COMMENTS: 229
Biofuels Are an Environmental Dead End
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In 1979, with the price of oil surging and a politically connected company called Archer Daniels Midland investing heavily in ethanol production, the U.S. Department of Energy invited Pimentel to chair an advisory committee to look at ethanol as a gasoline alternative. The committee's conclusion: ethanol requires more energy to produce than it delivers.
That assessment didn't stop the government from enacting a variety of subsidies for ethanol, which has since developed into a multibillion-dollar industry. Nor has Pimentel refrained from issuing a series of scholarly articles claiming to show that, after decades of steady government support, ethanol remains an energy bust.
Over the years, Pimentel has become an increasingly controversial figure. The U.S. Department of Agriculture now claims that corn ethanol delivers a modestly positive net energy balance [PDF], a conclusion recently endorsed by a study from University of Minnesota researchers. Yet Pimentel's provocations continue. Not only is corn-based ethanol a net energy consumer, he says, but cellulosic ethanol -- simultaneously biofuel's holy grail and sacred cow -- is "worse."
Pimentel thinks biofuels are an environmental dead end and enthusiasts for crop-based energy would do well to at least examine his analysis.
Philpott: You claim corn ethanol's energy balance is negative, and there's a growing consensus that it's positive. Why the difference?
Pimentel: Pro-ethanol people make it out to be positive by omitting many of the inputs that go into corn production. For example, they omit the farm labor -- I'm not talking about the farm family, I'm talking about the farm labor. They omit the farm machinery. They omit the energy to produce the hybrid corn. They omit the irrigation. I could go on and on. Anyway, if I did all of those manipulations, I could achieve also a positive return.
However, that's not the way these assessments are made. You can go check the noted agricultural economists who have looked at corn as well as other crops, and they do include the labor, they include the farm machinery, they include repair of the farm machinery, and so forth and so on. And so, those are all inputs that the ag economists include. Why are the pro-ethanol people leaving them out?
Philpott: When you say that the ethanol crowd fails to include the farm machinery, are you talking about the energy that's needed to manufacture a tractor, for example?
Pimentel: That's right. Or an automobile used by the farmer.
Philpott: From your experience, how do these researchers justify that omission?
Pimentel: They don't. They just omit it.
Philpott: I also see that in your studies, your calculation of how much energy goes into producing synthetic fertilizer is higher than the USDA's assessment. Why that difference?
Pimentel: Our data come from the U.N. Food and Agriculture Organization. We're actually using a lower number than [the FAO's]. We're using 16,000 kilocalories per kilogram [of fertilizer], and I say the FAO is using 18,000. So again, we're using the most accurate data that are available, and not trying to manipulate these numbers.
Philpott: Another place where you clash with other researchers is over the byproducts of ethanol: stuff like distillers grains that go into animal feed, etc. For those researchers, byproducts are what push ethanol's energy balance solidly onto positive ground.
Pimentel: We do account for it. Distillers grains, incidentally, are being used as a substitute for soybean meal. So we went back to the soybean meal, and examined how it's produced, and the energy that is required to produce it. Instead of giving [distillers grains] a 40 to 60 percent credit as the pro-ethanol people do, we found that the credit should be more like 9 percent. They [pro-ethanol researchers] are manipulating the data again.
Philpott: All of that is very controversial, but let's get to the really provocative part of your work. You claim cellulosic ethanol's energy balance is "worse" than that of conventional ethanol. How can that be?
Pimentel: It's quite easy. Number one, if you have a handful of sawdust, and a handful of corn, which one has the most starches and sugars? That's easy. It takes almost twice as much sawdust to make the same gross energy as [corn] from cellulose, or wood.
Number two, it takes two additional treatments to release the starches and sugars [from cellulose]. That is, you're going to treat the cellulose. It's held by the lignin, and the lignin is the stuff that holds the trees up straight. And the cellulose is trapped inside that lignin. And you've got to release it, and that requires an acid or an enzyme. And so that's one treatment, and then you've got to use an alkali to stop the acidity at some stage. And now you can introduce the bugs for the fermentation. But No. 1, it takes more cellulose, and No. 2, you've got two additional treatments.
Philpott: But wouldn't the response to that be that it's a lot less energy intensive to grow material for cellulosic ethanol because you don't need to focus on plants that have high sugar concentrations?
Pimentel: That's right. And we did that [in a recent study (PDF)]. But we found negative energy balances for both wood and switchgrass.
Philpott: Don't you figure that after 35 years the industry will figure out how to make cellulosic ethanol work? We're always hearing about a big breakthrough that's about to happen.
Pimentel: Well, we know how to make it work. The question is, can you do it energetically, with small amounts of energy? That I seriously doubt.
Philpott: You recently wrote that "green plants in the United States collect about 53 exajoules of energy per year from sunlight. Americans consume slightly more than twice that amount, however." How did you arrive at these figures?
Pimentel: All you do is sit down with a pencil and paper, total up all the crops being produced, along with any of the additional biomass that goes with it. Like with corn, you not only total up the corn, but the corn stalks. You total up all the crops, and then with the wood material, you total up all the annual production in forests, and we use a rather optimistic number, three tons per hectare per year, under a range of conditions. So you can make this calculation yourself.
Philpott: So if we converted 100 percent of a year's worth of solar energy stored in plant matter to fuel, we'd only supply half of our current energy consumption. What's that telling us?
Pimentel: It's telling us we're using too goddamn much fossil energy! And another thing it tells us is that you're not going to be self-sufficient, or even produce half of our energy from biomass in the U.S., if we want to eat. And that's using an optimistic figure for ethanol production. I don't know why [biofuel proponents] don't sit down with pencil and paper and make these calculations instead of spouting off on all the wonderful things we can achieve.
Philpott: One of your critics, David Morris, has written [PDF] that the basic thrust of your work is that "the world's population has vastly exceeded its biological carrying capacity." Is that an accurate characterization?
Pimentel: Yes. The World Health Organization is reporting now that we've got 3.7 billion people who are malnourished on Earth. That's about 60 percent of the world population, and that problem has been getting worse each year.
Now look at the production of cereal grains per capita. That's an important number, because it is per capita that we eat and utilize resources. And you will note that since 1983, per capita grain production has been declining continuously. Declining for more than 20 years. Now why?
Philpott: Population growth, right? Because overall production has actually risen over that same time.
Pimentel: That's right. But it's not increasing as fast as the population.
Philpott: What do you think about the prospects for sustainable or organic agriculture to meet these increasing population demands?
Pimentel: I don't want to say that organic can supply all the food in the world, but it can be much more sustainable than conventional ag and just as productive. I recently coauthored a 22-year study of organic agriculture utilizing corn and soybeans, which are certainly two dominant crops in the United States. Yes, we can produce these crops organically, with less energy, while improving the sustainability of the soil. [The study involved] rotating corn with soybeans in conjunction with cover crops. We had one field that was dependent on legume cover crops [for fertility], and one dependent on manure.
Philpott: Which came out better?
Pimentel: Well, the manure was slightly better in terms of increasing soil organic matter. Slightly ... I think the yields were about the same. In both cases, the yields equaled those in conventional corn.
Philpott: Now let me ask you a trick question. What if we took some of that organic corn and soy and turned it into ethanol and biodiesel? Would that achieve a positive energy balance?
Pimentel: No! It's not going to do it. It certainly would improve [the energy balance], because we were able to reduce the energy inputs for corn by about 30 percent.
Philpott: Is it theoretically possible to turn biomass into a fuel with a positive net balance?
Pimentel: The difficulty is that plants do not collect very much solar energy. On average, plants collect one-tenth of one percent of the solar energy available. Photovoltaic solar cells collect at least 10 percent, which means 100 times the energy collected by plants. But you can get a positive energy balance by simply burning biomass.
Philpott: But not by converting it into a liquid fuel?
Pimentel: No. I don't care what kind of imagination you have, it won't work.
Philpott: A lot of earnest people support biofuels as a way to reduce greenhouse-gas emissions and displace fossil fuels. What do you tell them?
Pimentel: Conserve! One word. And no one talks about it, including the environmentalists. When these people talk about biofuels providing us with our energy, they need to look at the facts right now. Eighteen percent of all corn is going into ethanol production. We're getting 4.5 million gallons of ethanol. That's 1 percent of U.S. petroleum use. It's 1 percent.
If we use 100 percent of U.S. corn, and we won't do that, but if we used 100 percent, what would that do for us? Six percent. And ethanol is being subsidized at 45 times the rate of gasoline.
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Posted by: drblack on Dec 13, 2006 12:48 AM
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If the leaves and flowers are put back into the soil it needs little additional fertilizer for each successive crop.
The energy needed to run the distillation equipment can be solar power.
Hemp will grow on poor quality soil if for the 1st crop enough nitrogen is used.
Hemp produces the most Bio-mass per acre of any feasible plant source.
It will not provide all our energy ,but it would produce enough ethanol to run our cars.
Henry Fords first combustion engine ran off of etanol from hemp.He changed to gasoline when Rockafeller(sp?) offered Ford a giant loan to start his car company if Ford used gasoline to power his engines.
This gets no press and seems to be ignored by most energy researchers.
This maybe because Hemp is also called marijuana:though the type grow for fuel is grown for its stem and has almost no THC...the stuff that gets one high.
There was a book written in the 70's by an engineer who spelled out this hemp for fuel plan....I think it was by David Gold and called solar Gas. I am not sure if this author or title are correct.I cannot find a copy of it these days.
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» RE: Hemp for biomass with solar stills CAN replace gasoline
Posted by: HeroesAll
» Yeah, depends on what you want it for...
Posted by: JoshuaLudd
» RE: Hemp for biomass with solar stills CAN replace gasoline
Posted by: aonghus36
» RE: Hemp for biomass with solar stills CAN replace gasoline
Posted by: drblack
» Solar and Wind Can Replace Gasoline!!!
Posted by: Douglas
» Obviously It Is Time To Get Rid Of Autos and Trucks!!!!!
Posted by: Douglas
» RE: Solar and Wind Can Replace Gasoline!!!
Posted by: Johnny Hempseed
» Thank you for calling BS on ANOTHER GATEKEEPER article
Posted by: YinRising
» BozemanBlues (aka NDNative) Confuses Intellectual Flabbiness For "Toughness"! What A Joke!
Posted by: Douglas
» Is Edelman Throwing A Christmas Party For You Guys Down There In Midtown Manhattan?
Posted by: Douglas
» And what does this have to do with the topic?
Posted by: maxpayne
» How Useful Is Your Comment, Genius? Or Your Many Other Posts That Follow?
Posted by: Douglas
» You seem a little more reasonable
Posted by: AdamG
» RE: You seem a little more reasonable
Posted by: aonghus36
» RE: Hemp for biomass with solar stills CAN replace gasoline
Posted by: willymack
» RE: Hemp for biomass with solar stills CAN replace gasoline
Posted by: drblack
» RE: Hemp is the best of the bunch, but as far as I know, unproven
Posted by: Techubus
» RE: Hemp and other biofuels were supposed to be the future but engines were adjusted to
Posted by: maxpayne
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Posted by: eddie torres on Dec 13, 2006 2:10 AM
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Just as soon as the US population reaches 35 million people.
Is ADM planning something "sinister"?
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» RE: 300 million today, 35 million tomorrow
Posted by: ignition
» RE: 300 million today, 35 million tomorrow
Posted by: MonkeyBoy
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Posted by: rsaxto on Dec 13, 2006 3:01 AM
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» RE: ways
Posted by: HeroesAll
» RE: ways,Hemp is a great food crop.
Posted by: Johnny Hempseed
» BozemanBlues and NDRes: The Dr Jeckyl and Mr. Hyde of the Hempnut Movement
Posted by: Douglas
» If Anyone Can Answer The Question I Will Gratefully Look At And Consider Their Answer! What Is It?
Posted by: Douglas
» RE: You're an idiot
Posted by: Techubus
» RE: ways
Posted by: drblack
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Posted by: EconProf on Dec 13, 2006 3:14 AM
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» Solar and Wind Are The "Fuels" of the Future
Posted by: Douglas
» RE: Solar and Wind Are The "Fuels" of the Future
Posted by: EconProf
» Since We Probably Don't Have Another 50 Years, I Have A Better Alternative. Let's . . .
Posted by: Douglas
» Douglas gives the MIDDLE FINGER to "BozemanBlues"
Posted by: Douglas
» Actually, Douglas Moved from Arizona to New York! BozemanBlues is a native New Yorker . . .
Posted by: Douglas
» He Can't Make Up His Mind Whether I Am A "Commie" or a "DEA Agent"? Maybe He Thinks . . .
Posted by: Douglas
» RE: Forget Ethanol and use Biodiesel! Another BAD IDEA!
Posted by: mtnclimber
» RE: Forget Ethanol and use Biodiesel! Another BAD IDEA!
Posted by: leftoverbacon
» RE: Forget Ethanol and use Biodiesel! Another BAD IDEA!
Posted by: EconProf
» RE: Forget Ethanol and use Biodiesel! Another BAD IDEA!
Posted by: mariao57
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Posted by: NowYogi on Dec 13, 2006 4:43 AM
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» RE: Follow the money, is it really from ethanol?
Posted by: YinRising
» RE: Follow the money, is it really from ethanol?
Posted by: willymack
» RE: Follow the money
Posted by: Plenum
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Posted by: Douglas on Dec 13, 2006 4:48 AM
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» Only the Gullible..
Posted by: YinRising
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Posted by: theskywolf on Dec 13, 2006 5:02 AM
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He is very much correct in saying that we have too many people and we are spreading the Earth's resources too thin. However, he is ignoring the premier plant resource on the planet: Hemp!
Hemp produces both bio diesel and ethanol, the diesel fuel is made from the seed oil, ethanol coming from the pulp, called hurds. What's left over provides the world's best bast fiber, from the stalk, and animal feed from the seed cake (After the oil has been extracted).
Hemp does not require the pesticides, herbicides, or other chemicals to grow and be processed that corn/soybeans need. Hemp grows well in even marginal soils.
Roughly four times more ethanol or biodiesel can be obtained from Hemp than from corn or soybeans.
Hemp's only problem: It's illegal If we pull the heads of the politicians out of their asses, we can fix that.
Go to: www.jackherer.com for more on Hemp fuel.
Skywolf.
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» Even Hemp Biofuel Is Unviable! You Are In Denial!
Posted by: Douglas
» How much higher a yield than corn does hemp produce? That is the question that needs to be addressed
Posted by: Douglas
» How Much Higher A Yield Than Corn Does Hemp Produce? Why Won't You Answer?
Posted by: Douglas
» How Much Higher A Crop Yield Than Corn or Soy Does Hemp Produce? Why Are You Afraid To Answer?
Posted by: Douglas
» If You Give The Answer I Will Look At It! What Is The Answer? Just the Statistics! No Name-calling!
Posted by: Douglas
» "DEA/Alternet DIPSHIT" Is Not The Answer To The Question! Why Are Yo Afraid To Answer The Question?
Posted by: Douglas
» Why are there too many posts by the same poster asking the same question? Consolidation anyone?
Posted by: maxpayne
» maxpayne goes on to ask this very same question in six other posts!!!
Posted by: Douglas
» Nah, must be the folks censoring the posts. They might as well remove Douglas's as well.
Posted by: Jason Jordan
» If You Aren't BozemanBlues How Do You Know That His Posts Were Removed?
Posted by: Douglas
» RE: ven Hemp Biofuel Is Unviable! You Are In Denial!
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» How Much Higher A Yield Than Corn or Soy Does Hemp Produce? Why Are You Afraid of the Answer?
Posted by: Douglas
» Give the Answer Again, Please!!!
Posted by: Douglas
» I Have Not Accepted Or Rejected The Answer! I Cannot Do Either Until You Give It! What Is It?
Posted by: Douglas
» Why post the same thing too many times? Let it go and move on.
Posted by: maxpayne
» Why post the same thing too many times? Indeed! Et Tu, Brute?
Posted by: Douglas
» My, my, are you pretty rude. Learn some manners, please.
Posted by: Jason Jordan
» If You Think This Is Rude You Should Have Seen The Removed Comment I Was Responding To!!!
Posted by: Douglas
» And the reward for the ruddest goes to Douglas.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» RE: Hemp Biofuels
Posted by: HeroesAll
» RE: Hemp Biofuels were studied by Dr. Pimentel,,,
Posted by: John Rice
» Just because you were his favorite student doesn't make him correct.
Posted by: maxpayne
» Why Don't You Critique His Ideas Instead of Engaging in Ad Hominem Attacks Against The Professor
Posted by: Douglas
» Professors can be wrong too of course. Pimenthal admitted his personal attack on biofuels.
Posted by: Jason Jordan
» Is "Jason Jordan" BozemanBlues' Newest Name After Abandoning NDNative, Sdres11 & maxpayne?
Posted by: Douglas
» A historical look at Douglas's posts will reveal his hypocritical NAME-CALLING behavior he claims to
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
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Posted by: Farmertim on Dec 13, 2006 5:15 AM
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So what would we feed the soy dependant feed lot industry?
In turn put that hamburger in the shelf?
Sweden figured out 20 years ago you cannot turn grain or total plant matter into fuel.
You can however, as they do turn waste products into fuel by using secondary biproducts for the energy that carries a duel purpose and net energy gain.
And conservation and mass transit helps a lot as well, given that is where the subsidies go and are best utilized.
Farmertim
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» Conservation and Mass Transit!! Absolutely Right!!
Posted by: Douglas
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Posted by: Ghoulman on Dec 13, 2006 5:25 AM
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Except that the oil companies would NOT be making billions and causing the suffering of the entire human race! Nearly 6 billion living in despair.
Oh yea, making every last thing (your cloths, desk, computer, make-up, hair gell, etc.) out of big gobs of oil is really stupid too (ever wonder why so many North Americans die of cancer?)
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» RE: There is no reason a gallon can't take you 1000k
Posted by: HeroesAll
» RE: There is no reason a gallon can't take you 1000k
Posted by: EconProf
» RE: this automobile is only a fantasy.
Posted by: Ghoulman
» RE: this automobile is only a fantasy.
Posted by: EconProf
» RE: I am a scholar
Posted by: Ghoulman
» RE: I am a scholar
Posted by: EconProf
» RE: I am a scholar
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» RE: I am a scholar
Posted by: Ghoulman
» RE: this automobile is only a fantasy.
Posted by: harris
» RE: this automobile is only a fantasy.
Posted by: EconProf
» RE: cited both my degree and my post-degree success.
Posted by: Ghoulman
» RE: There is no reason a gallon can't take you 1000k
Posted by: Lazylight
» RE: There is no reason a gallon can't take you 1000k
Posted by: EconProf
» RE: There is no reason a gallon can't take you 1000k
Posted by: Lazylight
» RE: There is no reason a gallon can't take you 1000k
Posted by: EconProf
» RE: ^^^ ignorant silliness
Posted by: Ghoulman
» RE: ^^^ ignorant silliness
Posted by: EconProf
» RE: ^^^ ignorant silliness
Posted by: joe2171
» RE: There is no reason a gallon can't take you 1000k
Posted by: purplelotus13
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Posted by: Bobsays on Dec 13, 2006 6:09 AM
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He tries getting a wind turbine for his house (and the calculations show it would take about a hundred years to pay for itself), he tries whittling down his life - and his family's - to such an extent that his wife nearly divorces him. All around him the greedy citizens of London gurgle and burp their flatulant greenhouse gases to merry abandonment. And of course somewhere in China or India, Xin Wan and Dirpal are buying a Merc 280 to drive back to their new monster home in the 'burbs.
So, ethical man's self-flagelation is a big waste of time. And not even fun.
The facts are plain: the only thing that will do anything to reverse this problem is engineering it out of our everyday existance. And that can be done if we concentrate on changing technology and stop wasting time with the agenda gimmicks of Big Green and Big Mean (the organic consuming, yuppie elite that we all know are the new greener than thou uber class).
It is time to stop flagelating, start thinking and start just focusing on leaving a nice life, being nice to people and enjoying the days you have left.
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» blah blah blah.. technology will save us... yeah... THATS worked before.
Posted by: JoshuaLudd
» Woo-hoo!
Posted by: meddlehead
» HA HA! Hairshirt "Greener Than Thou" FakeLeftists will never stop their Self-Flagellation!
Posted by: emmanuel_goldstein_fights_fake_lefties
» Yep. Cleaner, safer nuclear power is our salvation!
Posted by: emmanuel_goldstein_fights_fake_lefties
» RE: funny, but true
Posted by: Ghoulman
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Posted by: leftoverbacon on Dec 13, 2006 6:49 AM
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Until Pimentel uses a balanced scale, I will dismiss him as a kook. Sure biofuels may be energy intensive in their manufacture (ethanol more so than biodiesel), but they are a more efficient option when ALL energy inputs are considered.
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» RE: Pimentel is Blind as a Bat!
Posted by: Lazylight
» Not the point
Posted by: burlveneer
» RE: Pimentel is Blind as a Bat!
Posted by: Ghoulman
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Posted by: SteveB on Dec 13, 2006 7:10 AM
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"Conserve! One word. And no one talks about it, including the environmentalists."
The people I know who are biodiesel advocates talk about conservation all the time.
Unless your main objective it to pick fights with other environmentalists, why not simply acknowlege that we need both conservation and alternative energy sources (like biofuels) to solve the problem, and then join together and get to work?
As I said, the biofuels advocates I know do this - Pimentel doesn't.
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» RE: No one talks about it?
Posted by: Ghoulman
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Posted by: AdamG on Dec 13, 2006 7:41 AM
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Plain and simple, we are going to have to eventually give up passenger vehicles whether they be cars, trucks, or airplanes. In the short term, conservation is our best bet. Drive less, buy a hybrid if you can afford it, using and improving mass transit, buying food that is grown locally, making our houses and their appliances more enrgy effiecient, and more to lower our current energy use. Americans are little piggies, we use tremendously more energy then everyone else, including our not as fat but still portly piggie cousins, namely Europeans and Australians. We should, at least, lower our consumption to 20% of what it is now so that our use reflects our portion of the world's population.
While biofuels may not contribute to a net carbon gain, they do not help sequester it unless you are building topsoil in the process. Even if we quite burning fossil fuels today (carbon that existed in the atmosphere long ago) we would have decades before we lowered the CO2 amounts to more reasonable levels. We have been emitting carbon from both current sources and from fossil fuels. Current carbon had been sequestered in forest,grasslands, the soil as organic matter, and phtyoplankton. We have for at least 10,000 years been liquidating this sequestered carbon. Through deforestation, plowing up land for annual grain monocultures, and nonegenerative farming practices we have been unsequestering carbon. Add to this burning fossil fuels and it becomes clear why there is such an elevated level of CO2. Not only to we need to sequester the current carbon, we need to also resequester the fossil carbon. The easiest way to do this is reforestation, reestablishment of grassland (especially in arid areas, and regenerative farming practices.
We, currently, are not moving in this direction. We are still burning fossil fuels and we are still causing increasing desertification around the globe. Every year we continue in this direction the longer and harder we have to work to ameliorate this situation. It is wholly in the realm of possibilities that we would get to a point where the situation would not be able to be fixed. The Earth's climate could continue to change to where many of us would have to find an alternate living location other then the Earth.
The sooner we admit to ourselves some of these things, the sooner we can go about doing what needs to be done. The longer we procrastinate, the harder it will be in the long term.
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Posted by: JCR on Dec 13, 2006 7:50 AM
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The primary difference between American and Brasilian ethanol is the crop from which it's derived. In Brasil, ethanol is a product of sugarcane whereas in the US it's obviously corn-based. Brasil has ramped up sugarcane production recently but those expansive fields require massive implements to plow/plant/harvest not to mention the substantial inputs of diesel fuel required to power them. It's important to note that Brasil has a sizable population that goes hungry every day yet we rarely hear about them. Brasil is proud of its ethanol program, and rightfully so, but with a rapidly expanding population (Brasil just hit 200 million) it is just not feasible to allocate so much land to the cultivation of sugarcane when so many are going to bed hungry.
Another unfortunate consequence of sugarcane production is further deforestation of the already threatened Amazon and other "lesser" forests surrounding it. Chinese financed soy production has already made a considerable dent in many fertile areas within Brasil so it is understandable how an epic increase in sugarcane cultivation, a far more marketable commodity given its potential, is a reason for concern. I don't know how many of you follow the commodity markets but coffee production fell steeply this year due to serious drought. Even Brasil, home to the largest freshwater reserves in the world, is subject to the whims of global warming. Corn, an extremely water-intensive plant, should not be our first choice as the water wars draw near.
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» How Much Higher A Yield Than Corn or Sugar Does Hemp Produce? Are You Afraid To Answer?
Posted by: Douglas
» Last Week He Called Me A "COMMIE"! This Week He Calls Me A "DEA?Alternet Sockpuppet"! Which Is It?
Posted by: Douglas
» How Much Higher Than the Yields of Corn or Soy Does Hemp Produce? That is The Question!
Posted by: Douglas
» How Much Higher A Yield Than Corn or Soy or Sugar Does Hemp Produce? The Question You Won't Answer!
Posted by: Douglas
» Could you please GOOGLE it and give us an answer and a link? The readers would appreciate it a lot !
Posted by: maxpayne
» Does Douglas make it a point of trolling and insulting others with off-topic rant ?
Posted by: Jason Jordan
» Douglas, best reward for name-calling and do-no-research !
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
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Posted by: Mac Geek on Dec 13, 2006 8:08 AM
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SUNY ESF has been working with shrub willows as an alternative to corn for years.
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Posted by: smccaw on Dec 13, 2006 8:50 AM
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» RE: Someone must be smoking something.
Posted by: Douglas
» How Much Higher A Yield Than Corn Does Hemp Produce? You Can't or Won't Answer!
Posted by: Douglas
» BozemanBlues, NDNative and SDres11 Are All The Same Person Posting Under Different Names
Posted by: Douglas
» RE: "Douglas" is nothing more than Joshua Holland and his BIG GOVERNMENT cronies including this author
Posted by: famouspipeliner
» BozemanBlues Is Now Posting Under the Name "Jason Jordan"
Posted by: Douglas
» "BozemanBlues" Is Also Posting Under The Name "superfeduphoosier"
Posted by: Douglas
» Douglas LIES once again and never stops the name-calling he rails against.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» And Douglas doesn't do the same? Where's the outrage when Douglas does name-calling?
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
Comments are closed-
Posted by: John Rice on Dec 13, 2006 9:12 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
First off, did you even read the article the first time?
It seems to me about the only part you got right was his last name.
He needs no one else's words put in his mouth--he speaks very well for himself.
Regards,,,John
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» Bozeman Blues...
Posted by: Bree in Idaho
» How Much Higher A Yield Than Corn Does Hemp Produce? Why Are You Afraid To Answer?
Posted by: Douglas
» I'm Not Interested In Arguing With This Person! Who Does Know the Answer To The Question?
Posted by: Douglas
» How Much Higher A Yield Than Corn (or Soy) Does Hemp Produce? That Is The Question You Won't Answer.
Posted by: Douglas
» I CaN'T Accept Answers You Specifically Refuse To Give!! Why Do The Answers Threaten You So Much?
Posted by: Douglas
» Oh boy, too many useless posts. If you want answers, why not just GOOGLE it ?
Posted by: maxpayne
» Too many useless posts. maxpayne makes this same post four more times. Too many useless posts!!
Posted by: Douglas
» Does Douglas make it a point of trolling and insulting others with off-topic rant ?
Posted by: Jason Jordan
» All Of My Comments Were Responses To BozemanBlues Whose Posts Have Been Removed
Posted by: Douglas
» Douglas cries about name-calling but can't resist the urge to do the same? Give hemp a chance, sir.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Jerome Alicki on Dec 13, 2006 9:19 AM
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I think we should make it a law in the US that if you weigh more than 200lbs you cannot own a vehicle and must walk or ride a bicycle everywhere you want to go. This would solve the fuel problem and the obesity epidemic at the same time.
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» What about tall people?
Posted by: EconProf
» RE: What about tall people? That, and the small matter of the Constitution.
Posted by: Artaraxl
» RE: The Solution is Bicycles and Walking
Posted by: yankabroad
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Sojourner on Dec 13, 2006 9:46 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The oil companies spent enough money in the last election to defeat a proposition that would have taxed gas usage to provide programs for many of complaints mentioned in this thread. People refuse to face reality.
My conclusion is that nothing will happen until the petro industry is nationalized. That won't happen until it's down to the last drop of petrol--all the gassing about gas to the contrary notwithstanding.
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Posted by: Tim Chadron on Dec 13, 2006 9:54 AM
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Be kind in response, this is my first post......
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» "The larger the home, the greater the energy tax."
Posted by: Sojourner
Comments are closed-
Posted by: tdicks on Dec 13, 2006 10:16 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: I dont think anyone understands...
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» Oh, I definitely understand
Posted by: AdamG
Comments are closed-
Posted by: RichietheC on Dec 13, 2006 10:40 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: lmason on Dec 13, 2006 10:57 AM
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» RE: Truly dissapointed...
Posted by: Bree in Idaho
» The article might as well have been written by an oil tycoon.
Posted by: maxpayne
» But Is Hempfuel Viable? That Is The question I Can't Get Any of You Hemp Advocates To Consider!
Posted by: Douglas
» Well, instead of trolling, a quick search on google will give you the answers.
Posted by: Jason Jordan
» I Can't Get The Answers From People Like You Who Do Not Know Them . . .
Posted by: Douglas
» Methinks Douglas googled but is scared to admit that he's wrong.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» Douglas has definitely googled and that is why he does not think hempfuel is viable!
Posted by: Douglas
» Well, what do you have to show for it?
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» At least Yinrising makes it clear why hemp is a viable alternative while Douglas doesn't but LIES.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
Comments are closed-
Posted by: thelester on Dec 13, 2006 11:21 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Some things Pimental should consider.
The ethanol industry is still in its infancy, and is becoming considerably more efficient. The wet-mill process developed in the 70's is outdated. New dry-mill processes are cleaner and more efficient. We are currently getting 5%-10% more ethanol per bushel of corn since our plant opened (less than two years) and there are many new technologies that will surpass that. That's going to change the energy exchange ratio significantly.
Secondly, the USA produces an extra billion bushels of corn annually that is complete waste. It's a consequence of the collision of industrialism and agriculture. We practice intensive, industrialized monoculture and the massive overproduction is the consequence. What do we do with the waste? Burning it in automobiles seems a legitimate alternative to other possibilities.
Thirdly, I did not see any discussion of environmental impact. The health costs associated with petroleum pollution, especially in urban areas, not to mention oil spills, is unacceptable and costly. I worked oil fields, it's a dirty business. Ethanol can contribute to cleaner air and a healthier America. The petroleum-based oxygenate additive methyl tertiary butyl ether (MTBE) has had horrific environmental consequences, which is why it is banned in New York and California and will be prohibited nationwide. Ethanol is the only safe alternative for our cities.
I've read comments suggesting that ethanol will replace petroleum as our primary fuel. That isn't feasible. Our nation burns in excess of 110 billion gallons of gasoline and oil products a year. When the ethanol industry reaches peak performance, there might be approximately 20 billion gallons produced. And this is where Pimental is completely accurate: we grossly waste energy as a nation to the point of insanity. Ethanol is not the magic bullet. The only sustainable alternative to petroleum is committed conservation. Ethanol and other fuels can fill niches (except hydrogen fuel cells, that's a scam), but it will be the American citizen willing to do with less horsepower, more mass transit, more walking, and fewer impulse trips to the big box stores that will be the real solution. Ethanol, other boutique fuels, domestic petroleum production, and a heaping help of conservation is the only way we will have an energy independent, environmentally sustainable future for our nation.
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» RE: Future of Ethanol
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» Hemp can produce ethanol and requires no petroleum. Sad that the author ignored that point.
Posted by: maxpayne
» RE: Hemp can produce ethanol and requires no petroleum. Sad that the author ignored that point.
Posted by: Jason Jordan
» Hey "Jason Jordan," Shouldn't You Come CLean That You Are Actually "BozemanBlues"?
Posted by: Douglas
» Did Douglas VIOLATE Alternet's TOS? At least two of four violations have occurred.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» How Many Of These Has "superfeduphoosier" (aka "BozemanBlues") Violated In Just One Hour?
Posted by: Douglas
» superfeduphoosier tells the truth and never lies unlike Douglas.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
Comments are closed-
Posted by: asilsfable on Dec 13, 2006 11:47 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It's already being collected; why not pump methane into our homes instead of natural gas and compost the rest to be used on our farmlands?
Buckminster Fuller said, "Pollution are resources we haven't found uses for yet."
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Posted by: kuro_neko on Dec 13, 2006 12:25 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Highly diverse mixtures of native prairie plant species have emerged as a leader in the quest to identify the best source of biomass for producing sustainable, bio-based fuel to replace petroleum.
Mixed prairie grasses have emerged as a leader in the quest to produce biofuels.
A new study led by David Tilman, Regents Professor of Ecology in the University of Minnesota's College of Biological Sciences, shows that mixtures of native perennial grasses and other flowering plants provide more usable energy per acre than corn grain ethanol or soybean biodiesel and are far better for the environment.
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» another argument for preserving diversity
Posted by: Drclaw
» Carbon Negative
Posted by: Krain61
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Drclaw on Dec 13, 2006 12:37 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» Time To Answer The Question: How Much Higher A Yield Than Corn Does Hemp Produce!!!
Posted by: Douglas
» "DIPSHIT" & Other Namecalling Is Not The Answer! Just Give The Statistics, Please!
Posted by: Douglas
» If The Answer Was Already Given, Why Can't It Be Given Again? I Can't find It. Just Give The Facts!
Posted by: Douglas
» Give Me The Truth And I Will Handle It!! What Is The Truth? If You've Already. . .
Posted by: Douglas
» Oh boy, too many useless posts. If you want answers, why not just GOOGLE it ?
Posted by: maxpayne
» If YOU Don't Know The Answer To The Question, How Can you Reasonably Advocate Hempfuel???
Posted by: Douglas
» Max, Douglas is just a troll. Funny that Alternet keeps only his posts. I guess Douglas fears hemp.
Posted by: Jason Jordan
» Any Responsible Advocate Of Hempfuel Knows The Answer. It Is Telling That You & Max Do Not!!!
Posted by: Douglas
» Maybe Douglas should verify that hemp fuel is or isn't viable unless he's scared to admit he's wrong
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» Here Is BozemanBlues Again Under His Newest Name! He Isn't Fooling Anyone?
Posted by: Douglas
» Douglas, you're a bald-faced liar. Stop calling people names before telling others what to do.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» Who Is BozemanBlues? NdNative, Sdres11, maxpayne, superfeduphoosier and who knows what else?
Posted by: Douglas
» Did Douglas VIOLATE Alternet's TOS? At least two of four violations have occurred.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» No kidding. Douglas must be on prozac. What a loser.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» How Many Names Can BozemanBlues Come Up With? Here is Yet Another One!!
Posted by: Douglas
» Douglas needs to get a life and stop acting like Richard Nixon and stop being a bald-faced liar.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» Max, "Jason Jordan" Is Just Another Name for "BozemanBlues"
Posted by: Douglas
» Douglas is Prof Pimenthal and why not? Douglas reminds me of Nixon who classifies people he hates.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» Douglas needs to get a life and stop acting like Richard Nixon and stop being a bald-faced liar.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» Hey "BozemanBlues" (aka "superfeduphoosier"), You Are So Stupidly Transparent You Are Laughable!!
Posted by: Douglas
» Did Douglas VIOLATE Alternet's TOS? At least two of four violations have occurred.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» Should You Apply These To Your Own Posts?
Posted by: Douglas
» Douglas LIES once again but never gives up.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
Comments are closed-
Posted by: MonkeyBoy on Dec 13, 2006 2:05 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: MonkeyBoy on Dec 13, 2006 2:43 PM
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http://www.lifeaftertheoilcrash.net/Index.html
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Posted by: CyberBrook on Dec 13, 2006 3:43 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
weaning off of oil, expanding solar, wind, and tidal energy generators, solar panels on all govt buildings to start with, subsidizing renewable research, legalizing and using hemp, demilitarizing and stopping war, reforesting, buying local, organic agriculture, walking and biking, conservation and efficiency, installing compact flourescent light bulbs, recycling and buying recycled, reducing consumption, keeping in check one's number of bio-kids and pets, quitting smoking, green roofing, etc. and eliminating or sharply reducing one's meat consumption.
The science regarding the ravages (health and environmental, not to mention ethical) of meat is accumulating.
Please see some of the following sources:
Another Inconvenient Truth
http://www.eatkind.net/inconvenient.htm
EarthSave: A New Global Warming Strategy
http://www.earthsave.org/globalwarming.htm
Another Inconvenient Truth: Meat is a Global Warming Issue
http://www.emagazine.com/view/?3312
Another Inconvenient Truth: In the modern world, it is impossible to reconcile a carnivorous diet with environmental responsibility
aquarianonline.com/Eco/anotherinconvenienttruth.htm
UN: Which causes more greenhouse gas emissions, rearing cattle or driving cars?
http://www.fao.org/newsroom/en/news/2006/1000448/index.html
Livestock’s Role in Climate Change and Air Pollution
virtualcentre.org/en/library/key_pub/longshad/A0701E00.htm
Warming Up to a New Diet
http://simplevegan.blogspot.com
Diet, Energy and Global Warming
http://geosci.uchicago.edu/~gidon/papers/nutri/nutri.html
ABC News: Meat-Eaters Aiding Global Warming?
abcnews.go.com/Technology/TenWays/story?id=2119267&page=1
Greenpeace: On Your Plate
www.greenpeace.org/usa/news/green-living-guide/on-your-plate
Fight Global Warming by Going Vegetarian
http://goveg.com/environment-globalwarming.asp
Vegan diets healthier for planet, people than meat diets
http://www-news.uchicago.edu/releases/06/060413.diet.shtml
The SUV in the Pantry
http://www.organicconsumers.org/btc/gasfood112105.cfm
Physics World: Cut Global Warming by Becoming Vegetarian
http://www.physorg.com/news4998.html
Five Food Choices for a Healthy Planet
http://www.veg.ca/issues/enviro-5reasons.html
and
Eco-Eating: Eating as if the Earth Matters
http://www.brook.com/veg
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» RE: AMEN BROTHER, Thank you for posting all the solutions. This is what authors need to get at !
Posted by: Krain61
» The Closest You Ever Came To A Cowboy Was When You Visited A Long Island Dairy Farm
Posted by: Douglas
» Douglas and Bozeman, this kind of fighting is why Big Oil stands to win.
Posted by: maxpayne
» Right on. Douglas just wants to pick fights without any reason.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» Alternet Banned You, Didn't They, "BozemanBlues" (aka "superfeduphoosier")
Posted by: Douglas
» There you go again, calling people names and outright lying. Go ahead and keep lying about me being
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» How Much Higher A Yield than Corn Does Hemp Produce? Still Afraid To Answer The Question?
Posted by: Douglas
» He Continues To Refuse To Answer The Question. Why?
Posted by: Douglas
» If You Already Gave The Answer, Why Can't You Give It Again? Don't You Know The Answer?
Posted by: Douglas
» Douglas, just ignore Bozeman if he refuses to answer. Besides, why not have a meaningful discussion?
Posted by: maxpayne
Comments are closed-
Posted by: thoughtcriminal on Dec 13, 2006 6:14 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: One-sided viewpoints don't do the subject justice:
Posted by: Krain61
» RE: One-sided viewpoints don't do the subject justice:
Posted by: Douglas
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Krain61 on Dec 13, 2006 7:18 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Have you seen our Goverment do much of anything that has really made things cheaper for you in a while..We ship things over sea's to be manufactured and then back and that's global warming there..And they said they would pass the savings on to us...lol But they just didn't tell us who was going to get that savings.."The owners" Not You Not Me..So if you buy it you'll help raise the price of breads and cereals and even your meat..What do cows and pigs eat? We need to concentrate on wind and solar energy..That's our future.
Once put up they last a very long time with no global warmer afterwards..I guess we can make gas and eat grass after the cows come home!
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Posted by: maxpayne on Dec 14, 2006 11:47 AM
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Posted by: maxpayne on Dec 14, 2006 12:29 PM
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Any doozie, even an oil tycoon, can lecture bs on conservation but it hardly does anything to actually address the energy crisis. It's just like the Ford plant closure tragedy in Norfolk, where the CEO racks in OBSCENE amounts of money even as the company goes bankrupt and to add insult to the injury workers get laid off and are given a "cheap" voucher being told to go to school when in fact it's the CEO who deserves to go to JAIL and then REFORM school.
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» RE: Well, then why does Alternet make it disappear so fast all the while keeping Barbie shit first ?
Posted by: Techubus
» RE: Not sure how my reply ended up all the way down here.. N/T
Posted by: Techubus
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Jason Jordan on Dec 14, 2006 6:09 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
P.S.: Notice that those who criticize The Grist authors get their posts removed. And I had to read through all the frivolous drivel from too many jackasses saying yup yup to the author. The only posts that made any sense were the ones where the readers correctly pointed out Pimenthal's flaw of ENTIRELY IGNORING hemp. Hemp may be a biofuel but that doesn't mean it's the same as corn or soy. Even here at Twin Falls, Idaho, one can grow hemp that can withstand even the harsh cold weather. Try doing that with soy or corn. And you have to wonder why the amazon has to be DESTROYED just to grow corn or soy just to produce ethanol which then requires petroleum. Contrast that to hemp which can produce the cellulose needed to produce ethanol and hemp doesn't even contribute to global warming because unlike crude oil, no toxic chemicals are released and the carbon dioxide that is released is easily absorbed by the plants thereby contributing to further growth while not wasting all the soil.
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Posted by: superfeduphoosier on Dec 14, 2006 7:40 PM
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» Thank You For Your Comment, "BozemanBlues" (aka "superfeduphoosier")
Posted by: Douglas
» Once again, Douglas LIES and engages in NAME-CALLING.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
Comments are closed-
Posted by: jolo on Dec 14, 2006 11:07 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If we get out of the U.S. and don't look at make believe statistics and biased "studies", and look at the real think. Yes,. the real thing.
This is simple, LOOK AT BRAZIL.It is in action, working, ironically the President of Brazil uses a new General Motors vehicle which runs on biofuels. This is not theory, or a study, it is a ENTIRE nation, a rather LARGE nation if anyone looked at a map that is lights years ahead of the U.S. in stopping the use of fossil fuels.
Here are the facts:
First don't compare the low grade, crappy ethanol that is used at times in the U.S. or the ancient experiments done with ignorant "wantabee" intellectuals (actually there are wishtoberich). They are irrelevant.
FOCUS on the positive, real life, going on right now modern success story of Brazil.
Here is a FACT, Brazil is so successful with their biofuels program, that it has gotten the nation out of horrible date and they are now EXPORTING, not only their technologies to the rest of the world, but all exporting their biofuels. Japan, Australia. Sweden, China, Russia, etc. But the US puts an enormous tax on importing anything from Brazil.
The autos that run on Biofuels in Brazil WORK, are in existence is functioning today and mopre and more opf the biofuels autos are being made, even by General Motors, BUT NOT FOR THE U.S.
Brazil has figured out how to make their Biofuel factories that turn their sugar cane into Fuel run, COMPLETELY FINANCIALLY INDEPENDENT. To Biofuels making factories run entirely on Biofuel.
Farmers who took a trip to Brazil to see THE FACTS, are buying up land, factories and technologies from Brazil with the intention of moving on, while the U.S. is stuck on fossil fuels. So stuck that they bomb independent nations and destroy non-replaceable land to make MORE OIL WELLS.
I guess a country like Sweeden haven't been pimped by PIMPentel yet. They must sure be dumb. Huh.
Sweden has made a national commitment to be totally free of all fossil fuels and atomic energy in 15 years !!
Yes be totally energy independent.
What type of energy are the Swedes actively banking in for being TRULY free, independent and running on replaceable energy ?? It is BIOFUELS of course !!They know that they are banking on a working, proven technology.
You can read about the Sweden story here.
Click to read Sweden story from the Guardian Unlimited.
Please read from media that is outside of the U.S. The fossil fuel industry owns the U.S. Congress and Administration. They current government is so corrupt on Oil Industry lobbiests, that one will never read on honest story. Look at the media from other nations to read the truth about Brazil and the rest of the world.
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» RE: This is total misinformation. See PIMPentel do some pimping
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
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Posted by: yankabroad on Dec 15, 2006 8:09 AM
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Is this You?
Please clarify, anyone.
RR
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Posted by: PopulationStabilization on Dec 16, 2006 6:29 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
On the hemp issue, the insightful supporters of its use know that it can be used for a multitude of products, even possibly replacing the toxic petroleum plastics that pollute our environment. It is the way to go.
Good luck to us all for a happier future.
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» RE: PopulationStabilization -- Makes perfect sense. But what's your point? :-)
Posted by: Pat Kittle
Comments are closed-
Posted by: 1Eco. on Dec 16, 2006 10:43 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Any sustainable small scale local effort is a positive and should be supported by not only enviros and progressives, but everyone who might want to stand with the people for a greener future.
The sustainable objective should be to work toward local community and individual based alternative energy sources, while conserving or supporting conservation. Green commons, parks, tree planting, wild life viewing areas can all be a part of that green community mix. These are phased based options that demand time, regardless the emergency, and fear based, global warming timelines.
This nation goes from $8.4 Trillion in National Fed. Debt. and $2 Trillion for major conflict and we shift from that screwed up starting point. Utilization of the transportation infrastructure and retroactive use of most transportation assets require liquid fuels. It is low cost feedstocks that will allow that first phase transfer with time. Decentralization of the who power and energy equation is extremely important, one green community at a time. What has been up til now is the dead end.
What will be in the future means working to find the common good while allowing time for positive small scale projects to ramp up. That is being seen now in Wind, Solar, BioFuel, and forestry. The cry is always we have no time. Then start a small scale project, plant some trees, work with your local community for green alternatives, but don't expect to turn everything around in a year, two, or ten. Major mistakes have been made for the profit motive and the advantage of a select few. Sustainable energy communities will take time to form. Biofuels while an option for liquid fuel might be better suited for heat. Geothermal for cool, and so forth. Unless the electric source is solar or wind, or some other alternative energy, local, small scale solution, enviros simply miss the mark. I do not regard BIG ELECTRIC POWER, OR BIG ENERGY as anything but the REAL DEAD END. I don't know how much more we need to go into debt to see this. The true costs are hidden with this old energy game.
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Posted by: 1Eco. on Dec 20, 2006 5:53 PM
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They could bounce off their lows with any run up in gas prices.
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Posted by: drblack on Dec 13, 2006 12:48 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If the leaves and flowers are put back into the soil it needs little additional fertilizer for each successive crop.
The energy needed to run the distillation equipment can be solar power.
Hemp will grow on poor quality soil if for the 1st crop enough nitrogen is used.
Hemp produces the most Bio-mass per acre of any feasible plant source.
It will not provide all our energy ,but it would produce enough ethanol to run our cars.
Henry Fords first combustion engine ran off of etanol from hemp.He changed to gasoline when Rockafeller(sp?) offered Ford a giant loan to start his car company if Ford used gasoline to power his engines.
This gets no press and seems to be ignored by most energy researchers.
This maybe because Hemp is also called marijuana:though the type grow for fuel is grown for its stem and has almost no THC...the stuff that gets one high.
There was a book written in the 70's by an engineer who spelled out this hemp for fuel plan....I think it was by David Gold and called solar Gas. I am not sure if this author or title are correct.I cannot find a copy of it these days.
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» RE: Hemp for biomass with solar stills CAN replace gasoline
Posted by: HeroesAll
» Yeah, depends on what you want it for...
Posted by: JoshuaLudd
» RE: Hemp for biomass with solar stills CAN replace gasoline
Posted by: aonghus36
» RE: Hemp for biomass with solar stills CAN replace gasoline
Posted by: drblack
» Solar and Wind Can Replace Gasoline!!!
Posted by: Douglas
» Obviously It Is Time To Get Rid Of Autos and Trucks!!!!!
Posted by: Douglas
» RE: Solar and Wind Can Replace Gasoline!!!
Posted by: Johnny Hempseed
» Thank you for calling BS on ANOTHER GATEKEEPER article
Posted by: YinRising
» BozemanBlues (aka NDNative) Confuses Intellectual Flabbiness For "Toughness"! What A Joke!
Posted by: Douglas
» Is Edelman Throwing A Christmas Party For You Guys Down There In Midtown Manhattan?
Posted by: Douglas
» And what does this have to do with the topic?
Posted by: maxpayne
» How Useful Is Your Comment, Genius? Or Your Many Other Posts That Follow?
Posted by: Douglas
» You seem a little more reasonable
Posted by: AdamG
» RE: You seem a little more reasonable
Posted by: aonghus36
» RE: Hemp for biomass with solar stills CAN replace gasoline
Posted by: willymack
» RE: Hemp for biomass with solar stills CAN replace gasoline
Posted by: drblack
» RE: Hemp is the best of the bunch, but as far as I know, unproven
Posted by: Techubus
» RE: Hemp and other biofuels were supposed to be the future but engines were adjusted to
Posted by: maxpayne
Comments are closed-
Posted by: eddie torres on Dec 13, 2006 2:10 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Just as soon as the US population reaches 35 million people.
Is ADM planning something "sinister"?
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» RE: 300 million today, 35 million tomorrow
Posted by: ignition
» RE: 300 million today, 35 million tomorrow
Posted by: MonkeyBoy
Comments are closed-
Posted by: rsaxto on Dec 13, 2006 3:01 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: ways
Posted by: HeroesAll
» RE: ways,Hemp is a great food crop.
Posted by: Johnny Hempseed
» BozemanBlues and NDRes: The Dr Jeckyl and Mr. Hyde of the Hempnut Movement
Posted by: Douglas
» If Anyone Can Answer The Question I Will Gratefully Look At And Consider Their Answer! What Is It?
Posted by: Douglas
» RE: You're an idiot
Posted by: Techubus
» RE: ways
Posted by: drblack
Comments are closed-
Posted by: EconProf on Dec 13, 2006 3:14 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» Solar and Wind Are The "Fuels" of the Future
Posted by: Douglas
» RE: Solar and Wind Are The "Fuels" of the Future
Posted by: EconProf
» Since We Probably Don't Have Another 50 Years, I Have A Better Alternative. Let's . . .
Posted by: Douglas
» Douglas gives the MIDDLE FINGER to "BozemanBlues"
Posted by: Douglas
» Actually, Douglas Moved from Arizona to New York! BozemanBlues is a native New Yorker . . .
Posted by: Douglas
» He Can't Make Up His Mind Whether I Am A "Commie" or a "DEA Agent"? Maybe He Thinks . . .
Posted by: Douglas
» RE: Forget Ethanol and use Biodiesel! Another BAD IDEA!
Posted by: mtnclimber
» RE: Forget Ethanol and use Biodiesel! Another BAD IDEA!
Posted by: leftoverbacon
» RE: Forget Ethanol and use Biodiesel! Another BAD IDEA!
Posted by: EconProf
» RE: Forget Ethanol and use Biodiesel! Another BAD IDEA!
Posted by: mariao57
Comments are closed-
Posted by: NowYogi on Dec 13, 2006 4:43 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: Follow the money, is it really from ethanol?
Posted by: YinRising
» RE: Follow the money, is it really from ethanol?
Posted by: willymack
» RE: Follow the money
Posted by: Plenum
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Douglas on Dec 13, 2006 4:48 AM
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» Only the Gullible..
Posted by: YinRising
Comments are closed-
Posted by: theskywolf on Dec 13, 2006 5:02 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
He is very much correct in saying that we have too many people and we are spreading the Earth's resources too thin. However, he is ignoring the premier plant resource on the planet: Hemp!
Hemp produces both bio diesel and ethanol, the diesel fuel is made from the seed oil, ethanol coming from the pulp, called hurds. What's left over provides the world's best bast fiber, from the stalk, and animal feed from the seed cake (After the oil has been extracted).
Hemp does not require the pesticides, herbicides, or other chemicals to grow and be processed that corn/soybeans need. Hemp grows well in even marginal soils.
Roughly four times more ethanol or biodiesel can be obtained from Hemp than from corn or soybeans.
Hemp's only problem: It's illegal If we pull the heads of the politicians out of their asses, we can fix that.
Go to: www.jackherer.com for more on Hemp fuel.
Skywolf.
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» Even Hemp Biofuel Is Unviable! You Are In Denial!
Posted by: Douglas
» How much higher a yield than corn does hemp produce? That is the question that needs to be addressed
Posted by: Douglas
» How Much Higher A Yield Than Corn Does Hemp Produce? Why Won't You Answer?
Posted by: Douglas
» How Much Higher A Crop Yield Than Corn or Soy Does Hemp Produce? Why Are You Afraid To Answer?
Posted by: Douglas
» If You Give The Answer I Will Look At It! What Is The Answer? Just the Statistics! No Name-calling!
Posted by: Douglas
» "DEA/Alternet DIPSHIT" Is Not The Answer To The Question! Why Are Yo Afraid To Answer The Question?
Posted by: Douglas
» Why are there too many posts by the same poster asking the same question? Consolidation anyone?
Posted by: maxpayne
» maxpayne goes on to ask this very same question in six other posts!!!
Posted by: Douglas
» Nah, must be the folks censoring the posts. They might as well remove Douglas's as well.
Posted by: Jason Jordan
» If You Aren't BozemanBlues How Do You Know That His Posts Were Removed?
Posted by: Douglas
» RE: ven Hemp Biofuel Is Unviable! You Are In Denial!
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» How Much Higher A Yield Than Corn or Soy Does Hemp Produce? Why Are You Afraid of the Answer?
Posted by: Douglas
» Give the Answer Again, Please!!!
Posted by: Douglas
» I Have Not Accepted Or Rejected The Answer! I Cannot Do Either Until You Give It! What Is It?
Posted by: Douglas
» Why post the same thing too many times? Let it go and move on.
Posted by: maxpayne
» Why post the same thing too many times? Indeed! Et Tu, Brute?
Posted by: Douglas
» My, my, are you pretty rude. Learn some manners, please.
Posted by: Jason Jordan
» If You Think This Is Rude You Should Have Seen The Removed Comment I Was Responding To!!!
Posted by: Douglas
» And the reward for the ruddest goes to Douglas.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» RE: Hemp Biofuels
Posted by: HeroesAll
» RE: Hemp Biofuels were studied by Dr. Pimentel,,,
Posted by: John Rice
» Just because you were his favorite student doesn't make him correct.
Posted by: maxpayne
» Why Don't You Critique His Ideas Instead of Engaging in Ad Hominem Attacks Against The Professor
Posted by: Douglas
» Professors can be wrong too of course. Pimenthal admitted his personal attack on biofuels.
Posted by: Jason Jordan
» Is "Jason Jordan" BozemanBlues' Newest Name After Abandoning NDNative, Sdres11 & maxpayne?
Posted by: Douglas
» A historical look at Douglas's posts will reveal his hypocritical NAME-CALLING behavior he claims to
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Farmertim on Dec 13, 2006 5:15 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
So what would we feed the soy dependant feed lot industry?
In turn put that hamburger in the shelf?
Sweden figured out 20 years ago you cannot turn grain or total plant matter into fuel.
You can however, as they do turn waste products into fuel by using secondary biproducts for the energy that carries a duel purpose and net energy gain.
And conservation and mass transit helps a lot as well, given that is where the subsidies go and are best utilized.
Farmertim
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» Conservation and Mass Transit!! Absolutely Right!!
Posted by: Douglas
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Ghoulman on Dec 13, 2006 5:25 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Except that the oil companies would NOT be making billions and causing the suffering of the entire human race! Nearly 6 billion living in despair.
Oh yea, making every last thing (your cloths, desk, computer, make-up, hair gell, etc.) out of big gobs of oil is really stupid too (ever wonder why so many North Americans die of cancer?)
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» RE: There is no reason a gallon can't take you 1000k
Posted by: HeroesAll
» RE: There is no reason a gallon can't take you 1000k
Posted by: EconProf
» RE: this automobile is only a fantasy.
Posted by: Ghoulman
» RE: this automobile is only a fantasy.
Posted by: EconProf
» RE: I am a scholar
Posted by: Ghoulman
» RE: I am a scholar
Posted by: EconProf
» RE: I am a scholar
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» RE: I am a scholar
Posted by: Ghoulman
» RE: this automobile is only a fantasy.
Posted by: harris
» RE: this automobile is only a fantasy.
Posted by: EconProf
» RE: cited both my degree and my post-degree success.
Posted by: Ghoulman
» RE: There is no reason a gallon can't take you 1000k
Posted by: Lazylight
» RE: There is no reason a gallon can't take you 1000k
Posted by: EconProf
» RE: There is no reason a gallon can't take you 1000k
Posted by: Lazylight
» RE: There is no reason a gallon can't take you 1000k
Posted by: EconProf
» RE: ^^^ ignorant silliness
Posted by: Ghoulman
» RE: ^^^ ignorant silliness
Posted by: EconProf
» RE: ^^^ ignorant silliness
Posted by: joe2171
» RE: There is no reason a gallon can't take you 1000k
Posted by: purplelotus13
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Bobsays on Dec 13, 2006 6:09 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
He tries getting a wind turbine for his house (and the calculations show it would take about a hundred years to pay for itself), he tries whittling down his life - and his family's - to such an extent that his wife nearly divorces him. All around him the greedy citizens of London gurgle and burp their flatulant greenhouse gases to merry abandonment. And of course somewhere in China or India, Xin Wan and Dirpal are buying a Merc 280 to drive back to their new monster home in the 'burbs.
So, ethical man's self-flagelation is a big waste of time. And not even fun.
The facts are plain: the only thing that will do anything to reverse this problem is engineering it out of our everyday existance. And that can be done if we concentrate on changing technology and stop wasting time with the agenda gimmicks of Big Green and Big Mean (the organic consuming, yuppie elite that we all know are the new greener than thou uber class).
It is time to stop flagelating, start thinking and start just focusing on leaving a nice life, being nice to people and enjoying the days you have left.
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» blah blah blah.. technology will save us... yeah... THATS worked before.
Posted by: JoshuaLudd
» Woo-hoo!
Posted by: meddlehead
» HA HA! Hairshirt "Greener Than Thou" FakeLeftists will never stop their Self-Flagellation!
Posted by: emmanuel_goldstein_fights_fake_lefties
» Yep. Cleaner, safer nuclear power is our salvation!
Posted by: emmanuel_goldstein_fights_fake_lefties
» RE: funny, but true
Posted by: Ghoulman
Comments are closed-
Posted by: leftoverbacon on Dec 13, 2006 6:49 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Until Pimentel uses a balanced scale, I will dismiss him as a kook. Sure biofuels may be energy intensive in their manufacture (ethanol more so than biodiesel), but they are a more efficient option when ALL energy inputs are considered.
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» RE: Pimentel is Blind as a Bat!
Posted by: Lazylight
» Not the point
Posted by: burlveneer
» RE: Pimentel is Blind as a Bat!
Posted by: Ghoulman
Comments are closed-
Posted by: SteveB on Dec 13, 2006 7:10 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"Conserve! One word. And no one talks about it, including the environmentalists."
The people I know who are biodiesel advocates talk about conservation all the time.
Unless your main objective it to pick fights with other environmentalists, why not simply acknowlege that we need both conservation and alternative energy sources (like biofuels) to solve the problem, and then join together and get to work?
As I said, the biofuels advocates I know do this - Pimentel doesn't.
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» RE: No one talks about it?
Posted by: Ghoulman
Comments are closed-
Posted by: AdamG on Dec 13, 2006 7:41 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Plain and simple, we are going to have to eventually give up passenger vehicles whether they be cars, trucks, or airplanes. In the short term, conservation is our best bet. Drive less, buy a hybrid if you can afford it, using and improving mass transit, buying food that is grown locally, making our houses and their appliances more enrgy effiecient, and more to lower our current energy use. Americans are little piggies, we use tremendously more energy then everyone else, including our not as fat but still portly piggie cousins, namely Europeans and Australians. We should, at least, lower our consumption to 20% of what it is now so that our use reflects our portion of the world's population.
While biofuels may not contribute to a net carbon gain, they do not help sequester it unless you are building topsoil in the process. Even if we quite burning fossil fuels today (carbon that existed in the atmosphere long ago) we would have decades before we lowered the CO2 amounts to more reasonable levels. We have been emitting carbon from both current sources and from fossil fuels. Current carbon had been sequestered in forest,grasslands, the soil as organic matter, and phtyoplankton. We have for at least 10,000 years been liquidating this sequestered carbon. Through deforestation, plowing up land for annual grain monocultures, and nonegenerative farming practices we have been unsequestering carbon. Add to this burning fossil fuels and it becomes clear why there is such an elevated level of CO2. Not only to we need to sequester the current carbon, we need to also resequester the fossil carbon. The easiest way to do this is reforestation, reestablishment of grassland (especially in arid areas, and regenerative farming practices.
We, currently, are not moving in this direction. We are still burning fossil fuels and we are still causing increasing desertification around the globe. Every year we continue in this direction the longer and harder we have to work to ameliorate this situation. It is wholly in the realm of possibilities that we would get to a point where the situation would not be able to be fixed. The Earth's climate could continue to change to where many of us would have to find an alternate living location other then the Earth.
The sooner we admit to ourselves some of these things, the sooner we can go about doing what needs to be done. The longer we procrastinate, the harder it will be in the long term.
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Posted by: JCR on Dec 13, 2006 7:50 AM
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The primary difference between American and Brasilian ethanol is the crop from which it's derived. In Brasil, ethanol is a product of sugarcane whereas in the US it's obviously corn-based. Brasil has ramped up sugarcane production recently but those expansive fields require massive implements to plow/plant/harvest not to mention the substantial inputs of diesel fuel required to power them. It's important to note that Brasil has a sizable population that goes hungry every day yet we rarely hear about them. Brasil is proud of its ethanol program, and rightfully so, but with a rapidly expanding population (Brasil just hit 200 million) it is just not feasible to allocate so much land to the cultivation of sugarcane when so many are going to bed hungry.
Another unfortunate consequence of sugarcane production is further deforestation of the already threatened Amazon and other "lesser" forests surrounding it. Chinese financed soy production has already made a considerable dent in many fertile areas within Brasil so it is understandable how an epic increase in sugarcane cultivation, a far more marketable commodity given its potential, is a reason for concern. I don't know how many of you follow the commodity markets but coffee production fell steeply this year due to serious drought. Even Brasil, home to the largest freshwater reserves in the world, is subject to the whims of global warming. Corn, an extremely water-intensive plant, should not be our first choice as the water wars draw near.
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» How Much Higher A Yield Than Corn or Sugar Does Hemp Produce? Are You Afraid To Answer?
Posted by: Douglas
» Last Week He Called Me A "COMMIE"! This Week He Calls Me A "DEA?Alternet Sockpuppet"! Which Is It?
Posted by: Douglas
» How Much Higher Than the Yields of Corn or Soy Does Hemp Produce? That is The Question!
Posted by: Douglas
» How Much Higher A Yield Than Corn or Soy or Sugar Does Hemp Produce? The Question You Won't Answer!
Posted by: Douglas
» Could you please GOOGLE it and give us an answer and a link? The readers would appreciate it a lot !
Posted by: maxpayne
» Does Douglas make it a point of trolling and insulting others with off-topic rant ?
Posted by: Jason Jordan
» Douglas, best reward for name-calling and do-no-research !
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Mac Geek on Dec 13, 2006 8:08 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
SUNY ESF has been working with shrub willows as an alternative to corn for years.
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Posted by: smccaw on Dec 13, 2006 8:50 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: Someone must be smoking something.
Posted by: Douglas
» How Much Higher A Yield Than Corn Does Hemp Produce? You Can't or Won't Answer!
Posted by: Douglas
» BozemanBlues, NDNative and SDres11 Are All The Same Person Posting Under Different Names
Posted by: Douglas
» RE: "Douglas" is nothing more than Joshua Holland and his BIG GOVERNMENT cronies including this author
Posted by: famouspipeliner
» BozemanBlues Is Now Posting Under the Name "Jason Jordan"
Posted by: Douglas
» "BozemanBlues" Is Also Posting Under The Name "superfeduphoosier"
Posted by: Douglas
» Douglas LIES once again and never stops the name-calling he rails against.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» And Douglas doesn't do the same? Where's the outrage when Douglas does name-calling?
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
Comments are closed-
Posted by: John Rice on Dec 13, 2006 9:12 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
First off, did you even read the article the first time?
It seems to me about the only part you got right was his last name.
He needs no one else's words put in his mouth--he speaks very well for himself.
Regards,,,John
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» Bozeman Blues...
Posted by: Bree in Idaho
» How Much Higher A Yield Than Corn Does Hemp Produce? Why Are You Afraid To Answer?
Posted by: Douglas
» I'm Not Interested In Arguing With This Person! Who Does Know the Answer To The Question?
Posted by: Douglas
» How Much Higher A Yield Than Corn (or Soy) Does Hemp Produce? That Is The Question You Won't Answer.
Posted by: Douglas
» I CaN'T Accept Answers You Specifically Refuse To Give!! Why Do The Answers Threaten You So Much?
Posted by: Douglas
» Oh boy, too many useless posts. If you want answers, why not just GOOGLE it ?
Posted by: maxpayne
» Too many useless posts. maxpayne makes this same post four more times. Too many useless posts!!
Posted by: Douglas
» Does Douglas make it a point of trolling and insulting others with off-topic rant ?
Posted by: Jason Jordan
» All Of My Comments Were Responses To BozemanBlues Whose Posts Have Been Removed
Posted by: Douglas
» Douglas cries about name-calling but can't resist the urge to do the same? Give hemp a chance, sir.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Jerome Alicki on Dec 13, 2006 9:19 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I think we should make it a law in the US that if you weigh more than 200lbs you cannot own a vehicle and must walk or ride a bicycle everywhere you want to go. This would solve the fuel problem and the obesity epidemic at the same time.
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» What about tall people?
Posted by: EconProf
» RE: What about tall people? That, and the small matter of the Constitution.
Posted by: Artaraxl
» RE: The Solution is Bicycles and Walking
Posted by: yankabroad
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Sojourner on Dec 13, 2006 9:46 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The oil companies spent enough money in the last election to defeat a proposition that would have taxed gas usage to provide programs for many of complaints mentioned in this thread. People refuse to face reality.
My conclusion is that nothing will happen until the petro industry is nationalized. That won't happen until it's down to the last drop of petrol--all the gassing about gas to the contrary notwithstanding.
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Posted by: Tim Chadron on Dec 13, 2006 9:54 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Be kind in response, this is my first post......
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» "The larger the home, the greater the energy tax."
Posted by: Sojourner
Comments are closed-
Posted by: tdicks on Dec 13, 2006 10:16 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: I dont think anyone understands...
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» Oh, I definitely understand
Posted by: AdamG
Comments are closed-
Posted by: RichietheC on Dec 13, 2006 10:40 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: lmason on Dec 13, 2006 10:57 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: Truly dissapointed...
Posted by: Bree in Idaho
» The article might as well have been written by an oil tycoon.
Posted by: maxpayne
» But Is Hempfuel Viable? That Is The question I Can't Get Any of You Hemp Advocates To Consider!
Posted by: Douglas
» Well, instead of trolling, a quick search on google will give you the answers.
Posted by: Jason Jordan
» I Can't Get The Answers From People Like You Who Do Not Know Them . . .
Posted by: Douglas
» Methinks Douglas googled but is scared to admit that he's wrong.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» Douglas has definitely googled and that is why he does not think hempfuel is viable!
Posted by: Douglas
» Well, what do you have to show for it?
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» At least Yinrising makes it clear why hemp is a viable alternative while Douglas doesn't but LIES.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
Comments are closed-
Posted by: thelester on Dec 13, 2006 11:21 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Some things Pimental should consider.
The ethanol industry is still in its infancy, and is becoming considerably more efficient. The wet-mill process developed in the 70's is outdated. New dry-mill processes are cleaner and more efficient. We are currently getting 5%-10% more ethanol per bushel of corn since our plant opened (less than two years) and there are many new technologies that will surpass that. That's going to change the energy exchange ratio significantly.
Secondly, the USA produces an extra billion bushels of corn annually that is complete waste. It's a consequence of the collision of industrialism and agriculture. We practice intensive, industrialized monoculture and the massive overproduction is the consequence. What do we do with the waste? Burning it in automobiles seems a legitimate alternative to other possibilities.
Thirdly, I did not see any discussion of environmental impact. The health costs associated with petroleum pollution, especially in urban areas, not to mention oil spills, is unacceptable and costly. I worked oil fields, it's a dirty business. Ethanol can contribute to cleaner air and a healthier America. The petroleum-based oxygenate additive methyl tertiary butyl ether (MTBE) has had horrific environmental consequences, which is why it is banned in New York and California and will be prohibited nationwide. Ethanol is the only safe alternative for our cities.
I've read comments suggesting that ethanol will replace petroleum as our primary fuel. That isn't feasible. Our nation burns in excess of 110 billion gallons of gasoline and oil products a year. When the ethanol industry reaches peak performance, there might be approximately 20 billion gallons produced. And this is where Pimental is completely accurate: we grossly waste energy as a nation to the point of insanity. Ethanol is not the magic bullet. The only sustainable alternative to petroleum is committed conservation. Ethanol and other fuels can fill niches (except hydrogen fuel cells, that's a scam), but it will be the American citizen willing to do with less horsepower, more mass transit, more walking, and fewer impulse trips to the big box stores that will be the real solution. Ethanol, other boutique fuels, domestic petroleum production, and a heaping help of conservation is the only way we will have an energy independent, environmentally sustainable future for our nation.
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» RE: Future of Ethanol
Posted by: Iconoclast421
» Hemp can produce ethanol and requires no petroleum. Sad that the author ignored that point.
Posted by: maxpayne
» RE: Hemp can produce ethanol and requires no petroleum. Sad that the author ignored that point.
Posted by: Jason Jordan
» Hey "Jason Jordan," Shouldn't You Come CLean That You Are Actually "BozemanBlues"?
Posted by: Douglas
» Did Douglas VIOLATE Alternet's TOS? At least two of four violations have occurred.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» How Many Of These Has "superfeduphoosier" (aka "BozemanBlues") Violated In Just One Hour?
Posted by: Douglas
» superfeduphoosier tells the truth and never lies unlike Douglas.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
Comments are closed-
Posted by: asilsfable on Dec 13, 2006 11:47 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It's already being collected; why not pump methane into our homes instead of natural gas and compost the rest to be used on our farmlands?
Buckminster Fuller said, "Pollution are resources we haven't found uses for yet."
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Posted by: kuro_neko on Dec 13, 2006 12:25 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Highly diverse mixtures of native prairie plant species have emerged as a leader in the quest to identify the best source of biomass for producing sustainable, bio-based fuel to replace petroleum.
Mixed prairie grasses have emerged as a leader in the quest to produce biofuels.
A new study led by David Tilman, Regents Professor of Ecology in the University of Minnesota's College of Biological Sciences, shows that mixtures of native perennial grasses and other flowering plants provide more usable energy per acre than corn grain ethanol or soybean biodiesel and are far better for the environment.
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» another argument for preserving diversity
Posted by: Drclaw
» Carbon Negative
Posted by: Krain61
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Drclaw on Dec 13, 2006 12:37 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» Time To Answer The Question: How Much Higher A Yield Than Corn Does Hemp Produce!!!
Posted by: Douglas
» "DIPSHIT" & Other Namecalling Is Not The Answer! Just Give The Statistics, Please!
Posted by: Douglas
» If The Answer Was Already Given, Why Can't It Be Given Again? I Can't find It. Just Give The Facts!
Posted by: Douglas
» Give Me The Truth And I Will Handle It!! What Is The Truth? If You've Already. . .
Posted by: Douglas
» Oh boy, too many useless posts. If you want answers, why not just GOOGLE it ?
Posted by: maxpayne
» If YOU Don't Know The Answer To The Question, How Can you Reasonably Advocate Hempfuel???
Posted by: Douglas
» Max, Douglas is just a troll. Funny that Alternet keeps only his posts. I guess Douglas fears hemp.
Posted by: Jason Jordan
» Any Responsible Advocate Of Hempfuel Knows The Answer. It Is Telling That You & Max Do Not!!!
Posted by: Douglas
» Maybe Douglas should verify that hemp fuel is or isn't viable unless he's scared to admit he's wrong
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» Here Is BozemanBlues Again Under His Newest Name! He Isn't Fooling Anyone?
Posted by: Douglas
» Douglas, you're a bald-faced liar. Stop calling people names before telling others what to do.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» Who Is BozemanBlues? NdNative, Sdres11, maxpayne, superfeduphoosier and who knows what else?
Posted by: Douglas
» Did Douglas VIOLATE Alternet's TOS? At least two of four violations have occurred.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» No kidding. Douglas must be on prozac. What a loser.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» How Many Names Can BozemanBlues Come Up With? Here is Yet Another One!!
Posted by: Douglas
» Douglas needs to get a life and stop acting like Richard Nixon and stop being a bald-faced liar.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» Max, "Jason Jordan" Is Just Another Name for "BozemanBlues"
Posted by: Douglas
» Douglas is Prof Pimenthal and why not? Douglas reminds me of Nixon who classifies people he hates.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» Douglas needs to get a life and stop acting like Richard Nixon and stop being a bald-faced liar.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» Hey "BozemanBlues" (aka "superfeduphoosier"), You Are So Stupidly Transparent You Are Laughable!!
Posted by: Douglas
» Did Douglas VIOLATE Alternet's TOS? At least two of four violations have occurred.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» Should You Apply These To Your Own Posts?
Posted by: Douglas
» Douglas LIES once again but never gives up.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
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Posted by: MonkeyBoy on Dec 13, 2006 2:05 PM
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Posted by: MonkeyBoy on Dec 13, 2006 2:43 PM
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http://www.lifeaftertheoilcrash.net/Index.html
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Posted by: CyberBrook on Dec 13, 2006 3:43 PM
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weaning off of oil, expanding solar, wind, and tidal energy generators, solar panels on all govt buildings to start with, subsidizing renewable research, legalizing and using hemp, demilitarizing and stopping war, reforesting, buying local, organic agriculture, walking and biking, conservation and efficiency, installing compact flourescent light bulbs, recycling and buying recycled, reducing consumption, keeping in check one's number of bio-kids and pets, quitting smoking, green roofing, etc. and eliminating or sharply reducing one's meat consumption.
The science regarding the ravages (health and environmental, not to mention ethical) of meat is accumulating.
Please see some of the following sources:
Another Inconvenient Truth
http://www.eatkind.net/inconvenient.htm
EarthSave: A New Global Warming Strategy
http://www.earthsave.org/globalwarming.htm
Another Inconvenient Truth: Meat is a Global Warming Issue
http://www.emagazine.com/view/?3312
Another Inconvenient Truth: In the modern world, it is impossible to reconcile a carnivorous diet with environmental responsibility
aquarianonline.com/Eco/anotherinconvenienttruth.htm
UN: Which causes more greenhouse gas emissions, rearing cattle or driving cars?
http://www.fao.org/newsroom/en/news/2006/1000448/index.html
Livestock’s Role in Climate Change and Air Pollution
virtualcentre.org/en/library/key_pub/longshad/A0701E00.htm
Warming Up to a New Diet
http://simplevegan.blogspot.com
Diet, Energy and Global Warming
http://geosci.uchicago.edu/~gidon/papers/nutri/nutri.html
ABC News: Meat-Eaters Aiding Global Warming?
abcnews.go.com/Technology/TenWays/story?id=2119267&page=1
Greenpeace: On Your Plate
www.greenpeace.org/usa/news/green-living-guide/on-your-plate
Fight Global Warming by Going Vegetarian
http://goveg.com/environment-globalwarming.asp
Vegan diets healthier for planet, people than meat diets
http://www-news.uchicago.edu/releases/06/060413.diet.shtml
The SUV in the Pantry
http://www.organicconsumers.org/btc/gasfood112105.cfm
Physics World: Cut Global Warming by Becoming Vegetarian
http://www.physorg.com/news4998.html
Five Food Choices for a Healthy Planet
http://www.veg.ca/issues/enviro-5reasons.html
and
Eco-Eating: Eating as if the Earth Matters
http://www.brook.com/veg
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» RE: AMEN BROTHER, Thank you for posting all the solutions. This is what authors need to get at !
Posted by: Krain61
» The Closest You Ever Came To A Cowboy Was When You Visited A Long Island Dairy Farm
Posted by: Douglas
» Douglas and Bozeman, this kind of fighting is why Big Oil stands to win.
Posted by: maxpayne
» Right on. Douglas just wants to pick fights without any reason.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» Alternet Banned You, Didn't They, "BozemanBlues" (aka "superfeduphoosier")
Posted by: Douglas
» There you go again, calling people names and outright lying. Go ahead and keep lying about me being
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
» How Much Higher A Yield than Corn Does Hemp Produce? Still Afraid To Answer The Question?
Posted by: Douglas
» He Continues To Refuse To Answer The Question. Why?
Posted by: Douglas
» If You Already Gave The Answer, Why Can't You Give It Again? Don't You Know The Answer?
Posted by: Douglas
» Douglas, just ignore Bozeman if he refuses to answer. Besides, why not have a meaningful discussion?
Posted by: maxpayne
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Posted by: thoughtcriminal on Dec 13, 2006 6:14 PM
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» RE: One-sided viewpoints don't do the subject justice:
Posted by: Krain61
» RE: One-sided viewpoints don't do the subject justice:
Posted by: Douglas
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Posted by: Krain61 on Dec 13, 2006 7:18 PM
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Have you seen our Goverment do much of anything that has really made things cheaper for you in a while..We ship things over sea's to be manufactured and then back and that's global warming there..And they said they would pass the savings on to us...lol But they just didn't tell us who was going to get that savings.."The owners" Not You Not Me..So if you buy it you'll help raise the price of breads and cereals and even your meat..What do cows and pigs eat? We need to concentrate on wind and solar energy..That's our future.
Once put up they last a very long time with no global warmer afterwards..I guess we can make gas and eat grass after the cows come home!
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Posted by: maxpayne on Dec 14, 2006 11:47 AM
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Posted by: maxpayne on Dec 14, 2006 12:29 PM
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Any doozie, even an oil tycoon, can lecture bs on conservation but it hardly does anything to actually address the energy crisis. It's just like the Ford plant closure tragedy in Norfolk, where the CEO racks in OBSCENE amounts of money even as the company goes bankrupt and to add insult to the injury workers get laid off and are given a "cheap" voucher being told to go to school when in fact it's the CEO who deserves to go to JAIL and then REFORM school.
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» RE: Well, then why does Alternet make it disappear so fast all the while keeping Barbie shit first ?
Posted by: Techubus
» RE: Not sure how my reply ended up all the way down here.. N/T
Posted by: Techubus
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Posted by: Jason Jordan on Dec 14, 2006 6:09 PM
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P.S.: Notice that those who criticize The Grist authors get their posts removed. And I had to read through all the frivolous drivel from too many jackasses saying yup yup to the author. The only posts that made any sense were the ones where the readers correctly pointed out Pimenthal's flaw of ENTIRELY IGNORING hemp. Hemp may be a biofuel but that doesn't mean it's the same as corn or soy. Even here at Twin Falls, Idaho, one can grow hemp that can withstand even the harsh cold weather. Try doing that with soy or corn. And you have to wonder why the amazon has to be DESTROYED just to grow corn or soy just to produce ethanol which then requires petroleum. Contrast that to hemp which can produce the cellulose needed to produce ethanol and hemp doesn't even contribute to global warming because unlike crude oil, no toxic chemicals are released and the carbon dioxide that is released is easily absorbed by the plants thereby contributing to further growth while not wasting all the soil.
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Posted by: superfeduphoosier on Dec 14, 2006 7:40 PM
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» Thank You For Your Comment, "BozemanBlues" (aka "superfeduphoosier")
Posted by: Douglas
» Once again, Douglas LIES and engages in NAME-CALLING.
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
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Posted by: jolo on Dec 14, 2006 11:07 PM
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If we get out of the U.S. and don't look at make believe statistics and biased "studies", and look at the real think. Yes,. the real thing.
This is simple, LOOK AT BRAZIL.It is in action, working, ironically the President of Brazil uses a new General Motors vehicle which runs on biofuels. This is not theory, or a study, it is a ENTIRE nation, a rather LARGE nation if anyone looked at a map that is lights years ahead of the U.S. in stopping the use of fossil fuels.
Here are the facts:
First don't compare the low grade, crappy ethanol that is used at times in the U.S. or the ancient experiments done with ignorant "wantabee" intellectuals (actually there are wishtoberich). They are irrelevant.
FOCUS on the positive, real life, going on right now modern success story of Brazil.
Here is a FACT, Brazil is so successful with their biofuels program, that it has gotten the nation out of horrible date and they are now EXPORTING, not only their technologies to the rest of the world, but all exporting their biofuels. Japan, Australia. Sweden, China, Russia, etc. But the US puts an enormous tax on importing anything from Brazil.
The autos that run on Biofuels in Brazil WORK, are in existence is functioning today and mopre and more opf the biofuels autos are being made, even by General Motors, BUT NOT FOR THE U.S.
Brazil has figured out how to make their Biofuel factories that turn their sugar cane into Fuel run, COMPLETELY FINANCIALLY INDEPENDENT. To Biofuels making factories run entirely on Biofuel.
Farmers who took a trip to Brazil to see THE FACTS, are buying up land, factories and technologies from Brazil with the intention of moving on, while the U.S. is stuck on fossil fuels. So stuck that they bomb independent nations and destroy non-replaceable land to make MORE OIL WELLS.
I guess a country like Sweeden haven't been pimped by PIMPentel yet. They must sure be dumb. Huh.
Sweden has made a national commitment to be totally free of all fossil fuels and atomic energy in 15 years !!
Yes be totally energy independent.
What type of energy are the Swedes actively banking in for being TRULY free, independent and running on replaceable energy ?? It is BIOFUELS of course !!They know that they are banking on a working, proven technology.
You can read about the Sweden story here.
Click to read Sweden story from the Guardian Unlimited.
Please read from media that is outside of the U.S. The fossil fuel industry owns the U.S. Congress and Administration. They current government is so corrupt on Oil Industry lobbiests, that one will never read on honest story. Look at the media from other nations to read the truth about Brazil and the rest of the world.
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» RE: This is total misinformation. See PIMPentel do some pimping
Posted by: superfeduphoosier
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Posted by: yankabroad on Dec 15, 2006 8:09 AM
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Is this You?
Please clarify, anyone.
RR
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Posted by: PopulationStabilization on Dec 16, 2006 6:29 AM
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On the hemp issue, the insightful supporters of its use know that it can be used for a multitude of products, even possibly replacing the toxic petroleum plastics that pollute our environment. It is the way to go.
Good luck to us all for a happier future.
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» RE: PopulationStabilization -- Makes perfect sense. But what's your point? :-)
Posted by: Pat Kittle
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Posted by: 1Eco. on Dec 16, 2006 10:43 AM
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Any sustainable small scale local effort is a positive and should be supported by not only enviros and progressives, but everyone who might want to stand with the people for a greener future.
The sustainable objective should be to work toward local community and individual based alternative energy sources, while conserving or supporting conservation. Green commons, parks, tree planting, wild life viewing areas can all be a part of that green community mix. These are phased based options that demand time, regardless the emergency, and fear based, global warming timelines.
This nation goes from $8.4 Trillion in National Fed. Debt. and $2 Trillion for major conflict and we shift from that screwed up starting point. Utilization of the transportation infrastructure and retroactive use of most transportation assets require liquid fuels. It is low cost feedstocks that will allow that first phase transfer with time. Decentralization of the who power and energy equation is extremely important, one green community at a time. What has been up til now is the dead end.
What will be in the future means working to find the common good while allowing time for positive small scale projects to ramp up. That is being seen now in Wind, Solar, BioFuel, and forestry. The cry is always we have no time. Then start a small scale project, plant some trees, work with your local community for green alternatives, but don't expect to turn everything around in a year, two, or ten. Major mistakes have been made for the profit motive and the advantage of a select few. Sustainable energy communities will take time to form. Biofuels while an option for liquid fuel might be better suited for heat. Geothermal for cool, and so forth. Unless the electric source is solar or wind, or some other alternative energy, local, small scale solution, enviros simply miss the mark. I do not regard BIG ELECTRIC POWER, OR BIG ENERGY as anything but the REAL DEAD END. I don't know how much more we need to go into debt to see this. The true costs are hidden with this old energy game.
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Posted by: 1Eco. on Dec 20, 2006 5:53 PM
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They could bounce off their lows with any run up in gas prices.
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