PERSONAL HEALTH  
Barbaraehrenreich.com / By Barbara Ehrenreich
comments_imageCOMMENTS: 185

Why Does Everyone Bow Down to the Health Insurance Industry?

After facing down the Third Reich, the Japanese Empire, the U.S.S.R., Saddam Hussein, the United States has met an enemy it dares not confront -- the American private health insurance industry.
September 24, 2007  |  
 
 
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Bow your heads and raise the white flags. After facing down the Third Reich, the Japanese Empire, the U.S.S.R., Manuel Noriega and Saddam Hussein, the United States has met an enemy it dares not confront -- the American private health insurance industry.

With the courageous exception of Dennis Kucinich, the Democratic candidates have all rolled out health "reform" plans that represent total, Chamberlain-like, appeasement. Edwards and Obama propose universal health insurance plans that would in no way ease the death grip of Aetna, Unicare, MetLife, and the rest of the evil-doers. Clinton -- why are we not surprised? -- has gone even further, borrowing the Republican idea of actually feeding the private insurers by making it mandatory to buy their product. Will I be arrested if I resist paying $10,000 a year for a private policy laden with killer co-pays and deductibles?

It’s not only the Democratic candidates who are capitulating. The surrender-buzz is everywhere. I heard it from a notable liberal political scientist on a panel in August: We can’t just leap to a single payer system, he said in so many words, because it would be too disruptive, given the size of the private health insurance industry. Then I heard it yesterday from a Chicago woman who leads a nonprofit agency serving the poor: How can we go to a Canadian-style system when the private industry has gotten so “big”?

Yes, it is big. Leighton Ku, at the Center for Budget and Policy Priorities, gave me the figure of $776 billion in expenditures on private health insurance for this year. It’s also a big-time employer, paying what economist Paul Krugman has estimated two to three million people just turn down claims.

This in turn generates ever more employment in doctors’ offices to battle the insurance companies. Dr. Atul Gawande, a practicing physician, wrote in The New Yorker that ''a well-run office can get the insurer's rejection rate down from 30 percent to, say, 15 percent. That’s how a doctor makes money. It's a war with insurance, every step of the way.'' And that’s another thing your insurance premium has to pay for: the ongoing "war" between doctors and insurers.

Note: The private health insurance industry is not big because it relentlessly seeks out new customers. Unlike any other industry, this one grows by rejecting customers. No matter how shabby you look, Cartier, Lexus, or Nordstrom’s will happily take your money. Not Aetna. If you have a prior conviction -- excuse me, a pre-existing condition -- it doesn’t want your business. Private health insurance is only for people who aren’t likely to ever get sick. In fact, why call it “insurance,” which normally embodies the notion of risk-sharing? This is extortion.

Think of the damage. An estimated 18,000 Americans die every year because they can’t afford or can’t qualify for health insurance. That’s the 9/11 carnage multiplied by three -- every year. Not to mention all the people who are stuck in jobs they hate because they don’t dare lose their current insurance.

Saddam Hussein never killed 18,000 Americans or anything close; nor did the U.S.S.R. Yet we faced down those "enemies" with huge patriotic bluster, vast military expenditures, and, in the case of Saddam, armed intervention. So why does the U.S. soil its pants and cower in fear when confronted with the insurance industry?

Here’s a plan: First, locate the major companies. No major intelligence effort will be required, since Google should suffice. Second, estimate their armed strength. No doubt there are legions of security guards involved in protecting the company headquarters from irate consumers, but these should be manageable with a few brigades. Next, consider an air strike, followed by an infantry assault.

And what about the two to three million insurance industry employees whose sole job it is to turn down claims? Well, I have a plan for them: It’s called unemployment. What country in its right mind would pay millions of people to deny other people health care?

I’m not mean, though. If we had the kind of universal, single-payer, health insurance Kucinich is advocating, private health insurance workers would continue to be covered even after they are laid off. As for the health insurance company executives, there should be an adequate job training program for them – perhaps as home health aides.

Fellow citizens, where is the old macho spirit that has sustained us through countless conflicts against enemies both real and imagined? In the case of health care, we have identified the enemy, and the time has come to crush it.
Barbara Ehrenreich is the author of thirteen books, including the New York Times bestseller Nickel and Dimed. A frequent contributor to the New York Times, Harpers, and the Progressive, she is a contributing writer to Time magazine. She lives in Florida.
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The big difference...
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Posted by: chomsky on Sep 24, 2007 12:05 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As you said, for this battle, our leaders/politicians are not on our side...
That's the big difference!

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» I will be on your side Posted by: soulrebeljc
» Fight or flight Posted by: Cathyc
» RE: Fight or flight Posted by: LMNOP
» Failed relationships Posted by: Cathyc
» Not only... Posted by: Artkansas

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The fight between doctors and insurers.
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Sojourner on Sep 24, 2007 12:42 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Some years back I had private insurance that refused to pay the hospital where I had surgery. It was a simple matter of the longer the insurers kept their money, the more valuable it was to them.

I was caught in the middle and continued to telephone the insurance company to follow up their neglect. A clumsy clerk gave me information to reveal that their insistence they had not received my claim form was a lie, since the information he gave me on the phone was only available to him if he had received the form.

Shortly thereafter the hospitals took the insurance company to court and forced a settlement plus penalty. I have no reason to doubt that some similar ploy to lie and cheat happens all the time. Employees lie and cheat customers regularly. That's part of what it means to be a bureaucrat in our mass society: trade in your conscience for a paycheck.

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Bow down and strap on the electrodes: it's time for a little shock therapy
[Report this comment]
Posted by: eddie torres on Sep 24, 2007 1:24 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Ehrenreich: "What country in its right mind would pay millions of people to deny other people health care?"

The same country that pays millions of farmers to grow crops along 1930s federal food bureaucracy guidelines.

300 million Americans in a utopian single-payer US healthcare system are suddenly able to quit their miserable underpaid jobs because they no longer fear losing benefits?

Holy crap, Batman. That's what Wall Street calls "a revolution." Let's gently lobotmize that notion straight out of your head...

OJ's back! And now he's even more guilty!

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I couldn't care less what happens to 2-3 soulless insurance industry functionaries.
[Report this comment]
Posted by: darkenergy on Sep 24, 2007 1:53 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
They could build shanty towns after receiving foreclosure notices. They could look for work at Wal-Mart and other fine box stores. They've been bankrupting people for years by turning down insurance claims that should have been paid by the company.

As a little note:

Think of the damage. An estimated 18,000 Americans die every year because they can’t afford or can’t qualify for health insurance. That’s the 9/11 carnage multiplied by three -- every year.

That's six times as many who died in the 9/11 events.

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Shooting hoops.
[Report this comment]
Posted by: morningstar1972 on Sep 24, 2007 3:25 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Actually, I think Hillary is on the right track. I read her reforms yesterday, and I actually like it. I have to say I was skeptical at first, and really scared what she was going to propose, but let's see if I can get it all in a nutshell.
Those with healthcare coverages they like, can keep it. the rest of America without health coverage get the same benefits of congress, and those who wish to switch their coverage to that which congress gets are entitled.
She also has a plan for coverage. it will be working closely to those refund checks we enjoy every year (I don't because I always owe) to ensure every American has proper health coverage.
Even the American Cancer Society is promoting healthcare! I think it is great!
This isn't something to just "blow off" this is going to require some thinking. and, you are going to have to think of others as well, because this concerns all of us.

I was skeptical about all of these "healthcare reforms" but you know what? If I have to work in another hospital that denies service to a child, or an elderly person again, just because some idiot insurer turned them down, I am going to vomit.
sometimes you just need to see it for yourself to believe it!
and, don't put a price on human life. we all deserve to live.
(even those selfish people!)

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» RE: Shooting hoops. Posted by: oregonox
» Doesn't address the waste Posted by: notinKansas
» RE: Shooting hoops. Posted by: Bayardtom
» RE: Shooting hoops. Posted by: Dr. Colvin
» RE: Shooting hoops. Posted by: oldumbo

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Follow the money
[Report this comment]
Posted by: jlohman on Sep 24, 2007 3:43 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The answer is rather simple. Follow the money!!!

See HillaryCare2.0 is the symptom of a major disease

Hillary is no better than the rest. They all prostitute themselves for campaign money.

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The Authoritarians
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Posted by: shangrilalad on Sep 24, 2007 3:42 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Authoritarians
Link via Goggle.
By Bob Altemeyer


This is a book based on a psychological study of the authoritarian personality. You can read the whole book online for free, thanks to the author. Authoritarians ignore or attack this book, but the truths presented are self-evident. I found it fascinating.


.

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» RE: The Authoritarians Posted by: VannaLaRoche
» RE: The Authoritarians Posted by: Urgelt
» RE: Worth a read Posted by: rfrancis@godisdead.com

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my friend died on August 23rd, a victim of the health insurance industry
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Suzon on Sep 24, 2007 4:22 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It makes the issue very personal. My deepest grief is that she lived with multiple disabilities after a massive heart attack nine years ago, with Big Pharma using her as a cash cow.

My late husband's employer pays an insurer for a policy I will never need as I live in the UK and would simply buy travel insurance with medical coverage should I return for a visit.

I have often thought of telling the employer to drop the insurance but I have the feeling that it would only inspire the company to greater efforts to deny health care to those in genuine need.

Governments have been turning our lives over to corporations for the last 30 or so years. Limit campaign spending by offering candidates two free broadcasts and prohibit all other spending in the year prior to the election.

Then the government might be run with the interests of the public in mind.

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To answer the question "Why Does Everyone Bow Down to the Health Insurance Industry?"
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Posted by: ~Fiona~ on Sep 24, 2007 4:56 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
For the same reason people in one-sided relationship bow down, give head, bend over, etc do it... To get what they want... Politicians are the largest group of overpaid prostitutes in the world... THATS why they DO it!

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» Pimps and Prostitutes Posted by: Cathyc

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Reform in the long-term maybe
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Posted by: cinattra on Sep 24, 2007 5:02 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I would think that the rest of the business world would loathe the health insurance industry as an expense they would love to get rid. The reason that businesses don't have a problem with health insurance is that they by law they don't have to have it. So when businesses get to a point where the cost of health insurance is too much for them they just dump their plans all together.

Right now health insurance is a recruiting tool. Take that away and now I've got to find other ways to attract top talent. The cost of health insurance is nothing for the top businesses. For those businesses with smaller margins the cost of their services and products will have to go up to cover the added cost especially if they don't offer health insurance now.

In the future if health insurance becomes mandatory for businesses to offer I'm thinking then you may then start to see a true reform. That is an expense to business before the product is even dealt with. That can become a no-no where business competes on a global scale and not with just the guy down the street.

I'm not confident anyone's plan will slow the rising cost of health insurance. Looks like to me with any mandatory approach we are only feeding the fire.

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Why won't liberals vote Kucinich?
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Posted by: peacelf on Sep 24, 2007 5:21 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Come hell or high water, I'm voting for Kucinich or the Green Party candidate because of this one issue that Barbara Eirenrich is correct to spotlight as politicans' greatest fear: health insurance.

First, let's be honest: we don't have a health CARE system; we have a health insurance industry. There is no "care" in health services in america. And, with that many people dying because of health insurance rejections or lack or adequate affordable medical insurance coverage, then we have a crisis that the tyranical majority (who have health insurance) refuse to address.

But, if voting percentages are correct, candidates like Kucinich don't have a chance because, just as our Democratic candidates are weak or afraid to take on the health insurance industry, so are the "liberals" weak and afraid to take on the political party candidates by voting their consciences rather than the lesser of two evils.

Look, I'm not taunting liberals or progressives to get them to vote for Kucinich,but this problem with voting against one's interests has got to be addressed. I have heard liberals themselves explain how the media manipulates our choices, how big business manipulates our choices, how campaign finance manipulates our choices. If we know the rich and powerful are forcing cards on us, why don't liberals pick a different card?

If all the liberals and progressives voted their consciences, rather than the media-manipulated "popular" candidates, then we would make a statement that would reverberate throughout the DNC. They would have to take notice if 1/3 or 1/2 of Dem voters voted for a Kucinich.

It takes great strength of character to vote for a "fringe" candidate, the same strength it took blacks in the civil rights movement, except the only people getting hurt in the struggle are the uninsured. And, they already are hurting. But, they'd hurt less if they thought the party that's supposed to care for them was trying to change things.

peace

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» RE: Why won't liberals vote Kucinich? Posted by: racetoinfinity
» RE: Why won't liberals vote Kucinich? Posted by: nellie blogger
» Circular Reasoning Posted by: pdxstudent
» INTEGRITY ... Posted by: Cathyc
» RE: So peacelf, Posted by: peacelf

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Let's see who's bought and paid for
[Report this comment]
Posted by: MrX on Sep 24, 2007 6:00 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
http://www.michaelmoore.com/sicko/sickos-for-sale
/candidates/

I did a Google search on Ron Paul and Health Care and came up with this http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul339.html

In Sicko Michael Moore explains how Nixon created the HMO system. Ron Paul wants to undo that law from the looks of it.

What's more important is he wants to stop the US from policing the world. Health care is important, but hundreds of thousands of people are dying in Iraq. The US has been involved in one skirmish after the other for the past 50 years. Watch "Why We Fight" We need to try to stop the US Military Industrial Complex.

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» RE: on Paul is not the answer Posted by: rfrancis@godisdead.com

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Bottom Feeders
[Report this comment]
Posted by: fredwahl on Sep 24, 2007 6:04 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Employees, people who follow orders to deny claims, are no better than thieves, in fact their worse.
A former friend of mine changed careers, she is in the insurance industry, she denies claims and benefits for a living, she has been programed to think of customers as leeches, scum-bags, cheats.
Guess where she got the money to go to school for her new career, a auto collision, large settlement, hasn't seen a Dr. since.
These people have nothing to be afraid of, no personal accountability.
If by some chance some of them were to have an accident they might change there ways.

Names, addresses, and phone numbers published made members of congress afraid and change their vote on immigration.

It's an individual act, what do you have to lose, you lone nuts out there, does your life have any purpose?

How many lives of "leeches" have been ruined so an employee can have a nicer car, a better couch,just following orders.

Fred

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» RE: Bottom Feeders Posted by: bkvwd57

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As a doctor...
[Report this comment]
Posted by: PJAW on Sep 24, 2007 6:17 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
this is a subject that I deal with on a daily basis. I've investigated the mechanics of it fairly extensively and everything that the author says is true, plus more. The average person has no concept whatsoever just how evil this system has become. For example, did you know that insurance companies are specifically exempted from anti-trust laws, in all 50 states?

Several years ago, I devised a plan that I called "managed profits" (as a response to "managed care"). My thought was, develop a large pool of insurance purchasers (via the internet), and negotiate a contract with the insurance industry. I would approach them with a proposal along these lines, "I have x number of subscribers representing y number of premium dollars and we would like to purchase a group insurance plan, but with a set administrative fee and specified broad coverage". Turns out that's illegal. You are not allowed to form a group for the specific purpose of buying insurance.

Yes folks, they've covered all the bases, and they've been working for decades to accomplish this. They, like a few other industries (pharmaceuticals and military contractors to name a couple) have been busy for a long time, buying legislators and creating the legal context in which they will enrich themselves beyond all precedent. They have even developed a totally complicit media through which they disseminate the lie that they care about you and are working diligently in your best interests. And of course this media denigrates and marginalizes any candidate who represents real change. Not necessarily because they personally believe what they are saying, but because they are rewarded for being complicit and punished for speaking the truth (Dan Rather anyone?)

The solution? Independent thought and action by the voters is the best hope short of violence. Are there enough of us to pull it off despite the dumbing down we've been subjected to. We'll see, "Americans" have surprised the world in the past. I'm a Kucinich supporter myself.

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» RE: As a doctor... Posted by: djnoll
» RE: As a doctor... Posted by: photon's feather
» Independent thinking.... Posted by: Cathyc

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Not just health insurance all insurance
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Posted by: bkvwd57 on Sep 24, 2007 6:33 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This is not just health insurance that is a raging monster. I have a friend with a son that has a disability. She works in the schoold cafeteria so she doesn't work when he's not in school. Now because she has poor credit her homeowners insurance is being raised even though she has had them for 6 years now and has never been late on a payment, her insurance is escrowed.

The whole insurance industry is is bad. People with poor credit have to pay higher premiums, auto, home etc because they might do something to cause a claim because they need the money. Our politicians have allowed these companies to all insurance companies to decide that poor people don't deserve any breaks for anything. Poor people are bad apparently. My son went to try and get auto insurance on his own and Progressive wanted $1800 for 6 months up front because he had no credit history. This is an 18 year kid just starting out with liability only and a clean driving record.

Another friend had to have a double bypas and she has short term disability insurance but because she didn't have a heart attack before the surgery the insurance company would not pay her claim. What the hell is the insurance for?

I think all insurance is the biggest scam in the US. I have disability insurance on our truck That I paid for every month so if I became disabled it would pay the payments for me. I had a stroke last March and I can't get a Dr. to sign the paperwork for me and the insurance company won't accept my medical records as evidence of disability. So $500 per is not being paid and I have no job now, we are about to lose our truck.

They are all cheats and liars and scam artists and our government lets thm do this.

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» Blame the lawyers Posted by: gellero

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From reading Krugman and Dean Baker
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Posted by: chaoslegs on Sep 24, 2007 6:53 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
They are very supportive of Edwards plan. The concept is that people can buy into government insurance. Government insurance will compete with the other private plans. Over time, people (and probably employers first) will realize the government plan is cheaper and it will grow while the others dwindle.

It will be government insurance be free market, so take that Cato and Heritage.

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» RE: From reading Krugman and Dean Baker Posted by: oregonscribbler

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Undermining the insurance industry
[Report this comment]
Posted by: tomkara on Sep 24, 2007 6:57 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Unless the American people surprise us (miracle would be a better word) and vote in a large majority endorsed by groups like MoveOn, there won't be votes for a single payer system. The people keep more than enough retrograde politicians in office. Education (like sending this article to as many people you know, especially your right wing or middle of the road friends and family) may help, but as a political strategy, the current Democratic health care proposals may have some merit. First, get everyone insured. Next, offer them as one option access to government regulated programs like FEHBA and Medicare if they choose. Next, allow (as the doctor above mentions) people to form private insurance pools if they choose and also give incentives to nonprofits. Also, attempt more regulation of the for-profit industry, like forbidding refusal for pre-existing conditions etc. Since for-profits won't be able to compete with non-profits, we should hopefully see people chosing cheaper and better nonprofit options. And eventually we should see the insurance industry collapse. It may even be a better course, because I don't know what liability the nation would bear if we had to give the insurance industry a "buy out" under due process if they were suddenly made illegal. Of course this is only a hopeful scenario. The people have become so deluded lately, I don't know if even modest reform is possible.

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A tough decision that leaves me torn
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Posted by: rfrancis@godisdead.com on Sep 24, 2007 7:01 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
On the one hand I think government run healthcare would significantly boost the health of the average American and significantly lower costs.

On the other hand I don't think its right that nurses and doctors would be forced to work for the government with pay stipulated by the government. I believe they should have the right to decide for themselves what they want to charge for their services. As a libertarian, the idea of forcing doctors to work for the government does not sit well with me at all.

John Stossel recently had a piece on 20/20 suggesting that one way healthcare costs could be reduced is if every doctor was required to list their prices for different procedures.

That way everyone would know how much they charged and most would seek out the cheaper doctors thereby encouraging the more expensive doctors to lower their prices in order to compete for business.

Perhaps the government could pay for doctor and nursing education in exchange for those doctors and nurses working in government hospitals and practices.

Perhaps some sort of wholesale discount pricing for all consumer goods could be given to doctors and nurses who work at government hospitals and practices.

I have to think there is some solution available other than forcing by penalty of law, resulting in fines and jail, to encourage doctors and nurses to work for government health facilities rather than private ones.

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» Two Unassailable Observations Posted by: pdxstudent
» RE: Two Unassailable Observations Posted by: rfrancis@godisdead.com
» Guilty of Malpractice?? Posted by: gellero
» RE: A tough decision that leaves me torn Posted by: rfrancis@godisdead.com

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Exactly
[Report this comment]
Posted by: argyle on Sep 24, 2007 7:20 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The problem isn't that 47 million Americans don't have health insurance. That's the result of the problem. The problem is that access to health care is a basic right and we treat it as a commodity.

If we decided, as a people, to commonly fund a well-audited professionally run health care system that didn't have to compete to cut costs, yet was overseen by a small army of fervent auditors, we could actually save money. Yes people will be temporarily out of work. But the overall value added to the economy by the decrease in spending (that money doesn't disappear) on inefficient private health care companies would provide an enormous economic stimulus.

The literal Elephant in the room is that not only would a commonly funded non-market driven health care system provide what in any basic definition of ethics has to be a universal human right: It would save us money while allowing us to pay workers that actually provide services to patients better, and instantly flood the market with available capital without inflation.

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» RE: xactly Posted by: DrKen

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Hillary, Rudy both whores, one looks better in a dress though..
[Report this comment]
Posted by: TJ-stars4peace on Sep 24, 2007 7:22 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
All of our main politicians are sold out lying whores..!

The bankers and Insurance companies are thieving corporate fascists..!

We the People..have been betrayed by both parties..!


Hillary, Rudy, who cares they're both lying whores..one does look better in a dress than the other though, but still whores all the same..!



That's a keeper..!

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Wrong Wrong Wrong
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Posted by: nikkie on Sep 24, 2007 7:33 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As long as you remain so completely ignorant about the natural order of the universe and the perfection that is the human body you are doomed to enslave yourself regardless of who the players are.

You want health insurance? Begin educating yourself outside the box that you've allowed yourself to be put in. There is a path that will lead you to your highest and healthiest existence but you won't find it unless you are willing to shed the "beliefs" that you've been taught starting before the age of reason. As with the spiritual, "lest all your flowers die and you are born again you will not enter the kingdom", so it is true also in the physical as both respond to the same “cure.” You must empty the mind for it is full of poison in the form of conditioned belief. You must empty the body for it is full of poison in the form of conditioned response.

Understand that the human body is not the decrepit genetically deficient errant lump of hopeless flesh that increasingly you are being asked to believe. Yet the human race is dying at an exponential rate and indeed it shows all the markers of a species in decline. The easiest way to measure this truth is to rearrange your thinking so that you view your existence through the existence of your host in this universe; the blessed Mother Earth where you are provided an existence bounded by natural laws. Two things happen when you exceed these natural laws; your environment suffers and so does your health. The two are reflections of each other. The axiom is thus “that which is good for the planet is good for you and that which is bad for you is bad for the planet, and visa versa.”

Now look around you and see what is killing the health of the environment and you can easily see what is making you ill. The primary cause of all degenerative conditions of the human species is the over consumption of animal products. Likewise, the single greatest sector contributing to the demise of the environment is the over production of animal products for human consumption. It’s no wonder if you don’t already know both of these facts as they are concealed by those who benefit from a diseased species that has been taught to gorge itself on excess. Think about it and you’ll realize how large the opposition to your health is. It includes agriculture, food production, food service and the entire medical industry for starters.

Have you not been cultured into the very farm animal you consume without regard? Have you not been corralled and fattened, and made lazy and dependent? Have you not been made less adaptable to your environment where you burn easily in the sun and find fault with nature and the human body? Are you not rewarding a medical system for failure instead of success?

There is a way out of this maze but it does not involve any solution provided from the top down, which is only more manipulation. The way out is from the ground up. Get as close to nature as you can. Insist on organic out of PRINCIPLE and you’ll see magjc begin to happen in your life. Ask yourself how an elephant can grow into such a mass of muscle and bone without eating flesh. Ask yourself which course is healthier for the planet and your body: to consume a pound of flesh in one day knowing it took forty pounds of grain to produce, or to consume forty pounds of grain over six months as a staple? Can you see the waste and the excess? Can you see the cost benefit?

There are many cultures outside the corral of disinformation that still practice “backward” methods of sustenance where the incidence of degenerative disease is almost non-existent by comparison. No, it’s not natural for women to get osteoporosis. It’s a disease of women who have been poisoned.

Begin by reading George Oshawa from the beginning and you’ll find yourself unplugging and showered with rays of healing and hope.

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» RE: Wrong Wrong Wrong Posted by: Shehova
» RE: Wrong Wrong Wrong Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: Wrong Wrong Wrong Posted by: nltrihey

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New Mexico Health Security Act
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Posted by: soulrebeljc on Sep 24, 2007 7:37 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Here in New Mexico, we have an opportunity to get private insurance OUT of the health care system once and for all. The Health Security Act, reviewed by Governor Bill Richardson's Health Care Task Force (along with 2 other proposals which keep private pay insurance) was shown to be the most cost effective program, saving New Mexico 300-400 million a year AND everyone is covered. Everyone. Of course Bill Richardson has said that the private insurance companies will have the dominant role in NM health care reform. Look to the money, and we find that Richardson's greatest business sector donors are "Finance, Insurance, and Real Estate" - over twice as much, almost 3 million towards his 2006 Governor's race, as the next largest business sector donor.

Citizens of New Mexico must lobby the state legislature hard so that a small group of democrats such as Jerry Ortiz y Pino and Dede Feldman recognize that We the People want full health care that isn't steered by corporate profits. Private insurance has NO INHERENT RIGHT to play a role in health care, especially given how badly they have screwed things up so far.

I have made health care reform one of the primary platform issues of my campaign for First District Representative in New Mexico. I also support Dennis Kucinich for president and his HONEST and OPEN assessment of the health care system and necessary reforms. Single payer NOW.

Jason Call
www.Call4Democracy.org
Albuquerque, NM

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Vote for Dennis Kucinich
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Posted by: mel on Sep 24, 2007 7:39 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Great article, thank you!
Is there a conspiracy by AARP & corporate news to ignore Dennis Kucinich? Why wasn't he on the PBS/AARP debate about health care since he is the ONLY candidate who has an actual plan? There are more of us than them (Bush's friends).
Some Democrats are selling out but Dennis Kucinich is brave enough and honest enough to stand up to the insurance companies. He'll also get us out of this ridiculous war.

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» RE: Vote for Dennis Kucinich Posted by: sausage

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TAKE THE FIGHT WHERE IT BELONGS
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Posted by: VZEQICVA on Sep 24, 2007 7:49 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
With the Insurance cos. Between Edwards and Clinton there's a plan that will work. Too many people forget that there was a time in this country when getting sick was not a federal case and people rich and poor got the care they needed. Medication was affordabel. No it was not the dark ages. The biggest lie is about the "choices' people have. It's the insurance co. that have choices. They are NOT entitled to ongoing double digit profits. They have some respsonsibility to the insured. Thanks, ANNA

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The Power of Guilt
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Posted by: Gravitas on Sep 24, 2007 8:08 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Why does everyone cower in the face of the health care industry? How did the Church get away with sexually abusing children for centuries? The answer is rule by guilt. When someone is effective in making us feel guilty, it can politically and emotionally disable us. Our own shame induced myopia keeps us focused on our "sins" so we are completely blind to the motives of those who would exploit us. In our society, health is a moral issue that racks us with guilt. The media has been so completely successful with its propaganda that ill health is our own fault, we never think of environmental factors. And we don't demand a better system cause we are bringing on our poor health ourselves. This is particularly true with the scapegoating of obesity for almost every major ill there is. But it applies to all lifestyle factors. Sadly, while progressives have recognized many other manipulative tools of oppression, they have taken to heart the morality over health and fitness. As long as health remains equated with guilt, shame, and finger pointing, people will feel too disempowered to fight the system in any meaningful way!

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Perception vs. reality
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Posted by: willymack on Sep 24, 2007 8:18 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Why are insurance and drug companies seemingly invincible? You don't really have to strain the ol' brain cells to answer that one yourself. As with the oil & coal industries, Big Pharma & Big Insurance have most of congress on their payroll. This is minor compared to the war profiteers and the manufactors of war implements and munitions. Congress would rather go through the motions of protecting us from the very scoundrels whose arses they're kissing than actually doing their jobs. It's more profitable that way, and it doesn't take a lot of morals, ethics, and other unprofitable character traits to do what they do. Far too many of us would rather believe that our "leaders" are all sterling characters with our best interests in mind, when in fact, they're greedy lowlifes who should never have been elected in the first place. Money is power in this country. It trumps and negates everything based on honesty, decency, and fair play, and as long as that stays the same, don't expect any knights in shining armor to come to our rescue.

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America's failed Health care Delivery System
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Posted by: viswanat on Sep 24, 2007 8:23 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Our govt. unlike those of democracies in Europe is failing to provide what those countries are to their people because we have lost sight of controls on free enterprise and capitalism. The latter have been allowed to go wild and greed has replaced good sound business ethics.
As for facing down Nazism etc. that cannot compare with solving domestic problems. If there is anything we have been able to do is that we can mount massive wars but that never has solved any problem. Good luck to the people who have to reveive health care and that is all of us.

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More criminal than the Bushes and the Mob together
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Posted by: jeffrey7 on Sep 24, 2007 8:28 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Insurance is a racket. Has been ever since they sold 'comet insurance in the beginning of the 20th century when haley's comet came around. They proved they were even more criminal after 9/11 when they needed the gov't to bail them out of haveing to honor the claims by their insured. They did the same dance aftetr Katrina. Far too many folks got reamed because they had loopholes in their policies they did'nt know existed.
The insurance companies only want themselves in 'good hands'. You pay outragous premiums to get pittance, or worse
be dropped as soon as you file a claim. All the while the insurance company executives ride around in expensive cars
wear $2000 suits,and act like demigods of healthcare.
At the P.O.T. Party we contend to put Fedreal Health insurance in direct compition with them. It works like this....
Everyone would pay $10/month to be on the program, with $3 co-pay for all office calls and perscriptions plus Lab works.
This would cover all aliments,even catastrophic ones. The major support for the program would come from a 40% reduction in defense spending. No person would be refused for perexisting conditions,age or race. Nor would income be a barrier. The homeless could get the same care as everyone else by simply picking up litter for a couple of hours a day.
We'd have cleaner cities and the healthcare system truly would include everyone.
I think we're all pretty sick of having our money stolen by insurance companies for sub-human health treatment,to be forced out of a hospital barely healed up,to be told our insurance won't pay for most of the bills. These companies are criminal!!! Their business model is criminal!! They need to be shut down as racketeers.
So what kind of healthcare system do you want? One that rips you off and forces you to pay more or the one offered by the P.O.T. Party? We are the People Over Tyrants Party and the health insurance is just one aspect of this tyranny.
It's time to think outside the system
Draft Jeffrey7 for Prez '08

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Simple question on health care for all the presidential candidates
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Posted by: sausage on Sep 24, 2007 9:03 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Why is a private bureaucracy (or private insurance company), which is answerable only to its major shareholders, better (or preferable) than a governmental bureaucracy (or single-payer healthcare system), which, if the government is properly functioning, is accountable to the voting public?

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» What Government? Posted by: Cathyc

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Clinton Sucker-Punch to the Insurance Industry?
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Posted by: Urgelt on Sep 24, 2007 9:22 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Romney himselfpioneered a state plan similar to Hillary-Care. What's his objection to Clinton's approach? Why does he turn purple in the face just thinking about it?

The option to choose state-run health insurance. That scares the bejesus out of Republicans.

State-run policies like Medicare or the VA expend around 3% of premiums on administrative overhead. For the insurance industry it's around 15-30% for most insurers.

If Clinton delivers, private insurers will be required to compete with government insurance programs. With their complicated schemes for wringing profit out of policy-holders and higher overhead costs (15-30%, compared to around 3% for state-run policies), it's not clear to me that the insurance industry will be able to survive under Hillary-Care.

Is Clinton for real?

The Clintons are famously pro-business. Will that provision of her health care plan survive if she's elected? Or is that a sop to the Democratic base to keep them in line until after the election?

I don't know.

Kucinich is indeed the only candidate who says the right things on health insurance. I don't feel inclined to bet on Clinton's sincerity. But if she is sincere, her plan might have the same effect in the long run. If private insurers melt away under the competition, it's just a short jump to taking employers out of the picture and creating a single-payer system.

Plausible? I don't know.

This is a really wierd election. The Republicans have only one marginalized candidate who speaks to traditional Republican values - Ron Paul. The Democrats have only one marginalized candidate who speaks to traditional Democratic values - Dennis Kucinich. The poll-leaders are all pro-business talk-tough-on-foreign-policy image meisters with ties to corporate power and special interests. Both parties have been hijacked from their bases.

The liberal base is expected by the Clinton camp to peer through the haze of her rhetoric and somehow intuit that they'll like the result of her policies in the long run. According to the polls, they're doing it, too - rejecting the plain-spoken Kucinich for the over-complicated say-one-thing-and-mean-another Clinton.

Sometimes I wonder if Romney and the other Republicans are flaming Hillary just to lend her more credibility with the Democratic base. Hey, if Mitt hates her, she must be ok! Every time the Republicans attack her, she gains a few points in the polls. It all seems so orchestrated.

If that's really the case, then you can forget about Hillary-Care as she currently explains it. After the election, it'll be "negotiated" to a "compromise" which leaves social health insurance out of the mix. A Romney-style mandate will require poor people to pony-up or be branded un-American. Private health insurers will lock in ever-bigger profits. Health care costs will keep rising like a rocket.

Are we being played? Or is Clinton sincere? I wish I knew.

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health insurance industry
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Posted by: llyon0815 on Sep 24, 2007 10:02 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Thirty years ago the steel and auto industries that were both very "big" experienced a precipitous loss of employment because they elected not to adapt their management and production practices to deal effectively with prevailing economic conditions. Those industries found ways to adapt and their former employees eventually did as well. The health insurance industry is not particularly different - except maybe in that the steel and auto industries actually PRODUCED something. The companies and individual people impacted by the restructuring of the insurance industry in such a way as to support everyone effectively in retaining and regaining their health will eventually find a way to deal with it.

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Politicians (Who are Mostly Lawyers) Are Risk Adverse
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Posted by: drricklippin on Sep 24, 2007 10:32 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Barbara-

Thanks for your bold statement. Besides the lobbying dollars from the Insurance companies, lawyers, who comprise most of our politicians, are risk adverse by temperment. Insurance companies thrive on risk adverse people.

I am for single payer with much more emphasis on prevention- both individual (health behaviors) and institutional(public health). Prevention is our and other nations only way out of this economically unsustainable mess.

I write about this extensively on my blog

Be Well,

Dr. Rick Lippin
http://medicalcrises.blogspot.com

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» RE: PREVENTION Posted by: Cathyc
» RE: PREVENTION=GLAD YOU AGREE Posted by: drricklippin
» RE: PREVENTION LOL Posted by: gellero

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I TOLD you they would try to change the subject!
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Posted by: Ms. DuFontagne on Sep 24, 2007 10:33 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Keep reminding your representatives and the pres. candidates every chance you get - it's universal health CARE that we need, not universal INSURANCE. Let them know that you know the difference!

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Insurance scams
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Posted by: Maryanne on Sep 24, 2007 11:29 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We are among those who pay exorbitant rates for medical insurance, the monthly rate going up dramatically each year, while coverage is being cut and inefficiency has increased in reimbusements.

Bad as this is, there was an event that made our TV news recently. The car of a woman, who carries medical isurance, was hit head on, with the result that she was rendered unconscious, and was still woozy when the ambulance arrived to take her to the hospital. Although she had ambulance coverage, payment was rejected by the insurance company since she DID NOT GET PRIOR AUTHORIZATION TO USE THIS SERVICE. She is appealing.

It is way past time that we had universal medical coverage with ONE payer- just extend Medicare. We will be glad to continue paying what we do now, if we could get services paid for (no deductibles, co-pays, etc.) without the hastle we now encounter.

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» RE: Insurance scams Posted by: Nasookin
» Accident-free America? Posted by: Cathyc

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great article
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Posted by: allyourbasearebelongtous on Sep 24, 2007 11:48 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I'm a psychotherapist in private practice. All of the problems with getting paid by insurance companies that have been referred to by other professionals in this thread are true and sometimes it's even worse. A major insurance company where I am located has cut reimbursement by 20% and seems to have gotten away with it even though the governor of our state has expressed his displeasure with it. It is illegal for us to organize either to fight it or to negotiate with them. We are waiting to see how long it is going to take for the other insurance companies to cut rates too. Of course there will be a denial that there was ever any collusion on their part to do this and they will get by with it. I like what I do for a living but I am looking for other income streams and will cut back my practice after those income streams are in place and bringing in money. I suspect that other providers like me with lots of training and many years of experience will do the same as they are able to. This means that over time people in my part of the country increasingly will be getting their mental health care from less able, less experienced providers who think that the reimbursement level is okay because they have no standard for comparison. Unfortunately, psychotherapy is a profession that requires years of training, supervision and experience to do it well. To give you a comparison, people in private practice in 1990 were asking and getting insurance reimbursement for psychotherapy that was nearly twice what it is now. If you see a therapist in a solo private practice, you have probably noticed that that therapist has no office staff because reimbursement is now so low that he or she can't even afford to hire a receptionist.

The problem is the big insurance companies and big pharma. That's where your health care dollar is going.

I used to work for insurance companies back when they had their own private clinics. In 1994, the increase in compensation for the head of the mental health part of the insurance company I worked for (not the overall company CEO) was 10 times what my wife and I made together that year. Now this wasn't the person's entire compensation package for the year -- just the increase in the compensation package from the previous year. Later that year, I had the privilege of meeting that person and, well, I was not impressed. I had to wonder how that individual managed to get into that situation.

That was just a personal anecdote but the point is that, like the other corporate bureaucracies, a few people at the very top are making all the money while the rest of the people in the bureacracies are going along with it out of fear and out of a mistaken belief that they could be one of those people too. If you work for a large corporation, you have have about as much chance of being one of the folks at the top making all the money as the average street hoops shooter has of being an NBA star or the average musician has of being a music superstar.

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Vote
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Posted by: allyourbasearebelongtous on Sep 24, 2007 11:51 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
So the point is, vote for whoever the democrats nominate because that is the only way this issue is going to get addressed at all. if you vote third party or don't vote and of the repugs gets in, you can bet it'll be another 4 to 8 years before this gets done at all -- totally aside from whether it would get done in the way that you personally think is best by whatever democrat gets the nomination.

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Here's why you gutless, spineless cowards!!!
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Posted by: MAD on Sep 24, 2007 12:34 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"After facing down the Third Reich, the Japanese Empire, the U.S.S.R., Saddam Hussein, the United States has met an enemy it dares not confront -- the American private health insurance industry."

Well, first off, let's set the historical record straight. We faced down the Third Reich ONLY after the Bush family assisted them in their efforts to overrun Europe, Africa and the Middle East, and when it appeared likely that it could end up being profitable. I also think it's worth mentioning that Americans weren't nearly the brainwashed, cowardly, complacent and ignorant fucks they are today. Hollywood and the MSM weren't the masters of the universe they are today, and therefore, American heads weren't buried quite so far up their asses.

Yeah, we sure faced down the Japanese, or rather, Fat Man & Little Boy faced them down for us.

The equally demented, bellicose and imperialistic USSR was simply bankrupted by that "all-American hero" of neo-con lore, Ronald Reagan! His nitwit, pie in the sky fantasies like SDI were not courageous nor were they ingenious, and furthermore, didn't require anything exceptional of the American people other than allowing a B-grade actor to spend us into an unprecedented debt through building the Death Star.

Saddam Hussein? Do we really need to go into that? Didn't think so.

Now, as to the matter of why Americans are afraid to stand up to the Insurance companies . . . It's really quite simple: Americans are cowardly, self-absorbed assholes. The majority of Americans are insured and couldn't care less if the 50 million who go without die miserable deaths. I don't want to hear any discussion about this either. You all know damn good and well that the VAST majority of Americans have no vested interest in seeing others with health insurance. Most don't give a shit until they get canned and then it's all "poor me - why doesn't this greedy, corptocracy take care of me and my family?"

This country has always been about "getting yours" and that won't change in the foreseeable future. The insurance companies are merely a reflection of this greedy, self-serving attitude so pervasive in our society. Why do we insist on blaming them? We blame mortgage companies, Big Med, Big Defense et al rather than look inwards, placing the blame exactly where it belongs: with us.

We continue to let them run roughshod over us with little or no complaint. We let the gentle glow of the TV wash over us while we relax on the La-Z-Boy, fixated on Brangelina and Britney. The blame lies with us and us alone. We have the power to change the system yet we continue to elect corporate whores for politicians. The number of you idiots who continue to support the Dems is UN-FUCKING-BELIEVABLE!!!

Do you really think they're going to change things? Take a long, hard look at Hillary. I think Edwards is a twit and liar but he hit the nail on the head when, in a recent debate, he referred to her complete reversal of attitude regarding big Insurance thusly: "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em". You are all desperately opposed to the war but are so quick to forget that the bitch voted for it!!!! God, Americans are soooooo stupid. Many of you believe that Edwards may be the answer. That asshole voted for the war as well, no?. The people who didn't vote for it are lagging in the polls and are deemed completely unelectable by an MSM that you turkeys allow to rule the roost.

God forbid you idiots think about voting for a third party. You'll rush out and vote for Hillary and be right back here in 2 years, whining and crying when she doesn't accomplish shit, and *gasp* turns out to be an incredible corporate whore!!

I've said it before. I'll say it again. American deserves everything it gets!

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» A bit sweeping... Posted by: mjabele

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vote for democrats ?
[Report this comment]
Posted by: ShoShenQ on Sep 24, 2007 12:51 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Vote for democracts, but dont vote for Hillary Clinton, you know the one who gets millions from the Health Insurance companies ?

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» RE: mick3 Posted by: skydog

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Health Care Revolution
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Posted by: Dr. Colvin on Sep 24, 2007 1:25 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
You're right!

Where do we sign up to join the revolutionary forces? How do we get a hold of a tactic that will work?

How about this one. Since the greatest power that the insurance industry has is our money in their pockets, why not stop paying them? I'll take in one further, since they make the most money on generally healthy people who are between the ages of 25 to 35 why not encourage this specific group of people to drop their insurance policies. According to our preident they could just go to the emergency room if they needed to.

Imagine how it would effect the insurance industry if all of their profitable insured left, leaving only those who drain their coffers. We need to be much more subversive.

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» RE: Health Care Revolution Posted by: VZEQICVA
» Healthy People Posted by: Cathyc

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Why does America let itself be fooled by the insurance companies?
[Report this comment]
Posted by: freedom38 on Sep 24, 2007 1:37 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The people are not fooled, but here's why the American government is: too much lobbying and bribing by health insurance companies. It's time for some serious counter-lobbying by the American public. The government was created for the people, not for corporate interest!

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IF you're worried about health care, then I think you ought to be VERY WORRIED about CODEX!
[Report this comment]
Posted by: wireup on Sep 24, 2007 1:58 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What is Codex?

Do you take food supplements? Under Codex the dosages will be so low there will be little point in taking them.

Codex, an ally of Big Pharma, will wipe out alternative health. Health food stores will close.

There will be no more organic food.

All food animals will be given synthetic hormones and antibiotics.

Genetically modified food will not be labeled.

Freedom of choice in health will be a thing of the past.

If you want to know more about this Nazi "health care" read this from the natural solutions website:

Summary
http://www.healthfreedomusa.org/index.php?page_id=157

And then go here to watch a 45-minute video all about Codex:

http://www.healthfreedomusa.org/index.php

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Why...
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Knobby on Sep 24, 2007 2:15 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
have we become so dependent on not only Health Care but on Insurance companies?
If you answer that question correctlly you will have the answer to why we are in the mess we're in today...

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» RE: Why... Posted by: Trazom

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This just in: An AlterNet writer actually SUPPORTS KUCINICH
[Report this comment]
Posted by: Flora Gael on Sep 24, 2007 2:27 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Barbara Enreich, I love you. Always have. Well, not always. But lately. I discovered you only a couple of years ago. B ut anyway. The point is, you rule! Excellent article. I envy you and your talents. Anytime you want to write for my magazine, go for it:

www.clockwisecat.blogspot.com

Love,

Moi

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hardparts
[Report this comment]
Posted by: hardparts on Sep 24, 2007 3:35 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It seems that all the candidates are willing to discuss, is health care for the uninsured, or at least uninsured children. Will they make sure these people they are going to cover get a health care package equal to the health care coverage they have themselves? After all, the government package they vote for themselves as congresspeople is one of the best if not the best protection available, shouldn't it be the same package they offer to their bosses, us, we the people. How about offering universal health care to the entire country, and get this millstone off the necks of the American businessman. This way every American, in or out of public service, gets the same medical, prescription and surgical coverage. These people seem to forget when they get to Washington, they work for us, we chose to send them there to run the country for us. They are not Princes or Princesses, Dukes or Duchesses, they are our employees, entrusted with the welfare of our country and ourselves.

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» RE: hardparts Posted by: sharilynkay

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Macho spirit?
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Posted by: Cathyc on Sep 24, 2007 3:40 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Barbara Ehrenreich says:
"Fellow citizens, where is the old macho spirit that has sustained us through countless conflicts against enemies both real and imagined? In the case of health care, we have identified the enemy, and the time has come to crush it."

That's the problem, Barbara, the "macho" spirit you talk about is alive and kicking in the American Health Insurance Industry that you criticize! Its not the macho spirit that you should be endorsing, its the complete opposite: the balanced HUMAN spirit. The whole problem with America, and not just is Health System. It is its MACHO culture!!!

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mainstream candidates are shilling for the leeches
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Posted by: synapse on Sep 24, 2007 4:08 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
When Thomas Jefferson was dying, his physicians began using leeches and other dubious methods of treatment. The treatments didn't help and finally a miserable and frustrated Jefferson ordered a stop to the barbaric treatments so he could die in peace.

Modern day health insurance, more often than not, makes us feel like we are getting the leech treatment. The solution to combatting insane levels of health care inflation does not lie in giving the insurance industry an opportunity to destroy what little health freedom remains in this country.

The combination of taxpayer contributions to Medicare, Medicaid, state-based grants, veterans and military health care, prisoner health care (the only health care mandated by law), and employer subsidies together total 60% of U.S. health care expenditures. [This does not even include taxpayer funding for some of the dubious benefits behind federal research grants for basic and clinical research.] This huge base of taxpayer money for health care would be more than adequate to provide basic essential health care for all Americans.

The dysfunction and lack of transparency in the current system is reflected in the examples of: (1) The same basic protocol for treating a broken leg costing 300% more in one hospital than it does in another only 10 miles away, and; (2) Per capita Medicare expenditures several fold higher for residents in Miami than they are in Michigan thanks to a Florida culture of specialist care that takes advantage of the lucrative payouts for expensive tests and procedures.

A panel of health care providers and medical economists could eliminate the biggest sources of waste and inefficiency while also providing a framework for a transparent and flexible system. Citizen involvement could further reduce waste and foster a spirit of community participation.

This general discussion doesn't even touch on the problem of a medical system geared to treat disease instead of using the more practical and life-affirming approach of prevention through wellness and education. Mandated coverage would merely reinforce the current disease-based, pill-popping paradigm. I suppose that is another column for the intrepid Barbara Ehrenreich.

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The government isn't the only problem
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Posted by: ld7440 on Sep 24, 2007 4:11 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
While the government is responsible for the laws that are passed regarding the issue, remember the people who voted the present Administration into office. There are many ignorant voters who have been brainwashed into believing that 1) we can't afford to pay for a single-payer system; 2) that it will usher in socialism; 3) that we'll end up with long waits for medical care; etc. Clearly these people haven't bothered to watch Michael Moore's movie, "Sicko." As for uninsured children, they can't vote. Why should politicians care?

As for private insurance companies, they deserve to go out of business, or be restructured. If a company isn't doing what it's supposed to, it doesn't deserve our business. And private health insurance companies are failing us miserably. One could argue that governmental programs and their system of checks and balances leaves alot to be desired, too. However, democracy was founded on the principle of "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" - that's for everyone, not just for the wealthy and the privileged. Congressmen have total health insurance coverage with no copays. Are they implying that they are better than we are? People need to read between the lines.

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Culture of FEAR ...
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Posted by: Cathyc on Sep 24, 2007 5:42 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
... and normal human well-being goes together. America is a land of emotionally-starved Gekko-greedy automatons. Money and material things are all that matters to your average American citizen. How sad. How sad it is to live only by a purely materialistic code, where you and your children are nothing but material objects. So afraid are you of the real world - the beautiful world of Nature - that you find comfort in the material things of this world, if only for an hour or two, or a day or a week at a time.... to alleviate your emotional suffering. How sad and lonely this materialistic existence of yours must be... It must surely feel like one of those victims of "9/11" who had no choice but to jump to their deaths, rather than be slowly roasted alive....... ???

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» RE: Culture of FEAR ... Posted by: sharilynkay

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Health Care in America; Uninsured, Underinsured, Universal Woes
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Posted by: Betsy L. Angert on Sep 24, 2007 5:51 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Dearest Barbara Ehrenreich . . .

Please allow me to thank you. I am grateful that your words evoke this essential discussion.

I read. "With the courageous exception of Dennis Kucinich, the Democratic candidates have all rolled out health "reform" plans that represent total, Chamberlain-like, appeasement." I jumped for joy. That thought alone was the source of great excitement.

I too am frustrated by the submissive Americans that attempt to choose what they hope will be an electable candidate, while they acquiesce to inadequate health care. The mainstream and those on the Left ignore the deeper issues. Citizens of this country want nothing more than a "winner." For me, that attitude reflects the macho spirit. Actually, I wish that mentality was missing. To cast a ballot so that a Party might say, "We won" I think is untenable.

I have penned many a treatise on Universal Health Care. Throughout the Progressive cyberspace community, I share the plans Dennis Kucinich espouses. I too receive compliant comments. Today, I was told "half a loaf" is better than none. For me, if we accept that Insurers, Pharmaceutical Manufacturers, and Health Care Organizations must continue to profit from the fragility of human beings, then we, the citizens will remain consumers, a source for limitless earnings.

Ms Ehrenreich, you refer to Economist and Columnist Paul Krugman. The reference used supports the statement, Health Care Organizations are huge. I believe that is valid. Nonetheless, what frightens me is the stance Krugman takes on Universal Health Care. I quote . . .
The Edwards and Clinton plans as well as the slightly weaker but similar Obama plan achieve universal-or-near-universal coverage through a well-thought-out combination of insurance regulation, subsidies and public-private competition. These plans may disappoint advocates of a cleaner, simpler single-payer system. But it’s hard to see how Medicare for all could get through Congress any time in the near future, whereas Edwards-type plans offer a reasonable second best that you can actually envision being enacted by a Democratic Congress and signed by a Democratic president just two years from now.

I read this account in the course of my research. I rejected it for my missive. I invite your thoughts on . . .
Health Care in America; Uninsured, Underinsured, Universal Woes
Please also peruse . . .
Elected and Electable; Dennis Kucinich
Costly Happy Meals; Hillary and Mitt. Healthy Menu; Kucinich Plan

Betsy L. Angert
BeThink.org

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It's so simple
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Posted by: Jeanne on Sep 24, 2007 7:19 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If there were not a profit-making third party involved in the delivery of health care, then health care would be delivered. No insurance business wants to pay out. It is simply against their mission to make money. So there is an inherent conflict of interest. Having private insurers in the middle of reimbursements to providers is, quite frankly, insane. Their "return" is based on minimizing out-goings (payments for services of any kind) and maximizing income (premiums paid by their victims, I mean "customers"). There's no reward in maximizing services.

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Do or Die! Single Payer National Health Care as a Constitutional Human Right!
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Posted by: rwcbanzai on Sep 24, 2007 8:44 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Honorable Friends:

This article pretty well sums up what we should do to get a "Single Payer Universal Healthcare for all of u.s." I really encourage all of you to read this article and the comments. I spent 35 years in the labor movement fighting for the rights of working people and became disabled, cast away & put out of work, without any health insurance coverage! Yes, this can happen to you! I now pay over a thousand dollars a month for coverage for myself and wife leaving me economically & physically unable to do anything but to spread my disabling experience here on the WEB. I like many of you believed that if you work hard in life you'll reap the benefits. I found out the hard way that benefits can be taken away by the corporate & governing greedy. Even now, bankruptcy is not an option, just as insurance is not security! If you don't have your health, work, love, life - all become hopeless & meaningless!

Consider this, we have socialized national healthcare for all government, Federal, State, County, military, and the disappearing UNION jobs only if your ABLE TO WORK. There is coverage for the very young and the very old thru Medicare and MediCal and other programs if your unable to work. Those in-between (>50 million) have no coverage or overpay for private coverage if they are disabled on the job! No one, I repeat, no one should profit from sickness or illness but we allow them too! They (the medical/insurance industry) should all be non profits doing charitable humanitarian good works, not obtaining greedy profits on life or death! The VA hospitals are SOCIALIZED MEDICINE and outperform all for-profit hospitals and are the model of nationalized health care! We have it now, only for our Veterans of War, but what about our Veterans of LABOR? Well, well trained soldiers can take things by force, laborers can only negotiate in good faith! Health Care should be a universal human right superceding HAPPINESS in our CONSTITUTION!! For, without good health, life becomes death, a choice really, really worth fighting for.

Now, is the time to become aware of the frailty of our economic position in the face of future economic disaster. Employers dump their workers, dump their health and pension plans, and Insurance companies make money by denying coverage! The Loop hole is always in the fine print that those governing allow. This Single Payer National Healthcare is the ONE ISSUE that will determine my decision as to who will be elected to lead our great union of fifty states. I'm not going to Canada or Europe to obtain a basic human right, called national healthcare. The European UNION is not greater than the American Union? In this point in my life, it has become a life or death matter, and as a human being you too, will sooner or later, meet this same crossroad with which I find my life now on the line.

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Many more than 18,000 per year die because of the insurance system control over US medicine
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Posted by: logansafi on Sep 24, 2007 10:44 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The author grossly underestimates the number of deaths from the US insurance control over US medicine delivery. 18,000 extra deaths per bad care mandated by our US system hardly would cover California let alone the whole country. It is like if the estimate of Iraqi deaths was listed as under 100,000!

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Because, my dear, you've been conditioned to bow down.
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Posted by: nzo on Sep 24, 2007 11:34 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Walt Whitman says it better than I:

To the States or any one of them, or any city of the States, Resist much, obey little,

Once unquestioning obedience, once fully enslaved,

Once fully enslaved, no nation, state, city of this earth, ever afterward resumes its liberty.

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one of 2007's 18000
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Posted by: undrgrndgirl on Sep 24, 2007 11:55 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
my fiance died in june because he was uninsured, he was 53. he didn't have insurance because his 'regular' work was outsourced and he couldn't find another 9-5 job though he never stopped looking as his unemployment benefits ran out in 2003 and he no longer was counted as one of this county's unemployed - as a musician (he was an EXCELLENT electric guitarist) he barely got paid enough to cover the cost of traveling to gigs, so obviously no insurance there....he had a heart condition and probably undiagnosed diabetes...i am a former healthcare worker who battled the insurers on behalf of the doctors i worked for and the patients we cared for (most were cancer or HIV) for many years so i am well versed in the brutality of the insurance companies...both he (my fiance) and i knew that if he was diagnosed before we could get back on typical group insurance he would have been utterly uninsurable. he was not not sick enough for ssi and medicare and we had too many assets for medicaid...so rather than go to the emergency room on father's day night, he went to sleep and didn't wake up...the medical examiner from oklahoma city opted NOT to do a full autopsy - she said he looked like he had a heart attack in his sleep...but now i wonder if she didn't do the autopsy because there was no insurance to pay for it, either...i realize his mother or i could have asked for one, but on some level it didn't matter to either of us what killed him on at the physical level (dead is dead and that can't be changed)...we know he died because he didn't have insurance - if he had had insurance he wouldn't have ignored his heart problem for so long, and i would have seen to it that he was tested for diabetes...however, as it was any diagnosis would have also sealed his fate for getting a diagnosis while not covered will certainly keep you from getting any coverage at all...it was also nearly impossible for him to get an appointment with any doctor because once you say "i don't have insurance" they won't see you without cash in full up front if they'll see you at all....oh, and before you say, why didn't you get married and put him on your insurance - its because i am a student (at the age of 43) and the "student insurance" i get is "accident and injury" insurance which means they can deny payment more easily that the group insurance most people are familiar with...the "student insurance" wouldn't have covered any of his medical problems until a full year of coverage had been met; otherwise they would have been preexisting conditions - and to meet the full year of coverage clause it means NO treatment during that year - otherwise, guess what preexisting condition......kusinich is the ONLY candidate worth voting for if you value your health and the health of those you love...sadly i was just weeks away from completing my master's degree and would have been on my way to finding a job with benefits...now i'm struggling with a broken soul and could care less about the degree...my "insurance" runs out in december.

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» RE: one of 2007's 18000 Posted by: Aussie Kim

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Yes, It Would Be Disruptive ...
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Posted by: marxalot on Sep 25, 2007 4:18 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
... to switch out to a single-payer system. Disruptive to that fat-ass elite minority who make money off their money by investing in the medical insurance industry.

Basically, everyone who argues against the switch has a vested interest in the status quo, or are one of their ditto-head minions. In other words, they are either lying, or they are too cork headed to understand their own best interest.

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Why Does Everyone Bow Down to the Health Insurance Industry?
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Posted by: wagadog on Sep 25, 2007 7:45 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Why? Because they have the power of life and death.

This is like asking Why Does Everyone Bow Down to the Man With The Guns.

The real questions are: How Do We Take This Power Away From A Moneyed Elite? How Shall We Democratically Value All Lives Equally, And Thereby Distribute This Power -- and The Responsibility That Goes With It -- Entirely Equitably?

The first step is, necessarily, to drive a populist wedge between Big Pharma and Your Elected Officials. Michael Moore's SICKO was just the thin edge of it. Keep driving!

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Target the employees
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Posted by: kindmuse on Sep 25, 2007 8:13 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Target the Employees!

The employees of the insurance companies are human after all, they have a conscious. I hope anyway, even if it's a little one. Target them just like the great unions of the early 20th century targeted big business. Just like the ongoing battle to get rid of sweat shops. Target the employees, educate them. If the health insurance companies can't find anyone to work for them, then nobody will be able to deny claims. It will be a revolution that will force health change in America. But it can only start with the people. As any true revolution does.

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Seems like a good place...
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Posted by: henderson on Sep 25, 2007 11:48 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
to post some things I've read lately...
"Humans are the only animal on earth that will follow an unstable leader" (attributed to Caesar Milan).

"Humans are the only animals on the planet who destroy the nutritional value of their food before eating it." (Mike Adams)

"Humans are the only species that kills it's own kind in the name of God." (Unknown)

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» Unstable Leaders... Posted by: Cathyc
» RE: Seems like a good place... Posted by: zalmoxis

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Dr. S.R.Keister
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Posted by: S.R.Keister on Sep 25, 2007 2:01 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We are fragmented in our opposition to the profit oriented health care industry. We need single payer, universal health care as is available in most Western Nations. Physicians For A National Health Plan; , with their 15,000 members has been advocating a rational plan for 20 years. Rather than running in all directions please familiarize yourselves with this coherent plan to provide health care to all, sans the insurance industry and speak up to the Democratic Congress to get HR 676 out of committee and to the floor. Hopefully not ALL congressmen accept baksheesh from the insurance and pharmaceutical industries.

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L-o-b-b-y
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Posted by: Bambi on Sep 25, 2007 2:08 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Big money from the Pharma Lobby for starters. Democrat whores are exactly the same as Republican whores when the chips are down.

Bambi

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» RE: L-o-b-b-y Posted by: zalmoxis

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"ONLY KUCINICH DEFIES INSURANCE INDUSTRY"
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Posted by: zalmoxis on Sep 25, 2007 8:13 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The autrhor of this article is incorrect. While it is true that Clinton & Edwards especially are shilling for the insurance industry, former Senator Mike Gravel has proposed health care vouchers useable for any service & any providers desired. He & Congressman Dennis Kucinich are the only Dem. candidates talking about health CARE rather than health INSURANCE. Please get your facts straight before lumping Gravel in with ... (this is my first post. Is it acceptable to call Clinton, Edwards, Obama, Dodd, & Richards hypocritical liars? I leave out Biden because his campaign is going nowhere in a hurry.)

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TO ANSWER THE QUESTION -
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Posted by: Constitutionalist75 on Sep 26, 2007 10:06 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"Why Does Everyone Bow Down To The Pharmaceutical Industry?" - because America has become a corporate dictatorship supported by the dictatorship of George Bush and Dick Cheney. Don't believe it? Try to get Congress to pass universal health care, and try to impeach Bush & Cheney!

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Want to side step the federal gov and develope universal health care yourself?
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Posted by: Dr A on Sep 26, 2007 12:45 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I run a blog on the daily kos and I will be getting a web page up later next month. The Germans developed their health care system by a series of towns that insured their citizens for health care. Then later these towns were linked into a national network.

Many counties have ways a citizen can initiate a bill that is then voted on by the public at a general election. Democracy in action. 75% of voters say that they want such a bill to be passed to give them universal health care without insurance hassles.

I am leading a discussion about just such a bill at:
Dr A's Blog

You can see the entire initiative and download it at:
Dr A’s Initiaive


Or you can see a short version at:
Short Version

Finally I am working on the website and hope to have it up next month at:
www.myhealthcarelaw.com

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the real problem
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Posted by: ShoShenQ on Sep 26, 2007 6:52 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Well,

The real problem, beyond Iraq, Healthcare and other areas, is how american politics are funded, its the Mother of All Sins that money has such a big say in who gets elected and who doesnt, here in Canada our politics used to be rotten by money as well, but a reform (not so long ago) kicked Big Money out of the picture by severly capping the max amount you can "donate", in fact invest in a candidate.

That and the joke of having only 2 political party to represent 300 millions americans ARE the real problem.

Fix this and the rest will follow, that's how true democracies works (notice the root demos), "businessocracies" on the other hand...well you live in one, you know better.

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Time is running out... clock is ticking
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Posted by: Bearzerker on Sep 28, 2007 3:29 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Well I guess Clinton '08 is over/done... she wont win now is my guess...
what a disaster her health care reform package is...

American Politics is dead... to the golden rule... such a shame...

sell out?... she was bought out..
enjoy your 30 pieces of silver Hilary

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Alternet Comments:

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The big difference...
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Posted by: chomsky on Sep 24, 2007 12:05 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As you said, for this battle, our leaders/politicians are not on our side...
That's the big difference!

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» I will be on your side Posted by: soulrebeljc
» Fight or flight Posted by: Cathyc
» RE: Fight or flight Posted by: LMNOP
» Failed relationships Posted by: Cathyc
» Not only... Posted by: Artkansas

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The fight between doctors and insurers.
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Posted by: Sojourner on Sep 24, 2007 12:42 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Some years back I had private insurance that refused to pay the hospital where I had surgery. It was a simple matter of the longer the insurers kept their money, the more valuable it was to them.

I was caught in the middle and continued to telephone the insurance company to follow up their neglect. A clumsy clerk gave me information to reveal that their insistence they had not received my claim form was a lie, since the information he gave me on the phone was only available to him if he had received the form.

Shortly thereafter the hospitals took the insurance company to court and forced a settlement plus penalty. I have no reason to doubt that some similar ploy to lie and cheat happens all the time. Employees lie and cheat customers regularly. That's part of what it means to be a bureaucrat in our mass society: trade in your conscience for a paycheck.

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Bow down and strap on the electrodes: it's time for a little shock therapy
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Posted by: eddie torres on Sep 24, 2007 1:24 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Ehrenreich: "What country in its right mind would pay millions of people to deny other people health care?"

The same country that pays millions of farmers to grow crops along 1930s federal food bureaucracy guidelines.

300 million Americans in a utopian single-payer US healthcare system are suddenly able to quit their miserable underpaid jobs because they no longer fear losing benefits?

Holy crap, Batman. That's what Wall Street calls "a revolution." Let's gently lobotmize that notion straight out of your head...

OJ's back! And now he's even more guilty!

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I couldn't care less what happens to 2-3 soulless insurance industry functionaries.
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Posted by: darkenergy on Sep 24, 2007 1:53 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
They could build shanty towns after receiving foreclosure notices. They could look for work at Wal-Mart and other fine box stores. They've been bankrupting people for years by turning down insurance claims that should have been paid by the company.

As a little note:

Think of the damage. An estimated 18,000 Americans die every year because they can’t afford or can’t qualify for health insurance. That’s the 9/11 carnage multiplied by three -- every year.

That's six times as many who died in the 9/11 events.

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Shooting hoops.
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Posted by: morningstar1972 on Sep 24, 2007 3:25 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Actually, I think Hillary is on the right track. I read her reforms yesterday, and I actually like it. I have to say I was skeptical at first, and really scared what she was going to propose, but let's see if I can get it all in a nutshell.
Those with healthcare coverages they like, can keep it. the rest of America without health coverage get the same benefits of congress, and those who wish to switch their coverage to that which congress gets are entitled.
She also has a plan for coverage. it will be working closely to those refund checks we enjoy every year (I don't because I always owe) to ensure every American has proper health coverage.
Even the American Cancer Society is promoting healthcare! I think it is great!
This isn't something to just "blow off" this is going to require some thinking. and, you are going to have to think of others as well, because this concerns all of us.

I was skeptical about all of these "healthcare reforms" but you know what? If I have to work in another hospital that denies service to a child, or an elderly person again, just because some idiot insurer turned them down, I am going to vomit.
sometimes you just need to see it for yourself to believe it!
and, don't put a price on human life. we all deserve to live.
(even those selfish people!)

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» RE: Shooting hoops. Posted by: oregonox
» Doesn't address the waste Posted by: notinKansas
» RE: Shooting hoops. Posted by: Bayardtom
» RE: Shooting hoops. Posted by: Dr. Colvin
» RE: Shooting hoops. Posted by: oldumbo

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Follow the money
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Posted by: jlohman on Sep 24, 2007 3:43 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The answer is rather simple. Follow the money!!!

See HillaryCare2.0 is the symptom of a major disease

Hillary is no better than the rest. They all prostitute themselves for campaign money.

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The Authoritarians
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Posted by: shangrilalad on Sep 24, 2007 3:42 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Authoritarians
Link via Goggle.
By Bob Altemeyer


This is a book based on a psychological study of the authoritarian personality. You can read the whole book online for free, thanks to the author. Authoritarians ignore or attack this book, but the truths presented are self-evident. I found it fascinating.


.

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» RE: The Authoritarians Posted by: VannaLaRoche
» RE: The Authoritarians Posted by: Urgelt
» RE: Worth a read Posted by: rfrancis@godisdead.com

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my friend died on August 23rd, a victim of the health insurance industry
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Posted by: Suzon on Sep 24, 2007 4:22 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It makes the issue very personal. My deepest grief is that she lived with multiple disabilities after a massive heart attack nine years ago, with Big Pharma using her as a cash cow.

My late husband's employer pays an insurer for a policy I will never need as I live in the UK and would simply buy travel insurance with medical coverage should I return for a visit.

I have often thought of telling the employer to drop the insurance but I have the feeling that it would only inspire the company to greater efforts to deny health care to those in genuine need.

Governments have been turning our lives over to corporations for the last 30 or so years. Limit campaign spending by offering candidates two free broadcasts and prohibit all other spending in the year prior to the election.

Then the government might be run with the interests of the public in mind.

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To answer the question "Why Does Everyone Bow Down to the Health Insurance Industry?"
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Posted by: ~Fiona~ on Sep 24, 2007 4:56 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
For the same reason people in one-sided relationship bow down, give head, bend over, etc do it... To get what they want... Politicians are the largest group of overpaid prostitutes in the world... THATS why they DO it!

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» Pimps and Prostitutes Posted by: Cathyc

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Reform in the long-term maybe
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Posted by: cinattra on Sep 24, 2007 5:02 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I would think that the rest of the business world would loathe the health insurance industry as an expense they would love to get rid. The reason that businesses don't have a problem with health insurance is that they by law they don't have to have it. So when businesses get to a point where the cost of health insurance is too much for them they just dump their plans all together.

Right now health insurance is a recruiting tool. Take that away and now I've got to find other ways to attract top talent. The cost of health insurance is nothing for the top businesses. For those businesses with smaller margins the cost of their services and products will have to go up to cover the added cost especially if they don't offer health insurance now.

In the future if health insurance becomes mandatory for businesses to offer I'm thinking then you may then start to see a true reform. That is an expense to business before the product is even dealt with. That can become a no-no where business competes on a global scale and not with just the guy down the street.

I'm not confident anyone's plan will slow the rising cost of health insurance. Looks like to me with any mandatory approach we are only feeding the fire.

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Why won't liberals vote Kucinich?
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Posted by: peacelf on Sep 24, 2007 5:21 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Come hell or high water, I'm voting for Kucinich or the Green Party candidate because of this one issue that Barbara Eirenrich is correct to spotlight as politicans' greatest fear: health insurance.

First, let's be honest: we don't have a health CARE system; we have a health insurance industry. There is no "care" in health services in america. And, with that many people dying because of health insurance rejections or lack or adequate affordable medical insurance coverage, then we have a crisis that the tyranical majority (who have health insurance) refuse to address.

But, if voting percentages are correct, candidates like Kucinich don't have a chance because, just as our Democratic candidates are weak or afraid to take on the health insurance industry, so are the "liberals" weak and afraid to take on the political party candidates by voting their consciences rather than the lesser of two evils.

Look, I'm not taunting liberals or progressives to get them to vote for Kucinich,but this problem with voting against one's interests has got to be addressed. I have heard liberals themselves explain how the media manipulates our choices, how big business manipulates our choices, how campaign finance manipulates our choices. If we know the rich and powerful are forcing cards on us, why don't liberals pick a different card?

If all the liberals and progressives voted their consciences, rather than the media-manipulated "popular" candidates, then we would make a statement that would reverberate throughout the DNC. They would have to take notice if 1/3 or 1/2 of Dem voters voted for a Kucinich.

It takes great strength of character to vote for a "fringe" candidate, the same strength it took blacks in the civil rights movement, except the only people getting hurt in the struggle are the uninsured. And, they already are hurting. But, they'd hurt less if they thought the party that's supposed to care for them was trying to change things.

peace

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» RE: Why won't liberals vote Kucinich? Posted by: racetoinfinity
» RE: Why won't liberals vote Kucinich? Posted by: nellie blogger
» Circular Reasoning Posted by: pdxstudent
» INTEGRITY ... Posted by: Cathyc
» RE: So peacelf, Posted by: peacelf

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Let's see who's bought and paid for
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Posted by: MrX on Sep 24, 2007 6:00 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
http://www.michaelmoore.com/sicko/sickos-for-sale
/candidates/

I did a Google search on Ron Paul and Health Care and came up with this http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul339.html

In Sicko Michael Moore explains how Nixon created the HMO system. Ron Paul wants to undo that law from the looks of it.

What's more important is he wants to stop the US from policing the world. Health care is important, but hundreds of thousands of people are dying in Iraq. The US has been involved in one skirmish after the other for the past 50 years. Watch "Why We Fight" We need to try to stop the US Military Industrial Complex.

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» RE: on Paul is not the answer Posted by: rfrancis@godisdead.com

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Bottom Feeders
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Posted by: fredwahl on Sep 24, 2007 6:04 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Employees, people who follow orders to deny claims, are no better than thieves, in fact their worse.
A former friend of mine changed careers, she is in the insurance industry, she denies claims and benefits for a living, she has been programed to think of customers as leeches, scum-bags, cheats.
Guess where she got the money to go to school for her new career, a auto collision, large settlement, hasn't seen a Dr. since.
These people have nothing to be afraid of, no personal accountability.
If by some chance some of them were to have an accident they might change there ways.

Names, addresses, and phone numbers published made members of congress afraid and change their vote on immigration.

It's an individual act, what do you have to lose, you lone nuts out there, does your life have any purpose?

How many lives of "leeches" have been ruined so an employee can have a nicer car, a better couch,just following orders.

Fred

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» RE: Bottom Feeders Posted by: bkvwd57

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As a doctor...
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Posted by: PJAW on Sep 24, 2007 6:17 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
this is a subject that I deal with on a daily basis. I've investigated the mechanics of it fairly extensively and everything that the author says is true, plus more. The average person has no concept whatsoever just how evil this system has become. For example, did you know that insurance companies are specifically exempted from anti-trust laws, in all 50 states?

Several years ago, I devised a plan that I called "managed profits" (as a response to "managed care"). My thought was, develop a large pool of insurance purchasers (via the internet), and negotiate a contract with the insurance industry. I would approach them with a proposal along these lines, "I have x number of subscribers representing y number of premium dollars and we would like to purchase a group insurance plan, but with a set administrative fee and specified broad coverage". Turns out that's illegal. You are not allowed to form a group for the specific purpose of buying insurance.

Yes folks, they've covered all the bases, and they've been working for decades to accomplish this. They, like a few other industries (pharmaceuticals and military contractors to name a couple) have been busy for a long time, buying legislators and creating the legal context in which they will enrich themselves beyond all precedent. They have even developed a totally complicit media through which they disseminate the lie that they care about you and are working diligently in your best interests. And of course this media denigrates and marginalizes any candidate who represents real change. Not necessarily because they personally believe what they are saying, but because they are rewarded for being complicit and punished for speaking the truth (Dan Rather anyone?)

The solution? Independent thought and action by the voters is the best hope short of violence. Are there enough of us to pull it off despite the dumbing down we've been subjected to. We'll see, "Americans" have surprised the world in the past. I'm a Kucinich supporter myself.

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» RE: As a doctor... Posted by: djnoll
» RE: As a doctor... Posted by: photon's feather
» Independent thinking.... Posted by: Cathyc

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Not just health insurance all insurance
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Posted by: bkvwd57 on Sep 24, 2007 6:33 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This is not just health insurance that is a raging monster. I have a friend with a son that has a disability. She works in the schoold cafeteria so she doesn't work when he's not in school. Now because she has poor credit her homeowners insurance is being raised even though she has had them for 6 years now and has never been late on a payment, her insurance is escrowed.

The whole insurance industry is is bad. People with poor credit have to pay higher premiums, auto, home etc because they might do something to cause a claim because they need the money. Our politicians have allowed these companies to all insurance companies to decide that poor people don't deserve any breaks for anything. Poor people are bad apparently. My son went to try and get auto insurance on his own and Progressive wanted $1800 for 6 months up front because he had no credit history. This is an 18 year kid just starting out with liability only and a clean driving record.

Another friend had to have a double bypas and she has short term disability insurance but because she didn't have a heart attack before the surgery the insurance company would not pay her claim. What the hell is the insurance for?

I think all insurance is the biggest scam in the US. I have disability insurance on our truck That I paid for every month so if I became disabled it would pay the payments for me. I had a stroke last March and I can't get a Dr. to sign the paperwork for me and the insurance company won't accept my medical records as evidence of disability. So $500 per is not being paid and I have no job now, we are about to lose our truck.

They are all cheats and liars and scam artists and our government lets thm do this.

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» Blame the lawyers Posted by: gellero

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From reading Krugman and Dean Baker
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Posted by: chaoslegs on Sep 24, 2007 6:53 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
They are very supportive of Edwards plan. The concept is that people can buy into government insurance. Government insurance will compete with the other private plans. Over time, people (and probably employers first) will realize the government plan is cheaper and it will grow while the others dwindle.

It will be government insurance be free market, so take that Cato and Heritage.

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» RE: From reading Krugman and Dean Baker Posted by: oregonscribbler

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Undermining the insurance industry
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Posted by: tomkara on Sep 24, 2007 6:57 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Unless the American people surprise us (miracle would be a better word) and vote in a large majority endorsed by groups like MoveOn, there won't be votes for a single payer system. The people keep more than enough retrograde politicians in office. Education (like sending this article to as many people you know, especially your right wing or middle of the road friends and family) may help, but as a political strategy, the current Democratic health care proposals may have some merit. First, get everyone insured. Next, offer them as one option access to government regulated programs like FEHBA and Medicare if they choose. Next, allow (as the doctor above mentions) people to form private insurance pools if they choose and also give incentives to nonprofits. Also, attempt more regulation of the for-profit industry, like forbidding refusal for pre-existing conditions etc. Since for-profits won't be able to compete with non-profits, we should hopefully see people chosing cheaper and better nonprofit options. And eventually we should see the insurance industry collapse. It may even be a better course, because I don't know what liability the nation would bear if we had to give the insurance industry a "buy out" under due process if they were suddenly made illegal. Of course this is only a hopeful scenario. The people have become so deluded lately, I don't know if even modest reform is possible.

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A tough decision that leaves me torn
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Posted by: rfrancis@godisdead.com on Sep 24, 2007 7:01 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
On the one hand I think government run healthcare would significantly boost the health of the average American and significantly lower costs.

On the other hand I don't think its right that nurses and doctors would be forced to work for the government with pay stipulated by the government. I believe they should have the right to decide for themselves what they want to charge for their services. As a libertarian, the idea of forcing doctors to work for the government does not sit well with me at all.

John Stossel recently had a piece on 20/20 suggesting that one way healthcare costs could be reduced is if every doctor was required to list their prices for different procedures.

That way everyone would know how much they charged and most would seek out the cheaper doctors thereby encouraging the more expensive doctors to lower their prices in order to compete for business.

Perhaps the government could pay for doctor and nursing education in exchange for those doctors and nurses working in government hospitals and practices.

Perhaps some sort of wholesale discount pricing for all consumer goods could be given to doctors and nurses who work at government hospitals and practices.

I have to think there is some solution available other than forcing by penalty of law, resulting in fines and jail, to encourage doctors and nurses to work for government health facilities rather than private ones.

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» Two Unassailable Observations Posted by: pdxstudent
» RE: Two Unassailable Observations Posted by: rfrancis@godisdead.com
» Guilty of Malpractice?? Posted by: gellero
» RE: A tough decision that leaves me torn Posted by: rfrancis@godisdead.com

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Exactly
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Posted by: argyle on Sep 24, 2007 7:20 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The problem isn't that 47 million Americans don't have health insurance. That's the result of the problem. The problem is that access to health care is a basic right and we treat it as a commodity.

If we decided, as a people, to commonly fund a well-audited professionally run health care system that didn't have to compete to cut costs, yet was overseen by a small army of fervent auditors, we could actually save money. Yes people will be temporarily out of work. But the overall value added to the economy by the decrease in spending (that money doesn't disappear) on inefficient private health care companies would provide an enormous economic stimulus.

The literal Elephant in the room is that not only would a commonly funded non-market driven health care system provide what in any basic definition of ethics has to be a universal human right: It would save us money while allowing us to pay workers that actually provide services to patients better, and instantly flood the market with available capital without inflation.

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» RE: xactly Posted by: DrKen

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Hillary, Rudy both whores, one looks better in a dress though..
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Posted by: TJ-stars4peace on Sep 24, 2007 7:22 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
All of our main politicians are sold out lying whores..!

The bankers and Insurance companies are thieving corporate fascists..!

We the People..have been betrayed by both parties..!


Hillary, Rudy, who cares they're both lying whores..one does look better in a dress than the other though, but still whores all the same..!



That's a keeper..!

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Wrong Wrong Wrong
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Posted by: nikkie on Sep 24, 2007 7:33 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As long as you remain so completely ignorant about the natural order of the universe and the perfection that is the human body you are doomed to enslave yourself regardless of who the players are.

You want health insurance? Begin educating yourself outside the box that you've allowed yourself to be put in. There is a path that will lead you to your highest and healthiest existence but you won't find it unless you are willing to shed the "beliefs" that you've been taught starting before the age of reason. As with the spiritual, "lest all your flowers die and you are born again you will not enter the kingdom", so it is true also in the physical as both respond to the same “cure.” You must empty the mind for it is full of poison in the form of conditioned belief. You must empty the body for it is full of poison in the form of conditioned response.

Understand that the human body is not the decrepit genetically deficient errant lump of hopeless flesh that increasingly you are being asked to believe. Yet the human race is dying at an exponential rate and indeed it shows all the markers of a species in decline. The easiest way to measure this truth is to rearrange your thinking so that you view your existence through the existence of your host in this universe; the blessed Mother Earth where you are provided an existence bounded by natural laws. Two things happen when you exceed these natural laws; your environment suffers and so does your health. The two are reflections of each other. The axiom is thus “that which is good for the planet is good for you and that which is bad for you is bad for the planet, and visa versa.”

Now look around you and see what is killing the health of the environment and you can easily see what is making you ill. The primary cause of all degenerative conditions of the human species is the over consumption of animal products. Likewise, the single greatest sector contributing to the demise of the environment is the over production of animal products for human consumption. It’s no wonder if you don’t already know both of these facts as they are concealed by those who benefit from a diseased species that has been taught to gorge itself on excess. Think about it and you’ll realize how large the opposition to your health is. It includes agriculture, food production, food service and the entire medical industry for starters.

Have you not been cultured into the very farm animal you consume without regard? Have you not been corralled and fattened, and made lazy and dependent? Have you not been made less adaptable to your environment where you burn easily in the sun and find fault with nature and the human body? Are you not rewarding a medical system for failure instead of success?

There is a way out of this maze but it does not involve any solution provided from the top down, which is only more manipulation. The way out is from the ground up. Get as close to nature as you can. Insist on organic out of PRINCIPLE and you’ll see magjc begin to happen in your life. Ask yourself how an elephant can grow into such a mass of muscle and bone without eating flesh. Ask yourself which course is healthier for the planet and your body: to consume a pound of flesh in one day knowing it took forty pounds of grain to produce, or to consume forty pounds of grain over six months as a staple? Can you see the waste and the excess? Can you see the cost benefit?

There are many cultures outside the corral of disinformation that still practice “backward” methods of sustenance where the incidence of degenerative disease is almost non-existent by comparison. No, it’s not natural for women to get osteoporosis. It’s a disease of women who have been poisoned.

Begin by reading George Oshawa from the beginning and you’ll find yourself unplugging and showered with rays of healing and hope.

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» RE: Wrong Wrong Wrong Posted by: Shehova
» RE: Wrong Wrong Wrong Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: Wrong Wrong Wrong Posted by: nltrihey

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New Mexico Health Security Act
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Posted by: soulrebeljc on Sep 24, 2007 7:37 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Here in New Mexico, we have an opportunity to get private insurance OUT of the health care system once and for all. The Health Security Act, reviewed by Governor Bill Richardson's Health Care Task Force (along with 2 other proposals which keep private pay insurance) was shown to be the most cost effective program, saving New Mexico 300-400 million a year AND everyone is covered. Everyone. Of course Bill Richardson has said that the private insurance companies will have the dominant role in NM health care reform. Look to the money, and we find that Richardson's greatest business sector donors are "Finance, Insurance, and Real Estate" - over twice as much, almost 3 million towards his 2006 Governor's race, as the next largest business sector donor.

Citizens of New Mexico must lobby the state legislature hard so that a small group of democrats such as Jerry Ortiz y Pino and Dede Feldman recognize that We the People want full health care that isn't steered by corporate profits. Private insurance has NO INHERENT RIGHT to play a role in health care, especially given how badly they have screwed things up so far.

I have made health care reform one of the primary platform issues of my campaign for First District Representative in New Mexico. I also support Dennis Kucinich for president and his HONEST and OPEN assessment of the health care system and necessary reforms. Single payer NOW.

Jason Call
www.Call4Democracy.org
Albuquerque, NM

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Vote for Dennis Kucinich
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Posted by: mel on Sep 24, 2007 7:39 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Great article, thank you!
Is there a conspiracy by AARP & corporate news to ignore Dennis Kucinich? Why wasn't he on the PBS/AARP debate about health care since he is the ONLY candidate who has an actual plan? There are more of us than them (Bush's friends).
Some Democrats are selling out but Dennis Kucinich is brave enough and honest enough to stand up to the insurance companies. He'll also get us out of this ridiculous war.

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» RE: Vote for Dennis Kucinich Posted by: sausage

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TAKE THE FIGHT WHERE IT BELONGS
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Posted by: VZEQICVA on Sep 24, 2007 7:49 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
With the Insurance cos. Between Edwards and Clinton there's a plan that will work. Too many people forget that there was a time in this country when getting sick was not a federal case and people rich and poor got the care they needed. Medication was affordabel. No it was not the dark ages. The biggest lie is about the "choices' people have. It's the insurance co. that have choices. They are NOT entitled to ongoing double digit profits. They have some respsonsibility to the insured. Thanks, ANNA

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The Power of Guilt
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Posted by: Gravitas on Sep 24, 2007 8:08 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Why does everyone cower in the face of the health care industry? How did the Church get away with sexually abusing children for centuries? The answer is rule by guilt. When someone is effective in making us feel guilty, it can politically and emotionally disable us. Our own shame induced myopia keeps us focused on our "sins" so we are completely blind to the motives of those who would exploit us. In our society, health is a moral issue that racks us with guilt. The media has been so completely successful with its propaganda that ill health is our own fault, we never think of environmental factors. And we don't demand a better system cause we are bringing on our poor health ourselves. This is particularly true with the scapegoating of obesity for almost every major ill there is. But it applies to all lifestyle factors. Sadly, while progressives have recognized many other manipulative tools of oppression, they have taken to heart the morality over health and fitness. As long as health remains equated with guilt, shame, and finger pointing, people will feel too disempowered to fight the system in any meaningful way!

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Perception vs. reality
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Posted by: willymack on Sep 24, 2007 8:18 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Why are insurance and drug companies seemingly invincible? You don't really have to strain the ol' brain cells to answer that one yourself. As with the oil & coal industries, Big Pharma & Big Insurance have most of congress on their payroll. This is minor compared to the war profiteers and the manufactors of war implements and munitions. Congress would rather go through the motions of protecting us from the very scoundrels whose arses they're kissing than actually doing their jobs. It's more profitable that way, and it doesn't take a lot of morals, ethics, and other unprofitable character traits to do what they do. Far too many of us would rather believe that our "leaders" are all sterling characters with our best interests in mind, when in fact, they're greedy lowlifes who should never have been elected in the first place. Money is power in this country. It trumps and negates everything based on honesty, decency, and fair play, and as long as that stays the same, don't expect any knights in shining armor to come to our rescue.

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America's failed Health care Delivery System
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Posted by: viswanat on Sep 24, 2007 8:23 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Our govt. unlike those of democracies in Europe is failing to provide what those countries are to their people because we have lost sight of controls on free enterprise and capitalism. The latter have been allowed to go wild and greed has replaced good sound business ethics.
As for facing down Nazism etc. that cannot compare with solving domestic problems. If there is anything we have been able to do is that we can mount massive wars but that never has solved any problem. Good luck to the people who have to reveive health care and that is all of us.

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More criminal than the Bushes and the Mob together
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Posted by: jeffrey7 on Sep 24, 2007 8:28 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Insurance is a racket. Has been ever since they sold 'comet insurance in the beginning of the 20th century when haley's comet came around. They proved they were even more criminal after 9/11 when they needed the gov't to bail them out of haveing to honor the claims by their insured. They did the same dance aftetr Katrina. Far too many folks got reamed because they had loopholes in their policies they did'nt know existed.
The insurance companies only want themselves in 'good hands'. You pay outragous premiums to get pittance, or worse
be dropped as soon as you file a claim. All the while the insurance company executives ride around in expensive cars
wear $2000 suits,and act like demigods of healthcare.
At the P.O.T. Party we contend to put Fedreal Health insurance in direct compition with them. It works like this....
Everyone would pay $10/month to be on the program, with $3 co-pay for all office calls and perscriptions plus Lab works.
This would cover all aliments,even catastrophic ones. The major support for the program would come from a 40% reduction in defense spending. No person would be refused for perexisting conditions,age or race. Nor would income be a barrier. The homeless could get the same care as everyone else by simply picking up litter for a couple of hours a day.
We'd have cleaner cities and the healthcare system truly would include everyone.
I think we're all pretty sick of having our money stolen by insurance companies for sub-human health treatment,to be forced out of a hospital barely healed up,to be told our insurance won't pay for most of the bills. These companies are criminal!!! Their business model is criminal!! They need to be shut down as racketeers.
So what kind of healthcare system do you want? One that rips you off and forces you to pay more or the one offered by the P.O.T. Party? We are the People Over Tyrants Party and the health insurance is just one aspect of this tyranny.
It's time to think outside the system
Draft Jeffrey7 for Prez '08

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Simple question on health care for all the presidential candidates
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Posted by: sausage on Sep 24, 2007 9:03 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Why is a private bureaucracy (or private insurance company), which is answerable only to its major shareholders, better (or preferable) than a governmental bureaucracy (or single-payer healthcare system), which, if the government is properly functioning, is accountable to the voting public?

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» What Government? Posted by: Cathyc

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Clinton Sucker-Punch to the Insurance Industry?
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Posted by: Urgelt on Sep 24, 2007 9:22 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Romney himselfpioneered a state plan similar to Hillary-Care. What's his objection to Clinton's approach? Why does he turn purple in the face just thinking about it?

The option to choose state-run health insurance. That scares the bejesus out of Republicans.

State-run policies like Medicare or the VA expend around 3% of premiums on administrative overhead. For the insurance industry it's around 15-30% for most insurers.

If Clinton delivers, private insurers will be required to compete with government insurance programs. With their complicated schemes for wringing profit out of policy-holders and higher overhead costs (15-30%, compared to around 3% for state-run policies), it's not clear to me that the insurance industry will be able to survive under Hillary-Care.

Is Clinton for real?

The Clintons are famously pro-business. Will that provision of her health care plan survive if she's elected? Or is that a sop to the Democratic base to keep them in line until after the election?

I don't know.

Kucinich is indeed the only candidate who says the right things on health insurance. I don't feel inclined to bet on Clinton's sincerity. But if she is sincere, her plan might have the same effect in the long run. If private insurers melt away under the competition, it's just a short jump to taking employers out of the picture and creating a single-payer system.

Plausible? I don't know.

This is a really wierd election. The Republicans have only one marginalized candidate who speaks to traditional Republican values - Ron Paul. The Democrats have only one marginalized candidate who speaks to traditional Democratic values - Dennis Kucinich. The poll-leaders are all pro-business talk-tough-on-foreign-policy image meisters with ties to corporate power and special interests. Both parties have been hijacked from their bases.

The liberal base is expected by the Clinton camp to peer through the haze of her rhetoric and somehow intuit that they'll like the result of her policies in the long run. According to the polls, they're doing it, too - rejecting the plain-spoken Kucinich for the over-complicated say-one-thing-and-mean-another Clinton.

Sometimes I wonder if Romney and the other Republicans are flaming Hillary just to lend her more credibility with the Democratic base. Hey, if Mitt hates her, she must be ok! Every time the Republicans attack her, she gains a few points in the polls. It all seems so orchestrated.

If that's really the case, then you can forget about Hillary-Care as she currently explains it. After the election, it'll be "negotiated" to a "compromise" which leaves social health insurance out of the mix. A Romney-style mandate will require poor people to pony-up or be branded un-American. Private health insurers will lock in ever-bigger profits. Health care costs will keep rising like a rocket.

Are we being played? Or is Clinton sincere? I wish I knew.

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health insurance industry
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Posted by: llyon0815 on Sep 24, 2007 10:02 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Thirty years ago the steel and auto industries that were both very "big" experienced a precipitous loss of employment because they elected not to adapt their management and production practices to deal effectively with prevailing economic conditions. Those industries found ways to adapt and their former employees eventually did as well. The health insurance industry is not particularly different - except maybe in that the steel and auto industries actually PRODUCED something. The companies and individual people impacted by the restructuring of the insurance industry in such a way as to support everyone effectively in retaining and regaining their health will eventually find a way to deal with it.

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Politicians (Who are Mostly Lawyers) Are Risk Adverse
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Posted by: drricklippin on Sep 24, 2007 10:32 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Barbara-

Thanks for your bold statement. Besides the lobbying dollars from the Insurance companies, lawyers, who comprise most of our politicians, are risk adverse by temperment. Insurance companies thrive on risk adverse people.

I am for single payer with much more emphasis on prevention- both individual (health behaviors) and institutional(public health). Prevention is our and other nations only way out of this economically unsustainable mess.

I write about this extensively on my blog

Be Well,

Dr. Rick Lippin
http://medicalcrises.blogspot.com

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» RE: PREVENTION Posted by: Cathyc
» RE: PREVENTION=GLAD YOU AGREE Posted by: drricklippin
» RE: PREVENTION LOL Posted by: gellero

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I TOLD you they would try to change the subject!
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Posted by: Ms. DuFontagne on Sep 24, 2007 10:33 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Keep reminding your representatives and the pres. candidates every chance you get - it's universal health CARE that we need, not universal INSURANCE. Let them know that you know the difference!

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Insurance scams
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Posted by: Maryanne on Sep 24, 2007 11:29 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We are among those who pay exorbitant rates for medical insurance, the monthly rate going up dramatically each year, while coverage is being cut and inefficiency has increased in reimbusements.

Bad as this is, there was an event that made our TV news recently. The car of a woman, who carries medical isurance, was hit head on, with the result that she was rendered unconscious, and was still woozy when the ambulance arrived to take her to the hospital. Although she had ambulance coverage, payment was rejected by the insurance company since she DID NOT GET PRIOR AUTHORIZATION TO USE THIS SERVICE. She is appealing.

It is way past time that we had universal medical coverage with ONE payer- just extend Medicare. We will be glad to continue paying what we do now, if we could get services paid for (no deductibles, co-pays, etc.) without the hastle we now encounter.

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» RE: Insurance scams Posted by: Nasookin
» Accident-free America? Posted by: Cathyc

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great article
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Posted by: allyourbasearebelongtous on Sep 24, 2007 11:48 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I'm a psychotherapist in private practice. All of the problems with getting paid by insurance companies that have been referred to by other professionals in this thread are true and sometimes it's even worse. A major insurance company where I am located has cut reimbursement by 20% and seems to have gotten away with it even though the governor of our state has expressed his displeasure with it. It is illegal for us to organize either to fight it or to negotiate with them. We are waiting to see how long it is going to take for the other insurance companies to cut rates too. Of course there will be a denial that there was ever any collusion on their part to do this and they will get by with it. I like what I do for a living but I am looking for other income streams and will cut back my practice after those income streams are in place and bringing in money. I suspect that other providers like me with lots of training and many years of experience will do the same as they are able to. This means that over time people in my part of the country increasingly will be getting their mental health care from less able, less experienced providers who think that the reimbursement level is okay because they have no standard for comparison. Unfortunately, psychotherapy is a profession that requires years of training, supervision and experience to do it well. To give you a comparison, people in private practice in 1990 were asking and getting insurance reimbursement for psychotherapy that was nearly twice what it is now. If you see a therapist in a solo private practice, you have probably noticed that that therapist has no office staff because reimbursement is now so low that he or she can't even afford to hire a receptionist.

The problem is the big insurance companies and big pharma. That's where your health care dollar is going.

I used to work for insurance companies back when they had their own private clinics. In 1994, the increase in compensation for the head of the mental health part of the insurance company I worked for (not the overall company CEO) was 10 times what my wife and I made together that year. Now this wasn't the person's entire compensation package for the year -- just the increase in the compensation package from the previous year. Later that year, I had the privilege of meeting that person and, well, I was not impressed. I had to wonder how that individual managed to get into that situation.

That was just a personal anecdote but the point is that, like the other corporate bureaucracies, a few people at the very top are making all the money while the rest of the people in the bureacracies are going along with it out of fear and out of a mistaken belief that they could be one of those people too. If you work for a large corporation, you have have about as much chance of being one of the folks at the top making all the money as the average street hoops shooter has of being an NBA star or the average musician has of being a music superstar.

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Vote
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Posted by: allyourbasearebelongtous on Sep 24, 2007 11:51 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
So the point is, vote for whoever the democrats nominate because that is the only way this issue is going to get addressed at all. if you vote third party or don't vote and of the repugs gets in, you can bet it'll be another 4 to 8 years before this gets done at all -- totally aside from whether it would get done in the way that you personally think is best by whatever democrat gets the nomination.

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Here's why you gutless, spineless cowards!!!
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Posted by: MAD on Sep 24, 2007 12:34 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"After facing down the Third Reich, the Japanese Empire, the U.S.S.R., Saddam Hussein, the United States has met an enemy it dares not confront -- the American private health insurance industry."

Well, first off, let's set the historical record straight. We faced down the Third Reich ONLY after the Bush family assisted them in their efforts to overrun Europe, Africa and the Middle East, and when it appeared likely that it could end up being profitable. I also think it's worth mentioning that Americans weren't nearly the brainwashed, cowardly, complacent and ignorant fucks they are today. Hollywood and the MSM weren't the masters of the universe they are today, and therefore, American heads weren't buried quite so far up their asses.

Yeah, we sure faced down the Japanese, or rather, Fat Man & Little Boy faced them down for us.

The equally demented, bellicose and imperialistic USSR was simply bankrupted by that "all-American hero" of neo-con lore, Ronald Reagan! His nitwit, pie in the sky fantasies like SDI were not courageous nor were they ingenious, and furthermore, didn't require anything exceptional of the American people other than allowing a B-grade actor to spend us into an unprecedented debt through building the Death Star.

Saddam Hussein? Do we really need to go into that? Didn't think so.

Now, as to the matter of why Americans are afraid to stand up to the Insurance companies . . . It's really quite simple: Americans are cowardly, self-absorbed assholes. The majority of Americans are insured and couldn't care less if the 50 million who go without die miserable deaths. I don't want to hear any discussion about this either. You all know damn good and well that the VAST majority of Americans have no vested interest in seeing others with health insurance. Most don't give a shit until they get canned and then it's all "poor me - why doesn't this greedy, corptocracy take care of me and my family?"

This country has always been about "getting yours" and that won't change in the foreseeable future. The insurance companies are merely a reflection of this greedy, self-serving attitude so pervasive in our society. Why do we insist on blaming them? We blame mortgage companies, Big Med, Big Defense et al rather than look inwards, placing the blame exactly where it belongs: with us.

We continue to let them run roughshod over us with little or no complaint. We let the gentle glow of the TV wash over us while we relax on the La-Z-Boy, fixated on Brangelina and Britney. The blame lies with us and us alone. We have the power to change the system yet we continue to elect corporate whores for politicians. The number of you idiots who continue to support the Dems is UN-FUCKING-BELIEVABLE!!!

Do you really think they're going to change things? Take a long, hard look at Hillary. I think Edwards is a twit and liar but he hit the nail on the head when, in a recent debate, he referred to her complete reversal of attitude regarding big Insurance thusly: "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em". You are all desperately opposed to the war but are so quick to forget that the bitch voted for it!!!! God, Americans are soooooo stupid. Many of you believe that Edwards may be the answer. That asshole voted for the war as well, no?. The people who didn't vote for it are lagging in the polls and are deemed completely unelectable by an MSM that you turkeys allow to rule the roost.

God forbid you idiots think about voting for a third party. You'll rush out and vote for Hillary and be right back here in 2 years, whining and crying when she doesn't accomplish shit, and *gasp* turns out to be an incredible corporate whore!!

I've said it before. I'll say it again. American deserves everything it gets!

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» A bit sweeping... Posted by: mjabele

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vote for democrats ?
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Posted by: ShoShenQ on Sep 24, 2007 12:51 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Vote for democracts, but dont vote for Hillary Clinton, you know the one who gets millions from the Health Insurance companies ?

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» RE: mick3 Posted by: skydog

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Health Care Revolution
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Posted by: Dr. Colvin on Sep 24, 2007 1:25 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
You're right!

Where do we sign up to join the revolutionary forces? How do we get a hold of a tactic that will work?

How about this one. Since the greatest power that the insurance industry has is our money in their pockets, why not stop paying them? I'll take in one further, since they make the most money on generally healthy people who are between the ages of 25 to 35 why not encourage this specific group of people to drop their insurance policies. According to our preident they could just go to the emergency room if they needed to.

Imagine how it would effect the insurance industry if all of their profitable insured left, leaving only those who drain their coffers. We need to be much more subversive.

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» RE: Health Care Revolution Posted by: VZEQICVA
» Healthy People Posted by: Cathyc

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Why does America let itself be fooled by the insurance companies?
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Posted by: freedom38 on Sep 24, 2007 1:37 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The people are not fooled, but here's why the American government is: too much lobbying and bribing by health insurance companies. It's time for some serious counter-lobbying by the American public. The government was created for the people, not for corporate interest!

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IF you're worried about health care, then I think you ought to be VERY WORRIED about CODEX!
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Posted by: wireup on Sep 24, 2007 1:58 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What is Codex?

Do you take food supplements? Under Codex the dosages will be so low there will be little point in taking them.

Codex, an ally of Big Pharma, will wipe out alternative health. Health food stores will close.

There will be no more organic food.

All food animals will be given synthetic hormones and antibiotics.

Genetically modified food will not be labeled.

Freedom of choice in health will be a thing of the past.

If you want to know more about this Nazi "health care" read this from the natural solutions website:

Summary
http://www.healthfreedomusa.org/index.php?page_id=157

And then go here to watch a 45-minute video all about Codex:

http://www.healthfreedomusa.org/index.php

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Why...
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Posted by: Knobby on Sep 24, 2007 2:15 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
have we become so dependent on not only Health Care but on Insurance companies?
If you answer that question correctlly you will have the answer to why we are in the mess we're in today...

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» RE: Why... Posted by: Trazom

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This just in: An AlterNet writer actually SUPPORTS KUCINICH
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Posted by: Flora Gael on Sep 24, 2007 2:27 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Barbara Enreich, I love you. Always have. Well, not always. But lately. I discovered you only a couple of years ago. B ut anyway. The point is, you rule! Excellent article. I envy you and your talents. Anytime you want to write for my magazine, go for it:

www.clockwisecat.blogspot.com

Love,

Moi

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hardparts
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Posted by: hardparts on Sep 24, 2007 3:35 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It seems that all the candidates are willing to discuss, is health care for the uninsured, or at least uninsured children. Will they make sure these people they are going to cover get a health care package equal to the health care coverage they have themselves? After all, the government package they vote for themselves as congresspeople is one of the best if not the best protection available, shouldn't it be the same package they offer to their bosses, us, we the people. How about offering universal health care to the entire country, and get this millstone off the necks of the American businessman. This way every American, in or out of public service, gets the same medical, prescription and surgical coverage. These people seem to forget when they get to Washington, they work for us, we chose to send them there to run the country for us. They are not Princes or Princesses, Dukes or Duchesses, they are our employees, entrusted with the welfare of our country and ourselves.

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» RE: hardparts Posted by: sharilynkay

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Macho spirit?
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Posted by: Cathyc on Sep 24, 2007 3:40 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Barbara Ehrenreich says:
"Fellow citizens, where is the old macho spirit that has sustained us through countless conflicts against enemies both real and imagined? In the case of health care, we have identified the enemy, and the time has come to crush it."

That's the problem, Barbara, the "macho" spirit you talk about is alive and kicking in the American Health Insurance Industry that you criticize! Its not the macho spirit that you should be endorsing, its the complete opposite: the balanced HUMAN spirit. The whole problem with America, and not just is Health System. It is its MACHO culture!!!

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mainstream candidates are shilling for the leeches
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Posted by: synapse on Sep 24, 2007 4:08 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
When Thomas Jefferson was dying, his physicians began using leeches and other dubious methods of treatment. The treatments didn't help and finally a miserable and frustrated Jefferson ordered a stop to the barbaric treatments so he could die in peace.

Modern day health insurance, more often than not, makes us feel like we are getting the leech treatment. The solution to combatting insane levels of health care inflation does not lie in giving the insurance industry an opportunity to destroy what little health freedom remains in this country.

The combination of taxpayer contributions to Medicare, Medicaid, state-based grants, veterans and military health care, prisoner health care (the only health care mandated by law), and employer subsidies together total 60% of U.S. health care expenditures. [This does not even include taxpayer funding for some of the dubious benefits behind federal research grants for basic and clinical research.] This huge base of taxpayer money for health care would be more than adequate to provide basic essential health care for all Americans.

The dysfunction and lack of transparency in the current system is reflected in the examples of: (1) The same basic protocol for treating a broken leg costing 300% more in one hospital than it does in another only 10 miles away, and; (2) Per capita Medicare expenditures several fold higher for residents in Miami than they are in Michigan thanks to a Florida culture of specialist care that takes advantage of the lucrative payouts for expensive tests and procedures.

A panel of health care providers and medical economists could eliminate the biggest sources of waste and inefficiency while also providing a framework for a transparent and flexible system. Citizen involvement could further reduce waste and foster a spirit of community participation.

This general discussion doesn't even touch on the problem of a medical system geared to treat disease instead of using the more practical and life-affirming approach of prevention through wellness and education. Mandated coverage would merely reinforce the current disease-based, pill-popping paradigm. I suppose that is another column for the intrepid Barbara Ehrenreich.

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The government isn't the only problem
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Posted by: ld7440 on Sep 24, 2007 4:11 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
While the government is responsible for the laws that are passed regarding the issue, remember the people who voted the present Administration into office. There are many ignorant voters who have been brainwashed into believing that 1) we can't afford to pay for a single-payer system; 2) that it will usher in socialism; 3) that we'll end up with long waits for medical care; etc. Clearly these people haven't bothered to watch Michael Moore's movie, "Sicko." As for uninsured children, they can't vote. Why should politicians care?

As for private insurance companies, they deserve to go out of business, or be restructured. If a company isn't doing what it's supposed to, it doesn't deserve our business. And private health insurance companies are failing us miserably. One could argue that governmental programs and their system of checks and balances leaves alot to be desired, too. However, democracy was founded on the principle of "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" - that's for everyone, not just for the wealthy and the privileged. Congressmen have total health insurance coverage with no copays. Are they implying that they are better than we are? People need to read between the lines.

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Culture of FEAR ...
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Posted by: Cathyc on Sep 24, 2007 5:42 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
... and normal human well-being goes together. America is a land of emotionally-starved Gekko-greedy automatons. Money and material things are all that matters to your average American citizen. How sad. How sad it is to live only by a purely materialistic code, where you and your children are nothing but material objects. So afraid are you of the real world - the beautiful world of Nature - that you find comfort in the material things of this world, if only for an hour or two, or a day or a week at a time.... to alleviate your emotional suffering. How sad and lonely this materialistic existence of yours must be... It must surely feel like one of those victims of "9/11" who had no choice but to jump to their deaths, rather than be slowly roasted alive....... ???

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» RE: Culture of FEAR ... Posted by: sharilynkay

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Health Care in America; Uninsured, Underinsured, Universal Woes
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Posted by: Betsy L. Angert on Sep 24, 2007 5:51 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Dearest Barbara Ehrenreich . . .

Please allow me to thank you. I am grateful that your words evoke this essential discussion.

I read. "With the courageous exception of Dennis Kucinich, the Democratic candidates have all rolled out health "reform" plans that represent total, Chamberlain-like, appeasement." I jumped for joy. That thought alone was the source of great excitement.

I too am frustrated by the submissive Americans that attempt to choose what they hope will be an electable candidate, while they acquiesce to inadequate health care. The mainstream and those on the Left ignore the deeper issues. Citizens of this country want nothing more than a "winner." For me, that attitude reflects the macho spirit. Actually, I wish that mentality was missing. To cast a ballot so that a Party might say, "We won" I think is untenable.

I have penned many a treatise on Universal Health Care. Throughout the Progressive cyberspace community, I share the plans Dennis Kucinich espouses. I too receive compliant comments. Today, I was told "half a loaf" is better than none. For me, if we accept that Insurers, Pharmaceutical Manufacturers, and Health Care Organizations must continue to profit from the fragility of human beings, then we, the citizens will remain consumers, a source for limitless earnings.

Ms Ehrenreich, you refer to Economist and Columnist Paul Krugman. The reference used supports the statement, Health Care Organizations are huge. I believe that is valid. Nonetheless, what frightens me is the stance Krugman takes on Universal Health Care. I quote . . .
The Edwards and Clinton plans as well as the slightly weaker but similar Obama plan achieve universal-or-near-universal coverage through a well-thought-out combination of insurance regulation, subsidies and public-private competition. These plans may disappoint advocates of a cleaner, simpler single-payer system. But it’s hard to see how Medicare for all could get through Congress any time in the near future, whereas Edwards-type plans offer a reasonable second best that you can actually envision being enacted by a Democratic Congress and signed by a Democratic president just two years from now.

I read this account in the course of my research. I rejected it for my missive. I invite your thoughts on . . .
Health Care in America; Uninsured, Underinsured, Universal Woes
Please also peruse . . .
Elected and Electable; Dennis Kucinich
Costly Happy Meals; Hillary and Mitt. Healthy Menu; Kucinich Plan

Betsy L. Angert
BeThink.org

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It's so simple
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Posted by: Jeanne on Sep 24, 2007 7:19 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If there were not a profit-making third party involved in the delivery of health care, then health care would be delivered. No insurance business wants to pay out. It is simply against their mission to make money. So there is an inherent conflict of interest. Having private insurers in the middle of reimbursements to providers is, quite frankly, insane. Their "return" is based on minimizing out-goings (payments for services of any kind) and maximizing income (premiums paid by their victims, I mean "customers"). There's no reward in maximizing services.

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Do or Die! Single Payer National Health Care as a Constitutional Human Right!
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Posted by: rwcbanzai on Sep 24, 2007 8:44 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Honorable Friends:

This article pretty well sums up what we should do to get a "Single Payer Universal Healthcare for all of u.s." I really encourage all of you to read this article and the comments. I spent 35 years in the labor movement fighting for the rights of working people and became disabled, cast away & put out of work, without any health insurance coverage! Yes, this can happen to you! I now pay over a thousand dollars a month for coverage for myself and wife leaving me economically & physically unable to do anything but to spread my disabling experience here on the WEB. I like many of you believed that if you work hard in life you'll reap the benefits. I found out the hard way that benefits can be taken away by the corporate & governing greedy. Even now, bankruptcy is not an option, just as insurance is not security! If you don't have your health, work, love, life - all become hopeless & meaningless!

Consider this, we have socialized national healthcare for all government, Federal, State, County, military, and the disappearing UNION jobs only if your ABLE TO WORK. There is coverage for the very young and the very old thru Medicare and MediCal and other programs if your unable to work. Those in-between (>50 million) have no coverage or overpay for private coverage if they are disabled on the job! No one, I repeat, no one should profit from sickness or illness but we allow them too! They (the medical/insurance industry) should all be non profits doing charitable humanitarian good works, not obtaining greedy profits on life or death! The VA hospitals are SOCIALIZED MEDICINE and outperform all for-profit hospitals and are the model of nationalized health care! We have it now, only for our Veterans of War, but what about our Veterans of LABOR? Well, well trained soldiers can take things by force, laborers can only negotiate in good faith! Health Care should be a universal human right superceding HAPPINESS in our CONSTITUTION!! For, without good health, life becomes death, a choice really, really worth fighting for.

Now, is the time to become aware of the frailty of our economic position in the face of future economic disaster. Employers dump their workers, dump their health and pension plans, and Insurance companies make money by denying coverage! The Loop hole is always in the fine print that those governing allow. This Single Payer National Healthcare is the ONE ISSUE that will determine my decision as to who will be elected to lead our great union of fifty states. I'm not going to Canada or Europe to obtain a basic human right, called national healthcare. The European UNION is not greater than the American Union? In this point in my life, it has become a life or death matter, and as a human being you too, will sooner or later, meet this same crossroad with which I find my life now on the line.

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Many more than 18,000 per year die because of the insurance system control over US medicine
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Posted by: logansafi on Sep 24, 2007 10:44 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The author grossly underestimates the number of deaths from the US insurance control over US medicine delivery. 18,000 extra deaths per bad care mandated by our US system hardly would cover California let alone the whole country. It is like if the estimate of Iraqi deaths was listed as under 100,000!

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Because, my dear, you've been conditioned to bow down.
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Posted by: nzo on Sep 24, 2007 11:34 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Walt Whitman says it better than I:

To the States or any one of them, or any city of the States, Resist much, obey little,

Once unquestioning obedience, once fully enslaved,

Once fully enslaved, no nation, state, city of this earth, ever afterward resumes its liberty.

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one of 2007's 18000
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Posted by: undrgrndgirl on Sep 24, 2007 11:55 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
my fiance died in june because he was uninsured, he was 53. he didn't have insurance because his 'regular' work was outsourced and he couldn't find another 9-5 job though he never stopped looking as his unemployment benefits ran out in 2003 and he no longer was counted as one of this county's unemployed - as a musician (he was an EXCELLENT electric guitarist) he barely got paid enough to cover the cost of traveling to gigs, so obviously no insurance there....he had a heart condition and probably undiagnosed diabetes...i am a former healthcare worker who battled the insurers on behalf of the doctors i worked for and the patients we cared for (most were cancer or HIV) for many years so i am well versed in the brutality of the insurance companies...both he (my fiance) and i knew that if he was diagnosed before we could get back on typical group insurance he would have been utterly uninsurable. he was not not sick enough for ssi and medicare and we had too many assets for medicaid...so rather than go to the emergency room on father's day night, he went to sleep and didn't wake up...the medical examiner from oklahoma city opted NOT to do a full autopsy - she said he looked like he had a heart attack in his sleep...but now i wonder if she didn't do the autopsy because there was no insurance to pay for it, either...i realize his mother or i could have asked for one, but on some level it didn't matter to either of us what killed him on at the physical level (dead is dead and that can't be changed)...we know he died because he didn't have insurance - if he had had insurance he wouldn't have ignored his heart problem for so long, and i would have seen to it that he was tested for diabetes...however, as it was any diagnosis would have also sealed his fate for getting a diagnosis while not covered will certainly keep you from getting any coverage at all...it was also nearly impossible for him to get an appointment with any doctor because once you say "i don't have insurance" they won't see you without cash in full up front if they'll see you at all....oh, and before you say, why didn't you get married and put him on your insurance - its because i am a student (at the age of 43) and the "student insurance" i get is "accident and injury" insurance which means they can deny payment more easily that the group insurance most people are familiar with...the "student insurance" wouldn't have covered any of his medical problems until a full year of coverage had been met; otherwise they would have been preexisting conditions - and to meet the full year of coverage clause it means NO treatment during that year - otherwise, guess what preexisting condition......kusinich is the ONLY candidate worth voting for if you value your health and the health of those you love...sadly i was just weeks away from completing my master's degree and would have been on my way to finding a job with benefits...now i'm struggling with a broken soul and could care less about the degree...my "insurance" runs out in december.

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» RE: one of 2007's 18000 Posted by: Aussie Kim

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Yes, It Would Be Disruptive ...
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Posted by: marxalot on Sep 25, 2007 4:18 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
... to switch out to a single-payer system. Disruptive to that fat-ass elite minority who make money off their money by investing in the medical insurance industry.

Basically, everyone who argues against the switch has a vested interest in the status quo, or are one of their ditto-head minions. In other words, they are either lying, or they are too cork headed to understand their own best interest.

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Why Does Everyone Bow Down to the Health Insurance Industry?
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Posted by: wagadog on Sep 25, 2007 7:45 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Why? Because they have the power of life and death.

This is like asking Why Does Everyone Bow Down to the Man With The Guns.

The real questions are: How Do We Take This Power Away From A Moneyed Elite? How Shall We Democratically Value All Lives Equally, And Thereby Distribute This Power -- and The Responsibility That Goes With It -- Entirely Equitably?

The first step is, necessarily, to drive a populist wedge between Big Pharma and Your Elected Officials. Michael Moore's SICKO was just the thin edge of it. Keep driving!

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Target the employees
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Posted by: kindmuse on Sep 25, 2007 8:13 AM   
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Target the Employees!

The employees of the insurance companies are human after all, they have a conscious. I hope anyway, even if it's a little one. Target them just like the great unions of the early 20th century targeted big business. Just like the ongoing battle to get rid of sweat shops. Target the employees, educate them. If the health insurance companies can't find anyone to work for them, then nobody will be able to deny claims. It will be a revolution that will force health change in America. But it can only start with the people. As any true revolution does.

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Seems like a good place...
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Posted by: henderson on Sep 25, 2007 11:48 AM   
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to post some things I've read lately...
"Humans are the only animal on earth that will follow an unstable leader" (attributed to Caesar Milan).

"Humans are the only animals on the planet who destroy the nutritional value of their food before eating it." (Mike Adams)

"Humans are the only species that kills it's own kind in the name of God." (Unknown)

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» Unstable Leaders... Posted by: Cathyc
» RE: Seems like a good place... Posted by: zalmoxis

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Dr. S.R.Keister
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Posted by: S.R.Keister on Sep 25, 2007 2:01 PM   
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We are fragmented in our opposition to the profit oriented health care industry. We need single payer, universal health care as is available in most Western Nations. Physicians For A National Health Plan; , with their 15,000 members has been advocating a rational plan for 20 years. Rather than running in all directions please familiarize yourselves with this coherent plan to provide health care to all, sans the insurance industry and speak up to the Democratic Congress to get HR 676 out of committee and to the floor. Hopefully not ALL congressmen accept baksheesh from the insurance and pharmaceutical industries.

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L-o-b-b-y
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Posted by: Bambi on Sep 25, 2007 2:08 PM   
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Big money from the Pharma Lobby for starters. Democrat whores are exactly the same as Republican whores when the chips are down.

Bambi

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» RE: L-o-b-b-y Posted by: zalmoxis

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"ONLY KUCINICH DEFIES INSURANCE INDUSTRY"
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Posted by: zalmoxis on Sep 25, 2007 8:13 PM   
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The autrhor of this article is incorrect. While it is true that Clinton & Edwards especially are shilling for the insurance industry, former Senator Mike Gravel has proposed health care vouchers useable for any service & any providers desired. He & Congressman Dennis Kucinich are the only Dem. candidates talking about health CARE rather than health INSURANCE. Please get your facts straight before lumping Gravel in with ... (this is my first post. Is it acceptable to call Clinton, Edwards, Obama, Dodd, & Richards hypocritical liars? I leave out Biden because his campaign is going nowhere in a hurry.)

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TO ANSWER THE QUESTION -
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Posted by: Constitutionalist75 on Sep 26, 2007 10:06 AM   
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"Why Does Everyone Bow Down To The Pharmaceutical Industry?" - because America has become a corporate dictatorship supported by the dictatorship of George Bush and Dick Cheney. Don't believe it? Try to get Congress to pass universal health care, and try to impeach Bush & Cheney!

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Want to side step the federal gov and develope universal health care yourself?
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Posted by: Dr A on Sep 26, 2007 12:45 PM   
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I run a blog on the daily kos and I will be getting a web page up later next month. The Germans developed their health care system by a series of towns that insured their citizens for health care. Then later these towns were linked into a national network.

Many counties have ways a citizen can initiate a bill that is then voted on by the public at a general election. Democracy in action. 75% of voters say that they want such a bill to be passed to give them universal health care without insurance hassles.

I am leading a discussion about just such a bill at:
Dr A's Blog

You can see the entire initiative and download it at:
Dr A’s Initiaive


Or you can see a short version at:
Short Version

Finally I am working on the website and hope to have it up next month at:
www.myhealthcarelaw.com

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the real problem
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Posted by: ShoShenQ on Sep 26, 2007 6:52 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Well,

The real problem, beyond Iraq, Healthcare and other areas, is how american politics are funded, its the Mother of All Sins that money has such a big say in who gets elected and who doesnt, here in Canada our politics used to be rotten by money as well, but a reform (not so long ago) kicked Big Money out of the picture by severly capping the max amount you can "donate", in fact invest in a candidate.

That and the joke of having only 2 political party to represent 300 millions americans ARE the real problem.

Fix this and the rest will follow, that's how true democracies works (notice the root demos), "businessocracies" on the other hand...well you live in one, you know better.

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Time is running out... clock is ticking
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Posted by: Bearzerker on Sep 28, 2007 3:29 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Well I guess Clinton '08 is over/done... she wont win now is my guess...
what a disaster her health care reform package is...

American Politics is dead... to the golden rule... such a shame...

sell out?... she was bought out..
enjoy your 30 pieces of silver Hilary

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