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The Daily Beast / By Max Blumenthal
comments_imageCOMMENTS: 428

Did Paranoid Right-Wing Media Fuel the Pittsburgh Cop Killer's Rage?

Richard Poplawski, the man who allegedly murdered three Pittsburgh cops, was clearly influenced by Fox News's Glenn Beck and right-wing radio.
April 8, 2009  |  
 
 
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On April 6, two days after the 22-year-old Richard Poplawski allegedly murdered three police officers in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, a radio host named Alex Jones settled in before a microphone in his studio in Austin, Texas to do some damage control. "The mainstream media has certainly enjoyed tying me into this story," Jones complained. "They're attacking me and saying I'm delusional and there's no New World Order The Second Amendment, what the country's founded on--it's all my fault!"

Poplawski was a neo-Nazi wannabe who railed against blacks, Jews, "Zionists," and gun control. And like many members of the far-right fringe, he allegedly visited Jones' Web sites and posted alarming reports by Jones' writers on the white supremacist message board, Stormfront. (Poplawski's posts are here, authored under the handle, "Braced For Fate.") While Alex Jones generally avoids overt racism, he has found an eager audience on Stormfront by conjuring dark visions of an impending New World Order, claiming FEMA is secretly building a national concentration camp network, and announcing that President Barack Obama has planned mass gun seizures on his way to establishing a leftist dictatorship. "Remember, the first step in establishing a dictatorship is to disarm the citizens," warned a March 13 commentary on Jones' website, Prison Planet.

In the wake of Poplawski's alleged murder spree, the killer's friends and family members painted a portrait of a paranoid young man whose worldview was informed almost totally by the kind of conspiratorial themes entertained by Jones. Poplawski's best friend, Edward Perkovic, who also spouted white supremacist rhetoric, told the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review that his friend "grew angry recently over fears Obama would outlaw guns." Poplawski's mother remarked to police investigators that her son targeted cops "because he believed that as a result of economic collapse, the police were no longer able to protect society."

But hysterical warnings of government gun grabs and a socialist takeover of the U.S. are no longer the sole proprietary interest of fringe players like Jones. In the Obama era, Jones' conspiracy theories have graduated to primetime on Fox News. And radicals like Poplawski are tuning in. Indeed, according to the Anti-Defamation League, the alleged killer posted a YouTube clip to Stormfront of top-rated Fox News host Glenn Beck contemplating the existence of FEMA-managed concentration camps. ("He backed out," Poplawski wrote cryptically beside the video.) Three weeks later, Poplawski posted another Youtube clip to Stormfront, this time of a video blogger advocating "Tea Parties," or grassroots conservative protests organized by Beck and Fox News contributor Newt Gingrich (see here and here) against President Barack Obama's bailout plan.


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Max Blumenthal is a senior writer for The Daily Beast and writing fellow at The Nation Institute, whose book, Republican Gomorrah (Basic/Nation Books), is forthcoming in Spring 2009. Contact him at maxblumenthal3000@yahoo.com.
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See more stories tagged with: glenn beck, sean hannity, max blumenthal, alex jones, max blumenthal daily beas, richard poplawski, stormfront, pittsburgh murder, pittsburgh police murder, tea parties, prison planet, new world order, gun grab, david neiwert, andrew napolitano, one world government

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If he was 14, would you blame Marylyn Manson?
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Honky the Nihilist... on Apr 8, 2009 12:16 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
So Tea-Parties are bad but “Fast-Rising Protest Group Challenges the Outrageous Power of the Bankers” gets its link in Alternet? Gottcha.

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» There is a HUGE difference... Posted by: JoshuaLudd
» And by the way Posted by: Aimleft

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KBR awarded Homeland Security contract worth up to $385M
[Report this comment]
Posted by: LeftWright on Apr 8, 2009 12:33 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
By Katherine Hunt
Last update: 12:19 p.m. EST Jan. 24, 2006

SAN FRANCISCO (MarketWatch) -- KBR, the engineering and construction subsidiary of Halliburton Co., said Tuesday it has been awarded a contingency contract from the Department of Homeland Security to supports its Immigration and Customs Enforcement facilities in the event of an emergency. The maximum total value of the contract is $385 million and consists of a 1-year base period with four 1-year options. KBR held the previous ICE contract from 2000 through 2005. The contract, which is effective immediately, provides for establishing temporary detention and processing capabilities to expand existing ICE Detention and Removal Operations Program facilities in the event of an emergency influx of immigrants into the U.S., or to support the rapid development of new programs, KBR said. The contract may also provide migrant detention support to other government organizations in the event of an immigration emergency, as well as the development of a plan to react to a national emergency, such as a natural disaster, the company said.

I'm no fan of Alex Jones and WOULD NOT recommend his radio show or web sites to anyone, but this KBR contract with DHS is a fact, not a conspiracy theory.

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» Straw man Posted by: brunowe

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Answer: Yes
[Report this comment]
Posted by: zola77 on Apr 8, 2009 12:48 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I know Honky and Pointy will have a problem with this, but it is factual.

It would be hard to make a case that conservative media had no impact on these actions.

Media (of all political persuasions) tends to amp up the paranoia factor in its' audience to draw a crowd. The difference is that conservatives are naturally more prone to fear and are therefore already in a more paranoid mindset.

Sicentific studies suggest that people who identify as politically conservative are by nature/genetically more prone to fear and paranoia. If someone is naturally in such a frame of mind, and then an external source amplifies that - there is inevitably going to be a breaking point.

Here is a link to a series of scientific studies that have taken place on this topic over the years:

linked text

Here is another link from the Washington Post on yet ANOTHER study suggesting that conservatives are less likely to be swayed by factual or rational responses to their views.

Here is the link:

linked text

The combination of these two makes Limbaugh mongering and Coulter mongering a disaster waiting to happen.

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» RE: Answer: Are you high? Posted by: james108
» RE: Answer: Are you high? Posted by: james108
» RE: Answer: Are you high? Posted by: LMNOP
» RE: Answer: Yes Posted by: Lilly
» RE: Answer: Yes Posted by: winthrupt
» winthrup Posted by: zola77
» RE: Answer: Yes Posted by: LTBROWN
» RE: Answer: Yes Posted by: Livemike
» Bell Curvers from the Left Posted by: bubbabuddha

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The First Amendment Still Applies
[Report this comment]
Posted by: DrBrian on Apr 8, 2009 1:16 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
While I agree that raving lunatics can unsettle unstable minds, it would be a mistake to hold that they are responsible for the acts committed by their listeners. Unless they actively promote violence, the First Amendment protects their rights, as it should.

Many of us are increasingly critical of Obama's policies, but even a passionate, vulgar rant stopping short of advocacy of illegal acts shouldn't make the writer liable if some crackpot tries to assassinate him.

It bears some thought that Americans gleefully gave up many of their rights under the First, Fourth, Fifth, Sixth and Eighth Amendments in the name of the War on Terror, but have clung tightly to a bizarre interpretation of the Second--and that is the real culprit.

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» Yes it does. Posted by: brunowe
» ROTFLMAO! Posted by: GuitarBill
» RAV v St Paul Posted by: brunowe

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Did I fall asleep and wake up in the '90s?
[Report this comment]
Posted by: -matti on Apr 8, 2009 1:50 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
All of the Awake notice and reject the manipulation here, yes?

Don't bother "participating" in whatever stupid "discussion" follows, just hold the realization to yourselves and share it with the actual people around you.

We'll see you on the other side.

-matti.

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» No. Posted by: Beck

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Stormfront Opts Out
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Aged Liberal on Apr 8, 2009 1:51 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I tried to look at the posts Poplawski supposedly made at Stormfront.org. Apparently Stormfront has removed them.
Hm, I wonder why.

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» RE: Stormfront Opts Out Posted by: EscargencyResearch

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Escargency
[Report this comment]
Posted by: EscargencyResearch on Apr 8, 2009 2:30 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Wessels are nescessary because the Schafflongkerraz Wessel,captured in 1947 ROSWELL BASE -Area 51,as they are transported by these Flight-personell wessels are absolutely nescessary for fighting crimes and war-lords all over this planet.....
To keep peace in this world,somebody need to do the job,therefore these wessels are absolutely nescessary-these are the worlds of the Messenger-the man who in his 18-years 1974,saw the picture taken by Marija BERNADETTE Peraic-Kroatic Girl-in 1968 was she in Los Angeles,14 years of age,travelcompanion to a bulgarian woman 24-26 years,Journalist-Student by Sofia High School-Bulgaria-with her 14-year charm,successfully took a picture on Robert Francis Kennedy,thus in a moment of stress-he was attacked by two assasines-one from the front=Sirhaan-Sirhaan,and one from behind,Swedish Police-officer,son of H.Goering and Actress Gaby Stenberg-Koch.The Picture(colour) clearly shows that Walther Evert Wilhelm Kegoe-born 26 nov 1945-took a shoot upwards right side of Roberts neck,and thus inflicting lethal injuries to the brain and lifesupporting biological system.
Thomas Escargency Kallmyr-SWEDEN-Uddevalla City

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» RE:A true LUNATIC Posted by: mcyclemama
» RE: scargency Posted by: vioibi

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The 4th Estate had a fire sale
[Report this comment]
Posted by: weathered on Apr 8, 2009 2:33 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
on 9/11 and integrity went up in smoke.

As long as we continue to Lie to ourselves we'll remain as sick as our secrets.

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» RE: Google hot spots Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» marvin did it! Posted by: techcafe
» Waterboard Silverstein Posted by: weathered
» RE: Waterboard Silverstein Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Waterboard Silverstein Posted by: weathered
» RE: Waterboard Silverstein Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Waterboard Silverstein Posted by: weathered
» Great post, arraya! Posted by: LeftWright

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Perish the thought!
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Perry Logan on Apr 8, 2009 2:49 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Of course not. Ceaseless streams of violent rhetoric from unhinged white males has a proven beneficial effect on all listeners. :)

True, the violent crime rate went down for eight straight years under Bill Clinton, then started going up under George W. Bush. But this is mere coincidence.

As for Alex Jones, his fans go off their chumps at regular intervals:

Bohemian Grove intruder says he feared human sacrifices

Richard McCaslin planned a heavily armed assault on the exclusive Bohemian Grove men's club for more than a year, believing "it would take something dramatic" to draw attention to human sacrifices he feared were being held there.
National Press Club Emblem - Same as Bohemian Grove

National Press Club
was established in Washington DC in 1908, soon after elites and journalists on the West Coast established the Bohemian Club. Membership includes "news makers" in addition to news reporters, including 17 consecutive Presidents of the United States. Most have lectured in the Club's restaurant, and both Carter and Reagan announced their candidacies for president. Mystical symbolism in NPC's logo reveal influence from Bohemian Grove's Owl Shrine and Illuminati's illuminated rays of sunlight.
Bohemian Grove Dirt

In a jailhouse interview Monday night, the well-spoken, lucid and clean-shaven man said he "wanted to make a point" and was prepared to kill people at the Monte Rio resort if necessary..

McCaslin, 37, is being held in the mental health ward of the Sonoma County Jail, facing several felony charges stemming from his commando-like entry into the grove this weekend...

His fears of the alleged events were based on a videotape put out a few years ago by radio host Alex Jones, who claims on his Web site that "bizarre, Luciferian ceremonies" occur there.


PS: The newly-renamed planet Xe

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» RE: Perish the thought! Posted by: johnwinthrop
» RE: I'll cry for you... Posted by: Cybershaman
» Oprah cries Posted by: BlueTigress
» RE: Perish the thought! Posted by: aussidawg
» Waterboard Silverstein Posted by: weathered
» Behold the mind of an Israeli Posted by: weathered
» Waterboard Silverstein Posted by: weathered

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You call Jones right wing?? He is the only journalist to blame 9/11 on Bush.
[Report this comment]
Posted by: pfgetty on Apr 8, 2009 2:55 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If Alex Jones does anything right, it is that he has consistently and honestly blamed the Bush administration for 9/11. I call this journalistic integrity. That he also goes for Obama also is proof that he isn't controlled by the left right paradigm and looks to find the truth and not just support his political party.
He certainly isn't right wing, which Alternet is trying to portray.

But here we have Alternet criticizing Alex Jones, but Alex Jones is the only journalist I know with a major following who is not afraid to bring out the truth about 9/11. Alternet, on the other hand, has censored any mention of what really happened that day. Seven and a half years and not one decent article on the evidence that proves that the official story is a lie. Piles of evidence sits to prove it, and is presented by David Ray Griffin and Kevin Ryan and Steven Jones and Richard Gage and others, all ignored. So which journalists are really the ones who are shaping the news to fit their agenda? And why is Alternet doing this? We don't know. They won't tell us.
And so people have to go to Alex Jones to get the truth, the only journalist brave enough to broadcast 9/11 truth to millions.
Thanks, Alex, for standing up for truth.

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» RE: Thanks Posted by: solrev
» I agree Posted by: LMNOP
» RE: I agree Posted by: pfgetty
» ;-) Posted by: GuitarBill
» RE: ;-) Posted by: arraya
» In defense of Alternet Posted by: linecrosser
» RE: In defense of Alternet Posted by: weathered

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No selfresponsibility anymore?
[Report this comment]
Posted by: johnwinthrop on Apr 8, 2009 4:04 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
everytime a depressed or unemployed person kills more than one other person, the progressive or even msm decides society or even worse, Rush Limbaugh, is to blame. Whatever happened to personal responsibility? Whatever happened to do unto others, etc.?

Whatever happened to clear and convincing evidence, and not irresponsible tactics in political debate?

Articles like this remind of...well..something Sean Hannity might say in connection with why teen girls get pregnant. They read about sex in Cosmo.

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» Hey, he's one of your guys Posted by: ReallyBearish
» Been there Done that Posted by: linecrosser

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Personal responsibility
[Report this comment]
Posted by: BeckyD on Apr 8, 2009 4:20 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Your article teaser ties this guy to Glenn Beck and then almost the whole article is about Alex Jones with a few references to Beck thrown in. Very credible. Blaming any of these talk show hosts for this shooter's actions is ridiculous. Millions of people listen to right wing talk. How many of them shoot people? Obviously, it's the shooter's fault. To say otherwise is to head down a road that leads to censorship.

And yes, Beck mentioned the alleged FEMA camps. He also debunked them over two nights on his TV show with the head of Popular Mechanics. I know people involved in the tea party movement locally. They're not mindless ranting dittoheads - they're housewives and business people and parents who are outraged at the amount of money our government is spending, borrowing and printing. And frankly, as the bumper sticker says, anyone who isn't outraged, isn't paying attention.

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More people need to see what the Right-Wing is attempting to do!!
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Ninure on Apr 8, 2009 4:33 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
How many more people are going to die because of the Right-wing talking heads? Will they only be taken as the dangers they are when there is an all-out civil war?

BTW: I real do wish you'd use the "share" thingie that would allow tjose of us who use MySpace to share this there.


This is an excellent article, and needs to be hared as widely as possible.

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» RE: Let's see... Posted by: Cybershaman
» RE: Let's see... Posted by: lenioui

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Foreknowledge=Culpability=1st degree Murder
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Purple Girl on Apr 8, 2009 4:36 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Right Wing mouthpieces KNOWS exactly WHO they are inciting and for WHAT purpose. Timothy McVeigh, Kazinski,Ruby Ridge? Waco, Jonestown,Charlie Manson? Atlanta Oylmpics,Clinic bombings, MD assasinations,..
they know exactly What groups lurk inside their 'tent'- Radical Relgious extremeist, Neo Nazi's, and paranoid schizophrenics...History exposes their Rooster of followers.
Liberals gave up violent means for change after the Vietnam war era. It was evident that such crimal acts were countreproductive and needlessly dangerous to innocent people.
I don't fear the 6ft Dialysis patient hanging out in some cozy villa- I'm terrified of the Right wing,, Neo Nazi, Gun Toting, End of Dayer living down the Street was been ignited by their Deciever 'Pastors' , their Treasonous party leaders and the complicit Propagandaist.
These media and Political figures claim that they have no respsonbility for the actions take by their followers is as legitmate as me telling a cop I had no idea handing my 2 yr old a loaded gun could result in his death.Just because I didn't aim and pull the trigger does not mean I am not culpable in his murder. It's called Precedence- A ponderance of Historical evidence readily available to accurately determine the risk and thus an outcome. Why do you think it is Illegal to scream 'Fire' in a theatre when none exists? Historical Events have proven it endangers peoples lives.
These media and Politicans are not just inciting murder & suicide,But to an even greater extent ,violent insurrection,aka Treason.Bachmans call for people to become 'Armed and Dangerous' is evidential enough to bring charges.

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» we should Posted by: Juven
» wonderful point Posted by: Juven

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BA
[Report this comment]
Posted by: mnstra on Apr 8, 2009 4:42 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Though your article does point to a connection to how suggestive minds can be influenced to kill by talk radio. Its always the Killer who bears true responsibility. Never think for a min that talk radio made him do it.Right wing radio, however is pure trash , it does preach violence and rape. You would be better off putting you ear to a can full of garbage than to even tune to the Glen Becks of the world for even a second, They are so toxic Neal Bortz and company that in an earlier time would be kicked off the air. BUt they do not influence a person to murder. You give them too much credit and that is dangerous--Also Why are we not hearing about attacks or shootings of bankers And AIG ec=xcs?

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» RE: I just can't buy that. Posted by: Cybershaman

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Elitists like Blumenthal....
[Report this comment]
Posted by: okcsteve on Apr 8, 2009 5:35 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
...have been totally ignoring progressive movements in the bible belt for too long. It is time to pay attention to them, build up support, and get this country back on track.
We've been bombarded by hate radio, heritage foundation types, etc...and the Blumenthal's of the world have just sat back and made a career of it. It is disgusting to me.
I worked in downtown OKC during the bombing, and was almost as Right as McVeigh at the time! I was lucky enough to move to Boston later, meet prof. Chomsky, and wake up to reality. Got no help here from anyone...

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Alex Jones is Right Wing?
[Report this comment]
Posted by: ericthefoolish on Apr 8, 2009 6:11 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Wow, what a horrible article. It just shows that Max has no clue what so ever about who and what Alex Jones does.

Where were you about 4 months ago when Jones was railing the Bush administration. Railing Cheney, Rumsfeld, Gonzalez, Rice, and others. He has been smashing Glenn Beck, Rush, Hannity and others because they are liars.

How do you get a job mr. blumenthal. You don't even deserve capital letters.

My favorite is all the "liberals" here that follow lockstep with whatever is fed to them. Instead of going out and reading up, doing fact checking, and finding out for themselves, they elect to accept the "news" and regretfully swallow the blue pill.

None of you think for yourselves. None of you do any research concerning any of these issues. Its all left -vs- right. You all fall for this game, and you have no clue who is on the side of freedom. Instead, you bicker about O'Reilly, bicker about Rush, and bicker about Glenn Beck...while this ship sinks faster and faster.

Great job fellow fake Americans. You'll need it.

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» RE: Alex Jones is Right Wing? Posted by: pjnaltykins
» RE: Alex Jones is Right Wing? Posted by: ericthefoolish
» RE: Alex Jones is Right Wing? Posted by: ericthefoolish

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Don't click the link, identity theft--I've reported it
[Report this comment]
Posted by: brunowe on Apr 8, 2009 6:32 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Link goes through to a page that facilitates identity theft. He keeps getting banned and coming back with a different nom de scam.

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» Who doea? What link? Posted by: thornwolf

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Seriously dude...
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Ayla87 on Apr 8, 2009 6:41 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Everyone and their mother knows that site you keep linking to embeds key loggers onto computers.

You know you're going to get reported and banned. And you know multiple users are going to remind everyone that you're an identity thief.

So why bother?

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» RE: Seriously dude... Posted by: Sister_Lauren

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Let's Find Out
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Posted by: johnwinthrop on Apr 8, 2009 8:14 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
So wear a badge.

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What if he
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Posted by: Juven on Apr 8, 2009 6:43 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
was just actually looking around him? IS he paranoid?

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Connecting a Neo-Nazi to tea parties is going a little far?
[Report this comment]
Posted by: donnal on Apr 8, 2009 6:45 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
How nice...link a Tea Party to individuals who are killing their familes, police and persons at gathering places. A Tea Party has nothing to do with gun control, gay marriage, faith, or other social issues that are currently in the headlines.

A Tea Party is for our 550+ leaders in DC to stop spending unlimited borrowed money and listen to us the taxpayer. These individuals need to stop spending money, under the premise that all this borrowed money will have a trickle down to where it is needed. It will only bring more debt. This is not about Mr. Obama, its about the debt that will come due and who is going to pay for it?

Fox, Glen Beck, and others did not start this movement, we the citizens have...you know the 20% who take care of the 80%.

It is our right to assemble and let Mr. Obama and Co know that many do not like the direction he and his 550+ pals are taking us down. When I say us, I mean, not only the right, but liberals, business persons, persons of color and not of color, all individuals who want to say stop spending money we do not have.

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» Agree with Deep... Posted by: omatravel

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Killers always exist with or without talk radio.
[Report this comment]
Posted by: WYGunston on Apr 8, 2009 6:53 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As to the gunman, he's fucking up us law abiding gun owners and making it harder for Congress and the White House to push for more gun control laws against us. It's bad enough that Big Brother is getting nastier at wiretapping and fucking the Constitution. Damn those stupid shooters ! They're fucking ruining it for us law abiding gun owners ! I wanna have fun hunting in Cody and building on survival skills for myself, my family, and even my neighbors and the last thing we need is gun control thanks to them motherfucking shooters!

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Tin Foil hats or not Free Speech is Free Speech
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Posted by: HJamesDee on Apr 8, 2009 6:56 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
While I do not condone outwardly calling for violence, I do think that any individual has the right to make their opinion heard. Whether or not not one should make calls to general public via their media soapbox is an ethical question, and the core of this issue.
The interesting thing about this is that people like Jones and Beck are flip sides to more intellectual dissidents like Noam Chompsky. They are trying albeit in a primitive way to voice the sentiment that most of us feel: US elites are making decisions that are taking away our right and liberties, Using aggression against peaceful populations around the world, while privatizing our every action.
Anyone else notice that Obama gave a speech in which he spoke he talked of eliminating Nukes at the same time as he cemented a deal to Put in a missile defense system, or when Amy Goodman was violently arrested during the RNC even though she was clearly wearing a press pass and credentials.
Even if you take off the tinfoil hat the government is up to some shady things, and Jones and Beck are what happens when years of Lies come to boil.
While Beck and Jones are distorting information how far from the truth are they? In terms of ethics their methods are way off. In terms of passion their hearts may be in the right place. They are the products of a censored media state that does allow truth to be told, what else can we expect?

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» RE: If all things were equal Posted by: Cybershaman
» RE: If all things were equal Posted by: HJamesDee
» RE: That's what I do Posted by: Cybershaman

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I still think Bush won and keeps on winning; his fear meme
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Posted by: Beck on Apr 8, 2009 6:57 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
He spun a philosophy of fear, and it appears as though that is a powerful philosophy that spreads fast, mutates like the virus it is, taking whatever form needed to spread throughout various diverse groups. This article was about conservatives, but much of it could describe articles here recently and comments. There now seems little difference between this young killer's fears and the similar paranoia infecting and dividing the rest of us. The following quotes from the article just sound too much like many, if not most, forums nowadays.

". . . the killer's friends and family members painted a portrait of a paranoid young man whose worldview was informed almost totally by the kind of conspiratorial themes entertained by Jones. " Paranoid people almost totally informed by conspiratorial themes. Informed only by others who already think as they do. A self-contained loop of self-fulfilling prophecies. Or rather, prophecies that always APPEAR on the verge of being fulfilled. No prediction ever has to come true, apparently. The thought itself seems as valid as any event.

"Obama may stage crises to bring in martial law." I think I read this right here yesterday. Or something very similar. It comes up quite often.

"And like many members of the far-right fringe, he allegedly visited Jones' Web sites and posted alarming reports by Jones' writers on the white supremacist message board, Stormfront. (Poplawski's posts are here, authored under the handle, "Braced For Fate.") While Alex Jones generally avoids overt racism, he has found an eager audience on Stormfront by conjuring dark visions of an impending New World Order, claiming FEMA is secretly building a national concentration camp network, and announcing that President Barack Obama has planned mass gun seizures on his way to establishing a leftist dictatorship. "Remember, the first step in establishing a dictatorship is to disarm the citizens," warned a March 13 commentary on Jones' website, Prison Planet." Okay, does this REALLY sound different from much of what we now read right here? Change a few words and it fits right in. Posting alarming reports. Dark visions. First steps in establishing dictatorships.

"What it does is unhinge fringe players from reality and dislodges them even further. " And it does more than that. It gives fringe people access to other fringe people, who validate them and reinforce their philosophy. The worst of the fringe combines passion with a worldview that can't admit anything that conflicts with it, or shakes it. Any differing voice is a threat.

Except for liberal and moderate Democrats, much of America now seems run by and motivated by fear and paranoia. Worst, those that do this are proud of it, and disdainful of anyone who instead tries to open up their thinking to new ideas and people they disagree with. Narrowing one's own philosophy seems to be seen as the only valid path. Reaching out from one's own group earns the worst derision of all. Can we really save a bad sitution (bad, but one we refuse to acknowledge is also common throughout history; this sense of the Specialness of our personal and group victimization is another big problem we have that can keep us stuck) through constant refinement and distillation of the point of view we already had to begin with? This is very conservative thinking. They started a very effective virus, an infection the afflicted becomes fond of.

Everything is horrible! It's all about to collapse! We're all about to be completely controlled!

If these kinds of fears are taking up more than a few distracting minutes of your day, and especially if you aren't taking reciprocal action, and ESPECIALLY if you're feeling gratified and superior about all of it, you already are controlled. Our minds are the worst fascists of all.

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Yes, Yes, Yes
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Posted by: Lilly on Apr 8, 2009 7:11 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Did the right-wing media fuel, etc? O God, yes. I feel like Paul Revere, having been posting this for weeks. Go to townhall.com and read what folks are posting. 1) THEY ARE ARMING. They write about gun stores having long lines and empty shelves. They write about burying extra weapons so they'll still have some after "Obama's goons" come to confiscate their guns, an event they definitely expect. They brag about the size of their arsenals. They describe stockpiling ammunition. 2) THEY TAKE THE HIGH MORAL GROUND BY RATIONALIZING VIOLENCE AS PATRIOTISM. They make many references, direct and indirect, to taking up arms against the Obama government, which they perceive as oppressive. They equate their intention with that of our Colonial forefathers. They say "It's time for a second American Revolution". They say "I am angry and I am not going to take it any more".

NOW. Listen to Glenn Beck and Sean Hannity. Probably talk radio too---I don't have convenient access but I read some of the radio talkers who have online articles and they're in the same place. They teach their faithful thus, saying "It's time to rise up" and "I am getting thousands of emails saying that it's time to show the government etc" and "Folks say they will be ready for the Obama's people when they come and who could blame them?". Obama is consistently called a dictator, a spoiler of democracy, a demagogue, and a bringer of Socialism/Communism. Glenn Beck ranted about Obama's "overreaching" while in the background he ran footage of the Nazi army on the march; meaning can be clearly communicated by juxtaposition as well as by allusion, reference, association, and connotation---it doesn't have to be spelled out on the wall.

People, listen to me. I have been analyzing text for fifty years. I understand the English language very well. Pay attention here: the right-wing media are making their bread-and-butter the arousal of American conservative rage, and they are inciting armed insurrection against the Obama government.

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» Treason Posted by: johnwinthrop
» right of revolution Posted by: johnwinthrop
» RE: right of revolution Posted by: Lilly
» Wrong again Plopped it Posted by: brunowe
» RE: Yes, Yes, Yes Posted by: orwellturns
» RE: Yes, Yes, Yes Posted by: Shey

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Alex Jones
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Posted by: rflowers on Apr 8, 2009 7:20 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Obama's administration has publicly released a number of statements regarding their aims for "gun grabs". Check out clips and articles involving Rahm Emanuel, and Eric Holder.

To call Alex Jones an alarmist for referencing what's actually going on, and warning Americans against impending attacks on their constitutional liberties is pretty pretty bad. The 2nd amendment is there for a reason.. Jefferson talks on the matter well, in case you've forgotten.

To deny that the past 8 years' policy have time and time again seemed to be right out of the nazi playbook, is pure and dangerous naivete. The blatant coverup of Reichstag-esque 9/11, the Patriot Act, illegal wiretapping, secret prisons, torture, the appearance of the word "homeland", perpetual fraudulent war, "no-fly lists", PDD51, the expanded rise of the surveillance-industrial complex,
and the finale of writing a blank taxpayer-dollar check to criminal banks under the extortion of Congress and threats of literal martial law.

Yes, it can happen here. And it is. Our inherent Americanness does not magically protect us from fascism as it's classically defined. As it's said, the constitution isn't going to protect itself.
Naomi Wolf's "paranoid" film The End of America, highly recommended.

The biggest agitators here are those who would wish to grab the guns in the first place. They are the ones who lend clear credibility and tie reality directly to these "paranoid" ramblings in the media. And they're the only reason people like Alex Jones are even mentioning it.
And, reportedly, why Poplawski stocked up with an AK47.

When you have a dual-citizen Israeli/US chief of staff talking about removing the 2nd amendment rights from EVERYONE on the list of ever-expanding millions of "maybe possible terrorists", people who haven't been charged with a crime and don't even know they're on it until they try to travel... combined with the blatant controlled demolition of our economy at the hands of international banks with the vast majority of all 3 branches of government nodding along, amidst spiraling lob loss, what do they expect when people completely lose it?

The term "New World Order" has been a recurring phrase from various high profile political and foreign policy heads' own mouths. Jones just attempts to explore what these colorful fellows (ie Kissinger) might actually be talking about.

And yes, FEMA camps exist. There's also legislation presented to build more/legalize them, HR645.

To many Americans it seems the same shadowy guys are still at large the scenes, and have been tag-teaming their assault on the American people and the country's ideals, A right-handed attack under President Bush, with all the GOP sheep looking the other way, and now a combined left-handed attack under Obama, with all the "latte liberals" just still pretty much enjoying the idea of Obama as a generalized messiah. Even as he does the complete opposite of everything he said on the Campaign trail, expands the fraudulent wars, keeps all Bush's transgressions humming and refuses to uphold the law as functional, and appoints failed private banking regulators like Tim Geithner, who do nothing but blow smoke while tinkering with "exotic financial instruments" to send our economy further off the cliff. Fire him now, please.
And please urge your congressmen to cosponsor HR 1207 to audit the private Federal Reserve, if they haven't already.

Alex Jones is 100% nonpartisan by the way.
His film The Obama Deception on youtube. Now going viral with over a million views since it debuted last month. It's perhaps not what you'd think, at least judging from less than intellectually-curious articles such as this one.

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» Thanks Posted by: johnwinthrop
» RE: Alex Jones/A Great American Hero! Posted by: ron heringhauser

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Exploiting the Situation
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Posted by: Gravitas on Apr 8, 2009 7:33 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I think it is just as much a stretch to blame people like Alex Jones as it is for conservatives to blame liberals for unplanned pregnancy. This guy was unstable. If you research hard enough, he was probably an antidepressants.

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» RE: xploiting the Situation Posted by: johnwinthrop

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What goes around comes around
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Posted by: BlueTigress on Apr 8, 2009 7:37 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I've seen people on the Left saying 9/11 was a Bush & Co. inside job for years now.

Others say the FEMA camps were constructed to hold protesters when Bush declared martial law.

So the game's the same, but only the players change?

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» Israel's FedEx to America Posted by: weathered

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left/right, black/white, we're in a grey world...
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Posted by: cubist on Apr 8, 2009 7:56 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Just because someone was against Bush does not make him a liberal. Bat Buchanan was against Bush, the Iraq war, and the Patriot Act, yet he considers himself a conservative and a libertarian. The old labels and old divisions don't apply any more. We are a mixed society with overlapping views and opinions. Left/Right, Republican/Democrat... these are such 20th century labels.

I agree with the comment above that people -- left, right, progressive, conservative, socialist, anarchist -- need to start getting their information from multiple sources. We have the greatest access to any information we want with the internet. Yet most people just go to the same sites that confirm what they already believe.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/19/opinion/19kristof.html

Yes, visit the sites you like and agree with. But then go somewhere else, read what other people with other views have to say. And then go even further to places you'd never consider going. View every event, every situation from as many perspectives and points of view as possible.

Then make up your own mind.

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No, There's More
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Posted by: Lilly on Apr 8, 2009 8:04 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
They're not just outraged about the money. Go read townhall.com for an hour or two. Posters there believe that Obama is a ruthless dictator who intends to destroy democracy and substitute Communism, unless he first delivers us up to his Muslim brothers. They also expect their guns to be confiscated by Obama. They believe that resisting him, by violence if necessary (and they darkly hint that violence is in the offing) will be an act of patriotism. True, ever since Reagan the American people have been carefully taught that taxation is theft and that government is evil, but this is something new, and it's not just about money. Not at all. You are talking about a population that resents all forms of authority, everything from helmet laws and no-smoking rules to government regulation of the SEC and our food supply. The Right does not want a strong central government, and they want business to do anything it wants to. Obama would now take away the Reaganesque laissez-faire attitude toward business and would give government more clout, and the right-wingers are reacting to this by going crazy and peeing in their pants and running around screaming. This is not just about money.

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» RE: No, There's More Posted by: johnwinthrop
» Was Reagan an anarchist? Posted by: tjg1984

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Strange Bedfellows
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Posted by: jal64 on Apr 8, 2009 8:09 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"It's always been a problem when major league demagogues start promulgating false information for political gain,"

Reading this quote makes me wonder if the author is referring to Jackson or Sharpton or Wright

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the Daily Beast?! What is this article REALLY about?
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Posted by: waterflaws on Apr 8, 2009 8:12 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
First, the Daily Beast seems to be as right-wing as Fox/Newscorp. I gagged when the Daily Beast put Tucker Carlson on their "front page" for his restaurant recommendations for those attending Obama's inauguration. Or what about The Beast's calling W. "a simple Texas rancher", or their complaints about the cost of the inauguration?

Second, is this a hit piece against Alex Jones or "Fox News's Glenn Beck and right-wing radio?" I too, a socialism-leaning anti-zionist (but not anti-semite) non-gun-owning climate-change-believing gay man, read Alex Jones' Info Wars articles. I never watch/read Fox, and only rarely believe what I see/read on CNN, or the Daily Beast (which is just another corporate media outlet). The Anti-Defamation League is almost as bad as AIPAC.

What gives? This article had less information about the shooter than it did Alex Jones. Is it that you hate Jones for his, evidence-based, position on 9/11 (which I share).

BJ
naked agression, naked imperialism and naked capitalism. The empire has new clothes.

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» Right On, waterflaws!!! (n/t) Posted by: LeftWright

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Max Gets It
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Posted by: BobKincaid on Apr 8, 2009 8:59 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Alex Jones is a charlatan; the political equivalent of a faith-healer. The reason he easily shifts from objecting to the Bush Admin to objecting to the Obama Admin has nothing whatsoever to do with being a "journalist." It has to do with being a very clever marketer. He's keeping his gig alive.

Remember when all the rock n' roll acts tried their hands at disco in the late 70s and then took a run at "New Wave" a few years later? That's Alex Jones. If Ron Paul or Dennis Kucinich were elected president, Alex Jones would be ready with another of his self-promotional "documentaries" promising that either one was a tool of the Bohemian Grove/taking us to OneWorld Government/a closet IslamoCommunoFascistMarxistMaoist.

For heaven's sake! It's his schtick. That so many can't see that is amazing to me.

The larger isssue, i.e. the degree to which Jones, Beck, Limbaugh, Hannity, SavageWeiner, et al. weaponize the weak-minded is very well documented by Max Blumenthal and others. Ginning up conflict over manufactured fears is a time-tested money maker for the right-wing, from Father Coughlin forward. Because the ravings of right-wing broadcasters are sufficiently attenuated from the end results, they can always plead "that guy was insane" or "I'm only an entertainer" or rationalize it in some other weasely fashion.

Right wing media are snakes, and behave accordingly. Why in heaven's name are we surprised when they don't behave like fuzzy little bunnies?

America's Liberal Voice

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» RE: Max Gets It Posted by: uncleeddie

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Only the blind and deaf.
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Posted by: linecrosser on Apr 8, 2009 9:05 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Only the blind and deaf, or those who are in or for the "One world Government" would deny any of the conspiracy theories. For reasons I don't understand the population in general wants to hold those who achieve, influential status, up as examples of perfection, even in the face of glaring facts to the contrary. Maybe it's because we want to believe that if any of us were in such a position we would behave like a decent human. But they don't, never have, never will. Maybe it's our limited definition of conspiracy. Never mind what Blacks Law, Webster or Oxford dictionary says it means. The public understands it to be limited to three guys planning a robbery or drug deal. Even just being in the room where such crimes are discussed will make you part of the conspiracy and then prosecutable for being part of it, even if no actions came from the discussion. Now don't you all just feel a little bit guilty of something, remember high school, talking about skipping school friday, your guilty. World conquest has been the goal of any self respecting government. The wise ones realized it is better and easier to do it from the inside. That a, one world government, needs to be set up very slowly, over several generations. Control the resources, education, money, media, military and it offspring the police. Bush gave away our borders by signing the North American Union, and Obama gave away the control of all business at the G20 conference. We have abandoned, our children's future. Imagine a knock at your door, and three well dressed men, one you recognized, as a local TV news anchor. You invite them in and send the children to their rooms or outside to play, so the adults can talk. As the visitors sit you notice a badge and gun on their belts. In short order they explain that what you seeing going on in the world was planned before you were born. That those in control, want more, so they are going to take everything you have worked for and also going to force your children to pay for the rest of the meaningless lives. If you resist the ones with the guns will place you under arrest and take your children into custody. You want to call 911 and have the invaders arrested but then you realize 911 is in on the conspiracy. Yes folks, the conspiracy theories are true. And were all F&^*#@

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Double Standard?
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Posted by: Marshalldoc on Apr 8, 2009 9:14 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I find it interesting that, when discussing the roots of Muslim terrorism, there's no question that so-called 'radical islamist imams' are central to the motivation and justification of terrorism, but when the question of whether similar authority figures from the right-wing advocate similar views & actions for their adherents, it's suddenly a "question" worthy of intense debate.

Similarly, none of the reports of right-wingnuts going 'postal', despite the frequent targeting of identifiable ethnic or religious groups, are described as terrorism nor are they treated as a national epidemic worthy of the Joint Terrorism Task Force's attentions. However, were the same number of similar attacks in this country to have been perpetrated by Muslims, can anyone doubt that the hue and cry for massive arrests, prosecutions/persecutions, and imprisonments from the 'law-abiding' citizens would be overwhelming and unstoppable?

Yet, when one compares the number of people killed, wounded, and terrorized in the U.S. by right-wing gun nuts to the number of people killed by American Muslims the risk to our safety comes not from Muslims in America (sorry Brigitte Gabriel, Daniel Pipes, & David Horowitz), but from right-wing, Christian 'patriots' and their delusional responses to manufactured "threats" to their warped concepts of "American Values".

So, who are the real terrorists and why don't we alter our politics to address the authentic threat to American freedoms & safety?

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» Excellent point! Posted by: BobKincaid
» RE: Double Standard? Posted by: rickiey

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The gift that keeps on giving - left wing media!
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Posted by: 2thepoint on Apr 8, 2009 9:19 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The left doesn't get it. It;s not conservative radio hosts that drive these people to insanity..

They already insane.

But if one were to buy into the theory that someone can change an ordinary person into a killer, then the alarmist voices of left wing nut jobs like Olbermann and his type, who is constantly critical of this country and call for taking away rights of citizens, giving our social security to illegals, giving welfare to gitmo terrorists, threaten to change our nation into a socialist heaven, maybe THAT is what drives these nuts to more insanity!

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» Read what you wrote, knuckle dragger Posted by: ReallyBearish

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Richard Poplawski
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Posted by: aonghus36 on Apr 8, 2009 9:34 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Richard Poplawski hated Alex Jones because the latter condemns racism. Alex Jones is not racist, Stormfront notwithstanding. Also, there are plenty of left wingers that believe in conspiracy theories, too. It is not just right wing thing.

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» Huh? Posted by: BobKincaid
» RE: Huh? Posted by: aonghus36
» RE: ichard Poplawski Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: ichard Poplawski Posted by: aonghus36
» the fringe Posted by: techcafe
» RE: the fringe Posted by: aonghus36
» RE: the fringe Posted by: Shey

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Alternet lost credability
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Posted by: alternetisbull on Apr 8, 2009 9:46 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
How stupid dose this site think we are.

911 was an inside job no media will talk aobut it just alex jones and he is getting attacked.

They want all truth wiped out.

if you don't belive 911 was an inside job then go get steel poor some jet fuel on it and tell me that it will melt.

how stupid are the poeple to belive this crap

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» RE: Alternet lost credability Posted by: alternetisbull
» RE: Alternet lost credability Posted by: 2thepoint
» RE: Alternet lost credability Posted by: Just My Opinion
» RE: Alternet lost credability Posted by: uncleeddie
» RE: Alternet lost credability Posted by: uncleeddie
» RE: Alternet lost credability Posted by: 2thepoint
» Dr. Foo: "'Squibs', Reg?" Posted by: GuitarBill
» I respectfully disagree, arraya Posted by: LeftWright

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CIA created muslim extremest google it!!!!!!!!!!!
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Posted by: alternetisbull on Apr 8, 2009 10:25 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
left right is fake

only slavery and freedom

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» Who created who? Posted by: 2thepoint

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Jones' side of the Blumenthal story
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Posted by: aonghus36 on Apr 8, 2009 10:25 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
His response to it, as written by Kurt Nimmo at Jone's infowars site is here, for those interested in both sides of the story,
http://tiny.cc/dz9Vf

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This author simply has a hard on for A. J.
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Posted by: Zed1961 on Apr 8, 2009 10:32 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
.....which seems to be the real subject this article. I considered myself to be far left liberal and I can state that in following Alex Jones the last few years he has never espoused a far right wing stance ever. The guy simply is about conveying factual information about issues that the MSM ( including Alternet ) hasn't shown the cajones/integrity to expose. This article reads more like a smear piece on Alex Jones than what the subject in t's title advertises. Alternet clearly reveals itself a gatekeeper for the elite much as Noam Chomsky has.

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» schills for Jones Posted by: techcafe
» RE: schills for Jones Posted by: aonghus36

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Poplawski was an Alex Jones critic, not supporter.
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Posted by: andydandyguy on Apr 8, 2009 11:48 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I'm disappointed with Alternet and this article because it makes it seem as if this guy was an Alex Jones supporter and that the Alex Jones Show somehow "fueled" this guy's psychosis. This is completely irresponsible journalism considering the fact that Poplawski posted only 3 comments on Jones' website that were CRITICAL of Jones because Jones doesn't blame Zionism and the Jews for the state of the world. So not only is this article misleading but it also uses the same faulty logic if I were to say that J.D. Salinger was partly responsible for the murder of John Lennon because Mark David Chapman was obsessed with "the Catcher in the Rye."

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Sue Him Alex
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Posted by: uncleeddie on Apr 8, 2009 12:07 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Max Blumenthal should be sued for his libelous accusations. The shooter was opposed to Alex Jones and if so called liberals think that visiting a web site can drive a person to kill then maybe they need to take a closer examination at themselves and their own level of brainwashing. Alex Jones is a TRUE American and at the leading edge of the movement to save the Constitution and thereby America itself. Go to WWW.INFOWARS.COM and start deprograming yourself as soon as you can. It's not right vs left but the CONSTITUTION STUPID. As long as the constitution and freedom are protected then we can go on forever arguing about whose dog (right or left) is bigger.

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They get nuttier every day.
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Posted by: hedgewytch on Apr 8, 2009 12:29 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Where was the protests from these guys when Bush and CHENEY were setting all this up? They were fine with all the secret contracts for FEMA camps, the slashing and burning of our Constitutional rights. Didn't seem to hit their radar then. Now that a black, liberal man is President, all of a sudden their terrified it will be used against them. Do these people live in hampster balls or what??

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» RE: They get nuttier every day. Posted by: aonghus36
» RE: They get nuttier every day. Posted by: winthrupt

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As much as Hostess Twinkies fueled Dan White's murder of Harvey Milk!
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Posted by: slugsucker on Apr 8, 2009 12:41 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Seriously Blumenthal, get a f**in' grip! The dude was just a plain old kook. Far right, far left, it doesn't matter. Nucking futs, is just that, nothing more!

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Alex Jones is not a friend to the 9/11 truth movement
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Posted by: cplot on Apr 8, 2009 12:46 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
From what I see, Jones appears to be on a mission to associate the 9/11 truth movement with more right-wing and more lunatic fringe conspiratorial views. My sense is that any plan to bring down the WTC with thermite would have to have a thorough muddy the waters plan in place and implemented both before the actual event and after. The left would be the most likely to see the truth about 9/11 and so by associating it with these right-wing extremist views, Jones makes the truth about 9/11 seem dirty and immoral.

On the other hand I think we see Obama clearly associated with this right wing regime as well: offering only window dressing liberal changes yet still supporting the Patriot Act, Warrantless wiretaps, the permanent authorization of war, escalation of drone assassinations, etc.

Jones and Fox News are clearly trying to instigate these crazed attacks on police and others because such attacks on police falsely justify even greater powers of the authoritarian government.

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"Will No One Rid Me Of This Tiresome Priest?"
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Posted by: Lilly on Apr 8, 2009 12:47 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Whether suggested violence is the responsibility of the person suggesting it is an old question, not always resolved in the same way. In 1170 the King of England, frustrated with Thomas Becket, Archbishop of Canterbury, said, "Will no one rid me of this tiresome priest?" and several of the King's men reacted by murdering the Archbishop at the altar of the Cathedral. In 1993 followers of the "Blind Sheik" in New York attacked the World Trade Center; the Sheik was later held responsible and jailed. Now we have certain preachers giving the go-ahead to gay-bashers; a couple of years ago we had the same thing vis-a-vis Hispanic immigrants. And we have Glenn Beck, whose defenders continue to exculpate him for rousing the rabble to violence. Beck is like a nasty little girl who creates mayhem among her friends and then makes her eyes big as she mouths her innocence: "What did I say? All I said was...".

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I'm Troubled By Liberals Back Banning Radio Hosts Over This
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Posted by: mikeblack on Apr 8, 2009 1:11 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I don't think conservative talk show hosts should be blamed for this. I don't believe anybody can incite you to murder, you have it in your heart to do it or you don't. The guy was mentally ill and that had everything to do with it. Millions of people listen to muck-raking conservative talk show hosts a day and don't kill anybody.

And I'm troubled by fellow liberals who are jumping on the "ban right-winged hate talk radio before more murders happen!" because 18 years ago they (rightly) said Ice-T's "Cop Killer" wouldn't drive anybody to shoot a cop and 10 years ago (rightly) said Marilyn Manson didn't make Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold shoot up Columbine. What's the difference between Ice-T and Marilyn Manson and Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity and the rest? I think Alex Jones is just as much a full of shit cartoon character as Marilyn Manson was.

It really bothers me when fellow liberals make exceptions to their passionate defending of the 1st amendment when it's something that offends them. If you want to take a hardline stance on it, you've got to go all the way. You can't say "Well, I liked Natural Born Killers, Marilyn Manson and Doom so I'll say that didn't incite violence at Columbine, but Alex Jones and Glenn Beck offend me so we've got to use this opportunity to stop them." I can't stand right-winged radio idiots, but I'll defend their right to be idiots on the radio with my entire being. Because once you shut someone down that personally offends you it snowballs because somebody somewhere is offended by anything.

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» RE: I'm Troubled By Liberals Posted by: YogiBear

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Alex Jones..overrated,historically wildly inaccurate, and intellectually flabby.
[Report this comment]
Posted by: BlueGorilla on Apr 8, 2009 2:00 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As a UK vissitor to US politics sites,from right to left wing,I have never quite understood the appeal of Alex Jones.
The first time I ever heard him,he was banging on,making historically inaccurate comments about us Brit's,on Jon Ronson's The Secret Ruler's Of The World telly series.
Jone's made some crazy,wild and inaccurate semi-jokes,about us being turnip eating peasant's tied to a feudal mentality.
Of course that type of dullard exist's in Britain (primarily a few dim cockney's who think the Queen Mam was an angel come to earth ,as opposed to a gin sozzled racist,leaching off the site),such a view ignored the post war militancy and trade union agitation which was the scourge of our elite's.We got a welfare state...where was America's eh Jonesy !?We didn't kow tow to the privatisation hegemonic agenda either..in fact as a country,we were a lot more democratic and sussed than post-MacCarthyite America.
That isn't to belittle America,a country burgeoning with great idea's and a huge and dissapointed progressive rump.
No I merely point out Jones's unimpressive analysis of history,economics and society.In short he wouldn't last a second, with a more able thinker like the libertarian socialist Tony Benn,and he'd be torn to pieces by a Jesse Jackson.
It's not easy to place Jones' type on a left-right spectrum though,he has had Noam Chomsky on his show,and seemed to be in tune with Chomsky's anarchistic thinking re US elite's.Jones see's himself as acting in the tradition of US libertarian's..and of course his support at the last US election was for the small state Republican Ron Paul.
Ultimately this libertarianism,is inadequate,and misses the point that to have true freedom there must be a fairer distribution of wealth,decent pensions,welfare,quality public housing and an education system which provides as much opportunity to the children of the poorest (not the poor..there is no excuse for structured poverty,in any modern civilised state).
Such progress involves the state,and an injection of that particular ideology "socialism"which anti-historical Jones finds so fearful..and yawn unAmerican.
It is because of his lack of real analysis,that Jones can make sweeping statements about socialist conspiracies.No one with any nous,see's any elite's about to implemnet such a world order..it is not in their interest's,it never has been,and is anti-thetical to them.
Jones has a right to put out his poor quality views across the airwaves..but one must ask..why are station owners,commercial supporter's etc opposed to left wing radio hosts?Why are left wing respondent's cut off ,more often than right winger's trying to voice their views..that is no democracy.
As for this murdering paranoid dickhead,yes Jones et al fed his paranoia's..but that is as much a problem of the lack of opposing views,to the low common,usually right wing denominators..and can't be laid too much at the door of Jones,who is a symptom,more than a cause..as is the murderer.
Bring back 20/20 and democratise the media,which is currently ruling over a Murdochracy ..run by too many billionaire's with propagandist interests,and anti-democratic intent.

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» RE:Stupidity. Posted by: winthrupt
» cockroaches Posted by: techcafe
» RE: cockroaches Posted by: winthrupt

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WE GIVE THEM TOO MUCH CREDIT
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Posted by: VZEQICVA on Apr 8, 2009 2:39 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
While the crazies on the far right fuel the fire, it's a lazy way out to blame them for everything. Serial killers are almost aways deeply disturbed and have a history of serious mental illness. And yet they are allowed to buy guns. Did any of you see the letter he mailed two days before he murdered all those people he didn't even know? It ended with 'have a nice day'. To hang this on nutcases on the radio is to sweep it under the rug. Thanks, ANNA

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If radio had not existed in the 20's, Hitler and the Nazi
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Posted by: abusedbypenguins on Apr 8, 2009 2:51 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
party would never had gotten as far as they did. They appealed to the average persons fear and exploited it. It was the Jews and immigrants fault that Germany was in the bad shape that it was in. In the 21st century it is liberals and the new world order. Same song, different tune.

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Idiots don't know about 911
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Posted by: alternetisbull on Apr 8, 2009 3:15 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This is for the stupid fools that think 911 was a collapse.

http://www.ae911truth.org/

Architects and engineers for truth learn about a controlled demolition and fire damage collapse.

Get steel set it on fire at the top. Then watch it fall at free fall speed to the ground.
If you believe that fire damage collapses like demolition then you are either a paid disinfo agent that spreads complete bullshit or you are a complete idiot.

Once you learn about the controlled demolition then you can learn about how CIA runs alqueda for geopolitical reasons. Watch this movie and you will see a mountain of evidence about pre existing knowledge about the attacks and the many many many connections the piolets had to the FBI, CIA.

Here is the movie. Wake up real people. Disinfo agents can eat shit.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2144933190875239407

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think ...
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Posted by: winthrupt on Apr 8, 2009 3:21 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There are 306,176,591 people in the US. The people you are talking about have millions of listeners. Are you suggesting they should not be allowed to express their concerns because one person heard them an that person killed people? How do we know he didn't read one of your articles and it effected him is some way? For that matter, how do we know he didn't pass you on the street and it effected him in a negative way? How many people are killed because of romantic relationships each year? Would you suggest that no one should ever become involved in a romantic relationship ever again? The best way for us to prevent this kind of thing from ever happening again is for none of us to ever do anything again.

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» RE: think ... Posted by: Lilly
» RE: think ... Posted by: winthrupt
» RE: think ... Posted by: mikeblack
» RE: think ... Posted by: winthrupt
» RE: think ... Posted by: ericthefoolish

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too bad
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Posted by: dealmeinfo2 on Apr 8, 2009 4:31 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Its very unfortunate that things like this happen. However I dont think the programs would of made a difference for this guy. There are millions of listeners to radio programs and you dont see many going nuts.



---------------------------------------------------
calculator for mortgage payment

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» RE: too bad Posted by: Chaos Inc.

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gun control laws exempt all gov.employees in all depts
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Posted by: LillianB on Apr 8, 2009 5:05 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Maybe the shooter read the new gun law bill that Exempts all government employees in all agencies and departments and does not hold these government employees libel for any actions as a result of this exemption (Sec 801 in HR 45). They are also free to search homes or businesses that May have firearms.Did you know that government jobs are boomimg? Or that in South Carolina, according to their newspaper, they are specifically seeking black police officers to hire?
Castro was successful in closing down all opposition media but it didn't keep people from trying to escape.

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DO HUFFPO, MSNBC, CBS, ALTERNET, AND DAILYKOS FUEL THE THOUSANDS OF INNER CITY MURDERS IN US?
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Posted by: EagleX on Apr 8, 2009 5:49 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
cause they sure ain't watching and listening to beck, limbaugh, hannity, and fox news.

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This comment has been removed from the site due to non-compliance with AlterNet's community policies.

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Where does this leave us?
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Posted by: YogiBear on Apr 8, 2009 7:33 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What's the follow through here? Is the point of raising this issue to not only dismember second ammendment rights, but limit free speech as well?

What did Galadriel say in the Lord of the Rings, were she, and the forces of good, to gain ultimate power? "I would be beautiful ... and terrible."

There can be no freedom unless even the sickest among us are assumed the same rights we have. There are probably tens of thousands of people in this country who are one tick away from going psycho. What kind of state do we need to have to keep them from doing so? A totalitarian one, or an understanding one? We're clearly failing at something here, but lets not rush to remake the constitution before we try other alternatives.

I think a little bit of a social safety net wouldn't hurt these days. Universal healthcare would help ease some pain. A real discussion on the future of jobs in this country; not the claptrap we get from both sides about how safe tech jobs are. And there must be other avenues not tied to going after the constitution with a machete.

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Conspiracy Theories and Far-Right Disinformation
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Posted by: techcafe on Apr 8, 2009 9:09 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]

"The rabbit hole goes much deeper than you would ever believe. Or so the conspiracy theorists of the world would have you believe. But dig behind the scenes of the conspiracy crowd, and you'll find another conspiracy."

"It was clear, this was part of a disinformation campaign aimed at discrediting the left and advancing their own agenda by insinuating their own anti-Israel spin into things."

"One of the disturbing things I had uncovered that day included an article from the Southern Poverty Law Center, detailing the same type of lies being spread in the 9/11 conspiracy crowd. Now, this is clearly an appealing target for gullible left-leaning people."

click here to read more

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Maybe There Is Some Control
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Posted by: Lilly on Apr 8, 2009 10:08 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This afternoon I watched Glenn Beck's entire show as I wanted to see if he would continue his diatribe against the Obama government and his calls to arms. Interestingly, he did not even mention Obama except once, thus: "Be sure and watch the show on Friday. It will be called 'Destined to Repeat' and it's about how this country got in such a mess---I AM NOT JUST TALKING ABOUT OBAMA". I got the impression somebody had told him to cool it, either somebody at FOX or a sponsor rep.

The other thing Beck said that was interesting was "When a country is in collapse we send over agents to slow seeds of discontent so when the country falls we can push it in the direction we want." Then about two sentences later he again used the phrase "sow seeds of discontent". He was talking about the US sending undercover agents abroad but I got the feeling he was, in a weird way, talking about himself, not that we are in collapse, YET, but certainly we are in flux with big changes afoot. He definitely tries to sow seeds of discontent; the whole rest of the show was designed to stir up resentment among viewers.

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alex jones racist?
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Posted by: zuul on Apr 8, 2009 11:44 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
hardly.
i'm an educated african-american male and i gather my information from a number of sources both "mainstream" and "alternative" i'm not wearing a tin-foil hat and i am quite discerning when reading anything especially so called news even moreso when there might be some kind of "conspiracy" involved... i would say i give equal validity to the information posted here as to the information posted on infowars. you have to take it all with a grain of salt. and pursue your own research and do your own information gathering. turn of the tv get of the internets and read a book perhaps. i would submit anyone who doesn't simply is not an educated or curious reader...

i've been listening to alex jones for about 7 years now. i've seen several of his films. extreme? yes. over the top? yes? racist and right wing. no way. to suggest so is either ignorance or intentional misleading. i can't speak for his listeners but since i'm one (and i don't listen regularly) i would say that all of his listeners are not right wing wackos. i listen to ed schultz and randi rhodes and in their own way they are as extreme as alex jones. check out alex jones in the linklater flick waking life... lots of alex jones' conspiracy theories in fact later turn out to be fact and most of his information is easily supported by reports in the mainstream press.. really it's all about spin and interpretation... so what's the difference between him and any other blogger/media watchdog? recently downloaded the obama deception and started watching but haven't finished. typical alex jones faire... his production values have gone way up and subsequently the films are more watchable. surprised to see such luminaries as krs-one, willie nelson and jesse ventura contribute to this most recent documentary. i encourage people to check out his films.

i think mr. blumenthal at best did not prepare properly for this article or at worst it's a hit piece... either way i would expect better from alternet... this is neither an accurate or good article.

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What Israel hates most of all?
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Posted by: weathered on Apr 9, 2009 4:44 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Getting caught in the headlights of their very own remarkable arrogance and diabolic deceit and finding absolutely no one to manipulate blame on.

Keep lying to yourselves Israel and to everyone else, its what you do best.

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In the front row along with only 17% who stood aganist this war
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Posted by: donnal on Apr 9, 2009 6:25 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The war was misleading and was pushed by the same press that is pushing that spending is the way out of this mess...

This President is at fault as are the other 550+ individuals who continue to pour unlimited borrowed money into our economy on the premise that is will
trickle down to where it is needed.

Tea Parties are not aganist Mr. Obama the person, but Mr. Obama the President. He will continue to lose this war on the economy because he can not tell the difference between being constructive and being wastefull.

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Free speach and Uncle Adolph
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Posted by: mcyclemama on Apr 9, 2009 8:17 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Those of you that want to be able to listen or say what ever you want, or who advocate that hate radio jocks should be able to say anything at all, obviously don't know history or have a short memory. Adolph Hitler was an EXTEMELY gifted speechmaker who by his very words was able to incite a complete nation to his lunatic ways, much like Rash Lamebrain and the others, many of whom are on Faux tv. The Rash dittoheads are much like my german countrymen of the 30' and 40's who and who are incapable of free thought but will parrot anything these cretins espouse. Even if you can't understand the language, google up some of his rantings and
you cannot help but feel chills up and down your spine.

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» RE: Free speach and Uncle Adolph Posted by: treebeard4
» RE: Free speach and Uncle Adolph Posted by: helenwheels
» RE: Free speach and Uncle Adolph Posted by: helenwheels

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MILLIONS -- READ MILLONS WANT ANSWERS!!
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Posted by: maRcmAN1 on Apr 9, 2009 9:04 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Oh -- BUT nevermind the fact that WHAT Beck says carries considerable weight in MANY RESPECTS --that are questions and criticisms that millions (READ: MILLIONS) of Americans wanted attended to or answers about.

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Hate Groups
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Posted by: helenwheels on Apr 9, 2009 10:00 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
All one has to do to realize these people have a lot of influence is research the number of hate groups that have formed in the past year. Guess what? The number has more than doubled.

That's just fact. Now, what could be spurring all this hate?

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SHOOTINGS...the factors
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Posted by: reelman on Apr 9, 2009 11:36 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
So far, this year's public multiple shootings were committed by:

-- Richard Poplawski, 23, product of a broken family, expelled from high school and dishonorably discharged from the Marines, who killed three policemen in Pittsburgh.

-- Former crack addict Jiverly Wong, 41, who told co-workers "America sucks" who blockaded his victims in a civic center in Binghamton, N.Y., and shot as many people as he could, before killing himself.

-- Robert Stewart, 45, a three-time divorcee and high school dropout with "violent tendencies" -- according to one of his ex-wives -- who shot up the nursing home in Carthage, N.C., where his newly estranged wife worked.

-- Lovelle Mixon, 26, a paroled felon, struggling to get his life back on track by pimping, who shot four cops in Oakland, Calif. -- before eventually being shot himself.

-- Twenty-eight-year-old Michael McLendon, child of divorce, living with his mother and boycotting family funerals because he hated his relatives, who killed 10 of those relatives and their neighbors in Samson, Ala.

It might make more sense to outlaw men than guns. Or divorce. Or crack. Or to prohibit felons from having guns.
Except we already outlaw crack and felons owning guns and yet still, somehow, Wong got crack and Mixon got a gun.
=====
TELL US AGAIN THAT TRASHING THE FAMILY AND BASIC MORALITY BY LIBERALS DOES NO HARM TO A CULTURE..

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» RE: SHOOTINGS...the factors Posted by: Tenzin

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Ibett
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Tenzin on Apr 9, 2009 4:24 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
When Michell Backman of Minnesota speaks out about civil disobedience she should be repriminded by other members of congress. No congress person should publicly incite riots as she has in the past few weeks! Also, the Fox "news" should be made to advertise as FOX ENTERTAINMENT with a disclaimer regarding the fact they are NOT NEWS! Too many people fall for this crap and it is dividing our country!!

Ibett

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"All people like Alex Jones need is a good healthy cup of Jesus with extra cream"
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Posted by: techcafe on Apr 9, 2009 5:02 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
wanna a little taste of hardcore republican?

check this shit out:

=============Enemies of the homeland

God’s people hitlist: God wants them dead because they harm America!

* Barack “The Muslim” Obama
(aka “Homobama”, “Barack Osama”, “Husein the Terrorist”)

Aaron Russo (God won - died of cancer!)
Charles Darwin (God Won)
Nancy “Mafia Princess” Pelosi
Rudy “Cross-dressing Baby-Killer” Giuliani

... (click for more)

meh... with Giuliani, i kinda have to agree... not on the 'baby killer' nonsense, but about the 'cross dressing' thing. if you think Giuliani is ghoulish as a man... you haven't seen 'her' in drag... absolutely frightening!

anyway, it gets better...

"Let's KILL Two Birds with One Stone"

Friends,

In the same week that the commie Koreans manage to build a missile capable of sending a bomb as far as the USA, the state of Vermont has announced that it’s going to allow the homos to marry each other. Wouldn’t it be great if the Koreans just launched all their nukes at Vermont? We could solve two problems in one go… end Homosexuality and disarm the Koreans."

and that is just a teensy little sample. the site is like a clearing house for hate & stupidity, it's replete with this kind of invective... it must be seen to be believed.

and in an ironic twist of serendipity, i find this...

"Screaming and cussing, throwing insults like a 5 yrs old - Alex Jones has gone Mad.

What is wrong with Alex Jones. With around 10 Million listeners he is one of the most successful Radio Talkshow hosts in America and yet he does not seem to be able to enjoy his status, instead he is screaming and yelling like a lunatic. Why you ask? Because apparently he thinks that Obama is gonna take away his guns and therefor prevent him from visiting the gun club and shooting at paper targets. Poor baby!

And why else is he screaming like a toddler that feel from the changing table? Oh yeah, because some fictional police officer does give his child fluride (healthy teeth) and they goes somewhere and does not care that the very same child is “brain damaged”. Right. .. . Is there anything else bothering you, Mr. Jones?

Jones, you are a nutcase! You belong somewhere and trust me: We will lock you up sooner or later, Jones. When nobody is watching we are coming to take you away, Jones. Look over your shoulder, Jones. We are right there, we are watching you right now. Or maybe not.

All people like Alex Jones need is a good healthy cup of Jesus with extra cream.

God bless y’all for reading."

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Right Wing Media
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Posted by: WeimMom on Apr 10, 2009 3:36 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I hardly think you can blame O'Reilly, Beck or any other Conservative/Independent Talk Show Host.

How about the Left Wing Liberals creating this violence? The lack of jobs while allowing more immigrants in on visas, wanting amnesty for illegals, creating the DREAM Act, this is more likely to create violence during a recession with so many jobless.

Left wing media MUST wake up before we are all Socialists, bowing to other countries and apologizing for ourselves!

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» ugh, what a load of crap Posted by: techcafe

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Ron Paul on Alex Jones
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Posted by: techcafe on Apr 10, 2009 9:05 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Jones gets egged by Paul

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Rightwing Militias
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Posted by: rodan!!! on Apr 10, 2009 10:59 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We can't pretend the rightwingers espousing violence to solve what they perceive as America's ills are just fringe anymore. Glenn Beck, Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity -- all these guys are fomenting violence against Americans in a very real way. Beck just today was pouring fake gasoline on a guest in a bizarre skit to illustrate his twisted view of how President Obama is treating Americans. This is the man who has mused at length about KILLING Michael Moore -- while pretending to be a Christian no less. You've got loonies like Ted Nugent (who has threatened to kill Obama and Hillary) and Chuck Norris (who now wants Texas to secede from the USA) enjoying a resurgence in popularity that is only half-ironic. And after accusing President Obama of being conversely a fascist, a Muslim, and a communist, they've settled on calling him a "socialist" who wants to confiscate their precious guns. And they feel compelled to resort to violence over this paranoia -- and completely justified. This is the American rightwing's moment for jihad. Mass shootings from "disenfranchised" rightwingers have been epidemic the past month -- and expect it to get worse.

Time to get ready, folks. Arm yourselves and get the proper training. It's sad it has to come to this, but the rightwing is intent on FORCING their agenda through violence. They simply cannot accept that the majority of Americans wanted their party ousted. Their media (FOXnews and a.m. radio) is telling them they have a right to organize with guns. Let's hope cooler heads ultimately prevail, but let's be fully prepared if they don't.

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» Killing Michael Moore Posted by: techcafe
» RE: Killing Michael Moore Posted by: techcafe

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The Real Terrorists
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Posted by: dumdumboy on Apr 11, 2009 9:50 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
A year ago, Hillary Clinton tried to tie Barack Obama to Bill Ayers. In the fall campaign Sarah Palin picked-up where Hillary left-off, saying something along the lines that Obama was cozy with terrorists.

Yet, the Weathermen never murdered anyone, other than themselves. Although they twice bombed a police station in New York City, they had the humanity to alert "the pigs" beforehand, so that they could clear the building.

This looks like a clear case of the chickens coming home to roost. Either that or, and it's scary to contemplate, of "The real Americans" that Sarah Palin spoke of.

Rather than run away from the facts, the conservative talking heads should acknowledge their mistakes, and self-censor themselves.

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Henry Kissinger: New World Order "conspiracy theorist"
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Posted by: waterflaws on Apr 11, 2009 10:30 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If you want it straight from the horse's ass, watch Henry Kissinger's recent interview by Charlie Rose - "a New World Order".

Don't let "them" (the Max Blumenthals, Frank Luntzs, Barrack Obamas, and their ilk) re-write the definitions of OUR words.

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Listen for yourselves from the Horses Mouth
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Posted by: bubbabuddha on Apr 11, 2009 1:14 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
So much of this reaction to Alex Jones sounds so familiar, almost like a twilight zone episode from Nazi era or Fascist Italy trying to tell their critics to shut up, it won't be long before somebody like Jones gets killed by some David Chappman like wacko cause he wrongly thinks Jones got those police killed or something worse.
They are mad cause he made a film for 100,000 bucks called the Obama Deception and over 15 million have watched or downloaded it or made copies of it for free and handed them out so people could see the Wall st Obama trickster for what he actually maybe doing to the US.

ShutUpVideo

Hear Alex and think for yourself

The Trickle-Up Bailout

Some Link Economy With Spate Of Killings

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Alex Jones goes into a psychotic rage - Part 1 - you gotta hear these
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Posted by: techcafe on Apr 11, 2009 11:09 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
For anyone who still thinks that Alex Jones is actually sane, take a listen to the audio clips below... you will definitely be convinced otherwise after listening. In them, Jones goes completely off the rails - into a psychotic rage almost. Just have a listen to the links below (Parts 1 & 2 of this and the following post), and you'll hear what I'm talking about.

THEY WANNA TAKE OUR GUNS! (click on the audio clip to listen)

Posted to Shelley The Republican blog on January 8, 2009

Nobody can stop 'em, they're having their way with America! They want our GUNS! And if you're not with 'them' [the New World Order] COPS and military... AHHH, then you will declare that you are with the republic now. And don't tell me that I'm a weirdo because I'm upset about this!

Listen, I know what tyranny means, I know the bankers are putting poison in our food & water. I know the bankers have stolen 8.5 trillion. I know we're under the war powers act. I know they're hurting us. I know they're carrying-out New World Order. I know they've staged those terror attacks.

You know what it's like to gut-up to this, and go out every day, and go past the peer pressure, and come-out day 1 and say 9/11 was an inside job and lose most of the radio stations I was on? You know what it's like to go to sleep every night knowing that you work for a bunch of psychotic killers?! And you bastards are probably gonna end-up killing me one day! You know what it's like knowing you've RUINED MY LIFE?!! YOU KNOW WHAT IT'S LIKE YOU SONS A BITCHES?! I'M TIRED OF YOUR CRAP!!

YOU COMMIT EVIL, YOU'RE PART OF AN EVIL SYSTEM! AND WE'RE STANDING UP AGAINST YOU! AND THE REPUBLIC IS GOING TO DEFEAT YOU IN THE END. Some of us won't make it personally through this, but A LOT OF US ARE! And in the end, YOU ARE GONNA BE BROUGHT TO JUSTICE for all the kids you kidnapped for CPS. All you CPS workers, all you corrupt bureaucrats... all of you who've had your way with innocent children, over & over again, who think your evil is invincible... YOU'RE NOT INVINCIBLE, and GOD is gonna deal with you! And you are CURSED TO HELL!!

Arrrghhh... I'm done, I gotta get outta here... I'm pissed-off now.

cont... see next followup post for Part 2

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Shelley the Republic says Alex Jones is a "Domestic Terrorist"
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Posted by: techcafe on Apr 12, 2009 1:07 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The following was posted to Shelley the Republican on October 19, 2008

Domestic Terrorist | Alex Jones (Infowars.com - Prisonplanet.tv)

Dear Friends,

When it comes to pure fear mongering and hatred against America, nobody is worse than Alex Jones. Jones uses his position as syndicated radio talk show host and his access to the hearts and minds of up to 10 million listeners worldwide to sell cheap junk such as water filters, healing stones and other junk that is supposed to protect them from the evil people that control the planet. It might very well be the biggest con-job ever perpetrated on the American airwaves.

And this guy calls the Leader George W. Bush a monkey???

Jones, the maker of movies like “Zeitgeist” and “Loose Change 9/11” claims to fight for the American public and against a so called “New World Order” which he claims is trying to “exterminate 90% of mankind with material support of space aliens”. Unnamed sources confirm that he in fact, laughing about the gullibility of his listenership that keep buying his lies and distortions as well as all kinds of nonsense like storeable foods, magic teddy bears and silver coins. “The stuff I am selling can’t be too stupid that these morons won’t buy it” he is quoted by our sources inside the Alex Jones team. His personal wealth is very substantial after 13 years of on the air fear mongering. He is even going so far as to promoting dangerous hemp products on the air. Even though we all know badly hemp and its users are damaging the American society and we all know how expensive the war on drugs is, he still is promoting the use and sale of hemp on his radio show.

Alex Jones likes to be portrayed as young and hip when all he is, is a rancid old snakeoil salesman!

Perhaps the worst aspect of his daily radio broadcast is the open hatred against the Leader George W. Bush and the American government. I call for the arrest of Alex Jones and all his affiliates for the good of the Homeland. His wild-eyed conspiracy crap is polluting the minds of his listeners every day. This is especially bad when you take into consideration that America is in the midst of a fundamental transaction into a new societal structure using scientific methods of a kind the world has never been seen.

[here is] The young Alex Jones stuffing himself at MacDonalds, enjoying the fruits of American labor and ingenuity, yet all he has to offer is fear, stupid conspiracy theories and lies directed at the government. Y’all know me, I am a 100% pro life but this is the best damn argument for abortion I’ve ever heard. Maybe we should consider retroactive abortion in his case.
It is time that we acknowledge threats like this and deal with them accordingly. Human scum like that has to be sorted out of the American society. Today or better even yesterday.

Thanks for reading.
May God continue to bless America.
Shelley N. Goodman, Iowa City

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Unraveling like a cheap suit
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Posted by: Curious Tea Leaf on Apr 12, 2009 1:12 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It is a sad day to see that polarizing comments in these posts are as partisan and as divided as this nation. America, like these comments reflect not our ability to discuss issues but our desire to yell at each other with the hope that one voice will prevail not due to reason and logic but to volume. America is unravelling at break neck speed, the economy, the political process, the media and all three branches of government. As I reflect upon the deeds of the two political branches, the only thing that can be said is that they both betrayed our nation. They both sold out to big business in exporting jobs and failing to maintain control of the borders. America today has no sense of identity as to who she is. From the the comments above we have truly become a collection of squabling voices. As per ususal, this post does what too many posts do; attempts to afix blame on the right wing for inciting violence. Personally, I belive that members of both parties have their reasons to not trust the government and for good cause. Conspiracy theories arise when our government fails to disclose what it does and why it does it. Moreover, when it does disclose, what it offers by way of explanation, does not sound credible and actually runs contrary to what we see. There is no question that we have a problem with violence in this country, but if many people have to die to preserve freedom, then so be it. A disarmed populace is a helpless populace, and the tree of liberty must at times be watered with the blood of tyrants, patriots and innocent bystanders.

The point is that the bikering must stop, less we find ourselves in another civil war.

www.oracle66.wordpress.com

The curious tea leaf

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» RE: Unraveling like a cheap suit Posted by: bubbabuddha
» re: hemp Posted by: techcafe

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parallel realities
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Posted by: techcafe on Apr 12, 2009 7:28 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
i'm always amazed at the paranoid depths to which some fragile minds will plunge, succumbing to a myopic world-view of good vs evil, the republic against the psyops of the new world order.

for instance, this YouTube video - WARNING TO ALL MILITIAS

i mean, these people really do believe that they are in a holy battle against evil forces! they actually live in some ghoulish parallel reality, some bizarre medieval warfare meets 21st century nihilism. who the hell knows?!

the video is classic Alex Jones, proselytizing about a militia republic resisting the new world order.

i'm thinking schizophrenia??
whatever it is, there's a battle going on inside this guy's head, and he needs help.

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» RE: parallel realities Posted by: Neal1966

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Lets look at facts
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Posted by: Neal1966 on Apr 13, 2009 1:05 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Its not conjecture. Its not paranoia. Tyrants always disarm their populations to force their will on the masses.

Its not a conservative opinion. Its not a liberal opinion. Its just a fact.

Its also a fact that we now live in a country where you can be arrested on no charges and held in secret. What do you really think will happen when the next big crisis hits the Homeland? Maybe I should ask the people who lived in New Orleans a few years ago.

And, for the record, this delinquent, drunken cretin had nothing but bad to say about Alex Jones. Like Alex or not, he is an outspoken advocate of non-violent change through waging a war of information. His primary partner in developing his latest DVD expose (The Obama Deception) is a Roosevelt/New Deal Democrat. If you doubt that, then you probably haven't looked for yourself.

I am left leaning, but when i read stories like this, I realize that I can't really trust foundation funded media outlets like alternet to filter my news.

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» Alex Jones is a FRAUD Posted by: techcafe
Alternet Comments:

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If he was 14, would you blame Marylyn Manson?
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Posted by: Honky the Nihilist... on Apr 8, 2009 12:16 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
So Tea-Parties are bad but “Fast-Rising Protest Group Challenges the Outrageous Power of the Bankers” gets its link in Alternet? Gottcha.

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» There is a HUGE difference... Posted by: JoshuaLudd
» And by the way Posted by: Aimleft

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KBR awarded Homeland Security contract worth up to $385M
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Posted by: LeftWright on Apr 8, 2009 12:33 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
By Katherine Hunt
Last update: 12:19 p.m. EST Jan. 24, 2006

SAN FRANCISCO (MarketWatch) -- KBR, the engineering and construction subsidiary of Halliburton Co., said Tuesday it has been awarded a contingency contract from the Department of Homeland Security to supports its Immigration and Customs Enforcement facilities in the event of an emergency. The maximum total value of the contract is $385 million and consists of a 1-year base period with four 1-year options. KBR held the previous ICE contract from 2000 through 2005. The contract, which is effective immediately, provides for establishing temporary detention and processing capabilities to expand existing ICE Detention and Removal Operations Program facilities in the event of an emergency influx of immigrants into the U.S., or to support the rapid development of new programs, KBR said. The contract may also provide migrant detention support to other government organizations in the event of an immigration emergency, as well as the development of a plan to react to a national emergency, such as a natural disaster, the company said.

I'm no fan of Alex Jones and WOULD NOT recommend his radio show or web sites to anyone, but this KBR contract with DHS is a fact, not a conspiracy theory.

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» Straw man Posted by: brunowe

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Answer: Yes
[Report this comment]
Posted by: zola77 on Apr 8, 2009 12:48 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I know Honky and Pointy will have a problem with this, but it is factual.

It would be hard to make a case that conservative media had no impact on these actions.

Media (of all political persuasions) tends to amp up the paranoia factor in its' audience to draw a crowd. The difference is that conservatives are naturally more prone to fear and are therefore already in a more paranoid mindset.

Sicentific studies suggest that people who identify as politically conservative are by nature/genetically more prone to fear and paranoia. If someone is naturally in such a frame of mind, and then an external source amplifies that - there is inevitably going to be a breaking point.

Here is a link to a series of scientific studies that have taken place on this topic over the years:

linked text

Here is another link from the Washington Post on yet ANOTHER study suggesting that conservatives are less likely to be swayed by factual or rational responses to their views.

Here is the link:

linked text

The combination of these two makes Limbaugh mongering and Coulter mongering a disaster waiting to happen.

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» RE: Answer: Are you high? Posted by: james108
» RE: Answer: Are you high? Posted by: james108
» RE: Answer: Are you high? Posted by: LMNOP
» RE: Answer: Yes Posted by: Lilly
» RE: Answer: Yes Posted by: winthrupt
» winthrup Posted by: zola77
» RE: Answer: Yes Posted by: LTBROWN
» RE: Answer: Yes Posted by: Livemike
» Bell Curvers from the Left Posted by: bubbabuddha

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The First Amendment Still Applies
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Posted by: DrBrian on Apr 8, 2009 1:16 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
While I agree that raving lunatics can unsettle unstable minds, it would be a mistake to hold that they are responsible for the acts committed by their listeners. Unless they actively promote violence, the First Amendment protects their rights, as it should.

Many of us are increasingly critical of Obama's policies, but even a passionate, vulgar rant stopping short of advocacy of illegal acts shouldn't make the writer liable if some crackpot tries to assassinate him.

It bears some thought that Americans gleefully gave up many of their rights under the First, Fourth, Fifth, Sixth and Eighth Amendments in the name of the War on Terror, but have clung tightly to a bizarre interpretation of the Second--and that is the real culprit.

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» Yes it does. Posted by: brunowe
» ROTFLMAO! Posted by: GuitarBill
» RAV v St Paul Posted by: brunowe

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Did I fall asleep and wake up in the '90s?
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Posted by: -matti on Apr 8, 2009 1:50 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
All of the Awake notice and reject the manipulation here, yes?

Don't bother "participating" in whatever stupid "discussion" follows, just hold the realization to yourselves and share it with the actual people around you.

We'll see you on the other side.

-matti.

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» No. Posted by: Beck

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Stormfront Opts Out
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Posted by: Aged Liberal on Apr 8, 2009 1:51 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I tried to look at the posts Poplawski supposedly made at Stormfront.org. Apparently Stormfront has removed them.
Hm, I wonder why.

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» RE: Stormfront Opts Out Posted by: EscargencyResearch

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Escargency
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Posted by: EscargencyResearch on Apr 8, 2009 2:30 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Wessels are nescessary because the Schafflongkerraz Wessel,captured in 1947 ROSWELL BASE -Area 51,as they are transported by these Flight-personell wessels are absolutely nescessary for fighting crimes and war-lords all over this planet.....
To keep peace in this world,somebody need to do the job,therefore these wessels are absolutely nescessary-these are the worlds of the Messenger-the man who in his 18-years 1974,saw the picture taken by Marija BERNADETTE Peraic-Kroatic Girl-in 1968 was she in Los Angeles,14 years of age,travelcompanion to a bulgarian woman 24-26 years,Journalist-Student by Sofia High School-Bulgaria-with her 14-year charm,successfully took a picture on Robert Francis Kennedy,thus in a moment of stress-he was attacked by two assasines-one from the front=Sirhaan-Sirhaan,and one from behind,Swedish Police-officer,son of H.Goering and Actress Gaby Stenberg-Koch.The Picture(colour) clearly shows that Walther Evert Wilhelm Kegoe-born 26 nov 1945-took a shoot upwards right side of Roberts neck,and thus inflicting lethal injuries to the brain and lifesupporting biological system.
Thomas Escargency Kallmyr-SWEDEN-Uddevalla City

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» RE:A true LUNATIC Posted by: mcyclemama
» RE: scargency Posted by: vioibi

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The 4th Estate had a fire sale
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Posted by: weathered on Apr 8, 2009 2:33 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
on 9/11 and integrity went up in smoke.

As long as we continue to Lie to ourselves we'll remain as sick as our secrets.

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» RE: Google hot spots Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» marvin did it! Posted by: techcafe
» Waterboard Silverstein Posted by: weathered
» RE: Waterboard Silverstein Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Waterboard Silverstein Posted by: weathered
» RE: Waterboard Silverstein Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Waterboard Silverstein Posted by: weathered
» Great post, arraya! Posted by: LeftWright

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Perish the thought!
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Posted by: Perry Logan on Apr 8, 2009 2:49 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Of course not. Ceaseless streams of violent rhetoric from unhinged white males has a proven beneficial effect on all listeners. :)

True, the violent crime rate went down for eight straight years under Bill Clinton, then started going up under George W. Bush. But this is mere coincidence.

As for Alex Jones, his fans go off their chumps at regular intervals:

Bohemian Grove intruder says he feared human sacrifices

Richard McCaslin planned a heavily armed assault on the exclusive Bohemian Grove men's club for more than a year, believing "it would take something dramatic" to draw attention to human sacrifices he feared were being held there.
National Press Club Emblem - Same as Bohemian Grove

National Press Club
was established in Washington DC in 1908, soon after elites and journalists on the West Coast established the Bohemian Club. Membership includes "news makers" in addition to news reporters, including 17 consecutive Presidents of the United States. Most have lectured in the Club's restaurant, and both Carter and Reagan announced their candidacies for president. Mystical symbolism in NPC's logo reveal influence from Bohemian Grove's Owl Shrine and Illuminati's illuminated rays of sunlight.
Bohemian Grove Dirt

In a jailhouse interview Monday night, the well-spoken, lucid and clean-shaven man said he "wanted to make a point" and was prepared to kill people at the Monte Rio resort if necessary..

McCaslin, 37, is being held in the mental health ward of the Sonoma County Jail, facing several felony charges stemming from his commando-like entry into the grove this weekend...

His fears of the alleged events were based on a videotape put out a few years ago by radio host Alex Jones, who claims on his Web site that "bizarre, Luciferian ceremonies" occur there.


PS: The newly-renamed planet Xe

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» RE: Perish the thought! Posted by: johnwinthrop
» RE: I'll cry for you... Posted by: Cybershaman
» Oprah cries Posted by: BlueTigress
» RE: Perish the thought! Posted by: aussidawg
» Waterboard Silverstein Posted by: weathered
» Behold the mind of an Israeli Posted by: weathered
» Waterboard Silverstein Posted by: weathered

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You call Jones right wing?? He is the only journalist to blame 9/11 on Bush.
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Posted by: pfgetty on Apr 8, 2009 2:55 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If Alex Jones does anything right, it is that he has consistently and honestly blamed the Bush administration for 9/11. I call this journalistic integrity. That he also goes for Obama also is proof that he isn't controlled by the left right paradigm and looks to find the truth and not just support his political party.
He certainly isn't right wing, which Alternet is trying to portray.

But here we have Alternet criticizing Alex Jones, but Alex Jones is the only journalist I know with a major following who is not afraid to bring out the truth about 9/11. Alternet, on the other hand, has censored any mention of what really happened that day. Seven and a half years and not one decent article on the evidence that proves that the official story is a lie. Piles of evidence sits to prove it, and is presented by David Ray Griffin and Kevin Ryan and Steven Jones and Richard Gage and others, all ignored. So which journalists are really the ones who are shaping the news to fit their agenda? And why is Alternet doing this? We don't know. They won't tell us.
And so people have to go to Alex Jones to get the truth, the only journalist brave enough to broadcast 9/11 truth to millions.
Thanks, Alex, for standing up for truth.

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» RE: Thanks Posted by: solrev
» I agree Posted by: LMNOP
» RE: I agree Posted by: pfgetty
» ;-) Posted by: GuitarBill
» RE: ;-) Posted by: arraya
» In defense of Alternet Posted by: linecrosser
» RE: In defense of Alternet Posted by: weathered

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No selfresponsibility anymore?
[Report this comment]
Posted by: johnwinthrop on Apr 8, 2009 4:04 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
everytime a depressed or unemployed person kills more than one other person, the progressive or even msm decides society or even worse, Rush Limbaugh, is to blame. Whatever happened to personal responsibility? Whatever happened to do unto others, etc.?

Whatever happened to clear and convincing evidence, and not irresponsible tactics in political debate?

Articles like this remind of...well..something Sean Hannity might say in connection with why teen girls get pregnant. They read about sex in Cosmo.

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» Hey, he's one of your guys Posted by: ReallyBearish
» Been there Done that Posted by: linecrosser

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Personal responsibility
[Report this comment]
Posted by: BeckyD on Apr 8, 2009 4:20 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Your article teaser ties this guy to Glenn Beck and then almost the whole article is about Alex Jones with a few references to Beck thrown in. Very credible. Blaming any of these talk show hosts for this shooter's actions is ridiculous. Millions of people listen to right wing talk. How many of them shoot people? Obviously, it's the shooter's fault. To say otherwise is to head down a road that leads to censorship.

And yes, Beck mentioned the alleged FEMA camps. He also debunked them over two nights on his TV show with the head of Popular Mechanics. I know people involved in the tea party movement locally. They're not mindless ranting dittoheads - they're housewives and business people and parents who are outraged at the amount of money our government is spending, borrowing and printing. And frankly, as the bumper sticker says, anyone who isn't outraged, isn't paying attention.

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More people need to see what the Right-Wing is attempting to do!!
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Posted by: Ninure on Apr 8, 2009 4:33 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
How many more people are going to die because of the Right-wing talking heads? Will they only be taken as the dangers they are when there is an all-out civil war?

BTW: I real do wish you'd use the "share" thingie that would allow tjose of us who use MySpace to share this there.


This is an excellent article, and needs to be hared as widely as possible.

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» RE: Let's see... Posted by: Cybershaman
» RE: Let's see... Posted by: lenioui

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Foreknowledge=Culpability=1st degree Murder
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Posted by: Purple Girl on Apr 8, 2009 4:36 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Right Wing mouthpieces KNOWS exactly WHO they are inciting and for WHAT purpose. Timothy McVeigh, Kazinski,Ruby Ridge? Waco, Jonestown,Charlie Manson? Atlanta Oylmpics,Clinic bombings, MD assasinations,..
they know exactly What groups lurk inside their 'tent'- Radical Relgious extremeist, Neo Nazi's, and paranoid schizophrenics...History exposes their Rooster of followers.
Liberals gave up violent means for change after the Vietnam war era. It was evident that such crimal acts were countreproductive and needlessly dangerous to innocent people.
I don't fear the 6ft Dialysis patient hanging out in some cozy villa- I'm terrified of the Right wing,, Neo Nazi, Gun Toting, End of Dayer living down the Street was been ignited by their Deciever 'Pastors' , their Treasonous party leaders and the complicit Propagandaist.
These media and Political figures claim that they have no respsonbility for the actions take by their followers is as legitmate as me telling a cop I had no idea handing my 2 yr old a loaded gun could result in his death.Just because I didn't aim and pull the trigger does not mean I am not culpable in his murder. It's called Precedence- A ponderance of Historical evidence readily available to accurately determine the risk and thus an outcome. Why do you think it is Illegal to scream 'Fire' in a theatre when none exists? Historical Events have proven it endangers peoples lives.
These media and Politicans are not just inciting murder & suicide,But to an even greater extent ,violent insurrection,aka Treason.Bachmans call for people to become 'Armed and Dangerous' is evidential enough to bring charges.

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» we should Posted by: Juven
» wonderful point Posted by: Juven

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BA
[Report this comment]
Posted by: mnstra on Apr 8, 2009 4:42 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Though your article does point to a connection to how suggestive minds can be influenced to kill by talk radio. Its always the Killer who bears true responsibility. Never think for a min that talk radio made him do it.Right wing radio, however is pure trash , it does preach violence and rape. You would be better off putting you ear to a can full of garbage than to even tune to the Glen Becks of the world for even a second, They are so toxic Neal Bortz and company that in an earlier time would be kicked off the air. BUt they do not influence a person to murder. You give them too much credit and that is dangerous--Also Why are we not hearing about attacks or shootings of bankers And AIG ec=xcs?

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» RE: I just can't buy that. Posted by: Cybershaman

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Elitists like Blumenthal....
[Report this comment]
Posted by: okcsteve on Apr 8, 2009 5:35 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
...have been totally ignoring progressive movements in the bible belt for too long. It is time to pay attention to them, build up support, and get this country back on track.
We've been bombarded by hate radio, heritage foundation types, etc...and the Blumenthal's of the world have just sat back and made a career of it. It is disgusting to me.
I worked in downtown OKC during the bombing, and was almost as Right as McVeigh at the time! I was lucky enough to move to Boston later, meet prof. Chomsky, and wake up to reality. Got no help here from anyone...

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Alex Jones is Right Wing?
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Posted by: ericthefoolish on Apr 8, 2009 6:11 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Wow, what a horrible article. It just shows that Max has no clue what so ever about who and what Alex Jones does.

Where were you about 4 months ago when Jones was railing the Bush administration. Railing Cheney, Rumsfeld, Gonzalez, Rice, and others. He has been smashing Glenn Beck, Rush, Hannity and others because they are liars.

How do you get a job mr. blumenthal. You don't even deserve capital letters.

My favorite is all the "liberals" here that follow lockstep with whatever is fed to them. Instead of going out and reading up, doing fact checking, and finding out for themselves, they elect to accept the "news" and regretfully swallow the blue pill.

None of you think for yourselves. None of you do any research concerning any of these issues. Its all left -vs- right. You all fall for this game, and you have no clue who is on the side of freedom. Instead, you bicker about O'Reilly, bicker about Rush, and bicker about Glenn Beck...while this ship sinks faster and faster.

Great job fellow fake Americans. You'll need it.

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» RE: Alex Jones is Right Wing? Posted by: pjnaltykins
» RE: Alex Jones is Right Wing? Posted by: ericthefoolish
» RE: Alex Jones is Right Wing? Posted by: ericthefoolish

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Don't click the link, identity theft--I've reported it
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Posted by: brunowe on Apr 8, 2009 6:32 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Link goes through to a page that facilitates identity theft. He keeps getting banned and coming back with a different nom de scam.

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» Who doea? What link? Posted by: thornwolf

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Seriously dude...
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Posted by: Ayla87 on Apr 8, 2009 6:41 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Everyone and their mother knows that site you keep linking to embeds key loggers onto computers.

You know you're going to get reported and banned. And you know multiple users are going to remind everyone that you're an identity thief.

So why bother?

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» RE: Seriously dude... Posted by: Sister_Lauren

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Let's Find Out
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Posted by: johnwinthrop on Apr 8, 2009 8:14 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]