Home
Archive
Newsletters
Video
Blogs
Discuss
About
Search
Donate
Advertise
Advertisement
Advertisement
Advertisement
Advertisement
Advertisement
Advertisement
  • AlterNetYour turn

Support AlterNet
Do you value the information you're getting from AlterNet? Please show your support with a tax-deductible donation.


Feedback
Tell us how we're doing.

Advertisement
Advertisement

Environment

How to Address Humanity's Global Crises? Challenge Corporate Power, Embrace True Democracy

By Vandana Shiva, AlterNet. Posted October 1, 2007.


The physicist, activist and author outlines the scope of the "triple threat" represented by the end of cheap oil, human-induced climate change, and resource scarcity.
Advertisement
Upcoming AlterNet stories on Digg

Editor's note: the following remarks were made this September at a conference on "Confronting the Global Triple Crisis -- Climate Change, Peak Oil, Global Resource Depletion & Extinction," in Washington DC. For more information, visit the International Forum on Globalization's website.

Before I came here I was very fortunate to join the group of scientists and religious leaders who made a trip to the Arctic to witness the melting of the icecaps. An entire way of life is being destroyed. You've seen the polar bears losing their ecological space, but the highest mobility in that part of the world is the dog sledge. And they can't use it. They're locked into their villages because the ice is now too thin to travel on it. But it's still there and therefore not good enough for them to use boats.

The same melting is making the Himalayan glaciers in my region, the Ganges glacier, recede by 30 meters a year. In twenty years time, the Himalayan glaciers will have reduced from 500,000 square kilometers to 100,000 square kilometers. And given our rainfall patterns, in the hot summer season when we have a drought, it's only the melting of the glaciers that brings us water. So we're talking about one-fifth of humanity, twenty to thirty years from now, having no water in the grand rivers around which the grand civilizations of Asia have been built.

And where did this start? All this feels so timeless, but it started with humanity getting at the fossil fuel, which was never supposed to be touched… But that model carries on. And globalization now is industrializing every activity of every human being's life across the planet. For me, globalization is really expanding the use of fossil fuel.

And so while on the one hand, when we talk climate change, we're talking about reducing emissions, the entire economic model is based on increasing emissions. It is based on increasing emissions by destroying small-scale peasant farming and introducing large-scale industrial agriculture. It's increasing emissions by making every one of us dependent on our everyday needs to come from China.

Everything today is being made where it can be made most cheaply, which means where sources can be exploited the fastest and workers can be exploited the highest. And at one level, that's what's being reflected in China's double-digit growth and India's nine percent growth. It's basically converting our resources into commodities, to be sold around the world.

But that conversion requires the wastage of human beings on a scale we've never seen. In India right now, the relocation of industry for example; industry like steel that's shutting down in Europe and America, is relocating to India. Automobile companies that are shutting down in the West are moving to India; they're talking about making 50 million cars in India annually. Only four percent of India will ever own them. The rest will either be exported or that four percent will have eight cars rather than two. Already my landlord has five in a family of three. Those cars need minerals, they need steel, they need iron ore mining, they need aluminum, they need bauxite mining. And every inch of the land in India is today serving a global, fossil fuel economy that's on fast forward.

It needs land; land grab is the biggest resource crisis. Land you can't create, you can only exhaust. But peasants are saying we will not move. That's what they said in Nandigram, 25 were shot dead and they refuse to move. In Dhandri, where women were raped and attacked and refused to move. In place after place, the tribals, the peasants in India are saying this our land, this is our mother, and this is where we will be. And when the money for compensation becomes bigger and bigger-- I love this action-- the Nandigram peasants sent a letter to the chief ministers to say, "How much is your mother for sale. How much will you take for her? Because this land is our mother."

And the globalization of agriculture has really become genocidal. It's hugely responsible for increasing greenhouse gases, whether it's from the nitrogen fertilizers of the fossil fuel in the mechanical energy that's used, or in the long distance transport and food miles. But on the ground it's killing people. Long before it will kill us through climate change, it's killing people, physically killing people.

150,000 farmers have been pushed to end their lives in India because of Monsanto seed monopolies. Monsanto was collecting 2,400 rupees as royalty for a kilogram of Bt cotton seed that they were selling for 3,200 rupees. They're in the courts right now; we've challenged them, we've joined one of the state governments. They're saying we have a right to this monopoly and we're saying our country has never given you this right. They assume they got it in the United States and therefore they have it everywhere, whether the law allows it or not.


Digg!    Share on facebook   submit to reddit    Bookmark on Delicious   Stumble This  

See more stories tagged with: agriculture, globalization, global warming, climate change, fossil fuels, corporate power

Activist and physicist Vandana Shiva is founder and director of the Research Foundation for Science, Technology, and Natural Resource Policy in New Delhi. She is author of more than three hundred papers in leading journals and numerous books, including "Monocultures of the Mind: Biodiversity, Biotechnology, and the Third World and Earth Democracy." Shiva is a founding director of International Forum on Globalization.

Liked this story? Get top stories in your inbox each week from Environment! Sign up now »

Advertisement
Advertisement

 

Comments Turn comments off sitewide Give us feedback »
Comments closed.
The comments for this story have been closed. Thank you to everyone who participated.
View:
Excellent
Posted by: Donna_Darko on Oct 1, 2007 12:39 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
n/t

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Sad, But True
Posted by: NoPCZone on Oct 1, 2007 12:40 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Until we, in the US, throw the corporatist lobby out of the halls of power it's not going to get better. The only way that's going to happen is if a whole lot of people- a really significant number- get off of their apathetic backsides and get politically involved. I do not mean for a day or a season- I mean as a way of life.

Greed knows no bounds and the vulture funds, private equity funds and the ilk know no bounds and have no conscience or shame. The moneychangers are not only in the Temple of Government- they have the run of the place and are robbing us all blind.

I really see only two options ultimately:
Get involved
or
Turn out the lights

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Sad, But True Posted by: JerseyGuy
» RE: We are many - they are few Posted by: GrassRoutes
Vandana Shiva
Posted by: Lizmv on Oct 1, 2007 3:57 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
is brilliant.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

President: McVinney & Company, Boston, MA
Posted by: crmcvin on Oct 1, 2007 4:24 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The boldest thing we could do with organizations is transform them from hierarchies of money managers, with the workers stuck at the bottom, to functioning democracies. Imagine people getting to vote on whether they want their children to breathe carcinogens for the sake of the stockholders short term profits. A long and arduous task ahead in this centurt is to rid the system of the fascist work place - ultimately democracy has to be the password of the workplace or we will not succeed as a species.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

No one is going to rescue us, we must evolve.
Posted by: greentime on Oct 1, 2007 4:46 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We have reached the threshold of our poorest choices and we must now make new choices based on new or renewed philosophies.

These philosophies, as have been pointed out in Vandana Shiva's superb article, must be based on Peace, Democracy and the planet Earth's natural laws.

The system we in America claim to have, Democracy, is not what we have actually created. What we have created is a rapacious system of corporate rule and all wealth owned by a few. Simply put, it is destructive, backwards and not sustainable. Our religions, as we have created them, have also failed.

I urge us all to follow new leaders, make new choices, and above all take personal responsibility for your own impact in every way.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Clearwater
Posted by: rodneyg_53 on Oct 1, 2007 5:08 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
While I agree with the writer, I think it is unlikely that the American people will embrace the changes that would be required to create this post-industrial age. India still has people who have some connection with the earth. Americans are entirely consumed by their own consumerism. They are controlled by the advertising that bombards them and they no longer have any concept of a good life without the gadgets, trinkets, and other unneeded necessities. Americans want to reduce fossil fuel use, but only if they have the alternative energy to continue their lives unchanged. We will accept facsim before we change our lifestyles fundamentally.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Clearwater Posted by: Axiom69
Better get hemp for fuel going in India.
Posted by: maxpayne on Oct 1, 2007 6:59 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
By the way, they're going to need it especially when hemp clothing could better serve them all year round compared to cotton which itself requires PETROLEUM and doesn't last all year round.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Outstanding
Posted by: dayenta on Oct 1, 2007 7:46 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This article is outstanding and spot-on on every point. Wonder if Thomas Friedman has read it?

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

missing ingredient
Posted by: Constitutionalist75 on Oct 1, 2007 8:02 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The only reason Cargill, Monsanto and the other big corporations want to invest in India is because the growing population insures them a growing market. But if all women everywhere in the World were granted the right to decide if and when to birth children, a growing market of consumers would no longer be there for them and the people could reclaim and operate their own village industries. Growing corporations depend on growing populations. Reduce the human population Worldwide and overthrow the corporations in favor of regional networks of eco-tech villages that are free to trade with each other and surround themselves with miles of healthy wilderness. Then there would be plenty of resources for everyone.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

By the way, check out this article in Washington Post that INSULTS rural India.
Posted by: maxpayne on Oct 1, 2007 8:20 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Bilderbergers Final Solution..!
Posted by: TJ-stars4peace on Oct 1, 2007 8:40 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Bilderbergers already have a solution..

Start a huge fucking war by attacking Iran that eventually kills off at least 1/3 of the worlds population or more, the largest numbers dying in India and Pakistan..

Aren't they just fucking great..!

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

So India faces the same problems as the US?
Posted by: Sojourner on Oct 1, 2007 10:03 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I have not seen a better brief description of the insanity of current life. We were warned at least as far back as the 1970s and ignored the warnings. It's only a question of how bad it will get before we will pay attention--if we ever do pay attention.

But the assumption in this plea is that India would not make the same mistakes as the West is forcing on it if it were able to stay non-aligned. LOL. Just as the US is being run by the hoarders of wealth, who run over the opposition by paying off the leadership, the same has happened in India.

Ghandi was killed. His leadership to keep life sustainable in India died with him. The fact is that all developed and developing nations have ignored sustainability to choose "take the money and run." And that, even though we have nowhere to run to, maybe as soon as the next generation.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» Nowhere to run... Posted by: Cathyc
Balance/counter balance
Posted by: ray burchard on Oct 1, 2007 10:03 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
While I agree that this women has a very valid position on the dangers of greed inspired "global warming". But what is neglected is how the living earth's (vegetation forestation/animal migration) in conjunction with earths rotation (centrifugal force) uses these principles to create a living axis with a balance and counter balance option.

Now add the probability that the earths magnetic polarity reversal precipitated the extinction of the millions of years of the weighted dinosaurs and their supporting forestation in determining the earths accumulative living weight displacement.

Why do you think that the crude oil we are greedily eating up today is found, for the most part under the arid deserts, while the older crude oil is found under the ocean’s depths? Hint, Hint, whats the weight of crude oil pr. gal. versus air and/or water as it's replacement.

Apparently old mother earth has an overriding method to cast off it’s unwanted and harmful parasites.
Footnote: GreatGrand Parent…when you remove two Greeks (Gr), it reads ..eat…and…parent and/or pa…rent. Obviously our existance is conditionally relative to our collective, the "whole" of our selfcontrol.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

The prophetess Shiva
Posted by: peacelf on Oct 1, 2007 10:39 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Shiva recognizes our interconnected with the planet, something most americans could better understand. Yet, we are furthest from understanding.

In a nihilistic culture like the U.S. apathetic and complacent citizens vote for self-interest or the lesser of two evils, rather than voting their consciences or the common good. We actively support systems that harm earth, rather than supporting economic systems that promote environmental sustainability.

I blame Democrats as well as Republicans, but I blame liberals and progressives more, because they do not have the courage to stand for what they believe in, especially when they vote for another nihilist Democrat, like Hillary or Kerry, just because they think the Republican alternative will be worse.

The Dem's soft nihilism and corporatism is much more nefarious, because it lulls liberals into a sense of complacency and smug satisfaction because "we won." We didn't win. The corporate-owned politicians line both isles in Congress; choice is an illusion created by those with power for those without.

There are choices who serve the interests of the people. I won't even mention their names, but we know they've already been marginalized by the corporate media. Find them and vote for them, so we can have a better world for all.

peace

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Did you like Matrix Reloaded? Posted by: rfrancis@godisdead.com
» RE: Al Gore for President 2008 Posted by: edgar_michel
WHY IS NO ONE ON THIS FORUM WILLING
Posted by: Constitutionalist75 on Oct 1, 2007 2:22 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
to discuss the human population explosion and the need for family planing clinics to give women the right to choose if and when to birth children. Day after day, week after week, month after month, year after year I post evrywhere I can to alert people that they themselves are the cause of global warming by their refusal to support and promote family planning to reduce the population and thereby reduce their impact on the Earth. WHAT THE HELL IS WRONG WITH YOU!!!!!

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: WHY IS NO ONE ON THIS FORUM WILLING Posted by: rfrancis@godisdead.com
» RE: ecocidal insanity Posted by: Constitutionalist75
» RE: China has an answer Posted by: rfrancis@godisdead.com
» China has an answer??? Posted by: Constitutionalist75
Only Mass Calamity Will Wake Them Up!
Posted by: sofla100 on Oct 1, 2007 6:44 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Friends, nothing will change until society everywhere "bottoms out" on the philosophy of unregulated capitalism and consumption, increasing use and dependence on fossil fuels, and the use of military power for a nations "strategic objectives." It all has to change. What will bring this about? I am afraid it will take a global calamity. We already know the oceans will rise over 1 meter in 50-75 years. This alone will flood out a good part of coastal USA. We already know that more and more nations are acquiring nuclear weapons. While our stupid governments (like the USA) lecture these countries to give these weapons up they (the USA again) just develop and refine their own nukes. Who will listen to a hypocrite? SUV's get bigger and bigger, more and more roads and cars are being built, yet, their is no money for mass transist. Well, it goes on and on. When will it change. It will take disaster, bad disaster, for people everywhere to wake up, I am afraid.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Only Mass Calamity Will Wake Them Up! Posted by: Constitutionalist75
Peak oil will show us the light
Posted by: Missing Piece on Oct 1, 2007 6:47 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Yes, Ultimately it all comes down to population and the reduction of it, because even if we consume less that only means more for growth.

This trifecta of problems fast approaching reminds me of newtons law, an object in motion stays in motion. How could we possibly stop any one of these three problems? Globalization is nothing more than richer countries running out of resources, so they go abroad to exploit it. There own unsustainable practices have led them to go abroad instead of becoming sustainable.

My guess is that peak oil will jolt us into sustainability, and that is fast approaching. The question is will we have the knowledge required to sustain ourselves or will we ask corporate government to save us. Given that the majority of voters are boomers and they already voted for bush twice, I doubt our constitution will survive peak oil.

good luck, build an earth home and go off grid.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Wind / Tidal Power = 2 for 1 renewable energy
Posted by: rfrancis@godisdead.com on Oct 1, 2007 8:24 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It takes about 6 to 8 months for a wind farm to payback the energy that was used in manufacturing it. The energy it generates after that minus maintenance is free.

Many countries already have offshore wind farms and the technology is already there to build offshore wind farms.

It was reported in New Scientist only about 1 to 2 months ago that a company has created a tidal turbine, turbines shaped a lot like wind turbines but are underwater and use ocean tidal energy to turn the blades and create electricity.

How about combining a tidal turbine with a wind turbine. The tidal turbine would be attached to the support pole underwater while the wind turbine would be attached to the same pole above water.

Electricity could be generated from the water and the air all using one support pole which would save on resources for the pole, energy for its construction, and labor for installing it into the sea bed.

If we had spent the $100s of billions on offshore wind / tidal farms instead of the Iraq war we could drastically cut CO2 emissions and our dependence on foreign crude oil.

We need real leadership that can see past habits and customs of old and embrace the possibilities of tomorrow.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Maglev Transportation Highways
Posted by: rfrancis@godisdead.com on Oct 1, 2007 8:46 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If we managed to shift our energy consumption from burning petroleum products to creating electricity with renewable energy like wind / tidal farms, solar towers, and household solar cells we could power a maglev transportation highway.

Imagine a computer controlled highway that controls every vehicle from the time it first starts up the on-ramp to the time it takes the exit off the highway closest to your destination.

It uses maglev technology to lift the vehicles into the air and propel them down the highway.

With computers controlling the vehicles, the technology is capable of propelling vehicles upwards of 300 mph as has been demonstrated with the trains using these technologies today in other countries.

Vehicles such as plugin hybrids, would be able to recharge their batteries while traveling on the highway which means passengers would not need to stop as often at refueling stations.

Such a system would revolutionize the transportation of goods and people, moving them efficiently at high speeds and eliminating traffic jams (something I am pretty sure every American would love and would support the project for that reason alone).

And the system would completely wean us off petroleum for transportation.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Maglev Transportation Highways Posted by: AsteroidMiner
» RE: Maglev Transportation Highways Posted by: rfrancis@godisdead.com
» RE3: Maglev Transportation Highways Posted by: AsteroidMiner
Start by not buying?
Posted by: Logic's Edge on Oct 1, 2007 8:52 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Buy what you need to live on and nothing more. Prepare for some economic turbulence. If enough people do this, the system will collapse and have to be rebuilt, hopefully in a better way?

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Start by not buying? Posted by: VannaLaRoche
» Better yet - Posted by: Constitutionalist75
Democracy not necessarily the answer
Posted by: timebomb734 on Oct 1, 2007 10:00 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
While the author makes excellent points regarding agricultural exploitation of India by Western chemical companies, I do not buy into the idea of democracy being the answer. Democracy, by its definition, is the rule of the masses. However, the rule of the people does not necessarily translate into better environmental and agricultural policy. Generally, democracies are more likely to foster economic growth, which, in this case, unfortunately comes part and parcel with agricultural exploitation. If democracy truly were a harbinger of responsible policy, then why many of the world's leading democracies falling behind on just and responsible policy-making?

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Democracy not necessarily the answer Posted by: Constitutionalist75
Religion is at the bottom of it all . . .
Posted by: marknie on Oct 1, 2007 10:23 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Why does no one have the guts to admit this?

Watch this free movie

http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com

Nothing will change until we address this problem first . . .

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: eligion is at the bottom of it all . . . Posted by: Constitutionalist75
"Circumstances" from the book "Dead Reckoning"
Posted by: rwcbanzai on Oct 2, 2007 3:57 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Circumstances - Page 1 of 2
12/07

Dear Justice of the Peace:

"In the beginning, in empathy, many condemned such terrorist bombing policies as genocidal, yet caught in the web of revenge many silently used the same terror tactic to burn all of Japan and Germany down. Those who could see the hypocrisy stood alone in silence, knocked down to their knees, praying for all this madness to come to an end. Their prayers went unanswered, by Evil’s twin, that mega-terror atomic Japanese burning - scorching winds. The military conflict was over, yet the returning soldiers wrestled with their conscience, trying to justify the human carnage and their commander’s future whims.

The brutality from both sides can only be measured in obscure numbers: worldwide over 60 million human deaths, planetwide over 85 million forced into military dress, way to many names to remember, let alone to many deaths to list! In the end the final cost to America: 405 thousand dead or wounded in uniform, the cost over $3trillion in debt ($304 billion in 1945). Meanwhile, 16 million Americans were put in harms way for over 4 years, majority of them by a Draft (conscription, without choice), all in the name of “Liberty”!!! The worldwide casualties attest, that the War barely touched the mainland of America, as we took the war on terror to all of “Them”.

Yes, Imperialism, Fascism, Communism, Socialism, Colonialism, Capitalism, most of the “ism’s” were involved and share the burden of guilt by association. Pax Britannia & Colonialism was replaced by Pax Americana as the New World Order of Capitalism raged unbridled into international corporate cannibalism. Corporate world wide Monopolies and Cartels have devoured private free enterprise, as humanity and mom & pop shops reflect upon what happened and close their doors with the dust now left. Meanwhile, the enriched Corporate Barons construct towering walled glass castles ever so more into the skies, targets for more terrorist’s anarchist whims and corporatism lies.

Once again the Bogeyman of Fear reigns as Big Brother smothers freedom, spies with lies, increases the choices denied, all in Orwellian double speak fashion. History doesn’t repeat itself, it just fashions similar cyclical tragedies. Yet, the most tragic of all... the enslavement of Humanism in the Social Darwinism of Greed. That incessant consumerism where only the fittest survive, that usury demand for more than they really need to keep inflation alive.

Just as youth knows no bounds, nor fears death. Time reflects experience and reason with birth, old age & sickness, till our last breath.
Wisdom tests that reckoning, pondering good or bad intent. Your seeking mind finds meaning in the circumstances read."

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

a strategy for sustainable prosperity
Posted by: kparcell on Oct 2, 2007 4:21 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Here is a new approach that has gained the interest and support of leading activists and thinkers.
http://sunmoney.org

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: a strategy for sustainable prosperity Posted by: Constitutionalist75