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Environment

The Problem Is Simple: Too Many People, Too Much Stuff

By Paul & Anne Ehrlich, Yale Environment 360. Posted August 7, 2008.


An equitable and humane solution to overpopulation and overconsumption may actually be possible.
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Over some 60 million years, Homo sapiens has evolved into the dominant animal on the planet, acquiring binocular vision, upright posture, large brains, and -- most importantly -- language with syntax and that complex store of non-genetic information we call culture. However, in the last several centuries we've increasingly been using our relatively newly acquired power, especially our culturally evolved technologies, to deplete the natural capital of Earth -- in particular its deep, rich agricultural soils, its groundwater stored during ice ages, and its biodiversity -- as if there were no tomorrow.

The point, all too often ignored, is that this trend is being driven in large part by a combination of population growth and increasing per capita consumption, and it cannot be long continued without risking a collapse of our now-global civilization. Too many people -- and especially too many politicians and business executives -- are under the delusion that such a disastrous end to the modern human enterprise can be avoided by technological fixes that will allow the population and the economy to grow forever. But if we fail to bring population growth and over-consumption under control -- the number of people on Earth is expected to grow from 6.5 billion today to 9 billion by the second half of the 21st century -- then we will inhabit a planet where life becomes increasingly untenable because of two looming crises: global heating, and the degradation of the natural systems on which we all depend.

Our species' negative impact on our own life-support systems can be approximated by the equation I=PAT. In that equation, the size of the population (P) is multiplied by the average affluence or consumption per individual (A), and that in turn is multiplied by some measure of the technology (T) that services and drives the consumption. Thus commuting in automobiles powered by subsidized fossil fuels on proliferating freeways creates a much greater T factor than commuting on bikes using simple paths or working at home on a computer network. The product of P, A, and T is Impact (I), a rough estimate of how much humanity is degrading the ecosystem services it depends upon.

The equation is not rocket science. Two billion people, all else being equal, put more greenhouse gases into the atmosphere than one billion people. Two billion rich people disrupt the climate more than two billion poor people. Three hundred million Americans consume more petroleum than 1.3 billion Chinese. And driving an SUV is using a far more environmentally malign transportation technology than riding mass transit.

The technological dimensions of our predicament -- such as the need for alternatives to fossil fuel energy -- are frequently discussed if too little acted upon. Judging from media reports and the statements of politicians, environmental problems, to the degree they are recognized, can be solved by minor changes in technologies and recycling (T). Switching to ultra-light, fuel-efficient cars will obviously give some short-term advantage, but as population and consumption grow, they will pour still more carbon dioxide (and vaporized rubber) into the atmosphere and require more natural areas to be buried under concrete. More recycling will help, but many of our society's potentially most dangerous effluents (such as hormone-mimicking chemicals) cannot practically be recycled. There is no technological change we can make that will permit growth in either human numbers or material affluence to continue to expand. In the face of this, the neglect of the intertwined issues of population and consumption is stunning.

Many past human societies have collapsed under the weight of overpopulation and environmental neglect, but today the civilization in peril is global. The population factor in what appears to be a looming catastrophe is even greater than most people suppose. Each person added today to the population on average causes more damage to humanity's critical life-support systems than did the previous addition -- everything else being equal. The reason is simple: Homo sapiens became the dominant animal by being smart. Farmers didn't settle first on poor soils where water was scarce, but rather in rich river valleys. That's where most cities developed, where rich soils are now being paved over for roads and suburbs, and where water supplies are being polluted or overexploited.

As a result, to support additional people it is necessary to move to ever poorer lands, drill wells deeper, or tap increasingly remote sources to obtain water -- and then spend more energy to transport that water ever greater distances to farm fields, homes, and factories. Our distant ancestors could pick up nearly pure copper on Earth's surface when they started to use metals; now people must use vast amounts of energy to mine and smelt gigantic amounts of copper ore of ever poorer quality, some in concentrations of less than one percent. The same can be said for other important metals. And petroleum can no longer be found easily on or near the surface, but must be gleaned from wells drilled a mile or more deep, often in inaccessible localities, such as under continental shelves beneath the sea. All of the paving, drilling, fertilizer manufacturing, pumping, smelting, and transporting needed to provide for the consumption of burgeoning numbers of people produces greenhouse gases and thus tightens the connection between population and climate disruption.


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See more stories tagged with: population, consumption

Paul and Anne Ehrlich are in the Department of Biology and the Center for Conservation Biology at Stanford University, where he is Bing Professor of Population Studies and Professor of Biological Sciences and she is Senior Research Associate. Their latest book, The Dominant Animal: Human Evolution and the Environment (Island Press), focuses on the issues cited in this article and includes references.

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Thanks for a Thoughtful, Sane Article
Posted by: Jim Shaw on Aug 7, 2008 1:25 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It's nice to see that some thought leaders can not only see the obvious - endless growth on a finite planet is impossible - but accept this truth (perhaps the ultimate "inconvenient truth") and attempt to deal with it.

I get so frustrated with these liberal, left-leaning economists and politicians (I expect it from the right-wing market worshippers) who avoid this truth and continue to promote endless economic growth.

It's too bad that we've automated production so much that we have to produce tons of unneeded crap (the demand for which must be continually stoked by relentless marketing)just to keep people employed.

I think the wealthy don't like to talk about limits to growth, not just for the obvious reason that as the economy grows, they get much wealthier (and don't want to give that up), but also because if we stopped growing the economy, it would be painfully obvious that they need to start sharing the wealth. For now, they can say, "We may be getting the lion’s share of the pie now, and you may be left out of the party, but as the economy grows, you’ll have the opportunity to get a nice chunk of the much bigger pie.” What can they say once the pie has stopped growing?

It's time to cut our numbers, stop the over-consumption, and start SHARING the things that people actually need.

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Enough is as good as a feast
Posted by: Rod on Aug 7, 2008 2:19 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Good Enough for Mary Poppins, good enough for me.

Evidently not good enough for way too many.

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More Malthusian nonsense...
Posted by: ahmlco on Aug 7, 2008 4:10 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Remember back in the '60s and early '70s how all of the doom and gloomers were predicting the collapse of civilization within the next decade due to overpopulation and lack of food?

Remember "Limits to Growth?" ZPG? Heck, remember Soylent Green? Logan's Run, where we were forced to kill everyone over 30?

Didn't happen.

The simple fact of the matter is that if you improve the standard of living birth rates drop of their own accord. In fact, the US, Europe, Japan and other industrialized countries already have fertility rates at or below the replacement level. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_fertility_rate

That said, we do need to be more efficient with the resources we do use, and we also need to work out better and more equitable distribution system.

But "overpopulation" is and remains to be the boogieman forever hiding in the closet.

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» RE: More Malthusian nonsense... Posted by: sunnywater
» Quiver folks Posted by: kimbari
» Wrong Posted by: dudelette
If only we could talk about it
Posted by: Dartagnan on Aug 8, 2008 1:36 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
   I'm afraid this will be our downfall. We can't talk about it because everyone needs to be free to procreate, and most aren't intelligent or selfless enough to realize they should not have children, and the powers that be want continual growth.
   Humans not overcoming their instinctual drives and short-sightedness. - Want to help the environment? Don't reproduce! You'll save more resources and waste creation that way than you ever could by restricting your lifestyle.

   The health of the oceans is of great concern (we can't see how 'empty' they are compared to 200-500 or more years ago).

   The energy crises that we're finally talking about is only coming up now because we're on the edge of the cliff, and now may not have time to transition comfortably to lower consumption and alternative sources. - If only we had listened to Tesla... (and I'm sure a few dozen others).

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» RE: Soylent Green is People! Posted by: Last Chance
» Yum! Soylent Green! Posted by: Beepath
Wrong again
Posted by: Beached Whale on Aug 8, 2008 1:54 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Saying the same wrong thing over and over does not make it any less wrong.

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» RE: Wrong again Posted by: Last Chance
I'LL BE JUST FINE, SAYS PLANET
Posted by: opmoc on Aug 8, 2008 3:05 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
linked text

THE planet Earth has dismissed claims it is in danger from global warming, stressing the worst that could happen is the extinction of the human race.


The Earth spoke out after a series of books, television programmes and environmental campaigns urged people to do everything in their power to 'Save the Planet'.

Earth, 4,000,000,000, said last night: "I'll be absolutely fine, seriously. I might get a bit warmer and a bit wetter, but to be honest, that actually sounds quite nice.

"Try living through an ice age. Pardon my French, but it's absolutely fucking freezing."

The planet, based 93 million miles from the Sun, said it was 'sick and tired' of being drawn into arguments about human behaviour.

"Look, I'm just a planet doing its thing, alright? If you want to live on me, that's your business, but I've got important planet stuff to do, okay?

"Try being in elliptical orbit for five minutes, or balancing your gravitational pull with a medium-sized moon. Let me assure you, it's no fucking picnic."

The planet said environmental campaigners should change their slogan from 'Save the Planet' to something more relevant such as 'Save Your Sorry Arse'.

Earth added: "Okay, so there may come a time when, for a variety of reasons, I am no longer able to support pandas, polar bears, and humans, but you know what? Life goes on.

"Who knows, I might end up being a haven for toads."

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» Teheheh... Posted by: JingleFae15
» New Religion Posted by: kimbari
» All Religion is Bollocks Posted by: opmoc
» RE: I'LL BE JUST FINE, SAYS PLANET Posted by: JingleFae15
» To Explain Further Posted by: opmoc
» RE: To Explain Further Posted by: opmoc
A Very Specific Solution Is Available
Posted by: Last Chance on Aug 8, 2008 3:56 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Did the Erlich's memtion anything about family planning clinics and every woman's right to decide if and when to birth children?

I find it soooo BORING to plow through a lot of cautious, tip-toe rhetoric that skirts around the issue and takes 5000 words to say what can easily be said in one or two paragraphs. But I suppose that's how books are written these days, and why so many like myself prefer the Internet.

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An Execellent Summation Of The Facts
Posted by: pinnacle on Aug 8, 2008 4:33 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
A well thought out and presented article. I would just add this ----- consumption in the US could be reined in by the elimination of "easy" credit, particularly the proliferation of credit cards that started 30-40 years ago and has continued until we have found ourselves in a financial mess. People are simply buying stuff they don't need and, in the end, can't pay for.

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Pollution, hunger, war: Population bomb is very real
Posted by: Moonray on Aug 8, 2008 4:42 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As the above comment "More Malthusian nonsense" shows, many people would rather cling to comforting myths than face hard realities. Come to think of it, the entire conservative movement consists of clinging to comforting myths rather than facing reality. (As a reformed conservative who once drank the Reagan kool-aid, I know how easy it is to be seduced by those myths.)

Humans can survive for quite a while as our global population continues to explode, but our lifestyle will take the elevator shaft -- and already is, as we all can plainly see. A vigorous worldwide effort is needed to curb population worldwide, and I don't mean "better education and improving standards of living," as some wimpy liberals prescribe. That approach is clearly not working. The Chinese have the right idea with their one-child policy, but programs would have to be tailored differently for each nation. The alternative is also clear: Look at Ethiopia and wait for it to happen everywhere.

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» There Is An Answer Posted by: Last Chance
» small is beautiful and sustainable Posted by: socialpsych
» dystopian novel question Posted by: stilldreaming
» too soon Posted by: stilldreaming
» Hmmm, sounds like . . . Posted by: dustdevil
» Almost, but Posted by: Last Chance
» RE: There Is An Answer Posted by: Gracchus
Huh? There's a problem?
Posted by: PJAW on Aug 8, 2008 4:56 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I've long wished I wish I could come back to this planet in another 200 years or so and see what kind of shape it's in. That, in fact, could be exactly what's behind "UFO's". Other beings capable of interstellar travel, stopping by earth to take a look at what's going on here. If they live long enough, and stop by often enough, I would imagine they find it rather entertaining, in a sort of tragicomic way.

Erlich is right, too many people and too much stuff. And all of it made from other stuff that used to be just lying around or buried just beneath the surface. Which is where today's stuff will return some day. The atoms and molecules will be recycled, just as they have been many times in the past. Including the ones that make up our physical bodies. You know, ashes to ashes and dust to dust. And humans may or may not manage to hang around.

Collectively, I seriously doubt we have the intellect or the will to change what needs to be changed in order to increase the chances for our species to survive. Maybe we shouldn't burn all of that corn ethanol in SUV's. Maybe we should set enough of it aside for one final celebration of what humanity achieved, and one final drunken sob over what we didn't.

Just kidding..., God will be here any minute now and set all this shit straight.

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» I tend to agree. Posted by: Last Chance
» RE: I tend to agree. Posted by: g50
Thank you.
Posted by: kepstein7777 on Aug 8, 2008 5:18 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I'm glad somebody did the math. All of the technology in the world or future world cannot defeat the law of diminishing returns. Eventually our tendency to overproduce will catch up with us, if it hasn't already.

Humans may be have a knack for technology, but in other ways we're stupider than most of the animal kingdom. On the matter of sex and reproduction, I think we're all roughly the same. We will keep popping them out until our habitat can no longer support us all, and we will either starve, be devoured by predators--such as mortgage brokers and telemarketers--or be shot by rednecks.

And do you really think you can compare collective incidents like the collapse of communism in the USSR or the civil rights movement to the basic biological urges of everyone on the planet? Good luck with that.

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» Correction Posted by: Last Chance
Consumption Problem
Posted by: rotation on Aug 8, 2008 5:42 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Things are not made to last anymore. I purchased a freezer in 1973 and just defrosted it yesterday. My 1968 washer died in 1998 and the drier (1968) died in 1999. My 1968 refrigerator died in 1995 probably due to the move I made. The electric fry pan I use in the summer to help keep the house cooler (I live in TX) is now at least 50 years old. I got it from my parents for my first apartment and I do not remember them not having it before that.

The toaster I bought last year with a one year warranty died after 381 days. My new refrigerator (1995) has had the motor replaced once. Fortunately I purchased it from a small local business that repairs. Other things that do not last - computers, microwaves, toys and probably name it and it will not last if it is made by a large Corporartion.

Reconsumption is a Strategy:
Why would any company want to make something that will last? They lose a customer for a long time for that item. In the days of small businesses making a product they were proud to lose that customer because they had a word of mouth reference and a customer who would come back for other items. Large corporations are all about profit and a ploy to get more is to make the product to last only through the warranty period. There is no pride in the product only profit.

Ihatereplacingthingsmary

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» Obsolescence Posted by: kepstein7777
The Italians Have a Birthrate of 1.3 Despite The Pope Telling Them They Are Going To Hell
Posted by: opmoc on Aug 8, 2008 5:54 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If the entire human race adopted Italian culture and birthrate - the problem would already be solved.

Just do the maths.

Even to maintain our current numbers require a birthrate of 2.1.

Whilst I like slagging off the Pope with his Fuck For God message encouraging the sheep to have as many children as possible - his local flock appear to have told him to stick his views up his arse.

If the human race can discover why Italians have such a low birth rate and manage to replicate it across the planet, then the problem will be solved.

To be honest, I find it incredibly difficult to understand.

50 years ago Italians had the reputation for being Fat Pasta Momas with 10 kids each...

Now Most Italian Women are Staggeringly Beautiful and make the normal Fat English Drunken "Tracey" Slobs look totally disgusting.

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» Italy Posted by: kepstein7777
» RE: USA Posted by: Last Chance
world population control . . .
Posted by: dustdevil on Aug 8, 2008 6:08 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
High gas prices and the rapidly falling value of the dollar will slow population growth in this country. People just will not be able to afford large families. Of course there will always be people that are prone to live beyond their means.

Here's an idea:
If wealthy philanthropists such as Bill Gates, George Soros, Warren Buffet, etc. would offer to pay for vasectomies to willing participants,
it could reduce population growth while also reducing poverty in the world.

I admit this is directed toward the poor, but poverty is a world problem, too. And the rich aren't prone to have large families.

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Ha
Posted by: g50 on Aug 8, 2008 6:35 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I see the Erlichs no long provide a time frame for their predictions - perhaps more than 30 years of wrongly predicting catastrophe within five, ten years have taught them to be more generic?

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» RE: catastrophe Posted by: Last Chance
» RE: catastrophe Posted by: g50
RACIST MALTHUSIAN BULLSHIT !!
Posted by: jwverez on Aug 8, 2008 6:37 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Some people complain about population increases despite the fact that only a very small percentage of the world's population are the real culprits responsible for the depletion of the earth's natural resources. If the authors really want to help, they can simply shoot each other off as well as the rest of the RACIST neo-Malthusian assholes and there, PROBLEM SOLVED !!

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» RE: "shoot each other off" Posted by: Last Chance
» RE: ACIST MALTHUSIAN BULLSHIT !! Posted by: adempatriot
» Uh, no Posted by: dudelette
A MUST read!
Posted by: davidg on Aug 8, 2008 6:48 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
A Short History of Progress by Ronald Wright.
He compares the reason for collapse of all major global civilizations through millenia. Then, he applies the principles of his discoveries to our one global civilization. Disturbing, necessary.
Thank you, Paul and Ann Ehrlich. This could be real reality TV if "Swifter" would only advertize it. Someday we will have to stop amusing ourselves to death if we don't die first.

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» RE: A(nother) MUST read! Posted by: jimbee
While I appreciate the argument the author makes...
Posted by: ABetterFuture on Aug 8, 2008 7:37 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
...why the need to create mumbo jumbo equations that literally mean whatever the hell you want them to mean?

I mean c'mon--I=PAT?

If you really want to scare folks with large numbers, why not just express such fairy tale equations as I=(P^2AT^9)3Bazillion, where I also = Doom and Gloom to the nth power.

You don't need to resort to creationist-style math to argue effectively for lessening human impact on the environment.

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brer
Posted by: brer on Aug 8, 2008 7:45 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This may sound unbelievable to some, but EVERYTHING I own except my piano and my computer (oh, and my contact lenses) was pre-owned.

My furniture was purchased here and there from people who wanted a change in their decor.

My dishes--the same. In fact, lately, I've been going to garage sales to find beautiful single plates. I'm hoping to serve my guests each with a different beautiful plate.

If you are having a baby, and you go to a baby store, I'm sorry, but you are nuts. You can go out any day in the summer to a garage sale, and buy ANYTHING YOU NEED for one fourth the price. Sometimes one tenth. I always hold out for the one tenth, myself. Why do people get the idea that having a baby is so expensive? I'll wager I see at least THREE "How to raise your baby from birth to 6 months" books EVERY Saturday at different sales. There are even "twins" sales popping up more and more often. I guess the fertility drugs are really working, because three or four times a summer I come across a sale with two strollers, two high chairs, four carseats--one for the newborns, one for the larger babies. Piles of two matching dresses, two sunbonnets, two pairs of matching shoes. ETC!!

Oh, I forgot. I usually buy food first hand. But, I check the "ripe" counter every visit, and use the produce the same day.

Last week I found a garage sale with a box of canned soups (expiration date--8/09) and bought them for one dollar. That was about 7 cents a can. I priced them in the store that afternoon and they were selling for $2.99.

The only trouble with this article is that if everyone started living up to its principles, HOW WOULD I LIVE?

I really depend on all the first-timers who love new stuff. I don't even know how to shop in a mall. Have lived in my town for 13 years, and have been to the mall only two times. Ha! The last time was when my son had to have a "NAVY" suit to play in his band that was going on an overseas tour. We visited the nall stores where his eyes popped out at the high prices. I said, "Well, let's try a thrift store..." so we did. We got him a beautiful suit for $3. He was so proud of that. I think he told all his friends.

He wore that suit for the three week trip, and then we sent it back to the thrift store for some other lucky person to use.

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» RE: brer Posted by: g50
Pogo's "And he is us" again.
Posted by: Sojourner on Aug 8, 2008 8:10 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It may be just another urban myth, but I once heard that we, humans, were the only creatures who will tolerate and seek the pain of healing. We go to the dentist. I heard that spoken in a context that dolphins share the behavior. Preventive medical treatment at the individual level is now widely available and taken for granted.

The contrasting evidence of contemporaneous obesity and malnourishment testifies to the lack of justice in our world. While it seems that the “haves” are the winners, we tolerate such injustice—at our own peril. Those in need of healing and the healers are in it together. Bottom line ethics dooms our species. It just a matter of sooner or later.

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john
Posted by: theoldguy on Aug 8, 2008 8:13 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There are probably closer to 7 billion people on earth now. We should be realistic about our role on the planet and accept that we are nothing more than parasites; and not good parasites at that. We all have good parasites in our systems that help us digest our food, etc. Humans are like smallpox or tuberculosis that finally destroy the host.
We have almost conquered disease and are approaching death control. Now we need birth control if the species is to survive.

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According to the RACIST authors, if one student misbehaves, the entire class is to be PUNISHED.
Posted by: jwverez on Aug 8, 2008 8:53 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If the authors ever bothered to do their research work, they would have found out that outside and US, China (save the rural parts perhaps), Israel, and Europe, history has shown that regardless of the population density, people will consume far less than is available. Do working class Saudis, Syrians, Iranians, Palestinians, Pakistanis, Indians, etc ... consume like the West? HELL NO ! The RACIST Malthusians don't want you to find out that dirty secret. Oh, they're for "free" trade, privatization, deregulation, "war on drugs", wars for oil, social "conservatism", etc ... but don't want you to find out.

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Ehrlichs are my heroes
Posted by: leemiller38 on Aug 8, 2008 9:42 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As one who has followed the population explosion for 40+ years, my hat is off to the Ehrlichs who are somewhat optimistic that we can pull it off, i.e., save civilization. I admire their intellect, courage and tenacity. However, I am a pessimist, because of the Know-Nothings of whom we have a great sampling in the above remarks such as "Malthusian rascist", "Malthusian bullshit", etc., and other manifestations of ignorance, I don't think we will make it. We need to come together as we never have before to solve this one.

Especially egregious is the media which should be understanding the problem, informing the public and thereby putting pressure on politicians to act. Politicians who know better are also gutless to lead, because of the firestorm of religious controversy this may stir up. So we rock along with the Mexico City policies, abstinence only education being invoked by Repugs and overturned by Dems, but no long-range plan or adequate funding to arrest the growth.

We are deep into this problem. Over 10,000 years ago, civilzation was our first mistake as a species. Correcting the error from where we are now with billions of ignorant people consuming the earth while touting that their culture and their tribe, their DNA is primal looks pretty impossible, yet the Ehrlichs labor on in their old age to try to save humans from their own worst enemy, themselves. Thank you Anne and Paul. You articulate so well what we need to hear and do, but alas lack the will to achieve.

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mistakes and solutions
Posted by: mwildfire on Aug 8, 2008 9:51 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
First the mistakes, on the part of many commenters: one is disgusted by the simple I=PAT equation, while at least one other screams in capital letters that the authors are racist, presumably because they mention population control. Apparently such people believe that this refers specifically to lowering the population of the poor, or of people of color; presumably they imagine that population can go up forever as long as consumption declines. But it doesn't work that way. Ar some point you've got 40 million people living without shelter or food. That's the point of the equation--we can get away with increasing population longer if we reduce consumption, or we can get away with allowing more and more people to consume more and more if we reduce the population, but we can't increase either factor indefinitely without destroying the ecosystems on which we depend.
I think the reason the critical element of population reduction is mentioned so little is that people are afraid of exactly this dynamic. But there is a simple solution--if more intrusive than most would prefer. That's to declare that every woman on the planet is entitled to one child--or two perhaps, if you think we can afford to nearly maintain our current numbers rather than quickly reducing them. No extra kids because you "can afford them"--even if you have money, the planet can't afford them, and any inequality will just set off the breeding wars which will assure we all go down in ugly chaos together.
Reducing consumption is also necessary, but that part about summoning political will is Herculean. The reality is that capitalism is the cancer that's eating the earth, and all the top political and corporate leaders, and the media, are entwined it its demands. We could have a healthy, green, harmonious world in which no one is hungry or homeless and the depleted oceans and other ecosystems are in recovery, even at our current population levels. But only if we directed resources toward renewable energy and sustainable farming and away from those things we can't afford, chiefly warfare and the rich. The rich are now in control and they can use the media to prevent the rest of us from communicating and organizing to bring about the change we so desperately need.

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Hurray for the Ehlrichs
Posted by: janvdb on Aug 8, 2008 10:29 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Despite all the ignorant, gonad-propelled deniers-of-reality who have assailed them over the past 40 years, they keep plugging away, trying to save us all from ourselves.

Keep at it, please. Sorry for all the hecklers. More power to you.

Jan VanDenBerg

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Vegetarianism is the solution
Posted by: vasumurti on Aug 8, 2008 10:51 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Half the water consumed in the U. S. goes to irrigate land growing feed and fodder for livestock. Huge amounts of water wash away their excrement. U. S. livestock produce 20 times as much excrement as does the entire human population, creating sewage 10 to several hundred times more concentrated than raw domestic sewage. Animal wastes cause 10 times more water pollution than does the U. S. human population; the meat industry causes three times as much harmful organic water pollution than the rest of the nation's industries combined.

Meat producers, the number one industrial polluters in our nation, contribute to half the water pollution in the United States. The water that goes into a 1,000 lb. steer could float a destroyer. It takes 25 gallons of water to produce a pound of wheat, but 2,500 gallons to produce a pound of meat. If these costs weren't subsidized by the American taxpayers, hamburger meat would be $35 per pound!

Subsidizing the California meat industry costs taxpayers $24 billion annually. Livestock producers are California's biggest consumers of water. Every tax dollar the state doles out to livestock producers costs taxpayers over seven dollars in lost wages, higher living costs and reduced business income. 17 western states have enough water supplies to support economies and populations twice as large as the present.

Overgrazing of cattle leads to topsoil erosion, turning once-arable land into desert. We lose four million acres of topsoil each year and 85 percent of this loss is directly caused by raising livestock. To replace the soil we've lost, we're destroying our forests. Since 1967, the rate of deforestation in the U. S. has been one acre every five seconds. For each acre cleared in urbanization, seven are cleared for grazing or growing livestock feed.

One-third of all raw materials in the U. S. are consumed by the livestock industry and it takes three times as much fossil fuel energy to produce meat than it does to produce plant foods. A report on the energy crisis in Scientific American warned: "The trends in meat consumption and energy consumption are on a collision course."

Nor can fish provide any help here. There are signs that the fishing industry (which is quite energy-intensive) has already overfished the oceans in several areas. And fish could never play a major role in the worlds diet anyway: the entire global fish catch of the world, if divided among all the world's inhabitants would amount to only a few ounces of fish per person per week.

The American Dietetic Association reports that throughout history, the human race has lived on "vegetarian or near vegetarian diets," and meat has traditionally been a luxury. Nathan Pritikin recommended not more than 3 ounces of animal protein per day; 3 ounces per week for his patients who had already suffered a heart attack.

Obviously, then, the idea of providing the entire world with a Western-style diet is absurd. But what about satisfying today's demand for meat--which provides only a fraction of the population with a Western-style diet? If the world population triples in the next 100 years, and meat consumption continues, then meat production would have to triple as well. Instead of 3.7 billion acres of cropland and 7.5 billion acres of grazing land, we would require 11.1 billion acres of cropland and 22.5 billion acres of grazing land.

But this is slightly larger than the land area of the 6 inhabited continents! We are desperately short of forests, water and energy already. Even if we resort to extreme methods of population control: abortion, infanticide, genocide, etc...modest increases in the world population would make it impossible to maintain current levels of meat consumption. On a vegetarian diet, however, the world could easily support a population several times its present size.

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» Now I know you're batshit Posted by: AdamG
That's not the problem
Posted by: jeffrey7 on Aug 8, 2008 12:07 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We can handle more people what we can't handle is manufactured force fed 'needs' we must buy. The old corporate model was 'Fill the needs as they arise'. Now it's 'create a
need so we can maximize profits'. We greatly over produce. That's the real strain on the planet. our landfills are chuck full of manufactured junk that is designed to wear out fast. Few things of quality are made,you can't turn a profit that way,and what things that are quality cost so much the average person can't afford them.
Wasteful production has given us inferior products,more pollution,bigger landfills and more diseases for the public from their wastes.
The best thing we can do for ourselves and the country is to stop buying the latest,newest,most gotta-have-it piece of crap that's mass advertised to us. Sattlite HD TV is bullshit. It's pushed at us so Uncle Shiteater can circumvent the laws against subliminal visuals and subsonic tones. If you think I'm full of it...plug your TV into your stereo,you'll hear all kinds of tones coming out of your subwoofer, even in diaper commericals. This Government is all about controlling you...usually through FEAR.
Fear you don't have enough education. Fear you don't live in the right gated community,Fear you need a gated community. Fear you don't have the right appliances. Fear they won't work right. Fear that the population's going to eat itself and all the while the folks advancing the fear are laughing all the way to their secret offshore bank accounts. It's time to end the over producing bullshit because it's killing us,our children,and the grandchildren we'll never know.But then again WAL-MART is having a sale on plastic drinking glasses. Yes I'm being sarcastic.
WRITE IN Jeffrey7 for Prez '08

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Not so simple
Posted by: PaulK on Aug 8, 2008 1:12 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
First,there's a correlation between wealth and population decline. That requires tap dancing around the "simple" issue.

Second, I suspect that 100 billion people could live on the earth in peace. 100 million people could not live on the earth in war.

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» RE: Not so simple Posted by: Beached Whale
High birth rate = high poverty
Posted by: ciccio on Aug 8, 2008 1:47 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The worlds highest birth rates are in Yemen and Afghanistan, not by coincidence two of the poorest and unstable countries in the world. Their record reproduction rate of almost 7 children per woman is only matched by an equally high children's death rate. Somalia comes pretty close. The world had universally condemned the Chinese one child policy when it was introduced in 1980, they continue to bemoan the fact that half a billion Chinese births have been prevented by this inhumanity. It is not the existing 1.3 billion Chinese that have transformed the economy into one of the most prosperous in the world, it is the unborn half billion.

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Bio Evidence SHows humans are obsorbing the ecosphere
Posted by: common intelligence on Aug 8, 2008 5:20 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Frogs are disapearing, bees, bats, 100's of thousands of species are loosing habitat daily due to human encroachment on wild areas.

The oceans are being desimated. Coral reefs are dying species again are vanishing. Salmon, Sharks, even krill ( not because of whales over eating either).

But as the thinning diversity of fauna parrallel the untouched quiet spaces of the wildernesss on land sea and in the air, so goes the available drinking water and arriable lands for the flora to grow freely that provide for the wild living fauna of the mother earth.

Humans segregating masses of land by the increasing the web of highways on land, as well as shipping lanes with increasing traffic and air ways criss-crossing the sky. No space is let alone. 100's of thousand of animals die every year due to vehicular traffic of all types.
But as long as the sick self serving religious nimrods hold on to the idea that the dominion of the planet is OURS to use (up), and "Be fruitful and multiply", then the reason humanity is even here on this planet is lost, along with a reason to even live.

God will not save us from our stupidity.

When each of us takes to heart the value of Being a Humanbeing and find satisfaction without the need of superfulous "stuff" ,
instead of Being a Human Doing that has to constantly be entertained, constantly grasping to fulfill the sick notion that they are entitled to grandigose materialistic surroundings, then the the jewel of Eden will spiraling down into a hellacious existance, if at all.

Procreation by an unconscious society proves humanity is NOT a high living form.
Living a higher consciousness is living responsibly every moment,
Not living so is nothing more than being a Re-Active organism.

Over population IS a reality. But more so humanity is still over procreating.

With a social economy system based on growth (of the volume of production and use of meaningless stuff and over building the need v.s. the necessity) there is no hope.
Excessive use of the planets resources and our inability to meet the demand for materialistic crap only escalates the greed and selfish "entitlement factor".
Bigger, brighter, bolder, "newer", the latest, the best, the most popular.....Vanity is the devils best (poker) hand.

Judge, not the (each others) statis symbols, less ye to be judged!
One upping the Smiths and the Jones is the worst of social sins.

"He who dies with the most toys.......leaves the biggest mess"

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Not so simple
Posted by: chlamor on Aug 8, 2008 7:07 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
People in the United States and Canada account for approximately 5.3% of the global population, yet they produce about 26% of global CO2 emissions one indicator of the amount of energy consumed.

We don't really have to eliminate that many people we just have to get the right ones.

Where does the population debate stand when we account for this waste?

Environmentalists point out that the earth's capacity to sustain current models of consumption is very limited due to numerous problems that ecosystems around the world are already facing. That even though we will continue to find new sources and new ways of using them more efficiently etc, they are still finite, and we use them up at a rate faster than which nature can replenish. While these problems are generally agreed upon, the causes are not. Some believe in the simple Malthusian theories of population growth outstripping resources.

* We see from the U.N. statistics on consumption distribution (on the first consumption page; that the world's wealthiest 20% consume 86% of the world's resources while the poorest 20% consume just a miniscule 1.3%), that it is not most of the world consuming the resources.
* While growing populations naturally place more demands on resources, it is not as simple a reasoning to say that we are overpopulated, or that the poor and heavily populated poor nations are the causes of the environmental degradation, as some automatically conclude.
* Much degradation may be occurring in the poor countries, but global trade and economic models include a lot of enforced export out of poor nations to the centers of capital, where, as per the above U.N. statistics, most of the consumption is done.
* (Of course, the wealthy in the poor countries consume more than the poor in the poorer nations do as well, but often, finished products that poor nations might require, such as industrial tools, even food and health technologies, are made in wealthier countries, as raw materials, commodities etc are first exported there. A double blow for the poor nation then is that they buy back products which are more costly, that have been made often from their own cheap resources.)

Hence, even other issues, such as population-related issues should consider the impact of consumption on the planet more importantly and analyze where that consumption is taking place. Of course, if the entire world's population were to consume in similar ways to the wealthiest, then we would no doubt have even more environmental problems than we are already facing and in relation to how we consume we would have a serious over population issue.

Yet, the roots of this would be in how resources are consumed etc, rather than just population growths and declines. Consumption modes, the political and economic models that support certain ways of consumption therefore have a far greater impact on the environment than “over” population, alone.



The basic theses involved in the discussions about population control are false.

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» Deal with BOTH!! Posted by: janvdb
"as if there were no tomorrow" a self-fulfilling prophesy
Posted by: Daniel35 on Aug 8, 2008 7:19 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There'll be a "solution" all right, but I doubt it will be "equitable", if we could recognise such, and most wouldn't call it "humane". I've been expecting economic collapse for about 40 years, but now I'm looking at likely biosphere collapse within 10 - 20 years through global heating, which we've been hiding from ourselves with 'global dimming from atmospheric pollution. If peak oil and/or economic collapse shut down the airline industry and maybe power plants without any compensating pollution, we may see the rest of the collapse following much sooner.

The basic problem comes down to the animal instinct of greed for security and power, and since "we can't take it with us", for making little copies of ourselves so we can pass it on.

We're approaching the point of "Don't buy green bananas".

danrob at efn.org

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Could it be that there is untold reason behind the demise of US Economy?
Posted by: common intelligence on Aug 8, 2008 9:34 PM   
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As secret and evil as the Powers that are in control, of every thing from the weather to the lack of responsibility to disasters, that "they" may very well be initiating all the economic whoas on the American economy , as well as the world?

I mean if they can stage a full on Pearl Harbor II (911) for the purpose of a center stage location for oil control, "they" could just as well realize that population and over zealous materialism needs to be curbed "for the good of..humanity"?

Maybe "they" are actually really scared too. But in the process "they" don't want a premature world panic that would upset their one world government plans before "they" can get it together.

After all the Gov. of Russia have just attacked their own that want , out and independace from their mother land. What's the name of that providence? I forgot.

But anyway, Our "Gov." has been manipulating weather, media, propganda of all types in order to keep us on the path they have predetermined, by instigating a program of fear where there is nothing to fear.

That moves populations around. It concentrates people into urban masses away from rural areas. Into buying arenas for commercial gain. They use the movies stretegically to influence generations to fulfill lobor force needs.

Remeber during the 70's when all those "trucker" shows were on TV?
That was to stimulate interest in the same because "they" knew that they wanted to jack up the transportaton volume of "stuff", imports and exports. It worked. But now of course, diesel cost has sky rocketed.
(well they over did that!)

They "know" air transport is getting out of hand and "they" know our rail systems need a serious overhaul. Will this fuel crisis spur on the rails for a new era in transportation?

Just watch, as American credability has wained the last 8 years "we" (they) need to make people feel "Am. Pride" while they are living more spartan lives. SO whats in store to promot it?
Why, Captain America of course. Watch for it at a theater near you next summer. ( No kidding! )

This is not by just creative chance this is all coming down.

Look at the Olympics. The biggest marketing scam ever and the athletes are the pawns. Yah, the Olympic, to unite the world, in commercialism.
Man will "they" sell a lot of Nike, Puma, addidas.... shit.
The consiquences: Remember hearing about kids literally killing each other to steal each others Michael Jordan shoes?

YAh, people ..."A sucker's born every minute" PT. Barnum

SO what'll it be. Chinese all want to look like Americans.
Japanese women are having the fat sucked out of their eyelids to "look" like a Americans.

MAn we are "ALL" going to get HIGH DEFINITION TVs as mandated by law.....to get HighDef Commercials! Think about it.

TV's with such crytal clarity there will be no reason to leave our homes (no matter how small they become. "need more space? Just turn on your HD TV! ......Voila!"

AND why in hell are George Bush, Dick Cheney, Paul Wolfowitz, Donald Rumsfeld, and the rest of the band of pirates that pulled a coup da tat on the country not in jail?

What a god damned country.

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Welcome to the site
Posted by: Cattylion on Aug 9, 2008 6:35 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The rich people have such a hard time finding dates, the ***Millionaire4me.com***--This dating site guarantees complete anonymity so you can be sure that your potential mate likes you for your personality and not your status in life.

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It Will Take Global Catastrophe
Posted by: Southern Gal on Aug 9, 2008 6:43 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Bill Moyers Journal did a segment featuring the middle class in India. The young Indian college students who recently graduated and already have jobs were commenting that we in the industrialized countries have had ours for a very long time and it's time for them to get theirs. They are building shopping malls and buying all manner of goods for their families. These students are working for large corporations for much less money than graduates in western countries would receive and the corporations are building factories and businesses in India. They also commented that no one wants to be farmers any more. The global economy has unleashed huge work forces and buying markets for corporate products. This is true in China and India. I don't believe that those people recently allowed into the global candy store really want to hear messages about consumerism being bad for the earth and the environment. Corporations will continue to say that more is better and that the "technology gods" will save us. With corporations and financial markets in control of worldwide governments, it will take a major catastrophe such as a global plague that decimates large populations of people to slow this runaway train of corporations' control of assets and the spread of unchecked consumerism.

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So let's get on with the changes necessary
Posted by: eksommer on Aug 9, 2008 6:47 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Amazing! Reading all the posts to this article has been inspiring. Better than the article in some ways because so many people have had enough of consumerism and waste and overpopulation. Where are all of you?

Shouldn't we start a political party and get rid of the wrong-thinkers in both parties? Who wants to run for office? We moan and complain and then what? Let's do something.

And I totally agree that it is not the Earth that is in danger, although I feel for her angst. The human inhabitants are ones who will suffer. We're pretty much doomed, and for all our brains and opposable thumbs, we really don't get it.

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Wrong People
Posted by: vertical on Aug 9, 2008 12:03 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I think what bothers me most is that the wrong people are the ones driving this problem. For instance, In America if you are a convicted felon your fertility rate is 50% greater than the average American. In this country we will imprisone someone, and we may even execute them, but it would be wrong to take their reproductive rights; Ted Bundy was allowed to marry and father a child while he was sitting on deth row, and to make it even more twisted the woman that gave birth to his daughter was a cousiin of one of his victoms. I say if someone has been convicted of a felony that victomized a child they should loose those reproductive rights.

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Nature vs. Consensus
Posted by: chefranden on Aug 9, 2008 6:25 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I don't understand why people think we can come to some consensus on over population and over consumption. It is hard to get consensus out of 6 people. Getting consensus out of 60 people might be possible. Perhaps 600 people could come to a consensus for a few days, but getting 6 billion people on the same wagon is nothing but a pipe dream.

There are 2 solutions. An authoritarian global government that keeps most people poor and sterile. Or nature doing its thing. i.e. The population will expand to its limits (what ever that may be) and then it will collapse. Perhaps the population will collapse to extinction perhaps not.

I'm betting on nature.

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chuckwagoncharlie
Posted by: chuckwagoncharlie on Aug 9, 2008 7:26 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Too many people is an excellent article that certainly needs to be addressed.The continued unchecked growth of the human population will eventually create stress on the social fabric centered around the basic necessities of food,water,and shelter. Famine will more than likely start the conflicts of war for the control of life sustaining resources and potable water along with oil.
Reduction in populations will not come from controlled breeding but from disease and some form of weapons of mass distruction but a reduction will ultimately have to occur.

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stop thinking outside the box, start thinking outside the planet
Posted by: Llinn on Aug 9, 2008 8:57 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Instead of whining and whinging about the near and future collapse of the environment and society, you might all try to remember that there's a HUGE universe out there. And it has lots of resources no one is using. Right off there's an asteroid belt full of metal and ice. There's a big star pouring megagiga watts of energy through space.

There's too many of us for the planet, sorry but very true. It's time to grow up and move out a little. Put the dirty, smelly factories in space where no one cares. Invest in the future.

Llinn

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life without nature
Posted by: zgregz on Aug 9, 2008 11:51 PM   
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What is amazing to me is how far we seem to move from a real environment to a managed/constructed environment. The fishing hole is no longer, now there are managed use facilities, cause there are more people than resources. How many hours do you need to drive to find a really wild area? People don't realize there used to be woods here and there. I remember playing in fields with honest to gosh insects I still can't name. You may be able to prop up a preferred reality, and man loves to do so, but at some point none of the animals will exist - other than in the zoos. Some concern for the natural world minus the mass market might save us, but don't hold your breath.

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Liberals should abort
Posted by: dave68 on Aug 10, 2008 5:25 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It is obvious to me that the only way to control the population is for liberals to not have children. If a liberal does get pregnant they should put the child up for adoption when the child is born. Once a liberal discovers self awareness they should take themselves out, suicide being the quickest option. A liberal can also refuse medical treatment for a curable disease thereby reducing medical costs, savings that can be passed on to someone who does not use as much carbon. Less liberals in the world will reduce greenhouse gasses as liberals are so full of hot air.

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» Liberal could KILL YOU Posted by: janvdb
What a dick. Put a condom on your slimmy selfish ass mouth.
Posted by: common intelligence on Aug 10, 2008 2:20 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
'Nough said!

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The Steady State Economy
Posted by: vegsister on Aug 12, 2008 12:58 PM   
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Is an idea whose time has come.

Population and economic growth pose dire threats to our survival beyond the next 50 years, not to mention our survival with a quality of life that includes natural beauty, clean and abundant resources, and other species. Continuing to deny the finite carrying capacity of our planet is sheer lunacy.

The concept of the steady state economy offers an alternative to the certain disaster awaiting us at the end of the path of incessant growth. Check out www.steadystate.org.

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The Problem Is Simple: Too Many People, Too Much Stuff
Posted by: dggraham on Aug 12, 2008 12:59 PM   
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With the publishing of "The Limits to Growth" back in the early 70's we've known about the inevitability of this dilemma. Personally, I think we have passed the tipping point for a rational solution. The adverse affects of climate change may reduce population to more sustainable levels; however, I cannot imagine that that change will be pleasant or conflict free. Given our own WMD and those of a few others, it feels like we will be making our own flood soon.

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The leveling of standards of living will take care of this
Posted by: blogbooks on Aug 12, 2008 2:54 PM   
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People seem to think that America is just in a slump, that our go-go days of massive consumption will be back before we know it and we'll all live in homes valued at a few million dollars.

No.

Globalism is raising standards of living around the world. The world is not infinite and neither is our economy. As those 4 billion brown people in Asia buy cars and build suburbs, those of us in the West must concede our living standards.

The apex of Western civilization was roughly 1991. It's all down hill from there baby. If you have children, what can I say? Teach them some realistic life skills and keep them out of World of Warcraft.

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Some things never change
Posted by: ghost in the machine on Aug 13, 2008 3:01 AM   
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Great article ...what many have been thinking and saying for years . Turning nature into commodities for profit is the very essence of capitalism, but we seem totally unable to take it on board that at the end of all our fine words (as in this article ) we keep faith with a political and economic structure that has brought us to this dark place .
This is the lunacy of liberal thinking .How much more of this bullshit are we going to take before we actually kick their arses into touch . Believe me we will end up doing it ...but in far less favourable circumstances...once the liberals who have tied our hands for years run for the door.Obama is already predictably mimicking what "Middle" America wants to hear.
Long live the blind leading the blind

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It's a cycle
Posted by: distancebiker23 on Aug 13, 2008 7:16 AM   
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The human population will not change it's habits (consumption, overpopulating, etc.) until they can't afford to power their car, until they don't have money for christmas presents, and the food supply dwindles to a cabbage soup for dinner. We will not change until we are forced to change by what scarce things are available.

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