... try to think of why any person should care for those that the person considers "backwards" (presumably most people on this "progressive" site will find Honky's thinking "backwards").

We share this planet. The more we can care about each other and get along, the better.

If we ignore whoever we consider "backwards", then we may still have to deal with the results of actions of "backwards" people. While from Honky's viewpoint it may have appeared as though ignoring the people of Africa would result in the people of Africa just dying off, that is not as likely as the population explosion still continuing and the people of Africa continuing to move to different places and likely contributing further to the spread of HIV.

Any "backwards" person who is open to communication has some hope of changing the "backwards" thinking based on new information.

By disengaging with "backwards" people, we may find that their progeny also have a heavy tendency to be "backwards".

While it is possible that all of us humans may cease to exist (at least partly due to the lack of care from the likes of Honky), let us hope we can care enough to deal with "backwards" thinking people in constructive ways, rather than just ignore them or vent on them.

Sincerely,
Aouie

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"I would also like to challenge anyone to give me a reason to care about these backwards people."
__________

There are at least two possibilities in your case: you are unable to feel compassion for other life or, you are unwilling to feel compassion for other life. As to the first, if you are unable to feel compassion and, if such a personal dysfunction cannot be remedied by medical science, there is little you or anyone else can do for you. It is no matter. There are without a doubt plenty of other human beings who feel such compassion and can get the job done that you are prevented from doing through your disability. As to the second, if you are unwilling to feel compassion, your viewpoint is a matter of deficiency in education in that, if your education were adequate, you would clearly see that what happens to one life happens to all life within the ecosystem of our planet. Every event sets off a chain reaction of consequential events, much of which cannot be adequately predicted. When it comes to living organisms where complexity as compared to non-living matter is staggering, those inevitable chain reactions have even less predictable consequences. As to the first, there is little to nothing you can do. As to the second, you could accomplish much for yourself and for others by improving your education. I'm certain there are many who can advise you how to do that but, it is again no matter. There are, I think, plenty of other human beings with more than adequate compassion for these lives who can get the job done in your willing or unwilling absence.

My condolences.

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...group that is quickly becoming our superior,does not feel that same way about YOU in the future.

As I look around at the Amerikkkan public in general,it has become evident (especially since the Shrub administration has taken over), that we are becoming a dumbed down society.

Therefore to paraphrase you "I would also like to challenge anyone to give me a reason to care about these backwards people (Amerikkans). These people are (also becoming) too stupid to continue their existence. Nature (should, and probably will) place them between the Dodo bird and the Stegosaurus. "

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Yes, nearly 7 billion monkeys jumping on the bed, why oh why has a cretinous reptilian like you not been tossed already?

With a zero tolerance attitude about our burgeoning population I am confident that you chose not to procreate and thank Zeus for that!I'm thinking it probably wasn't your choice though, if your appearance is as unfortunate as your philosophy I'm sure no one would touch you with a ten-foot pole.

I say the sooner ugly people stop having babies the sooner the world will be a MUCH roomier place. Ugly people aren't just hard to look at but they have bad attitudes because they know it. Get those ugly MFs off this overcrowded planet for the good of all! Abstinence Only for Ugly People!

Irony rating: High

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Barack Obama like Rick Warren does state the belief that "marriage is between a man and a woman". While politically Barack decided to voice opposition to Proposition 8, it was an inconsistent stance.

The anti-gay witch hunt (hunting of anti-gays) is a sorry state of affairs, that is likely to result in losing the good will of lots of people. How should we deal with people whose religious beliefs have convinced them that same-sex sexual relationships are an abomination? Blacklisting, name calling (such as bigots or homophobes), finding legal loop holes to undermine the majority will (when not much is at stake as in California (unlike Arkansas where much is at stake)), articles such as this (similar in nature to the vilification of Jeremiah Wright), etceteras, are bad ways to deal with religiosity and its effects. I recommend dialogue and mutual courtesy.

Sincerely,
Aouie

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Warren is the same old sour, outdated wine in a shiny new bottle. People who reject modern science by promoting creationism (or cretinism), ignorance-based sex education, homophobia, intercessory prayer, miracles and other nonsense are laughingstocks in Europe nowadays, but in the US they're taken seriously.

The best way to undermine these charlatans is with dispassionate, logical, scientific arguments. You won't convince the deluded, but you can reduce their recruiting success.

That's how we have to fight an epidemic of a deadly disease called ignorance.

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One of the biggest problems with many of my co-conspirators on the Left is their absolute inability to think in terms of long range, political strategy. It happened too many times to count during the campaign which ended two months ago and now it's happened yet again. When I heard that Rich Warren would be giving the Inaugural invocation my first reaction was, "What is my man Obama thinking?"

Then I was reminded of a film I first saw when I was ten years old in the autumn of 1968. It was called, Yellow Submarine and it starred animated versions of the Beatles. At the movie's end, when John, Paul, George and Ringo liberated Pepperland from the evil clutches of the naughty Blue Meanies, what did they do? Did they ostracize the Meanies? Did they banish them from Pepperland forever? Mo. They reached out to them! Leave it to John Lennon (or the actor doing a piss poor impersonation of Joun Lennon's voice):

"Hello, Blue People! Won't you join us? Look up!"

The Blue Meanies picked up on the good vibes, everyone hugged one another and joined in with a rousing rendition of George Harrison's It's All Too Much. The film ended and they all lived happily ever after - or at least until the Fab Four broke up acrimoniously two years later, suing the shit out of each other in a London Court Room. C'est la vie.

Okay, I realize that that's a ridiculously simplistic analogy. The truth is, I have not a clue why Obama would want Warren at his inauguration. But I do have some ideas....

In the last three decades, this country has become as politically polarized as it's ever been. There are a lot of people out there who are so stupid, they still think that the Reagan Revolution was a neat idea. It is my belief that by having Pastor Warren deliver a prayer on 20 January, Barack Obama is reaching out to Americans of all political shades. He is telling them:

"We may not agree on many of the fundamental issues facing our troubled nation, but I am recognizing you as an equal participant in the American experiment. I may have defeated your ideology in the last election, but I respect your right to hold a differing opinion. I am reaching out to you. I want to be the Beatles to your Blue Meanies. Welcome to Pepperland....

"It's all too much for me to take
The love that's flowing all around me
Everywhere is birthday cake
So take a piece but not too much."

Or words to that effect.

Post #200: The Worst of "The Rant"

Tom Degan
Goshen, NY

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Will Obama Keep Supporting the Killing of People?

To follow Bush’s “war on AIDS” is as stupid as trying to save the world from terrorism!

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http://www.duesberg.com

His background and arguments are extremely compelling - but as a result of continuing to state what he is convinced is the truth - he gets the standard treatment of the dissident scientist.

"Instead of engaging in scientific debate, however, the only response has been to cut-off funding to further test Professor's Duesberg's hypothesis."

Here is another similar view

Get All The Facts: HIV does Not Cause Aids

1. The HIV-hypothesis is not supported. HIV is a harmless virus in both the in vivo and the in vitro settings.

2. AIDS in drug users and homosexuals in the U.S. and Europe is actually caused by the heavy ancillary use of glucocorticoids and other immunosuppressive agents to medically treat the wide range of chronic serious illnesses of the respiratory system, gastrointestinal system, and other organs, malnutrition, release of endogenous cortisol, and opportunistic infections in these persons. The appearance of "AIDS" in the U.S. and Europe has coincided with the approval of glucocorticoid aerosoll use in 1976, the introduction of crack cocaine, the use of heroin by inhalation, and the use of alkyl nitrites by homosexuals to enhance sexual activities.

3. AIDS in hemophiliacs is related to the use of corticosteroids and other immunosuppressive agents to prevent the development of antibodies for factors VIII and IX and to treat other chronic illnesses such as joint disease.

4. AIDS in people receiving blood and/or tissue is related to the use of glucocorticoids to prevent reactions of transfusion and tissue rejection, and to treat other illnesses.

5. AIDS in infants and children is caused by their exposure to drugs and corticosteroids in utero and their exposure to corticosteroids used after birth to treat their chronic illnesses.

6. AIDS in Africa is caused by malnutrition, release of endogenous cortisol, and opportunistic diseases. Atrophy in the lymphoid tissue in people suffering from malnutrition has been known since 1925. Malnutrition causes severe atrophy in the thymus and lymphoid organs and impairs the function of the T cells. These changes are reversible by feeding. The size of the thymus in malnourished children increased from 20% of normal to 107% of normal, following nine weeks of feeding.

7. Kaposi's sarcoma (KS) and lymphoma are induced by the use of sterolds and drugs, and the release of endogenous cortisol. They are not caused by a slow virus. KS is reversible upon the termination of treatment with immunosuppressive agents prior to metastasis.

8. I have found that the medications currently used to treat patients with AIDS, such as AZT, protease inhibitors, and glucocorticoids, are highly toxic. They can even cause AIDS in asymptomatic patients, and make the disease worse in patients with AIDS. These drugs do not have any therapeutic value, and their use must be discontinued immediately.

9. Damage to the immune system is rapidly reversible after removal of the true insulting agent or treatment of the true causes. For example. a) The CD4+ T cells of 1075 HIV+ pregnant women increased from 426/uL to 596/uL in six months by giving these women a balanced diet. This also improved the outcome of their pregnancy; and b) The reduction in CD4+ T cells in HIV+ homosexuals was also reversed by the cessation of treatrnent with glucocorticoids.

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Obama seems intent on failures of massive proportions ... The DLC Plan for more Democratic gifts to the well off while shooting them selves in the foot.

terrible appointments ...

rick warren ...

Stimulus with business tax breaks ...

jawboning Medicare and Social Security ...

failure to speak out on Gaza ...

~ I see massive failures, economic, fiscal and diplomatic ...

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The sooner these wacko fundamentalist go broke with the rest of corporate America then the sooner can the US and the rest of the world win reprieve from these dark age regurgitations!

PeterT

Nambassa downunder

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This is what I notice about conservative Republican politicians (and even ignorant Democratic politicians) and the evangelicals they are in bed with: Nobody has a problem pouring money into fighting AIDS in Africa. Even George Bush gets kudos for fighting AIDS. It's only a problem when it comes to fighting AIDS at home. Why?

In Africa, it's a cultural issue. Africans are viewed as ignorant. In America, it's still a "gay" disease and, therefore, viewed as something that is 'deserved.' I know. I'm gay and I've had conversations with theologians who think that way.

It's a sad, sorry state of affairs and neither Bush nor Warren deserve kudos for any of this. It's also a sad day when a man who has promised "Change we can believe in" chooses Warren over so many others who could have led the invocation.

I voted for Obama only because Dennis Kucinich had already withdrawn from the race. He's the only guy who "gets it."

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To have an asshole like Warren be their 'Representative' to the world community on 1-20-09.
We need more clarification on EXACTLY what Ricks "Purpose" Is. Cheney had a 'Purpose Driven Life' and look what he has done to our coutnry and the world.
If Warren is anything like the Other snake Oil Dealers calling themselves 'Evangelical', then his 'purpose' is to do all he can to bring on 'End of Days'. these Greedy arrogant lil' fuckers want to get soemthing going to FORCE 'god' to bring on the Apocalypse, Which will bring Forth THEIR magical Bus called 'The Rapture'.
Having been raised a Catholic (recovered now), I was never taught 'Revelations' was something to aspire to, Nor Revere.Hagee wants to Pre-emptively strike Iran to Kick start Armegeddon. Catholics (at least) do NOT see this type of Interference with the Divines design to be within Our Duties or Right.In Fact it is not the 'Good' who tries to spur such a showdown on...It is their goal to avoid it through their efforts toward peace and love.
End of Days Philososphies (Morbid Obsession) is NOT a Christian doctrine, it has been around since man realized he could Not control all that occurs on the Planet. This ideology (and 'Purpose')goes back to the age of Titans and Olympians. Christ said very clearly 'Only the Father Knows' when the End will come. Perhaps he should have added 'And Only the Father can make it happen'
Not to mention the fact Christ sought out the Outcasts and 'sinners' not just to 'heal' them but to add them to his Ministry. He did not JUDGE the prostitute, he only tried to bring some personal peace and Hope.
Thus Evangelicals ARE NOT CHRISTIANS, They are just using the most 'popular' Religion to disguise themsleves behind, No different than the Islamic 'Jihadists'- War and hate Mongers, fantasizing about THEIR big pay off, while others are left to suffer. Nothing more than Self Serving Heretics.

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We don't need some guy wailing to the Great Sky God at a presidential inauguration.

We need to get religion totally out of government--no inaugural prayers, no "invocations" in Congress.

'nuff said!

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That Rick Warren is an asshole, everyone knows that, so why do we need another Alternet article to point out the obvious? Warren is a pastor it goes with the territory, being an ignorant homophobe is one of his job requirements. However what Obama did in inviting him to do the innaugural invocation is brilliant. It put Warren in a horrible position, if he refused he would look like a total shit, if he went, he would lose part of his right-wing support base. Obama's invitation also diffuses any victimhood claims from these so-called christians. How can they claim to be excluded from mainstream America and be victims of the 'liberal elites' (whatever that means) if one of their own was included in the innaugural?

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After all the uplifting rhetoric and full-throated promises of change, letting this witch hunter and his crowd of pre-enlightenment assholes spew their unholy bullshit on an inaugural stage smacks of the kind of brown-nosing Democrats have perfected into an art these past eight years. I'm deeply disappointed, Obama.

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surprise these days. Yep, false hope and chump change come soon ! Glad I was an economic vigilante !

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When William the Conquerer launched his invasion of England back in 1066, out of the 700 ships that made the crossing only one failed to make it. One of those on board was the expeditionary force's soothsayer.

When William was informed of it, he replied: "No great loss...he couldn't even predict his own demise".

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Is it just me or does the Rick Warren come off as being a real douchebag?

JT
Privacy Center

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it's really sad that white westerners are playing out their own personal ideological battles over someone else's life. these religious fools are hypocritical people who attempt to live ascetic lifestyles to atone for their own past poor decision making. sadly, they are convinced that everyone else needs to be saved like they were. equally disturbing is the idea that homosexuality is un-natural. there isn't enough space to even begin to talk about that but let me say this, there is nothing wrong with being gay and anyone who disagrees with that is harboring ignorant and uncompassionate beliefs. there is no room for intolerance. gay people are no different from anyone else and if you can't see that then you have some true soul searching to do.

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I see everyone here is using logic to attempt to combat the pathological stupidity of the religious right: Burning condoms for Jesus.

Let's fight back in terms they can understand. Everyone take some condoms, sneak into a church that opposes birth control and stretch them over the head of a statue or picture of Jesus.

Fuck rationality and common sense. Let's have some fun here!

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It is unfortunate that the religious zealots choose not to believe in science! In their backwards zeal they are leading the whole country of Uganda (and others that follow) to the "sacrificial alter"! The evidence has proven over and over that abstinence only doesn't work - just ask Bristol Palin, and yet these sheep continue to demand that "condoms are ineffective"! It is ironic they site the ineffectiveness of condoms (based on what "science"?), yet they promote "abstinence only" which science has been empirically shown not to work!!!

I hope that people wake up and allow these sheep to jump off of the bridge and destroy themselves! Then maybe the civilized adults can start to make decisions that will help society rather than hurt it!

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...and has decided that they are right: Condoms contain evil spirits meant to trap the souls of men...

...like those who buy time with hookers who must rub dirt on their vaginas--because the males "like it dry"--in order to get a bonus or avoid a beating. You can paradrop rubbers or burn them to your tribal god, for all the good it will do, until those people who don't otherwise give a damn about dieing horribly decide they do. There is an economic component to that, but fruitful economic conditions require some semblance of stability, something that has been in short supply since the outmigration* of H. sapiens from that awful place, perhaps a couple of hundred thousand years ago.

Rick Warren is just another yankee who thinks the U.S. has business trying to make other folks in other countries behave in a self-beneficial way. They always get it wrong.

*assumes the well-supported "out of Africa" model is mostly correct, which has not been conclusively demonstrated, but which maternal mitochondrial DNA "epidemiology" (for lack of a better word) should shed light on.

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These men are seriously dangerous.

It's one thing to choose religion over science for yourself, but quite another when you take on the humanitarian duty of helping others. Your personal views should be taking a back seat and doing what is appropriate for the human.

This is worse than your door to door proselytizing; at least then people have the option of declining and closing the door. When you have loads of government money given to you for -humanitarian purposes-you have a higher responsibility to those humans, not to God.

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Rick Warren is not Thomas Muthee. There seems to be an attempt to shift the "witch-hunting" black-mark from Palin to Warren, perhaps in hopes of applying the appellate "witch-hunter" to all non-leftists in the U.S. That would reduce the charge to absurdity, thus clearing the way for Palin 2012.

Anyone who's done work in other countries knows that you're dealing with folks with vastly different world views. I could be linked to people who believe evil spirits cause misfortune and that coconuts must be sacrificed to avert the wrath of demons, and that the songs of transgendered people bring bad luck, with the same standard as what's applied to Warren here. This is quite different than the case with Palin and Muthee, since Palin's cohorts intentionally brought Muthee to Alaska for the express purpose to anointing her. If Palin's church simply sent medicine and food to Muthee's church, and got some progress reports on how the medicines and food were being distributed, congratulating Muthee on his success in those areas, it wouldn't have been an issue at all.

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Obama is trying to help us understand what we really want. We have Eight years of slogans, and preaching. These 8 years have made many of very Angry. Angry enough to go out and Vote, but when we voice our feelings. Maybe others will not hear our words the way we intended. Maybe Obama is trying to force us to hear ourselves.

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I read the source article and all the comments and their replies. So much mental energy going on over something that never would have happened IF HILLARY WERE THE PRESIDENT-ELECT. No matter what you think or thought of her, one thing is for ABSOLUTE SURE and you will have to agree with: Hillary would never have had Rick Warren involved in her inauguration. Seems a lot of you out there are having buyer's remorse. If this is any indication of things to come, "you ain't seen nothing yet!"

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If you read some of the source material on Warren's Wikipedia article, you find that Warren is sometimes mistaken on facts. For instance, he opposed pulling the feeding tube from Terry Schiavo, but his reasoning was based on faulty information - he thought that there was a possibility that she might recover. We know from brain images that such a recovery was impossible, but do we really think that a mega-church pastor is going to be abreast of all developments in science?

People can sometimes be wrong because they're dealing with incomplete or false information. That doesn't make them evil. If a person is willing to dialog and talk in a respectful manner, then such a person should be welcomed to the conversation. Truth will out.

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you either believe in equal rights for everyone or you don't.
Obviously Obama and Rick Warren do not.

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Whether Warren or someone else gives the invocation, the speaker invariably evokes mythic-biblical elements, which seem as out of place as at a 21st century presidential innogoration as stone-axes on a Mars-lander. Why not instead invite a Paul Krugman or Noam Chomsky, modern thinkers with rational solutions to give the invocation?
1.) Regarding marriage: why not just strike the phrase 'marriage' from the legal records and allow anyone to form a dual corporate entity (civil union)? Relegate marriage to its right place as a religious artifact.
2.) Make Sarah Palin sex dolls available to the religious-right. This would mitigate their need to project their repressed sexual urges onto the rest of the world by allowing them to have unprotected, non-human sexual interactions--and would simultaneously obviate their need to have her as a candidate--caribou barbie, without the nonsensical voice!

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I don't want to watch Rick Warren give the inaugural invocation. Can we arrange to have an alternative invocation at the same time on TV? Maybe by Gene Robinson the gay Anglican bishop. We can then just switch out Rick Warren. Worst case, I will switch to the Comedy Channel when Mr. Warren shows his face. You do the same.

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I'm not thrilled at Warren's inclusion at the inauguration, but look how much attention he's getting. Obama's intentions may have been entirely benign, but now America has a chance to see how evil our "religious" leaders really are.

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Take a look at the book ends of this issue.

Rick Warren at one end. Larry Flynt on the other.
Is this what holds us up, state religion and Sex.

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---Okay, seriously? I don't know whether or not I should keep coming here to read this stuff: I mean, its making me a whole lot more informed than I ever was before, but on the other hand, its fanning the flames of whatever mild or dormant dislike I had of right-wing/conservative extremists, to the point where I feel instant fury at every new story or event or bit of news....gah! Am I the only one alone in this feeling? Oyvey...

(And...its propelled by a feeling of hopelessness towards the US [I'm a Canuck]; like, if this is how America is starting to work, if this is the force that is taking over the collective mentality of America, then...its over. Abandon ship.)

/unintelligible rant

(p.s. if this post is too random then please delete, thanks)

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ran into other humanoids when they left the rift...i'm no longer convinced of the "out of africa" theory - or of the ice bridge to north america theory...

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"..you never, ever, ever make a deal with the devil... YELL FIRE!"

When will the owning class libs learn that? When will my fellow Jews learn that? Both are courting their respective devils... the fundie Xtians. And it's workin' out so very well, ennit?

This kuntry is just a breeding ground for batshit stoopids....

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OK, the case is made about Rev. Warren and his hurtful sexual crusades.

Now, here's what's in the bottom of the barrel below the Rev. Warren: Mr. Tinky Winky has died and gone to visit somewhere else, where he has been told that fleecing the flock and then investing in diamond mines, and lying about it to the flock, is not cool. The rest of the mafia all still think global warming is an anti-capitalist plot, God is a big piggy bank to be robbed, and thou shalt kill, steal and lie only when thou can get away with it.

That's why some people are doing the, God help us, Christian thing in reaching out to any corpse which might or might not have a pulse. That's Rick Warren. He actually talks about global warming. A little.

The goal is to wiggle a little bit of sense, just a touch of yeast, into the center of the Christian Evangelical movement. If just a few people can believe that global warming means something, then the idea will spread. Then maybe more ideas will spread.

It wasn't long ago that women could barely find any men to hold feminist positions, or that people of color could barely find any white supporters. However, the idea of separating the argument from the color, or the gender, or the religion, or the sexual orientation of the speaker, requires that a few of the other type of people hold the argument as true.

It's a tough nonviolent row to hoe. It has to be done. Oh, and someday, somewhere, we need one Evangelical who doesn't hate the lesbigays. Have you seen one?

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Why have we become so over-tolerant of people who feel entitled to dictate their self righteous, self centered, criminally discriminatory, de-evolutionary ideas based so loosely on the ideology they claim to "faithfully" follow that the only resemblance it has is the TITLE?! Never should Church and State meet to create policy as there are too many systems of belief to represent and satisfy and frankly, people of "faith" have a tendency as of late to make up definitions of what is "Holy" and "Evil" on a whim and call it blasphemy when anyone rational brings a light source anywhere near the definition. Frankly, I believe the accumulation of data I have gathered personally and shared with others who's beliefs are as varied as snowflakes, have come to the same conclusion when faced with this viral Religious infection. Anyone who would so vehemently spout their vile beliefs in the guise of religious fervor needs to decide if they truly believe the tenants they claim to hold dear and READ VERY CAREFULLY the words passed down by dictation and interpretation by thousands of people before them, for reasons as inspiring as being possessed by the holy spirit and as simple as crowd control. There are underlying ideas they have completely lost touch with and the God they love to invoke when claiming Homosexuals are damned or people of other cultures (often far more ancient than any Judeo-Christian story,) need to be converted and saved actually would have nothing to do with you and your ilk save to push you gently towards the truths you seek to ignore or destroy.
But mostly these signs are ignored to the point that "God" has to put their sorry ass in the middle of the railroad track and when they finally hear the horn, they misinterpret it as an apocalyptic prophecy. So say we all, Huzza, Huzza.
If they truly believed in God, The Devil and Hell, then most of these people might find they have created a hot spot reserved for them, complete with bronze plaque and personal demon bell-boy.
If they ever truly understood how far they have strayed from the light, they might be relieved to find that a "God" who would create such wonders as we take for granted everyday while screwing each other over for petty percentages while literally and figuratively defecating on our children's future,
has , by design, forgiven all of us in advance, deserving or not.
Keep your damn Bible lust out of our Government. It's only an excuse to make your weak soul and fractured little spirits feel as if the inanities you spout in unison with the other lemmings has weight and meaning to more than just you and your dead ended, exclusionary club. It's easy to put words in "Gods" mouth when you don't know how to listen anymore. You so sure he won't kick your asses for any of this crap, it's like you know he isn't there.
But "he" is.

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I am extremely disappointed in Obama's choice of Rick Warren to deliver the inaugural invocation. I thought Obama represented moving forward. Rick Warren doesn't represent moving forward in any way. I may not vote for Obama again in 2012 because of this absurd choice.

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Countries/peoples who are dumb and fearful of science will be killed by AIDS. The smart, open-minded ones will learn and adapt and survive.

Eventually, the god-morons will be wiped out. Halleleujah!

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needs to start a witch hunt against Twinkies.

#@!

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since he is against most of what Obama says he stands for.

Why else give this "Elmer Gantry" like preacher power?

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"I burn these condoms in the name of Jesus!" Ssempa shouted as he prayed over the burning box.

And inhaled a lungful of toxins, no doubt. Burning whatever is in condoms cannot be healthy, but then again, what these people are doing for their countrymen is just as toxic. It's like they want people to suffer and die. That's the only explanation I can come up with. Abstinence-only programs make the fundies happy, because they can prove 100-percent of the time that only the virtuous get HIV. In other words, if you get sick, you were the wrong sort of person to begin with. It's like a reverse witch hunt. Even women whose partners cheat on them are demonized, for failure to inspire virtuousness in their partner. It's so very Republican.

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Not only Fundamentalist Christians but Fundamentalist Muslims oppose condom-based AIDS programs. Thus President Bush’s compromise requiring a percentage go to abstinence advocacy meant that anti-Aids programs entered Muslim areas where it wouldn’t have without a percentage going to preaching abstinence.

I don’t know if the Aids criticism of Rick Warren is accurate, but I take it with a grain of salt since many of the hate Warren bloggers condemned Bush in Africa as well.

As far as child molesting insinuations go, both extreme gay activists and extreme Fundelmentalist Christians hurl child molestation supporting charges at each other far more pointedly than Rick Warren does, creating a witch-hunt atmosphere, and greater and greater punishments.

An 87-year-old minister, was jailed because he and his followers believed that the Bible mandated that marriage be allowed at puberty. Blogs condemning him made it seem like he personally was waiting in the bushes for young girls to pass by. One had him photographed as a 40-year-old man. Of course many Fundelmentalist are making sure that drunk drivers striking a pregnant woman is charge with two crimes when in the past a drunk driver was usually charged with one crime of manslaughter no matter how many passengers were in the car he or she struck.

Let’s both sides stop trying to prove our moral views by trying to get people in prison as long as possible.

Please see,
http://capitolhillblue.com/cont/node/13677
RichardKanePA

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I'm trying to suggest this every place I can. The Sojourners editor, author of God's Politics: Why the Right Gets It Wrong and the Left Doesn't Get It and The Great Awakening: Reviving Faith and Politics in a Post-Religious Right America, and longtime evangelical moderate would be an ideal choice.

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Warren ought to be reminded that the Nazis, too, were "purpose driven." Their purpose was to eliminate everyone they didn't like because their god, Adolf, saw Jews, gypsies, homosexuals, et al. as "sub-human." Only Aryans allowed. Put Christers into the equation and you get Dominionism and the Rapture, which these geeks are working so hard to bring about, as if it were a foregone conclusion.

I am continually amazed at how these evangalical types manipulate language to shroud the mean-spirited, un-Christian agenda that replaces Jews with queers and gypsies with lesbians. "Purpose Driven" is a euphemism for feel good capitalism, which Jebus never would have approved.

For all their nods to the Israeli lobby, evangelicals like Warren see them as useful idiots in bringing about Armageddon.

SHAME ON YOU, OBAMA!!! I would take back my vote if I could. Only, whoops! Had McShame won the race, we'd be having an invocation by Rev. John Hagee. Oy vay!!!

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