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Reproductive Justice and Gender

In Some States, Fetuses Are Deemed More Important Than Women

By Jeanne Flavin, NYU Press. Posted January 31, 2009.


"Fetal rights" turn women into little more than baby carriers rather than human beings.
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 Excerpted from Our Bodies, Or Crimes: The Policing of Women’s Reproduction in America by Jeanne Flavin. (c) 2009 NYU Press. Reproduced by permission of the publisher.

On Christmas Eve of 2002, Laci Peterson disappeared from her home in Modesto, California. She was almost eight months pregnant with a son that she and her husband had planned to name Conner. A jury later concluded that her husband, Scott Peterson, had killed her. California's definition of murder includes the unlawful killing of a fetus with malice aforethought, provided that the fetus has passed the embryonic stage (roughly between six and eight weeks). Scott Peterson was convicted of first-degree murder for killing Laci and second-degree murder for killing the fetus. He was sentenced to death.

In 2004, President George W. Bush enacted Laci and Conner's Law, as the federal Unborn Victims of Violence Act of 2004 (UVVA) eventually became known. Under the terms of the UVVA, if someone harms a pregnant woman and causes the death of her fetus while violating any one of 68 existing federal criminal laws, he or she can be charged for causing the mother's harm or death and face a second charge for killing the unborn victim. Very few violent crimes are prosecuted in federal courts. The UVVA applies only to violent crimes committed in places like a military base, a post office, or a Native American reservation; its potential to have a broad impact on domestic violence, then, is similarly restricted.

In addition to the federal UVVA, at least 36 states permit homicide charges to be filed in the deaths of fetuses. Fetal homicide laws were designed to be applied in cases where a pregnant woman is injured if her pregnancy is ended or harmed by an assault, a drunk driving accident, or other criminal act. Some laws require that the accused person act with malicious foresight, while others allow charges of involuntary manslaughter when there is no intent to kill.

State laws also differ in whether or not they, like the UVVA, extend the legal definition person and human being to mean a fetus. The UVVA and most state fetal homicide laws treat the fetus as an independent second victim that has legal rights distinct from the pregnant woman harmed by the criminal act: that is, when a pregnant woman is murdered or injured, two victims are claimed -- the woman and her fetus -- not one. (Here I refer to this category of laws as "fetus-centered homicide laws.") Some of these laws consider the fetus a separate victim or a person only after certain stages of development or after a particular gestational age. Laws in at least 15 states apply to a fetus at any stage of development, starting at conception. To date, fetal homicide laws have withstood challenges on the basis of their constitutionality.

Opposing the legal recognition of a fetus as a second person may seem callous, especially when one considers the death of a wanted unborn baby due to violence late in the pregnancy. But while we can understand why people want prosecution to reflect the unique harm of an assault on a pregnant woman, this can be accomplished without recognizing the fetus as an entity separate from the mother who bears it. In over a dozen states, lawmakers have adopted the enhanced penalty approach, applying stiffer penalties for murdering a pregnant women, instead of recognizing the death of the fetus as a separate crime.

In other states, however, the need for political compromise prevented full consideration of this approach. In Alaska, for example, an early draft of a fetal homicide bill lacked a provision stipulating that the law should not be construed to permit the prosecution of a woman with respect to her fetus. Without this provision, for instance, a pregnant woman could be prosecuted for not leaving her abusive husband. After a battle to get the provision into the bill, a compromise was eventually reached. The provision was included, but it came at the expense of serious consideration of enhanced penalties, rather than recognizing a second victim.

Fetus-Centered Laws as a Response to Domestic Violence

Lawmakers and politicians drafted and passed the Unborn Victims of Violence Act and fetus-centered homicide laws under the auspices of taking violence against women (and to a lesser extent, drunk driving) more seriously. But, there are reasons to question this claim. First, congressional and legislative testimony suggests that the attention lawmakers and advocates have heaped on murdered fetuses has not been accompanied by in- depth consideration of the causes, characteristics, and consequences of domestic violence against women more generally or by affirmative steps to deal with the problem. For instance, the Republican majority failed on multiple occasions to fully fund the Violence Against Women Act. As Rep. Jerrold Nadler (NY) pointed out in a hearing on the UVVA before the House of Representatives:

It appears that many of the Members who have signed on to this bill are the same ones who voted to divert funds from protecting women from violence to protecting stock dividends from taxation.

Second, it is unclear how fetus-centered homicide laws can be expected to deter violence against pregnant women. What deters people from crime is not well understood. Even serious sanctions such as life imprisonment and capital punishment have not been found to be effective in deterring people from violent crime. And in the present case, fetus-centered homicide laws offer no additional deterrent effect. One cannot hurt a fetus without in some way hurting a pregnant woman, and it is already against the law to hurt or kill a woman.

Rather, I would argue that one effect of these laws is to push the pregnant woman herself into the background. By separating the damage done to a woman's unborn child, these laws detract from the harm inflicted against the woman herself. For instance, when Kansas HB 2300 languished in the state senate judiciary committee, a state senator commented, "Now the bill is dead -- and so is Chelsea's baby." One feels the need to remind the senator that Chelsea is dead as well. Fetus-centered homicide laws contribute to the perception that the harm is defined by the harm to the fetus rather than to the woman. In doing so, they contribute to the devaluation of women that makes violence against women a problem in the first place. Fetal homicide laws imply that violence against a pregnant woman is, by definition, 'worse' than violence against a woman who is not pregnant. Claims of fetal rights relegate the women who are being hit, demeaned, and violated to the status of baby carrier rather than human beings.

If fetus-centered homicide laws which treat the fetus as a second victim do not ameliorate the problem of domestic violence (and may contribute to it), and if it is possible for legislators to acknowledge the distinct nature of an assault or murder of a pregnant woman without making killing a fetus a second, separate offense, why have such laws been passed with such zeal in the first place?

Anti-abortion activists deny that fetal protectionist homicide laws were created to erode abortion rights or to re-criminalize abortion. But these denials should not be accepted at face value. The National Right to Life Committee maintains a website on unborn victims of violence that tracks changes in fetal homicide laws but dedicates no space on it to violence against women. In the three-page UVVA, the terms 'child', 'unborn child,' or 'unborn children' are used no less than 28 times, consistent with the conservative, anti-abortion rights orientation of many of its drafters.

Elsewhere, champions of fetus-centered laws have co-opted the language of the women's movement to garner support for their position and arguably mask their intent. The executive director of the Christian Legal Society, Samuel B. Casey, was quoted in the Washington Times defending the UVVA claiming that "if there ever was a bill to protect a woman's right to choose, it is this bill that seeks to deter violence against or at least provide justice to the pregnant woman who is choosing life for her unborn child only to see her choice deprived by a crime of violence against her and/or her child." As the reader may recall from the opening of this chapter, this is the same man who two years earlier had told the Los Angeles Times he intended to put as many laws as possible on the books recognizing that the embryo is a person in an effort to trump a woman's right to terminate her pregnancy.

The Unborn Victims of Violence Act explicitly states that nothing in the act "shall be construed to permit the prosecution ... of any woman with respect to her unborn child." But state statutes have used nearly identical language (often, as noted, only after hard-fought battles to get the language included in the first place) and then have gone on to prosecute pregnant women for their drug use in what has been called a "legislative bait and switch." Fetal protection laws not only represent a backdoor to abolishing abortion but also they leave open the possibility that the laws used to prosecute those who assault pregnant women may be directed against pregnant women themselves. In Missouri, for example, the state argued that the exception articulated in their fetus-centered homicide statute applied only to a woman who indirectly harmed her unborn child, not to a woman whose drug use was claimed to have directly endangered the child.

Claims of the need for fetal protection have been and will continue to be used to control and punish pregnant women, not protect them. Fetus-centered homicide laws are, at root, fetal protection laws. They simply are not designed to protect and support the woman who carries the fetus. I return to Marguerite Driessen for help in explaining the nature of what is at stake. She writes:

That the mother and her unborn child are inseparably connected, that what affects the former affects the latter, and that access to the latter is accomplished only through the former, is obvious. These facts have led some to conclude that this creates an utter dependency of the unborn child upon its mother such that the mother has a duty to do all in her power to nourish and protect it. These same facts have led others to conclude that the unborn child is not a severable entity at all, but rather is a part of the mother, and thus she can have no externally imposed obligations to the unborn child.

Arrests and prosecutions of women for continuing their pregnancy to term despite their use of illicit drugs, court orders, and civil commitments are examples of state-sanctioned efforts to externally impose such obligations. These efforts are rooted in our beliefs about who is fit to reproduce and what a 'good mother' looks like (see chapters 7 and 8). These measures, purportedly undertaken in the interest of fetal and child health, result in 'the normalization or standardization of motherhood. Only those who meet the state-enforced standard are permitted to reproduce without state interference.'

These cases also serve a larger political purpose by distracting attention from significant social problems such as our lack of universal health care, the dearth of policies to support pregnant and parenting women, an absence of social supports for children, and the overall failure of the drug war. Instead, we focus our attention on "bad" pregnant women who are poor and who use drugs. We expect them to provide their fetuses with the health care and safety that they themselves have not been guaranteed.

The state cannot act this way without at least tacit public support. In general, the public seems increasingly, if grudgingly, willing to consider illicit drug use a public health or medical problem. Public animosity toward poor women who use illicit drugs and become pregnant and give birth, however, persists. The hostility has been fueled by the antiabortion movement's claims of fetal rights, combined with false and exaggerated claims about the effects of prenatal exposure to cocaine on pregnancy outcomes, fetal and infant health, and early childhood development.

Click on the link for a copy of Our Bodies, Our Crimes: The Policing of Women’s Reproduction in America.

(c) 2009 NYU Press

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We Cannot Have It Both Ways
Posted by: bryangalt on Jan 31, 2009 3:25 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As a society, we have proven to be continuously conflicted between our belief in religion and our first hand knowledge in what is happening around us every day. The division between those of us that believe a fetus has more rights than someone who is already alive and here with us is not just a small crack, but a deep and stormy chasm.

I believe that the rights of the woman supercede the rights of the cellular mass organizing itself within her body. From my point of view, the idea that a woman is obligated to have a child or to make every effort to ensure that she has a child is ridiculous.

The primary problem that I have with the anti-abortion crowd is their utter lack of follow-up when/if there is a baby born. What I see from them is a virtual jihaddish behavior to force the woman to deliver a baby, then its "can you please leave the hospital within 6 hours since you don't have insurance, thank you" and "good luck bitch."

The anti-abortion crowd then kicks in their more true to self natures suddenly, the woman that has the baby becomes a slut that deserves what she gets because of her rampant screwing in the first place, so why should society be stuck with the bills to take care of her and her bastard child.

Here is my solution to the whole abortion issue:

1. MAKE THE PLANET A PLACE TO BE PROUD OF: The fact is, we are working overtime to wreck this planet as fast as possible, with the nitwits out there hoping for a Biblical fix and the other dumbasses hoping for a technological fix. As long as we cannot get ourselves together and make this a planet that future generations can live on, then abortions should not only remain legal, but should possibly become mandatory.

2. TAKING CARE OF YOUR FELLOW MAN: If the anti-abortion crowd could prove that they can work to help take care of everyone that is alive and the newborns too, along with fixing the problem in #1, it could be possible to start looking at making changes to the laws concerning religious freedoms (why not, if we are still thinking about taking away a woman's right to her own body, lets look at religious BS too).

3. REGARDLESS OF THE OUTCOME OF #1 AND #2: If we clean up our act and turn back global warming and suddenly Earth becomes the galactic HQ for Star Fleet, where everyone has a home, a job, health care and food in the replicator, it still won't make a bit of difference when it comes to the woman and her right to control her own body.

4. THE BEST DEFENSE IS A GOOD OFFENSE: To put an end to the abortion issue, I think the best thing that can happen is mandatory sex education and mandatory birth control measures such as norplant (placed upon puberty). If anyone thinks that teenagers aren't going to have sex with or without the norplant, they have forgotten their own youth and landed into a pile of denile).

In closing, I want to remind everyone that it is a known fact that the fetus does not have any brain wave activity until the beginning of the 7th month, so it is truly just a human-shaped mass of cells on auto-pilot until that moment. However, the poor soul carrying that mass is already alive and in need of our support, not or scorn, so start acting like intelligent beings for once, and show compassion for the ones that you know truly need it.

Bryan Galt's Blog
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» RE: We Cannot Have It Both Ways Posted by: 2thepoint
RE: Discarded Fetuses Are Reborn
Posted by: willymack on Jan 31, 2009 11:36 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What comic book did you get that from? No offense, but do you have ANY scientific education? If you can't get around the idea that everybody should have at least a nodding acquaintence with science, then I'm wasting my time here, or maybe you're pulling our leg.

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RE: Discarded Fetuses Are Reborn
Posted by: Ocean tides on Feb 1, 2009 8:53 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This has got to be tongue in cheek, or sarcasm at its ultimate, no??

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One situation where the children should have...
Posted by: Purple Girl on Jan 31, 2009 5:08 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The woman who just gave birth to 8 babies is a prime example of when the welfare of children should take precedence over the mother's wishes.
This Woman already had 6 children, when she obviously began fertility drug to become pregnant again. Were these 6 childrens needs being met first and Foremost, before she got knocked up with 8 more babies? Not to mention the fact that each of those 8 babies lives were endangered because of the liklihood some or all could die during the pregnancy, birth afterwards. What about their quaility of life being born 9 weeks early averaging only around 2 lbs each? There is a high liklihood all will have disabilities, what is their future?
Apparently she is so delusional she thinks she can produce enough milk to breast feed all these babies, what happens when they are all hungry at the same time- She's not a dog.
I've heard she is not married, so a second income will not be available during the time she is 'convalescing', and what kind of job can afford child care for 8 babies (WallStreet CEO?). apparently her retired father states he will have to go back to work; Where, in this economy? If she is not married What poor sap is going to be hit with Child support, was he aware she was on fertility drugs- which is costly to begin with (about 10,000 a round). How many of these children will WE have to support now and in the future?
regardless of what She wanted the medical profession should intervened on the behalf of 6 children she already has, the 8 embryos who's survival rate was questionable and society.
I am hoping social Services steps in to assure the 6 are being well cared for and begin to help her find families who could actually meet the needs of some of these babies. Then she should be sterilized.What if she had died during birth, what would have happened to the other 6?
She jepordized the life and welfare of all those children just to satisfy herself. If she could afford the fertility treatments, then she could have also afforded to have some of these babies to be carried by surrogates, if nothing else.
I don't consider her story a 'Miracle', I consider it an atrocity.

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» Reserve your judgement Posted by: Kelly
» RE: eserve your judgement Posted by: willymack
» Isn't it? Posted by: Kelly
» RE: Isn't it? Posted by: MLO
» RE: Isn't it? Posted by: VZEQICVA
» RE: Isn't it? Posted by: TheLimit
This comment has been removed from the site due to non-compliance with AlterNet's community policies.
» Don't click on that link! Posted by: GuitarBill
» RE: Don't click on that link! Posted by: GuitarBill
If you think that is bad.........
Posted by: AJR Journal on Jan 31, 2009 6:25 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
there is a movement in Wisconsin to ban smoking in bars and restaurants!
When will the State take its laws off of our bodies?

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biblical damage reports
Posted by: littlepitcher on Jan 31, 2009 6:40 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
1--The reason that some of us view the druggie who uses while pregnant with opprobrium is that we have to deal with the end products--teens who can't communicate, have limited, damaged short-term memory, no capacity for rational decision-making, and a reproductive capacity which the Bible-thumping, stump-shouting Christian defines as follows:

"The Lord says that we are to be fruitful and multiply."

This is the rationale behind the conservative's hatred of contraception. I caught it in the face this week after reiterating that I had remained childless because I did not want to pass on the birth defects which are a result of inbreeding in my family.

To Christians, this is a wrong decision.

To Islamics--and the mother of octuplets plus six more welfare babies is Iranian--the same statement is the word of a God defined best by Mark Twain--a malign thug.

Down with all Middle Eastern religions!

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» RE: Religious freedom Posted by: TheLimit
» RE: eligious freedom Posted by: Kelly
» RE: eligious freedom Posted by: TheLimit
Ain't I a woman?
Posted by: Kelly on Jan 31, 2009 8:40 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I was born to a drug-addicted, mentally ill teenaged mother and a father with Asperger's--and therefore spent much of my time growing up wishing I'd been aborted and fantasizing about killing them both. I am a woman, too. Didn't I have some sort of right to be protected from that situation?

Choice is a good thing, but what do you do when presented with someone who continually makes bad choices? How much should those choices be allowed to damage the helpless? Just a thought.

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» RE: Ain't I a woman? Posted by: VZEQICVA
» RE: Ain't I a woman? Posted by: Kelly
» RE: Ain't I a woman? Posted by: mtnprivy
» RE: Ain't I a woman? Posted by: Quannah
» RE: Ain't I a woman? Posted by: Kelly
» RE: Ain't I a woman? Posted by: TheLimit
» RE: Ain't I a woman? Posted by: Kelly
» RE: Ain't I a woman? Posted by: TheLimit
» RE: Ain't I a woman? Posted by: Quannah
And our state of Idaho has "honor killings" once every few years.
Posted by: Jason Jordan on Jan 31, 2009 8:42 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The worst case happened in 1989 where there was a tragedy where an abusive father killing his own teen daughter, Spring Adams, in bed at an abortion clinic. The law only required permission from one of the parents and despite her mother's permission, the man wouldn't have any of it. In fact, he raped and impregnated her which may explain everything. It took a long time to get him incarcerated. Nowadays, a guy can get away with it by using the "right to defense" NRA talking point.

A few months ago an abusive man killed his wife for having an abortion despite her life being at risk if she didn't have one. She didn't want it but her life was in jeopardy but he would have none of it. The man was later killed by his own parents since they were ashamed of the way he treated his own wife.

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MILLION DOLLAR BABIES, EIGHT OF THEM
Posted by: VZEQICVA on Jan 31, 2009 8:45 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
A woman with six children is not usually a candidate for fertility drugs. That was the first mistake. Sorry to reduce the innocent children to basics but we simply cannot afford this woman's selfish behavior. And WE are paying for this. A country that can't afford lunches for school children or proper care for our veterans. We need a good close look at our priorities. ANNA

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origin of california statute
Posted by: nerdyk on Jan 31, 2009 8:53 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I thought that this was an interesting and well-argued article, but I disagree with its conclusion.

Although statutes like the California statue do are not accompanied with an in-depth legislative investigation into the root causes of domestic violence, they are, at their core, meant to deter violence against pregnant women.

I think that the aforementioned statute enacted shortly after Keeler v. Superior Court of Amador County (470 P.2d 617) in which a pregnant woman was assaulted by her estranged husband, killing her unborn child. At the time, the state of California defined murder as "The unlawful killing of a human being" and defined human being to mean a person who had been born alive. In the Keeler case, the court ruled that because there was no pre-existing law that prosecuted such an offense, they could not prosecute for murder.

As a result of the decision, the California legislature amended Section 187 to broaden the definition of murder to encompass the death of a human being OR the death of a fetus. Politically, this may have been a hasty amendment that did not consider all of the root causes of domestic violence prior to its enactment, but I think its deterrant value (despite being difficult to calculate) is critically important.

I am not a lawyer, and my knowledge of legal theory is weak at best. I think that these statutes, though they may be problematic, have a very important place in our legal system.

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Just wait until it's over
Posted by: Kelly on Jan 31, 2009 3:19 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
One good global bird flu pandemic or asteroid strike will solve the problem--probably taking you and I along with it. In the grand scheme of things, we are nothing more than a blip on the radar. We are undoubtedly trashing the planet, but as a species, we tend to aggrandize our impact. Pray you don't live to see how fragile a species we really are.

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» oops--reply to mtnprvy Posted by: Kelly
right on!
Posted by: ladyoracle on Jan 31, 2009 3:55 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The fetus laws mentioned in this article exist as part of a concerted pro-life effort to erode abortion rights, and they are successful by plaguing on fear, nostalgia, and revenge. Attacks on pregnant women are awful, and they are quite common relatively speaking. We need to focus more on the fact that a pregnant woman is still a person endowed with all rights of personhood than worrying about the growth in her ovaries.

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» RE: right on! Posted by: nerdyk
» RE: Questions Posted by: TheLimit
What Pro-Lifers Believe
Posted by: DrBrian on Jan 31, 2009 6:52 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Perhaps the greatest irony, not to say inconsistency, associated with the putative pro-life movement is that the vast majority of its partisans are enthusiastically in favor of aggressive war, including slaughter of hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians; landmines and cluster bombs, which maim and kill innocents, mostly children and farmers, for decades after deployment; sanctions on countries such as Cuba and, formerly, Iraq, causing immense suffering to innocents and very little for their rulers; torture, including torture resulting in death in dozens of cases, many of whose victims have later been determined to be innocent; and capital punishment. They're also against health care programs for the poor, and against condom distribution and needle exchange, proven public health strategies to save lives and prevent disease.

Pro-conceptus they may be, but pro-life they assuredly are not.

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» Irony Posted by: Kelly
» RE: Irony Posted by: Cytocop
» Jesus Was a Pacifist Posted by: DrBrian
» I Believe this claim is false Posted by: BobbyGreyFriar
» Fanatics? Posted by: ReallyBearish
I have four kids
Posted by: mombot on Feb 1, 2009 5:00 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
While having kids doesn't qualify me as an expert in medical things, I do know all the stages of a pregnancy and then some. I don't think that fetuses need additional rights because it makes the pregnant woman a less valued person than the fetus. More protections for the pregnant woman will automatically protect the fetus. The fetus is dependant upon the PW for everything. If the PW is killed, it makes sense that the fetus will die, too. So, make the laws more stringent for killing a pregnant woman, but not separate provision for a fetus.

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» RE: I have four kids Posted by: VZEQICVA
On the dignity of cells
Posted by: chance garden on Feb 1, 2009 10:11 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Ovum are living cells, animated with the same energy force that animates all living forms, indeed so are sperm cells...yet we do not make the claim that an unfertilized ovum has rights, or that sperm have rights...if the argument is made that human rights begin at fertilization...aren't we disenfranchising the sperm and ovum cells of their dignity?

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Over-Population is The Root Cause Behind Almost All Our Problems
Posted by: ATH on Feb 1, 2009 4:20 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The earth has limited resources. Man has already severely depleted many of these resources.

The fact is, there are simply too many people on this planet. The result is starvation, sickness, the destruction of the habitats of animals, even the extinction of many species, global warming, increaed use of chemicals to maintain the industrialized agriculture that has allowed this population explosion..The use of all these chemicals like pesticides, and the even more potentially dangerous use of genetically modified foods, contribute to growing disease rates, especally in regard to cancer, which causes medical costs to rise...We have taken nature out of the equation, by keeping alive people who would never have survived in a natural world. I'm not saying this is all bad, but when people live longer, and can live despite what was once mortal conditions, we must realize the effect this has.

Just about every major problem we face would not exist if it weren't for the extreme over-population of planet earth. And nature will work to correct this imbalance. This kind of imbalance, this type of overcrowding, in our modern world, sets the stage for the ultimate pandemic. It is not a question of if, but when, and how bad.

The truth is, the Republicans support anti-abortion laws for one reason: they want lots of babies who were unwanted, unaffordable, etc, etc. because they grow up to be the perfect recruits for the military--people with no hope but the false one given by the Military Industrial Complex (MIC) which owns the Repugnican Party, and quite a few Democrats as well. President Dwight Eisenhower warned us about the growing influence of the MIC, but we didn't listen. If Repugnicans truly cared about life, their concern wouldn't end the moment the baby was born, and then pop up again right when they're ripe for recruitment. After all, we can't have THEIR children going to fight these wars! And their care ends again soon as the soldier becomes a veteran. Veterans make up an enormous % of the homeless.

We need, as another poster said, to make sex education and the distribution of free condoms and other forms of contraception available for free, or as cheaply as possible. Sex education should be mandatory, in ALL schools, public & private-even Catholic schools, around the world.

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But fetuses do matter.
Posted by: Hans B on Feb 1, 2009 5:15 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
While I theoretically would agree with this article, I also remember a happening which contradicts it. One day I was accosted in the street by a distraught, stark naked, highly pregnant woman, who apparently had been thrown out of her home by her "friend". She asked me to help her get her clothes back, and we went to her house (or that of her friend, I don't know). A man came storming out and started kicking her in the stomach with incredible violence. I managed to pin him down while bystanders called the police, but the harm was probably done.

If he had kicked her in the back, the pain might have been the same but the act would have been much less shocking. The guy wasn't just trying to hurt a woman, he was also trying to kill a baby, albeit an unborn one.

Now I don't believe humanity begins at conception, but as a father of two I also know it doesn't start with the first breath of air. Attempting to crush a nine-month old fetus is something quite different from taking a morning-after pill. That doesn't mean I'm in favor of legislating it. In some cases laws simply aren't the best vehicle, and fetus protection is one of them.

But that recognition, that the law should stay out of it, does not in turn mean that the unborn child doesn't matter at all, and that a crushed nine-month-old fetus is relevant only insofar as the mother was hurt in the process.

Here is where some right-to-choosers, such as the author of this article, in my opinion go astray. In defense of the political argument that the fetus should not have legal status, they argue that it doesn't exist, except perhaps as dead matter, a thing. But it does exist, and that existence becomes more prominent and more precious as the pregnancy draws to a close. There's no real difference one second before birth and one second after it: it's the same child, no matter what the law says.

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» RE: But fetuses do matter. Posted by: nerdyk
» RE: But fetuses do matter. Posted by: TheLimit
» RE: But fetuses do matter. Posted by: TheLimit
Whatch where this goes
Posted by: Crazed Liberal1 on Feb 1, 2009 10:39 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The theocratic right who from all the obvious evidence don't respect our right to live our lives as we choose w/ religious freedom, privacy, and the ability of women to control their reproductive functions as they see fit...
At some point, the right will use the law or similar ones passed on the state level, which have key provisions and definition w/ the purpose of making abortion a crime...the next step would be court cases and court rulings by right-wing judges finding an abortion of a fetus is murder for which the woman is responsible and jail is the punishment.
We must stop this from happening

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