COMMENTS: 34
Should Parents Be Forced to Vaccinate Their Children?
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In her article, "How Safe Are Vaccines?" Alice Park attempts to address growing concerns about vaccines and asks the million-dollar question that parents around the country really want to know. Unfortunately, Park's version of the "truth" does a disservice to readers when it falls into the same trap that has plagued similar reports: gross inaccuracies, reliance on industry-funded spokesmen whose conflicts are not disclosed, and the all too familiar and constant beat of immunization dogma suggesting doomsday disease scenarios.
Those of you who have read my postings before know that I am very skeptical of both the public health officials' and the mainstream media's ability to objectively and forthrightly cover this issue. The Time article does nothing to change that opinion. If anything, it confirms it.
At the heart of Park's report, however, is the question about parental rights. Should parents be forced to vaccinate their children given the growing concerns about vaccine safety?
For over a year now, there has been a steady stream of articles about school districts and health departments' heavy-handed actions towards parents who choose not to vaccine their children. Intimidation tactics that included monetary fines, expulsion from school, even threats to call in child protection agencies were used to try and coerce parents into compliance with the current immunization recommendations.
In March, the New York Times ran two separate articles on the subject of parents deciding not to vaccinate their children ("More Families Are Shunning Inoculations" [March 2], "Public Health Risk Seen as Parents Reject Vaccines" [March 21]). Other news organizations around the country ran similar stories.
Throughout the article, Park implies parents are too "confused" to do their own homework on this subject or lack the good sense to make an informed decision. In reality, parents are deciding to opt out of vaccinations because they are concerned that vaccines may put their children at risk for adverse reactions that they feel are more threatening than the diseases the vaccines are purported to prevent. Chief among these concerns is the possible association between vaccines and autism.
As the Time article details, concerns about thimerosal-containing vaccines is one of several concerns that continues to weigh on the conscience of many parents. In one sentence Ms. Park states, "Thimerosal can do serious damage to brain tissue, especially in children, whose brains are still developing" and then dismissively trivializes parental concerns about a possible link between the developmental neurotoxin and autism by saying "that link could be merely temporal, of course; babies also get their first teeth after they get their first vaccines, but that doesn't mean one causes the other." The absurdly of this analogy ranks with one of the most nonsensical comments I think I have ever read. This "temporal" association has been reported by literally thousands of parents across the country who have documented evidence of their normally developing child regressing into a world of silence and isolation. To consider these vaccines containing neurotoxins like mercury and aluminum, along with other toxins, would seem to be reasonable, absent any other logical explanation.
The article also inaccurately reports that thimerosal-containing vaccines were "replaced" with thimerosal-free formulas in 2001. Thimerosal-containing vaccines were not recalled as the article suggests and remained on clinic shelves well into 2003, according to government communications. In addition, the majority of flu shots, given to pregnant women and babies as young as six months, still contain 25 micrograms of thimerosal.
According to the article, "In the first four months of this year, 64 confirmed cases of measles were reported in the U.S., scattered across 11 hot spots ... the most by this date for any year since 2001; 54 cases had links to other countries, an only one of the 64 patients had been vaccinated." Interestingly, the map denoting the location where the outbreaks occurred show that in four of the 11 "hot spots" only 1 case of measles was reported and only three states had more than 10 cases.
So let's put the reports about the recent measles outbreak into some sensible perspective.
Out of the approximately 40 million children born in the last ten years, hundreds of thousands of which are not vaccinated, there have only been 64 cases of measles reported nationwide, all of whom recovered although 14 did require hospitalization.
Now let's compare this statistic with the one that really has parents frightened, the 1 in 150 children who have been diagnosed with autism for which the health agencies have no logical explanation.
Like other articles on this subject, Time attempts to reassure parents about the safety of vaccines based on very selective information from conflicted sources and fails to cite recent published research and independent voices that support parental concerns. Nowhere did we read about the study that suggests delaying vaccinations for just two months might reduce the risk of developing asthma by half.
The article cites a 2003 Institute of Medicine (IOM) report as showing "no scientific evidence to support the link" between vaccines and autism. Actually it was 2004, and the same report also said the committee could not rule out an association in a small susceptible sub-group of children. In addition, it has been four years since that report was released and there have been dozens of published, peer-reviewed studies to suggest there could be an association. Those studies did not make into the Time article.
Having spoken to literally thousands of moms, I know many parents are terrified of the dozens of vaccines given to babies today. They want to do what is right for their children and want to protect them from diseases. Ms. Park notes that 77% of children are fully vaccinated and therefore supposedly protected from the childhood diseases, the author fails to acknowledge that these same children are among the sickest children in the world in spite of being the most vaccinated. They may not get the chicken pox, measles or mumps but they are beleaguered with serious developmental and autoimmune disorders that last a lifetime.
This is where Time fails to really explore the reasons and the truth about why parents are opting out of vaccinations and examine the mindset behind a modern day medical dictatorship that will go to any lengths, including school expulsion and threats of taking children away from parents in order to carry out their mission.
Suggesting that the reason parents don't vaccinate is because "the illnesses kids are being inoculated against are rarely seen anymore," Ms. Park opines, "Once you've seen your neighbor's toddler become paralyzed, you're a lot more likely to worry that the same thing will happen to yours." There may be some truth to this but many parents would look at this suggestion another way. Once you see your healthy, normal toddler, or your neighbor's healthy toddler develop autism following a series of vaccinations, you are a lot more likely to worry that the same thing could happen to your child.
Parents are not "confused," Ms. Park ... they are concerned and have every reason to be concerned.
It isn't parents that created this crisis in confidence; it is the government and medical establishment for dismissing parental concerns and failing to make vaccine safety a priority. It is Congress' fault for failing to do proper oversight.
Parents who chose to vaccinate their children should have nothing to fear from the relatively few who are not vaccinated. But ultimately, the choice of whether or not to vaccine a child must be made by the parent who will live with the life-long consequences.
The government bears the burden of proving vaccines are safe. Not parents. And the government has not proven the number of vaccines given to children today are safe, or that injecting our babies with mercury, aluminum and formaldehyde is safe.
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Posted by: warreno on Jun 3, 2008 2:30 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The claim that "the government" or "industry" (I wasn't aware that MMR was a vast moneymaking enterprise, personally) has to prove vaccines are safe is inverted. Those who have concerns about vaccination must prove a link between vaccination and autism.
This must be accomplished by rigorous study, not finger-pointing, and not conclusion jumping.
And yes, we as a larger society can compel parents to immunize, if the alternative is for us (as a society) to have to support individuals who have been permanently disabled by diseases that shouldn't have been contracted, and could have been blocked by immunization.
There is a difference between skepticism and simply doubting for the sake of it.
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» RE: Wow, several issues here.
Posted by: Ruby
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Posted by: Robba29 on Jun 3, 2008 3:08 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Now let's compare this statistic with the one that really has parents frightened, the 1 in 150 children who have been diagnosed with autism for which the health agencies have no logical explanation."
Look at the numbers! Here in Eastern Washington we've had 4 cases in the Spokane area, with it spreading to other counties in Northern Idaho and Washington. Autism, on the other hand, has become the new "don't know what it is so call it autism" diagnosis. Don't forget that data on autism includes those diagnosed with "autism spectrum disorder" a catch all for behaviorally/socially odd behavior that may or may not acutally be "autism." Not only that, but your article doesn't address the fact that autism seems to have "hot spots" such as silicon valley in CA and other places where high IQ folks tend to congregate. There was a great article on this in the Sacramento Bee a number of years ago. Maybe there is more of a genetic component? That seems a more likely scenario than "blame the vaccines." I've worked with autistic kids for years, and I have worked with the parents who make the claims that it must be the vaccines. They're the same who believe it could be flouride in the water or gluten in their bread. They like to co0me up with every excuse rather than actually help their children. Then there are those who focus on their children and their kids thrive with this sometimes debilitating disease. I have seen the full spectrum of autism from "spectrum disorder" to Asperger's to the student who can't talk, flaps his arms and grunts (but was getting a B in AP biology with the help of a computer). I have also seen how kids who were once labeled Down's Syndrome, ADHD, or PDD (Pervasive Developmental Delay) all of the sudden be labeled "autistic spectrum." The numebrs are being inflated. The "epidemic" of autism is as much a fabrication as your account of the measles.
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» RE: Get YOUR facts straigh
Posted by: rickiey
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Posted by: badkitty on Jun 3, 2008 3:19 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: Those of us who are old enough
Posted by: doctorvee
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Posted by: g on Jun 3, 2008 5:34 PM
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Posted by: willow920 on Jun 3, 2008 10:56 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am a huge proponent of freedom of choice, but this is one of those cases where someone else's choice can have dire consequences for my own family. Unless a child has a compelling medical reason for not being vaccinated, they all should be. And mommy is scared of autism isn't a compelling medical reason.
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» RE: ven if most children are vaccinated...
Posted by: doctorvee
» RE: ven if most children are vaccinated...
Posted by: Ruby
» RE: ven if most children are vaccinated...
Posted by: Ruby
» RE: ven if most children are vaccinated...
Posted by: willow920
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Posted by: tpurplesage on Jun 4, 2008 10:51 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
My partner works with autistic children and will tell you that vaccines have nothing to do with it. But I have an friend whose healthy child became listless, ill, detached, and was diagnosed with a chemical brain disorder (similar to Autism) within days of her first vaccines. She is an educated woman who did a great deal of research and chose not to vaccinate her second child.
I support each parents decision to vaccinate or not, depending upon their comfort level. It used to be that only religious minorities refused vaccinations, and we were warned that they were crazy, and putting all of our children at risk. It was wrong to blame the parents then for the "epidemic" that never arose, and it's wrong to blame parents now for an "epidemic" that most likely won't come again.
No concrete danger can be proven about vaccines, and no concrete danger can be proven about parents who don't vaccinate.
Our country is a study in variation. If one person does or says one thing, a dozen others will have beliefs that diverge wildly. Let people disagree, encourage open discussion and debate on these topics. Any kind of "all people who think this are crazy and should be stopped for the good of us all" talk should be identified for what it is - tyranny.
Argue on Alternetters!
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Posted by: Phred42 on Jun 5, 2008 6:31 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: Government mandated Brain Damage?!
Posted by: Ruby
» RE: Government mandated Brain Damage?!
Posted by: Ruby
» RE: Government mandated Brain Damage?!
Posted by: Ruby
» RE: Government mandated Brain Damage?!
Posted by: Ruby
» RE: Government mandated Brain Damage?!
Posted by: Ruby
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Posted by: Shakti on Jun 6, 2008 6:22 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Here is information about a recent legal case:
1. U.S. Government Concedes Vaccines Cause Autism
The U.S. Department of Health and Human Services, the federal agency that oversees the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) and the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), recently conceded the first vaccine-autism case.
This case was filed in the no-fault National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program as part of the Autism Omnibus proceedings in the U.S. Federal Court of Claims.
It was one of the first three cases chosen that alleged Thimerosal in childhood vaccines significantly contributed to a child developing autism.
Clifford Shoemaker, of Shoemaker and Associates of Vienna, Virginia, is the attorney of record in the Hanna Poling v. Secretary of HHS (case: 02-1466V).
Experts filing on behalf of the petitioner, Hanna Poling, included pediatric neurologist, Dr. Andrew Zimmerman of Johns Hopkins University, and Maryland geneticist and epidemiologist, Dr. Mark Geier of the Genetic Centers of America.
This concession shows the dishonesty of the continual media spin coming from public health officials and others who maintain there is no evidence that Thimerosal, or any other part of any vaccine, has ever caused autism or, for that matter, has harmed anyone in any way.
The facts are that the Vaccine Compensation Act has already compensated over 2,000 individuals who proved that they were harmed by vaccines, resulting in settlements of nearly two billion dollars.
Additionally, hundreds of peer-reviewed scientific/medical articles from some the world’s best universities have long implicated Thimerosal in vaccines as a causal factor in neurodevelopmental disorders including autism.
********
So, the fear that parents have is very real and well-founded.
As for some of the other comments:
1. Yes, vaccines ARE big business. Vaccine manufacturers make a lot of money off them.
2. Some of the childhood illnesses are not dangerous at all, chicken pox for example. Even whooping cough is not that dangerous for older children (my daughter had whooping cough when she was 3). Others, of course, can be quite deadly.
3. There is some evidence to suggest that certain diseases were beginning to fade out even before the introduction of routine vaccinations, due to better hygiene, nutrition etc.
4. Other countries, such as Japan, do not begin vaccinating their children until 2 years of age, when the immune system is more developed (the immune system is not fully developed at birth). Pumping weakened viruses and bacteria (not to mention all the other ingredients) into infants undoubtedly has unintended consequences.
Did you know that the early polio vaccines were made in monkey kidneys and that many of us now have Simian Virus 40 in our bodies? Look it up. Google "simian virus 40" and "polio vaccine."
Vaccines are a valuable tool but they should be used judiciously. Parents have a right to know the truth.
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» RE: many of these comments are bizarrely hostile
Posted by: summerhill
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Posted by: mjabele on Jun 8, 2008 7:34 PM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
On the other hand, if their children fall ill with a "vaccinatable" illness, they should be held fully liable for ALL the costs associated with that illness, i.e., medication, hospitalization, and - most importantly - the costs associated with care of a permanently disabled child. Ideally, no public moneys should be redirected for such care, and parents who decline vaccination for their children should be made well aware of this in advance when signing refusal waivers.
Alternatively, given that it may not be possible for some parents to take on such costs in the event of a "bad outcome" from failure to vaccinate a child, another way of appropriately distributing financial risk would be 1) to permit private insurance companies to charge extra premiums to parents who decline vaccination, to cover the costs of caring for a sick and/or disabled child, or 2) assuming we devolve (as I hope) to a single-payer system, to charge an extra tax for the same purpose.
I suppose if actuarial risk for autism could actually be demonstrated for vaccines that are currently given, then we could charge parents who choose to vaccinate similarly. But it seems pretty clear to me that this risk has NOT been clearly demonstrated - if it had been, the insurance companies would long since have noticed. Profit, after all, is the name of the game for them, and their noses are so highly tuned to the scent of money that I'm sure they would have sensed the risk-benefit ratio long before any of us ordinary mortals had.
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» RE: Compromise?
Posted by: WNYX
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Posted by: dkm on Jun 9, 2008 4:14 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
" I am very skeptical of both the public health officials' and the mainstream media's ability to objectively and forthrightly cover this issue."
What the author actually means is that she is not about to listen to factual refutation of her emotionally adopted position. To point out that she is completely and utterly unable to either objectively or forthrightly cover this issue is merely stating the obvious. This is the same mindset that gives us the rightwing rejection of evolution because it conflicts with their emotional attachment to a twisted religion.
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Posted by: dkm on Jun 9, 2008 4:39 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What I have seen is that large, as in hundreds of thousands of kids, studies done in various Scandinavian countries where everyone's medical records are available for researchers to check, have shown that there is no difference in the rate of autism in vaccinated and unvaccinated kids. What I have seen is a California study showing that the number of kids being vaccinated with thimersol containing vaccine has dropped precipitously, but the number of autistic children has increased. What I have seen is studies showing that there are several genetic variations that are associated with autism and with at least some of them, vaccination does not make a bit of difference.
The fact that the author can't deal with the facts on the ground is indicated by the fact that she refuses to mention these studies, but instead uses quotes from "experts" who have no professional recognition for their work but who do make a nice living testifying on everything from breast implants to alien abduction.
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Posted by: Paxmana1 on Jun 9, 2008 6:01 PM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
DEATH BY MEDICINE
October 2003
Gary Null PhD, Carolyn Dean MD ND,
Martin Feldman MD, Debora Rasio MD,
Dorothy Smith PhD.
If you Google Death by Medicine that will pull up the study for you.
Their dedicated work in this area is valuable evidence that all is not as it appears. And the figures revealed are sure to be just the tip of that proverbial iceberg.
This pernicious practice of vaccination whereby filth is pumped into a babies body and destroying the childs immune system based on Pasteur's Germ Theory .. A theory which has long since been discredited. The mothers milk and the initial colostrum is the best way to rear a healthy child.
The statistics that they publish as their proof of efficacy are nothing more than massaged frauds that may be added to the rest of the fraudulent clinical trials which are being uncovered almost daily and certainly by the week.
The methods of analyzing the data obtained are woefully inadequate, the confidence that is placed in mathematical formula that at the best can only handle a mere handful of variables against the complexity of each individual human frame is sadly misplaced .. once again we are being ruled by numbers that have not the slightest relevance, except as tools for the propaganda with which they dazzle blinded eyes.
The calls for justice by the parents of vaccine damaged children are ignored as they routinely follow the prevailing dogma and invariably produce the ultimate whitewash by the use of the sacred mantra .. 'There is no scientific evidence' .. Do these people really believe that they sit on the right hand of God?
The evidence is in the afflicted .. the unheard millions who they ignore as though they did not exist, and daily they consign hundreds of thousands of children to a life of ill health by the use of this sacrificial ritual .. I have never understood how one unvaccinated child could jeopardize the lives of hundreds of vaccinated children .. because if this particular piece of junk dissonance is correct then the whole explanation for this nasty practice is collapsed and exposed for what it is.
"As far as the laws of mathematics refer to reality, they are not certain, and as far as they are certain,they do not refer to reality".
Albert Einstein
It has surely not escaped the attention of these brilliant minds that their Materia Medica is totally flawed, extremely dangerous and compromised with lies and whitewash .. the medical journals are the coffee shops and smart eating places of academic snobbery, which is usually of the 'We know best genre' as the moral morons discuss in arcane language the merits of this or that killer pill and whether the risks outweigh the benefits .. how dare they decide for those whose risk or benefit it is.
They know what they are doing, that is why they have come up with the concept of
'Informed Consent' .. this throws the onus of medical harm onto the long suffering parents and patients and thus escape the consequences of their wrong doing.
It should not be necessary for me to point out that these Doctors spent many years learning the chemical and medical language and yet expect a parent or patient to be an instant expert, as in 'informed consent' .. What despicable people they are .. there is no hypocrite like the Hippocratic hypocrite.
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Posted by: EKSwitaj on Jun 9, 2008 8:30 PM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: janeshep on Jun 9, 2008 9:11 PM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
All the people touting how wonderful vaccines are have obviously not dug in very deep to all the issues and questions surrounding them. People who say that vaccines are safe and they should be mandated are harming many babies and children since it puts fear into parents and keeps them from truly being able to protect their children through further research and informed decision-making.
There are parents who take enormous time and energy to fully research vaccines, then put themselves in the line of fire for refusing to
poison their babies. These parents know they are decreasing the likelihood of their children contracting diseases, not because they are taking advantage of others that are vaccinated, but because they take the time and energy to do everything it takes to strengthen their children's immunity and keep them healthy. These are the truly self-less parents who will protect their kids even when they are being judged and viewed as neglectful parents. They will do whatever they deeply feel is in the best interest of their children, regardless of how anyone judges them and how difficult it may be for them in this society.
Then there are parents who just simply go along with what their doctor and the media says they should do because they fear rocking the boat or being shamed or ostracized for not vaccinating. They take no time at all to check into it; they do none of their own research. Some may vaccinate because they really believe vaccines will protect their children and they don't have a clue how toxic vaccines really are. But I think there are many now who have either witnessed vaccine reactions in kids they know or have read the ingredients and info about toxicity and adverse reactions (how could they not?) and vaccinate anyway, even if it goes against their gut feelings and best judgement, because they are afraid of how others will judge them and that their doctors won't accept them. This is self-preservation at the expense of their children. After all, no one is going to judge them if their child has a serious reaction since they did what they were supposed to do. These are really the selfish parents who put their kids on the line.
I know this is harsh, but perpetuating this sick message that parents who don't vaccinate are selfish is incredibly wrong and has to stop. And what gives anyone the right to say that I should risk my child to a medical procedure that is known to carry the risk of neurological damage and even death?
Other people's children will continue to be harmed until enough parents stand up and
say "we don't want your toxic vaccines".
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» Your comments are shamelessly arrogant and will get you nowhere with those of us...
Posted by: mjabele
» RE: Your comments are shamelessly arrogant and will get you nowhere with those of us...
Posted by: Paxmana1
» It's hard for me to know what you're talking about, given that much of your post...
Posted by: mjabele
» RE: It's hard for me to know what you're talking about, given that much of your post...
Posted by: Paxmana1
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Posted by: Paxmana1 on Jun 11, 2008 2:23 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
How does injecting monkey tissue from livers and kidneys laced with mercury protect these babies?
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Posted by: warreno on Jun 3, 2008 2:30 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The claim that "the government" or "industry" (I wasn't aware that MMR was a vast moneymaking enterprise, personally) has to prove vaccines are safe is inverted. Those who have concerns about vaccination must prove a link between vaccination and autism.
This must be accomplished by rigorous study, not finger-pointing, and not conclusion jumping.
And yes, we as a larger society can compel parents to immunize, if the alternative is for us (as a society) to have to support individuals who have been permanently disabled by diseases that shouldn't have been contracted, and could have been blocked by immunization.
There is a difference between skepticism and simply doubting for the sake of it.
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» RE: Wow, several issues here.
Posted by: Ruby
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Posted by: Robba29 on Jun 3, 2008 3:08 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Now let's compare this statistic with the one that really has parents frightened, the 1 in 150 children who have been diagnosed with autism for which the health agencies have no logical explanation."
Look at the numbers! Here in Eastern Washington we've had 4 cases in the Spokane area, with it spreading to other counties in Northern Idaho and Washington. Autism, on the other hand, has become the new "don't know what it is so call it autism" diagnosis. Don't forget that data on autism includes those diagnosed with "autism spectrum disorder" a catch all for behaviorally/socially odd behavior that may or may not acutally be "autism." Not only that, but your article doesn't address the fact that autism seems to have "hot spots" such as silicon valley in CA and other places where high IQ folks tend to congregate. There was a great article on this in the Sacramento Bee a number of years ago. Maybe there is more of a genetic component? That seems a more likely scenario than "blame the vaccines." I've worked with autistic kids for years, and I have worked with the parents who make the claims that it must be the vaccines. They're the same who believe it could be flouride in the water or gluten in their bread. They like to co0me up with every excuse rather than actually help their children. Then there are those who focus on their children and their kids thrive with this sometimes debilitating disease. I have seen the full spectrum of autism from "spectrum disorder" to Asperger's to the student who can't talk, flaps his arms and grunts (but was getting a B in AP biology with the help of a computer). I have also seen how kids who were once labeled Down's Syndrome, ADHD, or PDD (Pervasive Developmental Delay) all of the sudden be labeled "autistic spectrum." The numebrs are being inflated. The "epidemic" of autism is as much a fabrication as your account of the measles.
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» RE: Get YOUR facts straigh
Posted by: rickiey
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Posted by: badkitty on Jun 3, 2008 3:19 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: Those of us who are old enough
Posted by: doctorvee
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Posted by: g on Jun 3, 2008 5:34 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: willow920 on Jun 3, 2008 10:56 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am a huge proponent of freedom of choice, but this is one of those cases where someone else's choice can have dire consequences for my own family. Unless a child has a compelling medical reason for not being vaccinated, they all should be. And mommy is scared of autism isn't a compelling medical reason.
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» RE: ven if most children are vaccinated...
Posted by: doctorvee
» RE: ven if most children are vaccinated...
Posted by: Ruby
» RE: ven if most children are vaccinated...
Posted by: Ruby
» RE: ven if most children are vaccinated...
Posted by: willow920
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Posted by: tpurplesage on Jun 4, 2008 10:51 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
My partner works with autistic children and will tell you that vaccines have nothing to do with it. But I have an friend whose healthy child became listless, ill, detached, and was diagnosed with a chemical brain disorder (similar to Autism) within days of her first vaccines. She is an educated woman who did a great deal of research and chose not to vaccinate her second child.
I support each parents decision to vaccinate or not, depending upon their comfort level. It used to be that only religious minorities refused vaccinations, and we were warned that they were crazy, and putting all of our children at risk. It was wrong to blame the parents then for the "epidemic" that never arose, and it's wrong to blame parents now for an "epidemic" that most likely won't come again.
No concrete danger can be proven about vaccines, and no concrete danger can be proven about parents who don't vaccinate.
Our country is a study in variation. If one person does or says one thing, a dozen others will have beliefs that diverge wildly. Let people disagree, encourage open discussion and debate on these topics. Any kind of "all people who think this are crazy and should be stopped for the good of us all" talk should be identified for what it is - tyranny.
Argue on Alternetters!
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Posted by: Phred42 on Jun 5, 2008 6:31 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: Government mandated Brain Damage?!
Posted by: Ruby
» RE: Government mandated Brain Damage?!
Posted by: Ruby
» RE: Government mandated Brain Damage?!
Posted by: Ruby
» RE: Government mandated Brain Damage?!
Posted by: Ruby
» RE: Government mandated Brain Damage?!
Posted by: Ruby
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Posted by: Shakti on Jun 6, 2008 6:22 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Here is information about a recent legal case:
1. U.S. Government Concedes Vaccines Cause Autism
The U.S. Department of Health and Human Services, the federal agency that oversees the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) and the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), recently conceded the first vaccine-autism case.
This case was filed in the no-fault National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program as part of the Autism Omnibus proceedings in the U.S. Federal Court of Claims.
It was one of the first three cases chosen that alleged Thimerosal in childhood vaccines significantly contributed to a child developing autism.
Clifford Shoemaker, of Shoemaker and Associates of Vienna, Virginia, is the attorney of record in the Hanna Poling v. Secretary of HHS (case: 02-1466V).
Experts filing on behalf of the petitioner, Hanna Poling, included pediatric neurologist, Dr. Andrew Zimmerman of Johns Hopkins University, and Maryland geneticist and epidemiologist, Dr. Mark Geier of the Genetic Centers of America.
This concession shows the dishonesty of the continual media spin coming from public health officials and others who maintain there is no evidence that Thimerosal, or any other part of any vaccine, has ever caused autism or, for that matter, has harmed anyone in any way.
The facts are that the Vaccine Compensation Act has already compensated over 2,000 individuals who proved that they were harmed by vaccines, resulting in settlements of nearly two billion dollars.
Additionally, hundreds of peer-reviewed scientific/medical articles from some the world’s best universities have long implicated Thimerosal in vaccines as a causal factor in neurodevelopmental disorders including autism.
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So, the fear that parents have is very real and well-founded.
As for some of the other comments:
1. Yes, vaccines ARE big business. Vaccine manufacturers make a lot of money off them.
2. Some of the childhood illnesses are not dangerous at all, chicken pox for example. Even whooping cough is not that dangerous for older children (my daughter had whooping cough when she was 3). Others, of course, can be quite deadly.
3. There is some evidence to suggest that certain diseases were beginning to fade out even before the introduction of routine vaccinations, due to better hygiene, nutrition etc.
4. Other countries, such as Japan, do not begin vaccinating their children until 2 years of age, when the immune system is more developed (the immune system is not fully developed at birth). Pumping weakened viruses and bacteria (not to mention all the other ingredients) into infants undoubtedly has unintended consequences.
Did you know that the early polio vaccines were made in monkey kidneys and that many of us now have Simian Virus 40 in our bodies? Look it up. Google "simian virus 40" and "polio vaccine."
Vaccines are a valuable tool but they should be used judiciously. Parents have a right to know the truth.
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» RE: many of these comments are bizarrely hostile
Posted by: summerhill
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Posted by: mjabele on Jun 8, 2008 7:34 PM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
On the other hand, if their children fall ill with a "vaccinatable" illness, they should be held fully liable for ALL the costs associated with that illness, i.e., medication, hospitalization, and - most importantly - the costs associated with care of a permanently disabled child. Ideally, no public moneys should be redirected for such care, and parents who decline vaccination for their children should be made well aware of this in advance when signing refusal waivers.
Alternatively, given that it may not be possible for some parents to take on such costs in the event of a "bad outcome" from failure to vaccinate a child, another way of appropriately distributing financial risk would be 1) to permit private insurance companies to charge extra premiums to parents who decline vaccination, to cover the costs of caring for a sick and/or disabled child, or 2) assuming we devolve (as I hope) to a single-payer system, to charge an extra tax for the same purpose.
I suppose if actuarial risk for autism could actually be demonstrated for vaccines that are currently given, then we could charge parents who choose to vaccinate similarly. But it seems pretty clear to me that this risk has NOT been clearly demonstrated - if it had been, the insurance companies would long since have noticed. Profit, after all, is the name of the game for them, and their noses are so highly tuned to the scent of money that I'm sure they would have sensed the risk-benefit ratio long before any of us ordinary mortals had.
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» RE: Compromise?
Posted by: WNYX
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Posted by: dkm on Jun 9, 2008 4:14 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
" I am very skeptical of both the public health officials' and the mainstream media's ability to objectively and forthrightly cover this issue."
What the author actually means is that she is not about to listen to factual refutation of her emotionally adopted position. To point out that she is completely and utterly unable to either objectively or forthrightly cover this issue is merely stating the obvious. This is the same mindset that gives us the rightwing rejection of evolution because it conflicts with their emotional attachment to a twisted religion.
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Posted by: dkm on Jun 9, 2008 4:39 PM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What I have seen is that large, as in hundreds of thousands of kids, studies done in various Scandinavian countries where everyone's medical records are available for researchers to check, have shown that there is no difference in the rate of autism in vaccinated and unvaccinated kids. What I have seen is a California study showing that the number of kids being vaccinated with thimersol containing vaccine has dropped precipitously, but the number of autistic children has increased. What I have seen is studies showing that there are several genetic variations that are associated with autism and with at least some of them, vaccination does not make a bit of difference.
The fact that the author can't deal with the facts on the ground is indicated by the fact that she refuses to mention these studies, but instead uses quotes from "experts" who have no professional recognition for their work but who do make a nice living testifying on everything from breast implants to alien abduction.
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Posted by: Paxmana1 on Jun 9, 2008 6:01 PM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
DEATH BY MEDICINE
October 2003
Gary Null PhD, Carolyn Dean MD ND,
Martin Feldman MD, Debora Rasio MD,
Dorothy Smith PhD.
If you Google Death by Medicine that will pull up the study for you.
Their dedicated work in this area is valuable evidence that all is not as it appears. And the figures revealed are sure to be just the tip of that proverbial iceberg.
This pernicious practice of vaccination whereby filth is pumped into a babies body and destroying the childs immune system based on Pasteur's Germ Theory .. A theory which has long since been discredited. The mothers milk and the initial colostrum is the best way to rear a healthy child.
The statistics that they publish as their proof of efficacy are nothing more than massaged frauds that may be added to the rest of the fraudulent clinical trials which are being uncovered almost daily and certainly by the week.
The methods of analyzing the data obtained are woefully inadequate, the confidence that is placed in mathematical formula that at the best can only handle a mere handful of variables against the complexity of each individual human frame is sadly misplaced .. once again we are being ruled by numbers that have not the slightest relevance, except as tools for the propaganda with which they dazzle blinded eyes.
The calls for justice by the parents of vaccine damaged children are ignored as they routinely follow the prevailing dogma and invariably produce the ultimate whitewash by the use of the sacred mantra .. 'There is no scientific evidence' .. Do these people really believe that they sit on the right hand of God?
The evidence is in the afflicted .. the unheard millions who they ignore as though they did not exist, and daily they consign hundreds of thousands of children to a life of ill health by the use of this sacrificial ritual .. I have never understood how one unvaccinated child could jeopardize the lives of hundreds of vaccinated children .. because if this particular piece of junk dissonance is correct then the whole explanation for this nasty practice is collapsed and exposed for what it is.
"As far as the laws of mathematics refer to reality, they are not certain, and as far as they are certain,they do not refer to reality".
Albert Einstein
It has surely not escaped the attention of these brilliant minds that their Materia Medica is totally flawed, extremely dangerous and compromised with lies and whitewash .. the medical journals are the coffee shops and smart eating places of academic snobbery, which is usually of the 'We know best genre' as the moral morons discuss in arcane language the merits of this or that killer pill and whether the risks outweigh the benefits .. how dare they decide for those whose risk or benefit it is.
They know what they are doing, that is why they have come up with the concept of
'Informed Consent' .. this throws the onus of medical harm onto the long suffering parents and patients and thus escape the consequences of their wrong doing.
It should not be necessary for me to point out that these Doctors spent many years learning the chemical and medical language and yet expect a parent or patient to be an instant expert, as in 'informed consent' .. What despicable people they are .. there is no hypocrite like the Hippocratic hypocrite.
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Posted by: EKSwitaj on Jun 9, 2008 8:30 PM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: janeshep on Jun 9, 2008 9:11 PM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
All the people touting how wonderful vaccines are have obviously not dug in very deep to all the issues and questions surrounding them. People who say that vaccines are safe and they should be mandated are harming many babies and children since it puts fear into parents and keeps them from truly being able to protect their children through further research and informed decision-making.
There are parents who take enormous time and energy to fully research vaccines, then put themselves in the line of fire for refusing to
poison their babies. These parents know they are decreasing the likelihood of their children contracting diseases, not because they are taking advantage of others that are vaccinated, but because they take the time and energy to do everything it takes to strengthen their children's immunity and keep them healthy. These are the truly self-less parents who will protect their kids even when they are being judged and viewed as neglectful parents. They will do whatever they deeply feel is in the best interest of their children, regardless of how anyone judges them and how difficult it may be for them in this society.
Then there are parents who just simply go along with what their doctor and the media says they should do because they fear rocking the boat or being shamed or ostracized for not vaccinating. They take no time at all to check into it; they do none of their own research. Some may vaccinate because they really believe vaccines will protect their children and they don't have a clue how toxic vaccines really are. But I think there are many now who have either witnessed vaccine reactions in kids they know or have read the ingredients and info about toxicity and adverse reactions (how could they not?) and vaccinate anyway, even if it goes against their gut feelings and best judgement, because they are afraid of how others will judge them and that their doctors won't accept them. This is self-preservation at the expense of their children. After all, no one is going to judge them if their child has a serious reaction since they did what they were supposed to do. These are really the selfish parents who put their kids on the line.
I know this is harsh, but perpetuating this sick message that parents who don't vaccinate are selfish is incredibly wrong and has to stop. And what gives anyone the right to say that I should risk my child to a medical procedure that is known to carry the risk of neurological damage and even death?
Other people's children will continue to be harmed until enough parents stand up and
say "we don't want your toxic vaccines".
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» Your comments are shamelessly arrogant and will get you nowhere with those of us...
Posted by: mjabele
» RE: Your comments are shamelessly arrogant and will get you nowhere with those of us...
Posted by: Paxmana1
» It's hard for me to know what you're talking about, given that much of your post...
Posted by: mjabele
» RE: It's hard for me to know what you're talking about, given that much of your post...
Posted by: Paxmana1
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Posted by: Paxmana1 on Jun 11, 2008 2:23 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
How does injecting monkey tissue from livers and kidneys laced with mercury protect these babies?
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