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Health & Wellness

Health Care: It's Time for a Major Overhaul

By Alexander Zaitchik, AlterNet. Posted December 1, 2008.


A huge coalition of progressive and union forces is gearing up for political battle on the health care front.
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Back in early September, a microcosm of the looming health care debate played out on the stage of the Albuquerque Chamber of Commerce. Karen Ignagni, CEO of the insurers' largest industry association, was leading a roundtable discussion as part of a national "listening tour" organized by her organization, America's Health Insurance Plans. Waiting for Ignagni in the auditorium were activists from the local chapter of ACORN, who had come to share their thoughts on the CEO's market-based reform ideas. It didn't take long before the line of questioning became a little too heated for the Chamber of Commerce moderator.

"What do you expect?" he exploded in front of a stunned audience. "The insurance industry has to make a profit -- that's what they do!"

Following the Albuquerque confrontation, the insurers' group quickly lowered the profile of subsequent roundtables.

Ignagni may or may not have known at the time that those targeting her with ACORN-shaped rhetorical darts represented the activist wing of Health Care for America Now, an umbrella organization launched in July to win a "guarantee of quality, affordable health care for all" by the end of 2009. ACORN is one of 16 groups on the HCAN steering committee, which is a veritable Who's Who of progressive grassroots, netroots, and labor groups, including USAction, MoveOn, SEIU and the AFL-CIO. Four months after launching with a press conference in the National Press Building, HCAN now consists of more than 500 organizations and boasts the backing of the president-elect, his incoming chief of staff and 151 Democratic members of Congress, among them leading progressives and "pro-business" Blue Dogs alike.

As Karen Ignagni and her colleagues in the pharmaceutical and insurance industries are by now well aware, HCAN constitutes a double-threat to those standing in the way of solving America's health care crisis. As it was built to do, the well-funded coalition wields influence inside Washington and out, where it controls a millions-strong activist army, with constituent group organizations complimented by 80 full-time HCAN field staff in 42 states. "We represent the deepest single-issue coalition in modern American history," says Jeff Blum, HCAN co-chairman and USAction director.

The campaign was hatched during a conversation between Blum and Richard Kirsch, one of his board members and current director of HCAN. They were imagining what it would take to push through universal health care, once and for all, sooner rather than later. The wish list that resulted from their musings -- legions of activists, more resources, better research -- led to the idea of a broad coalition that combined Beltway influence and grassroots muscle. Blum and Kirsch first brought together SEIU and AFSCME, two unions with large memberships in the health care sector. The directors of those two groups plus USAction became the founding three co-chairs. By the time HCAN launched the following July, the steering board included community organizations like ACORN, and health care provider organizations like the American Nurses Association and the American Academy of Pediatrics. The Center for American Progress provides the coalition with think-tank heft, as well as further links to the incoming administration and Congress.

HCAN's constituent groups sometimes overlap, yet each brings a unique set of experiences and expertise to the table. "The coalition has a very smart design to it," says Lisa Codispoti of the National Women's Law Center, which sits on HCAN's steering board. "There is a synergy between all of the groups, each of which adds to the narrative." As an example, Codispoti points to a recent National Women's Law Center report detailing how women pay higher premiums in the private health insurance market. Other HCAN groups -- from the Children's Defense Fund to the National Council of La Raza -- have produced similar studies focused on other segments of the population. The result is a tapestry of expertise that forms a comprehensive condemnation of America's private-employer-based system. This expertise is useful to both challenge industry propaganda and guide lawmakers as they debate and craft a final bill.

"We're part of a lot of coalitions, but HCAN is edgy in a unique way," says Linda Tran, an SEIU spokeswoman. "It has a 'street heat' that we're known for, as well. The combination of grassroots and new media and online organizing gives it a special force and energy."

Defeating the Republican and Big Business message machines while uniting Democrats of different stripes behind bold reform will demand nothing less. Although hardly cash-poor, HCAN and reform advocates continue to play David to the industry's Goliath in terms of finances. The $10 million seed grant that HCAN received from Atlantic Charities is roughly equal to the cost of the insurers-sponsored "Harry and Louise" ad campaign of 1993, which helped torpedo the last reform drive.

HCAN is determined to avoid a repeat of that failure. The campaign continues to bolster its coffers and plans to buy $20 million in ads promoting its vision of a public health care alternative coupled with stricter government regulation of the private health care market. Another key difference between the 1990s and now is an opposition in disarray. The Republicans understand that simply screaming "socialism" is no longer sufficient to derail reform, but they lag far behind Democratic efforts to craft policy and build the coalitions needed to push it through. Even if Republicans do manage to unite behind a market-based reform plan, the health care debate has shifted so much over the last 15 years that they will likely find it difficult to defeat a Democratic plan that guarantees affordable coverage to all Americans.


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Alexander Zaitchik is a freelance journalist.

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View:
Great News ! But Where is the Plan?
Posted by: mmckinl on Dec 1, 2008 12:15 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Sounds to me that the American public will again get the short end of the stick.

Unless it is Single Payer it is Bull Shit ...

And when this "Universal Health Care Plan" gets passed we will be stuck for another decade or two trying to get real single payer, Medicare for All.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» The Illegals will love it Posted by: theVRWCwhodatesLiberals
» Apples and oranges. . . Posted by: peacefullaim
» Citizen of the World Posted by: theVRWCwhodatesLiberals
» RE: The Illegals will love it Posted by: peacefullaim
» Exactly right Posted by: tommy_slothrop
» the plan is hr 676 Posted by: undrgrndgirl
No Thanks
Posted by: salt-of-the-earth on Dec 1, 2008 1:53 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Please -- count me out. I don't want any part of government so-called "health-care." Don't want or need the statin drugs, the vaccines, the Prozac, or any of the other murderous medicine and horrific "treatments" of "modern medicine," or as the Bible calls it "science so-called."

Just stay away. Don't be coming on my property with your dangling badges and your hypos. Please? I just want to live in peace. Did you catch that word "live?"

If I get in a car accident and need to be stitched up, nobody has the science down better than modern American medicine and my auto insurance will pay for everything. Other than that, thanks but no thanks.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: No Thanks Posted by: teel
» RE: No Thanks Posted by: dmaciewski
» RE: No Thanks Posted by: salt-of-the-earth
» RE: No Thanks Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: No Thanks Posted by: 2thepoint
» RE: No Thanks Posted by: salt-of-the-earth
» RE: No Thanks Posted by: mtnprivy
» RE: No Thanks Posted by: salt-of-the-earth
» RE: No Thanks Posted by: Pleaides
» RE: No Thanks -- I second that Posted by: salt-of-the-earth
» RE: No Thanks Posted by: bornxeyed
» Universal isn't mandatory? Posted by: salt-of-the-earth
» RE: Universal isn't mandatory? Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Universal isn't mandatory? Posted by: salt-of-the-earth
» RE: Universal isn't mandatory? Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Universal isn't mandatory? Posted by: salt-of-the-earth
» RE: Universal isn't mandatory? Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Universal isn't mandatory? Posted by: salt-of-the-earth
Ethical, Fair and Compassionate Cost Control
Posted by: drricklippin on Dec 1, 2008 2:45 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Both Sen.Clinton's plan and President Elect Obama's health care proposals during the Presidential campaign came before the worst financial crisis that the US has faced since the great depression over 60 years ago. What is the plan this article is proposing and how will it be funded?

We need a health care plan that places primary emphasis on fair, ethical and compassionate cost control.Many have said, even before our current financial crisis, that a high-tech-high-cost treatment based "disease care" US health care system is simply not economically sustainable. And the ranks are growing on endorsing this reality.

The financial incentives in US Health care are perverse.

They reward disease -not health or prevention. We desperately need a true "health care" system for all Americans as soon as feasible.

I propose to the readers of AlterNet and to the Obama transition team that nothing short of the level of boldness and creativity that we are applying to the environmental crisis will carry the day in US Health Care Reform.

Richard A. Lippin MD
Health Care Forecaster
Southampton, Pa

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» TOM DASCHLE?? Posted by: drricklippin
» RE: TOM DASCHLE?? Posted by: bornxeyed
We need the Conyers HR676 bill.
Posted by: jlohman on Dec 1, 2008 3:00 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We don't need Wyden or Baucus or Kennedy. We need just one insurer: Medicare. We need the Conyers HR676 bill.

Yes, Canada’s health care system has wait times, and well it should. They spend just 10% of GDP compared to our 16%. But they cover 100% of Canadians and we only cover 85% of Americans and leave another 15% under-insured.

If Canada took one of every six people out of line, as we effectively do here in the U.S., they’d not have wait times either! But they are, indeed, under-serving their people. Shame on them.

But enough about Canada, let’s talk about the U.S.. We have the best doctors and nurses in the world, we just don’t make good use of them. Let’s fix the system we have.

Let’s follow Taiwan’s lead. They recently reformed their system after studying every health care system in the world. They came back with an answer, and modeled their new system after … drum roll please … our Medicare.


See Forget about Canada, we can do better!

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» RE: We need the Conyers HR676 bill. Posted by: pelican beak
» RE: We need the Conyers HR676 bill. Posted by: pelican beak
» They fixed this in England Posted by: pangolin
» They fixed this in England Posted by: pangolin
View from the Front line
Posted by: Ashoka911 on Dec 1, 2008 4:08 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I appreciate that there is FINALLY a high level or organization and will to get this done. (I hope).


I am a pretty well seasoned ER doc with a public health head, and have seen well over 60,000 people in the emergency department. I believe that there is no aspect of public health, health care, social and economic problems that are not reflected in our nation's departments. Whatever "solutions " we imagine, the feed back loop has to use the ERs as "eyes and ears" of the system. The ERs are failing because the entire health care system and the social contract with our people has been abandoned.

First, a few observations:

1) Health care and medical care is NOT a right guarenteed by the constitution or the Bill of Rights. That is a cold hard fact. If we want that to be otherwize, that needs to be addressed.

2) Health care and medical care, although they overlap, are not the same thing. Medical care (as an extreme example), can be a very speciallized, technical elective proceedure performed on a particular person). Elective cosmetic surgery , is less a health care focus.

Health care is a population issue (forest rather than trees)and incorporates primary care and episodic/emergency care. It includes not only medical care, but how it is financed , as well as how public health is prioritized.

It is important to make this distinction because we should be able to agree on a basic level of health care for all....and there will always be a level of private medical care for those who want more than that. (That is just a reasonably realistic guess).

3)I make a distinciton between the more medical aspects of care , health care and "wellness". Many people , of many cultures do many things to keep themselves happy and healthy. More power to them! We need to figure out what can have the most impact, for the most people with the idea that there actually are limitations on funding.

4) There needs to be basic medications available in ALL of the major classess of pharmaceuticals, at a reasonable price. I think that in the US, two tiers of medical care and access to medications will probably be inevitable.

Thses are simply perspectives to consider .

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» RE: View from the Front line Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: View from the Front line Posted by: Ashoka911
» RE: View from the Front line Posted by: bornxeyed
Same SOB's blaming the Unions, Have Blocked Univeral Healthcare for decades
Posted by: Purple Girl on Dec 1, 2008 4:10 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
'We can't compete globally because the Union Contracts cost too much'...Yada Yada yada.
Who hasn't figured out the Treasonous agenda of the 'Corporationists' (BOTH Red & Blue).
These SOB's want workers to be as cheap as possible to Incs, by throwing all healthcare costs on to the workers costs...Thus maintianing the lucrative aspects of privatized healthcare.
Same Assholes claiming that Americans cost Too much are the ones creating the disparity in costs.
What their real Goal is to have ameircna Workers be as cheap and 'low maintenence' as the 3rd world workers they currently have in Slavery. Gee I wonder why We have such a Bad name around the World...could it be partly due to the Corps who Fly our flags but hold NONE of our values?
There are certian things which should not be driven by profits or allowed to be gambled on in the Stock Market becasue they are ESSENTIAL to the welfare of the Citizens and the viablity of the economy...Healthcare, Unprocessed Foods and Energy. what use is a Gov't if it does not assure all these are accessible to all. How can you have a strong economy when your workers are hungry, or sick or can't afford gas to get to work?
What These Corporationist dream of is a system where Workers are nothing but TOOLS.
What they continue to ignore is the fact the Workers are also their Customers.They have been sucking th every life out of our economy...Cheap wages, no extraneous costs like healthcare and Prices which always keep US One step in the Hole (gotta help the 'Money Changer' golfing buddies )
'Socialism' is far more intricate than mere Healthcare. Socialism is where a MD makes as much money as a Garbageman. Being a 'socialist' myself I find this acceptable,considering they both assist in keeping the country Healthy (ever heard what happens when garbage piles up..Rats,...Plague. Garbage Disposal is Preventive Healthcare!)
In fact if all MD's made the same amount regardless of their 'specialty' then more Docs would be serving communities in the most dire need, instead of Rodeo drive.
So it is time to tell Corps this country was not founded for It's brick and mortar aspirations, It was Founded 'for the People and By the people'. Health Care is a Citizens Right, because with out the citizens the Corps would NOT exist, not here nor around the world. Humans are NOT a Commodity! We not only produce your products, we also Buy them. So screw the Worker and see which side your Corp comes out on with the consumers. No Good Jobs,exorbinant living costs,no extra cash in our pockets.... No Shopping, no Profits, No Corp!This country was built without Corps, we will survive their demise.
These TRAITORS think by wearing their Flag lapel pins WE are unable to see what the yhave done to US. We are no longer the Beacon, the Shining city on the Hill because they have been working diligently to dig the base out from under US by creating a Serf/Noble system which sees Human life as a mere tool to be used and disgarded once it has past it's 'expiration date' or usefulness.
healthcare is just as much a matter of national security as Jobs, because both effect our Economic livlihood. Weak Economy, Weak Nation.
It's time those who have confiscated our Free market be Prosecuted for Economic TREASON. We ar enot a Free Market, Nor even a Capitalist system, We are Owned,controlled and oppressed as a Nation by Corporationists (aka Monarchies with Logo's instead of Family Crests)

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» Free Beer! Posted by: theVRWCwhodatesLiberals
» RE: Free Beer! Posted by: bornxeyed
more synthetics
Posted by: Von on Dec 1, 2008 4:41 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I read an article yesterday in the Skeptical Inquirer on how we basically are a nation drugging our kids. It focused on Ritalin (spelling) and how big pharm can get behind a drug and push for it's use and even changing symptoms so as to have them fall under a diagnosis.


Have they ever got to the bottom of the mysterious desert storm illness, by the way?

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» RE: more synthetics Posted by: bornxeyed
Consider this financing system..
Posted by: Ashoka911 on Dec 1, 2008 4:45 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
More sniping from the emergency department....

A "Universal Health Care Savings Plan" is worth considering. Given that we spend some $6,000 or more per person per year on health care in the United States (!!!!) , I would like to see something like this:

1) Everybody has some amount per year that goes to their health care fund. (I will say $2,500) They pay for their primary and emergency care out of that and what ever is not used , goes into an educational fund or a housing fund earmarked to them or their children

2) Public Health/Preventitive Medicine, Pre Natal Care, and catastrophic care are paid for with the remainder.

3) Children are especially well covered, but frivolous use of health care needs to be implemented for all users.

4) Wellness care and additional "boutique" or private medical care is a second tier which insurance companies might have a function in.

The essence of this concept is a single party payer system for all basic care coupled with the universal health savings account.

This way, Joe "I only want to be suturered in a car accident " gets his wish.

Another consideration is that everything that we do as humans has an attributable risk. THAT should be paid for by the user! Each can of beer, each cigarrete, each motorcycle, just about EVERYTHING has an ultimate , calculatable cost. That should be paid up front by the user. By this scheme, the motorcyclist will disproportionately pay for the Spinal Cord and head injury uni. This would be a better use of actuarial science that letting the insurance companies risk stratify the population and "cherry pick".

Is anybody considering these approaches?

Haywood Hall, MD
Haywood.HallMD@pacemd.org

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Worth re posting....
Posted by: Ashoka911 on Dec 1, 2008 5:49 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Health insurance companies continue to compensate their executives out of proportion to any known formula

ANNUAL COMPENSATION OF HEALTH INSURANCE COMPANY EXECUTIVES (2006 and 2007 figures):

� Ronald A. Williams, Chair/ CEO, Aetna Inc., $23,045,834
� H. Edward Hanway, Chair/ CEO, Cigna Corp, $30.16 million
� David B. Snow, Jr, Chair/ CEO, Medco Health, $21.76 million
� Michael B. MCallister, CEO, Humana Inc, $20.06 million
� Stephen J. Hemsley, CEO, UnitedHealth Group, $13,164,529
� Angela F. Braly, President/ CEO, Wellpoint, $9,094,771
� Dale B. Wolf, CEO, Coventry Health Care, $20.86 million
� Jay M. Gellert, President/ CEO, Health Net, $16.65 million
� William C. Van Faasen, Chairman, Blue Cross Blue Shield of Massachusetts, $3 million plus $16.4 million in retirement benefits
� Charlie Baker, President/ CEO, Harvard Pilgrim Health Care, $1.5 million
� James Roosevelt, Jr., CEO, Tufts Associated Health Plans, $1.3 million
� Raymond McCaskey, CEO, Health Care Service Corp (Blue Cross Blue Shield), $10.3 million
� Daniel P. McCartney, CEO, Healthcare Services Group, Inc, $ 1,061,513
� Daniel Loepp, CEO, Blue Cross Blue Shield of Michigan, $1,657,555
� Todd S. Farha, CEO, WellCare Health Plans, $5,270,825
� Michael F. Neidorff, CEO, Centene Corp, $8,750,751
� Daniel Loepp, CEO, Blue Cross Blue Shield of Michigan, $1,657,555
� Todd S. Farha, CEO, WellCare Health Plans, $5,270,825
� Michael F. Neidorff, CEO, Centene Corp, $8,750,751

Get the insurance companies OUT of basic healthcare.

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» This is why you go to College! Posted by: theVRWCwhodatesLiberals
» Trial Lawers Posted by: theVRWCwhodatesLiberals
» RE: Trial Lawers Posted by: JSquercia
» The point Posted by: bornxeyed
» add it up Posted by: Rod
This ain't gonna happen on a federal level.
Posted by: maxpayne on Dec 1, 2008 5:50 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We need to focus on the local and state level elections there in addition to the federal level and elect better pols. Big Pharma/Insurance will then be forced to spend on all levels which means that for once the electorate was wise enough to put them on the defensive and make it harder to control the pols in Washington. Obama and Congress aren't gonna wave the magic wand for you. Just ask Hillary Clinton. She'll tell you the hell she went through trying to pass even a somewhat reforming package on healthcare.

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late diagnosis = early death
Posted by: muktuk on Dec 1, 2008 5:51 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
My younger brother died because he lacked access to health care.

When he was employed by IBM, he had a great retirement plan and a great health care package. But after 18 years he was terminated by IBM (age discrimination), and lost both his retirement and health care.

When he began to lose weight and had GI symptoms, he couldn't afford to seek medical attention until he was finally diagnosed (free clinic) with stage 4 renal cell carcinoma.

late diagnosis = early death.

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» Thank you, salt-of-the-earth Posted by: pelican beak
» PaulK -- You are not alone! Posted by: salt-of-the-earth
katrina howard RN
Posted by: katjac2 on Dec 1, 2008 5:52 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"The insurance industry has to make a profit -- that's what they do!"
Therein lies the problem in healthcare. Eliminate the health insurance companies! They provide no value to healthcare. They can be retrained to fill the jobs of the healthcare worker shortages.

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» RE: katrina howard RN Posted by: gar1948
It keeps the workers under control
Posted by: zooeyhall on Dec 1, 2008 7:26 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I think another reason for opposition to real health care in this country is that it is a method to keep your employees under control.

Just suppose we had universal free health care in the U.S. Then that removes a BIG incentive for workers to suffer a lousy employer, who may treat them like shit and poor pay--but still provides health insurance.

Keeping health care tied to employment (for those that still have this employment benefit) is a good way to keep the livestock in line.

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Put up or Shutup!
Posted by: gar1948 on Dec 1, 2008 7:56 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Okay folks, all in favor of Universal Healthcare in the US jump over to the link provided in the article and signup to support the movement and find out what YOU can do. Else, well, I guess you can just go on talking ...

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» RE: Put up or Shutup! Posted by: Ashoka911
Congressmen who refuse Impeachment will not get you Single Payer Healthcare
Posted by: JohnHKennedy Denver CO on Dec 1, 2008 8:17 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Congressmen who refuse Impeachment will not get you Single Payer Healthcare

FIGHT for IMPEACHMENT HEARINGS NOW

Gutless House Democrats who refuse to support and protect our US Constitution will never rise up against the Corporate Health Care industry, Not going to happen.

Starting Fighting Now to make
The US House Democrats Hold Impeachment Hearings Starting Next Week.

If you refuse to help make them do it

YOU ARE THE PROBLEM

Blame Yourself
for Bush & Cheney escaping Justice.

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but get off your a$$ first
Posted by: we_need_Abe on Dec 1, 2008 8:56 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am all for health care reform including universal health care because I think it will actually be less costly in the long term, but I cannot approve ANY plan that does not have some sort of personal responsibility features built in. If people don't take care of themselves first they get no support from me.

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» RE: but get off your a$$ first Posted by: bornxeyed
Funny thing about health insurance
Posted by: bornxeyed on Dec 1, 2008 12:11 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It occurred to me a few years ago that in a truly free market doctors probably couldn't charge outright per visit more than what co-pays are now because no one could pay $150 - $200 for an office visit out-of-pocket.

So the insurance companies basically exist to overpay doctors and skim some of that overpay themselves out of premiums while the patient pays - out-of-pocket copays - exactly the same as if there was no health insurance industry to begin with.

In short, the medical industry is still using leeches to bleed patients but the leeches are now HMOs.

How is it that everything in America is a racket?

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It is common knowledege that 70% of healtcare costs could be immediately reduced
Posted by: eeezzz on Dec 1, 2008 9:07 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If Americans took responsibility for their own health and practiced some level of self-control. 70% of Americans are now overweight or obese. 80% "seldom or never" exersize. 30% still smoke heavily. (Look it up concern trolls, it's all over the net and well documented in medical journals eveywhere) It is well know that most modern diseases are caused by this self-imposed pity-party mess.
What makes me "sick" is that the people who become ill through no fault of their own are dying because the greedy 70% gluttons are crowding the truly unfortunate out of the picture.
So like Americans, on every level of society - treating and gourging themselves endlessly and without a second thought, and then expecting a "big daddy" government or employer (or someone, anyone!) to BAIL THEM OUT when the cancer takes over.
Now, tell me why reminding Americans that a little personal responsibility would change themselves and the whole world for the better- is just a really, really mean and evil thing to say! Tell me how the real truth regarding the big picture just makes you "sick."

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» Over $1 trillion a week ??? Posted by: maxpayne
» RE: Over $1 trillion a week ??? Posted by: salt-of-the-earth
» RE: Over $1 trillion a week ??? Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Over $1 trillion a week ??? Posted by: salt-of-the-earth
» RE: Over $1 trillion a week ??? Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Over $1 trillion a week ??? Posted by: salt-of-the-earth
» RE: personal responsibility Posted by: katfish
Universal (tax)payer, single (government) provider healthcare will work out as well...
Posted by: ABetterFuture on Dec 1, 2008 9:11 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
...as the post office, the DMV, your court circuits, etc.

Good luck. As long as there is an option to acquire additional coverage and bypass the bureaucracy, I'll be happy.

Cut my costs. Thanks.

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Mark Dowie
Posted by: Dweeb on Dec 1, 2008 9:46 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The first item on the agenda of any discussion of healthcare should be health. A sensible national investment in public health and prevention will lower the cost of healthcare whether private, state, federal or single payer

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» But, but... Posted by: bornxeyed
» Can you spell R-A-C-K-E-T? Posted by: salt-of-the-earth
» RE: Can you spell R-A-C-K-E-T? Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: What makes you think so? Posted by: TheLimit
» RE: What makes you think so?- SOCKPUPPET Posted by: salt-of-the-earth
Physicians For A National Health Care Program
Posted by: fanny666 on Dec 1, 2008 9:58 AM   
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Watercolors
Posted by: Watercolors on Dec 1, 2008 11:03 AM   
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No need to reinvent the wheel. Take a look at France for a model universal health care system.

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Corporate ethics (or lack thereof)
Posted by: willymack on Dec 1, 2008 11:33 AM   
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It's been said that corporations are amoral. I think that's putting it lightly, and that they're EVIL. The insurance and drug companies are prime examples. We invent things here, and at one time led the world in new ideas aimed at improving the human condition. We almost certainly would've had the world's best universal, single-payer health health care system if it weren't for the savage resistance of the drug and insurance companies, and the crooks in government allowing them to place barriers to its implementation at every step of the way. It's way past time to pull the rug out from underneath the crooks and do what most of us KNOW can be done.

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» RE: And also ... Posted by: TheLimit
» RE: Corporate ethics=Fraud Posted by: pangolin
Tom
Posted by: robigreg on Dec 1, 2008 12:26 PM   
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With its broad grassroots base, HCAN will have something outfits like the drug industry, AMA, Congressmen beholden to them, and their ilk, not only do not but cannot have. The up from the bottom approach with healthcare will be a good test to see if the kind of grassroots stirring that elected Obama will continue with a president who has indicated he will take it seriously.

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National healthcare,Medicare,Socialized Medicine..
Posted by: donl51 on Dec 1, 2008 4:21 PM   
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call it what you will,is all based on the tax -structure much like social security,only not matched by employers,,,and this does not sit well w/Americans because we've been brainwashed that this is wrong,does not work..is bad etc....no system on the planet works 100%...but ours doesn't work at all....I'll take Socialized medicine and pay a higher tax any day...for the satisfaction that knowing I'm medically covered from birth to death and so are all others....

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Other things to ask for
Posted by: PaulK on Dec 1, 2008 4:58 PM   
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"Universal" Health Care should not be financed on the backs of the older working poor, as so many politicians have proposed.

Currently, medical residents are limited to 85 hours a week in New York State. Work weeks of over 100 hours are happening elsewhere. RNs are literally running around hospitals to get all their assigned work done. Unions have to fight for 60 hour work weeks in some hospitals. Naturally, patients die like crazy. Can we ask for real health care, not a circus?

If you know someone in the hospital, you get good service. Otherwise, you never know which doctors are the known butchers. That's the way health care works in America, dude. Could we have some accountability, not a massive coverup conspiracy whenever a doc or a nurse makes a mistake?

I once met a dentist at a workshop who said he could have his license yanked for saying that mercury fillings were dangerous. Then after hesitating, he said it anyway. In other medical denial news, a Congress-mandated panel finally admitted that Gulf War syndrome was real, after 17 years of coverups. We don't have fundamental honesty in medicine.

Social Security is not a slush fund to suck dry with medical drains on everyone's money. Right now the rich as well as the poor have a poll tax taken out of their social security, to help finance Medicare A, B, whatever. P.S. what idiot invented the Medicare donut hole in coverage?

Let's get the term "Health Care" clear. Health care is when you go out dancing so that you'll have aerobic exercise, better balance, and maybe find somebody cute to take care of you. That's health care. Sickness care is when they wash your sores in your hospital bed. I'm all in favor of massive health care expenditures except for some Ukrainian dancing -- too rough on the knees.

Vitamin C and zinc work when I get a cold. We have two different health care systems in America and one of them is in your natural foods store.

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I know i have no right to complain
Posted by: lil ole me on Dec 1, 2008 5:10 PM   
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I have employer provided insurance. which is 90/100. providing they are in network.otherwise its 70/100 I have no complaints about my Union negotiated coverage health insurance. but im smart enough to know that IF i werent in a union with a successful company these options would not be available to me if my company were to shut down operations. I have seen first hand the results of poor or no insurance on those less fortunate than I.

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Waldmeister
Posted by: Nasookin on Dec 1, 2008 10:06 PM   
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Canada's health care is no much better than that of the United States. Like the US, its health care system is the fastest growing failing business on the continent. Canadians are locked into a pharmaceutical/chemical paradigm that ignores the fact that the soil is every thing.

In British Columbia; the current provincial government is owned by big pharma [BP]. The purchase is achieved through BP's huge tax deductible grants to the University of British Columbia (UBC). Our premier loves the financing his political party gets from BP. So does our [now wobbly, teetering ] minority Conservative federal government. Incidentally our prime minister is [was?] a kiss ass admirer of Bush & Co. He, too, likes to deregulate every thing. He just hasn't been able to get a majority in parliament to do the damage to Canada that Bush & Co did to the U.S.

A Therapeutics Initiative set up between UBC and the University of Victoria to educate medical students & MD's to use older, cheaper but just as effective generic brands rather than the more costly brand names. This saves the provincial government $500 billion a year. On a per capita basis, if British Columbians spent as much on drugs as the provinces of Quebec and New Brunswick combined, the provincial drug bill would be 50 percent higher than the current one billion dollars per year.

It was this Therapeutics Initiative that warned BC MD's that the anti-inflammatory Cox 2 inhibitors, Vioxx and Celebrex, would be problematic. It wasn't long after this warning that Vioxx had to be recalled since it was implicated in the heart attack deaths of at least 50,000 US citizens.

What doctors don't know and are not told, a cox 2 anti-inflammatory accelerate the depletion of 3 B vitamins [folic acid, B-6 & B-12]leading to homocystine-uria - a toxic condition that leads to heart disease and heart attack.

If you want affordable health care - change the current the sickness treatment paradigm that relies on patented extortionately expensive synthetic chemicals that deplete the body of essential nutrients and keep the patient sick with a new set of symptoms that call for more drugs and more side effects - get back to the basics of dietary and nutritional support as the fundamentals of good health and healing.

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Other progressive forces support Single Payer HR 676
Posted by: Xihuitl on Dec 2, 2008 1:44 AM   
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What a shame that all these so-called "progressive" forces are wasting so much energy and money to fight the one logical, truly workable and just health care solution. Other progressives are working in favor of this better solution: Single Payer, which is the most cost effective and the greatest stimulus to our failing economy. See Progressive Demcorats of America at http://www.pdamerica.org/, Physicians for National Health Care at http://www.pnhp.org/, and the California Nurses Association at http://www.guaranteedhealthcare.org/. There has never been a better or more urgent time to get Single Payer passed. More and more businesses are struggling and they should be behind Single Payer -- it lifts the heavy costs of health care off the backs of employers. Single Payer costs less! And guarantees that everyone -- not just the fewer and fewer people with jobs -- will have health care.

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hms2004 Here's a Link for You on Chemotherapy being a racketT
Posted by: salt-of-the-earth on Dec 2, 2008 2:35 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This is from Mercola a few weeks ago.

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/
articles/archive/2008/11/20/winning-the-war-on-cancer.
aspx

or just click here:
click here for scientific article on ineffectiveness of chemo

Watch this classic online to explain why allopathic medicine doesn't help people:

click here to watch TOWN OF ALLOPATH

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Real Healthcare
Posted by: Btelfare on Dec 2, 2008 9:16 AM   
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A bandaid will continue to be put in place for healthcare until we face up. The American people need to take responsibility. The obesity problem is not the lack of health care. Knowledge about good health is a right. We avoid learning and praticing good healthcare.

The drug industry loves their quarterly balance sheet because of this lack of knowledge. Healthcare will change when Americans start using a preventive lifestyle. The conversation of healthcare crisis will continue until prevention is the cornerstone of healthcare.

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Retiree
Posted by: bandz on Dec 2, 2008 4:05 PM   
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We can no longer settle for compromises and half-measures when it comes to healthcare. There is ONE solution and ONLY ONE: We MUST have a universal, comprehensive, national, single-payer, not-for-profit healthcare system modeled on those in France, Canada, Japan and every other industrial nation on earth.

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» RE: etiree Posted by: talkville
Health Care
Posted by: hopeforchange on Dec 2, 2008 8:05 PM   
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The author did not explain how he thinks the progressive people/organizations will have to mobilize. We need someone leading this so our voices will be heard. The status quo is organized against a meaningful health care plan (ie. single payer). We need to be too and it is going to take a lot of pressure from progressives. How do we make sure our voices are heard by Obama and Congress and the administration?

Who leads the progressive viewpoint on Health Care to make sure it gets heard loud and clear?

Who is going to step up on this?


Without a strong organization pressuring them we will end up with the mess we have now.

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Who's Kidding Who????
Posted by: marizara on Dec 3, 2008 6:28 PM   
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I am a medical system user, and from what I see, the only purpose for medical infrastructure is to keep patients busy in anterooms, so the good doctor can slip out the back door, to go on a cruise. -- Really, everything is just a buffer to help them avoid doing their jobs, which they are not doing very well anyway. -- What passes for medical "care" these days is just a joke. -- The diagnostic skills of the average doctor barely exist at all, and are misapplied when they do. -- We really NEED a new medical paradigm!! -- Perhaps we should not have thrown out the Medicine Man with the bathwater. -- We made that choice too soon. -- Now we're stuck dealing with all the fallout from it, too. -- Dang!!

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Hoping for creatives out there!
Posted by: talkville on Dec 5, 2008 12:42 AM   
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I don't recall any actual law being passed that makes it a requirement that a for-profit insurance broker be inter-posed between a consumer and his or her health care needs. Such an assumption seems to be simply taken for granted and pre-supposed in most if not all questions dealing with issues related to our society's health care needs.

It is sobering to contemplate that a person such as Bill Gates, or an Al Gore or any number of the hedgefund managers bailing out of Wall Street fast (?) could, when push came to shove, obtain any health-related service from any location without the need for any insurance at all; "cash on the barrel" as they say. What I mean to say is that it is possible to conceive of obtaining at least some health-related services without pre-supposing the necessity of that greedy old insurance broker between oneself and a medical provider.

Are capitalist answers the only answers conceivable? Why is property (profit) always and in all circumstances the higher value over human value? One would think this is a law of physics perhaps? Or might it be a clever social construction? Who knows?

In health care, hope there are some young and vigorous thinkers out there that will first go deep and then go wide! Many times it is what is pre-supposed that matters more in problem solving.

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Miss Scarlett
Posted by: Miss Scarlett on Dec 9, 2008 6:52 AM   
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Here's a heretical thought- can it be said that American doctors make way too much money? I don't think doctors in other developed nations are able to accumulate the wealth that they do in this country. I don't have a problem with them making 2- or even 3- hundred grand a year, but a good many of them are making millions. Am I the only one that thinks that's wrong?

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