COMMENTS: 40
Michael Pollan: Americans' Unhealthy Relationship with Food
October 19, 2007 |
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Interestingly, Mintz's definition of cuisine came down to conversation. For Mintz, Americans just didn't engage in passionate talk about food. Unlike the southwest French and their cassoulet, most Americans don't obsess and quarrel about what comprises, say, an authentic veggie burger.
But if cuisine comes down to talk, things are looking up a decade after Mintz cast his judgment. Now, more and more people are buzzing about food: not only about what's good to eat, but also -- appropriately for the land that invented McDonald's and Cheetos -- about what's in our food, where it came from, how it was grown.
No writer has galvanized this new national conversation on food more than Michael Pollan, from his muckraking articles on the meat industry for The New York Times Magazine earlier this decade to the publication last year of The Omnivore's Dilemma.
On a recent day when he was reviewing the galleys of his latest book, due out in January, I rang up Pollan at his Berkeley, Calif., home to talk ... about food.
Tom Philpott: So tell me a little bit about what you've been working on recently.
Michael Pollen: The new book is called In Defense of Food: An Eater's Manifesto. It's a book that really grew out of questions I heard from readers after Omnivore's Dilemma, which was basically so how do you apply all this? Now that you've looked into the heart of the food system and been into the belly of the beast, how should I eat, and what should I buy, and if I'm concerned about health, what should I be eating? I decided I would see what kind of very practical answers I could give people.
I spent a lot of time looking at the science of nutrition, and learned pretty quickly there's less there than meets the eye, and that the scientists really haven't figured out that much about food. Letting them tell us how to eat is probably not a very good idea, and indeed the culture -- which is to say tradition and our ancestors -- has more to teach us about how to eat well than science does. That was kind of surprising to me.
It really comes down to seven words: "Eat food, not too much, mostly plants." What is food? How do you know whether you're getting food or a food-like product? The interesting thing that I learned was that if you're really concerned about your health, the best decisions for your health turn out to be the best decisions for the farmer and the best decisions for the environment -- and that there is no contradiction there.
TP: The other thing that's interesting, along the same lines, is this idea in American culture that what is good for you tastes bad, and what tastes bad is good for you.
MP: Yes, exactly right. There's no sacrifice in eating well, there is no sacrifice in pleasure. To the contrary, the best-grown food is actually the tastiest. Now, it wasn't always true. I mean, you know, in the first generation of organic farmers, they weren't that good at it. But the quality has dramatically improved and is superb right now.
TP: Then there's this idea that food is something you can endlessly fragment: if you find something in a food that's beneficial, you can isolate it, and concentrate it, and put it in a pill.
MP: It's the reductionist's logic of food science, basically. And the interesting thing is that whenever that has been tried, it has failed. Foods are much more than the sum of their nutrient parts, and you cannot expect to get the same effect. Now there are things like vitamins that have been isolated, and in their isolated form they can cure deficiency diseases. But when they've tried to take out the antioxidants, things like beta-carotene and vitamin E, they don't seem to work.
TP: There's an analogy there with agriculture: the macronutrients in food and the macronutrients in soil. A, B, C, and D vs. N, P, and K. Turns out that soil needs more than just isolated N, P, and K to produce fully nutritious food.
TP: The advice to "eat food, not much, mostly plants" is deceptively simple -- how do you apply that in a society that's become addicted to convenience food?
We cook every night here. My wife and I both work, and we can get a very nice dinner on the table in a half hour. It would not take any less time for us to drive to a fast-food outlet and order, sit down, and bus our table.
[But] when you create this image of people as being hurried, and harried, and of course you need TV dinners, that kind of sinks in. They kind of flatter us by telling us we're too busy and that we have such rushed lives, but in the end we find time for what matters. In just the last 10 years we've found, what, two or three hours a day to deal with the internet? It's a matter of priority, it's not really about ability. Some people are very intimidated about cooking and I think that's a shame, and I think we have to help people get over that by teaching them how to cook, teaching kids how to cook in school.
TP: How did you learn to cook?
MP: I learned to some extent from my mother, who was a really good cook, just hanging out in the kitchen watching her do it. I [had] a classic suburban childhood on Long Island.
My mom cooked dinner four or five nights a week, and always your classic -- there was some kind of protein, and two vegetables, and dessert, the whole bit. And it was a really important part of our family life. When I was living alone in my 20s, when I got my first apartment, I cooked partly because I couldn't afford to go out -- you know, it's kind of a myth that it's more expensive to cook. So I've always been kind of interested in it.
TP: I've lived in places where I could walk five minutes to an incredible farmers' market. There are a lot of people who don't have that privilege in other parts of the country. But I think that is changing, and there's a lot of great programs going on.
MP: I spent a lot of time on the road last year, and I was surprised at where the local food movement was taking root. It was a lot of places that you wouldn't expect it. And I know that there are still food deserts -- ironically they tend to be in the farm belt, a lot of them.
One of the things I always have to be aware of is I live in a place where it's very easy to eat off the supermarket grid, if you will. My farmers' market is open 50 weeks a year, and the CSA runs, I think, 48 weeks a year -- and that's only because they need a break. But I do think that to the extent there are alternatives and people support them, even if they're small now, they will very quickly get much bigger.
TP: Omnivore's Dilemma clearly struck a nerve. Were you surprised by the reaction, and did it start the conversation you were hoping it would?
MP: I was completely flabbergasted by the reaction. I had no idea it would start a conversation to the extent it has. You work on a book for years, and you don't know where the culture's going to be when you finish. And sometimes the message you're bringing happens to coincide with other things going on in the culture, and I think that that's what happened. There were several other very good food books out, and they all did quite well. So I think there was something in the air, and people were receptive to the message.
I was very struck by the energy I felt in audiences and still feel in audiences, which is very much a political energy. At a time when people feel really frustrated about electoral politics, very frustrated about the war, this administration in lots of ways, I think that that's part of what is creating this center of gravity around food.
Because it's really fundamental politics, because -- and I think that you've heard me say this -- you have a power here that you don't have elsewhere. You've got three votes a day, and how you cast those votes, we have seen over the last few years, has a tremendous effect.
The most gratifying thing I hear is farmers, ranchers, who say they're having a great year this year and more people are coming in and asking for pastured livestock, more people are joining CSAs ... consumers are starting to reconceive what it means to be a consumer, and [see] that citizenship is part of consumption. ... People are getting something besides food when they go to the farmers' market, they're getting a sense of community.
TP: Then you really get into local food, it's suddenly about community, coming together -- at the farmers' market, meeting a farmer at the CSA, cooking with your friends and family. Seems like there's a hunger for these things in a post-modern society that's built on suburbia, and the car, and atomization.
MP: You know, people have looked to food for all these values for thousands of years -- food was a way to come together, it was a way to express your identity, it was a way to engage with nature -- food has always had this power.
And I think we've had a kind of temporary forgetting of that, and this idea that food is just fuel, food is about health or illness, these very simplistic, reductive ideas have kind of thinned out the whole experience. But there's a desire to thicken it again, and lo and behold food is providing all these satisfactions that people were missing.
TP: Both of us have been active in the effort to demystify the farm bill and convince people to care about it. What are your hopes for the farm bill at this point?
There's more politics around the farm bill -- more grassroots politics, more reform politics -- than there has been in a generation. At the same time, and as a result of that, there has been a defensive reaction that has been fierce. And there is a resentment that anyone from the outside -- which is to say outside of these commodity crops, outside of the memberships of these committees -- is trying to get in on the issue and get in on the debate. There was a very telling quote in the San Francisco Chronicle by [Rep.] Collin Peterson [D-Minn.] ... where he says, "These city people don't know what they're talking about, they should stay out of it."
I think they understand as soon as they start negotiating these large questions then everyone's going to pile in and we're going to get a very different kind of farm bill, and they just don't want this to happen. And when I say "they," I'm talking about the Midwestern congressmen and senators on both agriculture committees.
Now it may be that the reformers have not done a good enough job of framing proposals in a way that doesn't look threatening. I think the basic tack has been a very simple anti-subsidy tack: "Subsidies are welfare, farmers should fend for themselves when prices are good."
So it looks like you're simply trying to take something away from farmers, and I think politically perhaps that has contributed to the powerful reaction we've seen ... I don't know how to craft those proposals, I'm not a policymaker, but I think we've made a mistake by equating reform with the destruction of farm support.
We'll have to see what happens, but it's not time to give up on this. I detect an enormous amount of anxiety about the politics on the part of the committees, and a sense that other people in Congress are looking now over the shoulder of the ag committee in a way they haven't before. So defensiveness -- you know, this is defensiveness, this isn't just power, and people should realize that.
TP: I was wondering if you'd been back to Iowa since you did your research on Omnivore's Dilemma. When you were there corn was $1.50 a bushel, and now it's $4 a bushel.
MP: I know, the good times are rolling right now. I have not. I'm going to go back this winter, though. The book tour is going to take me to Iowa City, which I'm really looking forward to. Not that that's exactly corn country, but it's close. I've done a lot of radio in the Corn Belt, and it's clear that I've pissed off some people there. And I spoke at Iowa State and a group of people got up and walked out because I was taking the name of corn in vain.
TP: Since Omnivore's Dilemma came out, John Mackey publicly criticized you, and at the same time he started rolling out these local foods measures, and now when you walk into a Whole Foods you see "Buy Local" signs everywhere. What is your take on Whole Foods' Buy Local effort so far?
MP: It was a very interesting exchange with him. It unfolded over the course of several months in these letters, and then he came to Berkeley to have an onstage conversation with me, which was surprising and somewhat courageous of him, given Berkeley's attitude toward Whole Foods.
And in many ways it was a very productive exchange: I learned something about how that company works, and he made some very promising initiatives.
I have seen what you've seen when I go around the country visiting Whole Foods. There's a much greater emphasis on local food in the signage and on the shelf. But I haven't done the kind of systematic look -- and it needs to be done about now -- to see how far they have come. It's not for me to do; I would feel a little awkward doing it myself. But I'm hoping that other journalists will do it.
TP: Well, I know you've got to wrap up. I've had a great time talking to you.
MP: Yeah, me too. It's always great to talk about this stuff -- it's just great that you're out there doing this, and that you bring this perspective as a farmer is very powerful. I've really enjoyed your stuff, and it's been wonderful to see the publicity you've gotten this year. I saw that terrific piece in Gourmet.
TP: Oh, speaking of that, that article in Gourmet exposed my predilection for chips. And my editor wanted me to ask you: What is your junk-food weakness?
MP: Oh, god, let me think ... My favorite packaged junk food has always been Cracker Jacks. Which is, of course, a corn product of a kind. Of several kinds. It's popcorn coated in corn syrup.
TP: I haven't had those in years, but I loved them as a kid.
MP: Cracker Jacks are great. Although the prizes have gone way downhill.
Grist staff writer Tom Philpott farms and cooks at Maverick Farms, a sustainable-agriculture nonprofit and small farm in the Blue Ridge Mountains of North Carolina.
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My cousin made millions from food science
Posted by: Frankstank on Oct 19, 2007 2:08 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: Frankstank on Oct 19, 2007 2:08 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
She is an expert flavouring frozen and chilled meals. She has made a fortune loading them up with salt, fat and chemicals. She is also really fat (she eats her own stuff). It is a sick culture.
I have done alright but chose not to do things that harm other humans. But guess who gets the most respect in the family? The fat multi-millionaire. Until people change their views about life and everything, nothing will stop.
I have done alright but chose not to do things that harm other humans. But guess who gets the most respect in the family? The fat multi-millionaire. Until people change their views about life and everything, nothing will stop.
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» Scarey..
Posted by: messedup
» www.votenic.com
Posted by: votenic
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Re. that "telling quote"
Posted by: Shey on Oct 19, 2007 4:22 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: Shey on Oct 19, 2007 4:22 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
...........in the San Francisco Chronicle by Rep. Collin Peterson (D-Minn.) "These city people don't know what they're talking about, they should stay out of it."
Excuse me? If you eat food, you should most definitely do the opposite. Educate yourself about what you're putting into your body, where it comes from, how it's produced. We're drowning in chemicals and salt and the meat of animals raised in the most unthinkably cruel and inhumane and unsanitary conditions, consuming second-hand antibiotics that are fed to these animals at a rate that is producing an ever growing resistance to medications that were once life saving.
The choices we make when we buy and consume food determines whether we support GMO crops or organic. Environmentally destructive mono-crops that are depleting the soil of nutrients and soaking it in toxic chemicals, produced by gigantic, taxpayer-subsidized agri-business, or the growing move toward more sustainable practices by smaller family farms.
Food production has become a political issue. How dare a member of Congress make such an inflammatory statement? And I'm not one of those "city people", I live in a very rural area where there are as many "Health Food Stores" as supermarkets and where small and organic farms are a powerful force in the politics of food production.
Awareness of the political and ethical ramifications of what we eat is the wave of the future. Dinosaurs like Rep. Peterson need to wake up and smell the organically grown, fair trade coffee.
Excuse me? If you eat food, you should most definitely do the opposite. Educate yourself about what you're putting into your body, where it comes from, how it's produced. We're drowning in chemicals and salt and the meat of animals raised in the most unthinkably cruel and inhumane and unsanitary conditions, consuming second-hand antibiotics that are fed to these animals at a rate that is producing an ever growing resistance to medications that were once life saving.
The choices we make when we buy and consume food determines whether we support GMO crops or organic. Environmentally destructive mono-crops that are depleting the soil of nutrients and soaking it in toxic chemicals, produced by gigantic, taxpayer-subsidized agri-business, or the growing move toward more sustainable practices by smaller family farms.
Food production has become a political issue. How dare a member of Congress make such an inflammatory statement? And I'm not one of those "city people", I live in a very rural area where there are as many "Health Food Stores" as supermarkets and where small and organic farms are a powerful force in the politics of food production.
Awareness of the political and ethical ramifications of what we eat is the wave of the future. Dinosaurs like Rep. Peterson need to wake up and smell the organically grown, fair trade coffee.
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» Yeah.
Posted by: grumble-bum
» RE: e. that "telling quote"
Posted by: jbur816
Comments are closed-
A Growing Hope.
Posted by: grumble-bum on Oct 19, 2007 4:54 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: grumble-bum on Oct 19, 2007 4:54 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I first picked up Pollan's Dilemma with at least a little trepidation; I knew from reading some of his articles that I would likely enjoy parts of it, but when would his city-boy disconnect inevitably cause me to discount parts of his point of view? When would I think, "well, it's all well & good if you live in San Fransisco", or something similarly dismissive? When would I feel overwhelmed & depressed with the hopeless nature of the entrenched mass-produced food industry?
It turns out that I found his writing to be damn near life-changing. He has an infectious open-mindedness, respect for the people he profiles (regardless of their place in the system), & willingness to examine & reevaluate his own preconceptions. Combined with his excellent writing, these qualities are a breath of fresh air in this climate of division & suspicion. At several points, this often cynical reader found himself moved to literal tears.
The end result of reading The Omnivore's Dilemma, & then his earlier Botany of Desire, has been a galvanizing of long-held but scattered beliefs, & a renewed sense of hopeful purpose. Combined with some other influences, I've been inspired to return to school to continue building my knowledge as a long-time professional cook & hopefully apply some of these concepts more fully in my work.
Having now read this interview, I look forward to his forthcoming book. & I see that he hits the nail on the head once again- Indeed, the prizes in Cracker-Jacks are absolute ass anymore!
It turns out that I found his writing to be damn near life-changing. He has an infectious open-mindedness, respect for the people he profiles (regardless of their place in the system), & willingness to examine & reevaluate his own preconceptions. Combined with his excellent writing, these qualities are a breath of fresh air in this climate of division & suspicion. At several points, this often cynical reader found himself moved to literal tears.
The end result of reading The Omnivore's Dilemma, & then his earlier Botany of Desire, has been a galvanizing of long-held but scattered beliefs, & a renewed sense of hopeful purpose. Combined with some other influences, I've been inspired to return to school to continue building my knowledge as a long-time professional cook & hopefully apply some of these concepts more fully in my work.
Having now read this interview, I look forward to his forthcoming book. & I see that he hits the nail on the head once again- Indeed, the prizes in Cracker-Jacks are absolute ass anymore!
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» RE: A Growing Hope.
Posted by: jbur816
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Wonderful article!
Posted by: hagwind on Oct 19, 2007 5:01 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: hagwind on Oct 19, 2007 5:01 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There's so much great stuff in this article I don't even know where to start. Like the connection between "cuisine" and conversation.
And this: "I spent a lot of time looking at the science of nutrition, and learned pretty quickly there's less there than meets the eye, and that the scientists really haven't figured out that much about food. . . . It really comes down to seven words: 'Eat food, not too much, mostly plants.'"
"Foods are much more than the sum of their nutrient parts, and you cannot expect to get the same effect."
And this, which applies to just about everything else too:
"I think that there's some brainwashing going on with this idea that we don't have time to cook anymore. We have made cooking seem much more complicated than it is, and part of that comes from watching cooking shows on television -- we've turned cooking into a spectator sport."
My long-time theory is that (because everything's connected) if you understand one thing very well, you're well on the way to understanding how the world works. Michael Pollan started with food, and what he says about food (and farming, and feeding ourselves) says so much about other things as well.
And this: "I spent a lot of time looking at the science of nutrition, and learned pretty quickly there's less there than meets the eye, and that the scientists really haven't figured out that much about food. . . . It really comes down to seven words: 'Eat food, not too much, mostly plants.'"
"Foods are much more than the sum of their nutrient parts, and you cannot expect to get the same effect."
And this, which applies to just about everything else too:
"I think that there's some brainwashing going on with this idea that we don't have time to cook anymore. We have made cooking seem much more complicated than it is, and part of that comes from watching cooking shows on television -- we've turned cooking into a spectator sport."
My long-time theory is that (because everything's connected) if you understand one thing very well, you're well on the way to understanding how the world works. Michael Pollan started with food, and what he says about food (and farming, and feeding ourselves) says so much about other things as well.
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» RE: Wonderful article!
Posted by: jbur816
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A standout nutrition book
Posted by: BobbieP on Oct 19, 2007 5:04 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: BobbieP on Oct 19, 2007 5:04 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If you are going to read one nutrition book, read the one that is considered the gold standard: the China Study. One thing it says: eat no more than 5% of your calories from animal protein, preferably wild caught fish, and make that small ones, like salmon, not the ones you already know have chemicals in them.
The book is a classic, and it analyses many of the nutrition and health studies out there, and the food and vitamin industries. I completely changed the way I shop and eat after reading this book.
The book is a classic, and it analyses many of the nutrition and health studies out there, and the food and vitamin industries. I completely changed the way I shop and eat after reading this book.
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» RE: A standout nutrition book
Posted by: sliver
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Americans do talk about food.
Posted by: colinmeister on Oct 19, 2007 5:08 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: colinmeister on Oct 19, 2007 5:08 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Even American food. They don't talk about American junk food, but they will talk passionately about local foods. I remrmber an excited man from Connecticut talking about chowder, and deriding Manhattenites for "Putting ketchup in their chowder".
People in New Orleans will talk passionately about gumbo and crawfish, and people in Arkansas talk of fried okra and catfish. Texans are passionate about barbcues, and Chicagoans about their pizza and hot dogs, even though these are modified European foods.
American food has a horrible reputation outside America, due mainly to overseas expansion by junk food chains. I am, of course, English, and will talk passionately about well prepared British food, but of course for some reason Americans don't want to listen :-).
People in New Orleans will talk passionately about gumbo and crawfish, and people in Arkansas talk of fried okra and catfish. Texans are passionate about barbcues, and Chicagoans about their pizza and hot dogs, even though these are modified European foods.
American food has a horrible reputation outside America, due mainly to overseas expansion by junk food chains. I am, of course, English, and will talk passionately about well prepared British food, but of course for some reason Americans don't want to listen :-).
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» RE: Americans do talk about food.
Posted by: Fat Man at the Buffet Line
» RE: Americans do talk about food.
Posted by: sliver
» RE: Americans do talk about food.
Posted by: yesman
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Huh?
Posted by: kelt65 on Oct 19, 2007 6:00 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: kelt65 on Oct 19, 2007 6:00 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I don't agree, that writer's obviously never been to New Orleans if he thinks Americans aren't passionate about food. There are other places as well.
On the whole, though, he's right; most of the US has been overrun with corporate chain restaurants and fast food crap.
On the whole, though, he's right; most of the US has been overrun with corporate chain restaurants and fast food crap.
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Wheat thins and crack cocaine
Posted by: arshi on Oct 19, 2007 6:07 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: arshi on Oct 19, 2007 6:07 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Last year I went hiking and took along some snacks, one of them being Wheat Thins. I sat on some rocks in a small river dropping litle peices of chicken into the water and watched the fish and crawfish feast away. Then I dropped some chips off Wheat Thins and they were ignored. I thought it was weird. Later, I put out some bread and Wheat Thins on a porch and watced as the birds and squirrels came to feast, but none of them ate the Wheat Thins. It was then I began looking into what I was eating, and I've almost completely stopped eating corporate food since then. Yes, it takes effort, and extra money. But if you have any doubt as to why you should not eat corporate food try this next test. Buy some Smart Chicken, or free range, and buy some Perdue chicken. Put them side by side, notice the color, the texture, then cook them the same way side by side and try them. You'll never eat factory chicken again if your smart.
(Sorry vegans, I eat meat in almost half of my diet - nver red though.)
Oh yeah, corporate food, like crack cocaine, are really bad things.
(Sorry vegans, I eat meat in almost half of my diet - nver red though.)
Oh yeah, corporate food, like crack cocaine, are really bad things.
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» Aha!
Posted by: grumble-bum
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Demon Food
Posted by: Gravitas on Oct 19, 2007 8:01 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: Gravitas on Oct 19, 2007 8:01 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Eating is to the left what sexuality is to the right. People must have a morality and with progressives, their hang up is increasingly eating. Just as the right has flaws in its theory so does the left. All this demonization of high fructose corn syrup. But unless one buys organic sugar, sugar production horribly exploits workers. Read about their lives.
Brainwashed we have no time to cook? The author needs to get a reality check on the lives of the working class. After working a dull, stressful, meaningless job all day, maybe the last thing one wants is another chore. Maybe they want something that tastes good to give themselves 2 minutes of pleasure in their otherwise miserable day, whether it is the best nutritional choice for them down the road or not.
Not that I disagree with much of what he says, but it will be academic for the vast majority of the public as the economic crisis worsens. Most people will simply have to consider cost as the bottom line.
Brainwashed we have no time to cook? The author needs to get a reality check on the lives of the working class. After working a dull, stressful, meaningless job all day, maybe the last thing one wants is another chore. Maybe they want something that tastes good to give themselves 2 minutes of pleasure in their otherwise miserable day, whether it is the best nutritional choice for them down the road or not.
Not that I disagree with much of what he says, but it will be academic for the vast majority of the public as the economic crisis worsens. Most people will simply have to consider cost as the bottom line.
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» RE: Demon Food
Posted by: jbur816
» RE: Demon Food
Posted by: yesman
» RE: Demon Food
Posted by: Shey
Comments are closed-
The China study is a sham
Posted by: Focal on Oct 19, 2007 8:19 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: Focal on Oct 19, 2007 8:19 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The China study relied on poor data collection methodology ......ie. pooled blood samples from entire villages and self reported food consumption ....as well as a bias toward the highly flawed cholesterol hypothesis.
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» Sorry, but you hardly have the credentials to refute the China Study
Posted by: jparsons
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Great! Now the Recipes Please!!
Posted by: bjandresen on Oct 19, 2007 8:54 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: bjandresen on Oct 19, 2007 8:54 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I loved the interview and am in total agreement. The only thing is I don't know how to cook a nutritious and tasty meal in 30 minutes. So Michael Pollan, if you read this, how about a book of the recipes of the meals that you and your wife prepare? Even a small book would be helpful. Only the writers of cook books have the time to prepare the elaborate delights that they think up.
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» RE: Great! Now the Recipes Please!!
Posted by: atka
» A Few More Pointers...
Posted by: grumble-bum
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I Cook the Turkey.....It is not a BIG Deal...
Posted by: picket on Oct 19, 2007 9:02 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: picket on Oct 19, 2007 9:02 AM
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not that I didn't make a big mistakes the first few times around!!! My generation X and Y children have limited time and their children just love that fast food....but they also LOVE my "simple" cooking. We still have the junk food but a lot less of it. I have more time now to think.
I know fathers DO HELP but if Mom is shopping, putting them away, planning the meal AND doing the cooking plus holding down a JOB...."Come on People!!!"
Say a prayer over the food...we don't really know where most of it came from. Buy some boneless meat, always have cooking onions, celery, and carrots , some potatoes on hand. Buy the other veggies when they are on sale OR get some bags of frozen. Have some broth and pasta and canned tomatoes ..garlic powder, chili powder etc ...you will need a responsible non accident prone person to chop the veggies. Desserts are a must ...do a lot more with fresh cooked apples, peaches etc...don't need all that pie crust, limit ice cream portions [ for the kids only]...
Love watching the cooking shows BUT there is no way I am using all that butter, cream and olive oil, no wonder it tastes so good....but I get a LOT of great ideas.
Gotta go the "kids" are here.
I know fathers DO HELP but if Mom is shopping, putting them away, planning the meal AND doing the cooking plus holding down a JOB...."Come on People!!!"
Say a prayer over the food...we don't really know where most of it came from. Buy some boneless meat, always have cooking onions, celery, and carrots , some potatoes on hand. Buy the other veggies when they are on sale OR get some bags of frozen. Have some broth and pasta and canned tomatoes ..garlic powder, chili powder etc ...you will need a responsible non accident prone person to chop the veggies. Desserts are a must ...do a lot more with fresh cooked apples, peaches etc...don't need all that pie crust, limit ice cream portions [ for the kids only]...
Love watching the cooking shows BUT there is no way I am using all that butter, cream and olive oil, no wonder it tastes so good....but I get a LOT of great ideas.
Gotta go the "kids" are here.
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Farm subsidies
Posted by: BlueTigress on Oct 19, 2007 10:35 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: BlueTigress on Oct 19, 2007 10:35 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This is something that started out as simple that got complicated when the factory farmers (Archer Daniels Midland, Conagra, etc) got into the act.
They discovered that if they broke up their giant farms on paper and assigned them to employees, they could collect the subsidy checks because the farms were "individually owned". I saw a stat several years ago that ADM was making $300 MILLION a year doing this.
That is just plain wrong.
They discovered that if they broke up their giant farms on paper and assigned them to employees, they could collect the subsidy checks because the farms were "individually owned". I saw a stat several years ago that ADM was making $300 MILLION a year doing this.
That is just plain wrong.
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Even More Important Than Iraq: America Needs a New Cheese
Posted by: maxpayne on Oct 19, 2007 11:39 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: maxpayne on Oct 19, 2007 11:39 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
OCTOBER 27, 2006 – The most amazing thing about our nation at this moment is that no one even knows what the real, important issues are. All over the country people are freaking out about Iraq Five more people dead. Ten more. One hundred Iraqis. Seven Americans. Billions more dollars.
This people are worried about. But the far bigger problem, the problem of American Cheese - that, no one has the courage to even speak out about, never mind take on.
In fact, people look at me sideways when I try to broach the topic with them.
"Which party are you going to vote for this election," my friend asked me a few days ago.
"Which one is ready to legislate us a new national cheese?" I asked in return.
And all I got was a stare - that stare; the one I get again and again, every time I point out the cheese problem - a problem of scale and scope beyond Global Warming, Iraq, and Iran getting nukes combined.
Great, now you're looking at me like, too. But I'm not joking, I'm serious.
It all began some decades ago. Remember when Willy Lowman, that character in Arthur Miller's Death of A Salesman, asked, "How can you whip cheese?"
Well, Willy was right. You can't. Not real cheese. Not actual cheese. Not cheese that is actually cheese.
Ah... now the point is beginning to come out, isn't it.
But no, you don't want to listen. You let poor Willy Lowman run off unheard until he was so depressed he offed himself.
But now stop. And look at the basic reality: the cheese that bears our nation's proud name, American Cheese, is, well, not cheese at all. It is pressed, hydrogenated soybean oil.
So, in fact, not only is not actual cheese, but, even worse, it is not something humans can consume healthily. While cheese is an actual food and is good for you, American Cheese is a manufactured fake food that, thanks to the trans fats known as hydrogenated oil, is horrible for you.
Everyday we eat it. We go get a "cheeseburger." There's no cheese on it, it's this fake, deadly crap that, for some inexcusable reason, gets to wear our nation's good name.
This, my friends, is where it all began - yes, this is how we got to obesity, TV addiction, and, yes, even Iraq.
You don't think American Cheese got us into Iraq?
By accepting and consuming the non-cheese, non-edible garbage called American Cheese as if it were cheese, we set a precedent that has been followed again and again.
Click above to read the rest of the article.
This people are worried about. But the far bigger problem, the problem of American Cheese - that, no one has the courage to even speak out about, never mind take on.
In fact, people look at me sideways when I try to broach the topic with them.
"Which party are you going to vote for this election," my friend asked me a few days ago.
"Which one is ready to legislate us a new national cheese?" I asked in return.
And all I got was a stare - that stare; the one I get again and again, every time I point out the cheese problem - a problem of scale and scope beyond Global Warming, Iraq, and Iran getting nukes combined.
Great, now you're looking at me like, too. But I'm not joking, I'm serious.
It all began some decades ago. Remember when Willy Lowman, that character in Arthur Miller's Death of A Salesman, asked, "How can you whip cheese?"
Well, Willy was right. You can't. Not real cheese. Not actual cheese. Not cheese that is actually cheese.
Ah... now the point is beginning to come out, isn't it.
But no, you don't want to listen. You let poor Willy Lowman run off unheard until he was so depressed he offed himself.
But now stop. And look at the basic reality: the cheese that bears our nation's proud name, American Cheese, is, well, not cheese at all. It is pressed, hydrogenated soybean oil.
So, in fact, not only is not actual cheese, but, even worse, it is not something humans can consume healthily. While cheese is an actual food and is good for you, American Cheese is a manufactured fake food that, thanks to the trans fats known as hydrogenated oil, is horrible for you.
Everyday we eat it. We go get a "cheeseburger." There's no cheese on it, it's this fake, deadly crap that, for some inexcusable reason, gets to wear our nation's good name.
This, my friends, is where it all began - yes, this is how we got to obesity, TV addiction, and, yes, even Iraq.
You don't think American Cheese got us into Iraq?
By accepting and consuming the non-cheese, non-edible garbage called American Cheese as if it were cheese, we set a precedent that has been followed again and again.
Click above to read the rest of the article.
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» I was shocked to learn that Canadians call American cheese...
Posted by: war_on_tara
» My friend declared his Krapt singles slices at Customs in New Zealand
Posted by: jparsons
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A Jargon Question
Posted by: Fruno on Oct 20, 2007 11:21 AM
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Posted by: Fruno on Oct 20, 2007 11:21 AM
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So . . . what is a CSA? Am I once again the last to learn a new jargon term?
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» RE: A Jargon Question
Posted by: Fat Man at the Buffet Line
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www.votenic.com
Posted by: votenic on Oct 21, 2007 9:04 PM
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Posted by: votenic on Oct 21, 2007 9:04 PM
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2008 PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION WEEKLY POLL
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Results Posted Tuesday Evening.
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http://www.votenic.com
Results Posted Tuesday Evening.
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American's don't argue the perfect food?!
Posted by: swarmofkillermonkeys on Oct 22, 2007 2:56 PM
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Posted by: swarmofkillermonkeys on Oct 22, 2007 2:56 PM
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OK. Great interview, actually. But I also take exception to:
For Mintz, Americans just didn't engage in passionate talk about food. Unlike the southwest French and their cassoulet, most Americans don't obsess and quarrel about what comprises, say, an authentic veggie burger.
Aside from the regional specialties mentioned, apparently this person has had neither PIZZA nor BBQ!
Heck, I've seen fistfights over ordering "real pizza" (Chicago Style) versus "good pizza" (New York Style). Yeesh, don't even get me started on when someone pipes up with a, "hey, how about a whole-wheat crust with that nasty white goo instead of tomato sauce from a chain restaurant?" That's just asking for it. Passion abounds in American pizza.
BBQ is the more traditional argument food, of course, because there is so much more to argue over. Gas, briquettes, or honest wood chunks? What kind of wood smoke? Again from shavings, chips, pellets or chunk? Does is HAVE to be offset only to be called BBQ? Then why do people call grilling (which is really broiling) BBQ? Doesn't there HAVE to be wood (not that imitation black goop)? Larding with garlic? Dry rub? Wet mop? Is Pork really the one true BBQ meat? And then the sauces... or no sauce? Vinegar or no? Which cut is best? Bone in or bone out? How do you serve it?
Man... I need some BBQ... Pork shoulder, hickory or pecan chunks over gas (or as wood chunks), thick dry rub, 14 hours, NO sauce!. Well, maybe juuust a little North Carolina or St. Louis style if it is somehow dry -- Texas and KC is for BEEF!. Mmm, beef. Brisket of course, larded with garlic, no dry rub, mesquite again over gas, with Texas style thin and spicy sauce (not so much vinegar or sugar).
Whew! Man, I'm hungry. How about you?
For Mintz, Americans just didn't engage in passionate talk about food. Unlike the southwest French and their cassoulet, most Americans don't obsess and quarrel about what comprises, say, an authentic veggie burger.
Aside from the regional specialties mentioned, apparently this person has had neither PIZZA nor BBQ!
Heck, I've seen fistfights over ordering "real pizza" (Chicago Style) versus "good pizza" (New York Style). Yeesh, don't even get me started on when someone pipes up with a, "hey, how about a whole-wheat crust with that nasty white goo instead of tomato sauce from a chain restaurant?" That's just asking for it. Passion abounds in American pizza.
BBQ is the more traditional argument food, of course, because there is so much more to argue over. Gas, briquettes, or honest wood chunks? What kind of wood smoke? Again from shavings, chips, pellets or chunk? Does is HAVE to be offset only to be called BBQ? Then why do people call grilling (which is really broiling) BBQ? Doesn't there HAVE to be wood (not that imitation black goop)? Larding with garlic? Dry rub? Wet mop? Is Pork really the one true BBQ meat? And then the sauces... or no sauce? Vinegar or no? Which cut is best? Bone in or bone out? How do you serve it?
Man... I need some BBQ... Pork shoulder, hickory or pecan chunks over gas (or as wood chunks), thick dry rub, 14 hours, NO sauce!. Well, maybe juuust a little North Carolina or St. Louis style if it is somehow dry -- Texas and KC is for BEEF!. Mmm, beef. Brisket of course, larded with garlic, no dry rub, mesquite again over gas, with Texas style thin and spicy sauce (not so much vinegar or sugar).
Whew! Man, I'm hungry. How about you?
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» RE: American's don't argue the perfect food?!
Posted by: Shey
» RE: American's don't argue the perfect food?!
Posted by: swarmofkillermonkeys
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A Vegetarian always has to post when it comes to food topics
Posted by: dennisinmemphis on Oct 23, 2007 10:11 PM
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Posted by: dennisinmemphis on Oct 23, 2007 10:11 PM
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So here it is - I'm the veg head in the family- husband to one and parent to two omnivores - so don't imagine I have anything particularly dictocratic to say to anyone who likes to eat some meat. But the point I'd like to make is that on the whole WAY LESS meat in a typical diet would be good both for you and the world you [we] live in. There's all kinds of statistics to demonstrate this - goveg.com if you are interested is a good place to start. I truly don't have any desire to 'stamp-out' meat eating - but I am befuddled, and dismayed overall to see the unnecessarily large meat portioning that is advertised so frequently as the centerpiece of every meal.
At this point I'm the primary cook and I don't cook meat. IF the wife or kids [teens] want their meat they know they have to cook it themselves. Mostly they don't though - and so they are very light omnivores. They think they're too busy I guess. I can tell you in my experience vegetarian cooking is cleaner [no grease] - way easier to clean up after and cheaper. An article ran on MSN a while back which presented a comparative cost study of meat/omnivore vs. vegetarian and vegetarian came out on top as the economical winner. Remarkable really in view of the fact that our agribusiness system is so geared-up to produce meat! Once you learn to focus on plant protein complementing as the center [more or less] of meal planning, it is easy. Once you master a few basic cooking methods you hardly even need cookbooks. And the author is correct - it's not that hard to put on a meal in 30 mins. You do definitely have to keep your pantry stocked though. Nothing to work with can defeat those good intentions. I have to drive across town for the farmers market - but I do go a couple times a month --the Wild Oats supermarket is just a few minutes so I can always get my organic 'fix' in there.
The short of it - eat less or no meat - you won't miss it [most people anyway], it's green and good and ecologically sound, and cheaper too.
At this point I'm the primary cook and I don't cook meat. IF the wife or kids [teens] want their meat they know they have to cook it themselves. Mostly they don't though - and so they are very light omnivores. They think they're too busy I guess. I can tell you in my experience vegetarian cooking is cleaner [no grease] - way easier to clean up after and cheaper. An article ran on MSN a while back which presented a comparative cost study of meat/omnivore vs. vegetarian and vegetarian came out on top as the economical winner. Remarkable really in view of the fact that our agribusiness system is so geared-up to produce meat! Once you learn to focus on plant protein complementing as the center [more or less] of meal planning, it is easy. Once you master a few basic cooking methods you hardly even need cookbooks. And the author is correct - it's not that hard to put on a meal in 30 mins. You do definitely have to keep your pantry stocked though. Nothing to work with can defeat those good intentions. I have to drive across town for the farmers market - but I do go a couple times a month --the Wild Oats supermarket is just a few minutes so I can always get my organic 'fix' in there.
The short of it - eat less or no meat - you won't miss it [most people anyway], it's green and good and ecologically sound, and cheaper too.
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My cousin made millions from food science
Posted by: Frankstank on Oct 19, 2007 2:08 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: Frankstank on Oct 19, 2007 2:08 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
She is an expert flavouring frozen and chilled meals. She has made a fortune loading them up with salt, fat and chemicals. She is also really fat (she eats her own stuff). It is a sick culture.
I have done alright but chose not to do things that harm other humans. But guess who gets the most respect in the family? The fat multi-millionaire. Until people change their views about life and everything, nothing will stop.
I have done alright but chose not to do things that harm other humans. But guess who gets the most respect in the family? The fat multi-millionaire. Until people change their views about life and everything, nothing will stop.
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Re. that "telling quote"
Posted by: Shey on Oct 19, 2007 4:22 AM
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Posted by: Shey on Oct 19, 2007 4:22 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
...........in the San Francisco Chronicle by Rep. Collin Peterson (D-Minn.) "These city people don't know what they're talking about, they should stay out of it."
Excuse me? If you eat food, you should most definitely do the opposite. Educate yourself about what you're putting into your body, where it comes from, how it's produced. We're drowning in chemicals and salt and the meat of animals raised in the most unthinkably cruel and inhumane and unsanitary conditions, consuming second-hand antibiotics that are fed to these animals at a rate that is producing an ever growing resistance to medications that were once life saving.
The choices we make when we buy and consume food determines whether we support GMO crops or organic. Environmentally destructive mono-crops that are depleting the soil of nutrients and soaking it in toxic chemicals, produced by gigantic, taxpayer-subsidized agri-business, or the growing move toward more sustainable practices by smaller family farms.
Food production has become a political issue. How dare a member of Congress make such an inflammatory statement? And I'm not one of those "city people", I live in a very rural area where there are as many "Health Food Stores" as supermarkets and where small and organic farms are a powerful force in the politics of food production.
Awareness of the political and ethical ramifications of what we eat is the wave of the future. Dinosaurs like Rep. Peterson need to wake up and smell the organically grown, fair trade coffee.
Excuse me? If you eat food, you should most definitely do the opposite. Educate yourself about what you're putting into your body, where it comes from, how it's produced. We're drowning in chemicals and salt and the meat of animals raised in the most unthinkably cruel and inhumane and unsanitary conditions, consuming second-hand antibiotics that are fed to these animals at a rate that is producing an ever growing resistance to medications that were once life saving.
The choices we make when we buy and consume food determines whether we support GMO crops or organic. Environmentally destructive mono-crops that are depleting the soil of nutrients and soaking it in toxic chemicals, produced by gigantic, taxpayer-subsidized agri-business, or the growing move toward more sustainable practices by smaller family farms.
Food production has become a political issue. How dare a member of Congress make such an inflammatory statement? And I'm not one of those "city people", I live in a very rural area where there are as many "Health Food Stores" as supermarkets and where small and organic farms are a powerful force in the politics of food production.
Awareness of the political and ethical ramifications of what we eat is the wave of the future. Dinosaurs like Rep. Peterson need to wake up and smell the organically grown, fair trade coffee.
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» Yeah.
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» RE: e. that "telling quote"
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A Growing Hope.
Posted by: grumble-bum on Oct 19, 2007 4:54 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: grumble-bum on Oct 19, 2007 4:54 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I first picked up Pollan's Dilemma with at least a little trepidation; I knew from reading some of his articles that I would likely enjoy parts of it, but when would his city-boy disconnect inevitably cause me to discount parts of his point of view? When would I think, "well, it's all well & good if you live in San Fransisco", or something similarly dismissive? When would I feel overwhelmed & depressed with the hopeless nature of the entrenched mass-produced food industry?
It turns out that I found his writing to be damn near life-changing. He has an infectious open-mindedness, respect for the people he profiles (regardless of their place in the system), & willingness to examine & reevaluate his own preconceptions. Combined with his excellent writing, these qualities are a breath of fresh air in this climate of division & suspicion. At several points, this often cynical reader found himself moved to literal tears.
The end result of reading The Omnivore's Dilemma, & then his earlier Botany of Desire, has been a galvanizing of long-held but scattered beliefs, & a renewed sense of hopeful purpose. Combined with some other influences, I've been inspired to return to school to continue building my knowledge as a long-time professional cook & hopefully apply some of these concepts more fully in my work.
Having now read this interview, I look forward to his forthcoming book. & I see that he hits the nail on the head once again- Indeed, the prizes in Cracker-Jacks are absolute ass anymore!
It turns out that I found his writing to be damn near life-changing. He has an infectious open-mindedness, respect for the people he profiles (regardless of their place in the system), & willingness to examine & reevaluate his own preconceptions. Combined with his excellent writing, these qualities are a breath of fresh air in this climate of division & suspicion. At several points, this often cynical reader found himself moved to literal tears.
The end result of reading The Omnivore's Dilemma, & then his earlier Botany of Desire, has been a galvanizing of long-held but scattered beliefs, & a renewed sense of hopeful purpose. Combined with some other influences, I've been inspired to return to school to continue building my knowledge as a long-time professional cook & hopefully apply some of these concepts more fully in my work.
Having now read this interview, I look forward to his forthcoming book. & I see that he hits the nail on the head once again- Indeed, the prizes in Cracker-Jacks are absolute ass anymore!
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» RE: A Growing Hope.
Posted by: jbur816
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Wonderful article!
Posted by: hagwind on Oct 19, 2007 5:01 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: hagwind on Oct 19, 2007 5:01 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There's so much great stuff in this article I don't even know where to start. Like the connection between "cuisine" and conversation.
And this: "I spent a lot of time looking at the science of nutrition, and learned pretty quickly there's less there than meets the eye, and that the scientists really haven't figured out that much about food. . . . It really comes down to seven words: 'Eat food, not too much, mostly plants.'"
"Foods are much more than the sum of their nutrient parts, and you cannot expect to get the same effect."
And this, which applies to just about everything else too:
"I think that there's some brainwashing going on with this idea that we don't have time to cook anymore. We have made cooking seem much more complicated than it is, and part of that comes from watching cooking shows on television -- we've turned cooking into a spectator sport."
My long-time theory is that (because everything's connected) if you understand one thing very well, you're well on the way to understanding how the world works. Michael Pollan started with food, and what he says about food (and farming, and feeding ourselves) says so much about other things as well.
And this: "I spent a lot of time looking at the science of nutrition, and learned pretty quickly there's less there than meets the eye, and that the scientists really haven't figured out that much about food. . . . It really comes down to seven words: 'Eat food, not too much, mostly plants.'"
"Foods are much more than the sum of their nutrient parts, and you cannot expect to get the same effect."
And this, which applies to just about everything else too:
"I think that there's some brainwashing going on with this idea that we don't have time to cook anymore. We have made cooking seem much more complicated than it is, and part of that comes from watching cooking shows on television -- we've turned cooking into a spectator sport."
My long-time theory is that (because everything's connected) if you understand one thing very well, you're well on the way to understanding how the world works. Michael Pollan started with food, and what he says about food (and farming, and feeding ourselves) says so much about other things as well.
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» RE: Wonderful article!
Posted by: jbur816
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A standout nutrition book
Posted by: BobbieP on Oct 19, 2007 5:04 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: BobbieP on Oct 19, 2007 5:04 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If you are going to read one nutrition book, read the one that is considered the gold standard: the China Study. One thing it says: eat no more than 5% of your calories from animal protein, preferably wild caught fish, and make that small ones, like salmon, not the ones you already know have chemicals in them.
The book is a classic, and it analyses many of the nutrition and health studies out there, and the food and vitamin industries. I completely changed the way I shop and eat after reading this book.
The book is a classic, and it analyses many of the nutrition and health studies out there, and the food and vitamin industries. I completely changed the way I shop and eat after reading this book.
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» RE: A standout nutrition book
Posted by: sliver
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Americans do talk about food.
Posted by: colinmeister on Oct 19, 2007 5:08 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: colinmeister on Oct 19, 2007 5:08 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Even American food. They don't talk about American junk food, but they will talk passionately about local foods. I remrmber an excited man from Connecticut talking about chowder, and deriding Manhattenites for "Putting ketchup in their chowder".
People in New Orleans will talk passionately about gumbo and crawfish, and people in Arkansas talk of fried okra and catfish. Texans are passionate about barbcues, and Chicagoans about their pizza and hot dogs, even though these are modified European foods.
American food has a horrible reputation outside America, due mainly to overseas expansion by junk food chains. I am, of course, English, and will talk passionately about well prepared British food, but of course for some reason Americans don't want to listen :-).
People in New Orleans will talk passionately about gumbo and crawfish, and people in Arkansas talk of fried okra and catfish. Texans are passionate about barbcues, and Chicagoans about their pizza and hot dogs, even though these are modified European foods.
American food has a horrible reputation outside America, due mainly to overseas expansion by junk food chains. I am, of course, English, and will talk passionately about well prepared British food, but of course for some reason Americans don't want to listen :-).
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» RE: Americans do talk about food.
Posted by: Fat Man at the Buffet Line
» RE: Americans do talk about food.
Posted by: sliver
» RE: Americans do talk about food.
Posted by: yesman
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Huh?
Posted by: kelt65 on Oct 19, 2007 6:00 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: kelt65 on Oct 19, 2007 6:00 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I don't agree, that writer's obviously never been to New Orleans if he thinks Americans aren't passionate about food. There are other places as well.
On the whole, though, he's right; most of the US has been overrun with corporate chain restaurants and fast food crap.
On the whole, though, he's right; most of the US has been overrun with corporate chain restaurants and fast food crap.
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Wheat thins and crack cocaine
Posted by: arshi on Oct 19, 2007 6:07 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: arshi on Oct 19, 2007 6:07 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Last year I went hiking and took along some snacks, one of them being Wheat Thins. I sat on some rocks in a small river dropping litle peices of chicken into the water and watched the fish and crawfish feast away. Then I dropped some chips off Wheat Thins and they were ignored. I thought it was weird. Later, I put out some bread and Wheat Thins on a porch and watced as the birds and squirrels came to feast, but none of them ate the Wheat Thins. It was then I began looking into what I was eating, and I've almost completely stopped eating corporate food since then. Yes, it takes effort, and extra money. But if you have any doubt as to why you should not eat corporate food try this next test. Buy some Smart Chicken, or free range, and buy some Perdue chicken. Put them side by side, notice the color, the texture, then cook them the same way side by side and try them. You'll never eat factory chicken again if your smart.
(Sorry vegans, I eat meat in almost half of my diet - nver red though.)
Oh yeah, corporate food, like crack cocaine, are really bad things.
(Sorry vegans, I eat meat in almost half of my diet - nver red though.)
Oh yeah, corporate food, like crack cocaine, are really bad things.
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» Aha!
Posted by: grumble-bum
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Demon Food
Posted by: Gravitas on Oct 19, 2007 8:01 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: Gravitas on Oct 19, 2007 8:01 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Eating is to the left what sexuality is to the right. People must have a morality and with progressives, their hang up is increasingly eating. Just as the right has flaws in its theory so does the left. All this demonization of high fructose corn syrup. But unless one buys organic sugar, sugar production horribly exploits workers. Read about their lives.
Brainwashed we have no time to cook? The author needs to get a reality check on the lives of the working class. After working a dull, stressful, meaningless job all day, maybe the last thing one wants is another chore. Maybe they want something that tastes good to give themselves 2 minutes of pleasure in their otherwise miserable day, whether it is the best nutritional choice for them down the road or not.
Not that I disagree with much of what he says, but it will be academic for the vast majority of the public as the economic crisis worsens. Most people will simply have to consider cost as the bottom line.
Brainwashed we have no time to cook? The author needs to get a reality check on the lives of the working class. After working a dull, stressful, meaningless job all day, maybe the last thing one wants is another chore. Maybe they want something that tastes good to give themselves 2 minutes of pleasure in their otherwise miserable day, whether it is the best nutritional choice for them down the road or not.
Not that I disagree with much of what he says, but it will be academic for the vast majority of the public as the economic crisis worsens. Most people will simply have to consider cost as the bottom line.
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» RE: Demon Food
Posted by: jbur816
» RE: Demon Food
Posted by: yesman
» RE: Demon Food
Posted by: Shey
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The China study is a sham
Posted by: Focal on Oct 19, 2007 8:19 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: Focal on Oct 19, 2007 8:19 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The China study relied on poor data collection methodology ......ie. pooled blood samples from entire villages and self reported food consumption ....as well as a bias toward the highly flawed cholesterol hypothesis.
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» Sorry, but you hardly have the credentials to refute the China Study
Posted by: jparsons
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Great! Now the Recipes Please!!
Posted by: bjandresen on Oct 19, 2007 8:54 AM
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Posted by: bjandresen on Oct 19, 2007 8:54 AM
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I loved the interview and am in total agreement. The only thing is I don't know how to cook a nutritious and tasty meal in 30 minutes. So Michael Pollan, if you read this, how about a book of the recipes of the meals that you and your wife prepare? Even a small book would be helpful. Only the writers of cook books have the time to prepare the elaborate delights that they think up.
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» RE: Great! Now the Recipes Please!!
Posted by: atka
» A Few More Pointers...
Posted by: grumble-bum
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I Cook the Turkey.....It is not a BIG Deal...
Posted by: picket on Oct 19, 2007 9:02 AM
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Posted by: picket on Oct 19, 2007 9:02 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
not that I didn't make a big mistakes the first few times around!!! My generation X and Y children have limited time and their children just love that fast food....but they also LOVE my "simple" cooking. We still have the junk food but a lot less of it. I have more time now to think.
I know fathers DO HELP but if Mom is shopping, putting them away, planning the meal AND doing the cooking plus holding down a JOB...."Come on People!!!"
Say a prayer over the food...we don't really know where most of it came from. Buy some boneless meat, always have cooking onions, celery, and carrots , some potatoes on hand. Buy the other veggies when they are on sale OR get some bags of frozen. Have some broth and pasta and canned tomatoes ..garlic powder, chili powder etc ...you will need a responsible non accident prone person to chop the veggies. Desserts are a must ...do a lot more with fresh cooked apples, peaches etc...don't need all that pie crust, limit ice cream portions [ for the kids only]...
Love watching the cooking shows BUT there is no way I am using all that butter, cream and olive oil, no wonder it tastes so good....but I get a LOT of great ideas.
Gotta go the "kids" are here.
I know fathers DO HELP but if Mom is shopping, putting them away, planning the meal AND doing the cooking plus holding down a JOB...."Come on People!!!"
Say a prayer over the food...we don't really know where most of it came from. Buy some boneless meat, always have cooking onions, celery, and carrots , some potatoes on hand. Buy the other veggies when they are on sale OR get some bags of frozen. Have some broth and pasta and canned tomatoes ..garlic powder, chili powder etc ...you will need a responsible non accident prone person to chop the veggies. Desserts are a must ...do a lot more with fresh cooked apples, peaches etc...don't need all that pie crust, limit ice cream portions [ for the kids only]...
Love watching the cooking shows BUT there is no way I am using all that butter, cream and olive oil, no wonder it tastes so good....but I get a LOT of great ideas.
Gotta go the "kids" are here.
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Farm subsidies
Posted by: BlueTigress on Oct 19, 2007 10:35 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: BlueTigress on Oct 19, 2007 10:35 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This is something that started out as simple that got complicated when the factory farmers (Archer Daniels Midland, Conagra, etc) got into the act.
They discovered that if they broke up their giant farms on paper and assigned them to employees, they could collect the subsidy checks because the farms were "individually owned". I saw a stat several years ago that ADM was making $300 MILLION a year doing this.
That is just plain wrong.
They discovered that if they broke up their giant farms on paper and assigned them to employees, they could collect the subsidy checks because the farms were "individually owned". I saw a stat several years ago that ADM was making $300 MILLION a year doing this.
That is just plain wrong.
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Even More Important Than Iraq: America Needs a New Cheese
Posted by: maxpayne on Oct 19, 2007 11:39 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Posted by: maxpayne on Oct 19, 2007 11:39 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
OCTOBER 27, 2006 – The most amazing thing about our nation at this moment is that no one even knows what the real, important issues are. All over the country people are freaking out about Iraq Five more people dead. Ten more. One hundred Iraqis. Seven Americans. Billions more dollars.
This people are worried about. But the far bigger problem, the problem of American Cheese - that, no one has the courage to even speak out about, never mind take on.
In fact, people look at me sideways when I try to broach the topic with them.
"Which party are you going to vote for this election," my friend asked me a few days ago.
"Which one is ready to legislate us a new national cheese?" I asked in return.
And all I got was a stare - that stare; the one I get again and again, every time I point out the cheese problem - a problem of scale and scope beyond Global Warming, Iraq, and Iran getting nukes combined.
Great, now you're looking at me like, too. But I'm not joking, I'm serious.
It all began some decades ago. Remember when Willy Lowman, that character in Arthur Miller's Death of A Salesman, asked, "How can you whip cheese?"
Well, Willy was right. You can't. Not real cheese. Not actual cheese. Not cheese that is actually cheese.
Ah... now the point is beginning to come out, isn't it.
But no, you don't want to listen. You let poor Willy Lowman run off unheard until he was so depressed he offed himself.
But now stop. And look at the basic reality: the cheese that bears our nation's proud name, American Cheese, is, well, not cheese at all. It is pressed, hydrogenated soybean oil.
So, in fact, not only is not actual cheese, but, even worse, it is not something humans can consume healthily. While cheese is an actual food and is good for you, American Cheese is a manufactured fake food that, thanks to the trans fats known as hydrogenated oil, is horrible for you.
Everyday we eat it. We go get a "cheeseburger." There's no cheese on it, it's this fake, deadly crap that, for some inexcusable reason, gets to wear our nation's good name.
This, my friends, is where it all began - yes, this is how we got to obesity, TV addiction, and, yes, even Iraq.
You don't think American Cheese got us into Iraq?
By accepting and consuming the non-cheese, non-edible garbage called American Cheese as if it were cheese, we set a precedent that has been followed again and again.
Click above to read the rest of the article.
This people are worried about. But the far bigger problem, the problem of American Cheese - that, no one has the courage to even speak out about, never mind take on.
In fact, people look at me sideways when I try to broach the topic with them.
"Which party are you going to vote for this election," my friend asked me a few days ago.
"Which one is ready to legislate us a new national cheese?" I asked in return.
And all I got was a stare - that stare; the one I get again and again, every time I point out the cheese problem - a problem of scale and scope beyond Global Warming, Iraq, and Iran getting nukes combined.
Great, now you're looking at me like, too. But I'm not joking, I'm serious.
It all began some decades ago. Remember when Willy Lowman, that character in Arthur Miller's Death of A Salesman, asked, "How can you whip cheese?"
Well, Willy was right. You can't. Not real cheese. Not actual cheese. Not cheese that is actually cheese.
Ah... now the point is beginning to come out, isn't it.
But no, you don't want to listen. You let poor Willy Lowman run off unheard until he was so depressed he offed himself.
But now stop. And look at the basic reality: the cheese that bears our nation's proud name, American Cheese, is, well, not cheese at all. It is pressed, hydrogenated soybean oil.
So, in fact, not only is not actual cheese, but, even worse, it is not something humans can consume healthily. While cheese is an actual food and is good for you, American Cheese is a manufactured fake food that, thanks to the trans fats known as hydrogenated oil, is horrible for you.
Everyday we eat it. We go get a "cheeseburger." There's no cheese on it, it's this fake, deadly crap that, for some inexcusable reason, gets to wear our nation's good name.
This, my friends, is where it all began - yes, this is how we got to obesity, TV addiction, and, yes, even Iraq.
You don't think American Cheese got us into Iraq?
By accepting and consuming the non-cheese, non-edible garbage called American Cheese as if it were cheese, we set a precedent that has been followed again and again.
Click above to read the rest of the article.
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» I was shocked to learn that Canadians call American cheese...
Posted by: war_on_tara
» My friend declared his Krapt singles slices at Customs in New Zealand
Posted by: jparsons
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A Jargon Question
Posted by: Fruno on Oct 20, 2007 11:21 AM
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Posted by: Fruno on Oct 20, 2007 11:21 AM
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So . . . what is a CSA? Am I once again the last to learn a new jargon term?
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» RE: A Jargon Question
Posted by: Fat Man at the Buffet Line
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www.votenic.com
Posted by: votenic on Oct 21, 2007 9:04 PM
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Posted by: votenic on Oct 21, 2007 9:04 PM
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2008 PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION WEEKLY POLL
http://www.votenic.com
Results Posted Tuesday Evening.
FREE, NON-BIASED
http://www.votenic.com
Results Posted Tuesday Evening.
FREE, NON-BIASED
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American's don't argue the perfect food?!
Posted by: swarmofkillermonkeys on Oct 22, 2007 2:56 PM
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Posted by: swarmofkillermonkeys on Oct 22, 2007 2:56 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
OK. Great interview, actually. But I also take exception to:
For Mintz, Americans just didn't engage in passionate talk about food. Unlike the southwest French and their cassoulet, most Americans don't obsess and quarrel about what comprises, say, an authentic veggie burger.
Aside from the regional specialties mentioned, apparently this person has had neither PIZZA nor BBQ!
Heck, I've seen fistfights over ordering "real pizza" (Chicago Style) versus "good pizza" (New York Style). Yeesh, don't even get me started on when someone pipes up with a, "hey, how about a whole-wheat crust with that nasty white goo instead of tomato sauce from a chain restaurant?" That's just asking for it. Passion abounds in American pizza.
BBQ is the more traditional argument food, of course, because there is so much more to argue over. Gas, briquettes, or honest wood chunks? What kind of wood smoke? Again from shavings, chips, pellets or chunk? Does is HAVE to be offset only to be called BBQ? Then why do people call grilling (which is really broiling) BBQ? Doesn't there HAVE to be wood (not that imitation black goop)? Larding with garlic? Dry rub? Wet mop? Is Pork really the one true BBQ meat? And then the sauces... or no sauce? Vinegar or no? Which cut is best? Bone in or bone out? How do you serve it?
Man... I need some BBQ... Pork shoulder, hickory or pecan chunks over gas (or as wood chunks), thick dry rub, 14 hours, NO sauce!. Well, maybe juuust a little North Carolina or St. Louis style if it is somehow dry -- Texas and KC is for BEEF!. Mmm, beef. Brisket of course, larded with garlic, no dry rub, mesquite again over gas, with Texas style thin and spicy sauce (not so much vinegar or sugar).
Whew! Man, I'm hungry. How about you?
For Mintz, Americans just didn't engage in passionate talk about food. Unlike the southwest French and their cassoulet, most Americans don't obsess and quarrel about what comprises, say, an authentic veggie burger.
Aside from the regional specialties mentioned, apparently this person has had neither PIZZA nor BBQ!
Heck, I've seen fistfights over ordering "real pizza" (Chicago Style) versus "good pizza" (New York Style). Yeesh, don't even get me started on when someone pipes up with a, "hey, how about a whole-wheat crust with that nasty white goo instead of tomato sauce from a chain restaurant?" That's just asking for it. Passion abounds in American pizza.
BBQ is the more traditional argument food, of course, because there is so much more to argue over. Gas, briquettes, or honest wood chunks? What kind of wood smoke? Again from shavings, chips, pellets or chunk? Does is HAVE to be offset only to be called BBQ? Then why do people call grilling (which is really broiling) BBQ? Doesn't there HAVE to be wood (not that imitation black goop)? Larding with garlic? Dry rub? Wet mop? Is Pork really the one true BBQ meat? And then the sauces... or no sauce? Vinegar or no? Which cut is best? Bone in or bone out? How do you serve it?
Man... I need some BBQ... Pork shoulder, hickory or pecan chunks over gas (or as wood chunks), thick dry rub, 14 hours, NO sauce!. Well, maybe juuust a little North Carolina or St. Louis style if it is somehow dry -- Texas and KC is for BEEF!. Mmm, beef. Brisket of course, larded with garlic, no dry rub, mesquite again over gas, with Texas style thin and spicy sauce (not so much vinegar or sugar).
Whew! Man, I'm hungry. How about you?
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» RE: American's don't argue the perfect food?!
Posted by: Shey
» RE: American's don't argue the perfect food?!
Posted by: swarmofkillermonkeys
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A Vegetarian always has to post when it comes to food topics
Posted by: dennisinmemphis on Oct 23, 2007 10:11 PM
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Posted by: dennisinmemphis on Oct 23, 2007 10:11 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
So here it is - I'm the veg head in the family- husband to one and parent to two omnivores - so don't imagine I have anything particularly dictocratic to say to anyone who likes to eat some meat. But the point I'd like to make is that on the whole WAY LESS meat in a typical diet would be good both for you and the world you [we] live in. There's all kinds of statistics to demonstrate this - goveg.com if you are interested is a good place to start. I truly don't have any desire to 'stamp-out' meat eating - but I am befuddled, and dismayed overall to see the unnecessarily large meat portioning that is advertised so frequently as the centerpiece of every meal.
At this point I'm the primary cook and I don't cook meat. IF the wife or kids [teens] want their meat they know they have to cook it themselves. Mostly they don't though - and so they are very light omnivores. They think they're too busy I guess. I can tell you in my experience vegetarian cooking is cleaner [no grease] - way easier to clean up after and cheaper. An article ran on MSN a while back which presented a comparative cost study of meat/omnivore vs. vegetarian and vegetarian came out on top as the economical winner. Remarkable really in view of the fact that our agribusiness system is so geared-up to produce meat! Once you learn to focus on plant protein complementing as the center [more or less] of meal planning, it is easy. Once you master a few basic cooking methods you hardly even need cookbooks. And the author is correct - it's not that hard to put on a meal in 30 mins. You do definitely have to keep your pantry stocked though. Nothing to work with can defeat those good intentions. I have to drive across town for the farmers market - but I do go a couple times a month --the Wild Oats supermarket is just a few minutes so I can always get my organic 'fix' in there.
The short of it - eat less or no meat - you won't miss it [most people anyway], it's green and good and ecologically sound, and cheaper too.
At this point I'm the primary cook and I don't cook meat. IF the wife or kids [teens] want their meat they know they have to cook it themselves. Mostly they don't though - and so they are very light omnivores. They think they're too busy I guess. I can tell you in my experience vegetarian cooking is cleaner [no grease] - way easier to clean up after and cheaper. An article ran on MSN a while back which presented a comparative cost study of meat/omnivore vs. vegetarian and vegetarian came out on top as the economical winner. Remarkable really in view of the fact that our agribusiness system is so geared-up to produce meat! Once you learn to focus on plant protein complementing as the center [more or less] of meal planning, it is easy. Once you master a few basic cooking methods you hardly even need cookbooks. And the author is correct - it's not that hard to put on a meal in 30 mins. You do definitely have to keep your pantry stocked though. Nothing to work with can defeat those good intentions. I have to drive across town for the farmers market - but I do go a couple times a month --the Wild Oats supermarket is just a few minutes so I can always get my organic 'fix' in there.
The short of it - eat less or no meat - you won't miss it [most people anyway], it's green and good and ecologically sound, and cheaper too.
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