation based on their outlandish claims.

This past February, Rep. Bill Posey, R-Fla., introduced a bill that would require presidential candidates to provide a copy of his or her birth certificate. (Posey has been widely quoted as saying he "can't swear on a stack of Bibles whether [Obama's] a citizen or not.")

David Weigel recently wrote in the Washington Independent, "While Posey initially said that he disbelieved conspiracy theories about the president's birth, he told the host of an Internet radio show that he'd discussed the possibility of Obama being removed from office over 'the eligibility issue' with 'high-ranking members of our Judiciary Committee.' "

According to Weigel, who has covered the birthers extensively, "as of July 15, nine fellow Republican members of Congress were backing the bill."

"While Rep. Randy Neugebauer, R-Texas, has said that he supports the bill because he didn't know whether Obama was a citizen, other sponsors say that they weighed in to pour cold water on the conspiracy theories."

One such sponsor is Rep. John Campbell, a California Republican, who parroted this dubious claim in an interview with Chris Matthews on July 21.

"Wouldn't you like to put all this to rest?" Campbell asked. "That's what this proposal is about." ("Nice try," Matthews responded.)

Matthews: No, no. You are feeding the wacko wing of your party. Do you believe that Barack Obama is a legitimate native-born American or not?
Campbell: That is not what this bill is about, Chris.
Matthews: No, what do you believe?
CAMPBELL: As far as I know, yes, OK?
Matthews: As far as you know?
CAMPBELL: Yes.

Campbell and his ilk may be an embarrassment to more "respectable" and powerful members of the Republican party. But they have more in common than they would like to admit.

"It appears to me that the Republican party, because of the choices it has made -- going back 40 years or more -- on policy positions have guaranteed that they were destined to be, at the end of the day, the white nationalist party," says Wise.

When "your budget-cut philosophy is about cutting programs that are perceived as helping 'those people', your attacks on affirmative action are very clear, your attacks on busing are very clear, all your law-and-order stuff … when you sow those seeds for several decades, you ought not be surprised when a whole crop of people who have grown up with that -- that's what they're about now."

Take the new chairwoman of the Young Republicans -- a 38-year-old named Audra Shay. She recently came under fire when she was caught cosigning a racist Facebook post that read "Obama Bin Lauden [sic] is the new terrorist … Muslim is on there side [sic] … need to take this country back from all of these mad coons … and illegals."

Shay's reply: "You tell em Eric! lol."

From Barack the Magic Negro; to e-mails depicting watermelons in front of the White House, to, most recently, a conservative activist's circulation of an image of Obama as a witch doctor, incidents like these are as ubiquitous now as they were during the presidential campaign.

And the people yelling "terrorist" at Sarah Palin rallies or those informing John McCain that Obama is "an Arab" have not gone away. Mainstream Republicans who wish to look respectable may want to distance themselves from this "lunatic fringe," but as representatives of a party largely built on structural racism, this is a very real part of their base.

In order for the GOP to survive, says Wise, Republicans are going to have to somehow bring in more minorities -- a task that would require a fundamental revamping of the Republican identity and agenda -- or "they're gonna have to start making a lot of babies."

"I don't think the Republican party ever thought they could get a lot of black folks," Wise says. "But they thought they could get Latinos. And the reason they thought so was because of this ridiculous and fundamentally racist naivete that said, 'Well, Latinos are family-oriented so they'll be against abortion.' If you don't think white folks are that one-dimensional, how can you think Latinos are so one-dimensional? Well of course you can -- if you're a racist."

For a number of people, the Sotomayor confirmation hearings were a sign that the Republicans are no longer particularly set on attracting "the Latino vote," something that might make the Pat Buchanans in the party smile, but which will ultimately prove costly for the GOP as a whole. As the country's demographics evolve, the party that brought us the Willie Horton ads in the 1980s will have to evolve, too. And so will white Americans who continue to insist on blaming their problems on people of color.

"The birther stuff to me is part of the same narcissistic breakdown that is at the heart of every e-mail I get from a college kid or that college kid's parents who say, 'I couldn't get enough financial aid because they're giving all the scholarships to black people,'" says Wise. "This narcissism is especially evident when you watch such hateful right-wing media buffoons as Rush Limbaugh -- who supports the birthers -- and "who are just becoming totally unglued."

"On the one hand it's funny," says Wise. "On the other hand it's really frightening, because people, when they're in that sort of meltdown mode don't make good decisions and do really crazy things."

Take James W. Von Brunn, the white supremacist -- and a "birther" -- who shot and killed a guard at the U.S. Holocaust Museum in June.

It would be pushing it to see the birthers phenomenon as a a sign that white hegemony is nearing its last throes. However, "one really positive thing about Obama's presidency in regards to race" says Wise, is that "its created this nuttiness on the part of a lot white folks who have always been thinking this stuff but they just haven't been as bold with it."

"At some point, it will become increasingly difficult for those who like to deny racism as a problem to continue completely burying their heads."

"At some point, people will have to say, maybe black folks aren't the crazy ones. Maybe it's not the folks of color who have lost their minds. Maybe it's you."

Liliana Segura is an AlterNet staff writer and editor of Rights & Liberties and World Special Coverage. http://twitter.com/LilianaSegura
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Grand Old Charade
Posted by: bonapartist on Jul 28, 2009 1:25 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
GOP & Dems, Dems & GOP - two sides of the same coin. Barack Obama is a mouthpiece for US ruling oligarchy, like G.W. Bush was before him.

In case you haven't noticed Mr. "Yes, we can" continued Bush's policies, decided to sustain two wars, voted for G.W's initial bailout and made a bail-the-rich continuation of the same.

This charade keeps the peasants happy: blah-blah - GOP is smearing Obama's birth certificate! vs. blah-blah - Obama is killing American liberties! Grand show by GOP & Dems creates a façade of two-party system and an illusion that Americans actually have a choice. Thief versus Robber = Republican versus Democrat, best of all it is the same gang.

In case you haven't noticed whichever faction "wins" it will keep the other intact as they are both part of the same package and parcel. The people will waste time and energy battling these non issues (who the heck cares about the lying shithead's birth certificate?) instead of focusing on important questions. You know, like the reform of the political system, economic and social reform, introduction of multi-party system (god-forbid, it would break the current monopoly of power) etc.

Barack's birth certificate controversy - what a farce.

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Odd...
Posted by: uncertain on Jul 28, 2009 1:40 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
So, where's the birth certificate? The original (or State-sealed, certified copy of) the long-form birth certificate that every single U.S. citizen born on U.S. soil gets?

Where is it? Why hasn't it been released? Why aren't copies of it printed in every newspaper around the country? All anybody would have to do to end all this madness is show the damn piece of paper. That hasn't been done yet. Period.

"But blah blah blah," you're sure to reply in a typical smug manner so common to the anti-birthers.

Save your breath - just show me the piece of paper. That's all it'll take.

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» RE: Odd... Posted by: DEBKAMAINE
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» RE: Odd... Posted by: Jbuuty
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» TROLL ALERT!!!!!! LOL Posted by: Prophit
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» RE: Factcheck.org Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» Darn! You beat me to it. %^) Posted by: GuitarBill
» LOL! ROTFLMAO! Posted by: GuitarBill
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» RE: Odd... Posted by: blue3zero
» Fact Check Site: Is it creditable? Posted by: Captain Moroni
» So, OK.. Posted by: uncertain
» RE: So, OK.. Posted by: Captain Moroni
» RE: So, OK.. Posted by: slowbob4
» RE: So, OK.. Posted by: helenwheels
» RE: It has been shown Posted by: Ellie1
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» The burden of proof is on you... Posted by: christopher13b
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» It has been released, here it is Posted by: Defenestrator
» Birth Certificate Posted by: reelectnoone
» RE: Odd... Posted by: jaglover
» For the record, genius... Posted by: djnoll
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» Odder and odder! Posted by: luzmejor
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Why the 2nd Attack in one week, on Obama's Birth Certificate Controversy, Alternet?
Posted by: jpom22 on Jul 28, 2009 2:18 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Conspiracy Theory Goes Factual On Obama.
http://www.earthfrisk.com/blog/?p=142

(please see site for links in excerpt below - not clickable here without HTML formatting)

(excerpted)
FACT : The State of Hawaii issues REAL birth certificates to people born in other nations like Russia, Japan, China and Kenya. Link (with direct links to Hawaii’s online pages stating this , More info - Link , Link

FACT: Only the vault copy of an American citizen’s birth certificate will tell what nation you were born in if you have a real Hawaiian birth certificate Thousands of people born in South Africa, Australia and Indonesia have real authentic birth certificates that Snopes and Factcheck would say were real, all in the state of Hawaii. Isn’t Hawaii interesting?

FACT: The President of the United States has now spent hundreds of thousands of dollars to prevent you from seeing his vault copy. Hmmm. (5 links - see website)

FACT: Why this matters - there are 3 requirements to become President of the United States:
1. You must be 35 years of age
2. You must be a resident of the US for 14 years
3. You must be a natural born citizen of the United States.

The bottom line of this is if there is nothing to hide, why is Obama still hiding it and why does he and his legal team think that you and I have no right to question his qualifications?

Something to think hard about as lawsuit after lawsuit is filed, and yet Obama will not let us see his birth certificate.

FACT : The State of Hawaii NEVER said Obama was born in Hawaii. They only stated that they have seen the original Hawaii birth certificate and that it is real, just like the thousands of other REAL original birth certificates in Hawaii of people born in other nations. Like Obama’s sister who also has a REAL HAWAIIAN birth certificate, yet she was born in Indonesia! Are you thinking yet?

Here’s Hawaii’s press release after Obama went to Hawaii this past October. Notice how they will NEVER say he was actually born in Hawaii. From this release the media which is all too biased comes up with articles such as this and even better click here and see how the media just makes up a fact - Hawaii saying that Barack was born there. They did not. Read the first line. Notice also how they keep repeating they hold or have seen the original birth certificate. Strange how we can’t see it huh! Aren’t you curious? Don’t we have a right to know? This is still our country right?

Want to See A Real Hawaii Long Form Vault copy?
Born in China but has a “Certificate of Hawaiian Birth”. No less than the Father of Modern China, the great hero, Dr. Sun Yat-Sen!!!

The leader of Nationalist China also has a real authentic Hawaiian birth certificate yet he was born in China. See it and what a real birth certificate in Hawaii in early 1960s should look like. This is for those of you who still point to the forgery on Obama’s website and cited by Factcheck and Snopes as real. For God sakes people just look at the 2007 borders! Click here
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
for the record, neither i nor many others are drawing attention to this issue for racist motives. i've marched for civil rights in NYC since 1963, later in Miami and Reno, NV.

i began detecting obama's lies (esp. re: his allegiance to common working class america) since his presidential campaign: no intention of ending the bogus war on terror, bailed out billionaire bankers, voted for amnesty for the illegal telecom spying, STILL RESERVES AMERICA'S RIGHT TO TORTURE, insists on public health insurance instead of universal health care, against the wishes of 75% of american voters.

i voted for Cynthia McKinney, green party, a black woman with a black woman VP on the same ticket.

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» Uhh... Wrong grasshopper... Posted by: The Old Hippie
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» Prophit, huh? Posted by: Fencerider

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This is amazing.
Posted by: slydad on Jul 28, 2009 2:25 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If you look for racism that hard, you'll find it whether it's there or not. I'll bet the author of this article would find racism if I go to an ice cream shop and order a scoop of vanilla. This is a case of connecting arbitrary dots to support an accusation in an attempt to get the rhetoric of the day on this subject.

Well I suppose it worked because I addressing it here, but just as most of the country thinks that the 'birthers' are a bunch of kooks, I hope that most folks can see through this blatant attempt to get the "R" word applied to anyone who is not for Obama.

Let's see. Now I didn't vote for Obama and back some years ago, I also didn't support Jesse Jackson either. I guess I'm a racist too. Obviously the only reason I voted for Alan Keyes was to throw everyone off. I'm only claiming to like Clarence Thomas just to cover my racism.

Is this where we're at in this country? There is a racist under every rock it seems. People, I know that there is racism, but let's at least have something a little more concrete that this to make an actual accusation.

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» Most blacks are racists?? Posted by: Captain Moroni
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» RE: YOU are amazing-amazingly stupid. Posted by: Captain Moroni
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» Using the "T" word, eh? Posted by: slydad
» RE: Using the "T" word, eh? Posted by: Captain Moroni
» Thank you sister Posted by: slydad
» Captain Maroni.... Posted by: Fencerider
» RE: Captain Maroni.... Posted by: Captain Moroni
» RE: Captain Maroni.... Posted by: Wacre
» Maroni, instead of.... Posted by: Fencerider

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The classic stratagem of sore losers
Posted by: Perry Logan on Jul 28, 2009 2:26 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I guess if you can't win, you can pretend to get the other guy on a technicality. This is the classic stratagem of sore losers.


Holes in History

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» Improve his mind? Posted by: Ellie1
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» originalism is stupid Posted by: Tom Tele

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Do not co-mingle 'conspiracy' w/9/11
Posted by: weathered on Jul 28, 2009 2:37 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What should concern us is why some fear a thorough investigation?

A country that continues to Lie to itself, marginalizes itself.

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» Absolutely! Posted by: GuitarBill

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Captain Moroni
Posted by: Captain Moroni on Jul 28, 2009 3:00 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
For a progressive site who seeks to find truth, you have totally failed when it comes to the "birthers."

The issue is NOT whether Obama is a citizen??? It is highly likely that he is citizen but a Native Born citizen, not a natural born citizen. You see, IF you knew the Constitution and the laws passed in the mid 1790s to clarify the natural born issue, you would KNOW that:

1. Only a NATURAL Born citzen can be POTUS. You can be either a Native Citizen or naturalized citizen and run for IL Senator and any other public office.
2. The mid 1790s laws clarified the Constitution by saying that a natural born citizen has to have BOTH parents be citizens for 5 years. Obama's father was a Kenyan citizen, although his mother, 18 at the time of birth, was a USA citizen. Obama publicly has said many times that his father was Kenyan. Conclusion? Obama is a native citizen.

I could go on and on about issues of passports, Occidental College, etc. BUT I KNOW there won't be dispassionate and objective dialogue. I fully expect that I will be attacked as a racist rather than any objective "opening of eyes" to the FACTS behind the "birther's claims. Shoot away.

I doubt if the owners of AlterNet would ever allow me to make an article with the FACTS so those who wish to know the facts can contact me at captainmoroni2009@live.com. FYI, I doubt that I will be overwhelmed with emails.

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Yet another desperate attempt to conflate 9/11 truth with lame "conspiracy theories"
Posted by: LeftWright on Jul 28, 2009 3:11 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Truthers are not "birthers" no matter how much the msm tries to confuse the two, and this ongoing attempt to slow the progress of the 9/11 truth movement will fail.

Every day more and more people are seeing the obvious controlled demolition of WTC 7 and finding out the true facts regarding that tragic day. Every day more people are seeing the massive corruption destroying our country and are refusing to accept the lies and deceit that are used to perpetuate it.

Every day more people are realizing that we are the leaders we have been waiting for and are taking a stand.

We don't buy the lies anymore, Alternet, and the sooner you start reporting reality the better your chance of surviving the coming revolution.

The truth shall set us free. Love is the only way forward.

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» RE: ZERO: An Investigation into 9/11 Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» Screw "Zero". "Zero" DEBUNKED. Posted by: GuitarBill

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Resistance Is Futile...
Posted by: The Old Hippie on Jul 28, 2009 3:18 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
 
Even after our “most trusted newscaster” ripped them a new one,
the propagandists, the sociopathic collaborators, and their deranged,
and dangerously moronic followers keep harping on it like the Borg.

Such is the horrific comedy our times, (sigh...)
 

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Sorry, this comment has been removed from the system.
» Hey Prophit.... Posted by: Fencerider

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This Whole Birth Certificate Thing is Bullshit!!!
Posted by: shill on Jul 28, 2009 3:44 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Go to Snopes.com and enter "Obama's birth certificate." They will explain in detail why this is a bunch of hogwash perpetrated by people who just are unable to deal with the fact that a black man with the foreign sounding name of Barack Obama is President of the U.S.A. You may agree or disagree with his politics, but this birth certificate issue is pure grade Z bullshit. Yeah, racism exists in our country. DUH!!! It exists all over the world! Laws can prevent the government from giving it a big "thumbs up," but peoples' hearts cannot be changed by laws. I'm just glad I got to live to see a minority President elected in the U.S. After living through the 50's and 60's, I never thought it would happen, but here it is! I only hope he can do a decent job. So far, I'm not real sure. But then again, Bush is a hard act to follow. (Yeah.....RIGHT!!!!!!)

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» bigotry and racism Posted by: Tom Tele
» SNOPES IS BULLSHIT! Posted by: Sananda

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It isn't just Racism
Posted by: LeonBNJ on Jul 28, 2009 3:47 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The 'birthers' claims are not just about Racism, it is about power and control. A major part of the 'birthers' are unrepentent right-winger Republicans, who have lost control of the President, Senate and Congress to the Democrats. They are seeking any way to confuse, distract and make illegitment Pres. Obama's place in office so they can return to power by any means necessary.

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» RE: It isn't just Racism Posted by: Basenjis
» RE: It isn't just Racism Posted by: Sister_Lauren

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You're on your own
Posted by: John Annis on Jul 28, 2009 4:02 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I cannot think of one other first-world country that would be having this argument almost nine months after a leader was elected.

Can anyone seriously believe that during the two years or so of pre-election campaigning, during which time Obama raised over $750 million in backing, nobody would have gone over this matter with a fine-tooth comb?

It's racism, pure and simple. As someone mentioned before, when Bush was called out on his National Guard nonsense there was hell to pay; Dan Rather lost his job over it.

We were told that we had to give a wartime (Hah!) president due respect as C-in-C. Yet it's open season on Obama from day one.

I am not an Obama supporter; I am not even that interested in American domestic politics. But how do you expect the rest of the world to take you seriously when you spend so much time and energy maligning a man simply because of the colour of his skin?

You should be ashamed of yourselves.

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» RE: You're on your own Posted by: Tom Degan
» RE: You're on your own Posted by: Captain Moroni
» RE: You're on your own Posted by: Nederbelg
» RE: You're on your own Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» RE: You're on your own Posted by: Captain Moroni
» RE: You're on your own Posted by: Quannah
» RE: You're on your own Posted by: lively56
» RE: You're on your own Posted by: Malamute
» RE: You're on your own Posted by: andrushka
» RE: You're on your own Posted by: Nederbelg
» RE: You're on your own Posted by: slowbob4
» RE: You're on your own Posted by: John Annis
» RE: You're on your own Posted by: songbird1268

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IT's a plot, I terll you!
Posted by: Tom Degan on Jul 28, 2009 4:13 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Barack Hussein Obama was born on August 4, 1961 in the state of Hawaii. That was the week the Berlin Wall went up.

Coincidence? I wonder.

This evil, subversive plot has been in the making for damned near forty-eight years! By all evidence, since the moment of Obama's birth! Here is a question that all good and decent Americans should demand an immediate answer to: Was the newspaper, the Honolulu Advertiser, in on the scheme when they printed little Barack's bogus birth announcement on August 9, 1961? Just where the hell does that paper lean editorially? To the hard Left, I strongly suspect. Wouldn't that just figure!

The NAACP, in coercion with the American Communist Party, Democracy NOW and Ed Asner, concocted this evil plot deep in the basement of Norm Chomskey's home in Cambridge, Massachusetts in the midst of a week-long peyote mushroom binge. The elevation of this dangerous and subversive man to the highest office in this grand and glorious land of ours is only the first step in their dastardly plan. Their next objective will be to force our daughters - our little personifications of patriotism and purity - to court and co-mingle with NEGROES.

Before very long our children - your children - will be physically forced to memorize whole chapters of James Baldwin's "Native Son" and "The Autobiography Of Malcolm X". Trust me, it's only a matter of time.

They must be stopped. Now is the time for all good men to come to the aid of the country that we all hold so dear to our freedom-loving hearts. America is falling; victimized by forces who would put a foreign-born A-Rab in the seat that was once held by the sainted Ronald Reagan - RONALD REAGAN, I TELL YOU!

My friends, now is not the time for the faint-of-heart. It a time for boldness and stoutness of mind and spirit. Only our collective intestinal fortitude will defeat the Liberal cabal - those nattering nabobs of negativism - who would burn our beloved country down. The time has come to give America back to the real Americans. My fellow citizens, you ignore me at your own peril....

And one more thing we must never ever forget: Barack and Michelle Obama named their two daughters, "Sasha" and "Malia". What's that all about?

Of course, what you just read is meant as satire. Only a complete and utter fool could possibly take any of it seriously. The really disturbing thing, however, is the fact that there are millions of people out there who would read those last five paragraphs and wouldn't even come close to getting the joke. While there is plenty of satirical gold to be siphoned from the bottomless mine that these lunatics have provided us with, they have created a dangerous atmosphere that is enabling nuttiest angels of the American nature. That is something that would do us all well to think about.

Tom Degan
Goshen, NY
tomdegan@frontiernet.net

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» RE: IT's a plot, I terll you! Posted by: Captain Moroni
» RE: IT's a plot, I terll you! Posted by: clthompson
» RE: IT's a plot, I terll you! Posted by: helenwheels
» RE: IT's a plot, I terll you! Posted by: justbach
» Koo Koo, Posted by: Fencerider
» RE: IT's a plot, I tell you! Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» Native Son is Richard Wright Posted by: stormchilde1975
» RE: IT's a plot, I tell you... Posted by: beijaflor
» SATIRE Posted by: CAPSLOCK_AVENGER

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Orwell's "Hall of Truth", AlterNet & Zionist MSM
Posted by: whole2th on Jul 28, 2009 4:13 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Time for everyone to get a copy of 1984 in their hands and see that AlterNet and the mainstream media now function just as Orwell's "Hall of Truth" functioned.

Revisionism is rampant--and those who revise the truth to make enforced truth are increasingly desperate to hold to power.

The truth will set us free.

Those who speak the truth (nano-thermite, WTC7, Pentacon, Oklahoma City bombing inside job) are ridiculed here by the owners of AlterNet.

"Truth lives a wretched life, but it outlives a lie every time!"

"Have I now become your enemy for telling you the truth?" Gal 5:12

"Make the lie big, make it simple, keep saying it, and eventually they will believe it." -- Joseph Goebbels

"Hell is truth seen too late...duty neglected in its season."- Tryon Edwards

Give/loan copies of 1984 to those who've not yet learned about the "Hall of Truth".

He-brews up a batch of lies to cover crimes and misdeeds--like a brat child who won't confess.

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» Birds of a Feather Posted by: EncinoM

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Obama's Birth Certificate
Posted by: electron on Jul 28, 2009 4:19 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I have not seen one iota of proof that this guy was born here in the US of A. If they want to quell this birther thing, than all he has to do is provide the real certificate. The one from Hawaii is not the original and I have seen it written where the hospital claims he was not born there. For $20.00 you can get the original, so what the hell is the problem. I'll give him the 20 bucks to get it. I'm tired of hidden politics in this country. All the questions would go away if he just proved he was born in this country. NO ONE should have a problem with this question, after all "We the People" have a right to question everything.

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» Then you obviously can't read Posted by: terradea42
» RE: Then you obviously can't read Posted by: Captain Moroni
» RE: LOL! "By Israel Insider staff" Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» CIA Black Ops... Posted by: aussidawg
» RE: Obama's Birth Certificate Posted by: clthompson
» RE: Obama's Birth Certificate Posted by: helenwheels

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Al Falafool
Posted by: alfalafal on Jul 28, 2009 4:21 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Thank you! This is one of the most astute and insightful analyses I've ever read on the collective mindset that so much of "white America" buys into. I am a product of that mindset myself - though in no way do I ever feel compelled to propagate it.

It is not "white guilt" that I feel. I just do not understand why so many white people find it so hard to denounce racism except when they feel it affects "their own race" in some perverse idea of "reverse" racism.

What do any of US get out of that? How do whites ever feel like we all have anything in common other than our imaginary sense of superiority. Superiority owing to what? I don't get it.

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» It is not an issue of race Posted by: whole2th
» RE: Al Falafool Posted by: Captain Moroni
» CM.... Posted by: Fencerider
» RE: Al Falafool Posted by: aussidawg
» First of all.. Posted by: Fencerider

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This "birther" business is BS!
Posted by: Woodpecker on Jul 28, 2009 4:28 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Does anybody seriously think that the Democrats would nominate a presidential candidate whose US citizenship was in doubt?

Even if debunked, the GOP would find some other "red herring!"

Terry

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» RE: This "birther" business is BS! Posted by: Captain Moroni
» Are You Serious? Posted by: aussidawg
» RE: This "birther" business is BS! Posted by: Sister_Lauren

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Show Me the Cheney Indictments!
Posted by: Purple Girl on Jul 28, 2009 4:29 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
that's all they Got??
I'll See Their Birth cert and raise them an Indictment against Cheney!!!
No doubt most of these 'Birthers' are racist, fearful that if Obama is proven Legitimate (and competent), there will never be another White male in the WH.Oh Yea of lil' faith in your own gender & race. A textbook example of over compensation due to Low self esteem .
But what I think the Politico's find so appealing about perpetuating this hysteria is that it deflects away from the Volumes of High Crimes investigations and accusations against the Bush Admin, esp Cheney and the Repug party in general.
When it comes to determining Who's a patriot and who is not....Cheney is the one wearing the Red Coat, and his co conspirators are wearing the matching Red Ties.
so instead of repeatedly displaying the Official Obama Birth Cert- we should be handing these Birthers a copy of Kucinich's Articles of Impeachment against Bush & Cheney- and all the proceeding investigative pieces on his Assassination squad and his desire to release the military on US cities, and ...
While obsessing over IF Obama WILL present a danger to the US (since apparently ALL foreigners are out to destroy the US- even our ancestors??), the politicos are hoping no one will mention who HAS been a danger to (and already destroyed) the US.
What it comes down to is the Fact a Birth certificate does not dicatate a persons Patriotism- but his actions do. Cheney et al may have been 'natural born' but they have done everything in their powers (and above) to create the economic and military clusterfucks we now face.What is more poignant is the fact he exercised powers above his post and undermined the system of check and balances. Cheney IS an Treasonous Illegitmate Bastard!
Benedict Arnold was born here...so was Timothy McVeigh...And Charlie Manson (and His "Family")....But Our Lady Liberty was not, she's French/Italian to be exact. Who would you rather have representing US?
The Politicos are hoping the Racists add enough fuel to this that the evidence against Cheney, and themselves, will go up in smoke.

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» RE: Show Me the Cheney Indictments! Posted by: Captain Moroni
» RE: Show Me the Cheney Indictments! Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» woodys is an idiot Posted by: Godfrey

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Not Racism, Pure Stupidity
Posted by: terradea42 on Jul 28, 2009 4:49 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It doesn't take a genius to see that birthers are nothing more than morons with huge mouths. That includes those in Congress.

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» RE: Not Racism, Pure Stupidity Posted by: Captain Moroni

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Using the tired litany of "racism" and or "conspiracy" to cover up Government Lies & Fraud
Posted by: mtcloud on Jul 28, 2009 5:02 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Using the tired litany of "racism" and or "conspiracy" to cover up Government Lies & Fraud

Alternet and its allies in the corporate government media monopoly again using "conspiracy" and "racism" to blind you all to the real issues.

Do you really BELIEVE that the corporate government now in place does not routinely CREATE FALSE documents?

They did it multiple times, and still do it. Are you all that monumentally naive?

Do you all really trust your cherished corporate government now in place?

http://www.infowars.com/

The New York Times claims the Obama birth certificate issue is “a rumor that has been widely discredited,” and yet the state of Hawaii, where Obama was allegedly born, refuses to release the primary birth certificate document, instead offering this image, declared to be a Photoshop fake.

It is an obvious fake for the following reasons: 1) the document does not have a raised, embossed seal 2) it is not signed (take a look at your birth certificate and see if it has the signature of a physician or hospital officials) 3) there are no creases from folding in the scanned version above 4) the certificate number is redacted 5) the document claims to be a “certification of birth,” not a “certificate of birth,” and 6) the date supposedly bleeding through the back of the document says 2007, not 2008, when it was allegedly released.

The Annenberg Political Factsheet claims to have examined the original document and says it is legitimate (see Born in the U.S.A., The truth about Obama’s birth certificate). “Recently FactCheck representatives got a chance to spend some time with the birth certificate, and we can attest to the fact that it is real and three-dimensional and resides at the Obama headquarters in Chicago. We can assure readers that the certificate does bear a raised seal, and that it’s stamped on the back by Hawaii state registrar Alvin T. Onaka.”

Annenberg is a less than credible source considering Obama was chairman of the Annenberg Challenge in Chicago. One of his cohorts in that position was none other than the terrorist Bill Ayers.

Instead of releasing the original document, the Obama administration trots out White House press secretary Robert Gibbs to make sarcastic comments about those crazy birthers. Gibbs’ comments reveal the Obama administration and his supporters are sincerely worried about the issue.

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» mccloud should be banned asap Posted by: Captain Moroni
» mtcloud=mtfog of mendacity Posted by: Jayzer

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You can't change stupid
Posted by: cberkland on Jul 28, 2009 5:10 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This whole issue should have gone away last year, but when you are dealing with people who think the world is 6000 years old, 9/11 was an inside job, the holocaust never happened, we never landed on the moon, and global warming doesn't exist, you are wasting your time trying to reason with the unreasonable. Here is the best information I have found on the birth certificate:

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html

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» RE: You can't change stupid Posted by: Captain Moroni
» RE: You can't change stupid Posted by: cberkland
» RE: You can't change stupid Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» RE: You can't change stupid Posted by: Quannah

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it's easy to explain
Posted by: eva on Jul 28, 2009 5:17 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
why he doesn't produce the original long form that his parents received, he doesn't have it. This is very common, especially here on the gulf coast where so many people lost family documents. I remember seeing my long form birth certificate and a newer but still very old copy issued by the health department. Alas, they are both gone and no matter what I do I will never be able to produce those types of documents to prove my birth.

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» RE: it's easy to explain Posted by: Captain Moroni
» RE: it's easy to explain Posted by: helenwheels

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Obama's hidden past?
Posted by: progressive-life on Jul 28, 2009 5:22 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
""If Barack Obama was an Irish American or a Polish American or a German American, there would be no discussion anywhere in this country about his citizenship,"""

How racist can one get! Obama being black has nothing to do with it.. The fact that his father was not a citizen and he was born overseas leads to this speculation. Do remember that McCain's place of birth was also questioned!

Obama has been less than open about many things in his life..school, how he got into Harvard, how he paid for Harvard etc.. His actions have left the door open for this!

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» RE: Obama's hidden past? Posted by: Captain Moroni
» RE: Obama's hidden past? Posted by: clthompson
» GIT OVER IT Posted by: CAPSLOCK_AVENGER

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Why keep this issue alive?
Posted by: weightman on Jul 28, 2009 5:22 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
So what is AlterNet's purpose in continuing to keep this story alive?
It seems the author wants to characterize anyone disagreeing with Obama, on anything, as a racist, not just "birthers."
But what do I know.
I'm just an ignorant cracker who voted for him.

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Wishing birthers were really on to the Big Lies of 9/11
Posted by: whole2th on Jul 28, 2009 5:31 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
WIth AlterNet and Zionist trolls here linking the birthers with 9/11 truthers, I want to say that I wish the birthers would investigate 9/11 with the sense of discernment and detail that they use to insist on ironclad proof of Obama's claim that he is a natural born citizen.

RIdicule and conflating the birther issue with 9/11 are intellectually dishonest techniques.

Both the birther issue and the 9/11 evidence have sufficient proofs to be tested in court and in the case of 9/11, with a real investigation.

70,000 petition signers were turned down by the city clerk in New York at getting an item on the November ballot to create a new investigation into 9/11. Democracy denied.

What a good idea. We can fulfill on the fears of AlterNet trolls and controllers. Let's recruit birthers into the 9/11 truth movement.

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» Go soak your head, anti-Semite Posted by: GuitarBill

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It doesn't matter
Posted by: marjani on Jul 28, 2009 5:33 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Dems, GOP - they're both right and they're both wrong; but they're not going anywhere.

Of course, racism is behind it. What else would it be?

Arnold Schwarzeneggar, Gov of CA -- no one mentioned a word about his birth certificate and he's an American immigrant not born here who could potentially run for US President, and might win.

John McCain -- not born on US soil at all. No one has said a word about his birth certificate. Obama was more qualified to run for president than him--at least he was born on AMERICAN soil. But it's the same as with those Mickey Mouse votes and monopoly money that planted in ACORN and tried to pin on Obama; and that whole Wm Ayers BS.

It's the usual, same-o, same-o 'black tax' being charged against the president.

The hurdles are fixed so we can't get over them, and IF we happen to do it anyway, the game gets changed to make sure it doesn't happen again; regardless of the fact that we won fair and square and overcame the racist hurdles that were already in place. It's the same reason for no politics in church. Fear of another Dr Martin Luther King Jr arising from the pulpits. Laws got changed after he was killed to make sure that never happened again. Now all Negroes in church preach about is BS that they're not even spiritually nor economically privvy to. Crap like "prosperity thinking" that doesn't even apply to them.

Bla-sey skippy-doo-da-day is right and retards will be retards no matter what you do. There are people who hate he's president just because he's black. For them, he wasn't supposed to win just for that factor alone.

They can't believe their KKKrakka world has come crashing down around them. But other black people, the ones these violent and insane murderous spirits can get to, will be punished in his place. That's how they roll.

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» RE: It doesn't matter Posted by: Captain Moroni
» RE: It doesn't matter Posted by: rgd

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The longer these nutty birthers keep this issue alive, the better it is for
Posted by: MeyravLevine on Jul 28, 2009 5:46 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
the DEMS and Obama; like the Ayers/Terrorist non-issue that these morons were clinging to pre-election, this issue will only alienate and piss off normal Americans.

So, keep it up morons!

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OMGosh
Posted by: aadinko on Jul 28, 2009 5:51 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Why does someone always have to come along and make a "black thang" out of it? NEver fails.

RT
Ultimate Anonymity

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Playing the racist card to distract
Posted by: whole2th on Jul 28, 2009 5:58 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
......from the appropriate days in court. Cambridge/Harvard scholarships--awarded to a "foreign student applicant"? Passport that got Obama into Pakistan at a time when State Department refused such passage to Americans.....what country's passport got Obama to Pakistan? And, of course the original birth certificate.

As a 9/11 truther, I'm now welcoming any and all "Hall of Truth" (1984) lies be revealed--even about Obama's ineligibility to be President--and I voted for Obama.

Sidetrack opponents with name calling and ridicule. This is also known as the primary 'attack the messenger' ploy, though other methods qualify as variants of that approach. Associate opponents with unpopular titles such as 'kooks', 'right-wing', 'liberal', 'left-wing', 'terrorists', 'conspiracy buffs', 'radicals', 'militia', 'racists', 'religious fanatics', 'sexual deviates', and so forth. This makes others shrink from support out of fear of gaining the same label, and you avoid dealing with issues.

Question motives. Twist or amplify any fact which could be taken to imply that the opponent operates out of a hidden personal agenda or other bias. This avoids discussing issues and forces the accuser on the defensive.

Become incredulous and indignant. Avoid discussing key issues and instead focus on side issues which can be used show the topic as being critical of some otherwise sacrosanct group or theme. This is also known as the 'How dare you!' gambit.

Change the subject. Usually in connection with one of the other ploys listed here, find a way to side-track the discussion with abrasive or controversial comments in hopes of turning attention to a new, more manageable topic. This works especially well with companions who can 'argue' with you over the new topic and polarize the discussion arena in order to avoid discussing more key issues.

I invite you, Liliana, to look at http://ae911truth.org and read about the attack on the USS Liberty to get it that our government does lie to us--as a matter of routine.

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» RE: Playing the racist card to distract Posted by: Captain Moroni
» Please Posted by: jmooney

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CHARADE II
Posted by: CLARENCE SWINNEY on Jul 28, 2009 5:59 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
DISTRACTION BY FREAKNUTS TO
DISTRACT FROM HORROR OF 20 YEARS OF INEPT DISASTROUS MANAGEMENT

1980
600B budget to 4000B in 2009
1000B Debt to 11,000B in 2009

20 years=23M net new jobs
12 years=33M (carter + clinton)

Redistribution of Wealth + Income

Today 1% own 21% and 10% own 71% of Total Individual Personal Wealth

From 1946 to 1981 each Percentile increased in wealth + income almost evenly on percentage basis

It was known as Picket Fence Distribution

Reagan started Step Ladder distribution and Bush accelerated it.

Each step gained a little but Top Step went to own 71%.

Middle Class shall Revolt.

Les Miserables ahead

cswinney2@triad.rr.com

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» RE: CHARADE II Posted by: Captain Moroni
» I figured it out!!!! Posted by: Fencerider
» RE: I figured it out!!!! Posted by: Sister_Lauren

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RE: Whackos
Posted by: Captain Moroni on Jul 28, 2009 6:10 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Perfect example of dishonest dialogue. Thank you for making the pint that many on AlterNet are dishonest intellectually

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RE: Whackos
Posted by: VZEQICVA on Jul 28, 2009 7:37 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
How right you are! Now people like Lou Dobbs make a lot of money on melt downs over nothing. Ignoring them is the way to go. Anna

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RE: Whackos
Posted by: helenwheels on Jul 28, 2009 8:36 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Indeed. I blame the GOP for coaxing them out from under their rocks and giving their paranoid delusions legitimacy. In any other society they would be institutionalized, here they are given prime-time air time.

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RE: Whackos
Posted by: uncleeddie on Aug 3, 2009 10:44 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Ya before 19 Arab hillbillies brought down 3 towers into their own footprints with 2 planes. In the good old days everyone would have accepted THAT!

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pa
Posted by: parrotuya on Jul 28, 2009 6:01 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Well! The nuts are out! I didn't think that wacko paranoid conspiracy theorists would even bother to read the Alternet.

Personally, I don't believe any of you nut-jobs are citizens because I haven't seen a birth certificate! If you're not a citizen, then you don't have the right to free speech. I wasn't there, I didn't see you born in this country! You nuts could have been born in Saudi Arabia for all I know! It will take more than a birth certificate. I want testimonials from medical staff, I want investigations, I want documentation! Being a paranoid conspiracy theorist birther takes work and requires U.S. citizenship! Not just anyone can be a nut-job! Show proof or shut up!

DOWn, baby, DOWn!

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» RE: pa Posted by: Captain Moroni
» RE: pa Posted by: cberkland
» Amen Posted by: Jbuuty

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The real scandal
Posted by: johnwinthrop on Jul 28, 2009 6:07 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Obama was raised by white people in white communities, went to elite white schools including private high school, and pretends he is black.

Aside from a kenyan father he barely saw once, and a kenyan family he's had nothing to do with, he is white. He suckered the press and the crying, weeping liberals into thinking the "first" black President had been elected.

That, and not the stupid birth certificate issue, is the swindle Barry Obama has pulled.

His policies will benefit academic upper middle class grad school degree holders the most, leaving blacks and working class whites in the dust. As for blacks, their disdain in general for rigorous education instead of sports and bad pop music will leave them in the dust of their own making.

At least Obama doesn't pretend to be a street black.. Just being 'black' is enough for his guilt ridden stupid white college grad admirers and the black population which will get nada from this fraud.

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» RE: The real scandal Posted by: Captain Moroni
» You two.... Posted by: Fencerider

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It about Constitutional eligibility not the birth certificate.
Posted by: donnal on Jul 28, 2009 6:12 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It is not about the birth certificate.

Mr. Obama has openly provided information that if one knew the Constitution would have had questions about his eligibiltiy during the campaign. His claim to be a citizen under the 14th amendment, his admission that we was born with dual citizenship, his Kenyan father, and his adoption in Indonesia, is what we should be debating not his birth certificate.

Natural born citizen must mean one who is a citizen by no act of law. If a person owes their citizenship to some act of law, they can not be considered to be natural-born citizen.

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Obama's Miraculous Birth
Posted by: Jbuuty on Jul 28, 2009 6:16 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The birthers are actually claiming that Obama's birth was a miracle. His birth is a sign. Soon they will be worshiping him as a new God.

You see, he was born in Kenya, even though his mother was in Hawaii at the time.

As Philip Ochieng, a friend of Obama's father and a respected Kenyan journalist wrote: Obama's mother never stepped foot in Kenya while Obama Sr was living. Therefore, it must have been a miraculous birth.

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» RE: Obama's Miraculous Birth Posted by: desidid

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b kenneth mcgee, author..eyes shut tight
Posted by: rfgtile on Jul 28, 2009 6:20 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Little Murders

I call them Little Murders. Maybe, I should call them accessories to Little Murders. Either way, they are the things that people say that diminish or degrade other people. We hear them all of the time. Bigotry and racism can be a very subtle thing. In fact, it is the subtle that can be the most damaging.

You see, it has always been that “little murders” preceded the real murders. The holocaust could never have happened if the awful remarks had not proceeded it. A young black man in Mississippi would not have been beaten to death for whistling at a white woman if the awful words had not been used first. I cannot even bring myself to even write the “n” word but how many times have you heard it said. A gay man would not have been tied to a fence and beaten to death if there had not been first the awful words---fagot, queer, homo, etc. And then there is the “wink, wink, nod, nod,” comments that say it all about those that we want to set apart. I read now that the hate groups are using the immigration issue to recruit for their hateful purposes. Will we always find a way to hate somebody? Will it ever end?

Are we being an accessory to a “little murder if we listen to these remarks and say nothing? I think so. Is it too embarrassing to call someone out that says these things? I think not. Is it worth a moment of embarrassment to do so. You tell me. Bigotry, prejudice, racism, anti Semitism, and homophobia, are set ablaze by the hate mongers but they are fueled by the indifferent. Where do you stand?

That is the bad news. But, there is also the good news. I sat in the stands at a high school wrestling match last weekend. I watched as Afro-Americans and white kids wrestled each other, horsed around on the mats together between matches, and laughed and joked together. I watched as white female wrestlers (still somewhat of a shock to an old timer) did the same, wrestling young black men, horsing around together, and laughing and joking together. Could this be? Forty years ago when I was a civil rights activist in the South, those young men would have been beaten, lynched, and thrown in the river for even whistling at the young ladies. Now, here they were doing what wrestlers do to each other when they wrestle and to them it was the most natural thing in the world. My gosh, I thought, things really have changed. There is an Afro American that is running for President and has a very good chance of making it. Borack Obama is a US Senator from Illinois. He was elected in a state that South of Chicago is not exactly a liberal bastion. The young people in particular don’t give a darn if he is Black or White. They like him, his message and because he is close to their age they feel a kinship. Not all to be sure, but enough to make a difference.

I think back forty years and the days in Alabama and Georgia. Maybe, someday, “little murders” will be as much a thing of the past as the crimes that they preceded.

I realize that yes, things have changed -- not yet what it should be and hopefully not what it will be, but by gosh, not what it use to be! Free at last? Not quite, but a heck of a lot closer!

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Cook Lawsuit
Posted by: MyLeftFoot on Jul 28, 2009 6:27 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
the gov't backed down on this lawsuit and Cook was not deployed.

from the article;
After the revocation of the order to deploy, Judge Clay Land sided with the defense, finding Cook’s suit “moot” in that he already has been told he doesn’t have to go to Afghanistan, eliminating his need for relief from the court. ”Federal court only has authority of actual cases and controversies,” Judge Land said according to the Miami Herald. “The entire action is dismissed for lack of subject matter jurisdiction.”

Therefore, the U.S. government has signaled it would rather not take up the issue since their boss would have to finally come clean and present clear and convincing evidence of his status of “natural born citizen”. However, the actions of the U.S. government make it seem that he likely wasn’t, and they are willing to give an “out” to any soldier who follows the footsteps of Major Cook in order to not have to deal with such a troublesome fact.

linked text

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» RE: Cook Lawsuit Posted by: Captain Moroni
» RE: Cook Lawsuit Posted by: helenwheels

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Race an over simplification
Posted by: solrev on Jul 28, 2009 6:28 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I think there is a bigger segment of the population involved. I call this segment the Palin patriot pals or better yet Hannity’s world. A racial subgroup is only a part of this larger segment. This segment of the population views their world in decline. Like a wolf with its leg caught in a trap, individuals within this segment can become very dangerous whichever subgroup they come from. They would rather fight than switch.

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» RE: ace an over simplification Posted by: Captain Moroni
» RE: ace an over simplification Posted by: Fencerider
» RE: Race an over simplification Posted by: photon's feather

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Brilliant Illusionist
Posted by: americansheep on Jul 28, 2009 6:32 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We all hear how well spoken and brilliant Obama is, but for a smart man he is making alot of dumb decisions. But wait. What I think are his dumb decisions are precisely what he smartly intended to do while he was promising us "change", which we also misinterpreted. I admit he is a smart man when it comes to illusions then smoothly moon walks backwards. He is doing what he was elected to do...and We know he was elected not by me nor you but by the corporate wealthy who pared our choice to few. We are walking contradictions each with a different view. And never the twain shall meet here in the Ununited States.

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distraction
Posted by: james108 on Jul 28, 2009 6:52 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Racism has nothing to do with it. He is a lying fake to the bone, from his high minded talk on health care and Afghanistan down to his sealed birth certificate.

He spent about a million dollars on legal fights to keep his birth records sealed, and then posted on the web a newly printed summarization with stark discrepancies to reality.

"African" was not on a race on US birth certificates in 61, for one thing. For another, why are his actual records still sealed, and we have to rely on a summary that they "vouch for"? Isn't he the only president in history now who sealed his actual birth records? It's not racism to see something is a lie, even if it has to do with race.

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» Distraction indeed. Posted by: Benn_Miller

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Check ALL Birth Certificates
Posted by: DHFabian on Jul 28, 2009 6:50 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The origins of the allegation that President Obama isn't a citizen is so ignorant that it's funny. Obama was born in Hawaii, which is one of the two newest states. Someone came up with the notion that Hawaii wasn't yet a state when Obama was born, so the spin was that Obama isn't really a US citizen -- and a movement was born! AFTER this effort was launched, someone did the math. Hawaii became a state in 1959. Obama was born in 1961. Oops. Then we had the inconvenient fact that Obama's opponent, John McCain, actually wasn't born in the US; he was born in the Panama Canal zone.
No matter, the Birther movement was launched.

Interestingly, I've yet to hear the call for the release of birth certificates for EVERY
person in government office, so we can see for ourselves if they meet the citizenship requirements of their office. One can argue that the Republican leadership has so intensely worked against the best interests of the US since the '80s that they just might be foreign-born "plants" whose job it is to destroy the US. After all, it's a given in the international community that the surest way to destroy the US is to destroy its economy.

Shouldn't the public demand the release of the birth certificates every Republican in federal office?

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» Sure Posted by: james108

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Are Any Of The Birthers Children Of Servicemen Born Abroad?
Posted by: desidid on Jul 28, 2009 7:01 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
My sister was born overseas, because my father was in the Army, would anyone like to challenge her citzenship? The people of Hawaii don't like mainlanders for just this reason, they are made to feel foreign. And why wouldn't they be, they certainly don't look American (blonde hair, blue eyed). I imagine if I were in another country looking at America now I would have found our weakness. Our weakness is we don't believe our Constitution. There is a reason that Al Queda has been able to recruit American citizens, because those people know we don't believe in our Constitution. The world knows we pay lip service to the notion of equality. We are not an equal nation, we are a nation of stigmas. We ask people who look like Obama to go to war and kill people because, this is the only nation where "real equality" exist. I got swept up in the possibility of an Obama presidency, today I am right back in 1964. This nation has not changed in my lifetime, the lie is bigger and uglier, because the possibility of a Black president being judged by his good or bad works are gone.

The birthers have won one thing, today there are thousands of Black Americans who once had hope for this nation, and our place in it. Today I see the people who have been elected to make the laws as the hooded creatures they really are. And the people who elected them are like-minded.

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Distraction away from the Real Coupe
Posted by: Purple Girl on Jul 28, 2009 7:19 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Come on Who was the illegitmate POTUS who continues to rear his Ugly head in his own defense of his acts of Abuse of power, Treason, War crimes.... DICK.
This is not so much about casting doubt on Obama's legitmacy as much as a distraction away from Cheney's illegitimacy.
As VP it is their duty to assure the 'Decider' is ALWAYS FULLY INFORMED! "Basically" is NOT an Option- to the POTUS and certainly not ANY of the Underlings, esp The VP.
Further it appears VP Cheney had other military operations, which have yet to be proven approved by Bush. Further allegations of abuse of power and undermining our system of Checks and Balance are coming from one of the Other Equal Branches of Gov't. So Cheney not only usurped the Commander in Chief - but both Houses. And considering Cheney is a man who knows to CYA - do you think he relied solely on the breifs of two low rankers like Yoo and Beybee? Try again....Who revealed his Twisted logic differentiating Torture from Punishment on national TV? Sounded like Scalia provided the basic principles Yoo and Beybee spring boarded off.A Hunting Trip or Two Anthony and Dick?
Nor should we forget that Dick was the First VP to have unfettered powers, yet no accountablity in both the WH and Senate. Enjoying the privieldges of both, but none of the restrictions. Dick created a new Branch of Gov't- Dicks.
And lets be honest- when a public official unabshedly responds "So" to the will (demands) of the people in a democracy- he no longer accepts the concept of a democracy.
My response to the Birthers would be the exact same as Rep BONERS about the Stimulus Bill- I'd slam the volumes of evidence against Cheney on the floor and demand the right of the People to Know exactly What's in it!

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Think a minute
Posted by: DHFabian on Jul 28, 2009 7:21 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
First, how do you know Obama was lying about anything, much less his citizenship? If he is lying, what is the goal?

When it became evident during the presidential campaign that Obama was in the lead, don't you think the McCain campaign went through Barack Obama's records "with a fine-toothed comb," looking for anything that could disqualify Obama? Had McCain actually discovered that Obama did not meet the requirements, he (Sen. McCain) would have been required by law to reveal this information. He did not.

Candidates and office holders aren't required to release copies of their birth certificates to the general public. However, every candidate IS required by law to provide proof of citizenship, age, etc. -- a legal birth certificate -- to the government (not the public, but the government) before they can run for office, and this information is carefully verified, as US law requires. This is how we know that, for example, John McCain, Obama's opponent in the last election, actually wasn't born in the US. He was born in the Panama Canal zone, outside of the US. Barack Obama was born in Hawaii, two years AFTER Hawaii became a state.

Now think for a minute. Once it became evident (during the campaign) that Obama was taking the lead over McCain, do you think that the Republican Party would have failed to fully investigate Obama's qualifications and life history? If Obama didn't fully meet the citizenship requirements of office, wouldn't the McCain camp take immediate action to disqualify Obama? Senators (like McCain) do have full access to records such as birth certificates. Sen. McCain knew, and publicly confirmed, that Barack Obama is, in fact, a US born American citizen.

So, what is your evidence for your claims against Obama?

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» RE: Think a minute Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Think a minute Posted by: samd11

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What Is Really Happening Here....
Posted by: Kita on Jul 28, 2009 7:22 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The truth is President Obama is a natural born citizen...unless you believe that it has been a consipiracy his whole life!....Dont think so!

The real issue here is that many people cannot deal with the fact that a Black President was voted into office. It just seems to rock their worlds.

Obviously, based on some of your comments here, having a Black President is a sore spot. It has everything to do with racism!!! If people REALLY thought that our President wasn't a US born citizen and that were the issue, discussions would have been minimized when the news presented President Obama's birth certificate.

Where were you conspiracy theorists when we needed Bush out of office????????? He was NEVER harassed nearly as much as President Obama.

Honestly, even if by some miraculous event, your crazy theory was proven to be true, and President Obama wasn't a "natural-born" citizen.....WHO CARES!!!!!! News flash buddy, the majority of American citizens WANTED Obama for President. Nothing that is said or done will ever change that fact. And if one African American can be voted into office, guess what, many more can be voted in!

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» No regard for the truth Posted by: james108
» RE: No regard for the truth Posted by: Quannah

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COVERT racism?
Posted by: BlueBerry PickN on Jul 28, 2009 7:35 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
wow, really?

gee, I'm glad someone pointed out that there was racism involved.

who could have never noticed, otherwise?

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It's not "all white people hate Obama"
Posted by: zooeyhall on Jul 28, 2009 7:53 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Remember it was Iowa--allmost 100% white, that gave Obama his first big victory on the way to the presidency.

I live in Nebraska, and the 2nd Congressional district--where most of the people live--gave Obama it's Electoral vote.

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So if my mother is an American citizen and I'm born in Britain,
Posted by: Fempatriot on Jul 28, 2009 7:55 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
that makes me a British citizen and not an American? Hogwash. Maternity is the most provable part of being born. Paternity may sometimes be questioned, but not who's your mama.

I don't get it. Plenty of Americans have been born somewhere other than the USA. John McCain was born in Panama--I didn't hear anyone saying that he was Panamanian during the election. And Panama is not the USA.

I did receive the most racist, lying bunch of emails I've ever had during a presidential election, and they were all about Barack Obama. He was a Muslim, he wasn't an American citizen, he was going to force us all to be Muslims, etc.

Get over it you racist Republicans/Hillary worshipers. Give the guy a chance. He couldn't do us more dirty than Bush-Cheney have done over the past 8 years. He's inherited the biggest mess on Earth. Help clean it up, not contribute to it.

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"IT'S ALWAYS SOMETHING" (Gilda Radner)
Posted by: VZEQICVA on Jul 28, 2009 7:57 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Today it's the birth certificate. When that dies down they Repubs will have another thing to torment us with. Going back to the campaign and the election, the world was dancing in the streets, literally. Bush, a dismal failure, was gone. The new guy was smart, and gave most of us a new look at the country that Bush destroyed. The Republicans were humiliated. They didn't just lose. They lost many of their own people to Obama. McCain couldn't make the cut and Sarah Palin was a disgrace. We've since had several reality checks and the euphoria has worn off. But the Republicans can't forgive the rest of us for having walked all over them. Looking for their own mistakes is not their style. So they behave like spoiled brats and continue to disrupt anything they can. I can't wait until someone gets a picture of Obmama having a cigarette. They will always find something to feed the 24/7 news. Other than real news. Like we have two wars going on and 31 soldiers died in July. Incidentally, many of themwere not native born Americans. I don't like their tactics because they detract from important things. But that's what they do. I give them a week to find the next thing which I suspect will derive from the Obama, Gates, Crowley ceremonial, 'bury the hatchet beer'. That's their style. ANNA

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» I Wonder... Posted by: aussidawg

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even whackos sometimes have a point!!
Posted by: wolfbite on Jul 28, 2009 8:18 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
im curious why some seemingly great journalists trot out non evidence to make the argument....like the certificate of live birth...strange!

use wierd arguments and belittle the messanger instead of doing some real factfinding.....strange

citizen or not Obama is still a better choice than McInsane/Palin

can you imagine what would happen if this birth stuff were true???



Its about the constitution stupid!!!

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Not racism
Posted by: leafsong1 on Jul 28, 2009 8:30 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
No, it's not racism; it's consistency of propaganda. It's precisely for the reason one source the author quoted said it was: to persuade people that Obama was deliberately attempting to weaken the country (by not aggresively attacking Iran and anyone else that looks cross-eyed at Israel). This is a projection of treason on an American citizen from people who are greedy for profiteering dollars and/or loyal to a foreign power. It doesn't matter if it is true; it matters that it is consistent with the rest of the propaganda: nobody can be trusted with US foreign policy except those that spend and invade the most. This is straight out of Mein Kampf.

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» RE: Not racism--Karl Rovism Posted by: Ripcord

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turns on it's head...
Posted by: ellie on Jul 28, 2009 8:40 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Obama is half white and his mom was officially and legally about as american as you can get... this turns the race argument into a moot point...

not all states have the long version of birth certificates... many local and county vital statistics records have been damaged or destroyed along the line and the best you can get is an official record of birth from the state...

my own official long form was destroyed in a fire in 1967, best I have is an official record... stuff happens...

every time the critters on the hill get crap like this going, am always wondering what the smoke screen is all about... what are they trying like crazy for us not to know or see???

could it be that they are up for recess where they will be expected to go back to their home state and be subjected to the wrath of voters on a boatload of issues we are not happy about that they have done???

smell a dead rat in this pile of bull...

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» RE: turns on it's head... Posted by: luzmejor

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Captain Morons-plural and co., what about the birth announcement?
Posted by: helenwheels on Jul 28, 2009 8:49 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I noticed that you aren't responding to threads that bring up the birth announcement that was in the Hawaiian paper. Why not?

And since you birthers claim to be all about protecting the Constitution, could you be so kind as to let me know what you were doing when the shrub stole 2 elections and then proceeded to use the Constitution as toilet paper?

Obama's mom was an American citizen, so he is too. Get over it, racists.

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Proof by Comparison
Posted by: bandofotters on Jul 28, 2009 8:56 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Take Obama and 4-6 other people born the same year in Hawaii. Now let's take a look at the legal birth records of all these people in the sample. The people chosen should be picked by birthers and non-birthers.

Form & substance, are the documents the same?

There is no reason to rely on anything but one's own two eyes.

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Bob Tyrrell
Posted by: Ripcord on Jul 28, 2009 8:54 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
editor of the American Spectator appeared on "Hardball" with Chris Matthews and rejected the "birther" phenom with a psychology argument:

Psychologically people are lazy and:

1) need an enemy and
2) are bored.

1) hence, they hang on to unproveable conspiracy theories (FDR bombed Pearl Harbor; LBJ shot JFK; yes, Cheney brought down the Twin Towers, and Obama is a Nazi).

2) Someone calls the White House at 4 in the morning asking what they're doing about UFOs

Here Segura also points to a deep psychological enemy: anyone that looks different--the lazy observers pick out the most latent appearance--his skin is a different color, Obama is a black enemy.

Repeating Segura: "Unlike all conspiracy theories, it thrives on a deep-rooted, racist belief: that a black man with a foreign name could never have won the presidency in the United States through anything other than trickery, deception, or fraud."

But the argument itself is a little lazy.
Yes, we acquired our prejudices upon our mother's knee.
But what to do about it?

Turn your view from going out to the color of another's face, in towards your own center.

There you will find a face that has no color, no-face, no size--just an empty space, boundless.
Everyone's headless empty space joins with all other empty spaces to join with a boundless life unconditionally loving all.

see: www.headless.org

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birth certificate/smirth certificate
Posted by: WesternNY on Jul 28, 2009 9:05 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am truly confused about this Kenyan birth issue. Who cares. Nobody is denying that Obama is the child of his mother, who is/was an American citizen.

Even if he were born in Kenya, so long as his mother is American, he is American. End of story. Locale of birth is then irrelevant. It only becomes relevant if BOTH his parents are foreign nationals.

By the way, McCain was born in Panama to an American citizen, and nobody is claiming he's not American.

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Hawaii was stolen from her people for the benefit of wealthy American plantation owners and military
Posted by: tony_opmoc on Jul 28, 2009 9:17 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Whilst Obama is almost certainly a legitimate citizen of The US based on his Mother's status as an American, Hawaii probably isn't a legitimate US state.

Hawaii is in a similar position as Territory forcibly conquered by the British that became part of the British Empire, not States of Britain.

Hawaii is not legally a state! Most folks have heard that Hawaii is a state, one of the United States of America. Most people, including those who live in Hawaii, accept that statement as a fact. But the reality is that in a world in which nations are as bound by the rule of laws as are the citizens of nations (if not more so), the truth is quite different! The truth is that each and every step along Hawaii's path from sovereign and independent nation, to annexed territory, to state, was done in violation of laws and treaties then in effect, without regard to the wishes of the Hawaiian people. Many people, including President Grover Cleveland, opposed the annexation of Hawaii.But in the end, simple greed and military interest overrode any concerns or moral right and legality. Hawaii's legitimate government was toppled using threat of American military force. Hawaii was stolen from her people for the benefit of wealthy American plantation owners and military interests, and the justifications for the crime were invented after-the-fact. Hawaii's government was overthrown on Jan. 17, 1893, by a relatively small group of men, most of them American by birth or heritage, who seized control of the Islands with the backing of American troops sent ashore from a warship in Honolulu Harbor. To this "superior force of the United States of America," Queen Lili`uokalani yielded her throne, under protest, in order to avoid bloodshed, trusting that the United States government would right the wrong that had been done to her and the Hawaiian people. Who were this group of American men and why did they overthrow the government? Sugar! Sugar was by far the principal support of the islands, and profits and prosperity hinged on favorable treaties with the United States, Hawaiian sugar's chief market, creating powerful economic ties. The plantation owners were, for the most part, the descendents of the original missionary families who had brought religion to the islands in the wake of the whaling ships. As ownership of private property came to the islands, the missionary families wound up owning a great deal of it! Hawaii has little in the way of mineral wealth, so the land was useful only for agriculture. But the United States had, in 1826, recognized Hawaii as a sovereign nation in its own right, and imposed the usual import tariffs on sugar coming from the islands. This cut into the profits of the sugar plantations. Indeed, being American citizens themselves, the plantation owners were rankled by the fact that the US government actually made more profit from their sugar then the plantation owners themselves did! To evade the tariff, it became necessary to the plantation owners that Hawaii cease being a separate and sovereign nation. In 1887, during the reign of Lili`uokalani' s brother, King Kalakaua, a group of planters and businessmen, seeking to control the kingdom politically as well as economically, formed a secret organization, the Hawaiian League. Membership (probably never over 400, compared to the 40,000 Native Hawaiians in the kingdom) was predominantly American, led by Lorrin A. Thurston, a lawyer and missionary grandson. Their goal, for now, was to "reform" the monarchy. But what was "reform" to the Americans was treason to the people of Hawaii, who loved and respected their monarchs. It is important to recall that, unlike the hereditary rulers of Europe, Hawaii's last two Kings were actually elected to that office by democratic vote.....

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Captain Maroni....
Posted by: Fencerider on Jul 28, 2009 9:25 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
You sir, have neither the pot to piss in or the accuracy to get it there.

How are we to take you and your tired and outright bogus theories at all seriously if you cannot even grasp the nuances of syntax, grammar, spelling and due-diligence?

Really, the yelling, the typos, the lack of fact checking? You sound like a crazy old coot, shouting at imaginary enemies from a not so tall rooftop. I believe you are not a well person, and I strongly recommend therapy. This would would be a good next step for you.

How's that for being a caring individual?

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Born to a U.S. citizen
Posted by: tngreen on Jul 28, 2009 9:31 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I guess these "birthers" aren't aware that you don't have to be born on U.S. soil to be a natural-born American citizen as long as one of your parents is. If that weren't the case, no pregnant woman would dare take an overseas trip, in case she unexpectedly went into labor and risk having her child not be a citizen. Doesn't this sort of neutralize the entire debate, as we know that Mr. Obama's mother was a natural-born U.S. citizen? Geeeeez.

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» RE: Born to a U.S. citizen Posted by: jvaljon1
» RE: Born to a U.S. citizen Posted by: aonghus36

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Creepy
Posted by: freshlemon on Jul 28, 2009 9:33 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am always shocked when people waste so much time and energy on such stupidity as this. I'm even shocked at myself for being so angry.

This is not America! Who are these people and what do they want?

Are you all just planning to complain and bicker about petty BS and destroy the principles this country has mandated in the Constitution and in the recent election?

If it is your purpose to destoy the Obama presidency, then it must also be your purpose to destroy the United States. You are guilty of treasonous behavior that displays bigotry,lies,immorality and an infantile tantrum stage.

The democrats that rode into office on Obama's coat-tails and the just say no republicans are idiots with ego problems and dollar signs in their eyes. This country is going "belly-up" and you proceed with blinders covering your eyes and ears to argue a moot point in sophomoric style.

The democratic administration of Obama has only been in office seven months. Those of you who are complaining that he has disappointed you,should start pointing your finger of blame and shame at the real culprits. The fear and hate mongerers,the republican minority,bigots,
racists and the religious radicals. How about blaming Wall Street, banks, insurance companies, and the drug and health industry. And what about the war kings in the Pentagon who pick the country's pocket everyday.

And do not forget the media. Where are the true news people who report on important issues? Not the speculators who talk as if they have the corner on the truth market when they know that they are lying to capture the audience of those who feel disenfranchized.

I am ashamed of and embarrassed by the behavior of these so-called pundits and the people who take them at their word. PUNDITS DEAL IN OPINIONS, NOT FACTS.

We need to get over ourselves and start thinking for ourselves about how to solve our problems and not in creating the illusion of problems.

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» 7 months? Bollocks Posted by: bonapartist
» RE: 7 months? Bollocks Posted by: freshlemon
» No need to thank me Posted by: bonapartist
» RE: Creepy,,blah blah blah Posted by: Caleb Darkstar

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I love this crap
Posted by: fred_53_99 on Jul 28, 2009 9:47 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The GOP for years catered to the right wing racist nut cases. They still do for the most part to the point that no black person other than a self hating fool would want to be a part of this party. So now the nuts who have been "pimped" for so many years now wanna run the nut house.I don't think the gOP can control them. What we've seen at those Palin rallies last year, well they are the real thing. You can't make this stuff up

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Is the State of Hawaii also involved?
Posted by: reelectnoone on Jul 28, 2009 10:17 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Check this web site.

Certificate confirmed and includes photos of the raised seal and stamp from State of Hawaii and quotes from the state verifying they have the original on file in their office.

factcheck.org

But some will now accuse the entire state of Hawaii for being in on the conspiracy. Idiots will insist that Obama's mother planned this entire conspiracy when he was born because she knew because of her crystal ball the her some would someday be elected president !

Go figure the total lack of mentality when you hate someone else.

/

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Simple reply
Posted by: Jeanne on Jul 28, 2009 10:27 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What proof do "birthers" have that Obama was born anywhere? If they want to float this notion, they should have the decency to produce some proof that he was born (somewhere else). I don't imagine these half wits would have the collective skill to research that paper trail. Case closed.

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» RE: Simple reply: SHOW us your Posted by: aonghus36

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Karl Rove's Playbook
Posted by: Ripcord on Jul 28, 2009 10:30 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
see: Silverblatt, Bruns and Jensen,
Deciphering Karl Rove's Playbook: Campaign Tactics and Response Strategies" Webster University

It's a coordinated Republican campaign to regain seats in 2010 and the Presidency in 2012.

1) Take the Offensive
The first out of the starting blocks takes control of the race (no pun intended)
2) Attack your Opponent's strengths
Obama pesonifies diversity.
Response: promote diversity
3) Accuse your Opponent of which he is going to Accuse you of
Repubs are afraid of being accused of being racist, so call Obama a racist
4) Go Negative, Then Cry Foul
5) The "Big Lie"
It's the very magnitude of a "big lie" that makes it believable
6) Appeal to Moral Values
7) Sell the (Ronald Reagan) Persona
8) Sell an Adolescent Worldview
There are "Birthers" and "Truthers"
9) Exploit the Media
10) Create Straw Issues
Manufacture minor (but emotionally loaded) issues to divert the attention and allegiance of voters
11) Employ Surrogates
12) Use Emotional Appeals
13) Rely on Expert Testimonals
14) Rhetorical Devices
15) Use of Language

All of these strategies are being used by demogogues to regain seats.

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OWW! My Eyes! My bleeding, burning eyes!
Posted by: Reality Chick on Jul 28, 2009 10:29 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What a bunch of morons! Only in a country chock full of retards would this conversation even be happening. I try.. I swear I do.. not to be embarrassed by the rank stupidity of most americans, but jesus hussein christ! seriously?

STOP! OF COURSE he's a citizen. OF COURSE this is racism. Now,let it go!

Here's a thought.. get out of your pj's, walk out the door and expend all this hateful energy on something that IMPROVES the world instead of adding more pollution to it with all this ugliness.

Seriously, STFU. Obama is president. Try to be happy that at least we have a man with dignity and intelligence, something no conservative in the office has had since Eisenhower.

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» Thanks, Jvaljon1! Posted by: Reality Chick
» RE: Thanks, Jvaljon1! Posted by: helenwheels
» RE: Thanks, helenwheels! Posted by: Reality Chick
» RE: Thanks, helenwheels! Posted by: helenwheels
» LOL, helenwheels! Posted by: Reality Chick

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After eight years of Bush -----
Posted by: symcokid on Jul 28, 2009 10:39 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
what difference would it make if Barack Obama was born in this country or not. How could the irreparable harm done by Bush throughout the world ever be rectified in ten lifetimes?

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Doctors,Nurses,Which Hospital
Posted by: theo777 on Jul 28, 2009 10:40 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Why have none of the hospital staff come forward. If I where present at the birth of a world leader I would be proud of it and tell someone. Why is there confusion over the hospital in which he was born?

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» RE: Doctors,Nurses,Which Hospital Posted by: helenwheels
» RE: Doctors,Nurses,Which Hospital Posted by: helenwheels

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So I guess the Honolulu paper 48 years ago just made this up?
Posted by: helenwheels on Jul 28, 2009 10:48 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]

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Trolls. Trolls everywhere.
Posted by: theblackgeorgecarlin on Jul 28, 2009 11:13 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It appears that the wingnut and tinfoil hate crowd have come out in full force to justify there racism and stupidity. If ever there was proof the education system in the US needs to be fixed, the comments so far show it. Jesus, the comment section is filled to the brim with retards that don't have an idea about what "facts" or "logic" or "truth" means.

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Who cares Alternet? Ridiculous article
Posted by: chlamor on Jul 28, 2009 11:15 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Pandering to the political charade is not a pretty thing to watch.

So the entire US economy gets shipped to the safe havens of the colonized lands for cheap labor and the denizens of the Imperium are left to squawk over the import of whether or not their Emperor is really-really from The Homeland or was he too shipped in with the Made in China label.

Who cares.

People are being blown to smithereens by the latest War Monger in Command and you have the audacity to keep the mighty Wurlitzer blaring with such garbage as this article?

Please desist with the latest fluff du jour and get involved with some serious journalism and start asking some relevant questions such as: "Is Obama a war criminal?";

"Do Obama's supporters have obligations now that we've seen how horrific are his policies?";

"Is the liberal media so thoroughly corrupted that it has become the twin of the reactionary media?;

"Will Obama set all records for war spending and bank bailouts?"

You folks really need to take a look in the mirror and ask yourselves what your agenda truly is.

Oh and BTW the illegal US assault in Af/Pak rages on, record unemployment figures soar higher, Iraq casualties pile up, and no peeps from the pseudo-black man with good diction who resides in the House of White.

Wake up.

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Unbelievable
Posted by: helenwheels on Jul 28, 2009 12:31 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Of all the causes in the world to devote ones' time and energy to, this has to be the most futile and ridiculous.

Do the birthers actually think that they're going to get anywhere close to unseating Barack Obama? REALLY?

I noticed Moroni conveniently left after I linked the birth announcement link several times.

I even dabble in what's considered conspiracy theory - I study them. I think the truthers really have something. There are a ton of unanswered questions, etc.

The birther thing though? Just fecking stupid and desperate and paranoid as it gets.

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» RE: Unbelievable Posted by: aonghus36

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New rules, courtesy of Repubs and 3rdies.
Posted by: Beck on Jul 28, 2009 1:16 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
No more innocent until PROVEN guilty! All it takes is an accusation. Make an attractive accusation, one that will bolster many of your other fondly-held notions, and convince everyone who "thinks" like you and holds all your fondly-held notions that it's true. This will be the easiest thing you ever do. Right-wing pundits pick it up and "report" on it, usually vaguely. People speak in gatherings and others cheer! Others are cheering! More validation!

Did you think you lived in the US where the accuser must prove their case, have enough evidence to do so, and the accused is innocent until proven guilty? You apparently no longer live in THAT United States. You live in the NEW US, where people hear an idea they really, really like, one that they believe will straighten out a situation they really, really do not like (the new president is of a political party they do not belong to), and those fiercely patriotic citizens now cry, "Well, PROVE your innocence! PROVE the things I believe are not true! Up to you, dude. IF you're innocent, you could PROVE it at any time. The fact that you do not refute what I chose to believe PROVES you are the liar I was already sure you were to begin with."

THIS is the new United States of America, folks!. Set up a straw man, ignore governors (Republican), various Department officials, other officials, archival birth announcements. Why ignore them? They do not match your previously-held assumption, the one that gratifies you so deeply. The one that proves what you want to believe. The one you deeply hope will set the unfortunate situation you find yourself in (your party lost, and some other party controls the presidency, house, and senate) more to your liking, as you are so certain should be the case. And repeat your bogus new rules as if they actually exist, as if any accusation you make must be straightened out by your accused, or that's further proof that they're as bad as you thought beforehand.

Too bad it has nothing to do with American justice. Too bad no one else even attempts to live up to such standards.

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Honestly, I do not give a rat's arse where our leaders were born...
Posted by: Quist on Jul 28, 2009 1:35 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
...as long as they are doing their jobs properly, proficiently, intelligently, truthfully, gracefully, empathetically, and sensibly and have "our" (We the People's) interest in mind.

Is Obama doing his job properly, proficiently, intelligently, truthfully, gracefully, empathetically, and sensibly is a whole other issue.

This issue though is a total farse. Independents, like myself, are really sick of these non-issues and sophomoric behavior from the two major parties.

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Just because these idiots say it, doesn't make it true. Our President was born in America,
Posted by: avidAmerican on Jul 28, 2009 1:53 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
in the State of Hawaii, yes it IS a State. Don't you think it's time to stop showing the world how stupid you bunch of morons are and find something honest and useful to do with your time? I know I shouldn't be, but I am shocked at the number of idiots in this country. We do have good school systems, but maybe they just didn't have enough schooling. They leave us with the picture of them in our minds of Moonshine-sucking, gun-toting, jackbooted nazi-like sore losers. You lost, get over it.

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