We're going to provide healthcare for an additional 47 million people (including 10 million illegal aliens), improve coverage for those that already have it, spend $900 trillion, and NOT raise the deficit one penny?? Obama is just pissin on us and telling us it's raining. And he's gonna be the LAST president to address health reform?? How arrogant!

Oh, and thanks Obama for FINALLY admitting that Bush was right on tort reform and that you Democrats were wrong for blocking it when Bush was president.

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Reviewing President Rahm Emanuel's Health Care Speech

"Not to be too much of a downer, but I found Obama's speech tonight a big O-bummer. Really, other than his very important reminder that "we're all in this together," it was disappointing (although that's probably not the right word, because it implies I expected something more). And remember, while I have at times been critical of Obama, I've been very supportive of him on health care...up until tonight. Here's a list of my basic problems:

- Why do Republican presidents and politicians never bash "The Right," but President Obama uses a joint session speech to bash "The Left?"

- Obama felt the need to tell the country that he's devoted to making sure the wildly unpopular private insurance industry at the heart of the health care meltdown remains profitable. He also made sure to forget that Americans love Medicare and hate private insurance when he went out of his way to reiterate his support for "market" economics (shocker - this was the line both parties stood up and gave a thundering round of applause). Awesome.

- Completely unclear why Obama promised to "call out lies," and then proceeded to embrace the Right's most dishonest narrative about tort reform being a major vehicle to fix health care (not surprisingly, the "don't negotiate with legislative terrorists" lesson was reinforced when the GOP response called Obama's bluff and pushed to work with him on tort reform).

- The wavering on the public option would be hilarious if it wasn't so serious. Really - his insistence that he supports it but might also support removing it reminded me of a Saturday Night Live skit parodying wavering and waffling Democrats. Obviously he just had to listen to pundits insisting he must abandon the public option, when a huge majority of Americans continue to support it, and he has a huge legislative majority in Congress. He obviosuly just HAS to compromise on it because...well...just because - and he certainly can't use reconciliation like President Bush did because...well, again, just because. And, of course, those of us who don't expect him to compromise away an already compromised yet still wildly popular public option are obviously on the radical fringe regardless of polling data. Obviously!

- Though he didn't draw a direct equivalence, he implied there was one between the progressive push for single payer and the ultra-conservative push to destroy the entire health care system. Sick.

In sum, when you couple this with the speech's fawning praise for lunatics like John McCain and Chuck Grassley and add to it the news that the White House is holding closed-door compromise meetings with corporate Democrats tomorrow, I felt like I was listening to a parsed screed by President Rahm Emanuel, not a call to arms from the Barack Obama who actually ran for president. There was lots of passionate talk about the problem, and little courage to demand a serious solution.

I mean, I seem to remember an election just a few months ago that resulted in a Democratic president, and huge Democratic majorities in Congress - and I seem to remember there was a Barack Obama who only a short while ago said geting those electoral results was the only obstacle to a full-on single payer health care system, much less a weakened public option. But again, I guess it's just too bad that after that election, President Emanuel now rules America."

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Another brilliant liar in the White House.


FREE AMERICA

REVOLUTIONARY (DIRECT) DEMOCRACY

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Rahm ISRAEL Emmanuel's hand up the sock puppet Obama's ass? Or was it the CEO of CIGNA "Health"(sic)? Next week the Joint Chiefs will work the puppets mouth when he requests more troops for Afghanistan (or is it Pakistan? Iran?).

Hey where do I get in line to stick my hand up the sock puppet's ass? I have a few things I'd like him to say like "I repeal the Patriot Act, Military Commissions Act, John Warner Defense Authorization 2007, Homeland Security, the War on Terror, the War on Drugs, the Bush Doctrine, extraordinary rendition and YES I will support a new investigation of 9/11. Oh, and one more thing...Osama Bin Laden is dead and any politician who mentions his name is LYING"

One
Big
Ass
Mistake
America

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Often we fall into the endorphine trap ...that is that when great words are spoken the heart soars , and that as long as we have these 'good intentions '...failure is acceptable

Change (social justice) will not come to America , under the prevailing conditions . The' opposite 'is what will actually occur , because the market place and the financial system now demands the destruction of all that is not profitable , and to do so it must intensify competition , and squeeze more out of all workers .

This is the over riding logic and 'necessity ' that willl dictate what ''actually happens ''.

Fancy words and calls to the 'character of our nation' will just be endorphic injections to provide some 'cerebral illusion and replacement for the real thing .

The real 'moral character of America' is the FACT that those with the most and who created this crisis are 'MORALLY OUTRAGED'that they should pay an extra cent on their tax to pay for it .

For what was 'once' the richest country in the world it has NEVER found the 'MORAL STRENGTH OF CHARACTER' to protect the very health of ALL its people .

As the song goes....''Take a good look at yourself ''

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From Progressive Democrats of America - Illinois, August 30:

Congressman Dennis Kucinich (D-OH) told 100 PDA and Single-Payer supporters meeting in Central Ohio recently that the Democratic legislation related to health insurance mandates currently moving through Congress is deeply flawed and should be defeated. The bill, HR 3200, would require people to buy insurance. It also makes provisions for an as yet undefined 'public option' plan that would be available to a relatively small portion of the population*. (See below.)

Kucinich said that HR 3200 would actually worsen our nation's health care system. The legislation, according to Kucinich, would enshrine private insurance--the cause of our health care crisis--into the nation's health care system, giving private insurance companies a permanent role that would make true cost reduction impossible.

The Congressman also stated that he would vote against HR 3200 even if his own amendment is included. (The Kucinich amendment would clear federal barriers to state-based single-payer programs.) Instead, the Congressman said he would offer his amendment as stand alone legislation.

Kucinich's strong announcement is probably intended to cut through the confusion and conflict that has arisen among health care activists, progressives, union leaders, adn the Democrats about whether to support the so-called 'public option' as an incremental step toward achieving honest reform of the country's broken health care system. Single payer supporters such as PDA insist that the public option is more deception than solution and that only Single-Payer (Medicare for All) can bring guaranteed affordable and quality health care to all.

Kucinich's announcement adds to the rising chorus of criticism aimed at Obama's failure to champion the progressive reforms promised during his campaign, but particularly in health care. In addition to critics on the left, mainstream liberal such as Paul Krugman and Robert Reich have recently castigated Obama and the Democratic Party leaders for their repeated concessions to corporate donors on issues of banking, health care, EFCA, and war.

Recently, on Bill Maher's program, Bill Moyers, the conscience of American journalism, delivered a blunt critique of Obama, the Democratic leadership, and especially, Rahm Emanuel, for caving in to corporate contributors and then trying to hush criticism from the left.

Moyers also tacitly supported Kucinich's call to defeat HR 3200. Bill Moyers said, "I would rather see Obama go down fighting for vigorous, strong, principled public insurance, than to lose with a corporate-dominated bill..."

Currently, it looks like Obama may indeed lose with his corporate friendly bill. But what would have happened if he had supported Single-Payer from the very beginning?

See more articles at PDA-IL's Progressive Reads:

-Montana Gov. plugs Single-Payer at Obama event. Prez not happy. RU? Please call Montana w/Kudos

- Joe Scarborough Is Shocked, Yet Awed by Single-Payer Logic

- Arne Duncan and Barack Obama's "Race to the Top"
_____
* "According to the Congressional Budget Office, the 'public options' described in the Democrats' legislation might enroll 10 million people and will have virtually no effect on health care costs, which means the 'public options' cannot, by themselves, have any effect on the number of insured.

Bait and Switch: How the 'Public Option' Was Sold

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for any typos in the above, as yours truly had to type it out, not knowing how to cut-and-paste.


Also, I cut out the header, "Medina, Ohio," and all opening quotation marks which traditionally appear at the beginning of each paragraph in a quoted document: It was necessary in order to fit it all into one post.

Finally, I also omitted the attributions for the last link - you can see them, if you follow the link - and the usual PDA ad and such. (I don't really apologize for omitting the ad - just had to include reporting it in this statement of incompleteness.)

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Look you guys -- you all know as well as I do that it's the people with REAL MONEY to spend that really matter -- and you can bet your damn LIFE that this bill is already secretly co-written by insurers & other wealthy contributors, and is in the process of being approved by the real powers. After all the fake B.S. bickering (as if we couldn't see through it) the REAL bill will be steamrolled through and signed with no real discussion.

I think we here all know that Congress & Barack have NO REAL POWER. Their power has been purchased by the highest bidder. And Barack, as was George, & Bill, & Ronnie, and Jimmie, and on and on, are only PUPPETS!! Come on guys!!! It DOES NOT MATTER if someone is Democrat or Republican!!! They answer to the same people!! And you can bet NONE OF THEM have people's true interests at heart!!

I have said this here before, and I will say it again this morning: Talking, blogging, calling our so-called "representatives" & the President -- has done and WILL DO NOTHING -- EVER!!! The only thing they understand is the EXERCISE OF RAW POWER -- MASSIVE COLLECTIVE CONSCIOUSNESS!!

A MASSIVE GENERAL STRIKE will be the ONLY thing they will understand -- When we QUIT being their corporate slaves and dollar slaves, we FREE OURSELVES AUTOMATICALLY!! So what if you have bills to pay -- don't pay!!! So what if you go a little hungry in a strike situation -- everything will work out in the end. PEOPLE HAVE SOME BALLS!!! If we say we want this big political change in this country, and we do, we CANNOT DO IT through "normal" means, and you all have to see that by now!!!

Everyone -- EVERYONE -- walk off their jobs -- big and small companies -- and stop paying your bills (the better to deny income to credit-companies) Who really gives a shit about "good credit" when everyday the Man has you by the balls?? What does it matter in the end -- answer -- it doesn't!!!

Anyway -- NOBODY WORK -- PERIOD. Shut down the US economy ALL THE WAY. Let's see how these motherfuck*rs react to THAT!! No matter what they do -- DO NOT WORK PERIOD -- for AS LONG AS IT TAKES to get CAPITULATION FROM THE RULERS on our agenda!! Let 'em try to "order" people to go "back to work" -- DON'T DO IT!! -- let 'em lock people up for not working -- it will only ENRAGE THE MASSES MORE and create more MASS CONSCIOUSNESS of change!!!

If we are serious about socialism, we will PUT OUR VERY LIVES ON THE LINE to inplement it here!! If we are serious about change, the time has passed to do things by elections...

the only way we will be heard is when we have the powers-that-be BY THE BALLS and START TO PULL -- hard!!!

Get off you asses people -- start talking to EVERYONE YOU KNOW -- whether or not you at first think they will support this idea -- get the plan out there

Let's SHUT 'EM DOWN!!!

MATT -- Richmond VA

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It's going to be welcomed by the purists who can't accept that Rome wasn't built in a day.

It's red meat to the people who think that government should spend money on "defense" and let "free" enterprise run everything else.

It's another opportunity for those who like to despise their neighbors as "sheeple".

It's an opening for those who worship Ralph Nader and then misrepresent those suspending judgment as Obamabots.

And of course, it's a gift to the out-and-proud racists who can't discriminate between fantasy and evidence.

Everyone is entitled to their world view, but they also have a moral obligation to be as honest and fair and open-minded as possible.

Obama is highly intelligent and an unquestionably gifted orator. He can inspire and he has the power of veto, but it is Congress that is going to produce the bill. With any luck, many millions of Americans will be much better off. Like universal education, universal healthcare is a wise and prudent investment.

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Brilliant: why don't you buy some and take lots. A young maintenance man in my apartment building did just that. He is now dead. If you run into him in the Afterworld, say hi for me.

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...while Alternet looks the other way. Why even have a "report this comment" link?

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.

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President Obama made it clear that if there were some other way to get health-insurance companies to lower their premiums rather than having a public option, then he would be open to it.

But we all know that there is no other way. The health-insurance companies have a monopoly, and they employ it ruthlessly. This is because, for them, health insurance is a profit-making scheme, not a means of helping people when they're sick. This is why they would rather deny claims than pay them whenever they can find a loophole in a policy. This is why they relentlessly raise their premiums just because a person has had another birthday. (My Humana Medicare Supplement jumped 35% in one year--just because reached age 75--and Humana's premiums aren't the lowest, either.)

Why are the Republicans dead-set against a public option, when we know it would lower costs for millions of Americans? The answer is obvious. These are the same people who fought against Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid. They consider health-care to be part of the free market, with more profits going to the companies that can squeeze as much as possible from a helpless citizenry. But we all know how free-market thinking crashed and burned in the latest recession. Something as important as health care should not be traded on a free-booting market. Health care should instead be considered a right, rather than a way for companies to make money. An even more insidious reason for Republican obstructionism is that the ones railing against the real reform of health care are the ones whose re-election campaign coffers are filled with health-insurance company contributions.

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I think it needs too be said that one of the problems with 'Progressive s' is that they indulge in the minutae . They love all the legal wrangling . The tit for tat . The micro analysis of legislation and the rest.

Sorry but this is just a waste of time .

The reason we're having this conversation . The reason why the Town Halls are bursting with angry people , is because the "Profit system" has FAILED!!!!.

That is the central issue here .The failure of health care is the failure of the free market to provide on a sustainable and egalitarian basis.

It has collapsed and with it will go health care .

Things arent 'progressively' going to get better , there actually quickly going to get worse !!!

Thats the bottom line . Staring at your navel and picking hairs won't cut it .

You need to grasp the 'essence 'of the 'whole' to make sense of the 'part '.

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I thought it was a great speech - it's hard not to like him.. but thats the problem..he didnt say much... his statements on healthcare not increasing the deficit is wrong or misleading..every analysis available shows that it will..We also know that illegals will be able to purchase insurance under the public option..even though he says it wont..

so again, a nice speech, personable guy - not much substance or truth!

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Fred Flintstone said:

" "Universal Education" produces a nice homogenized product ready for Walmart employment. They'll never complain about their shitty wages and will never even THINK about questioning the store manager let alone the board of directors. Yes, "education" really cranks out the SHEEPLE. "

Fred, AMEN 10,000% to that, my brother !! It's time for all these sheeple around us to wake up and realize that the Democrats and Replublicans are one and the same, all puppets of financiers. Ol' Barack has already sold us out -- he didn't even wait a month after swear-in to begin breaking promises!!

I think Barack has potential to be even worse than li'l George -- at least with Georgie, we KNEW what he was about -- with Barack, he keeps changing his stories, and he's good at fooling the sheeple -- with masses of adoring "obama-bots" doing the Illuminati's bidding -- without even knowing it!!

Like you said, education is geared toward producing obedient, unquestioning little robots, sheeple with no independent thought, who just do whatever they see on TV, who are addicted to work-a-day shitty Target-Wal-Mart-Kmart-type worthless jobs, while spending all their money on bills, with no money left for savings or anything else...with no change in sight...

Like the post I wrote here earlier, the time has passed for talk, calling "representatives", dumb-ass sign-carrying "protests", and all that. The time is here for EXTREME action -- massive work stoppages, economic shutdowns - THAT kind of action --

Now THAT would scare the FUCK out of the Controllers, wouldn't you say??

Each time I post on Alternet and other "progressive" sites about general strikes and the futility of continuing to stupidly elect and trust Democrats who sell us out each and every time, I am repeatedly attacked by people who I believe are totally blinded by the system -- they have a hard time expanding their thoughts past little "protests" and letter-writing and e-mailing and blogging, etc as means for changes in the country. I try not to take their attacks personally; I just believe that they have not de-programmed themselves all the way yet of all the years of educational, social, & media conditioning that causes them to think in limited ways...

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Without a veto from the president on a bill without a public option, this health care package will deliver billions of dollars more to health insurance and do nothing to keep them in check....the article is BS BS BS BS!

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The President is hobbling forward on aluminum crutches, across the hot charcoals of imperatives and obstructionism, wearing eloquent asbestos boots and using his silver tongue to snatch flies out of the air.

I am far less than overwhelmed.

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Just think of the dollars that could be saved if we had a single payor healthcare option. To illustrate, a word problem: $1.00 of coverage is broken down to 65 cents paying for healthcare, 35 cents to ins co's. If 18% of Americans are without healthcare (50 million) plus another 40-50 million underinsured, could the extra savings of 35% pay for the influx of newly covered Americans? Based on a population of 300 million, adding 1/3 additional Americans into the mix to be covered in healthcare should be a wash because the savings from insurance co's would be approximately 33 to 35% of each healthcare dollar. Remember, the people without insurance are in the 19 to 65 age group, for the main, healthier as a demographic. The elderly, disabled, those injured at work (work comp) and in auto accidents are already carved out through other programs. MEdicare is already in existence with an infrastructure that works with a cost overhead of 2-3%, use it!

Those that will not be working in healthcare could be retrained in green jobs and bringing manufacturing back to America. It's a win/win all the way around.

But, like many, I have a pipe dream. This will be the biggest f'g giveaway to insurance co's in the history of our country. Traitors.

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Percentage change since 2002 in average premiums paid to large US health-insurance companies: +87%

GET IT ?

Percentage change in the profits of the top ten insurance companies: +428%

UNDERSTAND THIS ?

Chances that an American bankrupted by medical bills has health insurance: 7 in 10

FEEL PROUD ?

- Harper’s Index, September 2009

They hold sick children hostage as they force parents to bankrupt themselves in the desperate scramble to pay for medical care.

This is an industry that hires doctors and analysts to deny care to patients in order to increase profits. It is an industry that causes half of all bankruptcies.

And the 20,000 Americans who died last year because they did not receive adequate care condemn these corporations as complicit in murder.
linked text

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For over 10 years I had no health insurance. I am the working poor (and at 68 I am still having to work to survive). My job did not provide insurance, and on my small salary I could not afford private insurance. I made just a few dollars over the limit to qualify for Medicaid. It is only by the grace of God/Goddess/Universe that I made it to 65 in one piece and was able to get Medicare. There are millions of people who live as I did and cannot afford even a few dollars out of their meager earnings to buy insurance. Obama says we will all be required to buy insurance.....how in hell can anyone in the position I was manage to do that???
The only thing that is fair and will work for everyone is Single Payer...just give Medicare to everyone. Single Payer works in the rest of the world, it will work here. And for those that want, and can afford, more than a Single Payer system will provide, they can opt to pay for the extras they want. The only problem in this country is the massive insurance companys and Big Pharma who are running the show and do not want to give up one dollar of their disgustngly excessive profits. Obama and the Congress are supporting the insurance and pharmacutical companys over what's best for the people.

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In addition to the comments by everyone calling for single payer, I would like to add that Obama is most likely used to accepting the notion that Big Insurance/Pharma is somehow good for America. In his speech last night, he sounded as if he put more blame on the little guy as if they're to blame for everything. When people are out of work or working in jobs where they are provided with no health care coverage, for Obama to say that Big Insurance is our friend would make their blood boil given that as an individual, purchasing insurance can prove too costly. Additionally, even if you do purchase what appears to be the best of insurance, you find yourself with more copays and find out that such and such is not covered or that you thought it was covered by the wording of the policy. By now, it should be clear to most everyone after last night's silly dilly speech that there will be no health care reform but instead health care deform.

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I do not know who the "we" are, but I bet they are few and far between.

Oh, yeah the Obamabots keep the faith and keep believing. But as Ben Franklin said "The way to see by faith is to shut the eye of reason."

The man is a fraud and was since day 1 of his campaign. The proof came when he was elected and then essentially continued the Shrubs policies.

Anything less than single payer is an even bigger fraud and should not be fought for by anyone, as it will just be a piece of sh$t that Bam Bam can point at to be re-elected.

As Bill Moyers has tacitly stated in his support for Kucinich's call to defeat HR 3200: "I would rather see Obama go down fighting for vigorous, strong, principled public insurance, than to lose with a corporate-dominated bill..."

Let's face it Obama is a corporate whore and/or the weakest leader this country may ever see. If he had any balls I would kick his one term wonders back to where the sun does not shine.

..."what we have been waiting for"...give me a break..

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The President hit a huge one out of the park last night in the bottom of the 7th inning.

Victory for US health care reform is clearly in sight.

Looks like history will be made within about a year after a historical moment of monumental proportions for the US was made last November.(the election of our very first Afro-American President)

Dr. Rick Lippin

PS- A crass and rude opposing player was “tossed out” thus helping the President's team

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Just ignore the Rethuglicans and pass a bill including a Public Option. Tweak it later. In 1965, Medicare was pretty "controversial" too, but the votes for it were there, and of course, it's been tweaked a few times since it was established.

Now we have the idiot teabaggers protesting, "Keep the government out of my Medicare!"

The economy is going to come back with a roar in '10, especially if you pass this bill - business won't admit it, but they'll be relieved to start getting the health insurance monkey off their back - so no need to worry much about the Rethuglicans regaining control of Congress.

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To me -- Barack's ideas and the so-called "plans" in Congress are worse than the "system" we have now !! If it isn't single-payer, it is a total win-win for drug / health "care" / insurance industries!!! Do we really want people to be charged with a crime for not buying insurance, and enriching yet another insurance company??

I sincerely hope that nothing is done at all about this, even though that means people will go without health care even longer, because the longer this shit continues, and gets worse, the more the case for single-payer universal coverage will make itself !!

See, we need for the situation to get so bad that unstoppable mass collective consciousness finally forms & comes together, demanding single-payer a la Canada/England/France, etc. It might take a while, but trust me, it will eventually happen...

...Or, as I've said many times, we could organize and implement a massive national strike that would shutdown the U.S. economy -- until these "leaders" are forced to capitulate to the people's demands for universal coverage, as well as implementing public campaign financing, and maybe term limits as well...

All I know is that neither Democrats or Republicans represent ANY REGULAR PERSONS interests -- they are one and the same -- and they sure as fuck don't represent the "people" -- that is, until a "peoples'" revolt & revolution forces them to...

MATT 'n Richmond VA

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Our local news reported that if insurance is "required" to be purchased and a person does not, there will be a $3800 penalty. Where and paid to whom is a mystery. TRAITORS!!!!!!!!!!

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PEOPLE:

LISTEN TO DENNIS KUCINICH. THE PUBLIC OPTION OBAMA IS ADVERTISING IS A MANDATE TO SECURE AN EVEN STRONGER HOLD OF INSURANCE COMPANIES ON HEALTHCARE. STOP BEING PLAYED FOR FOOLS WITH HIS RHETORIC AND SMOOTH TALKING!!
IT WILL FORCE PEOPLE WHO ALREADY DO NOT HAVE THE MONEY TO BUY HEALTHCARE. IT IS NOT SINGLE PAYER MEDICARE FOR ALL HEALTHCARE -- IT IS THE OPPOSITE.
THE DEFICIT MEANS NOTHING -- IT IS SMOKE AND MIRRORS USED BY ELITISTS TO SCARE YOU INTO NOT ASKING OR GETTING WHAT THE REST OF THE INDUSTRIALIZED NATIONS HAVE -- HEALTHCARE FOR ALL. IT IS A BASIC HUMAN RIGHT.
STOP REINFORCING THE BUZZ WORDS THAT THE ELITISTS (OBAMA INCLUDED) WANT YOU TO USE. WE DO NOT WANT THE PUBLIC OPTION. KILL HR 3200.
WE WANT SINGLE-PAYER HEALTHCARE (PAID BY THE GOVERNMENT PLAN VIA OUR TAX DOLLARS DIRECTLY TO HEALTHCARE PROVIDERS, NOT INSURANCE COMPANIES).
THIS IS THE PLAN CURRENTLY PROVIDED TO ALL OF CONGRESS -- SINGLE PAYER.
WHY ARE CONGRESS AND OBAMA RECEIVING SINGLE PAYER HEALTHCARE AND NOT THE REST OF THE COUNTRY???
REPUBLICANS PRETEND TO DISAGREE WITH OBAMA BUT THEY LOVE HIM! HE IS ONE OF THEM AND HIS VOTES IN CONGRESS PROVED THAT. HE IS NOT A NICE GUY.
WAKE UP!!!

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Sorry cheerleaders - We got sold out last nite. THE SPEECH with a few comments shows why.

OUR GOODY BAG

"Under this plan, it will be against the law for insurance companies to deny you coverage because of a pre-existing condition. As soon as I sign this bill, it will be against the law for insurance companies to drop your coverage when you get sick or water it down when you need it most. They will no longer be able to place some arbitrary cap on the amount of coverage you can receive in a given year or a lifetime. We will place a limit on how much you can be charged for out-of-pocket expenses, because in the United States of America, no one should go broke because they get sick. And insurance companies will be required to cover, with no extra charge, routine checkups and preventive care, like mammograms and colonoscopies - because there's no reason we shouldn't be catching diseases like breast cancer and colon cancer before they get worse. That makes sense, it saves money, and it saves lives."

NOD (BUT LITTLE MORE) TO THE PUBLIC OPTION (The public option would only apply to five percent of the population (.05 x 300 million = 15 million covered) - and not all the uninsured):

"The public option is only a means to that end - and we should remain open to other ideas that accomplish our ultimate goal...some have suggested that that the public option go into effect only in those markets where insurance companies are not providing affordable policies. Others propose a co-op or another non-profit entity to administer the plan. These are all constructive ideas worth exploring.

"It is only one part of my plan, and should not be used as a handy excuse for the usual Washington ideological battles. To my progressive friends, I would remind you that for decades, the driving idea behind reform has been to end insurance company abuses and make coverage affordable for those without it. The public option is only a means to that end - and we should remain open to other ideas that accomplish our ultimate goal."

INSURANCE COMPANIES RULE! AND TAX CREDITS TOO BUT LET'S WAIT SOME MORE

"That's why under my plan, individuals will be required to carry basic health insurance - just as most states require you to carry auto insurance

"We will do this by creating a new insurance exchange - a marketplace where individuals and small businesses will be able to shop for health insurance at competitive prices. Insurance companies will have an incentive to participate in this exchange because it lets them compete for millions of new customers

"For those individuals and small businesses who still cannot afford the lower-priced insurance available in the exchange, we will provide tax credits, the size of which will be based on your need. And all insurance companies that want access to this new marketplace will have to abide by the consumer protections I already mentioned. This exchange will take effect in four years, which will give us time to do it right. In the meantime, for those Americans who can't get insurance today because they have pre-existing medical conditions, we will immediately offer low-cost coverage that will protect you against financial ruin if you become seriously ill.

"making a not-for-profit public option available in the insurance exchange. Let me be clear - it would only be an option for those who don't have insurance. No one would be forced to choose it, and it would not impact those of you who already have insurance. In fact, based on Congressional Budget Office estimates, we believe that less than 5% of Americans would sign up.

ABORTION - AND CHOICE - ARE BAD BAD THINGS - EXCEPT FOR THE RIGHT

"no federal dollars will be used to fund abortions, and federal conscience laws will remain in place"

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I have been following this debate with amazement. Throughout the world there are a range of ways in which countries organize their health care, some are completely government run, others are run by private enterprise and then there are those that have a mix of private and public systems working side by side. All of them have just one simple objective: to provide health cover for all citizens. The costs of providing universal health care in these nations seems to be much lower than the cost of providing limited coverage in the USA.
How is it that the world's richest nation cannot look after all of its citizens? How is it that a country that in many ways is so caring can tolerate that some of its citizens are denied basic health care?
I have always been struck by the compasionate nature of the Americans that I have met. Can it be that only compasionate Americans travel overseas? Or is there something else at work here? Surely if Americans can agree that all citizens should have access to universal health care they could make that happen? Surely no American would deny a fellow American access to health care?
Is this really an issue one can afford to be partisan about?

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ANOTHER LIMITATION: GOVERNMENT WONT REALLY GET INVOLVED - THE INSURANCE COMPANIES ARE SOOOOO CORRECT!

"the insurance companies and their allies don't like this idea. They argue that these private companies can't fairly compete with the government. And they'd be right if taxpayers were subsidizing this public insurance option. But they won't be. I have insisted that like any private insurance company, the public insurance option would have to be self-sufficient and rely on the premiums it collects"


LET'S NOT HAVE PATIENTS BUTCHERED AND KILLED BY DOCS AND HOSPITALS BE ABLE TO SUE - AND LETS TOSS LAWYERS OVER THE SIDE - LIKE WE WE HAVE DONE WITH THE LBGT FOLKS, LABOR, AND OTHERS

"many in this chamber - particularly on the Republican side of the aisle - have long insisted that reforming our medical malpractice laws can help bring down the cost of health care. I don't believe malpractice reform is a silver bullet, but I have talked to enough doctors to know that defensive medicine may be contributing to unnecessary costs. So I am proposing that we move forward on a range of ideas about how to put patient safety first and let doctors focus on practicing medicine. I know that the Bush Administration considered authorizing demonstration projects in individual states to test these issues. It's a good idea, and I am directing my Secretary of Health and Human Services to move forward on this initiative today"

Props to placton for this

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Are you in the bag for Obama? This is the Senate Bill with Obama's endorsement- not a thing more. As badly as I desire to see healthcare financing reform I cannot support this bill. It's as big a handout to Insurance as the Medicare D bill was to big Pharma.

I'll take nothing before this Turd from President Rahm.

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People with cars and houses do not realize that there are many of us who actually run out of money between paychecks, we don't have any extra cash to spend on anything. Now I see with Obama, I'm going to be left out of coverage again. If it's free to low-income only, once again people like me who make just a little more income than low income will be screwed. They will tell me I can afford $100 a month when I honestly can't. I already am having this experience now in California.

Just expand MEDICARE to everyone and who cares if scrooge insurance companies fail. They deserve to fail. They have failed!

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...on Tara in Afghanistan, Iraq, the looming collapse of Medicare, the more distant collapse of social security, infringements into our civil liberties by Bush and his bipartisan Congress, addressing the problem of lobbyists writing legislation for their clients, rather than legislators writing it for their constituents...

Where'd your change go? Mine went for a cup of coffee, but at least I got what I expected.

Back to health care, since that seems to be the only thing that folks are selfish enough to focus on at once: why not a real public option? As in, you can opt-in to the government's health system and pay accordingly, or opt-out and not pay for services not rendered, with the caveat that we can all chip in and make sure that the helpless in the country have access to timely primary and emergency care.

Why are folks so anti-choice about their neighbors retaining their options, at their own expense?

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You've gotten a phony WAR, TAX Cuts, Lying, Spying, Corruption, a huge 10 trillion deficit, DEPRESSION and a Economic Collapse: shoved up your A-S,
and
NOW!
Your crying because Obama wants to fix Health CARE?
Rome wasn't built in a day.
If the Reptilians want to STOP it!
I'm all for it.
Please climb down from your Ivory Towers and come play in the dirt.
The Mud slinging has just begun.
You voted him in and now he needs your help!
We have to sell it,
One by One!
Shut off the BULL SH-T Indoctrination Box and sell this thing.
Healing the sick sounds pretty good to me
Funk the Fauxtians and the Corpirate Talking heads.
They're paid plenty to do their dirty work.

Let's Win this Battle and Move ON!
To:
MEDIA REFORM
Living Wage
Ending Privatization
Nationalizing all Energy Resources (For National Security)
The Decentralization of the GRID(Power) and the mono-culture, Agricultural System
The Greening of America
TRUE FREEDOM and the end to Corpirate Slavery

12,000 families have amassed 99% of the Wealth in this Country
That's OBSCENE!

They own the media.
They own the stock market.
They own the Corporations.
You worship and are enslaved to a figment of their children's imagination;
Concocted at Harvard and Princeton by their pledges.
We can do better than this!
Throw off your chains.
Leave all that BULL SH-T conditioning behind.

Invest in yourself, family and community.
Join the Micro Democracy REVOLUTION!
Pump that money into your family's health and well being.
Where it's needed most and where it will do the most GOOD!
Self sufficiency and self reliance is the key!

Start in your own backyard
Stick your hands into the dirt and turn the soil.
Plant the seeds for a cleaner, healthier tomorrow.

Go Local
Go GREEN and
Go Organic

Survive and Prosper!

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I wonder if when the corporations take over of our country is complete will they be renaming the cities and streets to promote their products like "Preparation H" highway or how about Viagra Nevada instead of Los Vegas?

This does not even approach something that I can call change. It looks more like business as usual with an added 30 million or so that the insurance providers can find ways to deny coverage to. It's a win so far to them and not us.

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As a supposedly liberal site, I really would have hoped that you were waiting for more than a plan that provides more profits for the insurance industry while they deny care. Something like a strong public option or even the biggie of single-payer would seem more like the hopes of a "liberal" site. Oh, well. This is just another insurance paid site, rejoicing that the really poor will now be forced to buy insurance instead of food.

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Obama is a war criminal and owned by corporate America.

I'm very optimisstic that any meaningful health care reform will not pass by the war-mongers in Congress. You guys don't deserve anything good because you bring death and destruction around the world.

Rahm Emanuell and his House Negro are only 2nd to that Retarded psychopath Bush.

Your filthy empire is dying before our eyes. It is time to rejoice!

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The whole system is a failure, as it stands now. The Repubs want to keep BIG BUSINESS, the Insurance Companies in charge and the Dems want to secure their next election with a victory of ANY KIND.
Who is going to suffer even more than they already do with ALL the current proposals??? The average hard working citizen !!!!

Read Thom Hartman.. "Medicare Part E: Everybody" [a real public option for only those that WANT IT]

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2009/09/09-9

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The cost of lawsuit and defensive medicine practice has been estimated to not more than 2% of the total health care cost.

And Obama stands up in front of the country and gives credence to such a discredited lie!

FUCK YOU Obama.

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Last night we saw the campaign Obama, pouring his elixir of magic rhetoric in our ears, selling us God-Knows-What, but it doesn't matter. The late Ted Kennedy rose from the grave to help Obama sell us a health care package that will end world poverty?

No, the healthcare of Obama's dreams is one that will be a boon for the health insurance industry. Sure, he threw in a few protections, but requiring people to purchase health insurance like auto insurance is a positive for any corporate bottom line. In five years, we'll be in worse shape than we are now without a true public option.

If the health care package Obama proposed does not allow a public option where businesses and citizens can purchase low-cost, price controlled Medicaid, then there's no true public option. Instead, only people who lose their health care coverage can buy government health insurance, Obama estimated less than 5% of americans.

That means no real competition for health insurance corporations. That means, we're fuc'd again.

Yet, Obama used the analogy of public and private colleges to describe why we should have a public option. Well, the number of students in public colleges far exceeds the private college industry. Not only is it a bad analogy, it's deceptive. Obama, the used car salesman, is trying to sell us the same old gas guzzling SUV health insurance. I'm not buying it!

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Nixon's health care reform plan was far more progressive than Obama's corporate sponsored empty plan.

Nixon grew up poor; and saw two of his brothers die of TB, lacking health care access. Compared to today's psuedo-liberals, Nixon was a progressive.

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He's authoritarian enough, thank you very much, or did you forget him blocking bulk bargaining legislation for his pharma buddies practically before the file was even saved? Did you forget his signing statements to get around the law that would have protected whistle-blowers and other acts of Congress he doesn't like?

And you don't have to call it a death panel, but even a plan as expensive as what's being thrown around will still involve rationing. He himself said seniors cost too much. So we don't want to give them expensive treatments not want them to suffer, and we need to have "a democratic discussion" about that, while proposing gutting medicare by about $500 BILLION?

Let's not call it a death panel then. Let's call it "proposed cutting of funds for services to the elderly" by a half trillion dollars, and then saying they cost too much in their last days but he would have bought the hip himself.

He says he'll save a half trillion or so, but really, the bottom line is he "projects savings" while taking the money from their budget.

OK, the best I can gather from his feints and dodges is he wants a "democratic conversation" (by panels I'm sure), "guided by medical doctors, scientists and ethicists", about how much care old people should get on their tail end, while taking half a trillion from their budget, and counseling them on their do-not-resuscitate options. Calling it death panels isn't too crazy, but could be hyping it up. To say there is no validity to the charge seems a lie itself though.

Of course, it's a little unfair to read any truth in what he says, since he tells anyone what they want to hear to gain their support, and he has a speech for almost any point anyone wants to make. Hey, he's pro-Palestine, pro-single payer, anti-single payer, pro-AIPAC, pro-hawk, diplomacy personified. It was a waste of time analyzing Bush's words when his action's were loud and clear, and the same with Obama.

I don't want people to suffer either while these big money jerks play games with the issue, but I really think this "public option" will do more harm than good, wasting what little money we have to funnel it to big health care corps when real reform could help so many more and cost so much less. This still leaves many uninsurred to jack up cost, distorts the market with pretend competition, and we already know of one side deal he made to keep costs up, so I will assume more until people dare to even hold him accountable for that one.

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The majority of comments are loud and clear.
The President and Congress have the political
battle of their existence at stake, and they
know it. A pluralty of Americans simply do not
want the federal government dictating health care choices to them.
In all of this debate, it must be remembered that Mr. Obama studied and taught the radical
philosophies of Saul Alinsky, who admonished in
his writings, that once in political power, a
politician can then CREATE a situation/problem
and then offer up the 'fix everything' solutions and policies of government. This is the modus operandi of the extreme left and their 'progressive' allies; first create a national emergency and then attempt to convince the populace that the
central government has all the answers.
Sound familiar? And Cap & Trade is next, my
fellow Americans, followed by an increase in taxes the likes of which will be unprecedented
in American history.
Perhaps the grassroots of the 21st Century
American Revolution will sprout on Saturday,
Sept. 12th as hundreds of thousands of concerned, patriotic American citizens gather in Washington for a rally and march.
Wish I coulld be there to lead you down
Pennsylvania Avenue.

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No public option + mandatory coverage = huge healthcare insurer profits

Healthcare insurer bean counting + lax malpractice rules (i.e. Tort Reform) = Continued decrease in quality of care in the nation that is already 37th in the world when it comes to health care.

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With all the B.S. in Wash. these days, has anyone taken the time to notice where we the people are at financially? The stock market is UP, corporate profits are UP, the economy according to Gentle Ben is heading UP.
Unemployment is UP, decline in wages is UP, prices are UP... and all we can do is bitch about health care? Don't be misled by the hype. The gov. warns us about smoking and yet it throws up a massive smoke screen.

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Everyone is forgetting: When you are sick you usually can't go to a full time job, you lose the job, insurance drops you, then you are "free lancing" often while still sick, like I am.

How do you work to pay for insurance when you are sick in bed?

Is anyone thinking anymore in this country? ????

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Having said that it is nice to see him grab the bull by the horns, it remains to be seen if he goes down fighting. For all you people who believe there is a magic wand, I hate to disillusion you but it takes three generations to change. For you rational progressives, who believe that Obama badmouthed you on national TV in front of congress, quit looking at the world with horse blinders on. Obama knows that getting elected in 2012 has nothing to do with healthcare reform, it’s the economy stupid. Every government on this planet friend or foe knows that Obama said, “ I will not sign a bill that does not have a public option”. So cease with the liar liar pants on fire rant. Any future foreign policy will become null and void if the world believes that Obama can not be trusted, so much for the peacemaker. Any attempt to dismantle the health insurance economy in a single blow will lead to one thing, anarchy. Just like any attempt to dismantle the offensive military and provide for the common defense will lead to one thing, anarchy. The question is, can we avoid anarchy while globalism crashes? Obama keeps reaching out and people scream fool, fool. Did you ever think that he might be playing rope a dope? The republicans are becoming more isolated and less and less in touch with reality daily. The best thing that happened in the speech was, when he said liar and the repub screamed liar, you could not have scripted that better. It proved his very point they are off the deep end and not playing with a full deck. If Pelosi sticks with the game plan she will be the angel of healthcare, Jesus healed the sick and so can we. The Senate must be filling a bit stupid this morning. The funny thing is, I see what Obama is doing and where he is going. I see that his alternatives are limited and it still pisses me off.

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With the exception of Beck, Longdream, Aimleft, and the usual Obama fundies, everyone on this forum is not fooled by Obama's bullshit talk. Whatever Obama signs on health care will go down as a major failure and the Republicans will be able to capitalize on Obama's TAX-UH-CHEW-SETS care.

Apologies to all MA folks btw.

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There is no doubt that Barack Obama is a masterful orator often able to bring tears to his audience. But to what purpose… and in whose interest … are his Harvard education and lawyer’s rhetorical skills being employed?

The article quoted and linked below critically examines content. What does the Obama “health care reform” mean to working people?

Obama seeks to reassure insurance companies, Republicans in speech to Congress on health care
By Barry Grey
10 September 2009

President Barack Obama’s nationally televised address to a joint session of Congress Wednesday night, billed as an effort to explain his health care proposals to the American people, was largely devoted to reassuring the health care industry and conciliating his Republican opponents.

Obama sought to repackage his proposed overhaul of health care to better conceal from the public its reactionary content, but the bulk of his speech focused on the need to slash health care costs, both those born by private companies and government outlays for Medicare and Medicaid, the government programs for the elderly and the poor.

“The problem of rising costs,” he said, places “American businesses that compete internationally, like our auto makers” at “a huge disadvantage.” The reference to US auto companies was significant, since Obama forced General Motors and Chrysler into bankruptcy in large part to push through a drastic lowering of health benefits for auto workers. With this remark, Obama sent a signal that, despite his “reform” rhetoric, the assault on auto workers’ health benefits was the model for the kind of cuts his health care proposals would effect more broadly.

He went on to declare that his health care plan was essential to reining in the ballooning federal deficit and national debt. “Put simply,” he said, “our health care problem is our deficit problem. Nothing else comes close.”

This is a lie. It ignores the far greater role of the multi-trillion-dollar bailout of the banks, the hundreds of billions spent on the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, and the half-trillion-dollar annual military budget in bankrupting the federal treasury.
…”
Please read the full article here:
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2009/sep2009/obam-s10.shtml

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Here is what Representative Kucinich had to say about this Welfare Plan for the Insurance Industry and Big Pharma, from AFP.

“If the matter were not so serious, it would be farcical,” he said. “The executive branch pretends that the proposed healthcare reforms are something they are not. The legislation is being attacked for something it is not. Congressional leadership and the White House defend the legislation, pretending it actually is the very proposal that is being attacked. But it is not.”

An absolute farce...A bipartisan farce--just like the wars, the bailouts and the corruptioin. All that remains is for chumps to accept it. Its the kind of health plan deserved by a people who would spend their blood and treasure on wars based on lies, lies and nothing but lies...and then imagine that magically, the very same people who accepted these lies, who were put into offiice by those who profit from the policies moved along by the lies, are suddenly inclined to deal with them honestly on matters of health...Need I remind you that these are mainstream Democrats and Repubicans...in short...scoundrels and fools.

But, the president made a very fine speech...'it was what we were waitng for'... Indeed. I'm sure the CEOs and owners of the health insurance industry-- financial intermediaries that haven't gotten their pound of flesh yet from the Democrats--thought so as well...along with Big Pharma.

Clinton and Gore, who gave us NAFTA, think so as well. What a fine 'party of the people'... the people who own Wall Street, that is.

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COMMUNIST. I visited my right-wing family recently and was straightened out on this.

Luckily, all this "Obama is corporate Republican shill" juxtaposed with "Obama is a socialist" does get funnier. Or maybe I should write "silly dillier"?

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how about the one about how "rigid ideologues" want universal coverage, the implication being somehow that this was outside the "American tradition".

As if we never heard of Medicare, providing universal coverage with an age limit.

How about simply dropping the limit, plug the holes punched in it by Congress, rather than this Rube Goldberg contraption proposed by Obama?

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...as if they had any meaning or significance? These are words. Obama's actions deny his words. If Obama praised puppies in his speech, would you expect him to put one under your christmas tree? While the rest of the country pretends that this is a battle between Obama's high morals and Republican lies, the actual "reform" that will be passed and signed into law merely requires that all Americans buy the defective products of the insurance industry, whether they can afford them or not. When Obama urges passage of a reform bill, regardless of what he hypothesizes might be in an unspecified bill, he is advocating the product of Baucus and the corrupt gang of six. This is the Obama we have been waiting for? No, this is the Obama to which we are sadly accustomed. Lots of pretty words dressing up business as usual.

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Then it is time for the rest of us to become very frightened. Obama said nothing last night that was new, except to muddle his already muddled health care message even further.

Single Payer is the only system that will work and be sustainable. Canada's works well, especially in those provinces that have not started to sell out to free market health care, such as Saskatchewan (yeah, the province that started the whole thing rolling in Canada over 50 years ago!).

The biggest problem with Obama's garble-de-gook solution is not so much that it won't make health care affordable to everyone (although it won't). The biggest problem is it won't do ANYTHING to improve outcomes, except for the most well-heeled who can afford the platinum-level choices.

The health care exchange will become the next big junk bond or subprime mortgage casino. We'll either have to wait for some future administration to make the final speech on health care, or just do it ourselves.

Why should we wait any longer?

(Adele, please take off the rose-colored glasses and see that Obama and the Democratic Party are not the great hope you were hoping for.)

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Lies heaped upon lies. Propaganda passing for analysis.

"Save the current system because it has worked so well for so long"???? How does that remotely make any sense, given that we are at this point because the system is in tatters??

"Save the insurance companies because they provide jobs"??? Even if those jobs are to scam us and provide zero value to Americans??

Blasting the left - again. Equating representation for the average American as equivalent to astroturf corporate "grass roots" employees screaming lies and hate??

This is not my President talking. Someone else owns him. Who could it be?

peace,
Paul

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Barack Obama is a great speechmaker and grandstander; no doubt of that.
If he can bring a tear to the eye of a cynic like Joe Biden, he can get to ANYBODY.
At the same time, his true motives are cleverly concealed. Never let be said that he doesn't keep his true thoughts close to the vest. This is most likely necessary, given the poisonous atmosphere produced by neocon thugs and their stooges in government.
Despite the obstacles and stalling, it seems we may actually lurch toward something resembling a more humane form of health care.
Obama's gradualist approach certainly isn't for the impatient, and let's face it; when it comes to healthcare, we have a perfect RIGHT to be impatient.
One thing Obama's method has accomplished is that the true enemies of reform and our people have been drawn out of their hidey-holes, and are there for all to see.

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Let's see, single payer just tossed out the window without a glance. The anemic public option restricted to only those who the insurance corporations reject. And even at that Obama show a willingness to "work together" and toss that little scrap overboard. What is the centerpiece of Obama's "plan?"

The mandate that citizens must purchase health insurance policies from the same corporations that have created the health care mess in the first place is the centerpiece of Obama's "plan." Everything else is small potatoes. Everything else is window dressing and distraction from the elephant in the room. The insurances corporations know it. It represents an enormous transfer of wealth to them.

The insurance corporations are besides themselves with joy. They have acquired the power of taxation in all but name. A law that uses the power of the state to force you to pay money or else be punished is a tax. There is no other name for it. A tax is a tax.

These corporations now have the power collect taxes directly without the interference caused by democracy and our elected representatives with the only role for government is as the enforcer.

The power to tax. What a plum! What a reward! I guess because these corporations have done such a fine job giving us the wonderful efficient healthcare system we now enjoy they deserve all this new wealth and stunning new power. We can all be assured they will be responsible with it. Why wouldn't they be? They are deeply concerned with our well being. It says so right in their ads.

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Ms. Stan,

By complaining that Mr. Obama's stance on the public option is "still unclear," I think you are missing how he is really handling it. He knows as well as we progressives do just what having this option will mean to the insurance companies and to the country.

He is playing his cards very well: What he is telling Congress is that if anyone can come up with a plan that will work better than a public option, he is willing to listen.

But, they can't! And he knows this. He doesn't have to draw a line in the sand; no one can show that it isn't already there!

Let's give him some credit. He is a much better politician than either you or me.

And I am more confident now than ever before that this time, a public option will finally become a reality. Once it's been established, even if it's not much to begin with, over the following decades it will blossom and grow into what it ultimately can become.

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We appreciate it that he was able to fend off false charges from the Republicans but we were disappointed with his complicated plans for different people. Last year my brother and I gave up looking for employment to campaign hard for Obama and this is all he can show for it? I am sorry America that I lied to hundreds of voters I tried to convince telling them that Obama would support single payer health care. The two of us stood together like brothers and wasted months going door to door begging voters to give Obama a chance. Last night's speech makes us feel that our efforts were wasted. We finally made it to another low paying part time job with no benefits whatsoever. We apologize for lying to the voters about Obama's positions on the war and health care. It is now clear that Obama would much rather fund wars while giving no credence to health care for all.

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But when you listen, really listen to what he actually said... it was a complete capitulation to the pharmaceutical and insurance industries. In the end, what we will get in this country is MANDATORY insurance where those that either don't sign up or can't afford the premiums will be fined thousands of dollars and possibly be jailed if we still can't pay. He also never mentioned the fascist right that has been sending goons to town hall meetings all summer but he DID mention the "radical left" (and the TV cameras all went right to Barbara Lee... what was up with that?). It's time you all wake up! Obama is no progressive. He's pro war, pro military and pro business but he has a nice smile and a reassuring demeanor. Where we mean single payer, he means "affordable" coverage.. (read INSURANCE, not HEALTH CARE) but Americans are so BRAINWASHED by TV, they see the two as synonymous. You allow yourselves to be dumbed down that way and this is what you get. Going down with a ship of fools.

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is the Obama we have been waiting for? this is the same Obama before the election. all Talk and no action. Let's wait and see if we have been duped AGAIN.

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Forcing -- with the threat of criminal penalties --private health insurance on Americans who cannot afford it is the WORST of all worlds!
Prices will rise, services will be cut.

Why is this the plan that is the most likely to pass!?
(Don't bother answering. I know. Big Money talks.)

We are better off now, with people literally dying because of lack of health insurance, than we would be under this make-us-into-criminals plan!

I know it doesn't do any good anyway, but call and write your friends, your Senators, your Representatives, the President, and write the editors of your local and national papers!

If this abomination passes anyway -- as I fear it is likely to do -- shut down America! Storm the castle! We MUST be freed of this fascism that controls America!!

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the president's speach was great. The comments to this article show very clearly how cynical Americans have become after eight years of Bush incompetence and misfeasance. Sure Bush ran the country into the ground, sure he allowed it to be attacked on 911, sure he instituted torture and thereby destroyed the country's reputation and standing in the world, sure he lied and started two endless wars, sure he increased the deficit by adding a couple of trillion dollars to it and by doing so made the US a debtor nation financially enslaved to China, sure he politicized the department of justice thereby obstructing justice, sure he also politicized scientific research thus creating uncertainty as to its validity, sure he spied on Americans and ignored the laws of the country but that was then, this is now. America has a new president and the sins of the old should not be visited upon the new. He is doing his best to clean up the unholy mess left by Bush and to get the country back working again so how about supporting him instead of grousing about his efforts?

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This was not a bad speech, and definitely scored high on style. I'm a little disheartened by some of the comments here, and suspect the virulence stems mostly from the disappointment of unrealistic hopes. Obama was never going to the knight on a white charger imagined by his supporters on this site during the election campaign, so it would be sensible to aim for ensuring that he is the best he can be. Countering hysterical and abusive right wing attacks on the President with hysterical and abusive "left wing" wing attacks on the same hate figure seems a little self defeating. Intelligent and critical but positive support would seem to be a more sensible stance if the overall aim is to achieve a better America as opposed to some utopia, the exact nature of which varies between individuals.

Health is obviously a critical and keystone issue, but, from the outside, there seems to be something even more fundamental going on. The hard core right are taking unto themselves the power to prevent effective governance unless they are the governors. They worked on the tactic during Clinton's terms, and now they really seem to be going for broke. And the unbending fundamentalism of some self-avowed progressives both mirrors the far right and aids its mission. There is more at stake than Obama, unsatisfactory and non-Messiah like as he may be. Progressives must choose whether they will hate all politicians or fight to preserve and reinstate American democracy.

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Health company stocks up- big surprise. Rahm writes a great speech and Barack can deliver it with gusto.

People will be forced to buy insurance, almost no one will have any kind of option, the option is Kent Conrad's stupid idea, and the 'if we didn't already have what we have" mantra gets more inane and irritating each time I hear it. Amazingly, he actually said we have a system that works? Really? I guess it does if you're an insurance company.

He gave us up to the drug makers for this? I'm not just disillusioned, I'm angry. We need a movement that gradually gets us to more than two parties and IRV.

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As always, more wishy washy bullshit talk. Obama is no different from before. He just got someone to craft him a smooth talking speech to deceive the public with. Last year I voted for Ralph Nader after Obama flipflopped on everything and I still don't feel like voting Democrat even for a dog catcher anymore.

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Better go do some more research into Barack beyond his worthless, lying, empty words. Almost all of his campaign promises have been BROKEN already -- and it has been LESS THAN 7 months since swear-in !!!

It is not about Bush -- Obama is JUST THE SAME or WORSE than Bush -- he is a turncoat and liar -- Obama is totally despicable-- at least George said what he was about, and did it. Barack says one thing, and does another. All he cares about is moneyed interests. If you do a little checking into Barack, you will find all of this out -- and more, unfortunately.

TIME TO WAKE UP, my brothers and sisters !!
DEMOCRATS & REPUBLICANS ARE ONE AND THE SAME !!

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The cheering and the jeering of Obama are all part of the plan to make sure we continue to think that we actually live in a Democracy, where we shout and argue, but "at the end of the day, we're all Americans who are basically united" in our objectives, we're "all in this boat together, in spite of how much we argue", etc. etc.

And a lot of us continue to believe that. After all, it implies that there's something superior about us. That we are a superior group of people, living together in this geographical area marked off and christened "The United States of America". A people united. United for the glory of the Empire.


Now, shall we all chant together, "Hope, Change, Progress"? Maybe if we repeat it enough times, we will actually convince ourselves that we have achieved this with Obama.

But if after all that chanting, we haven't convinced ourselves, maybe we ought to think about the possibility that our system, in spite of the great freedoms enjoyed within it, because of the way it is organized, will never be democratic and will always favor the rich and powerful while oppressing the weak and poor. Regardless of which party is in place. The ones in power are basically the same. Of course, they wouldn't have it any other way. They're the ones who invented this system, to keep us running around in circles while they run the show.
I'm not offering a fold-your-arms-and-let-me-do-the-thinking-for-you solution, like the politicians do: "Let me do this or that for you!" I think each and every one of us has to do a lot more thinking. Critical thinking. And stop being taken for suckers.

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He admitted the public option isn't for, well, the public. Who is it for? Those poor people without any health insurance who live in states "like Alabama" where there's a monopoly insurance industry so they have no chance of finding something the administration deems affordable. We should rename it "no-place-else-to-go" option. But, of course, it won't even be optional if these same poor people are forced to buy something and that's their only "option."

Unfortunately, I notice quite a few people, including good friends of mine, must have heard a different speech from a different Obama because they still believe this public option is something they will opt for. They believe they will be eligible. They won't be.

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I heard President Obama speak quite clearly on the public option: it would cover 5% of us - the sliver he has referred to before - but he is open to other suggestions. He will move it forward for the immediate time, for those currently uninsured (taking McCain's lead on this, from his campaign proposal), while the full bill gets fully launched in 4 years. This is BOLD action in a time of great need, as more and more people are dropping through the cracks in so many ways - one being lack of health insurance. The whole speech is on YouTube, in 2 parts.

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I mean the latests and greatest Obama's speech was a pure winner.

He was applauded by the Republicans for it so apparently they are happy. After all his policies are not so different from their more moderate approaches and a principle of bipartisanship is a perfect de facto veto.

The Democrats also applauded, blue Dogs are happy for their Republican masters. Old sellouts like Pelosi, Clinton and Biden are happy - the money will keep rolling in from big business.

He pledged to protect the big business, more particular the travesty of the healthcare industry. That should make big business and lobbyists happy.

2 independants in the Senate don't count and if anybody is disgruntled, the party pressure will be applied to get them inline.

But what abotu the public? Ahh, public got another empty speech with no guarantees but who cares? It is not like the people matter any more, the political oligarchy in power is happy, the rich are happy, the special interests are happy.

Courtesy of Mr. Change-we-can-believe-in.

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Who woke up this morning and felt that this was a solution?

I measure people by what they do, NOT WHAT THEY SAY. This reform is a giveaway to the rich. The villagers will simply love it.

With no cost controls in place, the insurance company owners will get rich beyond their wildest dreams. The American public will be reamed beyond their wildest nightmares. The the top 1% will now earn more than the bottom 50% combined.

What can I say other than... my dalliance with Obama has ended badly.

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The example of auto insurance doesn't hold water.

While I would maintain that if the state mandates insurance, the state should provide the insurance at a reasonable rate, driving an automobile is not a constitutional right, it is a privilege.

Being a citizen is not a privilege! It is a constitutional right of those who meet the conditions of citizenship! A government requirement that I patronize (at whatever fee the market will bear) one business or another because I am a citizen of the USA makes that corporation into a taxing entity whenever they raise any fee, co-pay or deductible in any way whatsoever!

The constitution mandates specific conditions for raising taxes; the board of my insurer meets none of those requirement

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All of you vocal opponents of health care reform who secretly prayed for it to pass can now breathe a sigh of relief: It looks like this may actually get done.

As happened during the Progressive Era, Great Depression, and several other times in the last 100 years, it looks like the adults (Democrats) will rescue the children (Republicans) from themselves.

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Far from delivering a powerful argument for the long-delayed overhaul of our sorry excuse for public "health care", Obama did what all Dems do: placate his billionaire corporate sponsors.

A much-better analysis of the speech can be found at
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2009/sep2009/obam-s10.shtml

Like Darth Cheney did to us, Obama (aka Barry O'Bomber--of Afghanistan, Iraq, soon-to-come any other small victim of U$ imperialism) held secret meetings with the "health care" corporados to make sure they would continue to run the show and rake in obscene, undeserved profits--at our expense.

He has never intended to give us what citizen-driven governments long have provided: universal health care. The U$ ranks near the bottom of all industrialized nations in public health service. Even many so-called Third-World nations have successfully administered universal public health care for their citizens. I know this for a fact, because I've seen and even experienced these benefits first-hand. We subjects of Wall Street/Washington pay more for our "care" than any other modern nation, and get lower returns (than even in many of the above-mentioned poorer countries).

Oh, and to the bozo who asked, "let me see if I got this right" and similar gullible robot watchers of Faux"News" and other corporate media: the only "right" involved is right-wing. They're more examples of parrots sponging up and regurgitating the worn-out, pathetically insane clap-trap of the highly paid, ultra-right fear/hate mongers.

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Wow! I just glanced through the comments. Boy, would I ever hate to live in the heads of the majority of those writing. Has anyone commenting read The Audacity of Hope? There is hope, and this man stands for it. I stand with him!!! I believe we can bring health care to all Americans, as many countries have done for their citizens. And I believe America can be a leader in a new green energy economy. I believe we stand on the threshold of remarkable and positive change. I do have the audacity of hope!!!! And I love this President!!!

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His proposed public option as defined last night will take only the people the insurance companies don't want! The most expensive cases, in other words. The insurance companies will be thrilled to get all those healthy young clients now forced to buy policies.

Then the spending will be capped.

So what happens when the irresistible force meets the immovable object?

Ain't gonna be pretty.

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Most of you Americans are simply nuts. Sitting here in Canada with my 100% health coverage, NO co-pays, NO ONE deciding if I have a "pre" existing condition... I shake my head at the insanity of you all (left, right, libertarian, hippy, fundie... you all have the same capitalistic mindset -- me me me!

In Canada a person does not have a choice to "opt out". ALL must pay so that ALL recieve the same level of care.

There areinsurance companies (only if you "opt in") But even then, those insurance companies have NO SAY in your medical care. If the Doctor says you have cancer and need Chemo, you get it, no questionnaires, no draining bank accounts, no death panels, no questions asked.
The Doctor bills the government, the goverment writes him/her a cheque. Easy and completely non-corrupt!
Why can't Americans see this? What in the hell are you so afraid of? That some other American might get healthy and "one-up" you? Are you really that greedy, that competitive? So much so that you would gladly pay a private insurance company to force your neighbour to die?

That is what it looks like from here. Yer nuts!
Certifiably insane -- 99.99% of you! LOL

Shame on ALL of you. YES, ALL Americans bear the brunt of responsibility.

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The trouble with many of the posters here is they forgot the maxim: The devil is in the details.

So clearly "death panels" is hyperbole but what is real is rationing of care which has accompanied govt intrustion into health care as evidenced in two cases I am familiar with: Canada and Britian. And rationing which will impact greatly on older people will lead to premature death or unecesary suffering. Proof: Everyone who reads know that at least 30,000 people come from Canada to hip, knee replacements and cancer treatments because of reationing which leads to long delays. Another example is England where if you had macular deeneration(leads to blindness) they would only pay to treat one eye(because of an uproar that was overtunred.

The point being that the cheerleaders for govt intrusion are blinded by slogans and don't devote the time and effort to do the the research to see what the implications of such are. So altough death panels were hyperbole they referred to something real that should scare everyone.

To paraphrase a phrase from the Magna Charta: To deay justice is injustice. Hence, rationing would lead to either death or unecessary suffering and that has the experience on other countries with govt intrusion.

I forgot one more egs> I read that in Sweden the prime minister waited 13 months for a hip replacement. I an average guy with no power waited one month. I understand in Canada if you are hockey player or politician there is no waiting. That is what happens with rationing: Those pull go to the head of the line.

So death panels: no; rationing: yes and such will cause premature death and uncessary suffering. Be careful what you ask for and do yur home work before coming a cheer leader for abstraction in which you have not flushed out the consequences.

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At best this talk last nite -- it was wishy-washy. At worst it was nearly treasonous!! Ol' Barack has sold us down the river -- yet again. Every time I look at Barack, all I can see are the puppet strings moving his mouth open & closed...

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Obama has promised the following reforms:

1. No Discrimination for Pre-Existing Conditions
Insurance companies will be prohibited from refusing you coverage because of your medical history.

2. No Exorbitant Out-of-Pocket Expenses, Deductibles or Co-Pays
Insurance companies will have to abide by yearly caps on how much they can charge for out-of-pocket expenses.

3. No Cost-Sharing for Preventive Care
Insurance companies must fully cover, without charge, regular checkups and tests that help you prevent illness, such as mammograms or eye and foot exams for diabetics.

4. No Dropping of Coverage for Seriously Ill
Insurance companies will be prohibited from dropping or watering down insurance coverage for those who become seriously ill.

5. No Gender Discrimination
Insurance companies will be prohibited from charging you more because of your gender.

6. No Annual or Lifetime Caps on Coverage
Insurance companies will be prevented from placing annual or lifetime caps on the coverage you receive.

7. Extended Coverage for Young Adults
Children would continue to be eligible for family coverage through the age of 26.

8. Guaranteed Insurance Renewal
Insurance companies will be required to renew any policy as long as the policyholder pays their premium in full. Insurance companies won't be allowed to refuse renewal because someone became sick.

If a health reform bill includes all of the above guarantees, it is a lot better than the status quo. However, without a plan to offer universal health care (medicare for all) or even a watered down version of health plan option, that covers all those without a health insurance (and not just 5%), this bill falls short of a meaningful reform.

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I'm pretty happy with what I heard last night. I was afraid that Obama would drop the public option.

Is it ideal? No. I am a supporter (and recipient) of government health care (in the form of VA), so I agree that a public option is not really the solution. Neither was emancipation of the slaves by itself, but nobody can claim that that was a bad thing. I'm sure some argued that without immediate equal rights for all races, Lincoln should have shit-canned the whole idea, but that's silly. It was a significant step in the right direction, and like true emancipation, true health care reform is probably going to be a long evolutionary process.

So, like many other posters, I wish we could get the real deal. But I'm not disappointed with things so far.

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Through eight years of George W. Bush Democrats did nothing to oppose the illegal wars, the corruption, the scandal and even contributed to all of them...trying to outdo Bush in hawkishness. He could stand before a joint session of Congress and lie and lie and lie. Someone should have stood up...just once in all of those eight years and called him the Golf Delta liar that he was!

Obama stands before the a joint session and perhaps the most contemptible type of Republican that has ever been born, hatched or sprung upon us--a South Carolina Republican-- is able to pin the tail on this Democratic Ass in the first year of his presidency. For shame!

Yes, he is lying! There is no way that citizen verification can be made under the bill:

"CNN reported last month the Congressional Research Service, the nonpartisan policy research arm of Congress, found that without a citizenship verification system illegal aliens would receive subsidies. Mark Krikorian, executive director of the Washington-based Center for Immigration Studies, told CNN the report “undermines the claims of the president and others that illegal immigrants would not be covered under the House version of the bill.” Kurt Nimmo, infowars.com

Its way past time that sparks fly in Congress...I'm tired of seeing representatives of the people who kow-tow to the interests and remain silent in the face of deceit. Perhaps, Wilson was a bit overstated...but, who cares...it was a fine start...Now, lets see if the Democrats can find some kind of hormonal fortitude and point out the lies that the Republican Sierra-Oscar-Bravos have endorsed and continue to support...with regard to the economy, ENRON, the FED, the wars, the Patriot Act, the bailout... Lets make Question Time in the British Parliament look tame by comparison!

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Obama sure charms many wishful thinking people with his often accurate depiction of the problem. The walk is something else again, isn't it?
He talked eloquently about the Banksters and the need for financial industry accountability and regulation. That was the talk. The walk: he gave away our hard earned money to bail out the thieves and gave them a few minor detours on the course they have payed for through decades of politician payoffs.
The walk on health care, I think, will be mandates for health insurance for the increasing number of people who cannot afford it - but it will be at government (that is, you and I) expense. The Insurance Industry will have no incentive to hold down costs and CEOs will become even more filthy rich.
While the wacko right talks about Obama the socialist and the infatuated left defends him, the march begun decades ago to corporatism, accelerated under Bush, will make wet dream gains under Obama.
Behold the disingegration of America!

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Hopefully this draws out the fundies ... ( I love pissing off fundies of any persuasion)

NO,I will never stand with much less put my trust in tyrants who:

1. Spy on people in their bedrooms with programs like warrantless wiretapping and the Patriot Act.

2. Steal from hard-working people and pay their equally disgusting coporate BFF's.

3. Lock up 2-3 million people for having the wrong kind of chemicals in their pockets.

4. Bomb poor people around the world.

5. Fail to protect the weak and helpless in this society we call "the greatest nation on earth".

6. Feeding off the misery of said people like vultures in an African desert.

This for people like Beck and the other "Obama-fundies". I'm not here to convert you or be converted. You've obviously found all the answers you're looking for. Your cup is full.

I, on the other hand will continue to search for mine. Regardless...

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While I am in full agreement with mmckinl regarding Sirota's article being on target, I would like to add the obvious: the plan from the beginning, once they announced single-payer to be "off the table" and that the fix was in, was the infusion of funds into the insurance industry, for much the same reason AIG was bailed out -- too many securitized instruments, which created too many phony billionaires, and are in emergency need of resuscitation -- screw the citizenry.

Truly, anyone who isn't brain dead has to have noticed that President Obama co-opted Max Baucus' exchange plan, thus lowering taxation rates on the insurance industry, shoveling monies to them, and to hell with the rest of us.

FDR proclaimed the insurance industry to be a bunch of crooks!

President John F. Kennedy, and his brother, Bobby, proclaimed the insurance industry to be a bunch of crooks! (And it was in October of 1963 that the Kennedy brothers forced the insurance industry executives to sign a Consent Decree, stipulating they would cease and desist their artificial price fixing ways.)

But President Obama proclaims the insurance industry to be a bunch of good ole boys and fully embraces them.

Nothing is rotten in Denmark, but the stink is so bad in the USA everyone can smell it the world over.

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And if those who think they have bigger ears then I have better think fast. I am not here just to talk b***** I mean I am from the grassroots in Kenya where the tribalism is very bad. But the Red Cross and UN still exist. Okay I know that it is not functioning as should but I have the new cuts here and here and here and here but the children at the schools are happy, the Gays are happy. What is more even the Trumpeting nurses' support for a health care overhaul while lamenting a worsening toll of uninsured, President Barack Obama kept up the pressure Thursday for congressional action .Did you hear hear hear hear that? I veto the whole bloody thing. You think I came to see the result. NO. I want you to get me the results and pronto.
"We don't need more partisan distractions," Obama said in remarks at the White House, speaking again on the issue just 14 hours after his Wednesday night address to Congress and a national television audience. "We have talked this issue to death. ... The time for talk is winding down."
Who has stolen is my clock? Conspiracy aha I smell that.
The White House is in what Obama aides regard as the final, crucial phase of the health care debate, in which the president will move aggressively to try to close the deal with lawmakers and the American public. While Democratic leaders acknowledged that the speech probably did not guarantee any new support, Mr. Obama nonetheless invited a group of centrist Democrats — essential to passing the legislation — to meet with him at the White House on Thursday afternoon. You, Germen what are you doing near my house?
I thank you
Firozali A. Mulla

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Why with 100,000 dollars he could probably buy a whole bunch of stamps to send out a mass mailing.
Any mention of the money that Wilson recieved from his supporters?

Joe Wilson's comment "YOU LIE."..was a STAGED EVENT. He will be rewarded furiously for doing it.

Barak Obama does LIE...but Joe Wilson wasn't talking about Obama's lies. He is speaking for white America that doesn't like black people...that was a pure racist comment and Obama felt crushed by it. Look at his reaction closely. It was intended to destroy his speech. To Show that he can be abused and ridiculed.

The people behind Wilson are racists, the people around Obama are all Bush appointees, (The entire Bush Pentagon) and are his enemies...Hilliary Clinton and Joe Biden are his enemies. they ran against him.

The Republicans sense his weakness, and they are trying to kill him figuratively and or literally.

It's another display of Disgusting Americana.

More humiliation and interruptions will follow. He being destroyed because he is black and he is being destroyed because he's without any friends and he's being destroyed because he wants to be accepted by his enemies.

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A Bit More On Healthcare, Rude Boy Blows It.
I was working late tonight. So this is going to be short and sweet.

First I want to say that although I think that Joe whatsits-face from South Carolina didn’t do his state or his party any good by calling the President a Liar in the middle of his speech last night. In fact that comment might have tipped public opinion decisively in favor of the President. People may finally be ready to say enough of this right wing rhetoric. First it was the birthers with that crazy notion that Obama was born in Kenya. After that came the ridiculous statements that the President is a racist. Then there was the deather nonsense with people calling the health plan a secret euthanasia plan. It got so bad that people were grabbing onto the Presidents speech to children as socialist propaganda. Like telling kids to wash their hands and study is some kind of a socialist thing. Real capitalists are dirty and don’t study I guess. When the Congressman made his little noise while the President was speaking, he showed the world exactly what this whole thing is, rude and ignorant. It is the kind of thing you would expect from the British House of Commons, or from some hick from the sticks who hadn’t been taught manners. It basicly sealed the fate of the right wing resistance. Now they have to apologise and that is what this incredible Joe did.
Was it racist? Maybe. Was it rude? Definitely. Was it beyond the pale? Not really, just inappropriate. If Obama had been saying the Health Care Bill would give us eternal life, well he might be justified calling that a lie. Personally I have nothing against being rude when it is appropriate. It comes under the rubric of Speaking Truth To Power, but this guy was just showing his ass. All he did was make people feel that maybe these criticisms of the President are off key and irrational.
I respect the President. I like his style and agree with most of what his intent is. I simply think he is too conservative, in line with the so called main stream but not what the country needs. I think we need more radical solutions. But we will get what is feasible. I just hope we don’t end up with something that is too much for the corporations and not enough for the people.
The liberal media were loving the Obama speech and carefully avoided mentioning the mandatory nature of the new health plan and the optional nature of the public plan. The right wing media is so far out on this I won’t even bother to read it. What we are getting is health care reform the insurance, pharmaceutical and private hospital industry can support.
My opinion is we are getting the shaft. We need the reform, we really need a universal health care system, but what we are probably going to get is expanded private coverage.

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What speech did you hear last night? Was President Obama respected by the Repukes? What do you think that was all about? Did you think that was just for pretend? I remember when Martin Luther King was being called a communist by some and a house n***er by others. It was confusing and, looking back on it all, it's clear to see now that these arguments were made by fools on both sides. If Obama turns out to be a sell out, we'll know, but it's safe to say that he isn't going with the status quo. Until we see an actual bill, I don't know how anyone can define the situation unless they are relying on reports from the media. I'm so sick of listening to the media & immediately trusting what is being said and later realizing that it's a total distortion. "We", as a group, have as our best unifying force, the ones we saw last night during President Obama's speech - the ones that were shouting, laughing, and booing. TV was always the 'cool' medium and for these elected pros to carry on so only reflects their frustration, not their cooperation. Yeah - I want universal health care. But what kind of fool doesn't want a public option? Hint - when you are under 40, with no health problems, you have no idea what the insurance companies can do to your life. And when you are over 65, with medicare, you no longer care except to promote the insurance companies as a paid stooge or as a total fool since you are on a government insurance plan anyway. Pick your poison - but if I had to guess, President Obama doesn't really think that most people won't opt for a public plan. Most people running a business are paying at least $1-2K a month for some dipshit health insurance plan. Around the fool's block, they'd say that $300 a month isn't okay.

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Dr. THOMAS SOWELL NAILS BHO LYING STYLE

BHO_LIE

“Hubris-laden charlatans” was the way a recent e-mail from a reader characterized the Obama administration. That phrase seems especially appropriate for the Charlatan-in-Chief, Barack Obama, whose speech to a joint session of Congress was both a masterpiece of rhetoric and a shameless fraud.

To tell us, with a straight face, that he can insure millions more people without adding to the already skyrocketing deficit, is world-class chutzpa and an insult to anyone’s intelligence. To do so after an analysis by the Congressional Budget Office has already showed this to be impossible reveals the depths of moral bankruptcy behind the glittering words.

Did we really need CBO experts to tell us that there is no free lunch? Some people probably did and the true believers in the Obama cult may still believe the President, instead of believing either common sense or budget experts.

Even those who can believe that Obama can conjure up the money through eliminating “waste, fraud and abuse” should ask themselves where he is going to conjure up the additional doctors, nurses, and hospitals needed to take care of millions more patients.

If he can’t pull off that miracle, then government-run medical care in the United States can be expected to produce what government-run medical care in Canada, Britain, and other countries has produced– delays of weeks or months to get many treatments, not to mention arbitrary rationing decisions by bureaucrats.

Obama can deny it in words but what matters are deeds– and no one’s words have been more repeatedly the direct opposite of his deeds– whether talking about how his election campaign would be financed, how he would not rush legislation through Congress, or how his administration was not going to go after CIA agents for their past efforts to extract information from captured terrorists.

President Obama has also declared emphatically that he will not interfere in the internal affairs of other nations– while telling the Israelis where they can and cannot build settlements and telling the Hondurans whom they should and should not choose to be their president.

One of the secrets of being a glib talker is not getting hung up over whether what you are saying is true, and instead giving your full attention to what is required by the audience and the circumstances of the moment, without letting facts get in your way and cramp your style.
Obama has mastered that art ………

http://conservablogs.com/theconservativecrawfish

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Gosh, a big speech? In which the president, the Despicable One, makes good points, comes off well, sounds like things could improve? Well, wouldn't THAT suck! Gosh, wouldn't success be just a great big stinkin' pity? No matter that uninsured will be insured, "Barry" can't succeed!!! Not that, never that!

There, there. Calm down. Things stink so bad, the country that Bush handed over is in such terrible shape that there will still be things you can criticize. I know, it's very scary to suddenly worry that something will get fixed; then what??? AHHHH!!!! Hope? Change? What happens when you mock them and then they happen? HOrrors!

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The problem is NOT this dumb-ass Congressman -- shit, he called a spade a spade -- Barack is a motherfuckin' LIAR and PROMISE BREAKER !! You know it, I know it -- no one can deny it!!! What is so bad about some booing and yelling?? Hell, in England THEIR Parliament is loud as HELL -- and fun to watch -- and Barack DESERVES to be heckled --

Look -- as I've said here many times before, the Republicans and Democrats are ONE AND THE SAME! Makes no difference who you vote for -- once the cameras cut off and the fake, scumbag corporate "journalists" leave to go write their propaganda for the Controllers, and the doors close for private conversation, the Democrats AND Republicans are best of friends and laugh hysterically at us chumps, the regular people of America, for once again believing what they told us they would do during campaigning...

Barack & the other Democrats are now bending us over and are in the process of fucking us -- hell - not just regular fucking -- this time they're fucking us DRY -- they're ripping our assholes to pieces!!

This time Barack has told more lies in the 1st 7-8 months than any other Democrat politician I can remember-- the same for the trash scumbag fake Democrat "progressives" in Congress-- they said they would do single payer, stop the war, all of that shit, ONLY IF they had the wet dream "supermajority". Well, they got their dream!! Now, they claim they can't rally the troops to support any of the liberal agenda -- or that they have to be "bipartisan" in whatever they do -- more lies!! You and I know they never intended to pass any kind of progressive agenda, no matter how big a majority they have. Shit, they could have a 4-1 or better majority, and I bet they STILL would come up with BS excuses not to implement progressive plans!!

I sure hope you guys aren't fooled anymore by Democrats -- by now, I hope you realize that no matter how many times you vote for them, or what they promise, they will not follow through.

So DO NOT vote for a Democrat ever again -- Only vote Socialist or maybe Green Party. I don't give a shit if Republicans win in the meantime, because having them in power is just the same as the worthless Democratic Party in power -- they take their fucking bribes, and do what their masters want -- never what the "people" want or need...

Take a look at The Obama Deception if you haven't already -- you might not believe everything in it about the New World Order -- but the parts in it about all of Barack's lies and broken promises -- You NEED TO HEAR AND SEE that part - Barack breaks more promises he made us EVERY GODDAMN WEEK !!!

Barack sure as hell as deceived us...and the world...

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Lets let the American people decide for themselves if its wanted.

It is obviously the largest piece of legislation to be considered in our lifetime. So why not let the people decide for themselves?

Of course, that may be a little TOO MUCH like democracy. Besides the Obama camp wants this far and forgotten by the time elections come around,

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Pres Obama sold America out in his Wednesday speech. He had every intention of doing this all along. Months ago he was negotiating with Billy Tauzin, a Big Pharma leader who before the election he condemned. Before there were angry town halls or Blue Dog opposition, there was a deal in the works to NOT NEGOTIATE FOR LOWER PRICES ON DRUGS and TO MAINTAIN THE BAN ON DRUG IMPORTATION FROM CANADA. Once Obama reached the White House, Tauzin was a frequent visitor and "health care reform" consultant.
One of Obama's first Cabinet picks was, along with his wife, a leading pro-insurance lobbyists. Tom Dascle and his wife, have, over the years, made big $$$ from the parasitic insurance cartel championing their lies and distortions. Although he was forced to withdraw his name from the HHS cabinet post for cheating on his taxes, Obama named him as a chief advisor on his Health Care Advisory Council. At the same time he named one Nancy Ann De Parle, a former insurance industry lawyer, as his Health Care Czar. During this time, people who advocate for single payer or the public option like Howard Dean, have been ignored. Dean, the former head of the DNC, was not even asked by Obama to attend the swearing in ceremony for his replacement. Certainly a clear message.
And now we get a flaccid public option that most Americans won't be allowed to join and won't even be available for 4 to 5 years...a mandate that we must do business with the fraudulent insurance companies...and tort reform (a gift to insurance companies). States with tort reform have some of the highest doctor liability insurance rates, so what's the point?
Obama's Wednesday night speech did offer leadership...LEADERSHIP IN THE WRONG DIRECTION.

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